Lakers Now

Round-the-Clock Purple and Gold

« Previous Post | Lakers Now Home | Next Post »

Sizing up scenarios that will give Pau Gasol and Lamar Odom rest

57945367

Lakers Coach Phil Jackson walked into the press conference room lamenting the team's poor effort after its 95-92 loss Sunday to the Indiana Pacers, but that wouldn't dampen Jackson's enthusiasm for having fun at Pau Gasol's expense.

Gasol had just ended an uncharacteristic 5-of-15 effort from the field, overstepped on a screen-and-roll that resulted in a Roy Hibbert dunk with 16.7 seconds remaining, and logged his third consecutive 40-minute plus game.

So after playing for 45 minutes and 30 seconds, was Gasol tired?

"He was."

Is it because of all the minutes he's been logging?

"I think so."

Is there a cure for that?

"Rest," Jackson said with a smile.

The million-dollar question followed: How do you get him the rest? There are no easy answers. Andrew Bynum says he's about three weeks away from returning to the court after rehabbing his surgically repaired right knee.  Theo Ratliff is expected to miss three to five more weeks after getting arthroscopic surgery on his left knee. And rookie Derrick Caracter is inexperienced.

Jackson mentioned that the Lakers have a three-day break between their home games Friday against Sacramento and Dec. 7 against Washington. But what about in their back-to-back games Tuesday at Memphis and Wednesday at Houston?

"No," Jackson said. "It's not going to be easy until we get back after this week."

There certainly aren't many answers for either Gasol or Lamar Odom, and below the jump I'll explain why.

1. Why aren't the Lakers acquiring a backup center? Jackson had expected the Lakers front office would acquire one by the end of last week, but The Times' Mike Bresnahan and Mark Heisler both reported the Lakers would've had to spend at least $70,000 a week in player salary and luxury taxes. As Heisler mused, however, "Happily for the Lakers, they made $353,600 Sunday night, just off their courtside seats — enough to afford [Jake] Voskuhl for five weeks! There are 136, all sold as season tickets at $2,600 each. Unfortunately, owner Jerry Buss has the money earmarked for other purposes, confident Bynum's return is imminent." That's partly why Jackson expressed such frustration with Bynum's timetable as he remarked, "We put all our eggs in the basket of Andrew coming back."

2. Will Jackson play Caracter more? That's something Jackson has grudgingly found as a compromise. But Caracter's inexperience, poor ball handling and raw post-up moves aren't the only reasons Jackson is so reluctant to give him an elevated role, which so far has resulted in averages of 2.5 points in 6.9 minutes per game.

"I hate to put a kid like Derrick in that situation and have him fail consistently," Jackson said. "That's not what we want to have done with rookies, you want to have them succeed, but I'm probably going to have to do that eventually. Let him be a body out there and let fall what may fall. Hopefully he'll survive."

Caracter doesn't need to reinvent the wheel, but instead hone in on things he can do instead of worrying about things he can't do. Caracter can be physical, has a knack for grabbing offensive rebounds and can force teams to spread the floor. If he thrives in focusing on that role, that will at least ease the burden temporarily.

57946118

3. Can the Lakers go small? Yes and no. Jackson has done that in certain rotations, putting Ron Artest, Matt Barnes and Luke Walton at power forward, but it's never been for an extended period of time. The reasons for this point to the fact that it's not a good long-term formula to change the Lakers from a perimeter team to a post-oriented team. The Lakers poor shooting against Indiana illustrates why, as plenty of the team's previously effective outside shooting hinges on good ball movement in the post.

This can be a reasonable approach, however, during garbage minutes, but that will only work if the Lakers build a sizable lead. At that point, it wouldn't really even matter since Jackson has typically yanked all of his starters out during significant parts of the fourth quarter when they've had double-digit advantages.

4. Can't Bynum return sooner, even if he's less than 100%? An absolute no. Some might read Jackson's initial prodding in prompting Bynum to slightly adjust his own timetable from three weeks to 2 1/2  weeks, but Jackson and Bynum have both said the training staff has encouraged the center not to expedite his recovery. There is a difference between playing hurt and playing injured, as Bynum valiantly displayed during the 2010 playoffs. But the last thing the Lakers need is to leave themselves vulnerable to Bynum reinjuring his knee again because it wasn't fully rehabbed.

In the short term, Bynum providing 12 to 15 minutes per night might be realistic and would surely relieve the burden on Gasol and Odom, but that strategy is simply a bad gamble given Bynum's injury history. As tough as the minutes have been on Gasol and Odom, they're more equipped to handle that burden than Bynum can playing injured. Gasol took off the entire summer from basketball after playing in three consecutive NBA Finals and the 2008 Olympics. Odom, meanwhile, appears on a surge ever since maintaining his rhythm this summer from the 2010 FIBA World Championships.

5.Take it easy during practice: Jackson has used practice as a way to give Kobe Bryant rest, believing his longevity is more important than any rhythm he may lose because of missed practice time. Bryant has demonstrated time and time again he doesn't really need practice time. Jackson is adopting that same approach with Gasol and Odom. He gave them the day off from Monday's practice and he plans to give them more rest after Friday's game against Sacramento. Jackson has afforded the team itself plenty of days off, including days before both games against Golden State, Denver and the day after Thanksgiving. That will likely become more and more prevalent for Gasol and Odom before Bynum returns.

-- Mark Medina

Twitter.com/latmedina

E-mail the Lakers blog at mgmedin@gmail.com

Photo: Lakers center Pau Gasol draws a double-team defense from Pacers center Roy Hibbert and guard T.J. Ford in the second quarter Sunday. Credit: Jeff Gross / Getty Images

Photo: Pacer center Roy Hibbert scores despite the challenge from Lakers forward Lamar Odom in the first half Sunday. Credit: Gina Ferazzi / Los Angeles Times.

 
Comments () | Archives (70)

The comments to this entry are closed.

Yup - still got it!

Now, I seriously doubt the capability of the Lakers to "three-peat" Not unless PJ makes a change in the starting line-up from Artest to Barnes we can say "Adios" to our dream of another back 2 back 2 back. Matt is more fluid and active than Ron, more reliable scorer and rebounder. Barnes defense is at par compare to Artest. I don't see any downside in changing our starting small forward at all. Without this major change in our starting line-up we may see a Spurs against Celtics in the finals this year.

No relief in sight, they just gotta suck it up and man up. Sorry, but Gasol has to step up on this one. Not going to re-hash the 'soft' argument, he shed that image two NBA rings ago when he out-toughed Dwight Howard. But he's got to find another level and get to it, it's not like he's playing the entire game without rest.


Caracter has shown he can't yet hang with any kind of skilled big, he's trying which is admirable, but no matter how useless some think the regular season is, the fact of the matter is that HCA is worth pursuing. To think that this Laker team can just out-play a playoff tested opponent on their homecourt is a bit short-sighted, in my mind. I'm not saying that they can't but I WANTED to play Boston last year solely because I knew we would have had HCA. Every advanatge is worth having.


Time outs, TV time outs, free throws, all of that is a form of rest and we've been shooting a decent amount of free throws (about 24/game). Phil might want to call an extra time out or two, particulary in the 4th quarter. I know he's not a fan of the time out for lots of reasons, but in this case it might be a creative way to get Pau an extra minute or two of rest.


Before the tomatoes start getting hurled I just want to say that I think Gasol is playing great basketball, he's acknowledged his minutes are up and to his credit you'll never hear him complain to the media about it, he just acknowledges it and moves on, a consumate pro if ever there was one. But on the court it's obvious that mental fatigue is Pau's greatest hurtle, when he's mentally tough, he's physically tough. Maybe he needs to bust some P90X or watch True Grit (John Wayne, but looking forward to the re-make, one of the few I expect to ever look forward to)

I see this as a short term concern at worst. Before you know it, Bynum AND Ratliff will be back and the Lakers will find their groove. This is a long season and while it's nice to get off to a great start, it is more "important" to play well in the middle of the season when teams are establishing their identity. Only the Lakers can beat the Lakers, so the same panic that we heard ad nauseum last season when the Lakers couldn't beat the elite teams on the road, we are hearing again this season. Hopefully that will be different this year when we waltz into hostile arenas and I expect it to be. Regardless, I'm sure we'll have a top 4 seed (probably HCA) and everyone starts 0-0 in mid-April when it counts.

We should just sign Paul Davis to a couple 10-day contracts. This is getting ridiculous.
-
What do we play for? RINGS!!!!
-
Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.
-
GO LAKERS!!!!

Hmmm....maybe Phil refusal to play Caracter the 5-6 minutes necessary to give Pau more rest, is his way of putting FO on alert that he disapproves of them not signing another big man to tide them over.

Yup - still got it! Posted by: justanothermambafan | November 30, 2010 at 01:32 PM
*
There never was a moments doubt!!

Give Sasha some minutes at center. (Remember, professional basketball IS entertainment.)

Rocky,

Yes, Fish will forever be part of Laker lore, and his contributions go beyond what he does on the floor, BUT, let's be real here. When he IS on the floor, he has plenty of weaknesses as a player. His rotations on defense are as slow as molasses, he over dribbles, his drives to the basket is a turnover or a block waiting to happen, he's a liability on fast breaks, he plays the human safely cone against quick guards, and he does not have the ability to cut to the basket in half court sets. Whether his leadership, toughness and 'clutchness' outweigh his weaknesses is certainly open for debate.

Two years ago, Fish was a liability for the entire year, including the playoffs, until he made those huge clutch shots against Orlando in the finals. Last season, Fish was more consistent in the playoffs, but was a major liability during the regular season. Let's hope he continues to be clutch in the playoffs, because watching Fish in the regular season can get real ugly at times. Phil seems to be gaining confidence in Blake and Brown in crunch time, and I think the team would benefit if Phil increased Blake and Brown's minutes at the expense of Fish, at least in the regular season.

@Justa – oh yeah, me and da king Yellowman go WAY BACK!


@MVP – Your response was duly noted. As far as your foul --- you weren’t whistled for a flagrant #2…I said it was just a personal foul and hobbit got the flagrant #1 for his comeback. But we do have common ground...I agree with you 100% on “Loose Balls” being a great book!

@rafanico - sorry but Barnes defense isn't on par with Ron Ron's. But I agree that Ron's gotta step his game up.


One last drop of raggae flavored jam, cause its all about the love (my best phred imitation). This should put a smile on your face compliments of Michael Franti..


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ehu3wy4WkHs

Disgusting, but appropriate.
-
http://www.deadseriousnews.com/?p=330
-
What do we play for? RINGS!!!
-
Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.
-
GO LAKERS!!!

Simple solution: Pau and Lamar have to suck it up for 2 1/2 to 3 more weeks, then Bynum comes back and eats some minutes.


Hey, I didn't say it was a good solution. But it is simple and about the only option.

Enough is enough! If money is an issue for the front office, I'll play for free. Yeah that's right, for free. As a true fan I'm not going to stand on the sidelines and see the Lakers struggle anymore. I'll be part of the solution and not continue to bash anyone. In fact, I believe that if I shoulder Cyber (I hope he's light) we can stand 6'10 ish. That should be enough to help Pau and Lamar get some rest. Cyber are you in? Sign me up!
If not we can audition for that Snicker's commercial.

Russell Westbrook may be on his way to the becoming the best PG in the league...

- - -

MM: Nice rundown regarding the frontcourt minutes situation.

- - -

LRob: "Hmmm....maybe Phil refusal to play Caracter the 5-6 minutes necessary to give Pau more rest, is his way of putting FO on alert that he disapproves of them not signing another big man to tide them over."
-
I tend to agree with that, was thinking the same thing. Seems though that Phil has toned that back a bit, at least giving L.O. and Pau some practices off. The way he reluctantly says that DC will get some time bodes well, too.

- - -

888: What? I thought it was HCA or bust! Isn't that the purpose of the regular season, to rack up wins in November???


GO LAKERS!!!!!!

Laker J,
-
Please put me on the "I'll Play For Free To Give Pau And Lamar Some More Rest" Bandwagon.
-
Mitch! Make the call!
-
What do we play for? RINGS!!!
-
Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.
-
GO LAKERS!!!

I rather take a few losses now and to have a fully healthy team later. It's a marathon, not a sprint.

888: What? I thought it was HCA or bust! Isn't that the purpose of the regular season, to rack up wins in November???

Posted by: CyberCosmiX | November 30, 2010 at 02:18 PM
====

My bad. I retract my foolish statement.

@MVP – Your response was duly noted. As far as your foul --- you weren’t whistled for a flagrant #2…I said it was just a personal foul and hobbit got the flagrant #1 for his comeback. But we do have common ground...I agree with you 100% on “Loose Balls” being a great book!

Posted by: LRob | November 30, 2010 at 02:07 PM

=====

Sorry for yet another in a series of inaccuracies. Candidly, I skim through or over the unimportant stuff, which includes all the posts by you-know-who in this childish war that I have been participating in. However, I am proud to have LakerTom's back because when I got here, he had no protection from the vicious assaults he was fending off. From my vantage point, there was no question who the bullies were, and it wasn't our elder statesmen. Tom may be a superb counter-commenter, but he's not an instigator.

I'm all for it J, but must admit to gaining about 40 lbs since my 180 lbs college weight, and probably none of it muscle I'm afraid... lol


GO LAKERS!!!!!!

Disgusting, but appropriate.
-
http://www.deadseriousnews.com/?p=330
-
What do we play for? RINGS!!!
-
Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.
-
GO LAKERS!!!

888: I'm still wondering why Phil didn't play Kobe 30+ in that London game. We almost had that one in the bag! Still stings...


GO LAKERS!!!!!!

It's amazing how much different the dialogue is today from a few weeks ago when Christmas was looked at as the first time the Lakers might be challenged in a game.

Now Christmas doesn't look so bad but it's each and every game in between that looks like a problem.

Jon K - I am currently regretting clicking on that link...

Cyber,
That's alright we'll be there for the muscle, I mean mass. All we have to do is clog the lane. Occasionally, you may have to jump on an opposing player's back like a rabid spider monkey to send a "message". Keep in mind that between the two of us we'll have 12 fouls. I just hope we can keep the jersey. Mitch, you got my number.

Rocky,

Yes, Fish will forever be part of Laker lore, and his contributions go beyond what he does on the floor, BUT, let's be real here. When he IS on the floor, he has plenty of weaknesses as a player. His rotations on defense are as slow as molasses, he over dribbles, his drives to the basket is a turnover or a block waiting to happen, he's a liability on fast breaks, he plays the human safely cone against quick guards, and he does not have the ability to cut to the basket in half court sets. Whether his leadership, toughness and 'clutchness' outweigh his weaknesses is certainly open for debate.

Two years ago, Fish was a liability for the entire year, including the playoffs, until he made those huge clutch shots against Orlando in the finals. Last season, Fish was more consistent in the playoffs, but was a major liability during the regular season. Let's hope he continues to be clutch in the playoffs, because watching Fish in the regular season can get real ugly at times. Phil seems to be gaining confidence in Blake and Brown in crunch time, and I think the team would benefit if Phil increased Blake and Brown's minutes at the expense of Fish, at least in the regular season.

Posted by: LAKER TRUTH

Laker Truth I'm glad someone is actually watching the game with an open mind and not brainwashed like most of the Laker faithful. Really good analysis.

justa: "Jon K - I am currently regretting clicking on that link..."
-
I'm just glad that lebron had a great comeback line for Delonte.

The funniest thing is, it's true, at least in terms of that particular event happening...

- - -

I think I'm good for taking one charge a game, maybe two or three if they let me wear a helmet. Certainly will rack up the full 6-fouls too. I'm definitely in if it means sitting on the Laker bench and kicking it with the team at practices! We could always do what Ron Ron did to Paula one time when he was taking a shot, pulling his shorts down. Better not do it when playing the Celt's though, might give Delonte flashbacks...


GO LAKERS!!!!!!

Has anyone (seen) 63Footer? I know he had his son last week during Thanksgiving, but is this French Connection week? I miss his sense of humor around here. I bet he can still ball.

@Jon K
I think you should have posted a disclaimer with your D. West link:
"Do not open unless you like throwing up a little in your mouth"

Also, put me on the "I'll play for free..." bandwagon

@LRob
I'm not ready yet:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q0F-PQpGtGs&feature=related

I understand Buss not wanting to spend the extra dough on a temp center, but c'mon, it's not like he doesn't have the highest roster already. Whats a few more thousand?

@Laker J and Jon K - Mitch has been trying to talk to your representatives about a contract deal, but he's concerned you guys will leak inside info on to the Lakers blog. Plus, sources within the organization are saying you guys are now trying to demand max money to a long-term deal. What's going on?

mclyne - LOL - that's exactly what I meant.

Disclaimers are your friends....

Mitch has been trying to talk to your representatives about a contract deal, but he's concerned you guys will leak inside info on to the Lakers blog.
You guys are now trying to demand max money to a long-term deal. What's going on?

Posted by: Mark Medina | November 30, 2010 at 02:48 PM


BUSTED!!! Guilty as charged, darn it. Anything to sound intelligent while blogging here. I thought for sure I'd get inside knowledege and gain instant credibility. As for max money, yeah, I was going to drop that one on Mitch too. So much for the free tacos, dang it. But just so you know, I would give it my all out there, which would give Pau an additional 30 seconds a game on the bench.

MM,

Excellent my friend!

mclyne - LOL - that's exactly what I meant.

Disclaimers are your friends....

Posted by: justanothermambafan | November 30, 2010 at 02:49
PM


Justa, was it the tattoos?

Jon K keeps "accidentally" bumping mamba24 on his way to the RCOD. That act is more a South Beach thing.

btw, does anyone have a pic of Lebron's Mom?

MM,

Excellent my friend!

"Rocky,

Yes, Fish will forever be part of Laker lore, and his contributions go beyond what he does on the floor, BUT, let's be real here. When he IS on the floor, he has plenty of weaknesses as a player. His rotations on defense are as slow as molasses, he over dribbles, his drives to the basket is a turnover or a block waiting to happen, he's a liability on fast breaks, he plays the human safely cone against quick guards, and he does not have the ability to cut to the basket in half court sets. Whether his leadership, toughness and 'clutchness' outweigh his weaknesses is certainly open for debate.

Two years ago, Fish was a liability for the entire year, including the playoffs, until he made those huge clutch shots against Orlando in the finals. Last season, Fish was more consistent in the playoffs, but was a major liability during the regular season. Let's hope he continues to be clutch in the playoffs, because watching Fish in the regular season can get real ugly at times. Phil seems to be gaining confidence in Blake and Brown in crunch time, and I think the team would benefit if Phil increased Blake and Brown's minutes at the expense of Fish, at least in the regular season.

Posted by: LAKER TRUTH "

Great points.

@Jon K - How's the writing coming along? Are you bummed you're not in Cleveland to witness the Le Bron homecoming? Did you think you left the cold weather in Ohio only to find yourself reaching for those earmuffs?


Just wanted to say 'howdy', man, hope all id well.


Also, hating on Derek Fisher is like hating on the enzymes that break down the bits of food in your tummy that give you energy: they're not pretty, you're not really sure how it works and it isn't always pretty, but when you need them, they're always there.


Anyone hear about the pre-paid Kardashian Debit/Credit card?

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/money_co/2010/11/kardashian-kard-pulled-amid-complaints-of-egregious-fees.html


This planet is so strange, we find new and exciting ways to take each others money, but can't agree on basic human rights or the importance of exploring space. For a country that prides itself on our pioneer roots, our moxie and striving to be the best, we sure have become run-of-the-mill consumers who can't do much without calling IT.


Why was I born an Earthling?

mclyne,

Ever heard of Google?
Lots of pics of her.

@Jon K - Meant that I hope all IS well, I'm sure your Id is doing just fine.

What does Darth Jangles really think about the Bynum injury and setback after another setback?

http://hoopstopia.com/

Bynum had better get his tail back on the court ASAP!

@Art-FL Laker Fan
It was meant to be a joke- guess you didn't get it. What is this thing you call Google?

@Jon K - Clicked on the link...loading...hmmm (reads, throws up in mouth a little bit) I think this is an apropos response:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMtZfW2z9dw

Ah the anti-Fish comments flow so freely from fans who choose to ignore all the good things that Fish still does on the court. His defense will forever remain unappreciated by those same fans simply because he can't stay in front of speedy point guards. No one can. Aaron Brooks was recently asked if he could cover himself and he said: "No." Fish is physical, understands the Lakers team defensive schemes, communicates well on defense and has actually shot pretty well for most of this early practice season. He's a role player on offense who helps organize the offense and is our fourth or fifth option of the starters depending on Artest's role for that particular game.

The vast majority of those fans who make these comments about Fish made the same comments about him last season, the season before that and even in 2007-08, when they didn't want him back at all. While it is true that Fish has slowed down, he is a character guy and a leader who commands the respect of all his teammates and players around the league. He is still a part of the chemistry of the Lakers' starting 5 and Phil Jackson will adjust the minutes of his guards according to what is best for the team, not for what is best for the Fisher naysayers.

I know of a Caps' Googles!

S Perkins:

Most of the Laker Faithful are brainwashed? Really?

Is it being brainwashed to say that so far this season, Derek's shooting has been a very nice surprise?

Laker Truth is correct to say that Derek has had some not-so-aesthetically-pleasing stat lines. This season, however, he's been pretty fantastic considering his career averages. The last few games haven't been spectacular, but as someone who is taking the entire season to date, I am one who is happy with his play.

I think one of the reasons why is that we have a backup PG who (a) could start for many teams in the NBA, (b) is doing his best to be a team-first PG at all times he is in, and (c) who can also play well enough to allow PJ to mitigate Derek's minutes.

There is something positive that both Derek and Steve bring to the team, and I'm glad to have them both. I honestly don't care who starts and who finishes games, as long as we win. I'm actually very happy that they both play for the Lakers.

"Ah the anti-Fish comments flow so freely from fans who choose to ignore all the good things that Fish still does on the court. His defense will forever remain unappreciated by those same fans simply because he can't stay in front of speedy point guards. No one can. Aaron Brooks was recently asked if he could cover himself and he said: "No."
Posted by: KobeMVP888 | November 30, 2010 at 03:21 PM "

There are point guards that do slow down Aaron Brooks and give him problems. I guarantee you Aaron Brooks would score a lot fewer points against himself than he does against Derek Fisher.

It's a copout to say those guys just score on everyone. Just because quick point guards will inevitably score doesn't mean you shouldn't want to make it hard for them to do so.

As much as you may like Derek Fisher, most of the point guards throughout the league bring more than he does and you don't have to look beyond a box score to notice it.

How many other starting PGs in the League right now have 5 rings?

...... I thought so.

We all know Fish isn't the most talented, or athletic Pg in the League, but he sure fits in the triangle nicely.

Bumyn said, "I had surgury at the perfect time!" I had surgery at the perfect time! Are you kidding me Big Baby Video Game Bumum? Sure, if you are a hugely selfish and egotistical person, than your surgery happened at the “perfect” time.

Unfortunately, basketball is a team sport and you put yourself and your vacation time in front of your team. Let’s say that you had your surgery on June 25th, giving you a full week to bench press Playboy Playmates while you gallivant around at the Playboy Mansion, you would have been back on the hardwood smoking fools night after night. Instead, you decided that you needed to blow on a vuvuzela all day long and see the World Cup live and in person, thus pushing your surgery date back to July 28th. Douche bag.

I guess when you have already signed a guaranteed contract for big money, you can do whatever the hell you want, because you’re going to get paid regardless. Great attitude Bumum. It’s no wonder that your best friend on the team is the effeminate Sasha Vujacic. Do yourself a favor Albatross Bynum – shut your mouth, get your knee fully rehabbed, get your ace back on the court and earn at least some of your paycheck!

Dump The Albatross Before It's Too Late,

BandWagon!!!

As much as you may like Derek Fisher, most of the point guards throughout the league bring more than he does and you don't have to look beyond a box score to notice it.

Posted by: Bay to LA | November 30, 2010 at 03:33 PM
====

They are referred to as "lead guards" in the triangle offense. Give me a list of point guards who would fit Fisher's role as a team leader and who understand everything that the Lakers do out on the floor. I think Mitch Kupchak signed the one guy who fits that description and that is Steve Blake, but he's still learning. Guys like Billups and Kidd aren't available and their contracts are too big. The great point guards in the NBA: D-Wil, CP3, Nash, Rose, Wall, Westbrook, Rondo, etc., need the ball in their hands to be at their best. Derrick Rose, for example, was averaging more than 25 points against the rest of the NBA before he played the Lakers and Phil didn't have Fish guard him anyway. Out of curiosity, please tell me the point guards who don't get "burned" by their speedy counterparts.

Derek Fisher brings more to the Lakers than anything a box score can possibly tell you. If you are one of those box score aficionados and believe that that is all you have to look at to determine Derek Fisher's value to this team, then I must respectfully say that I don't think you understand the Lakers. In fact, take a look at the statistics of the starting lead guards on ALL 11 of Phil Jackson's championship teams and they probably reflect statistics which graze the bottom of the stat sheet for NBA starting point guards those years.

Mr. Laker:

While your passion for the team is laudable, I would like to make a few comments:

A) Please read the following: http://nba-point-forward.si.com/2010/11/30/promising-big-men-in-west-pose-problems/?eref=sihp

B) I worry about a possible inconsistency in your post - you seem to say that you want Andrew to return A.S.A.P. and play, and yet you also state "Dump The Albatross Before It's Too Late". You also seem to acknowledge that Andrew has the ability to "smoke fools". I can understand your frustration that he's not healthy. This seems to be a tad extraneous though

C) NBA players have *already* earned their pay checks once they sign a contract. They don't (except for 10-day contracts and what could have been offered to Paul Davis) get paid per game, so asking Andrew to "earn at least some of your paycheck" is a bit like trying to yell in the middle of a tornado.

Like you, I hope that Andrew comes back healthy and is ready to contribute when he gets cleared medically.

"How many other starting PGs in the League right now have 5 rings?

...... I thought so.

We all know Fish isn't the most talented, or athletic Pg in the League, but he sure fits in the triangle nicely.

Posted by: mclyne | November 30, 2010 at 03:36 PM "

He'll have those rings when he's 60. Will you still use them as a reason to start him at that time?

"How many other starting PGs in the League right now have 5 rings?

...... I thought so.

We all know Fish isn't the most talented, or athletic Pg in the League, but he sure fits in the triangle nicely.

Posted by: mclyne | November 30, 2010 at 03:36 PM "

He'll have those rings when he's 60. Will you still use them as a reason to start him at that time?

Posted by: Bay to LA | November 30, 2010 at 03:58 PM
=====

Bay to LA

True or false: You said the same things about Derek Fisher last season.

No, but there are 5 HUGE reasons why he was trusted to hit big shots and take charges on D in the playoffs.

Sorry, but RINGS don't lie. You can't take them away, ever. It's not like Fish can be compared to Adam Morrision, who did nothing to contribute to championships.

Also, you are basically saying that Phil Jackson, the most successful head coach ever in any proffessional sport(by the time he retires), doesn't know what he's doing. Don't get me wrong, I've often questioned some of Phil's decisions, but who am I to argue with greatness?

Posted by: Mr. Laker | November 30, 2010 at 03:38 PM
=====

Waaahhh! Are you the same Mr. Laker from TLN? I think Mr. Poser would be more appropriate.

@C.
Well my post has to be double-sided. I do want him traded for a serviceable Big-Man that will clog up the middle. Look at all my previous post, I have always called Bynum an Albatross because he takes up a large portion of our salary Cap, we are always waiting for him to get back on the court! Remember he has only played in about 58% of all games including playoffs since he joined the team. But I am realistic, since no one wants a lazy unreliable Next Great Greg Oden with a big fat contract, I do have to urge the Big Video Game Baby to get back on the court and give us some minutes and if not earn some of his paycheck then give us some Worth out of it! (Pennies on the Dollar)

Hindsight is 20/20! But The Bumum contract has Been Mitch's Biggest Blunder Ever, Worse than the Walton Contract!!

Dump The Albatross Now For Expiring Contracts Before It's Too Late,

BandWagon!!!

"They are referred to as "lead guards" in the triangle offense. Give me a list of point guards who would fit Fisher's role as a team leader and who understand everything that the Lakers do out on the floor. I think Mitch Kupchak signed the one guy who fits that description and that is Steve Blake, but he's still learning. Guys like Billups and Kidd aren't available and their contracts are too big. The great point guards in the NBA: D-Wil, CP3, Nash, Rose, Wall, Westbrook, Rondo, etc., need the ball in their hands to be at their best. Derrick Rose, for example, was averaging more than 25 points against the rest of the NBA before he played the Lakers and Phil didn't have Fish guard him anyway. Out of curiosity, please tell me the point guards who don't get "burned" by their speedy counterparts.

Derek Fisher brings more to the Lakers than anything a box score can possibly tell you. If you are one of those box score aficionados and believe that that is all you have to look at to determine Derek Fisher's value to this team, then I must respectfully say that I don't think you understand the Lakers. In fact, take a look at the statistics of the starting lead guards on ALL 11 of Phil Jackson's championship teams and they probably reflect statistics which graze the bottom of the stat sheet for NBA starting point guards those years.

Posted by: KobeMVP888 | November 30, 2010 at 03:54 PM "

Nope. Not saying that a box score tells the whole story. What I am saying is those intangibles you are talking about aren't exclusive to Derek Fisher and Steve Blake isn't the only other player that has them either.

There are players in the league that can do everything Derek Fisher does plus more.

mclyne,

Nope, didn't get it.
As soon as I posted that I wished I could take it back, just sounded like a cheap shot.
Sorry.

I was going to jump into the Fisher debate and thought for a minute.

Lets see:

1) He has a 3 year deal
2) He will not be traded
3) He has a proven history of hitting clutch shots especially during playoffs, .04, game 3 vs Celts, etc, etc
4) Kobe wants him right where he is
5) There may be better PG's in the league, irrelevant, they aren't coming to LA.


There are players in the league that can do everything Derek Fisher does plus more.

Posted by: Bay to LA | November 30, 2010 at 04:12 PM
====

And you haven't named ONE.

@Art
no worries-
I like your additions to the Fish debate.

"Bay to LA

True or false: You said the same things about Derek Fisher last season.

Posted by: KobeMVP888 | November 30, 2010 at 04:04 PM "

Yes, I thought they would be better with a better point guard last year and I still think the same this year. A championship is the sign of the best team, not the perfect team.

Mark Medina,
-
My only demand for a deal with the Lakers is that Thriller and I get to go bowling during offtime in a city like Milwaukee or Charlotte.
-
That's it.
-
I will even pay for my own uniform.
-
What do we play for? RINGS!!!
-
Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.
-
GO LAKERS!!!

I have to agree: it was Mitch's biggest blunder to sign Bynum - even without the benefit of hindsight - to that long term contract before he was able to play an entire season without injury. He was going to be a restricted free agent which means if the Lakers wanted him, they could've had him.

I understood the gamble: lock him for cheap before having to compete for his services but I don't think it was evaluated properly. He had knee injuries in HS that kept him out of at least 30 games since he transferred there and when he got signed, he had already injured the same knee twice.

Now, some will argue that the injuries were in HS and they're really not relevant but I would argue that they are since he was coming into the league right out of HS. In any case, that was really Buss' call and we all know the man likes to gamble and he can do whatever he wants because it's his team and his money.

We are fortunate to have a championship team and we'll just have to watch the product that was put together for our fanatical viewing and rooting. This team has what it takes to win a championship and I am POSITIVE that the FO will address the team's issues in the "middle."

GO LAKERS & IN BUSS WE TRUST!!

Jamie Sweet,
-
"How's the writing coming along?"
-
It's been slow over the last six weeks because I've been working in the day and then working on my "Dear God, please keep me in Los Angeles" plan at night.
-
"Are you bummed you're not in Cleveland to witness the Le Bron homecoming?"
-
Yeah, IF IT WAS FOR LIKE ONE DAY. Cleveland is not a very awesome place to spend extended time in. Anyhow, all my homies in the A-K-Rowdy (Akron, Ohio) have constantly been admonished with "I told you so! I told you he was a scumbag." To which they dejectedly respond, "I know. I know."
-
They really hate him out there now. I don't think Los Angelenans can really get how visceral it is. Clevelanders really know how to hate and there's is a righteous hatred this time. He betrayed them.
-
"Did you think you left the cold weather in Ohio only to find yourself reaching for those earmuffs?"
-
My metabolism has alost acclimated. I feel the "cold" out here; however, I did recently find myself walking throug the "cold" rain in Chinatown with only a t-shirt on and found various people looking at me like I was a madman.
-
After you've known real cold for a while, one realizes that temperature is primarily in one's head. It's not cold if you don't let it be cold. You get angry at it and it goes away... mainly.
-
What do we play for? RINGS!!!
-
Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.
-
GO LAKERS!!!

"And you haven't named ONE.

Posted by: KobeMVP888 | November 30, 2010 at 04:23 PM

"

You hadn't asked. And leaving all of the elite and/or score first point guards out of the equation, I'd take guys like Jarrett Jack, Anthony Parker, Jose Calderon, JJ Barea, Carlos Arroyo, etc. ahead of Fisher. All good ball handlers, all can knock down the open 3, and all are quicker than Fisher.

Jon K - Unfortunately Mitch thinks you'd be a bad influence on Ron and vice-versa

@frmkt

We've been saying all along!

But some Myopics don't want to see what is right in their freaking Face!

Showcase The Guy To Mark Cuban - He will do something Stupid and Trade for him or trade him straight up for Yao Ming, at least he plays a few minutes a game!!

Richest team can't afford to sign a Veteran to a ten day contract for league minimum, HOW EMBARRASSING!

Taking Us Down The Luxury Tax Hole Of Death!!!

I'll Clog Up The Middle For Free, Just Dump The Bum,

BandWagon!!!

@Mr. Laker - we'll be all right. what's done is done and this is when mngmnt earns their money. not sure why they won't spend the extra money in order to "spell" LO & Pau in order to avoid injury; that's my concern with their minutes. fatigue can sometimes translate into an injury and like i've been saying: then we're _ _ _ _ed! with Buss, there's always a method to the madness. something is going on and we'll soon find out.

but, we're just fans of the game and the team; we can only watch and see how it all develops. after all, that's the fun part of following your championship Lakers! enjoy the game tonight.


Connect

Advertisement

In Case You Missed It...

Video

All Things Lakers »

Your database for all things purple and gold.

Find a Laker

Search a name

Select a season

Choose one of our lists



Categories


Archives
 

About the Bloggers


Bleacher Report | Lakers

Reader contributions from Times partner Bleacher Report

More Lakers on Bleacher Report »



Get Alerts on Your Mobile Phone

Sign me up for the following lists:


In Case You Missed It...