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Phil Jackson's nickname for the bench: Renegades

It's only two games into the regular season, and Lakers Coach Phil Jackson has already assigned the team's bench a nickname. They're "Renegades."

"I gave it to them," Jackson said Saturday after practice at the Lakers' facility in El Segundo. "They're getting a sense of how to play together."

That includes Steve Blake, Shannon Brown and Matt Barnes, a trio KCAL-9's Stu Lantz and a few L.A. Times Lakers blog readers described as "Killer B's." Beyond this settling a long debate or perhaps furthering it within this corner of the blogosphere, it's not so much important what nickname Jackson has assigned the reserves so much as that his willingness to do it so early in the season shows his satisfaction with the team's overall play. Jackson limited Saturday's practice solely to the reserves, a unit he says will feature more unspecified playing time from Devin Ebanks and Sasha Vujacic possibly as early as Sunday against the Golden State Warriors. 

Dictionary.com defines "renegade" as a "person who deserts a party or cause for another," hardly a quality trait you'd want to have in a teammate. But the Lakers see it differently.

"When you think of renegade, you think of someone who's almost mean, but going out there and getting the job done," Brown said. "They're fierce. They don't play many games, but they're close knit together. They won't let nobody mess with them."

The reactions among the bench struck a perfect balance between amusement ("I'm liking all these names," said Brown) and professionalism ("We're not going to worry about nicknames," Blake said. We're just going to go out there and keep doing what we're doing").

The bench so far has been doing the right things. In the Lakers' 112-110 season-opening victory Tuesday against the Houston Rockets, Blake hit the game-winning three-pointer and shut off Aaron Brooks in the lane on the final play. Meanwhile, Brown provided an energy boost in both season opener and in the Lakers' 114-106 victory Friday over the Phoenix Suns, showing a solid mid-range game and ability to run the break. And Barnes has scrapped on the boards as well as going three-of-four from three-point range against the Suns.

I noted before how the bench's teamwork mentality will surely pay dividends this season, and a scene in the locker room before the Suns game fully illustrated why. Barnes recalled seeing Ron Artest's ring brought a wave of emotions.

"Seeing that ring for the first time, I'm happy for those guys but I'm definitely jealous," Barnes said. "It makes me hungrier to get my own. I'm thinking about how it's going to feel to get my own."

For now, the Lakers' bench can be comforted to know they've at least earned enough respect for a nickname. They realize they've earned it.

"Renegades are people that are out there reckless and taking care of business," Barnes added. "Killer B's is self explanatory. It's us three taking care of business and having fun."

Brown suggested there should be a poll on this topic, so I told him I'd be more than willing to oblige and then report the results. Feel free to vote in some of the polls below after the jump. Of course, if you don't like these nicknames, pitch a few others and I'll see if it resonates with the bench.

 
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By Shannon suggesting a poll, does that mean he reads this blog?

If so, SHAN-WOW, YOU HAVE BEEN AMAZING SO FAR! WE ARE MORE THAN IMPRESSED!

MM, r the lakers appealing to the league about Barnes' tech? That was ridiculous! Joey Crawford was already a power hungry napoleon complex riddled ref and to give him that power? Like my friend always says, why do we even know joey Crawford's name? The refs r supposed to b invisible! The game isn't about them!

Bad boy, bad boys...what you gonna do when PJ calls for you...

That's my nickname for the new bench mob...

Bad Boys...BB for the rest of the Bs...BLaker, Barney, and D-Town Brown...

Lakers Dynasty - The Next Generation...
#17 Coming Up!!!

@LRob - sorry about the Spartans going down...I think it's Auburn's year...

That is awesome, I love 'The Renegades' for the whole bench. Think it's a lot better than 'Bench Mob'

Killer B's would be great when the 3 (Blake, Barnes, Brown) are on the floor together, but for the whole bench 'The Renegades' is awesome.

Great work with the interviews MM. Funny to see Luke was kinda like 'whatever' - I think he is just focusing in on getting/staying healthy.

I'd love to see Ebanks get some more time, even if only a few minutes. Same with Caracter. Those minutes will add up during the season.

- - -

Justa: Last nights sad Seinfeld moments from the in-law had to do with him going to the market and cooking up some hamburgers - if 'cooking' is what he did to them. I've seen some hamburgers pink on the inside before, but his were partly pink still on the outside too. When all the kids had an 'ugh' reaction from seeing the next-to-raw meat on their plates, he explained to them that meat didn't have to change color to be thoroughly cooked, and the 'blood' is really the 'juice' from the meat. He even did a 'here, watch me take a bite' thing, and even threw in an 'mmmmm' for sound effect.

Thank god only 5 days left... lol


GO LAKERS!!!!!

chemistry...these guys are developing a chemistry that is remarkable. Thanks to Blake, he makes this chemistry so easy to happen...


And we still have Ebanks.....hehe.


His time will come.

Cyber - ewwwwwwww - don't give me nightmares, man! LOL!! Sound effects too huh? This man is serious about his meat LOL!!

Oh the humanity!!! Think of the children!!!!!

Cyber In-Law Watch: 5 days and counting......


Yeah but where is Density when you really need it?

What?? Phil is muddled in a malapropism here. A renegade is a disloyal person, such as a deserter. That hardly characterizes our dedicated bench.

Hi Cali,

you posed an interesting question.. but i'd have to say probably way past the allstar break though its still way too early to tell with too many variables like injuries to really make an educated guess

but first and foremost of course we'll need a healthy bynum and once hes integrated fully back i assume everyone will have to accept new roles which should change the chemistry of the team and mindset of a lot of role players off the bench.

one thing i am sure of is if luke the puke keeps poppin in and out of the lineup he not only kills the benchs chemistry but cohesiveness as well.

justa "Oh the humanity!!! Think of the children!!!!!
Cyber In-Law Watch: 5 days and counting......"
-
LOL!!! I really was thinking of them, imagining all of them getting sick lol. Thank god I have had a sore throat for a few days and had a soup instead - I was soooo glad about that! I was secretly happy the kids were having stomach churning reactions, that'll teach them to appreciate more what I make for them in the future! lol...

Funniest thing though, after seeing their reactions and having them only pick at the meat of their hamburgers, leaving most of it uneaten, the in-law mentions how he thought they were hungry... oh brother... lol

At least the dogs were happy last night LOL =P


GO LAKERS!!!!!

Speaking about Sasha & Luke, and their supposed uselessness, I'm gonna repost a portion of my response back to pfunk here:

I don't think it's fair of you to say these guys have no value. They add to team chemistry. They add to the knowledge given to the new guys. Their contributions may be limited this year, but to say they are of no value is not only disingenuous but downright wrong. We have all see them play with heart and determination. I'm hoping Sasha can get his opportunities and Luke can get healthy. We need a deep, healthy, talented team this year to take on the league and keep what is rightfully ours. Any contribution - no matter how small it may seem to be - is vital to the Lakers success in reaching that goal again.

Cyber - lucky dogs! Bet they'll be sad to see them go.

Cyber In-Law Watch: 5 days & counting...

justa: "Speaking about Sasha & Luke, and their supposed uselessness, I'm gonna repost a portion of my response back to pfunk here:

I don't think it's fair of you to say these guys have no value. They add to team chemistry. They add to the knowledge given to the new guys. Their contributions may be limited this year, but to say they are of no value is not only disingenuous but downright wrong. We have all see them play with heart and determination. I'm hoping Sasha can get his opportunities and Luke can get healthy. We need a deep, healthy, talented team this year to take on the league and keep what is rightfully ours. Any contribution - no matter how small it may seem to be - is vital to the Lakers success in reaching that goal again."

-

Amen! My god, why the single-minded obsession to kick down those two, who have seen next to no minutes over the past few years. Sasha proved his worth last year in game 7, simply coming in cold off the bench and knocking both free throws, well, like a machine! Luke can't even go a week uninjured it seems like, so why keep bashing on the poor kid?

There are also the intangibles they bring, their attitudes on the bench, their friendships with the other players. Sasha seems to be the butt-end of most jokes, Luke may be the most well-liked Laker of all. These guys are good character guys, good people, and for the end of the bench the types of human beings - let alone players - a team should have. Team chemistry does play a role in success, everyone knows that.

But to focus so much on two players that don't play much, did you eat some bad ribs at Luke's food place, or have a secret crush on Anna Sharapova? I don't know what it could be.

Keep on fightin' the good fight justa. These trolls want to see failure by those guys, feed off of it so they can come on here and say 'I told you so' - even if it jeopardizes team success. I think some people would have rather had Sasha miss those free throws and lost a title just so they could have more ammo to bash him with - at least it seems that way!


GO LAKERS!!!!!

Human nature...people will always look to complain or gripe about something...

Thry will find something to be unhappy about...Like the guy who got the best ice cream sundae, and for free...

He will complain, there is no cherry on top...lol

Goes back to the half empty or half full glass...

Be like Cyber...in that whole situation...he found the bright spot...'The dog was happy"

Lakers Dynasty - The Next Generation...

#17 Coming Up!!!

@Faith, beautiful profile from a beautiful lady. Nice to meet you after all these years!
@Jon K congrats on rcotd. Nice.
@Mamba24 Man you are on a musical roll. DeBarge, Shalamar,
EWF... Smoking.
@LRob As always nice musical vibes. Keep em coming.

yellowfever -

I think that you're right that it might be a bit too early to tell if the team will be road warriors; I was just highlighting the fact that the two longest road trips come before the all-star break. I remember Kobe saying something about how teams really show what they are worth when they go on the road for an extended time (although I can't remember if it was last year or the year before).

I think last season they had a long trip in february or march (can't remember at the moment). Once everyone gets back, I think you're right that there will have to be an adjustment period. From the looks of things, that adjustment period should last roughly one practice, given how cohesive the bench is right now.

One other (hopefully thought provoking) question for you: Say we're close to undefeated by the time Andrew is ready to play again. Would you have him come off the bench to play with the bench unit? It would be him, Blake, Brown, Barnes and maybe L.O. - that unit can definitely run, and I can see that Blake would be willing to pass to him (along with L.O.).

Thanks for getting back to me! Hope you're having a good Saturday so far.

LEWSTRS: "Human nature...people will always look to complain or gripe about something...
Thry will find something to be unhappy about...Like the guy who got the best ice cream sundae, and for free...
He will complain, there is no cherry on top...lol
Goes back to the half empty or half full glass...
Be like Cyber...in that whole situation...he found the bright spot...'The dog was happy"

-

That is an excellent point LEWSTRS. I notice that a lot around here. Certain people always seem to dwell on the negative. They can't help themselves it seems.

I know it's been tough for some: we're now mid-dynasty, 3 straight Finals appearances, a couple titles, a deep lineup that is signed for at least the next few years, best owner in sports, best coach in sports, best player in the game, some very nice off-season additions, getting picked by most to win another title and undefeated so far in the season...

I guess all that is left to nitpick are the players that see little minutes if any. What are they to do if Sasha goes 6-for-7 next game with a few assists? Or if Luke comes back strong? Are they going to complain about the Laker girl outfits? It's just curious to see that some people can't cope with a good thing, they gotta find fault with anything. Great point LEWSTRS.


GO LAKERS!!!!!

Hey Cali, how's the early-morning weather in the UK?

Personally, I'd get Bynum back into the starting lineup, but limit his minutes at first so that L.O. can ease back to 6th man role. Whatever PJ does I'm fine with though, who am I to argue with success??? lol...


GO LAKERS!!!!!

Heres a tune my middle son loves. He made a youtube video playing halo using this music.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c7bLO8D9sis

MAMBA24 -

I apologize for not saying hello to you earlier and acknowledging your comment to me. Thank you for the kudos good sir! I am really appreciative with it coming from you.

Hope your Saturday is going well!

CyberCosmiX -

That sounds pretty feasible - have him start, and give him a quick hook at the beginning to ease him back to the grind of the regular season. I could see him playing with the bench because they seem to be such a good unit, and he wouldn't be asked to do too much. I like your idea too.

Weather is cold (around 50 degrees) and damp here. I think that's the reason why my sinuses are acting up. That and late nights waiting to watch the Lakers come on doesn't help things either. lol

How's everything on your end? I could glean from your previous posts that you were having in-law issues? I hope that gets better real fast. :-)

bench name suggestions
next wave
tidal wave
silent storm
lighting strike
purple and blue wrecking crew
the mechanics
the hit squad
hitmen
the contractors

Cali: Ugh, I've also been battling a cold, but the cold/damp weather must not help things.

Outside of the in-law everything is good, but starting to think about another week around Thanksgiving when the mom-in-law comes into town. These visits were more tolerable when we lived in the South Bay, but out here in Apple Valley, with fewer things for them to do, they pretty much stay in the house and it makes it much worse lol.

I'm wondering how you're able to watch the Laker games, I know there is ESPN UK, but the local telecasts like KCAL9 - are you able to catch them somehow?


GO LAKERS!!!!!

oops meant purple and gold wrecking crew

Luke has a rib place?

Jefe101: "Luke has a rib place?"
-
http://www.joeyssmokinbbq.com/

Down in Manhattan Beach. I've never been there, but look forward to trying the Torrance location one of these days. I first heard about on one of those old 'Life With Luke' episodes that used to run on FSW pregame/postgm shows.

Man, looking at the pic from the web-site, I REALLY wish they were close by!!!


GO LAKERS!!!!!

The Bench is rock'n it.

M Geezy!!! You're back??!!

Renegades...hmmmm...I was feelin Killer B's. I guess I'll take it. At least they'll get their own T-shirt come June 2011.

Renegades it is!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWya1uTnPsA

GO LAKERS & IN BUSS WE TRUST!!

frmkt - nice one. Another, faaar older one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qPo3QUWM1Io

Or course, we could always go this way:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gdz3StIpErw

frmkt: "Renegades it is!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWya1uTnPsA
GO LAKERS & IN BUSS WE TRUST!!"
-
May I suggest:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GcG6xt5-iwQ

Very underrated metal band they is...


GO LAKERS!!!!!

LAKERS FANTASY LEAGUE PART DEUZ IS DRAFTING NOW! GET IN THE DRAFT!

I guess Phil called them renegades because they left their team to join the Lakers and now they are working harder than ever. As for Shannon, he also turned down a more lucrative offer and stayed with the lakers so yes the word renegade can be used.

Personally, I prefer the mercs as in mercenaries. I love our team now and it'll only get better not to mention when Drew gets back. Maybe this is the year of 73 wins and 9 losses.

What up, y'all? I'm still battling this nasty chest cold and sinus infection since almost three weeks ago, so my posts are few and far between. However, I must say that "renegades" is pretty cool. Considering that Laker Phil broke it down like he did above, the name is quite fitting. Following Mamba24's groove, here's my musical take on the new nickname...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tqWP1rsAMrw

Title Heaven in 2011!

DBDH!

"pfunk - were you saying Sasha had no value after he sealed the Game 7 victory for us? Justa curious...."


Justanothermamba:


How many times do I have to tell you...........Last weeks meal doesn't satisfy tonight's hunger.......the process must continue. You'd be terrible at running a business...........you get too emotional when decisions need to be made.

Yes those were HUGE freethrows Sasha hit last year...........but that was last year, I mean he was rewarded.........He got to ride in the parade didn't he?

This is a new year and some of the dynamics have changed from last year to this year...........none more important than the addition of Blake and the obvious hard work and improvement of Shannon Brown..............these changes now make Sasha expendable.............it's not personal, I like Sasha........this is strictly business.


Right now Sasha's expiring contract is his biggest worth and value to this team............We could definitely use another big that can defend the post and clog the lane in case one of our other bigs go down

@Jon K- congrats on RCOTD

@Lew - Yep MSU got a real beat down. Oh well, at least they're still in the mix for a BCS bowl game.

@63 Footer - Good Saturday selection. Question...was Ian dogging the Stones on this part of the song?

In 71 all the people come
Bust a few seats but it's just for fun
Take the Mick out of Top of the Pops
We play better than they do

@Cyber - you're definitely having a Seinfeld episode. You can't make this stuff up...lol

@frmkt/63 Footer/Cyber/DBDH - Some fun Renegade selections...I'll throw this in for some funk:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYzakWz3JxU&list=QL&playnext=1

And of course this Renegade classic:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgIGlYsccRM

Dang when are we going to get rid of Luke Walton?? Can we trade him away for a pair of Ron Rons ring raffle tickets??

There is no room for Sasha on this team!!! With the great play of the killer B's and the promise of the young Ebanks, I do not see where Sasha fits. We just dont need him. Who ever thinks other wise. explain!!

LRob - I'm not 100%, but I always thought it was a reference to Mick Ronson, who Mott wanted to play with them after Mick Ralphs left the band. But Ronson went solo (I think), and they ended up with Ariel Bender (Luther Grosvenor, greatest fake name evah!).

But that is only a guess on my part and it could be a reference to Mick Jagger & the Stones. When I look at the lyrics now, that may be the simpler reasoning. I hope someone can 'splain for real.

pfunk - we'll have to agree to disagree for the moment. Let's pick this up later in the season when we see how things are turning out. One of us will be saying 'I'm sorry - you were right'. I think it will be you.... justa sayin..... :)

"Luke can't even go a week uninjured it seems like, so why keep bashing on the poor kid?"

CyberCosmiX


"Poor"? The last time I checked "poor" Luke Walton is guaranteed over $17M the next three years...............If that is "poor" to you.....well like Sollozzo told the Don........"salute"

I don't want to assume however, because you may have mastered both Austrian and Keynesian economic theories...............you may have managed accounts with independent traders set up with your offshore bank acct that yields you 15-30% MONTHLY....................you also may have a keen awareness of how arbitrage+leverage+ compounding interest creates wealth.................this could be you


But that would put you in the top 10% of people in the world let alone the country that could say that Luke's $17M.............is "poor".


If that's not you I would simply say Luke's a big boy..........he's already made more money than what he has actually "earned" as a laker...........this is the real world buddy

LRob - then again, they were on TOTP's in '71 and that's when Exile on Mainstreet was big. I'm so confused. Why couldn't you ask me something easy like: If Luke Walton were a superhero's sidekick, which one would he be?

Answer:

Wonder Woman's sidekick: Etta Candy.

pfunk36- totally agree with you on the sorry Walton and the no value Sasha subjects!!!!

They are the BENCH MOB.
period

GO LAKERS!

@63 Footer - your first explanation seems right. When listening to it I thought it was odd that he'd take a shot at Jagger. But then I thought since Ian was cool with Bowie...and a lot of them from the more underground crew (excluding Bowie) may have resented the Stones because of their mainstream success.

Now I'm over thinking this way too much...lol.

@just: Any contribution - no matter how small it may seem to be - is vital to the Lakers success in reaching that goal again.

----------

I'm totally with you on that one!

--Fearless

LRob - on the other hand, I found this quote from Paul Stepto: "We recorded 'Walkin' With A Mountain' at Olympic Studios in London. During the recording Mick Jagger walked in and started dancing in the control room."

I'm w/"pfunk..." Sasha's expiring contract = huge value and Luke is definitely not "poor." I hate seeing these high paid athletes being paid to wear street clothes on the bench or warmups for an entire game; they take away money that could be used to improve the team. But that's contract sports. I mean, look at "drew." Again, I have no problem with these guys making me eat my words because I'd rather see them produce than to be right.

Anyway, "Killer B's" should be reserved for the Hornets whenever they secure a "killer" bench. PJ likes Renegades and at the very least, we should like it too! This is his YEAR...His Time & his team. If and when "drew" gets back, LO goes back to the bench and we will see them "wax" their opponents on a regular basis. Without a legit 5, teams will feel that they have a shot at the Lakers each and every game.

Keep an eye out for Monta Ellis tomorrow night. He appears to be a legit scoring machine - sorry Sasha.

Love the "tunage," so keep em' comin'!

GO LAKERS!!

Cali

IMO the answer to your question will depend entirely on the play of bynum himself.. Will we see a hesitant bynum favoring one leg or will he ever regain beastlike status? No doubt lakers can win as long as he's on the floor as was evident last playoffs but If its the former no way he deserves starter minutes but probably spot minutes instead.. Now if its the latter (note very unlikely) lookout nba and I say feed the beast and ride him like zorro!

I'm also very eager to see how long odom can keep up this rebounding barrage.. Most of us like to think he's turned a corner but its only been 2 games and he's probably still riding that emotional olympic high.

Naaah, Music. Bench Mob was Jordan, Sasha, Josh, DJ & the boys. That was then. RENEGADES (headed by the Killer B's) IS NOW!

Renegades is an appropriate name for a bunch who takes over the job and move on efficiently to the next level. They run, shoot and defend in a single motion, no more standing around or spending too much time dribbling under the legs or going to the post in suicide fashion that leads to T/O. The renegade bunch looks for the open man and not afraid to take an open shot because they have confidence with their ability not too dependent on Kobe nor let the triangle do the shooting. Look at the score box, PJ played 9 players and 6 have double digits and B & B are combined with 14 pts. That's a renegade production never been achieved before except during the Showtime. Lakers have not fortified the control of the post in absence of Bynum so things could still improve in that area. I hope Ebanks, Sasha and Caracter would be able to play in the next game, however it is also good to keep them as hungry or eager beaver.

At this time, these are the groans of Sasha:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZsYfHpFl9qY

Lewstrs....I like Renegades, but I'm with you I kinda like your Bad Boys!!!Nice ring to it.What you going to when Phil calls on you?

gotta go with the coach's tag....

they play like a bunch of renegades

I like the way they hit threes and act like its normal

i wanna be a renegade

WOW I don't think I've ever heard Phil say anything so positive so quickly.

And, I love how Luke refers to the second unit as "they" as if he were not a part of it!!

GOOOooooOOOO LAKERS RENEGADES !!!

Phil Jackson should consider giving Fisher, Blake & Brown an average of about 18 minutes a game and Sasha an average of about 10 minutes a game. Sasha needs to help the Laker guards achieve a higher shooting percentage and to provide a different defensive look. Lakers need to improve team defense against easy lay ups the fast point guards keep getting. The Celtics and Heat are already playing team defense at a higher level than the Lakers. Burn-out should be avoided by limiting the average minutes played, not by slacking off on defense which leads to inconsistency in the play-offs and inadequate mental toughness for a championship team! Blake & Brown would do well to emulate Rondos intensity, anticipation & effort to give his team more possessions every game!

I want the last 2 minutes of my life back!

I ABSOLUTELY FRICKEN LOVE THE NAME "THE RENEGADES" AND I WILL USE IT FROM NOW ON!
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My only concerns about this team are Luke Walton and Andrew Bynum. I'm fearful that both are injury plagued. I'm less worried about Luke's spirit than I am Andrew's. If healthy, Luke will do whatever he needs to do to get the job done. Andrew (whom I'd love to play a game of D&D with)... I'm less sure. I really want him to have that obsessive wolverine-like urge to destroy his opponents (which I have), but I'm kind of worried that he may have a Generation Y "It's all good!" view that inhibits a person from being their best.
-
I say this with certainty... Andrew Bynum is a Hall of Fame player... but his competitive spirit needs to catch up with his physical and intellectual capabilities.
-
What do we play for? RINGS!!!
-
Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.
-
GO LAKERS!!!

What?? Phil is muddled in a malapropism here. A renegade is a disloyal person, such as a deserter. That hardly characterizes our dedicated bench.
Posted by: Allnet | October 30, 2010 at 04:31 PM

Actually, Phil knows what he is talking about.

The 'great' Laker championship teams have always been made up of deserters from other squads, and for an organization and fan base so deficient of honor, what's in a name anyway?

'We don't play for honor, we play for rings!!!'

'Renegades' actually has a nice familiar ring to it.
Almost something to boast about.

On the other hand, a name like the 'Cuckoo Birds' might be an even better fit,
as it suggests brood parasitism which is even more closely identified with the Laker M.O.

Hmmm. You've got some good choices there.
Nice work Phil. On the money as ususal.

Go Kings!
Go Giants!
Oregon Ducks! Gave the Socal quitters a good spankin'!
Go Manny, go!

Sonnybelfast



Justanothermambafan and CyberCosmiX -

If I'm not mistaken, pfunk is using the terms "poor" and "value" solely in the economic sense of the word, which does not imply that it supersedes other uses of the term. So Luke can still be poor even though he is a millionaire, and Sasha can have value beyond his expiring contract.

Let's not allow economic imperialism to rule the day regarding linguistic terms. Besides, economics has enough issues with trying to be a "science" like some econometricians purport to say it is. Especially if the concept of utility is either (a) ambiguous or (b) subjective in nature - that's plenty enough to give the discipline issues, and I'm not even getting into the concept of rationality (bounded or not).

Yellowfever -

If Andrew comes back like he did when he stood up to Shaq, I think we will dismantle teams in a way that I haven't seen in quite some time. (I'm thinking of that playoff run when we went 16-1 or 15-1). If his body language implies that he's still a bit unsure in himself, would you play him minutes like Yao?

And if L.O. is on a high from getting a gold medal, I need to find a legal chemical substitute or something for him so that his high won't wear off. I'm thinking he'll have a high rebounding game against Golden State, but he'll have to deal with David Lee, and Lee is a pretty good rebounder as well.

i can't say that my opinion of a player has ever had anything to do with how much money he made. just like in the real world, there are many who make much who are unproductive and there are many who do their job well, but it's not so obvious what they really do for the money. arguments based on how much money a player makes are pointless and weak.


it's also pointless and weak to hate on players who can't crack the rotation, but practice hard and are ready to play when called on. being ready to play is all that a bench player can be asked to do.

there's no need to wish to "lord" over players as some make-believe GM/Furer/plantation owner with crys of "business". first, just because some people with power do take the attitude that human beings are nothing more than mechanisms to their own happiness and power doesn't mean that really a good way to be. second, it really doesn't matter how great any of our thoughts might be out here in audience land, when it comes to the Lakers. we can complain to the FO and we can cheer. that's it. hooray! we won last night and the team looks good! we're going to need EVERYBODY'S best effort to win another championship. from the waterboy to the last guy on the bench, from the jock-sorter to Kobe, we need them all.

if Mitch finds better players and can make a deal to improve the team, i think he will. the Lakers have obviously made a serious effort in the last three years to stay at the top, and so far, this looks like the best team yet. it's HEALTH that we need to pray for.

*yawn* ... I ain't impressed with our bench play ... we're allowing 108pts per game

Don't get me wrong ... I'm not complaining cuz it's just been 2 games ... but after back 2 back championship, it's gonna take a whole lot more 2 impress me ... jus sayin

108pts/game given up by the defense = renesoft

ARISE OH MIGHTY LAKER NATION!!! THE WORLD IS OURS!!!!
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AND NOW THE LAKERS NATIONS ANTHEM : http://tinyurl.com/ylp3qqc _ I Love LA
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PEOPLE WE ARE FAMOUS!!! You don't think Phil Picked the name RENEGADE by chance and the first person he tells is MM? Think Folks" RENEGADE CHAT" He was sending a message that he reads the blog. He couldn't just come out and say it cause how would it look for Phil the Cerebral Intelectual to admit reading Blogs. Sonny Belfast caught it also. SO THERE IT IS!!!

Like umm wow u'd think we were the milwaukee bucks or sumthn ... this is y y'all need a sheriff ... like enough of d hoopla y'all ... didn't we start like 15-1 with farmarr throwing it down ... and where's LakerTom, u feeling blake? I mean farmarr was ya boi wasn't he?

pfunk36,
"Yes those were HUGE freethrows Sasha hit last year...........but that was last year, I mean he was rewarded.........He got to ride in the parade didn't he?"

Yeah until blake twists an ankle and then u need another shooter ... Besides those free throws demonstrate a mental toughness ...

As for Luke, umm I was gonna say PJ sees him as a son so he does add value by giving Phil incentive to keep coaching the Lakers ... but umm u ain't a fan of PJ so umm idk ... Luke adds chemistry to the team, that's the company line and we're sticking to it

SHERIFF!!!!! How you doing my brother. So, it's going to take a whole lot to impress you. Then I think this season is made for you cause when it's over...THE WHOLE DAMN WORLD WILL BE IMPRESSED!!! 9Rings is pulling out all the stops and doing things he never does. Going with the hot hand instead of a set rotation, praising and trusting the Rooks. Mannnnn to quote Laker Tom, This will be a season for the ages. So just sit back and enjoy the ride homey!!!

Has anyone noticed that the Lakers are now committing the least TURNOVERS in the league with only 11.5 per game?

That is HUGE. Before the season even started I saw that this team by adding Steve Blake to the line-up would probably drastically lower turnovers. Farmar was the main reason this team was not better at handling the ball. Committing 13.4 turnovers last year, while that is not not bad. There was definitely room for improvement in that area.

I think it's a little early to try and come up with a nickname for the bench or form too many judgements just yet. They've only played two games against two teams that didn't even make the playoffs last year. I look forward to seeing how they (the whole team) do against some tougher competition but that's going to be a while. In November only Denver and Portland and maybe Memphis or on the road at Milwaukee present a challenge. If this team is as good as it appears they could be undefeated right up into the Christmas day game against Miami or be something like 25-4.
As Segeboy reminded us, last years team started 15-1.

But back to the bench.
I like what Blake said, ("We're not going to worry about nicknames").

Maybe Phil thinks a nickname will help to forge an identity.

Perhaps "terriers" might be a fit.
They are fearless, tenacious, they don't get intimidated or care how big or strong an opponent is and they never give up.

And as Brown said, ("They're fierce. They don't play many games, but they're close knit together. They won't let nobody mess with them.").

Killer B's. I like it. It came to my mind, too, but not just to describe the 3.

Bryant,
Bynum,
Brown,
Blake,
Barnes and (E)Banks.

Renegades? Like it. Renegades as in a "close-knit band of warriors, coming in from the cold to give it up in a last-ditch rush for Redemption."

And they're gellin.' Looking good. Now where, oh where art thou, Good Master Bynum?

Jon K.,

"Andrew Bynum is a Hall of Fame player... but his competitive spirit needs to catch up with his physical and intellectual capabilities."

He has to prove his worth first before considering him a HOF'er and for that matter play a complete season next year.

If Luke and Sasha will not play this first half, at least they add chemistry by giving the Lakers a handsome faces. It is like going to a mall sometimes you're attracted by the mannequins not for sale but for display.


GAME DAY BABYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!!!!!
WE ARE THE FREAKIN 16 TIME NBA CHAMPION 4 DYNASTY LA LAKERS
THAT'S WHO THE HELL WE ARE!!!!!!!!!!!!
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http://tinyurl.com/ylp3qqc _ I Love LA
http://tinyurl.com/2c3uutk - IT’S TIME FOR WAR
http://tinyurl.com/26p8aet LETS GET DIRTY


TELL ME THIS AINT THE FREAKIN GOAT!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0fUfYUqw0jU&feature=related KOBE BLACK MAMBA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTCYgHrEyVs&feature=related - till I COLLASPE KOBE BRYANT

PEOPLE, PEOPLE, PEOPLE!!! TELL ME THIS IS NOT THE FREAKIN GOAT!~!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-s9QFm51Lu4&feature=related

If Luke and Sasha will not play this first half, at least they add chemistry by giving the Lakers a handsome faces. It is like going to a mall sometimes you're attracted by the mannequins not for sale but for display.

Posted by: Edwin Gueco | October 31, 2010 at 06:38 AM

Hilarious! lol

Not going to get into the Drew thang (th0ugh I do have my opinions, that's all they are), but I hope to see more than one dunk on Shaq from years ago this year. I hope it becomes a regular thing.

Sasha & Luke, they're here and they work hard, and that's that. Phil makes the call on playing time, and if they suck as bad as some people here think, then I'm sure Phil won't play them very much (if at all). Hey, who was in the 4th quarter the other day? This could really be Phil's last year - he's going to want the W real bad.

Two of my favorite Sunday songs:

From the man who wrote it (Kris) and the man who first covered it (Johnny):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RLiuPRMJy8

And of course, the Velvets:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0cWzxJvgWc8

If Luke and Sasha will not play this first half, at least they add chemistry by giving the Lakers a handsome faces. It is like going to a mall sometimes you're attracted by the mannequins not for sale but for display. Posted by: Edwin Gueco | October 31, 2010 at 06:38 AM
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Hilarious! lol Posted by: Caliphilosopher | October 31, 2010 at 08:08 AM
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Pleas Cali, please tell me. What the frak does it mean? LOL! Just playing with ya Edwin!

Good morning 63 Footer & Caliphilosopher! Hope both of your weekends are going well. I smell a huge victory tonight!!!!

MAMBA24 - mornin' right back atcha.

Monta Ellis has been going off pretty good lately, though - so I'm not counting any w-chickens before they're hatched. Mmmm, w-chicken. I could eat a whole bunch of w-wings tonight though.

Here's a chicken song from the always ahead-of-his-time (even now) Mr. Zappa:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vZyI91emzYE

And a little sumethin' somethin' 'bout wings (with Duane on slide):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLPHz8KT9No

Usually I just ignore the Luke and Sasha haters, but their, ummmm, renegade-like persistence just cries out for a beatdown this morning. So here ya go.

Posters who constantly diss weak, injured, or non-playing members of championship teams typically do so for one of two reasons. In some cases, they are loudmouths who pretend to have a great knowledge of a game they themselves never excelled at, and who use the "beat up on the weak kid" routine as a cover for their own feelings of inadequacy. In other words, they're the very kids who always got picked last when choosing up teams, or who "got to play right field" in T-ball (or whose Mom got them into soccer...same thing).

The other type did play a little ball, now have just enough knowledge to pretend expertise, but who never in fact were on a championship team on any level. Those of us who have in fact been on a championship team know EXACTLY why Luke and Sasha have CONTINUED VALUE on this team, and why Phil Jackson continues to demonstrate why he personally, the greatest basketball coach ever, continues to value them, appreciate them, and obviously have warm feelings for both of them. They work hard. They contribute to team chemistry (yes, that's a BIG deal on championship teams). They support the guys who play ahead of them. They do the little things that great coaches know great teams need to keep winning.

In other words, Luke and Sasha haters, YOU DON'T KNOW SQUAT ABOUT CHAMPIONSHIP TEAMS. Move along. You are dismissed.

We want a nickname that is a little nasty, that strikes fear in the opponents' hearts:

The Justin B-bers.

{Running for cover....}

CornerJ - not going to go there with you on the two "types" of Sasha/Luke haters, but about role-players on championship teams: I'm with you all the way. (And not just teams, any group of people that have to function at a high level for long periods of time, like, say... oh, television seasons.)

Anyway, one thing role players can do is increase the longevity of the team over not just the season, but lots of seasons. Guys like Kobe can be difficult to hang with over the years... not in an unlikeable way, but in a they-are-so-focused-so-intense way that it's wearing. And if there are a bunch of other "stars" all pushing their own agendas, it can make for bad chemistry over time. Take Shaq - seriously, I thought we had a few more championships there if he had stayed (and with a good attitude).

The silly cliche: too many chiefs, not enough Native Americans can be true. You have to have some people who just enjoy "being" part of the whole thing, who work hard, keep a great attitude, but aren't trying to run the show, or going off on their own tangent (which was why I thought Jordan had to go, and good luck to him on the Nets).

One of the reasons I think Pau and Lamar compliment Kobe so well is they're able to shine without grabbing the spotlight, trying to wrench it away. Our new additions do the same, and don't get me started on Ron Ron's great 'tude.

Anyway, it's early, and I'm using far too many words for something rather unimportant in that Phil will play the rotations he deems best for the situation, and his track record has been mighty good with that.

Randy in Winnipeg - You can run, but you can't hide! We WILL find you and make you pay for that comment! Painfully. Slowly. To the lilting melody of the Biebster's "Baby." Oh, it WILL be horrible.

Randy in Winnipeg - You can run, but you can't hide! We WILL find you and make you pay for that comment! Painfully. Slowly. To the lilting melody of the Biebster's "Baby." Oh, it WILL be horrible. Posted by: 63 Footer | October 31, 2010 at 08:50 AM
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SWEET JESUS!!! ROTFLMAO!!

63 Footer, your version of the importance of role players in all walks of life was very measured and diplomatic. Normally, I prefer that style myself. But the constant, chihuahua-on-crystalmeth-like yapping just took me over the edge with these incessant Luke and Sasha haters. And I take nothing back. I meant every word.

Enough already. We've got rings to play for. And both Luke and Sasha are going to contribute to #17 some way, somehow.

But the constant, chihuahua-on-crystalmeth-like yapping just took me over the edge with these incessant Luke and Sasha haters. And I take nothing back. I meant every word. Enough already. We've got rings to play for. And both Luke and Sasha are going to contribute to #17 some way, somehow. Posted by: CornerJ | October 31, 2010 at 09:05 AM
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GOD@@$%%^%^#$#!!!!! OUT FREAKIN STANDING SIR!!!!! Carry On!

Yes Mamba24, Kobe is an outfreakin' goat that separates him from past superstars. Who among the past Superstars played the opening of the season @ 75% effective and after getting 5 rings still wants to win? It is mind boggling that the brain takes over in ask legs to perform and excel. Others enjoy prolonged inactivity and readily convinced themselves that they are disabled. I'm not referring to our injured players but to other Superstars who are known for their prolonged injuries and simultaneously enjoyed rich contracts in their career like Greg Oden, Kenyon Martin or HOF'er Bill Walton. Injuries and rich contracts are inter related in their career. Why do we have to compare Kobe to MJ, or LBJ who have never played @ 75% effective. Kobe deserved every freakin' dollar given to him and gives back 100% rate of return.

I also agree with Art Fl....we ain't seen nothing yet! There is not enough sample to conclude what would happen in June. I also agree with what Blake said that Titles are not that important. It may distinguish or identify the period sloppiness compared to a unit wanting to excel among Laker bench eras.

I would like to quote a period of French history during the time of Napoleon Bonaparte. Napoleon was a military genius who has penchant in giving titles, he gave himself a title of First Consul as he led the French Army to victories, then as he continued his military supremacy, he created a better title to First Consular for Life. He won in Italy, he became King of Italy. He occupied the countries along Rhine river, he coined a new title of Protector of Confederation of Rhine. As he marched to Spain and Russia, he became lonely with lofty titles so he named himself Emperor of France and start of monarchical period, Napoleon I. When he was defeated and finally exiled in the island of St. Helena, he lowered his status to be a humble emperor of his own garden. After his death, the French preserved his memory by burying him at the place of their soldiers at Les Invalides which became a tourist spot. Therefore that's what titles represent, sometimes they are used as a form of motivation by creating attention to satisfying egos. lol!

When he was defeated and finally exiled in the island of St. Helena, he lowered his status to be a humble emperor of his own garden. After his death, the French preserved his memory by burying him at the place of their soldiers at Les Invalides which became a tourist spot. Therefore that's what titles represent, sometimes they are used as a form of motivation by creating attention to satisfying egos. lol! Posted by: Edwin Gueco | October 31, 2010 at 09:07 AM
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AW HELL YEAH!! Where else would you get an education on Napolean while discussing the GOAT? Therefore, yes I have to say it...OUT FREAKIN STANDING SIR!!!!

I watch (3) Teams trade down, Boston, Lakers, and Orlando Magic. Steve Blake, Matt Barnes just doesn't fit in with the Lakers like Jordan Farmar and Sasha Vujacic these guy were all on the same page. Odom, Brown, Farmar, and Vujacic on the floor was great together.
Lamar and Brown were the Lakers bench, i don't remember Blake or Barnes making baskets, i am sure they did, but they were so few until i don't remember them.
D.J. Mbenga played better than these two guys, say good by and move on.


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