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Sizing up the next possible Lakers Hall of Fame candidates

34004897

Tex Winter

Credentials: Winter was a key architect of the triangle offense, which helped spur 11 NBA titles with Lakers Coach Phil Jackson. He had head coaching stints at with the Houston Rockets as well as at Marquette, Northwestern, Long Beach State and Kansas State, where he was named the UPI Coach of the Year in 1959. He had assistant coaching gigs with the Chicago Bulls and Los Angeles Lakers and was also the chairman for several years of the National Association of Basketball Coaches.

Chances of getting in: It's sad to say that the chances for the innovator of the triangle offense to get into the Hall of Fame are slim. But that's the reality. Winter was inducted into the National Collegiate Basketball Hall of Fame in February and received the John Bunn Award from the Naismith Hall of Fame in 1998, which recognized him as a contributor to the game. When Winter received the Chuck Daly Lifetime Achievement Award prior to Game 2 of the 2010 NBA Finals, Winter's son, Chris, told reporters that Tex had received seven nominations to be inducted, though the limit is supposed to be five. When it was announced in April that Lakers owner Jerry Buss would be inducted in this year's class, Lakers Coach Phil Jackson shared that throughout his tenure with the Chicago Bulls he engaged in letter-writing campaign so that his long-time mentor would get his due. "It's like Tex says, he's outlived all his contemporaries," Jackson said of Winter, who had been an active consultant with the Lakers until suffering a stroke in April 2009. "It's a hard shot for him to get in."

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Kobe Bryant

Credentials: Bryant lived up to the hype and then some ever since impressing the Lower Merion  (Pa.) high schooler impressed Jerry West during his pre-draft workout. After collecting his fifth NBA championship last season, he's brought continual debate on whether he'll surpass Michael Jordan as the league's all-time greatest player and whether he'll be considered the Lakers' greatest player of all time. There have been rough patches, particularly early in his career, with his scoring mentality and aggressive play disrupting team chemistry. But no one can match Bryant's work ethic, clutch shooting and love of the game. His other achievements include two Finals and one regular-season MVP, a gold medal from the Beijing Olympics, 11 All-NBA honors, nine NBA all-defensive honors, a 12th-place standing on the league's all-time scoring list and surpassing West as the Lakers' all-time leading scorer.

Chances of getting in: This isn't a matter of if, but when. Players must be fully retired for five years before being eligible for enshrinement, so the timing of this all depends on whenever Bryant hangs up his laces. Bryant recently signed a three-year contract extension that will keep him with the Lakers through the 2013-2014 season. If Bryant retires after that, that means the earliest time he'd get inducted would be in 2019.

36691584

Shaquille O'Neal

Credentials: As one of the most physically imposing dominant big men of his time, Shaq's bullying size made him nearly impossible to stop in the lane. Teams addressed that issue with the Hack-a-Shaq  strategy because of his poor free-throw shooting, and O'Neal didn't have the best conditioning/work habits. But no one can understate that he is one of the league's all-time elite centers, or discount his four championships and his gold medal from the Atlanta Olympics.

Chances of getting in: Laker fans may not like it now, but O'Neal's contributions to the Lakers' three-peat in 2000-2002 can't suddenly go away. He'll definitely get in. Given Shaq's tendency to trash every former coach and organization he's played for, I'm curious what his speech entails and what exactly he'll say about his time with the Lakers.

54102381

Pau Gasol

Credentials: Gasol has compiled equally impressive accolades in both the NBA and in international play. After the Lakers acquired him from Memphis in February 2008, he helped guide L.A. to three consecutive Finals appearances and two NBA championships. Gasol has since shed his "soft" tag by not backing away from physical contact, while still embracing his finesse game, mid-range abilities and basketball intelligence, three qualities that make him one of the top forwards in the game. Internationally, Gasol is considered one of the top Spanish players, helping FC Barcelona to the 2001 Spanish National Cup with MVP honors, winning gold at the 2006 FIBA World Championships and collecting silver in the Beijing Olympics.

Chances of getting in: Gasol's body of work at this current stage of his career is solid enough. But Gasol has plenty of years of basketball left entering his 10th season in the NBA and being under contract with the Lakers through the 2013-2014 season.

6a00d8341c506253ef0134852b4230970c-320wi

Derek Fisher

Credentials: Fisher is a strong catalyst for the Lakers' five championships since the 1999-2000 season, and his veteran presence has always helped keep the locker room intact. He has also played in 199 career playoff games, the fifth-highest total in NBA history, ranks second all-time in NBA Finals three-pointers made (43) and has the highest three-point field-goal percentage in NBA Finals history (42.6%).  Fisher has had some memorable playoff moments.  He hit the  game-winner with .04 of a second left against San Antonio in Game 5 of the 2004 Western Conference semifinals. His three-pointer with 4.6 seconds remaining in regulation tied the game and his three-pointer with 31.3 seconds left in overtime helped secure the Lakers victory against Orlando in Game 4 of the 2009 NBA Finals. Fisher's three-pointer with 28 seconds left gave the Lakers a one-point lead over Utah in Game 3 of the 2010 Western Conference semifinals. He scored five of the team's last 11 points in the Lakers' win over Phoenix in Game 5 of the 2010 Western Conference Semifinals. Fisher's 11 fourth-quarter points sealed the Lakers' Game 3 victory over the Boston Celtics in the 2010 NBA Finals. And his three-pointer that tied the game at 64, Jackson said,  "changed the complexity of the game" in the Lakers' Game 7 win over Boston in the NBA Finals. Nonetheless, Fisher has always been a role player, and has gone through stretches where his shooting and defense were inconsistent.

Chances of getting in: It's a tossup, considering Fisher's career is more defined by his presence than actual statistics. His clutch performances in the postseason should give him a boost.

29241944

Robert Horry

Credentials: Big Shot Rob has seven NBA championships, including three with the Lakers, is one of only two players to have won a title with three different teams and is one of nine players to have won at least seven championships. Horry also holds plenty of playoff records, including being second all-time for three-pointers made in the postseason (237), first in the NBA Finals (53) and consecutive three-pointers made in the playoffs (seven). Horry made a game-clinching three-pointer in at least one game in four straight playoff series during the Lakers' three-peat from 2000 to 2002. Some of his big shots with the Lakers: making seven three-pointers in the Lakers' Game 2 loss to Utah in the 1997 Western Conference semifinals, making a corner three-pointer and four free throws in the final minute of the Lakers' Game 3 victory over the Philadelphia 76ers in the 2001 NBA Finals, a game-winning three-pointer with 10.2 seconds left in the Lakers' Game 3 victory over the Portland Trail Blazers in the first round of the 2002 NBA playoffs, and a game-winning trey at the top of the key as time expired in the Lakers' Game 4 win over the Sacramento Kings in the 2002 Western Conference Finals.

Chances of getting in: If you measure it on playoff performances, Horry is a shoo-in. If you also equate his regular-season contributions, it's a little less clear. He averaged only seven points on 34.1% shooting during the regular season of his 17-year-career.

-- Mark Medina

Follow the L.A. Times Lakers blog on Twitter: twitter.com/latmedina. E-mail the Lakers blog at mgmedin@gmail.com

Top photo:  Tex Winter. Credit: Associated Press.

Second photo: Kobe Bryant's induction into the Hall of Fame is a given. Credit: Wally Skalij / Los Angeles Times

Third photo: Shaq is a no-brainer for the Hall of Fame. Credit: Mike Blake /Reuters

Fourth photo: Lakers forward Pau Gasol has plenty of accolades from the NBA and international play. Credit: Wally Skalij / Los Angeles Times

Photo: Lakers guard Derek Fisher may get into the Hall of Fame because of his playoff performances. Credit: Alex Gallardo/Los Angeles Times.

Photo: Robert Horry's three-point shot over the outstretched arm of Sacramento's Chris Webber in the final seconds of Game 4 evened the Western Conference finals in 2002. Credit: Associated Press

 
Comments () | Archives (87)

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If Bobby Hurley Sr. got in, then Tex Winter should most definitily be in.
Fisher and Horry are playoff studs, but not sure how they will fare.

It's a travesty - an absolute TRAVESTY - that Tex isn't in already.


NO TEX IN THE HOF??? NO PEACE!!!!

MM - Excellent topic.

Tex Winter - Unfortunately you're probably right about his chances being slim. You would think that MJ, Phil, Scottie and Kobe could just storm the committee and say enough already put Tex in.

Fish and Horry - No way. No how. I love their contributions and the Lakers would certainly have a lot fewer titles without them, but their numbers are just not HOF worthy.

Pau - He's on course. Give us 5 more years at 17/9 and he's a lock.

Would someone please get Artis Gilmore into the HOF. It's unbelievable that he's #5 all-time rebounder (NBA/ABA) and #20 all-time scoring (NBA/ABA) and he's not in. Yes, his best years were in the ABA...but he certainly shouldn't be punished for that. It's the Basketball HOF...not the NBA HOF. And next up after the A-Train is Bernard King.

Mitch Kupchack for building the best NBA team ever in 2010-2011 season.

Duncan, at the PF, averaged 21/11
Robinson, at the C & arguably the best C playing at the time, averaged 15/10 w/ 1.5 blocks.
Posted by: hobbitmage | August 20, 2010 at 08:47 AM

Hobbit,

DRob was outstanding, but Shaq was best center in 1999...no argument there. (Also I think that was Zo's big year where he was top 5 in MVP votes) There seemed to be some confusion on your post about two HOFers. I thought you were referring to DRob and Duncan right?

LRob,

you wrote: DRob was outstanding, but Shaq was best center in 1999...no argument there. (Also I think that was Zo's big year where he was top 5 in MVP votes) There seemed to be some confusion on your post about two HOFers. I thought you were referring to DRob and Duncan right?

my response: Otis & Art were asking about Lakers, as I understood their
question. The HOFers on the Spurs are DRob & Duncan.

MM, I'm surprised you didn't include Bynum in your write up. Is it too early to stir the pot? LOL.

Ok, I get it now RE: Robinson and Duncan as the HOF'ers.
When you wrote "we", I figured you meant the Lakers, but after reading through your initial post I see it clearly now what was meant.

BTW hobbitmage,

The bridge to nowhere remark was meant to mean that's how I felt 'our' discussions went, not all of yours with other people. That's for them to decide.

Fisher's chances "a tossup"? It's a little early in the day to start drinking, don't you think?

LakerJ - very funny.

At some point, hopefully after the season starts, we can have an open mic session for those to voice their individual cases for who is playing well and who isn't.

I just hope that I will get my turn at the mic to gather up, research, over-analyze and declare all the reasons why D-Fish is an HOF'er and how great he's playing within the concept of this new season.

In the meantime, I think given the last few blog days and antsy, jittery Lakerholics looking for their next fix, we should just focus on the TEAM and not individual players.

Cheers.

How is Tex Winters not in the Hall of Fame?


It's just plain wrong.


What do we play for? RINGS!!!


Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.


GO LAKERS!!!

PLG - you're talking crazy. You may be the next to be banned.


:)

*
PUT TEX WINTER IN HALL OF FAME NOW – BANDWAGON
ELEVEN RINGS AND COUNTING – How you like that HALL OF FAME
*
(00) KOBE BYANT - When Kobe came out from the locker room the stopped to give Tex a squeeze.
(01) LAKERTOM – OWNER - You know, all our little bandwagons are a lot of fun but the one bandwagon that we really ought to use the power of the Blog to get rolling would be a Tex Winter Hall of Fame Bandwagon. We could even get Lakers and other NBA players to sign as well as every Lakers fan who reads or posts on the blog. Tex deserves to get in while he is still around
(02)JUSTAANOTHERMAMBAFAN - DRIVER - It's a travesty - an absolute TRAVESTY - that Tex isn't in already. NO TEX IN THE HOF??? NO PEACE!!!!
(03) MAMBA24 - RIDING SHOTGUN - NO TEX IN THE HOF??? NO PEACE !!!!
(04) JON KK - SECURITY - How is Tex Winters not in the Hall of Fame? It's just plain wrong.
(05) E – I agree with Tom. Tex Winter deserves every detail of that Hall of Fame trophy.
I hope there's gonna be a 'Thank you Tex' banner hanging at Staples on opening night.
(06 CALIPHILOSOPHER - Sign me up for the Tex Winter bandwagon.
(07) KT – I’m on the Tex Winter HOF Bandwagon. I'm happy that he's well enough to be there tonight.
(08) VMAN - The Hall is diminished by not having Tex. Hopefully, this is the year.
(09 KOBEBLITZ - Tex Winters has been one of the most brilliant basketball minds. It is his offense that made Michael Jordan from a isolation plays shot jacker to a team player that became one of the greatest of all time. His emphasis on team play gave the Bulls the team of the decade. TEAM play was his model. Not the isolation, less fundamental, more jacking up shots, highlight reel plays of today. It helped make Michael what he is today and help made Shaq help being the most dominant center of his time. Kobe I'm hoping stays more in the offense and score more efficiently. Get well Tex. Our thoughts and prayers go out to Tex and his family.
(10) LAKER FAN 24 – Get well soon Tex
(11 BOZZ - Get well soon Tex, this Rings for y ou.
(12) IN THE ZEN MNASTER WE TRUST - Best wishes to Tex for a speedy and full recovery.
(13) EDWIN GUECO - Get Well Soon, our prayers from the Lakers Blog family
(14) BAYWOOD - Outspoken and Dedicated. He's put his full mark on the team we love.
(15) BENJAMIN - Tex, get well soon and thanks for the offense!
(16) LAKER TOM - Sad News about Tex. Get well soon and recover fully, Tex. We love you
and you’ll be in our prayers. We win tonight for you.
(17) OMEGA - best wishes to Tex and his family
(18) EJK - Best wishes to Tex. I'm guessing he pulls through this and is able to celebrate with us in June. It would be a shame if the Lakers don't come out tonight and get a win for Tex..
(19) BUTLER - The fans of the PHX SUNS wish the best to Tex Winter in his recovery
(20 FAN OF THE MAMBA - Get well soon Tex, our prayers go out to you and your family.
(21) RETURN OF THE PURPLE AND GOLD ASSASIN - Basketball is this man's life. He has contributed immeasurably with knowledge and passion to the best game on Earth. Now Let's go get a win for Tex!
(22) TOM DANIELS - Best wishes for Tex. I have long admired his lifelong push for baketball to be played the right way, to, as he puts it, please the basketball gods. A great mind and a feisty coach not at all intimidated by big salaries and big egos. All the best for a full and speedy recovery, I hope he is up and watching his Lakers again soon.
(23) JOHN IN HOUSTON - We're Pulling for you in Houston Tex Thanks for all the hard work and all the memories Tex. We are praying for your health and for your family.
(24) LAKERMAN420 This toke’s for Tex & his family & extended Laker family. WE’RE PULLING FOR YOU. (26) BRONXLAKERFAN May God help Mr. Winters and his family through this most difficult time. Mr. Winters has lived a long and distinguished life. I hope he recovers.
(25) SEGEBOY/TALIQ/SHERIFF – NO TEX WINTER IN HOF NO PEACE!!! Sign that winter bandwaggon as "10 rings and counting, you shame yourselves by refusing to acknowledge that the triangle offense and its architect has been an integral part of all those championships. Do the right thing people, acknowledge what is already in the history books instead of trying to explain it away"
(26) LAKERNORTH – I have to be on your bandwagon Tex
(27) EASTCOASTJESSIE – Can't wait to see tonight's ceremony...I might just cry


Justa - those are fightin words.

:)

the more fan pressure we give and persistence of it, (and media support) im sure the committee will ultimately decide upon entering Tex into the HOF. He well deserves it. It is his strategies and work on basketball that completely changed the game or at least, 11 of the last few championships of the modern time.

*
PUT TEX WINTER IN HALL OF FAME NOW – BANDWAGON
ELEVEN RINGS AND COUNTING – How you like that HALL OF FAME
*
(00) KOBE BYANT - When Kobe came out from the locker room the stopped to give Tex a squeeze.
(01) LAKERTOM – OWNER - You know, all our little bandwagons are a lot of fun but the one bandwagon that we really ought to use the power of the Blog to get rolling would be a Tex Winter Hall of Fame Bandwagon. We could even get Lakers and other NBA players to sign as well as every Lakers fan who reads or posts on the blog. Tex deserves to get in while he is still around
(02)JUSTAANOTHERMAMBAFAN - DRIVER - It's a travesty - an absolute TRAVESTY - that Tex isn't in already. NO TEX IN THE HOF??? NO PEACE!!!!
(03) MAMBA24 - RIDING SHOTGUN - NO TEX IN THE HOF??? NO PEACE !!!!
(04) JON KK - SECURITY - How is Tex Winters not in the Hall of Fame? It's just plain wrong.
"
"
(28) BRIAN - the more fan pressure we give and persistence of it, (and media support) im sure the committee will ultimately decide upon entering Tex into the HOF. He well deserves it. It is his strategies and work on basketball that completely changed the game or at least, 11 of the last few championships of the modern time.

Add me to the PUT TEX WINTER IN HALL OF FAME NOW – BANDWAGON

Its bizarre to me that he is not already there. Makes absolutely no sense.

Did anyone read the new Simmons column on why he thinks Shaq joined the celtics? Don't like Simmons but its pretty entertaining. I don't see Shaq being motivated enough to do all that Simmons hope though (get in shape, play hard etc)

Put Tex in the hall of fame and put him in NOW!
JustaM24, add me to the bandwagon.


*___________________________________________________________*
PUT TEX WINTER IN HALL OF FAME NOW – BANDWAGON
ELEVEN RINGS AND COUNTING – How you like that HALL OF FAME
*___________________________________________________________*
(00) KOBE BYANT - When Kobe came out from the locker room the stopped to give Tex a squeeze.
(01) LAKERTOM – OWNER - You know, all our little bandwagons are a lot of fun but the one bandwagon that we really ought to use the power of the Blog to get rolling would be a Tex Winter Hall of Fame Bandwagon. We could even get Lakers and other NBA players to sign as well as every Lakers fan who reads or posts on the blog. Tex deserves to get in while he is still around
(02)JUSTAANOTHERMAMBAFAN - DRIVER - It's a travesty - an absolute TRAVESTY - that Tex isn't in already. NO TEX IN THE HOF??? NO PEACE!!!!
(03) MAMBA24 - ALT/DRIVER - NO TEX IN THE HOF??? NO PEACE !!!!
(04) LROB - RIDING SHOTGUN - Tex Winter - Unfortunately you're probably right about his chances being slim. You would think that MJ, Phil, Scottie and Kobe could just storm the committee and say enough already put Tex in.
05) JON K - SECURITY - How is Tex Winters not in the Hall of Fame? It's just plain wrong.
"

"
"
(29) BRIAN - the more fan pressure we give and persistence of it, (and media support) im sure the committee will ultimately decide upon entering Tex into the HOF. He well deserves it. It is his strategies and work on basketball that completely changed the game or at least, 11 of the last few championships of the modern time.
(30) LO FAN - Add me to the PUT TEX WINTER IN HALL OF FAME NOW – BANDWAGON Its bizarre to me that he is not already there. Makes absolutely no sense

Although his time as head coach with the Lakers was short, you're missing one very good Hall of Fame candidate: Rudy Tomjanovich. How many coaches with two NBA Championships aren't in the Hall of Fame?


*___________________________________________________________*
PUT TEX WINTER IN HALL OF FAME NOW – BANDWAGON
ELEVEN RINGS AND COUNTING – How you like that HALL OF FAME
*___________________________________________________________*
(00) KOBE BYANT - When Kobe came out from the locker room the stopped to give Tex a squeeze.
(01) LAKERTOM – OWNER - You know, all our little bandwagons are a lot of fun but the one bandwagon that we really ought to use the power of the Blog to get rolling would be a Tex Winter Hall of Fame Bandwagon. We could even get Lakers and other NBA players to sign as well as every Lakers fan who reads or posts on the blog. Tex deserves to get in while he is still around
(02)JUSTAANOTHERMAMBAFAN - DRIVER - It's a travesty - an absolute TRAVESTY - that Tex isn't in already. NO TEX IN THE HOF??? NO PEACE!!!!
(03) MAMBA24 - ALT/DRIVER - NO TEX IN THE HOF??? NO PEACE !!!!
(04) LROB - RIDING SHOTGUN - Tex Winter - Unfortunately you're probably right about his chances being slim. You would think that MJ, Phil, Scottie and Kobe could just storm the committee and say enough already put Tex in.
05) JON K - SECURITY - How is Tex Winters not in the Hall of Fame? It's just plain wrong.
"

"
"
(29) BRIAN - the more fan pressure we give and persistence of it, (and media support) im sure the committee will ultimately decide upon entering Tex into the HOF. He well deserves it. It is his strategies and work on basketball that completely changed the game or at least, 11 of the last few championships of the modern time.
(30) LO FAN - Add me to the PUT TEX WINTER IN HALL OF FAME NOW – BANDWAGON Its bizarre to me that he is not already there. Makes absolutely no sensE
(31) FAN OF THE MAMBA - Put Tex in the hall of fame and put him in NOW! Add me to the bandwagon.


Art -FL Lakers Fan,

I interpreted you "bridge to nowhere" comment to be regarding our
discussions. As I said, sorry you feel/felt that way. I didn't.

Regards

Can I put you on the Tex Bandwagon HobbitMage? Pleassssse!

I'm good for another bandwagon too. And Tex with his contributions to 11 rings is definitely HOF worthy.

Justa - At some point the Laker Blog Girls will have to show these boys what a real chick fight is all about. LOL

GOOD AFTERNOON LAKER FAMILY...

Been gone for a few days, doing the Lake Mead thing...

Well it seems I have a lot of catching up to do...Mamba24 please add me to the Tex Winter wagon...Without Tex, PJ might not have half his championships...

I noticed everyone is adding 'justa' before their handles...

'justalewsters'...hmmm...kinda rolls off your tongue...LOL

Even though there are alot who are tired of it here...the conversations between Laker Tom, MVP888, KBlitz, and hobbitmage are GREAT reads...as long as you guys stay civil, I enjoy the back and forth...great writing, and all it shows are how 'die hard' you all are...

Lamar fragrance: Herbal Essence...Let's not all forget why Lamar loves sweets so much...;)

Well I have a lot of catching up to do...Everyone please have a safe and great week end...

#17 Coming Up!

I can't believe I'm not part of the Tex in HOF Bandwagon. Sign me up please!

*___________________________________________________________*
PUT TEX WINTER IN HALL OF FAME NOW – BANDWAGON
ELEVEN RINGS AND COUNTING – How you like that HALL OF FAME
*___________________________________________________________*
(00) KOBE BYANT - When Kobe came out from the locker room the stopped to give Tex a squeeze.
(01) LAKERTOM – OWNER - You know, all our little bandwagons are a lot of fun but the one bandwagon that we really ought to use the power of the Blog to get rolling would be a Tex Winter Hall of Fame Bandwagon. We could even get Lakers and other NBA players to sign as well as every Lakers fan who reads or posts on the blog. Tex deserves to get in while he is still around
(02)JUSTANOTHERMAMBAFAN - DRIVER - It's a travesty - an absolute TRAVESTY - that Tex isn't in already. NO TEX IN THE HOF??? NO PEACE!!!!
"
"
((31) FAN OF THE MAMBA - Put Tex in the hall of fame and put him in NOW! Add me to the bandwagon.
(32) LEWSTRS - please add me to the Tex Winter wagon...Without Tex, PJ might not have half his championships...
(33) LAKER-J - I can't believe I'm not part of the Tex in HOF Bandwagon. Sign me up please
(34) PSYCHEDLAKERGIRL - I'm good for another bandwagon too. And Tex with his contributions to 11 rings is definitely HOF worthy.

Tex should be in already.

Shaq & Kobe are 100% in.

Horry's chances are around 2% - but you can make an argument for him.

Fisher has no chance and you can never make an argument for him.

If Gasol's career ended right now, he wouldn't make it in. However, if he goes on to win 2 more with the Lakers, then he'll get in no doubt.

*___________________________________________________________________*
PUT TEX WINTER IN HALL OF FAME NOW – BANDWAGON
ELEVEN RINGS AND COUNTING – How you like that HALL OF FAME
*___________________________________________________________________*
(00) KOBE BYANT - When Kobe came out from the locker room the stopped to give Tex a squeeze.
(01) LAKERTOM – OWNER - You know, all our little bandwagons are a lot of fun but the one bandwagon that we really ought to use the power of the Blog to get rolling would be a Tex Winter Hall of Fame Bandwagon. We could even get Lakers and other NBA players to sign as well as every Lakers fan who reads or posts on the blog. Tex deserves to get in while he is still around
(02)JUSTANOTHERMAMBAFAN - DRIVER - It's a travesty - an absolute TRAVESTY - that Tex isn't in already. NO TEX IN THE HOF??? NO PEACE!!!!
"
"

(35) TIM-4-SHOW - Tex should be in already

Ok, what happened to the ticket thread, it disappeared.

Good morning fabulous Laker Blog Family

(forgot my iPhone this morning so I had to do actual work at work... yuck)

It's an absolute travesty that tex is not in the hof already. Seriously we need to start a petitition or something.

I love Tex Winter, but an HOF bid for him is not a slam dunk. Why? Because his biggest claim to fame is the triangle and Tex did not CREATE the Triangle. Sam Barry, his coach at USC, who is already in the Hall, did. He called it the "center opposite" or something like that.


Three guys who played for Barry at USC took his ideas to the NBA.


Alex Hannum won titles in St. Louis with Bob Petit in '58 and in Philly with Wilt in '67, the only two years of his careeer that Bill Russell did not win. He also coached Rick Barry's Oakland Oaks to a '69 ABA title. He is in the Hall as a coach.


Bill Sharman, of course, won in '72 with the Lakers. Both of Wilt's titles came when being coached by Sam Barry disciples who made Wilt more of a facilitator. Sharman won an ABA title with the Utah stars the year before, making Sharman and Hannum also the only two coaches to win both an NBA and ABA title. He is in the Hall as a player and as a coach.


Which leaves Tex. He literally wrote the book on the Triangle and he evolved it and made it famous. He was a very successful college coach, but he never won a title. He had a huge impact in Chicago and LA, but he was an assistant at the time.


So for HOF voters you have a guy known for an offense he evolved, but didn't create. He had a good college career, but never won a title. He was part of multiple NBA titles, but as an assistant. On their own, none of these would get him in. So Tex needs the voters to look at a "body of work" rather than specific accomplishments.


Sadly, they probably will do it right after he dies.

DFish? Hall of Fame?

No.

Hey Tim,

No chance for .04 at all?
He ranks second all-time in NBA Finals three-pointers made (43) and has the highest three-point field-goal percentage in NBA Finals history (42.6%), 5 rings and counting.
Does the HOF have a category for evaluating "intangibles"?
:)

Here is a brilliant piece by the controversial, but dedicated Lakers journalist, Roland Lazenby on Tex Winter. I will post the link and then an excerpt. Mamba24, BY ALL MEANS, please add me to this bandwagon! Thank you.

http://lakernoise.com/2010/01/the-phil-phenomenon-by-roland-lazenby/

"As for his role as part of coaching’s odd couple, the 88-year-old Winter has never gotten the sort of respect he’s deserved from the snobbish and persnickety Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame, and these days he’s in a senior facility in Oregon after suffering a stroke this past spring. But the fiery Winter took Jackson from a guy who didn’t know a basic flex offense and forged him into the superior coach who has mastered Winter’s triangle system and dominated the game."

~~~~~~~~~~~~

"In 1985, Krause’s labor came to fruition. He was hired as GM of the Bulls as Jordan was entering his second season. Sure enough, one of the first calls he made was to Winter. First, Krause hired Stan Albeck as head coach. But Albeck didn’t want to listen to Winter and didn’t want to use the offense. Krause also wanted him to hire a goofy young assistant named Phil Jackson. Krause had discovered Jackson, a lanky big guy at the University of North Dakota, while scouting small college ball. Krause had quickly come to believe that Jackson had a bright future. But Albeck absolutely refused to hire Jackson, who was viewed as something of an oddball back in the 1980s.

Krause fired Albeck and promoted a bright young coach, Doug Collins. Krause wanted Collins to hire Jackson, but the new coach was reluctant. “I went around some things with Doug, but I finally got Phil on his staff,” Krause said.

Once there, Jackson soon began working with Winter and learning from him. But like Albeck, Collins didn’t want to listen to Winter. He even barred Winter from Bulls practices at one point. Finally, Krause grew fed up, fired Collins and hired Jackson as his head coach.

At last, Krause had the two people he had dreamed of putting in charge. It was the beginning of a beautiful relationship. “Phil was the first person to understand how good Tex was,” Krause said. “I give Phil a lot of credit. Phil is the best brain picker I have ever known. Phil has picked Tex’s mind for years. I’m a great brain picker myself. I’ve picked Tex’s mind for years. But Phil is by far the best I’ve ever seen because he took a genius and picked his brain. I hired Phil because he was a brilliant defensive coach. When Phil said he wanted to use Tex’s triangle, I said, ‘That’s great.’”

*___________________________________________________________________*
PUT TEX WINTER IN HALL OF FAME NOW – BANDWAGON
ELEVEN RINGS AND COUNTING – How you like that HALL OF FAME
*___________________________________________________________________*
(00) KOBE BYANT - When Kobe came out from the locker room the stopped to give Tex a squeeze.
(01) LAKERTOM – OWNER - You know, all our little bandwagons are a lot of fun but the one bandwagon that we really ought to use the power of the Blog to get rolling would be a Tex Winter Hall of Fame Bandwagon. We could even get Lakers and other NBA players to sign as well as every Lakers fan who reads or posts on the blog. Tex deserves to get in while he is still around
(02)JUSTANOTHERMAMBAFAN - DRIVER - It's a travesty - an absolute TRAVESTY - that Tex isn't in already. NO TEX IN THE HOF??? NO PEACE!!!!
"
"
(35) TIM-4-SHOW - Tex should be in already
(36)TROY B - It's an absolute travesty that tex is not in the hof already. Seriously we need to start a petitition or something.

@KOBEMVP888 Thanks for the info. Hope you don't mind that I put some of it on the Bandwagon.
*
*
*

*___________________________________________________________________*
PUT TEX WINTER IN HALL OF FAME NOW – BANDWAGON
ELEVEN RINGS AND COUNTING – How you like that HALL OF FAME
*__________________________________________________________________*
"As for his role as part of coaching’s odd couple, the 88-year-old Winter has never gotten the sort of respect he’s deserved from the snobbish and persnickety Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame, and these days he’s in a senior facility in Oregon after suffering a stroke this past spring. But the fiery Winter took Jackson from a guy who didn’t know a basic flex offense and forged him into the superior coach who has mastered Winter’s triangle system and dominated the game
*___________________________________________________________________*
(00) KOBE BYANT - When Kobe came out from the locker room the stopped to give Tex a squeeze.
(01) LAKERTOM – OWNER - You know, all our little bandwagons are a lot of fun but the one bandwagon that we really ought to use the power of the Blog to get rolling would be a Tex Winter Hall of Fame Bandwagon. We could even get Lakers and other NBA players to sign as well as every Lakers fan who reads or posts on the blog. Tex deserves to get in while he is still around
(02)JUSTANOTHERMAMBAFAN - DRIVER - It's a travesty - an absolute TRAVESTY - that Tex isn't in already. NO TEX IN THE HOF??? NO PEACE!!!!
"
"

(37)KOBEMVP888 - BY ALL MEANS, please add me to this bandwagon! Thank you.

it's the hall of FAME, not the hall of great stats. head rep of the players union, hitter of some of the biggest shots in history and many times multiple championships is worth, at least, consideration.


that, of course, has nothing to do with the FACT that Tex should be in the hall NOW.


TO THE LA TIMES LAKERS BLOG…
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I didn’t sleep much last night after being incensed at being called a Bynum butt licker and being joked about being in a porno film with Andrew Bynum. While I am grateful to the few bloggers who came to my defense, I was disappointed that not many bloggers seemed to think it was a big deal. This is what I wrote last night:
~
“What bothers me about this situation is how most of the blog thinks this is all just a big joke or fun. To those bloggers, I would ask what they would think and say if they had been the person at whom the obscene sophomoric comments made today had been directed. Think about that for a second. Someone stepped way over the line and he is applauded by some. Hey, it’s all just fun, right?”
~
When something you love dearly that has been part of your life for the last five years no longer is fun, then the time has come to move on. That any blogger would be allowed to slur someone with such rude and obscene comments without consequence is beyond any standard of good taste, fair play, and sportsmanship. As a result, I have decided to take a long and maybe permanent vacation from the blog.
~
My thanks to KobeMVP, Art, and Blitz for having my back regarding the comments made but I have no desire for my wife, son, grandson, or friends to come to this blog and read such denigrating comments about me. Next year is going to be a wonderful year for the Lakers. I will just have to find another place to enjoy it.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
TOM

justa saying....

hey man, the place u were talking about is http://sportscomplainer.com . i found it a few hrs ago. ok bye

What about our famous Jordan Farmer?

Laker Tom not calling me Twiddle Dee (or Dum) or Bynum Bashers/Baiters will go a long way for you not to get those remarks. Those comments that were posted about you weren't nice either but considering what you said in the past it shouldn't have been surprising.

Just make sure not to keep doing that particularly when it comes to Andrew Bynum mmmkkay (and those porno flick comments won't be seen either, not that I posted those comments just saying you shouldn't have been surprised considering all the name calling before)

MM

Unless I'm reading it wrong, you've got both Fisher and Horry at 2nd alltime
in Finals 3 pointers made, with different amounts.

Some normalcy with LEWSTRS and Mamba24 back, lol.

Tex's career makes him as deserving as Pete Newell.

"As a result, I have decided to take a long and maybe permanent vacation from the blog. "

Sorry I missed that part. If you do decide to call it quits Laker Tom then I thank you for the last 2 years I've known you on this blog and for the many conversations/debates we had.

Best wishes for you and your family.

"As a result, I have decided to take a long and maybe permanent vacation from the blog. "

Sorry I missed that part. If you do decide to call it quits Laker Tom then I thank you for the last 2 years I've known you on this blog and for the many conversations/debates we had.

Best wishes for you and your family.

LakerTom - please add me to the list of many who have had your back throughout the various going's on around here. I would absolutely HATE to see you leave. Please reconsider. You're one of the best writers on here, and you'd be impossible to replace.

MM - PLEASE - can you reconsider how you're handling the crap that's being spewed on here? The blog is disintegrating. The community is breaking up. It's not right and it's not fair. Please do something.

Hello Everybody! *as Dr. Nick from the Simpsons*

So has the Bynum Brawlfest finally abated?

I wasn't sure if that was ever gonna end.

And as for Good 'Ol Tex, he MOST DEFENITELY needs to be inducted into the HOF! I can't believe this is even a question.

Tex is like the 3M of the Triangle System:

He didn't make it... He made it BETTER!

So Senor JustaMamba24 - Will you save me a spot on the Bandwagon please?

PLG - chick fight? Nawww.... I have no interest in showing the boys on here how it's done. We'd never get them back to talking about the Lakers LOL!

As for Derek Fisher, he will not get in based on his numbers and he certainly was never a star in the classic sense of the loose use of the term.

HAVING SAID THAT, he has been the President of the National Basketball Players Association since November, 2006 and, assuming that he remains President, will play a big role in the negotiations for the new Collective Bargaining Agreement. While the assumption remains that the players are going to be on the losing end of the new CBA, wouldn't it be interesting if it came out more favorable for the players than expected? And why not, especially after all the predictions on the salary cap and luxury tax were off base this year. I think that would add to D-Fish's growing body of work.

And then, of course, there's the unpredictable. I would love to see Fish named the Lakers player-coach as Phil Jackson's successor. Is it so far fetched to think that someday he could be a Hall of Fame caliber head coach? Can anyone name any player in the NBA who could make that transition as quickly as Fish can? Look at his attributes. He's smart, tough, understanding, a motivator, a leader and is the only player who Kobe Bryant will listen to.

Also, while people have been looking for Kobe's Pippen since Shaq left, when Fish returned to the Lakers for the 2007-08 season, he proved that he has been Kobe's Pippen all along. Game 3 of the 2010 NBA Finals was the defining game to accentuate that point. When Kobe went cold, Brian Shaw saw a wrinkle in the Chowds' defense and Kobe and Fish ran the rarely seen 2 man screen role between them to perfection. Fish came through when Kobe needed him most.

Finally, in answer to KB Blitz's question of naming the all-underrated Lakers team under Jerry Buss, why the hell did I put Sedale Threatt on that team when Derek Fisher might be the most underrated player in NBA history? He has heard the same criticisms throughout his career, but at the end of the day he has played an important, sometimes prominent, role in every one of his five championships. He's too slow, he doesn't play defense, he can't keep up with speedy players, he can't finish, he's the worst point guard in the league and, more recently, he can't shoot and he's too old.

All I can say is that he is in MY Hall of Fame and ranks right up there with my all-time favorite Lakers.

Go D-Fish! #6 coming up STRONG!!

LFIC-

You refrenced game 5 of the okc series. That was one of the most buatifully played basketball games I have ever seen. It all starts with Kobe (of course).

Kobe played the facilitator role in that game to perfection. Also, his teammates were playing their roles to perfection. Kobe tried the facilitator in game 4, but it just seemed the entire team (Kobe included) was just not ready to play.

If Kobe will play the facilitator role more frequently (assuming his teammates will play that hard), he would gain a lot more respect from others including more MVP votes.

I can envision Kobe playing that role and only changing to a "weapon" role as needed in game situations. I believe that would lengthen his career.

Anyway good stuff, and I agree with you on that game

LT-

Please reconsider. I view you as a Godfather on here and I would hate to see you leave without enjoying the in season Lakers/NBA talk with someone whose understanding of the game is as deep as yours.

LakerTom - that's too bad. I am sorry you feel like this and I am certainly not going to sway your current conviction.

We have had our own back and forths but there has always been respect. However, you acknowledged your own shortcomings and it is a putoff to some. None of us should be made to feel less knowledgeable or loyal Laker fans because others might know more about bball, Laker tidbits or the NBA ins & outs.

I have gotten over it and hopefully you will too. Your well-thought Laker history/knowledge will surely be missed and we won't have anyone to anchor the "AB17 is the beast" blog post that is certain to come this season.

Perhaps everyone will be a little more respectful when it comes to race, religion, lifestyle preferences and other personal matters.

This is a public forum to express opinions and any name calling shouldn't be part of it no matter how funny someone thinks it might be.

We have to remember there are younger, possibly teenage Laker fans who have found this place to learn more about basketball and the Lakers in general. I certainly wouldn't want my nieces or nephews seeing some of the name calling and personal attacks either.

Ciao for now LakerTom. I know you will secretly be reading the blog as a purist Lakerholic does. Maybe when you do come back it will be a more respectful place.

Cheers - PLG

@KOBEMVP888 Thanks for the info. Hope you don't mind that I put some of it on the Bandwagon.

Posted by: JustaMamba24 | August 20, 2010 at 12:51 PM

=====

That's what it's there for. We all pick up little jewels here and there and this January blog by Lazenby on this very issue stuck with me. I hope you all enjoyed it!

KobeMVP,

Nice little rant on Fish, or more like a tribute.
Fish has given Jerry West a run for his money for the Mr. Clutch award.

Laker Tom,

FWIW, I agree with your take on the situation.
It seems there are not many here who really are willing to take a stand and speak out at an injustice.
There is the general can't we all get along stuff, but it pretty much stops there.

And perhaps that's ok, perhaps it shouldn't be the roll of the blog participants to try and police itself since the bloggers have no authority or ability to remove an offensive poster.

I guess it should be the roll of the blog monitor, but it's a roll that is not being filled by anyone on a fair, consistent and impartial basis.

Kobe and Shaq are locks for the H.O.F. I can't see why any Laker fans would resent Shaq. He was the main man on the 3-peat squad. Kobe was No. 2. I love Pau Gasol and hope he makes it, but if Artis Gilmore can't get in . . . ! Much love to D-Fish and Horry, but they are not Hall of Famers--just good solid, clutch role players that help win rings. Tex definitely deserves a spot in the HOF! If he stays healthy, Drew is Hallof Fame-bound too . . . ! How about the beautiful Jeannie Buss for Hall of Fame honors--she kept Phil out here in L.A. long enough to rack up five rings (she worked behind the scenes to bring him back after the Rudy Tomjanovich debacle in 2004-05!)! Loved Dr. Buss' comment the other day, "They still have to kiss the ring!" Awesome. Greatest owner of all time in any sport!

Tell you what. How about Lawrence Tanter for the Hall of Fame! Greatest P.A. announcer of all time! Seriously, he's up there in my book with all-time icons such as Pat Piper (Cubs), Roy Steele (A's), etc.

Laker Tom -

"Wat ya talkin bout Willis"

Please reconsider leaving the family...Maybe take a break...There is no Laker news, but you know darn well the closer we get to training camp...there will be more subjects to discuss...

I think MM will find a solution to moderating the thread better...hell the trolls are even using his name...lol

I'm sure MVP888 will agree...there is no other Laker Blog on the net with the content, members, knowledge, history and loyal fan hood, then our Blog...

It's the reason I have transferred over, and I'm just regretting I didn't experience the last 3 years with this group from the start...

So LT, we still have unfinished business with this group of Lakers...Let's witness the whole story together, for I think the best chapters are still to come...

Long live the LAT Lakers Blog...and long live The Lakers...#17 coming Up...

Laker Tom -

"Wat ya talkin bout Willis"

Please reconsider leaving the family...Maybe take a break, but don't leave permanantly...There is not much Laker news presently, but the closer we get to training camp, there will be lots of topics to discuss...

I'm sure MVP888 will agree with me...you won't find another Laker blog like ours...We have the knowledge, wisdom, history and the greatest members in our blog...we are a different and diverse group, from all four corners of the globe...but we are all connected by one factor...our LOVE for the Lakers!!!

This is the main reason I transferred here, and my only regret is not sharing the complete 3 years of this current team, with you all...So LT, don't do something you will regret, for this current team is on a special run, and the best chapters are still to come...something I would love to witness with you...

MM - this is out of control, when the trolls are even using your name to post...

Long live the LAT Lakers Blog, and long live the Lakers...#17 Coming Up!!!

Glad Lakers aren't #1 on this list. But seriously, Lakers opening night when they are getting their rings is less than watching the Greenies celebrate their losing trip to the Finals or the 76ers celebrate whodidtheysignthisSummer?

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/multimedia/photo_gallery/1008/nba.priciest.home.openers.2010/content.1.html

I vote for Gary Vitti, the Lakers trainer. He's the longest tenured athletic trainer in the NBA....He could be the first trainer inducted into HOF as contributor. Or if he makes Bynum for injury free for next 2-3 yrs, he should be there for sure.

LakerTom,

While I can certainly think of some poster who really add NO value to the blog except for lot of wasted emotions and commotion. To these posters Mark Median even has begged them to stay because they add more value to his quest in climbing the LA times corporate ladder and I can understand it. Your posts are well crafted, thought out and fun to read, and I certainly hope that you continue to post regardless of the comments directed at you. I suggest that you sit out in the sun and get your skin toughened up.


cheers!!

*_________________________________________________________¬____________*
LAKER TOM PLEASE RECONSIDER LEAVING – BANDWAGON
*_____________________________________________________________________*
When something you love dearly that has been part of your life for the last five years no longer is fun, then the time has come to move on. That any blogger would be allowed to slur someone with such rude and obscene comments without consequence is beyond any standard of good taste, fair play, and sportsmanship. As a result, I have decided to take a long and maybe permanent vacation from the blog. My thanks to KobeMVP, Art, and Blitz for having my back regarding the comments made but I have no desire for my wife, son, grandson, or friends to come to this blog and read such denigrating comments about me. Next year is going to be a wonderful year for the Lakers. I will just have to find another place to enjoy it.
*_________________________________________________________*
(01) JUSTANOTHERMAMBAFAN – OWNER - LakerTom - please add me to the list of many who have had your back throughout the various going's on around here. I would absolutely HATE to see you leave. Please reconsider. You're one of the best writers on here, and you'd be impossible to replace.
(02) KOBEMVP888 – DRIVER – LAKERTOM - Please reconsider. I view you as a Godfather on here and I would hate to see you leave without enjoying the in season Lakers/NBA talk with someone whose understanding of the game is as deep as yours.

(03) MAMBA24 –RIDING SHOTGUN – MANNNNNNN! MY Idol leaving the Blog? This ISH just aint right!
(04) PSYCHEDLAKERGIRL - LakerTom - that's too bad. I am sorry you feel like this and I am certainly not going to sway your current conviction. We have had our own back and forths but there has always been respect. However, you acknowledged your own shortcomings and it is a putoff to some. None of us should be made to feel less knowledgeable or loyal Laker fans because others might know more about bball, Laker tidbits or the NBA ins & outs. I have gotten over it and hopefully you will too. Your well-thought Laker history/knowledge will surely be missed and we won't have anyone to anchor the "AB17 is the beast" blog post that is certain to come this season. Perhaps everyone will be a little more respectful when it comes to race, religion, lifestyle preferences and other personal matters. This is a public forum to express opinions and any name calling shouldn't be part of it no matter how funny someone thinks it might be. We have to remember there are younger, possibly teenage Laker fans who have found this place to learn more about basketball and the Lakers in general. I certainly wouldn't want my nieces or nephews seeing some of the name calling and personal attacks either. Ciao for now LakerTom. I know you will secretly be reading the blog as a purist Lakerholic does. Maybe when you do come back it will be a more respectful place.
(05) KB-BLITZ - Sorry I missed that part. If you do decide to call it quits Laker Tom then I thank you for the last 2 years I've known you on this blog and for the many conversations/debates we had. Best wishes for you and your family.
(06) ART-FL LAKERS FAN - Laker Tom, FWIW, I agree with your take on the situation. It seems there are not many here who really are willing to take a stand and speak out at an injustice. There is the general can't we all get along stuff, but it pretty much stops there. And perhaps that's ok, perhaps it shouldn't be the roll of the blog participants to try and police itself since the bloggers have no authority or ability to remove an offensive poster. I guess it should be the roll of the blog monitor, but it's a roll that is not being filled by anyone on a fair, consistent and impartial basis.
(07) LEWSTRS - Laker Tom - "Wat ya talkin bout Willis" Please reconsider leaving the family...Maybe take a break...There is no Laker news, but you know darn well the closer we get to training camp...there will be more subjects to discuss... I think MM will find a solution to moderating the thread better...hell the trolls are even using his name...lol I'm sure MVP888 will agree...there is no other Laker Blog on the net with the content, members, knowledge, history and loyal fan hood, then our Blog...It's the reason I have transferred over, and I'm just regretting I didn't experience the last 3 years with this group from the start...So LT, we still have unfinished business with this group of Lakers...Let's witness the whole story together, for I think the best chapters are still to come... Long live the LAT Lakers Blog...and long live The Lakers...#17 coming Up...
(08)

JustaMamba24........Please put me on the Tex Winter bandwagon.. He's the Godfather of the triangle! Great to see you back and hope you had a fun get away.

I vote for Gary Vitti. He's the longest tenured athletic trainer in the NBA. He could be the first trainer to be inducted into HOF as contributor..And if he makes Bynum for the next a few years injury free, he is sure bet to be HOF.

*___________________________________________________________________*
PUT TEX WINTER IN HALL OF FAME NOW – BANDWAGON
ELEVEN RINGS AND COUNTING – How you like that HALL OF FAME
*__________________________________________________________________*
"As for his role as part of coaching’s odd couple, the 88-year-old Winter has never gotten the sort of respect he’s deserved from the snobbish and persnickety Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame, and these days he’s in a senior facility in Oregon after suffering a stroke this past spring. But the fiery Winter took Jackson from a guy who didn’t know a basic flex offense and forged him into the superior coach who has mastered Winter’s triangle system and dominated the game
*___________________________________________________________________*
(00) KOBE BYANT - When Kobe came out from the locker room the stopped to give Tex a squeeze.
(01) LAKERTOM – OWNER - You know, all our little bandwagons are a lot of fun but the one bandwagon that we really ought to use the power of the Blog to get rolling would be a Tex Winter Hall of Fame Bandwagon. We could even get Lakers and other NBA players to sign as well as every Lakers fan who reads or posts on the blog. Tex deserves to get in while he is still around
(02)JUSTANOTHERMAMBAFAN - DRIVER - It's a travesty - an absolute TRAVESTY - that Tex isn't in already. NO TEX IN THE HOF??? NO PEACE!!!!
(03) MAMBA24 - ALT/DRIVER - NO TEX IN THE HOF??? NO PEACE !!!!
(04) LROB - RIDING SHOTGUN - Tex Winter - Unfortunately you're probably right about his chances being slim. You would think that MJ, Phil, Scottie and Kobe could just storm the committee and say enough already put Tex in.
(05) KOBEMVP888 –RIDING SHOTGUN 2 - Here is a brilliant piece by the controversial, but dedicated Lakers journalist, Roland Lazenby on Tex Winter. I will post the link and then an excerpt. Mamba24, BY ALL MEANS, please add me to this bandwagon! Thank you. http://lakernoise.com/2010/01/the-phil-phenomenon-by-roland-lazenby/ "As for his role as part of coaching’s odd couple, the 88-year-old Winter has never gotten the sort of respect he’s deserved from the snobbish and persnickety Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame, and these days he’s in a senior facility in Oregon after suffering a stroke this past spring. But the fiery Winter took Jackson from a guy who didn’t know a basic flex offense and forged him into the superior coach who has mastered Winter’s triangle system and dominated the game."
(06) JON K - SECURITY - How is Tex Winters not in the Hall of Fame? It's just plain wrong
(07 CALIPHILOSOPHER - Sign me up for the Tex Winter bandwagon.
(08) KT – I’m on the Tex Winter HOF Bandwagon. I'm happy that he's well enough to be there tonight.
(09) VMAN - The Hall is diminished by not having Tex. Hopefully, this is the year.
(10) KOBEBLITZ - Tex Winters has been one of the most brilliant basketball minds. It is his offense that made Michael Jordan from a isolation plays shot jacker to a team player that became one of the greatest of all time. His emphasis on team play gave the Bulls the team of the decade. TEAM play was his model. Not the isolation, less fundamental, more jacking up shots, highlight reel plays of today. It helped make Michael what he is today and help made Shaq help being the most dominant center of his time. Kobe I'm hoping stays more in the offense and score more efficiently. Get well Tex. Our thoughts and prayers go out to Tex and his family.
(11) LAKER FAN 24 – Get well soon Tex
(12 BOZZ - Get well soon Tex, this Rings for y ou.
(13) IN THE ZEN MNASTER WE TRUST - Best wishes to Tex for a speedy and full recovery.
(14) EDWIN GUECO - Get Well Soon, our prayers from the Lakers Blog family
(15) BAYWOOD - Outspoken and Dedicated. He's put his full mark on the team we love.
(16) BENJAMIN - Tex, get well soon and thanks for the offense!
(17) LAKER TOM - Sad News about Tex. Get well soon and recover fully, Tex. We love you
and you’ll be in our prayers. We win tonight for you.
(18) OMEGA - best wishes to Tex and his family
(19) EJK - Best wishes to Tex. I'm guessing he pulls through this and is able to celebrate with us in June. It would be a shame if the Lakers don't come out tonight and get a win for Tex..
(20) BUTLER - The fans of the PHX SUNS wish the best to Tex Winter in his recovery
(21 FAN OF THE MAMBA - Get well soon Tex, our prayers go out to you and your family.
(22) RETURN OF THE PURPLE AND GOLD ASSASIN - Basketball is this man's life. He has contributed immeasurably with knowledge and passion to the best game on Earth. Now Let's go get a win for Tex!
(23) TOM DANIELS - Best wishes for Tex. I have long admired his lifelong push for baketball to be played the right way, to, as he puts it, please the basketball gods. A great mind and a feisty coach not at all intimidated by big salaries and big egos. All the best for a full and speedy recovery, I hope he is up and watching his Lakers again soon.
(24) JOHN IN HOUSTON - We're Pulling for you in Houston Tex Thanks for all the hard work and all the memories Tex. We are praying for your health and for your family.
(25) LAKERMAN420 This toke’s for Tex & his family & extended Laker family. WE’RE PULLING FOR YOU. (26) BRONXLAKERFAN May God help Mr. Winters and his family through this most difficult time. Mr. Winters has lived a long and distinguished life. I hope he recovers.
(26) SEGEBOY/TALIQ/SHERIFF – NO TEX WINTER IN HOF NO PEACE!!! Sign that winter bandwaggon as "10 rings and counting, you shame yourselves by refusing to acknowledge that the triangle offense and its architect has been an integral part of all those championships. Do the right thing people, acknowledge what is already in the history books instead of trying to explain it away"
(27) LAKERNORTH – I have to be on your bandwagon Tex
(28) EASTCOASTJESSIE – Can't wait to see tonight's ceremony...I might just cry
(29) BRIAN - the more fan pressure we give and persistence of it, (and media support) im sure the committee will ultimately decide upon entering Tex into the HOF. He well deserves it. It is his strategies and work on basketball that completely changed the game or at least, 11 of the last few championships of the modern time.
(30) LO FAN - Add me to the PUT TEX WINTER IN HALL OF FAME NOW – BANDWAGON Its bizarre to me that he is not already there. Makes absolutely no sensE
(31) FAN OF THE MAMBA - Put Tex in the hall of fame and put him in NOW! Add me to the bandwagon.
(32) LEWSTRS - please add me to the Tex Winter wagon...Without Tex, PJ might not have half his championships...
(33) LAKER-J - I can't believe I'm not part of the Tex in HOF Bandwagon. Sign me up please
(34) PSYCHEDLAKERGIRL - I'm good for another bandwagon too. And Tex with his contributions to 11 rings is definitely HOF worthy.
(35) TIM-4-SHOW - Tex should be in already
(36) TROY B - It's an absolute travesty that tex is not in the hof already. Seriously we need to start a petitition or something.
(37)KOBEMVP888 - BY ALL MEANS, please add me to this bandwagon! Than
(38)MUD - it's the hall of FAME, not the hall of great stats. head rep of the players union, hitter of some of the biggest shots in history and many times multiple championships is worth, at least, consideration.
that, of course, has nothing to do with the FACT that Tex should be in the hall NOW.
(39) HALOSANT - Will you save me a spot on the Bandwagon please?
(40)

Tex, Fisher, and Horry ... unlikey NBA HOF inductees. Pau is on track - maybe. Kobe and Shaq - no question in the NBA HOF.

Seems to me we need more categories for banners in Staples for our great players and contributors like they have in acting: Best Actor and Best Supporting Actor.

One banner for the Best Lakers, as we currently have, adding Kobe and Shaq in the near future. Pau may go up there someday.

Another banner for all the other greats, our Best Supporting Lakers cast members: Derek Fisher, Michael Cooper, Kurt Rambis, Tex Winter, Norm Nixon, Gary Vitti, etc. (for openers).


@LakerTom - Sad to see you leave LAT Laker Blog, but I split time between here and the K Bros blog because the vitrol here can be annoying and even maddening.


It's sad how anger is used against people who are, essentially, all rooting for the same thing. I can't help but feel that context is a big issue, though not as large as the blatant insults being hurled from one side of the Blog to the other (much like monkeys flinging crap). I generally stay out of other people arguments and try to hew to the 'if you don't have anything nice to say...' mentality.


But it does get wearisome scrolling through known troll posts and dealing with a general lack of civility. LEWSTRS pointed out that there is no other Laker Blog that has such a large body of active participants, but like an over-crowded ship, we're now jumping off and swimming for more spacious locals.


Good luck LakerTom, can't say I can find fault with your decision as your admiration for one player has somehow morphed into Insultville, USA.


I hope to bump into you on the web somewhere. Adios.

LakerTom,

One Tom to another, don't go away for good. You are one of the great voices on this blog (actually, some of the folks you get into disagreements with are too, but that's another story). You would be very missed.


Having said that, I understand. I took a break myself earlier in the year, tiring a bit from all the negativity directed at a team we are damn lucky to be fans of. It's one thing to be clear eyed about your team, another to spew hatred at its players and management. It took some of the fun out for me. Look LT, if folks can personally attack PJ and Kobe and Gasol and Fish, you are not off limits.


My blog vaca helped me learn to enjoy this place and brush off the stuff that drives me crazy (mostly). This is too rich a place for a Laker fan for me to leave forever, from the official posts that collect most of the interesting Lakers news in one place to the many informed and often funny fans who post below.


You have taken some, umm, well, pretty strong stances in the past, and made yourself a bit of a lightning rod. So you get some heat. And you give some back. That's all OK, but sometimes it does cross the line and I understand how you feel.


So take a break, but be back here before Bynum starts playing well so you don't look like a front-runner.


Tom D. (Tom the Lesser)

WHO NEEDS FISHIN, IT’S THE LAKERS I’M MISSIN
Yes I’m back & Fishing was bad, Still it was the most fun in a long time that I’ve had.
No laptops or Ipods & just one Cell, No Lebron James updates & No Posts from Hell
I sure missed the Morning Crue, And, yes I really missed the Head of Mamba Clan too!!!
How have things been here in Laker Nation? I sense in the Force a disturbing sensation
Has Miami won it’s 7 titles yet, With the 3 Meat Balls winning even one I wouldn’t bet
Does Lebron still refer to himself as the Royal we, Lebron please , think of your Legacy
Dwade is already starting to get sick, Trying to figure what makes Lebron James tick
Is Lebron slightly disturbed or completely mad, Lord what made a good Princess go Bad
But we’ll leave Miami to fall apart, And heal LakerBlog wounds or at least make a start
No family agrees on everything, Not even a family that has sixteen soon seventeen Rings
But instead of each other on which we beat, Turn that anger to Princess Jimmy & the Heat
This is going to be a long wild trip, Wacth Phil, Fish and Kobe as they let her rip.
If you have not done so as of yet, Make sure you Stock up on plenty of Vodka & percoset
Not that there is a chance in hell I say, Of any NBA team beating Freaking LA
But if Phils Lectures are any indication, We are in for one wild ride Laker Nation
So we need all hands on deck, We need to keep emotions against each other in check
Nothing more I can say or do, I’m mamba24 an unrecovered Lakerholic, How about You?

Fish is on my all-time Lakers character-hustle-good-guy-clutch-persistence-work ethic team. Like others here, I wish intangibles counted more.

Some of you may be curious about my Post name - it most certainly has nothing at all to do with rooting for the Nuggets (never have - never will, which is cause for shunning or worse out here). It is only where I hang out at 9000 feet elevation. I have been a huge Lakers fan since 1957 in Minneapolis where I got to see-hear about them up close and personal as a local boy. I once saw the Lakers play a legit game against the Harlem Globetrotters in the '50s! I have almost never rooted for somebody where I lived: Yankees; Baltimore Colts - then-now SD Chargers (where I did live); Lakers always; Chicago Black Hawks; Arnold Palmer then Tom Watson-Tiger now; Elgin then Wilt then Magic now Kobe; Mantle-Ford-Yogi then Tony Gwynn now ???

Anyway enough about me.

I hope some of these Laker legends get a Laker HOF nod at least. The SD Chargers have their own HOF in Balboa Park, Lakers should also.

LakerTom,


I'm sorry. I didn't read the attacks upon you; otherwise I would have come to your defense.


Who was the jerk calling you names?


What do we play for? RINGS!!!!


Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.


GO LAKERS!!!

I'm really laughing on NBA yahoo writter Kelly Dyer because Kobe is only number 2 on the best shooting guard in the NBA and DWADE is number one,i dont know what crack Kelly smoking he's just one of those stupid Kobe hater...

When something you love dearly that has been part of your life for the last five years no longer is fun, then the time has come to move on. That any blogger would be allowed to slur someone with such rude and obscene comments without consequence is beyond any standard of good taste, fair play, and sportsmanship. As a result, I have decided to take a long and maybe permanent vacation from the blog.
~
My thanks to KobeMVP, Art, and Blitz for having my back regarding the comments made but I have no desire for my wife, son, grandson, or friends to come to this blog and read such denigrating comments about me. Next year is going to be a wonderful year for the Lakers. I will just have to find another place to enjoy it.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
TOM

Posted by: LakerTom | August 20, 2010 at 12:54 PM

Exactly the reason why i seldom post here anymore. The MikeT days were fiery but it was better and civil. These days, bloggers would just come in here and resort to obscenities.

Shame that it has come to this LTom leaving. And I guess many still others who has preferred to stay away from this blog but still reads it on a daily basis, like myself.

MM, you really have to make a decision here.

Automatic posting should be for registered and long time members/posters

Regulated posting should be for first timers and/or new posters, or unregistered ones.

But you have to have some kind of membership registration to make it happen.

Go Lakers.

*___________________________________________________________________*
PUT TEX WINTER IN HALL OF FAME NOW – BANDWAGON
ELEVEN RINGS AND COUNTING – How you like that HALL OF FAME
*__________________________________________________________________*
"As for his role as part of coaching’s odd couple, the 88-year-old Winter has never gotten the sort of respect he’s deserved from the snobbish and persnickety Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame, and these days he’s in a senior facility in Oregon after suffering a stroke this past spring. But the fiery Winter took Jackson from a guy who didn’t know a basic flex offense and forged him into the superior coach who has mastered Winter’s triangle system and dominated the game
*___________________________________________________________________*
(00) KOBE BYANT - When Kobe came out from the locker room the stopped to give Tex a squeeze.
(01) LAKERTOM – OWNER - You know, all our little bandwagons are a lot of fun but the one bandwagon that we really ought to use the power of the Blog to get rolling would be a Tex Winter Hall of Fame Bandwagon. We could even get Lakers and other NBA players to sign as well as every Lakers fan who reads or posts on the blog. Tex deserves to get in while he is still around
(02)JUSTANOTHERMAMBAFAN - DRIVER - It's a travesty - an absolute TRAVESTY - that Tex isn't in already. NO TEX IN THE HOF??? NO PEACE!!!!
(03) MAMBA24 - ALT/DRIVER - NO TEX IN THE HOF??? NO PEACE !!!!
(04) LROB - RIDING SHOTGUN - Tex Winter - Unfortunately you're probably right about his chances being slim. You would think that MJ, Phil, Scottie and Kobe could just storm the committee and say enough already put Tex in.
(05) KOBEMVP888 –RIDING SHOTGUN 2 - Here is a brilliant piece by the controversial, but dedicated Lakers journalist, Roland Lazenby on Tex Winter. I will post the link and then an excerpt. Mamba24, BY ALL MEANS, please add me to this bandwagon! Thank you. http://lakernoise.com/2010/01/the-phil-phenomenon-by-roland-lazenby/ "As for his role as part of coaching’s odd couple, the 88-year-old Winter has never gotten the sort of respect he’s deserved from the snobbish and persnickety Naismith Memorial Basketball Hall of Fame, and these days he’s in a senior facility in Oregon after suffering a stroke this past spring. But the fiery Winter took Jackson from a guy who didn’t know a basic flex offense and forged him into the superior coach who has mastered Winter’s triangle system and dominated the game."
(06) JON K - SECURITY - How is Tex Winters not in the Hall of Fame? It's just plain wrong


(35) TIM-4-SHOW - Tex should be in already
(36) TROY B - It's an absolute travesty that tex is not in the hof already. Seriously we need to start a petitition or something.
(37)MUD - it's the hall of FAME, not the hall of great stats. head rep of the players union, hitter of some of the biggest shots in history and many times multiple championships is worth, at least, consideration.
that, of course, has nothing to do with the FACT that Tex should be in the hall NOW.
(38) HALOSANT - Will you save me a spot on the Bandwagon please?
(39) NEWMEXICOLAKERLIFER - Please put me on the Tex Winter bandwagon.. He's the Godfather of the triangle

The Hall of Fame would have to significantly lower their standards for Fisher or Horry to ever get in. Don't even know how you could consider them, Mark? Since when did the 4th, 5th or 6th best players on championship teams deserve to be honored? Maybe we should start campaigning for Bryon Scott, Michael Cooper or even Kurt Rambis to get in. Sure their contributions should be acknowledged, but they'd never be in that situation on teams without players like Magic, Kareem, Worthy, Kobe, Shaq, Gasol. Fisher and Horry will get in when Bruce Bowen and Steve Kerr do... Never!

I would like to know if international competition like WordlCups, europeancups or olimpic games are in the hall of fame measures.? Because gasol has a WorldCup Mvp and gold, a Eurobasket MPV and gold, a Olimpic Games scoring champion ( 2004) and silver ( 2008).
Because if we are talking just about nba would be just possible for gasol, but if we talk about international basket...there is no doubt...

NO WAY Derek Fisher and Robert Horry will ever sniff the Hall of Fame.
Both are ordinary NBA players who found themselves on extraordinary teams.

Tex Winter, being an original architect of an offense that has won 11 championships in the last 20 years, deserve a place in the Hall of Fame to recognize his extraordinary contribution.
Pau Gasol, I think, is borderline. Remember, there are a total of 144 players in the Hall of Fame. Being "damn good" isn't good enough.

When will Jamal Wilks be considered is my question. A multple winner at every level.

I think Gasol's accomplishments has already surpassed Karl Malone who just got in. The volume may not be there yet but, in terms of skill level, performance during playoffs, & championships, who wouldn't pick Gasol over Malone? Gasol is just getting better every year.

Phil Fish and Tex should all be shoe ins.
But the way the NBA has screwed with Phil since 1973.
The NBA would not have let him in if he did not win these last two championships. Sad, But Phil would have laughed it off. Phil I'll See you back in Polson
Vinny

What we all do is playing for rings. As someone said: Lakers now - Lakers forever...

yeah kobe and shaq is 100% in!!


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