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Dissecting the Suns' three-pointers in Lakers' 121-116 loss to Phoenix

57645145Were Lakers Coach Phil Jackson a gambling man, he'd gladly roll the dice that Phoenix's penchant for three-point shooting wouldn't last.

"Our philosophy," Jackson said, "is those things even out through time."

Instead, the team's 121-116 loss Sunday to the Suns featured Phoenix setting a franchise-record 22 three-pointers, the second-highest league total any team's scored in a game.

The feat seems so uncommon that Lakers guard Kobe Bryant nearly guaranteed that you wouldn't see it happen again anywhere else.

"When guys are in the gym by themselves," Bryant said, "they can't shoot that percentage."

And Phoenix's live-and-die-by-the-three mentality seems so unorthodox, Lakers guard Derek Fisher highly doubts that strategy will prove sustainable for a playoff run.

"I'll just say I have five rings playing a particular way," he said. "I feel like that works pretty well. People do other things, and you see the results. That's just my opinion. Obviously, I'm biased."

The Lakers' refrain in the locker room after their second consecutive loss became as predictable as the Suns' relentless three-pointers. Rather than using this time to reflect on their poor defense, the Lakers pointed their fingers at Phoenix, claiming there was very little L.A. could do to stop a hot shooting night. Sure, Lakers forward Lamar Odom conceded the team could've performed better on closeouts. Sure, Lakers guard Shannon Brown acknowledged that the Lakers should've slowed the pace down to prevent the Suns from hitting so many three-pointers. And sure, Lakers forward Matt Barnes pointed to the Lakers' 18 turnovers feeding into Phoenix's high-octane offense.

But the Lakers' aura of resignation masked the plenty of things they could've prevented in allowing an opponent to set a new franchise record for most three-pointers given up in single game against the Lakers' franchise. Considering how rare it is for teams to hit such a high volume of three-pointers in a single game, it's tempting for the Lakers simply to just forget it and move on. But the tape shows this is another example of the Lakers' ongoing problems on defensive coverages.

Below the jump, I detail what went wrong on nearly every Suns' three-pointer. I left out two sequences simply because I DVR'ed Fox Sports West's replay Monday afternoon, and that version fast-forwarded through a few parts of the first quarter, leaving two first-quarter treys on the cutting-room floor. But you get the idea.

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First quarter, 11:01 - 10:52: As soon as Ron Artest hit a corner three-pointer, Phoenix guard Steve Nash pushed up the tempo. Suns forward Hedo Turkoglu set a high pick for Nash on Derek Fisher, causing Artest to pick up Nash near the top of the key. Despite Artest picking up Nash, Fisher fought through the screen, causing Pau Gasol to move out toward Turkoglu despite trying to mark Suns center Robin Lopez as he moved downcourt.

Meanwhile, Kobe Bryant remained in his "free safety/center field" defense, in which he gives shooters space on the perimeter, leaving Bryant the ability to cheat on defense and be open to help if needed. That strategy appeared to come in handy as Nash drove into traffic on the far side, but he immediately found Jason Richardson open on the near corner. Bryant appeared to rush out to contest the shot, but Gasol beat him to the punch and Bryant instead manned Lopez inside. Richardson fired away at ease, tying up the game at 3-3 for what would begin a long night.

First quarter, 9:47 - 9:37: After receiving a pass from Bryant, Odom pump-faked at Turkoglu at the top of the key, created separation and drove left-handed into the lane. To prevent Lopez from blocking his shot, Odom brought the ball underhand for the left-handed layup, but the shot hit off the backboard.

Turkoglu grabbed the loose ball and pushed it up the floor, with Artest trailing, Fisher stationed between Turkoglu and Grant Hill and Bryant manning the paint in case he's needed for help defense. Once Hill received the pass from Turkoglu, Bryant and Fisher shut him off as he drove the lane. But with Odom trailing back, there was no one to mark Richardson on the near corner. Odom rushed out to contest Richardson's three-pointer, but the shot dropped in to cut the Lakers' lead to 7-6.

First quarter, 8:17 - 8:06 The Lakers played in a box-and-one on this sequence with Gasol on the right block, Odom on the left block, Bryant in the paint, Fisher on the far wing and Artest guarding Nash up top. Once Lopez ran a high screen on Artest, Turkoglu curled up toward the top of the key as Odom approached closer toward Nash and Lopez.

Once Turkoglu received the ball, both Bryant and Odom approached Turkoglu, but both remained in the paint to shut off the passing lane. After Richardson received a pass from Turkoglu on the far corner, Bryant stepped out toward him, but Richardson drove baseline. Odom dropped down to shut off the baseline drive, but that move left Turkoglu open from outside. Bryant didn't switch until the past was made, giving Turkoglu a fairly open look to knock down a trey, cutting the Lakers' lead to 10-9.

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Second quarter, 11:38 - 11:30: On a jump ball, Phoenix forward Josh Childress tips the ball toward Suns forward Jared Dudley, who then backs up behind three-point range and fires away, giving the Suns a 26-25 lead. This sequence revealed the Lakers breaking down on multiple defensive assignments. After Lakers forward Devin Ebanks lost the tip to Childress, he continued guarding him despite Pau Gasol being there in the paint to mark him. Lakers guard Sasha Vujacic remained fixated on guarding forward Channing Frye up top. And Lakers forward Matt Barnes locked on Suns forward Hakim Warrick before eventually stepping out to contest Dudley's shot.

Second quarter, 8:07 - 7:48: As soon as Odom drove past Phoenix with ease on a layup, Suns guard Goran Dragic immediately pushed the ball up the floor. Frye set a pick up top on Shannon Brown and Dragic used that space to drive through the lane. But Brown caught up and prevented Dragic from penetrating inside. Dragic backed up, switched to his left hand and then drove in again before Derrick Cararacter and Brown shut him off baseline. Dragic fed a pass from the baseline inside to Warrick, but Barnes blocked his shot.

Bryant immediately tried grabbing the loose ball, but Frye picked it up. Meanwhile, Dragic flashed toward the far-side perimeter, while Brown remained stuck in the paint. Bryant cut over to contest the shot, but Dragic's pump fake threw him off. Dragic then dribbled back and dropped in the three-pointer, cutting the gap to 35-33.

Second quarter, 6:51 - 6:43:After blowing past Bryant on the far end, Dudley was picked up by Caracter and Brown. Dudley kicked the ball out in mid-air to Frye at the top of the key, but Brown immediately denied him space both to shoot and drive. He swung the ball to a wide open Dragic at the top of the key. Bryant had been marking Dudley inside, but he jumped out to contest the shot. But Dragic had enough time to release the shot with ease, cutting the Lakers' lead to 37-36.

Second quarter, 3:24 - 3:09: With Nash manning the point up top, Frye set a high screen on Fisher. As Nash drove left, Gasol picked him up on the perimeter, but Fisher ran into Frye's screen and hunched over. With Odom marking the free-throw line, Frye didn't roll to the basket, however, and Fisher stayed on Frye. Nash cut into the lane past Gasol, forcing Fisher and Odom to pick him up inside. Nash then kicked the ball out to Turkoglu, who stood behind the arc. Odom ran out to contest the shot, but Nash had him boxed. Turkoglu's three-pointer reduced the Lakers' lead to 46-43.

Second quarter, 3:01 - 2:48: After Fisher missed an outside shot on the next possession, Frye grabbed the board and gave the ball to Nash to run the break. Odom got back on defense quickly enough so Fisher marked Turkoglu on the far side. Odom immediately picked up Hill once he received a pass along the baseline, while Gasol manned the paint. But that left Frye wide open on the near side and his trey tied the game up at 46-46.

Second quarter, 2:38 - 2:27:Once Bryant's far-corner three-pointer rimmed out, it was time for the Suns to run. Bryant tried preventing that by attempting to deflect Frye's pass to Nash, but he just missed. Phoenix had numbers but Artest closed in on Nash. He stopped on the wing, kicked the ball out to Richardson and blocked Fisher from contesting the shot. Richardson's trey gave the Suns a 49-46 lead after the team went on a 9-0. Remarked Lakers' play-by-play announcer Joel Meyers: "When you're that hot from the outside, you're going to keep going aren't you until it cools down." Said Lakers analyst Stu Lantz: "That's their game to begin with, so there's no reason for them to cool down."

Second quarter, 1:21 - 1:12: After Artest's missed lay-in, Nash pushed pace once again. Fisher picked Nash up at the top of the key, forcing him to swing the ball over Turkoglu on the far end. He then made a swing pass to Richardson, who nailed a triple from the corner for the 56-48 advantage, marking a 16-2 run. THe Lakers' defensive rotation appeared very odd. Odom usually guard Turkoglu, but he let him open outside so he could defend the paint because Gasol wasn't back on defense. Since Gasol wasn't in good position to guard Turkoglu, Bryant guarded the far wing between him and Richardson. But Bryant didn't even try stepping out to contest Richardson's shot.

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Third quarter, 6:40 - 6:35: Phoenix didn't have to work much to create an open three-pointer for Turkoglu. After Turkoglu fed an entry pass to Hill, Fisher guarded him straight up, while Odom stepped down the left block in case help was needed. But that left Turkoglu wide open on the far end for a three-point shot, resulting in a Suns' 70-64 lead.

Third quarter, 4:48 - 4:41: This sequence showed how the Lakers' attempt to overplay the perimeter still led to bad results. Gasol and Fisher doubled Nash on the near side, prompting him to pass up top to Frye. Odom marked Frye, while Gasol rotated over, but that just resulted in Frye swinging the ball over to Turkoglu on the far side. Bryant, who played the free-safety position between Turkoglu on the far end and Richardson on the far corner, confronted Turkoglu up top, but that left Richardson wide open for a corner three-pointer, giving the Suns a 76-68 lead.

The Lakers experienced a systematic breakdown on this play because it adopted two conflicting strategies. On the far end, Gasol was loading up on the perimeter, but on the far side Bryant was guarding a particular area. Gasol made a valiant attempt at contesting Richardson's shot, but it did very little.

Third quarter, 4:17 - 4:09 The Suns showed here they sorely miss Amare Stoudemire's presence on screen and roll. But that didn't matter against the Lakers because this sequence resulted in -- you guess it -- another three-pointer. Warrick rolled to the basket after setting a screen for Nash on the near side on Fisher, but Gasol quickly shut him off. Too bad Odom also collapsed on D to stop Warrick because he left Turkoglu wide open at the top of the key. Despite Odom calling out his teammates to help close out, no one was in the vicinity to pick him up. Barnes ran out toward Turkoglu, but wasn't able to contest the shot. Turkoglu's trey increased the Suns' lead to 79-71. Said Lantz: It's all about the reaction time. If you are a second late on your rotations, that's what happens. You have to know where you're going and bang bang, you have to be there."

Third quarter, 3:01 - 2:53 Nash passed to Turkoglu up top on a give-and-go sequence, but Fish dropped back so he could still guard Nash on the nearside. Meanwhile, Odom marked Turkoglu at the top of the key. Warrick set a down screen on Barnes, while Richardson cut up top to the far side. Barnes instantly marked Richardson, but he had enough space to drive left. Odom picked him up on help at the free-throw line, but that left Turkoglu open at the top of the key. Fisher immediately picked him up, but he jumped to contest a possible shot and fell out of position. Though Fisher immediately recovered, Odom tried picking Turkoglu up, leaving Nash wide open on the nearside. His three-pointer extended the Suns' cushion to 84-74. Said Lantz: "Two guys went to Turkoglu. That's because they're not on the same page as far as who should rotate over to Turkoglu."

Third quarter, 2:42 2:31: After Odom's fall-away jumper fell short, Turkoglu grabbed the rebound and found Nash to push the pace. Fisher and Barnes stayed back to prevent any transition points inside, but Nash found a better alternative in Richardson on the far corner instead. Fisher rushed out to contest the shot, but Richardson's attempt went in, giving the Suns a 87-74 lead.

Third quarter, 2:09 - 2:00: The Suns showed on this possession that their screen-and-rolls without Stoudemire will mostly aim to open up more outside shots. Warrick set a screen on Fisher and nearly caused him to stumble, but he picked up his step and switched on him while Gasol went over to Nash. Though Barnes had marked Richardson on the corner, he dropped back to stop Warrick from getting an open look in the lane. Nash stopped at the free-throw line, threw a behind-the-back pass to Richardson on the near side and he pulled up for the open triple. The Suns took a commanding 90-76 lead.

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Fourth quarter, 11:50 - 11:42: After feeding an entry pass to Childress on the nearside, Dudley set a screen on Odom at the free-throw line. Instead of switching up and guarding Frye at the top of the key, Brown stayed with Frye at the free-throw line. Odom contested the shot, but Frye had enough time to nail the triple, giving the Suns a 95-84 lead. With a big stroke of irony, Fox Sports West's sideline reporter Patrick O'Neal asked Lakers assistant coach Brian Shaw during this sequence what adjustments the Lakers need to make with Phoenix's small lineup. "We have to switch. Instead of trying to get in screen-and-rolls and get into our rotations, we have to switch and keep our man in front of us so we don't have to rotate." The Lakers essentially did the exact opposite on the play described above.

Fourth quarter, 9:29 - 9:14: This play epitomized the Lakers' contention that the Suns frankly experienced a hot shooting night. Childress drove right only to be cut off by Barnes and Brown along the baseline. Childress then picked up his dribble and swung the ball out to Goran Dragic at the top of the key. Vujacic gave him very little space, but Dragic somehow managed to nail the three-pointer as the shot clock expired, expanding the Suns' cushion to 100-92.

Fourth quarter, 4:20 - 4:15: After Nash received a swing pass at the top of the key from Richardson, Frye set a screen on Brown. Gasol and Brown effectively switched, with Gasol marking Nash on the far side and Brown covering Frye at the top of the key. But Nash simply drilled a trey in Gasol's face, extending Phoenix's cushion to 107-102.

Fourth quarter, :40 - :34: After Nash hit a free throw following Lamar Odom's controversial technical foul, Nash connected with Turkoglu on the nearside. Though Bryant covered him closely, Turkoglu nailed the shot, set the franchise record and gave the Suns a convincing 115-109 lead.

What this means

The Suns' shooting mentality may win them some games this year, but it's not going to prove to be a sustainable strategy. It was a point Fisher passionately made after the game. It was also a factor Phoenix Coach Alvin Gentry conceded to reporters afterward.

That being said, the Lakers could've offset the Suns' three-point shooting had they changed their strategy. Though the Lakers showed genuine hustle in playing defense, they showcased an arrogant attitude by not respecting Phoenix's capabilities. That's a sound attitude for any normal team, but by the time Phoenix hit 10 three-pointers the Lakers should've guarded the perimeter as if it were the paint. Instead, the Lakers kept daring the Suns to shoot outside shots, expecting that suddenly those shots would misfire.

The Lakers can flush some of these sequences out because Phoenix's record-setting night is record-setting for a reason. But a good number of the Suns' three-pointers came off of sequences in which the Lakers failed to switch up and communicate properly on assignments. That's a very correctable area of concern and it's not exactly spelling doom for the Lakers so early in the season. But the Lakers have experienced continuous problems with this, meaning they should view sharpening up defensive communication as their top priority moving forward.

-- Mark Medina

Twitter.com/latmedina

E-mail the Lakers blog at [email protected]

Photo: Phoenix guard Steve Nash, left, tries to drive past Lakers guard Derek Fisher during the first half of the Lakers' 121-116 loss Sunday at Staples Center. Credit: Gina Ferazzi / Los Angeles Times

Photo: Lakers guard Shannon Brown, left, and center Pau Gasol, right, try to strip the ball away from Phoenix forward Jared Dudley. Credit: Gina Ferazzi / Los Angeles Times

Photo: Phoenix guard Goran Dragic, left, loses the ball as Lakers guard Shannon Brown defends. Credit: Gina Ferazzi / Los Angeles Times

Photo: Lakers center Pau Gasol, right, tries to stop Steve Nash from making a shot during the fourth quarter. Credit: Gina Ferazzi / Los Angeles Times .

 
Comments () | Archives (61)

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Great analysis, MM. Phil and his team have prioritized guarding the perimeter, much to our collective frustration. This mindset will inevitably cost us a few games. But the strategy of protecting the interior and hoping the outside shot levels off is something I agree with, to an extent.

At this point, I'm just trusting what Phil does.

Have NEVER prioritized, I should have said.

63 footer and Kobe MVP 888,

We are not experienced and may also be unreasonable but I would personally prefer reading posts imbued with courtesy and gentility on debates among Laker fans. The real name of Laker Truth is Mitchell and he has been in this blog for many years now. It is really unpalatable to read name calling among fans who have strong opinions on something and try to ram it on others. I am not referring to just one but to all protagonists. Are they successful? No. They only get reprisals with equally loud response with emotions bordering to personal insults. Come to think of it we are all Laker fans in this blog. Move on from there. Are we starting some kind of factionalism in this blog? Why don't we pick on topic we agree and respect each others opinions on things we disagree.

Reading this post is like getting dragged like a chamber of horrors. Not MM's fine analysis which is right on point, especially pointing out the lack of cohesiveness on defense, but the sheer number of poor Laker plays and defensive breakdowns was running rampant in this game.

The Suns actually resorted to solid defense last night in defeating the Nugg's, so they are more than a one-trick pony. Kudo's to the underrated Alvin Gentry, the best Clipp coach in the last decade (I guess that's like picking the best deckhand on the titanic... =P ) and who is a great players-coach.

I like for these two losses to occur in a row as it has given Phil a whole lot of material to zing the team with and help them get back on the winning track. Phil has got a bucketful of sequences that he could use to draw from.

Personally, I think there has been a dropoff of energy these past couple of games, seems to have affected the entire team. That is illustrated in the lack of communication. They also seem to be going through the motions and trying to ramp it up in the 4th, but unable to pull out wins.

If there are ever 'good losses' - well these two games were just that. No loss is a good one, but these were acceptable since they came against two squads that may be good but not threaten the Lakers at the end of the day.


GO LAKERS!!!!!

Edwin - not sure what you were referring to as per me. Did I say anything discourteous? I don't think so, but if I did, I apologize. But please quote me to me if you could, as I don't recall anything.

Restating my position Fisher is the weak link.
PJ taking Shannon Brown out for Fisher was the wrong move.

Good thing for Fisher he only missed one game since his return to the Lakers.
If Fisher misses games, Brown or Blake with take his spot because folks will see Lakers are a BETTER TEAM with other point guard options.

Did folks note Farmar got 35 minutes against the Clippers producing 15 points and 12 assists. Farmar NEVER got 35 minutes with the Lakers.

63 footer,

You are never a protagonist but provide the appropriate background music. I addressed it to you because the post refers to you as one of the reasonable and experienced posters here.

Laker fan-

Are 3 consecutive losses considered a 3 peat?

Edwin - gotcha. I think you'll find, music aside (which I try to soothe the savage blogger), that I don't take umbrage with anyone or anything, even trolls. I just ignore anyone who seems a little "out there," not saying anything at all to them, because, as I feel that if I can't say anything good about someone, the least I can do is shut up.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dx0Shn5Hvpc

131-92,

These are the trying times, we are imitating our counterpart in the East with the O'Neal weak knees. This could be another geriatric match up in June and see which knees would hold.

Celtic fan-


Is losing to a LeBron less Cavs team irrelevant because Perkins wasn't playing Center?

63 footer - there you go. Keep smiling, the sun is shining that's what friends are for.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EtGF2m102Wg

These are the trying times, we are imitating our counterpart in the East with the O'Neal weak knees. This could be another geriatric match up in June and see which knees would hold.

Posted by: Edwin Gueco | November 16, 2010 at 08:58 AM

I understand. But I have been led to believe that we are the old team. And we cant make it through a full season without injury. Remember the average age of our starting 5 if you take out the point guard and add 3 then divide by pi is 35. I dont really understand this average age thing. Does that make the guys under 35 older and the guys over 35 younger?

Edwin - I'm surprised that stage didn't explode it was so full of talent.

Is losing to a LeBron less Cavs team irrelevant because Perkins wasn't playing Center?

Posted by: utzworld - THE BANNER HOLDER | November 16, 2010 at 09:03 AM

Only if losing to an Amare less Suns team (at home) irrelevant because Bynum wasnt playing Center!

[written to the soothing tunes of Why Can't We Be Friends. aaaahhh....]

Edwin: I'm with you. 63 Footer has a great philosophy in ignoring the 'out there' posts, which seem to multiply ten-fold after losses. But isn't it all of our responsibilities to help cool things down when the inevitable skirmishes start? We could do without those that call others out.

We can debate the merits of players, but when we start turning on each other and no one steps in it starts to get out of hand.

My personal philosophy is answer the posts, not the poster. It is simple etiquette not to call anyone out, but the blog equivalent of rounding up a posse, arming them with shotguns, piling them in the back of a chevy pickup and driving them to someones house to call them out happens occasionally and it's all of our responsibilities to keep that from happening or the blog will quickly degrade itself (and I'm speaking from experience on that)...

No hard feelings for anyone, I'd have a beer with any and all. Please though, for the love of god no Luke Walton talk if we did - that's all I ask! lol...


GO LAKERS!!!!!

The difference between Lakers Fans and Celtic Fans:


We can admit when we lost a game. No excuses. No blaming things on injured players. Neither you, your fans, your players OR your coach has the dignity and self-respect to do the same.


We let Phoenix 3 point us to death! YAAAY! We accept it.
Have you reached the point of accepting this:


83-79
83-79
83-79
83-79
83-79
83-79
83-79

CyberCosmiX - darn, man - Luke and I were gonna call you out for a beer, but... well, with Luke there, how can there be no Luke talk?

Just like your handle 131, you quoted a fuzzy math by using the power of the pi. I just listen to TNT analysts who are referring to Celtics as getting old and getting older with Shaq. Well, we took Ratliff supposedly a durable oldie but knees buckled down after few games. I guess both teams are just on going through intramurals during this young season. With modesty aside, Lakers are bored in winning so they have to lose two in order to be challenged. We need to awaken the Artest testosterone and grit, Kobe's precision and Gasol's El Cid spirit. Right now, they are playing to the tune of "lockout" is just in the horizon, preserving their energies to a long season. I don't know how many more millions they would need to put them on equal footing of the unemployed.

35: "I understand. But I have been led to believe that we are the old team. And we cant make it through a full season without injury. Remember the average age of our starting 5 if you take out the point guard and add 3 then divide by pi is 35. I dont really understand this average age thing. Does that make the guys under 35 older and the guys over 35 younger?"
-
Here's a math primer for you:

Kobe + Pau + Bynum + DFish + Ron Ron + L.O. + Killer B's = bling

That's about as much math as you can absorb in a day so I'll stop there...


GO LAKERS!!!!!

We can admit when we lost a game. No excuses. No blaming things on injured players. Neither you, your fans, your players OR your coach has the dignity and self-respect to do the same.


We let Phoenix 3 point us to death! YAAAY! We accept it.
Have you reached the point of accepting this:


83-79
83-79
83-79
83-79
83-79
83-79
83-79

Posted by: utzworld - THE BANNER HOLDER | November 16, 2010 at 09:20 AM

LOL .. You forget all the "if Bynum wasnt hurt" excuses! LMAO

You "let" Phoenix? Way to give credit to the other team.

How Laker fan of you to "let" the other team beat you.

131-92
Quit
131-92
Quit
131-92
Quit
131-92
Quit

63 Footer: Aww man... Well that's OK if you bring his hot sister, Leia! Especially in that skimpy slave-girl outfit... =)


GO LAKERS!!!!!


|x|-|y|<=|x+y|<=|x|+|y|.

This is the famous Triangle Inequality Equation, and the only equation we need worry about. Forgetting all the mumbo-jumbo math stuff, it basically says if the Lakers run the Triangle to perfection, we win.

See, math made simple.

Here's a math primer for you:

Kobe + Pau + Bynum + DFish + Ron Ron + L.O. + Killer B's = bling

That's about as much math as you can absorb in a day so I'll stop there...


GO LAKERS!!!!!

Posted by: CyberCosmiX | November 16, 2010 at 09:25 AM

Here a baseball math primer for you:

Red Sox beat the Yankees 2 out of 3 to end the year and kept them from winning the division.

2>1 so Boston won the series!

Please check your baseball math before you post!

"LOL .. You forget all the "if Bynum wasnt hurt" excuses! LMAO"


Wasn't it YOUR COACH who lathered up the media talkin that "Our starting 5 is still undefeated in the Finals" & "If Perk wasn't hurt..." noise? That's the only noise I heard poppin from Bah-Humbug-Ston last summer...other than the news that you're banking your future on Kobe's sloppy seconds.

63 Footer: |x|-|y| Albert Einstein > Tex Winter > Phil Jackson > B-Shaw > D-Fish & Kobe


GO LAKERS!!!!!

Actually...he's DWade's sloppy seconds, too. And LeBron's. Kinda sheds some light on why your new hero Shaq has knee issues. Too much kneeling down and...


SLAP! BAD BANNER HOLDER! REPENT AND GIVE GOD 20 PUSH UPS!

an alien lifeform or 35 hijacked the above post, lol. lemme try that again:

63 Footer: |x|-|y| Albert Einstein > Tex Winter > Phil Jackson > B-Shaw > D-Fish & Kobe


GO LAKERS!!!!!

131-92 (2008)
.
.
83-79 (2010)

utz: "Kinda sheds some light on why your new hero Shaq has knee issues. Too much kneeling down and..."
-
OH MY!!!! Definitely TMI of what is goin on in the C's locker room!!!! LMAO


GO LAKERS!!!!!

35: You may want to arrange for some boxes of cracker jacks to be delivered to Doc Rivers, I heard there are rings some of them. That way, in 20 years when there's a reunion they can have their rings touch...

Nice game that day. Maybe Doc shoulda reminded them that basketball is a 4-quarter sport, not 3...


GO LAKERS!!!!!

63 footer and Kobe MVP 888,

We are not experienced and may also be unreasonable but I would personally prefer reading posts imbued with courtesy and gentility on debates among Laker fans.

Posted by: Edwin Gueco | November 16, 2010 at 08:42 AM
====

1) LAKER TRUTH came out of the woodworks and laid into me and I simply defended myself. In other words, HE STARTED IT. He distorted my takes and views and transmuted them into lies. So if you prefer to read Mitchell's distortions and consider them to be "courteous," then that is your prerogative. I am always a gentleman until someone says something that I consider to be out of line to me or to a blogger I respect or states an opinion that I feel compelled to strongly dispute.

2) Did you read my thoughts on your post this morning? That was the kind of discussion I enjoy. Your post was original and well thought out. I hope you considered my response to be courteous and gentile, something that Mitchell rarely is to me. Oh, and nothing is more offensive to me than telling me how long someone has posted on here. This isn't a fraternity, it's a public blog. So Mitchell will just have to live with my strong rebukes to his opinions should they deserve equal and opposite and some sometimes excessive force.

@CCX: Sheds new light on that Delonte/Von Wafer locker room brawl, don't it?

"This isn't a fraternity, it's a public blog."


Naaah, bro. This IS a fraternity. Tried and true.

Restating my position Fisher is the weak link.
PJ taking Shannon Brown out for Fisher was the wrong move.

Posted by: Todd | November 16, 2010 at 08:46 AM
====

Fish has been the weak link on all Lakers blogs for years, but not Lakers teams because despite his diminishing physical skills, his leadership and the way he organizes the floor is invaluable. I don't view him as a weak link at all; I view him as a necessary component to our chances to three-peat.

HAVING SAID THAT, I was at the game the other night, felt the energy at Staples and I actually queried the same thing to my friend about Phil subbing Fish back into the game for ShanWow. It was from my friend that I adopted the "I defer to Phil Jackson" thing, so I made my query to him, we both shrugged our shoulders and that was that. We would have lost that game anyway.

Kobe888,

You wreak of desperation when, instead of providing facts to counter my claims, you resort to insults. I quote Laker players and coaches to support my claims, you quote Doc Rivers and CyberX. Everything I said was factual, so don't make me waste my time and go back to the archives. Be a man, and admit when you have been proven wrong or when you are being a hypocrite, or at the very least, try to address my points.

Kobe888,

For someone who has eaten a buffet of crow all year, you sure are feisty.

Let me refresh your memory on ALL of our past discussions, to remind you that ALL of your takes have been proven WRONG thus far:

1. You ridiculed my concerns about Bynum's prolonged absence, and argued that the regular season is nothing but a "glorified scrimmage", yet Phil, Pau, Lamar and Kobe have all expressed similar concerns about Bynum's absence leading to over extended minutes for Lamar and Pau. How's that crow taste buddy?

2. In your desperate attempt to defend any and all criticism directed at Bynum, you argued that the regular season does not matter, yet most sane Laker fans will acknowledge how important home court was against Boston, and how important it will be this year.

3. You shot down my concerns about Bynum getting re-injured (you even tried to argue that Bynum was not injury prone LOL), yet Phil recently stated that if Bynum gets injured again this year, he might become a "career situational player", which is much harsher that anything I ever said about Bynum. I guess Phil must be an "unappreciative and spoiled" Bynum Basher too? At least I'm in good company.

4. You argued that Barnes is not a good player, and worse than Luke (LOL), because he's played on so many teams. I'm guessing you're a Barnes fan by now. Don't forget to eat your vegetables with that crow.

5. You attack anybody and resort to name calling at anyone who criticizes Bynum or Luke in the slightest, no matter how factual the criticism may be, yet you have the audacity to criticize Kobe over a "glorified scrimmage" game in November? Your take on Kobe was an "unappreciative post from a spoiled fan who complains about our players even after we win championships". Sound familiar?

- You have every right to criticize a player, as you did with Kobe, but I just wanted to point out the hypocrisy of your criticism. After months of shooting down anyone who criticizes a Laker, I found it amusing that you would criticize the back to back finals MVP.

- “The TRUTH is incontrovertible, malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end; there it is.”

Laker fan-

If you can win title with our "sloppy seconds" (Fox and Shaw) why cant we with yours?

Tell Rick Cheetah that Mrs Christie is looking for him and watch him run!

Today we'll find out if we Buck the trend of playing poor team defense and taking ill advised one on one shots. Milwakee is an up and coming team that will try to capitalize on the Lakers "issues". Execute and play as a cohesive unit and we prevail. As for Kobe, he doesn't have to say anything to the fans, he'll do the talking on the court....and tonight, we'll get over it.

FCM - Thanks for this post - it was detailed and nice.

But, it's two days later and I am over it. I am looking forward to tonight's game as a comeback from dropping two straight. It's a long season, let's move on......

Cheers - PLG

"Laker fan-

If you can win title with our "sloppy seconds" (Fox and Shaw) why cant we with yours?"


Well,... hummmmm,... good question,... maybe because you HAVEN'T. Oh, and you WON'T.

Good job MM. Hard to criticize PJ with all his rings..but it was 'baffling' for a smart team not to get it. Yeah great points Fisher, but you lost THAT game. THAT game PJ and Fish and Kobe and Pau who are all suppose to have good to great basketball IQs should have made adjustments. It IS correctable. And that is also the frustrating thing because I am sure MM you have made these same comments before as things to correct. I guess PJ and Fish need to read the blog on a regular basis.

Maybe the Lakers only feel they need to make adjustments or play smart come playoff time. But then why play the regular season at all? If they are out their earning their paychecks what would it have hurt to react to what was going on and actually win the game? Is it any harder to play smart? I know Kobe is super competative (or at least he is in Black Ops) why didn't he get fed up with all the 3s and say look we have GOT to stop this?

Hey I thought this link was pretty hilarious

http://www.nba.com/heat/tickets/heat_fan_up_miami_2010.html

MM - Fan Up? Fan... frickin'... up? Jeeze Louise! Begging their fans for support... how sad. Maybe if they start handin' out free mojitos and Lebron does his pre-game ritual with cocaine instead of chalk, they'll get a few more butts in the seats, a few more people screaming... when they're not snuffin' up the white stuff.

So now the Bandwagon Heat Fans have their own field manual. How cute! Soooo new money!

63 Footer,
Did you say free Mojitos?? Now, that's tempting. I wonder what the Lakers will hand out on Christmas, a W will suffice.

Edwin: See what I say about certain posters calling others out?

If Mitchell is a long-time blog-mate of yours, perhaps he would listen to you if you asked him to stop calling other people out. Rants and raves are fine, but calling out others cross the line. The biggest irony is when it's someone that has tried to pin 'rules' on others.

Shouldn't we all do our part to keep things civil? I don't want to see the blog degrade into a civil war constantly, we already went through a lot of that this summer - and this on the heels of a championship win I might add. Not that KobeMVP888 can't defend himself and make valid points, which he does superbly, but the blog would be a better place if certain people would stop calling others out like drunk bar patrons looking for a fight.

At some point it becomes annoying to see the drunk at the bar running his mouth even though we can all see he's pretty harmless, since there are no bouncers on the blog we need to do what we can to keep this stuff from getting out of hand.

That's just my two cents. Eventually it gets annoying when the fly keeps landing on you until something is done to make it stop.


GO LAKERS!!!!!

Good morning CRUE!!


GAME DAY BABY!!!


YYYYEEEEEEEAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!


PLG - I agree - I'm over it too. I defer to PJ. This team will win in June. I don't care about a November game against a team that is perpetually irrelevant.


FAN UP??? HAHAHAHHAHAHAH!!!!! This reeks of pathetic desperation!! WHAT SHOULD I DO???? I'm a star - why doesn't anyone want to see me plaaaayyyyy?????? WAAAAAAHHHHHHHH!!!!!! This is hilarious!!!!! OMG!!!!!


*tears streaming down my face from laughing so hard*


*gasp*


*wheeze*


OK.... whew..... HAHAHAHA!!!


Music CRUE - sorry LRob.. I'm late again... but the drive this morning started out kinda slow, which didn't fit the mood I'm in, so I had to JAM!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5fj3W4zhw4


(fastforward to the 2:30 mark for the beginning)


Have a great day peeps!


GO LAKERS!!
Let the hunt for 6 begin - DFish
Nothing but another title will suffice - KBryant
WE GOT THIS - justa


""Our philosophy," Jackson said, "is those things even out through time."

That philosophy is why things never did even out through time in the game. Things "even out" when you start putting a hand in someone's face and making their shot total a mix of open shots as well as contested shots.

If they let a team shoot 40 uncontested 3pointers again, I think the same result can be expected. It's ignorant to think that players will shoot their normal percentages whether or not you guard them.

Back in the day............we used to have to match up one-on-one for defense. If we couldn't play our man on-on-one, we rode the pine. Simple as that. This generation of offense first bballers has made everyone think that the new era has relatively quicker offensive players than defensive players. That is a fallacy. Those same quick offensive players have the same quickness on the other end of the floor! We had to play our man no matter where he was - even full court a lot. If my man could shoot efficiently from 30+ feet, then I had to pick him up and stick to him all the way to the basket from 30+ feet! Too much laziness in today's players.


PLUS, as much as I love Kobe, I am fed up with his free safety attitude that cost us many points of hiss man - Jason Richardson!

The easiset things we had to learn back-in-the-day was to block out your man for rebounding and play between your man's strong hand and the basket on defense. Neither of these two things I see being done by more than 5% of this era of players! Basketball 101 is ignored by these prima donas to the discredit of the game. That is one reason I like to watch women's basketball - they apply tried and true basic principles of play to their games and know that if they cheat they get beat.


@CCX
"35: You may want to arrange for some boxes of cracker jacks to be delivered to Doc Rivers, I heard there are rings some of them. That way, in 20 years when there's a reunion they can have their rings touch..."

LOL!!!!!!!!!

Friedman award- hand it to the man!

"PLUS, as much as I love Kobe, I am fed up with his free safety attitude that cost us many points of hiss man - Jason Richardson!

Posted by: NuggetsCountry | November 16, 2010 at 10:48 AM

"

Well said. It would seem beneficial if he was providing good help defense and picking up a lot of rebounds, steals, etc. but that isn't happening. It seems more like he is coasting.

Justa...What up with Mamba24? Hope all is well with him and if it is...Where the H is our Game Day Bandwagon? LOL

@JUSTA

in response to your selecion:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4hXPu32FuE4

LAKER (DISTORTS THE) TRUTH: My long winded reply to your long winded BASHING:

1) Of course everyone's going to be concerned about extended minutes with Bynum out. How does that make me eat crow? Just because I thought Bynum would be back earlier before we found out that the surgery was more extensive than we previously knew?

2) For a championship team like the Lakers this IS the practice season and for you not to grasp that concept shows your utter lack of sophistication as a Lakers fan. Even when Andrew returns, you are going to scratch your head at some of the combinations that Philip puts out on the floor for extended minutes. Yes, he wants to win HCA, but in the process he tweaks, refines and otherwise gets his team ready for every possible situation. He's also a master at distributing minutes whether your realize it or not.

3) I never "shot down your concerns" about Bynum getting re-injured. Of course that's a concern. I may have tested you by making a bet on how many games he's going to play (if that was you), but that's just me being optimistic about his future. You make it seem like I make all these bold predictions when that is the last thing I am about. So please stop the unfounded accusations.

4) I never said Barnes wasn't a good player, just one I had concerns about. All I said was that if Luke and Barnes started the season healthy, it wouldn't surprise me if PJ had Luke ahead of Barnes in the rotation mainly because of the learning curve of the triangle. Luke started the season injured and I am thrilled that Barnes is fitting in! But you blew that one way out of proportion.

5) If that isn't the biggest distortion and exaggeration of the truth, I don't know what is. I don't "attack" people who criticize Bynum and Luke, I offer my own opinion. If you feel that I'm trying to impose my opinion on your fragile ego, that's your problem. Kobe had an off night and I merely pointed it out in context, which is that it happened during a fluke Suns shooting night in a meaningless early season practice game. Kobe had a bad game. So what. That makes me a hypocrit? I was over that loss by the time I left the arena.

If I am wrong about something, I'm the first to admit it. How that makes me a hypocrit is beyond me. Why you choose to wail away at me is also befuddling, especially when your posts are packed with lies, distortions, exaggerations, attacks and other such garbage in an effort to make yourself look good. But hey, if that works for you, enjoy!

There really isn't much to dissect; the 3-pt barrage was a combo of hot shooting and poor defense, nothing more, nothing less. Now if coaches and players want to pick where they want to defend - interior or perimeter - instead of just defending, then you get what we saw: the 2nd best 3-pt display in NBA history.
Now you know why PJ doesn't shy away when asked if this team can break any records - especially his Bulls team - because this team refuses - whether they are capable or not - to commit to defense. The team is certainly capable of winning the trophy but to do so, it's going to take some more GM magic to fill our void at the Five and some defense as the season wears on.
As of today, I believe - GASP!- that the Celtics are better than the Lakers. The C's are playing like the whole NBA championship was a fluke... That they are the reigning champions and they're out to prove it to the league. All of this without their starting center: Perkins while carrying a couple of "has beens" the "O'Kneels!" Boston is playing with purpose and is matching or exceeding their opponents' energy, unlike our Lakers who seem to be pacing themselves and perhaps this is what they have to do to get through the later parts of the season next year so they don't limp into the playoffs and I'm certainly OK with that.
So, expect quite a few losses this year to good and bad teams and what I thought was going to be a Christmas Day massacre just might not happen. As long as we "kill" it in the playoffs, make it and win the finals, none of this will matter.

GO LAKERS & IN BUSS WE TRUST!! MITCH- EOY

Just a little side note: Don't "blink" when it comes to the Spurs. They're on a 7 game winning streak and congratulation to N.O. for suffering their first loss; misery loves company and I feel fine!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thMm-7RFsm0

MM.....that advert for fans is as sad as i've seen., that pleading seemed to resemble the back seat of a highschool drive in date....I think the miami fans should fill the place but dress as talent scouts.....

prepare for Riley? I bet he's starting to 2nd guess it, he won't take the reins unless he's positive they can win it all...

Pop and Tim know how...here they go again

I like us to play solid ball on the road, I think the game slows down for Caracter tonight....

"And Phoenix's live-and-die-by-the-three mentality seems so unorthodox, Lakers guard Derek Fisher highly doubts that strategy will prove sustainable for a playoff run.

"I'll just say I have five rings playing a particular way," he said. "I feel like that works pretty well. People do other things, and you see the results. That's just my opinion. Obviously, I'm biased."

And what particular way is that, Derek? You mean like how you play shoddy defense and take most of your shots from behind the 3 point line? Because that's exactly what the Suns do, too.

>>>Are 3 consecutive losses considered a 3 peat?

Hey, I see you're practicing up your "pick and troll" moves.

>>>>LOL .. You forget all the "if Bynum wasnt hurt" excuses! LMAO

hey again troll-boy,

The difference is, no Laker fan ever rolled those out as an excuse. They only brought that up for juxtaposition for Doc Rivers' sake when Doc ridiculously claimed that the Green are undefeated when they have their starting five.

The truth is, there are no asterisks.

The Lakers have won 2 championships in the last two years, and 5 in the last 11 years.

The Celtics have won 1 championship in the last 24 years.


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