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Keeping Shannon Brown would be a good move for the Lakers

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Throughout the free-agency period, it appeared Shannon Brown's future with the Lakers swung like a pendulum.

That wasn't because the Lakers had mixed feelings about what Brown could bring to the team. The organization equally has valued his athleticism, upside, attitude, and of course, dunks, and believe the aforementioned qualities trump the defensive lapses and inconsistency in offensive execution. It was just that Brown's future hinged on plenty of variables beyond his control, including whether Derek Fisher would return to the team and for how much, whether the Lakers could attract a free-agent guard and who else might leave the team..

Well, the picture appears a little bit clearer now. Fisher re-signed with the team, agreeing to a three-year deal worth about $10.5 million. The Lakers signed former Clipper guard Steve Blake to a four-year, $16-million deal, and he presumably will serve as Fisher's backup. The Lakers' efforts to acquire free-agent guard Raja Bell ended with Bell canceling a dinner meeting with Kobe Bryant. And Jordan Farmar left the Lakers and accepted a three-year, $12-million offer to play for the New Jersey Nets.

That doesn't mean Brown will definitely be on the 2010-2011 roster, but the offseason developments at least help his chances. The Times' Broderick Turner reported the Lakers and Brown are still in negotiations after he opted out of the final year of his contract that would've paid him $2.1 million. Brown's agent, Mark Bartelstein, told Turner that "hopefully in the next few days we'll get something done."

For both the sake of the Lakers and Brown, it would be in their interest that Brown remains on the team. Despite opting out of his contract, the move reflected Brown's hope to test the open market and reach a long-term deal after spending his first four seasons in the NBA with four different teams. I recently criticized Bell's decision to join the Jazz, and even some Lakers fans disagreed with my assessment that his option to go for a more expensive and longer deal seemed misguided because he has the best chance to win an NBA title with the Lakers. I don't have the same opinion toward Brown's decision simply because Brown is at the beginning of his career and it'd be unclear if one more year would significantly bolster his development enough to spur the Lakers into keeping him for the long term. Meanwhile, Bell is already developed and surely could've extended his stay a season or two with the Lakers if he helped the team to another title. Nonetheless, Brown made it clear during his exit interview that he'd love to stay with the Lakers because of the talent around him.

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The Lakers, meanwhile, have seen Brown grow tremendously since acquiring him last season, along with Adam Morrison, from Charlotte for Vladimir Radmanovic. Since then, Brown has become a fan favorite for his acrobatic dunks, with the website LetShannonDunk.com documenting them, and impressing the Lakers enough to sign him to a two-year, $4.2-million contract before last season began. When Brown was selected for the NBA Dunk Contest, Bryant and Brown agreed that the honor points to the hard work he's put in since joining the team.

Still, as much as Brown reveled in the attention his serious hang time generates, he's never wanted to be pigeonholed as a dunker. One needs to look no further than how his disappointing performance in the dunk contest preceded a dip in numbers after the All-Star break. After 10 points per game on 40.2% shooting in February, Brown's numbers went down to 7.3 points per game on a 38.5% clip before rebounding to an 11.3 points per game average in April. Nonetheless, Brown's averages in the 2008-09 and 2009-10 seasons (3.2 points in 7.6 minutes per game, 8.1 points in 20.7 minutes per game) clearly show that Brown's on the right track.

Even though Brown hasn't completely mastered the offense and frequently gets beat on defensive rotations, those lapses point more to his development than any effort problems. And thanks to Brown's willingness to put in the work needed to fix those problems, the Lakers' decision to keep him would serve as a logical choice to help their long-term future.

-- Mark Medina

Follow the L.A. Times Lakers blog on Twitter: twitter.com/latmedina. E-mail the Lakers blog at mgmedin@gmail.com

Photo: Shannon Brown. Credit: Wally Skalij / Los Angeles Times.

Photo: Brown soon became a fan favorite because of his high-flying dunks. Credit: Luis Sinco/Los Angeles Times

 
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Giant Green Lunatic,

Mamba24 took a vacation for a while after a stressful playoffs balancing the blog, his job and his personal family. We'll expect him to come back before preseason.

What do you think of the addition of Franks to the coaching staff in replacement of Tim Thibodieu? Is 'sheed retiring or being package for trade? Have they decided on PP contract? it still blank on hoops website.

LTLF,
Over the last 5yrs DWade has been one of the top 5 players in the game. He's reached heights that Dumars never scaled. Teams game plan to slow DWade - stopping Joe was never at the top of the game plan when playing the Pistons. Joe D was all-NBA 3 times (2nd team once and 3rd team twice). Wade has been all-NBA 5 times already (1st team twice, 2nd team twice and 3rd team once). Living in Detroit and seeing Joe play his entire career he was an all star player, but not one of the all time greats like DWade could be if he sustains his current level for another 4-5 years.

JonK
People said rap was just a fad...now 35 years later its still going strong. Sure a lot of what you hear on the radio is the narcissistic stuff...but that relatively small sample size shouldn't denigrate the entire genre. There's a LOT of creative, thought provoking rappers out there. (even some of the braggadocios stuff is very clever). People that frown upon the whole genre remind me of those that did the same to early RockNRoll, or who down this generation of NBA ballers. Every genre of music has a good and bad artist. Every generation of ballers has it great and mediocre players.

Matt Barnes informed his fans on Twitter that he will reveal the team where he will join 2morrow, maybe that is Saturday.

Barnes is being wooed by Cavs and Celtics but according to Barnes, he will surprise his fans on his choice.

I'm a voice of sanity and reason? We're in trouble.

I vote Shannon a three year deal for about 7 mil. expires at about the time we might need to rebuild, gives him the long term deal he wants, let's us pay him about the 2 mil we think he's worth. Unless of course we can get him cheaper. I would be better informed to guess if I knew what another team might offer, but I guess Shannon's crew and Mitch's crew can keep track of that. Just my ballbark prediction.

Ah, jeez, now we have the Heat fan talking about rap. Well, I guess we all can agree about either the Lakers or Rap music. It must be about the love.

If we still have Sasha and Brown, I argue to let Mbenga and Powelll go, and spend the rest of the MLE on Oberto or Kurt Thomas, if they don't get better offers somewhere else. But whatever, the main roster is set, and Alea Jacta Est etc.

Bring on the season.


Oh, thanks Rick for the link, not much new info, but worth reading.

Shannon doesn't count against our MLE, and the Doctor (Buss) hasn't complained about the few million difference, so I won't either. I assume we can spend the 1.7 on somebody, and maybe we can find somebody better than DJ. we shall see.

Oh, and (@#$ Matt Barnes. I don't like that guy. And (@*# Shaq. He can't play 116 games, he thinks he's better than he is, and I can't see him helping us in the locker room. Or helping us at all.

I think TMAC is either out of our price range or he really is washed up, if the Knicks or another team that has scouted the post injury version make him and offer higher than 1.7, then they will get him. If they don't, we probably don't want him.

I suppose the Knicks or the Clips could offer TMAC 3 mil+/yr, and he would decide to sign with the Lakers for 1.7 because he wanted the championship, but it would seem like a long shot, and we would still need a backup big man.

justa, phred,

Doctor? You want the Doctor? Try this: http://www.doctorwho-episodes.com/

IIRC, Drew said that he had his surgery scheduled for July 18th. Kobe's finger is a lot more serious as they think the damage around his knuckle is serious.


In relation to Brown, like his enthusiam, but plays out of control sometimes, just like Sasha. Would love for Sasha to earn his contract and not just be a nickname. Needs to hit a higher % of shots, but good defense. Not sure if both are trying to hard to show Phil they can play and get more minutes or what. I'm glad that Brown found out this summer he's not worth as much as what he thought he was so that will motivate him to work on his weaknesses, as others have already said.


Would'nt mind M'Benga back as I and others have said as b/up C. We desperately need one and have been posting that he needs to play more as Phil didn't use him when Drew was out in the POs because of ?. Want him to be ready to PLY not sit. Agree with why not use Cap to help w/M'Benga. Don't know about Kurt Thomas as he was old 2 years ago although very smart and has a jumper too. REALLY, REALLY, REALLY, want Drew to have a breakout season.


Also think the Lakers are going to be more motivated this season more than the last because everybody is dissing them and giving it to the Heat even though they haven't even played together yet.


How many think that the Artest signing was a mistake now, especially if we do go up against the Heat in the Finals? I still think it's going to be a lot harder for the Heat to get out of the East w/Boston and Orlando and a young Atlanta team than people think. Will LeBron quit? Who knows?


If the Heat either don't get to the Finals, or get beat in the Finals, what happens to the team? Will they self destruct because they were EXPECTED to win it all and didn't? It will definitely play with there minds.


As to PJ retiring if he wins a ring again, I don't know if he will because the last time anybody won 4 was RA and he hates RA and that would cap a stellar career, especially if this team can develop some of the younger talent - Ebanks and Caracter - and the road is a little easier this season than expected.


Great point on the 76ers. Been posting the same thing for 2 weeks and nobody notices me. They signed a bunch of Superstars in the mid 70's and were EXPECTED to win, but the pressure was too much and the chemistry was bad and they lost.


Would love to get a great player who wants a ring for what's left of the MLE, but I'm not optimistic.


In relation to rap and the whole culture, was a teacher for 22 years and have never seen kids calling each other misogynistic names more than ever before w/B-word and Ho, etc. Does affect the attitude towards women, cops, others. Just another way to divide instead of being inclusive. JMHO.


Thanks for letting me join this group lately. Have occasionally written but mostly read as this seems a tight knit group. Been a Laker fan for 40 years and still loving them. Best owner in BB and Mitch has turned into the Logo II.

BRING SHAQ BACK!!!

@ Phred, Rick F,Laker Lover, LRob, Jon K and Troy

AMEN !!! Fist Bumps !!! I enjoy everything from Aerosmith to Zappa but NOTHING trumps my love for the LAKERS!!! End of Story.. excuse me blog cru...

JUSTAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA !~!~~!~!!~!~ *HUGS*

I actually popped in because I miss you guys and wanted to see what was goin on cuz I have a lil downtime.. I've watched game 7 13times and it keeps getting better lol I'll be honest, once Phil came back and we signed up Fish.. I'm GOOD.. every and anything else is just icing on the cake to me. I am aware we have a couple of solid rookies coming in and alot of the Family here wanted Blake on board.. but I'm officially out of Basketball mode now until after Labor day weekend ( its my ritual every season so my GF wont think I'm obsessed, yes, I watch game 7 when she isnt home lol )

I couldnt stay away because of all this "SuperTeam" mumbo jumbo and I just wanna go on record right now and say... WHATEVER!!! Bring It B*&%ES !!!!! Its gonna take more than a hand picked squad of underachievers to unseat Our Boys.. matter of fact, as much as it pains me to say it, I doubt if they can even make it past Boston, let alone meet up with the Big Dawgs next June ( yes Heat fans, thats my way of saying, GET OVER YOURSELVES )

Hopefully everyone is having a Fun and safe CHAMPIONSHIP SUMMER.. I know I am.. just like a Micky D's commerical.. I'm LOVIN IT !!! I just wanted to pop in because I miss Mamba, Justa, Rick, Laker Tom, Edwin,Faith,LEWSTRS,LakeShow,LTLF and of course MM's detailed reports..Its just really easy to take a long hiatus knowing my Sis, Justa is still on Troll Patrol and the Blog Cru is still as happy as I am for #16.. Sorry Laker Haters.. maybe if your teams didnt suck so bad.. you could feel my joy too !!!! Theres Laker fans and theres those that WANNABE Laker fans..now if you'll excuse me, Im in the mood to listen to Nirvana's Bleach album followed by Ice Cubes - Death Certificate lmaoooooooooooo

Given the options remaining this is what MK should do immediately to guarantee a 3-peat: Get T-Mac/Rasul Butler/Barnes in order of preference for the triangle & perimeter defense. Wade will be the toughest play-off guy for Lakers to guard when James, Bosh, Haslem and Miller are on the floor! For Bynum b/u get Shaq/Mbenga. Shaq is the best center remaining for a 15-20 minute stint. SBrown is not worth more than $2.1 M. If we get T-Mac or Butler we may have to settle for MBenga as b/u unless Turiaf can be obtained via trade for Sasha. Bynum, Kobe & Lamar need to get any needed surgery out of the way ASAP. That will get Lakers ready for 3-peat against the Rondo led Celtics or Wade's Heat Team!

I totally agree with Phred.. I cant stand Barnes and I'm HAPPY Bell didnt sign with us because I cant stand him either!!!

@ Justa.. I was so happy you're still up hangin out, I forgot to answer your ?'s Sis.. as much as I am embarrassed to admit it, Yes, I watched the LeGone show and although I'm not a fan, I defend his right to leave, even if I disagree with his choice ( I wanted him to stay in Cleveland and bring that city a Title one day ) I was completely SICK TO MY STOMACH watching that BS with the 3 big egos !! I mean, geesh, Smoke, fireworks, Keys to the City you'd THINK they actually did something to earn all that !!! Just shows me that Miami is as hard up as every other city that doesnt have teams named Lakers, Thunder or.. ugh Celtics.. lol I dont really get to watch much summer league games because I owe it to my better half, once the season is over.. to stay away from the man cave until college football starts.. but since SC is on ice for a few years.. I'll prolly stay out of the cave until the nba starts up again ( nope, cant really get into pro football cuz im a *cough* Raider fan and I refuse to prolong my agony, 11 years is plenty ) I heard Penny Hardaway wants to play for Miami now.. Its going to be HILARIOUS when these dorks hand pick a team and STILL walk away ringless !!!! I used to really like Riles, but the smug look he has these days.. makes me wanna smack that grease outta his hair...I never ever ever thought I'd root for the Celtics.. so... GO MAGIC !!!! lmaooooooooooooooooo

Who is Garrett Kall ? and better yet, WHY is he HERE? shouldnt you be out on South Beach gathering Tar Balls?

If you had to make a choice between Shannon Brown and a veteran serviceable backup Center would you still take Shannon? Because that's the choice facing the Lakers. There is no money and the Lakers have a backup to Kobe who has an albatross contract: Sasha. So do you really NEED Shannon? He is completely overrated. He is good at one thing. Dunks. His foot speed is atrocious, he is constantly tripping over his own feet and he consistently missed wide open looks in the Playoffs. He actually did the unthinkable and allowed Sasha Vujacic back into the lineup in the Finals....and he delivered.

The Lakers have no more money. Period. And we do not know at any given moment if Andrew Bynum is gonna suit up. So you have to get another Center because Pau cant play the whole season as a 5. Period. And they only have two options. Brad Miller and......Shaq. The latter can't happen.

I have to imagine the Lakers are working tenaciously to sign Brad Miller and not Shannon Brown. We have insurance at the 2 guard and none at the 5. And don't say Mbenga. He's gone and has zero basketball ability. Raja Bell was the Lakers last best chance unless by fluke they can pull something off to bring Matt Barnes who can give you minutes at the 2 or the 3. Forget Shannon Brown. No one else has signed him because his skill set is nominal.

I pray the next move the Lakers make isnt Shannon Brown because that means they have surrendered on the idea of a Center and will let Derek Caracter be the de facto back up Center.

And Miami guy. Get a life. This isn't the Olympics its the NBA. Your one and only Center is a 35 year old Russian. You have no Power Forward. Dont say Bosh. What about his body screams Power. And you continue to ignore the fact you wont get past Boston.

Dream on. Have a Daquiri and watch re-runs of Miami Vice.

Somebody actually referred to Lebron James as....ahem....."the smartest most talented motivated athlete." Or something to that effect. Um did ya see the Decision or the 8 million jokes that came of it? I can assure you that Lebron James and the word smart will never again be used in the same sentence. As for motivated? Maybe we can have Dan Gilbert weigh in on that....

That little display, as someone above eloquently articulated above, in Miami was the best thing that could have happened to Los Angeles. No sooner had the huge Green monkey been lifted from this squads back, than a huge new 800 pound Gorilla emerged from Miami.

The Lakers care about one team. The Boston Celtics. And in this whole conversation everyone just ignores the Boston Celtics. And the Orlando Magic and the Chicago Bulls and frankly every other team in the Eastern Conference who is now nothing more than a presumed loser. Quick cancel the season. Miami already won.

Dwade had to go public to try to remind everyone his team isn't the one everyone should be gunning for. A little late now DWADE. You just had a frickin victory party....in July. Usually victory parties in July are reserved for teams that actually just won a Championship.

But not Miami where the sport of contract signing is apparently the new winning.

Every single team, including the Los Angeles Lakers, and especially Kobe Bryant has one team and one team alone in their sights whether they can bring it or not. Miami. All those Eastern Conference squads who were just run over by the Press have a great big chip on their shoulder with a special emphasis on the Boston Celtics, who, by the way, signed Miami's all star Center Jermaine O Neal. Perkis, Garnett, O Neal, Pierce, Rondo, Allen...... Miami...pfffft.

And lets not forget that all of those coveted Free Agents all ran with their tails between their legs out to the East to get as far away from the Lakers as possible. Who got better out West? Utah? Maybe. Golden State? Whereas Miami is gonna have to play 4 games a year against alot of pissed off suddenly stacked Eastern Conference squads.

If I had any doubts about the Lakers making it to a 4th straight NBA Finals, something that, by the way, has not been done since the Celtics of the 1960's, they are now gone. Tying Boston for 17? Important. 6 rings for Kobe. Nice but its really gravy. Now? The Lakers are pissed and you will see what motivation really looks like.

All this Miami Heat talk that they are going to represent The EC next season. Don't count out the Orlando Magic. They made the same mistake that the Cavaliers did a year before; sweep teams on their way to the Eastern Conference Finals. They did that only because they thought they were entitled to make it back so easily after they had actually made the Finals before.

The Orlando Magic are more experienced now. They were humbled in the Finals in 09, and were humiliated in 2010. I believe in 2011 they will be hungry; out to prove that in reality the Eastern Conference goes through them. And I truly do believe that. If any Easten team can beat them, they will be in the Finals.

First Garrett Kall states that he was won 33 straight bets before, and then follows it with why Lakers have no chance againts the Heat. That the only way the Lakers can beat the Heat is through our prayers and wishes that one of the Heats big 3 gets injured.

Laker fans don't wish or pray injuries to other players in opposing team, instead we do the oppositte. Pray and wish that the opposing team bring their best, so that when they lose there won't be any excuse why they lost.

Also, GK says Wade had the best performance in NBA Finals ever seen. I say, if a tree in a forest falls, and no one was there to see it; does it make a sound?

I was talking to a couple of friends today. They love the Lakers, only when they are winning championships. They don't really care for ESPN (who does?)
They don't follow all the sports hype. But its funny when they ask me why don't the Lakers get more love and respect from Magazines/ESPN and certain Blogs? They say, "they just won a championship, they repeated as champs. What other team has done that so far?"

They also asked me how many championships has LBJ won that he is so oftenly shown in highlights in ESPN, and has so many pictures in newspaper,and in magazines.

I told them that Lebron James hasn't won anything. Their response was, "then why the F!@# is he shown everywhere, and praised for doing nothing?"

EJK

I agree with u as well. I was going to make that same point. Yes Shaq was the most dominating player in the NBA. Every team drafted a big player so they could counter attack Shaq. All the attempts were futile.

Shaquille O'Neal did change Laker History, he did make it easier for the Lakers to win a 3peat. Shaq was never matched, but he was in foul trouble. He carried us for 3 quarters, but KOBE finished and did the dirty work.

When it came down to decide whether Jerry Buss wanted to spend Millions on either Shaq or Kobe; the answer came down to who played more games in a season. Thats where the money is being made.

Shaq always needed some time off in the season for some reason. So far Kobe needs to be asked to take some games off.

Why did Lakers lose in 04 againts the Pistons? Clearly, let Shaq score his points, and at all cost keep Kobe from going off.

Who was the most inmportant player then?

Shaq won Kobe one ring; Kobe won Shaq 2 rings.

Persons don't remember the championship run of 2009 when the LAKERS faced Denver. The Bird Man was imposing his will by blocking almost every shot that came into the lane. It wasn't until UPS game him a facial that the momentum switched and we won the series and eventually the ring. UPS represents youth and athleticism two things LA needs. With Raja signing for Utah I don't blame him because his playing career is imminent. If Kobe wants another good player on his team he needs to give Dr. Buss a few dollars back to get it done. Kobe is looking at Miami wearily. They got an excellent core in wade/lbj and bosh. Now they add mike miller and haslem. Another thing when is Bynum getting his surgery? Bynum don't pull a Shaq and delay before training camp please. Perkins already had his surgery and so should you by now.

Dumars was not a "great", there were enough distractions on those teams for him to get his job done. Lakers in 4, now!!!!!

If Bell "played" Kobe there's a gonna a 60 on the board vs. the Utah "Jizz".....

Garrat Kall,


done.

You know who was happiest about the Miami trio? It wasn't Bosh. It wasn't Wade. It wasn't Lebron. It wasn't all the ghetto fabulous Miami residence at that ostentatious WWF-like introduction. It was Kobe Bryant, Phil Jackson, and Derek Fisher. They know that one of the hardest things about repeating is finding out where the next challenge is going to be. Those guys live for this. And they've got 21 championship rings to show for it.

Brown is an asset and I hope we re-sign him.

But there is someone even more important to retain.

A recent article on ESPN.com talked about the 4 Lakers who may not return (Shannon, Powell, DJ Mbenga, and Morrison) and that Caracter and Ebanks would most likely fill 2 of those spots cause they're decent and cheap. We can do without Powell and Adam Morrison. I really want to keep Shannon but if push comes to shove we can do without him. Who we can't do without is DJ Mbenga.

Aside from his valuable role in practices, he's arguably the best third string center in the NBA. But the big hole he fills is - what do we do if Drew goes down again with an injury - as he has every year? Gasol as a 48 minute center? That would be the worst thing that could happen to him - and us. Caracter as a back-up? Veterans would eat him alive plus we'd lose our massive height advantage in the middle. We absolutely need another 7 footer with defensive and shotblocking skills who can help cut Drew's (and Pau's) minutes during the regular season and fill in if either one gets injured. Add to that his knowledge of the triangle and he's indispensable - especially because he'd likely re-sign for the vet minimum.

BRING BACK BENGA!
BRING BACK BENGA!
BRING BACK BENGA!

Posted by: Jay Jay | July 16, 2010 at 09:36 PM

=================
I agree. Since PJ didn't utilize his talents ( a shame) does not mean the next coach won't use Benga and not wear out Pau.
Lets not tie our hands for the future because of the quirks of a coach willing to shorten star players careers by overusing them.

Jon K.

"The main problem with rap is that it closely relates to what most innercity kids actually experience"


Not really. Half the stuff is talking about VIP rooms and living the highlife which the inner city equivalent of white kids from the suburbs singing songs about fighting dragons in the 70's. It's a fantasy."
****************************************************

Well, this aspect of rap reflects a rapper's success within the market, and the lavish lifestyle does exist for them. In addition, what is the harm of young people dreaming/aspiring to live the high-life? Since when has music and fantasy NOT gone together?

As far as "the other half", the intensity of street life and its criminal element is very real for many innercity kids. Yes, there is a need to exaggerate the criminal mannerisms and results for entertainment sake, but again, since when has any form of entertainment not reflected some form of exaggeration for entertainment sake? Hollywood, anyone?

Look, I'm no true fan of rap, but your rationales for disliking it (although clearly your prerogative) or also clearly flawed.

Justa-

I'm glad you can recognize the contributions of Sasha. And since the NBA is equal parts physical and mental capabilities, can you imagine what type of Sasha we'd get when he knows he's going to be able to stay in the game for X amount of minutes.

One of the reasons for why Farmar left (and perhaps Shannon wanted to leave) is because Phil doesn't treat his young guards with any level of respect. He, instead, will throw them into the game without warning and expect them to play at high levels, coming stone cold off the bench. This isn't realistic.

If I have one true criticism of Phil, it's how he's traditionally treated his young guards.

Complex Brotha,

I agree more with you than I am against you. I didn't say I hated ALL rap. There's a ton of non-violent, positive rap that I like, which is why I criticized Jon K for his blanket hatred of the genre. For example, I'm a big fan of LL Cool Jays offerings, a guy who never got into the violent aspect of rap, but still put out some seriously good tracks.

Even the typical gangsta rap has its entertainment value, depending on my mood. I think what gets me and other people (who hate all rap) is that the kids that listen to gangsta rap often don't reflect the type of disposition of someone who seems to be on their way to being productive citizens. In other words, problematic teens who look menacing are bad enough, watching them bob their heads to menacing music that celebrates violence, abuse of women, the N word, and dysfunctionalism is just the icing on the cake.

This goes back to my sentiment that the kids who are probably going in a certain dysfunctional direction in life are more apt to head that way with or without rap. It's just that seeing these types of kids listening to rap makes the whole situation all the more upsetting, and when you have people who already think lowly of young African Americans seeing this, and validating their prejudices, it stings for all African Americans who are headed in positive directions in America (and Latinos, whom are pretty much in the same boat).

Edwin,

Should our priority be to find a backup shooting guard or a backup center?

Edwin,
Those are a lot of questions. First, PP signed at a discount, like RA. It was finalized yesterday. 4/61 were the finals numbers. On Boston radio station WEEI on Thursday, Danny said Sheed has retired. They can use his contract as trade bait for another team wishing to shed salary cap. There are some wild rumors out there, the latest being Sheed and BB Davis in a sign and trade to CLE for Shaq and Jamario Moon. I'm kind of lukewarm on that one, unless we get Craig Smith to replace Davis. Celtics fans don't really care what Matt Barnes does, we just need someone on our bench. Frank? Good question. We loved Thibodeau, as he was the defensive guru. Frank comes with a good rep as a defensive coach, so we'll give him a shot. But I know one thing, Da Bulls will be really good this year with Tibs as their coach.

Thanks for the info on Mamba24, and congrats on 2010!

I watched game 7 yesterday from start to finish. I have a thought/beef I would like to share about the Celtics that I have been sitting on. I don't really know how to say it because it's offensive. I have waited until I could say it in a way that I felt ok about. So here is my best attempt:

Throughout the series I saw that Kevin Garnett, Paul Pierce, Rasheed Wallace, and sometimes Ray Allen fouled in a deliberate way and included attitude. That didn't bother me that much as it just added to my hatred of the Celts. Here is what REALLY bothered me.

It appeared to me that with MANY fouls when the players ended up tangled, a Cetic would end up with a knee in or very near the groin area. In fact in game 7 when Artest and Pierce ended up entangled, Pierce took a swipe down and around Artest groin at the very end of their entanglement. There was no ball near them to swipe at either (no pun intended).

I saw this throughout the series with Garnett and Lamar Odom as well. Next time you watch the games, watch how many times Garnett puts his knee in or near Lamars' groin or watch Garnett on top of Fisher pinning Fish to floor. Garnett talking to the ref while Fish is in agony on the floor unable to move.

Now the Giant Bald menace wants to post here and would like our respect. Hard to respect that. Kobe sees this kind of thing as just hard BB and accepts it as part of the game. I say so be it. But man let me tell you, I don't like these guys or their fans. Imposible for me to like them or show the courtesy I afford most others.

Heat fans and the "Three Amigos" think that they are going to cake walk to the NBA final next year. I am a Laker fan but is any one paying attention to what the BULLS are doing? And how much they have improve? In my opinion they could be the best team in the East.

Giant Bald,

If you will ask my opinion, Celtics should convince both Sheed and JO to join forces in 2010-11 to knock out the Heat trio.

Thanks for the congratulations and it was fun all throughout the 7 games. Wish Red and 131 would also visit during this off season.

This is my first time posting but I just have to chime in about this whole Heat bs Laker debate, who has the most motivation, etc:

Well my blood is boiling regarding Lebron and the Heat and I know every other Lakers'fan blood is boiling too. Now, you don't think the TEAM is red hot about this? You don't think they're motivated to beat the heat?? That's ridiculous! If anything it's the Heat that lack motivation now, soaking up the sun, articles about how great they are already, media attention... The lakers should and probably do want to destroy them to being them back down to earth. Now THATS motivation!! And that's why I predict...

LAKERS 3 PEAT

Oh my God! Wake up Laker boys and girls. It's a new and glorious day in the varrio. No need to step in front of a truck, not today.

The dude is amazing to watch. Unfortunately, whether he stays or goes, for purposes of three-peating, it isn't going to matter.

But, let's get clear about something. Your boys are good. Good enough to have won two championships in a row. No small feat in today's NBA, even with the layers of advantage bestowed the Laker organization over most other teams in the NBA. A stellar and special effort this year against the Celtics. Hats off.

It's just that whether Shannon stays or goes isn't going to matter.

We're due for a reality check, don't ya think?

Kobe is injured all the time; getting old (bad news), arthritis in the hand (worse news). Laker fans must get used to not relying on him so much to bail you out.
There are several young studs in the west who will rightfully, and successfully challenge him now. (Cut his play time by two-thirds and make him a three point specialist, and you might have something there...or some team will. By doing that, Kobe can still be the clutch game winner, and all the little Laker boys and girls can stay sweat).

Andrew, poor Andy, is a young giant, who for all practical purposes may as well be old. His value must necessarily be limited in the long view. Achilles and Knee? Come on. You've got to be kidding.

Paula alone, as much as I like his game, cannot carry anybody anywhere, alone.

Testes (and I love the guy) is long overdue. I love his psychiatrist too. But, what happens when you start losing? And you will...probably sooner than later.

Lamar, well...

Oh, I forgot. You've got Fish. And for three years. Nice move! They pay big bucks for Assistant Coaches down in the varrio these days. (For the record, if the Lakers had matched Utah's offer, Raja would still have gone to Salt Lake. The man ain't no fool after all. It may have been a -ring vs. quality-of-life- issue I would guess, so his choice makes perfect sense).

Actually, be good to yourselves. I think it would be useful (if not therapeutic) to prepare yourselves, and ponder who you will root for in the next NBA final, with a full appreciation that the Lakers might not be a participant. It ain't going to be Miami, we know that. But, what team from the west will you choose?

Like I said. You had a good run. Hat's off.

In the meantime, as we approach football season, I'm just wondering how that Los Angeles franchise is shaping up. The Niners are looking poised and ready to make a move.

Sonnybelfast

Troy,

As I suggested if we are not going re-sign Mbenga @ 1M+, then go for any of the Summer League Centers with minimum salary, one of them is my boy, Samhan from Gaels St Mary's. maybe @ 0.3M

Johnny V,
Sorry you feel that way, don't really care, but sorry you do. A little paranoid are you? Have you ever played basketball? You used the perfect word - entangled. When bodies get entangled, body parts inadvertently go where they shouldn't. That is what happened here. This is the first I'm hearing of it. I mean, it's not like McHale clotheslining Rambis (I did not like that, just for the record). In 2009, I saw Derek Fisher "club" Luis Scola in the chest and koME elbow Ron Artest in the throat. I came on this site the next day (they were two separate days), and lakers fans were saying how it was "good, clean, playoff basketball." Can't have it both ways, Johnny. You are the first person I know that has mentioned this. Most people mention the 37-17 discrepency in FT attempts, 24 in the 4th Q, and 12 in the last 6 mins - but we don't want to go there, for I do not make excuses. You will never hear me mention that Perkins was hurt for Game 7 - those are excuses, and in the playoffs, as Bryant said, "you got to man up or you don't deserve to be champions." So please, sell your petty little rants to someone else. You WON, get over it!!

But, let's get clear about something. Your boys are good. Good enough to have won two championships in a row. No small feat in today's NBA, even with the layers of advantage bestowed the Laker organization over most other teams in the NBA. A stellar and special effort this year against the Celtics. Hats off.
Posted by: Sonny Belfast | July 17, 2010 at 08:13 AM

Thanks Sonny. That must have hurt to say huh? You are saying that simply to have the credibility to spout what you REALLY wanted to say (predicting our impending doom!) I would say that you did not predict that we would win this championship. Did you? Why should we believe a word you say about our future? It will be enjoyable proving you wrong as we listen to your garbage throughout this next season.

What Fisher did to Scola was intentional and not hidden in the scrum of play. Kobe didn't hide a thing when he hit Artest in the throat either. We'll see if any of my Laker bretheren saw what I saw. As for how you feel and what you saw, I could give a Rats @ss.

Hey Mr. Johnny,

Stung a little? Reality suck sometimes, doesn't it?

I wasn't aware that I needed credibility to post here. If that's the rule, why make me an exception?

Follow the press, follow the money. It can't be a mystery to anyone why the Yankees, Manchester United, Lakers, and any of a handful of other sports franchise win a disproportionate number of championships at anything. Duh.

Well, I'm a betting man, and the Lakers were a clear favorite. Do the math.

Why should you believe a word I say, you ask? Actually, I'd advise you not to, if it will make you feel better.

Go Niners!

Sonnybelfast

Why should you believe a word I say, you ask? Actually, I'd advise you not to, if it will make you feel better.
Go Niners!
Posted by: Sonny Belfast | July 17, 2010 at 08:43 AM

Fair enough. I appreciate the tip. Next time you post I will keep that in mind.

Johnny Victory,

Please don't hurt yourself.

Sonnybelfast

Johnny Victory,
Please don't hurt yourself.
Posted by: Sonny Belfast | July 17, 2010 at 08:50 AM

Thanks again Sonny.

But tell me Johnny,

About the Laker players I mentioned. What did I say that is so off the mark?

And if it's not off the mark, then again, you need to do the math.

(My apologies if you attended school in the "Southland'. It ain't your fault).

Sonnybelfast

But tell me Johnny,

About the Laker players I mentioned. What did I say that is so off the mark?

And if it's not off the mark, then again, you need to do the math.

(My apologies if you attended school in the "Southland'. It ain't your fault).

Sonnybelfast

Woops! Double post

Sonny's failed predictions:

1. Kings would win at least a title earlier in the century
2. Brokeback fans would realize Kobe causes losing
3. Celtics would defeat the Lakers in 2010
4. Lakers are done winning titles with this roster

I was just reading a few posts from JohnnyV & GBH? and I thought to myself:

It is *TRULY* great to be a Lakers fan. We actually are the center of the
basketball universe. [ I know. Sonny Belfast, various Celtic trolls &
some spaniards (Ricky) will disagree. ]

reasons: ~ half of all NBA championships.
5 Lakers in the greatest of all time discussions. [ No, didn't say that
any of them won. ] ( Wilt, Kareem, West, Magic, Kobe )

Have you considered:
- the most recent trade that still irritates coaches. - Pau Gasol
- previous league altering tandem: Shaq & Kobe
- current league altering tandem: Kobe & Pau.

Why is talent fleeing the west?
1. The east has been terrible, have great draft picks & salary cap space.
2. Recent west configurations are incapable of beating the lakers.
ref. D-Will after Jazz lost.
Why did LBJ, join D-Wade & Bosh in Miami?
1. LBJ is not a champion.
2. LBJ couldn't get past a great team in Boston.
Why did Bosh join D-Wade in Miami?
1. Raptors were horribly configured. Bosh couldn't win.
2. Nobody could get past a great team in Boston.
Why is it relevant that nobody can get past a great team in Boston?

Because with all of our injuries, Boston couldn't get past the Lakers. There
are 29 teams trying to beat the Lakers.

This coming season has the potential to be extra-ordinary.

"The Last Season of Phil Jackson"

Starring: Phil Jackson as "The Zen Master"
Kobe as "The Black Mamba"
Pau as "El Cid"
D-Fish as "The faithful sidekick"
Artest as "the Man in Black"
Bynum as "the project"

But, but, but...Timmy!

How am I off target in my 8:13 post?

Which player have I missed the mark on?

Better get a grasp on reality, or the whole Laker nation will be needing the services of Ron Ron's shrink.

You can't win every year...and your hour glass is running out of sand.

Nice draft picks, by the way. Blake can be helpful. But you are woefully short.

Sonnybelfast

>>>First, Starter have more minutes played vs. a reliever who plays only 3 to 5 minutes


Wow, what a revelation. I never knew that.

>>>Example: two attempt, one made = 50%
>>>ten attempts, four made = 40%
>>>do u mean to tell me the 50% player was better than the 40% player?

Well, if the sample sizes are that small, then neither of them is significantly significant. So first of all we have no idea if the guy who took two shots is a more efficient shooter than the guy who took 10 shots.

Note that Luke Walton has played 7980 minutes in the NBA. And has taken 2087 shots.

Do you comprehend the significance of sample size? 2 shots (or however many minutes that person played) is not a significant sample size. 2000 shots and almost 8000 minutes played is a large enough sample size that statistics like shooting percentage and number of rebounds per minute played are meaningful.

Second, you just proved my point.

You talk about 2 shots and 10 shots... and then you ask if I THINK THEY'RE A BETTER PLAYER. Not a more efficient shooter, but a better player.

You don't seem to comprehend the significance of comparing ONE SINGLE STATISTIC of production vs comparing two players.

For me to say that Luke Walton has been a more efficient shooter than Ron Artest in their respective careers is not an opinion of mine. This is not something where I have an opinion and you have an opinion and we can agree to disagree. It is a fact. Nothing you say can change the fact.

Now if you ask who is a better player, then that is an objective thing, where each of us can have an opinion. And I'm sure we both agree that Ron Artest is a better player than Luke Walton.

Are you following this? Luke is a more efficient shooter and has been a more productive rebounder when he's on the floor, but Artest is the better player. Two of those things are facts. The third thing is an opinion. Do you recognize the difference?

Johnny V

You saw "good clean playoff basketball." NO ONE has jumped to your defense. Reason? You are delusional!!

G in DC(akaGDub)....

Those sunglasses were pretty funny! It just reminded me of the difference between fashion and style...style is timeless whereas fashion changes every year...and is sometimes ridiculous!

Garrett Kall,

you wrote: Dude Wade had the single best Finals series in basketball history. He was busy running circles around all 5 players on the court who couldn't stop him even though their gameplan was specifically designed to do just that in the closeout game. In comparison Kobe shot 6-24 and did everything he could to lose, only because he had a superior supporting cast was he able to be bailed out.

my response: Umm ... your viewpoint is skewed. Allow me to clarify.

this: http://www.nba.com/games/20060620/MIADAL/boxscore.html

is a link ot the box score for one of the championship games.

The starting 5 for Dallas was: C - D. Diop, PF - Dirk, SF - J. Howard - SG -
J. Terry, PG - D. Harris

The starting 5 for the Boston Celtics was: C - R. Wallas, PF - KG, SF - PP,
SG - RA, PG - RR

If I read this right ... you're comparing Kobe's game 7 in the finals against
the best defensive team in a decade to the squishy soft Mavericks. That's
not a good comparison. Let's use some concrete qualifiers.

R. Wallace - former champion, multiple years in big games. I think the Pistons
went to the eastern conference finals 5 times. To the finals 2 or 3
times. I believe they beat the Lakers, lost to the Spurs. all-star
KG - Former MVP, Former DPOY, guaranteed HOFer, former
champion. all-star
RA - all-star, former champion, future HOFer
PP -all-star, former champion, former finals MVP
RR - all-star, former champion

vs.

Dirk - all-star, MVP
J. Howard - all-star
J. Terry - all-star

All right. It should be clear that Kobe faced a much tougher team && this
does not include the defensive minded coach Tom Thibedeau who now is
a head coach for the bulls.

Furthermore, can we put Kobe's game 7 in perspective:

http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f74/kobe-bryants-game-7-perspective-1238124/index2.html

The clincher of the Seattle Sonics-Bulls game, the great Michael Jordan who wouldn't do anything wrong scored 22 points on 5-19 shooting (Almost as bad percentage
wise as 6/24) and had 5 turnovers. He had 9 rebounds and 7 assists which isn't bad.

Chicago Bulls at Seattle Supersonics Box Score, June 12, 1996 | Basketball-Reference.com

From the same series, Game 4 where in they had a chance to win it Jordan responded with a 23 point game on a slightly better 6-19 shooting while grabbing 4 rebounds, had 4 turnovers compared to 2 assists.

Chicago Bulls at Utah Jazz Box Score, June 8, 1997 | Basketball-Reference.com

The Jazz-Bulls series 1997. MJ needed 27 shots to score 22 points, Kobe needed 24 to score 23.


So ... If you want to claim that D-Wade is better because he beat up on
lesser talent/had better numbers against lesser talent ..... Feel free.

Sonny,
"It may have been a -ring vs. quality-of-life- issue I would guess, so his choice makes perfect sense)."

Now, that is precious! A Sacramento Kings fan talking about "quality of life". "Sacramento"? Are you serious?

Johnny V
You saw "good clean playoff basketball." NO ONE has jumped to your defense. Reason? You are delusional!!
Posted by: Giant Green Bald-Headed Lunatic | July 17, 2010 at 10:10 AM

I like these "Last Word Guys". I went through the same thing with 131 and I haven't seen HIM in awhile now. I'm not sure I need "Defending" and again, how you feel and what you think isn't important.

I feel completely comfortable putting what I saw out there. The next time you watch the games (Laker Fans), you tell me if you saw it. Watch how often a Celtic knee ends up in a Laker groin or a Celtic "Swipe ends up in someones family package. And yes, I have played enough sports to realize when I am engaging a bully. Most of my life has been filled with competitive sports.

Wow, We had so much hope in improving our bench this summer, and we laid an egg. I mean Blake is ok, but we started out hoping for Kyle, Miller, Bosh you name it. And now the reality is, there's no money. What a pipe dream, now everybody put you're pipe down. Were back to signing Brown, DJ and hoping Luke recover from his injuries, And get this... hoping Sasha can be the X factor in winning our 3 peat.

Shannon brown is a terrible 3-point shooter, and that was the single biggest weakness of the lakers last season. They need to sign someone that can spread the floor. If they are going to settle for a below average shooter, they should at least try to get someone who is a good defender like matt barnes. How does golden state keep finding these great shooters that go undrafted from the d-league, and the Lakers can't? Shannon Brown is definitely not worth more than 2 million per year and I hope the lakers don't make the same mistake they made with Luke and Sasha and overpay another player. By now, Brown is who he is, and that is an athelete that can't shoot. There are better options out there.
http://www.basketballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=1177

GGBHL...

I'll stand up and agree with Johnny V. Your Celtics are the dirtiest bunch of basketball players that I have ever seen. KG is nothing more than a bully and a pig. Same with Pierce, Allen, Rondo, Big Baby and EVERYBODY ELSE ON YOUR TEAM! Doc Rivers is the most mealy-mouthed, whiningest, complaining coach in the Association. The Celtics foul on every play, knowing that the refs can't call every one, and then call it good, physical basketball. The truth about your Celtics is that they know that they can't defeat teams with skill so they foul and cheat to gain every advantage they can. And it's been that way since the Russell/Auerbach days. In Short, BOSTON SUCKS!!!

Sonny Belfast...

What's happened to you, my friend? You used to be able to be counted on for some good, wry humor. Now, your're coming off totally different.

Maybe it's because that since the Lakers beat back the Kings to irrelevence in the early 2000's, your team hasn't been able to recover. Every year, you guys are either in the draft lottery or hoping to be in the draft lottery. Your team never seems to get better. It seems that your "NBA Finals" are the couple of games that are on the schedule against the Lakers.

I notice your comments on this site don't even speak to how the Kings can improve. It seems you're just fixated on the Lakers and bringing them and their fans down. Tsk, tsk!!

Johnny V - I'll leave you alone now - I already told you I don't post every day and I can't waste my limited computer time arguing with someone who only sees things in purple and gold. And I am NOT 131, he's not really indicative of all Celtics fans. Also, if what I thought didn't matter, they wouldn't let me post here now would they? Know what's worse than a sore loser? A sore, whiny winner. You WON, congrats, move on!

bronxlakerfan - I can tell you're from the bronx. Nice langauge, very intelligent comeback. Apparently you missed the whole Pistons teams of the late 80's!! Those guys were dirty. As for the Celtics, I really don't go much for all the trash talking, but it is a far cry from being a "bully". Actually, I thought Gasol outplayed KG in the Finals, and all Celtics fans noticed, the trash talking in this year's playoffs was WAAAYY down from 2008.

As for Doc - tell me, who gets fined for whining more than Phil Jackson? Who throws his players under the bus more than Phil Jackson? When you come up with a answer, please respond, and feel free to use the bright sophisticated language you used in your last post, very entertaining!!

Johnny V - I'll leave you alone now - I already told you I don't post every day and I can't waste my limited computer time arguing with someone who only sees things in purple and gold. And I am NOT 131, he's not really indicative of all Celtics fans.
Posted by: Giant Green Bald-Headed Lunatic | July 17, 2010 at 12:11 PM

Great! Nice having you here. But I am guessing I haven't heard the last of you.

Thanks a lot, have a great day!!

Thanks a lot, have a great day!!
Posted by: Giant Green Bald-Headed Lunatic | July 17, 2010 at 12:31 PM

Thanks, you too buddy.

Lakers should not keep Shannon Brown. He has a lot of natural talent like jumping out of the gym but does not have anything between his ears. Look at the slam dunk contest, how creative was he? He cannot do the entry pass to the bigs only east or west. Those players from summer leage look better than him at the minimum wages - Green, Robinson, Strawberry, etc.

Doc Rivers= Overrated losing coach who never won squat until two hall of famers fell into his lap. One of which was gifted to him by a former keltic, dirty, clotheslining, Frankenstein-looking worst GM not named Thomas in NBA history.

htj and bronx should get together for lunch!!

GGBHL...

What's the matter...does the truth hurt? Between gm. 1 and gm.2 of the Finals, Rivers went on a campaign complaining about how his team was being victimized by the referees. He and Thibodeau whine and complain on the sidelines like nobody's business. Phil does use some gamesmanship in his remarks, but I've never seen him run out onto center court while the game was in progress to call a time out! Doc does not respect the coach's box and is constantly on the court.

And your namesake, KG, is one of the worst examples of sportsmanship in the entire league. Everytime he blocks a shot, he screams out "get that S**T outta here!" He does that every time! Real nice for the youngsters sitting courtside. Pierce...declaring himself the world's greatest player? That's for others to say, not him. I could go on and on, but I won't. I'm from the Bronx so I'll keep it short and sweet. BOSTON CELTICS SUCK!!!!

And, I'd enjoy having lunch with htj or any other Laker fan on this site. We would have a great time trying to figure out why trolls love this blog so much.

bronx - so, if we "suck", what adjective (know what that is?) would you use for the New Jersey Nets?

And if you can tell me why lakers fan continually post on the Boston Globe, then I will leave and never return!!

Btw, I'm only here because Lakers bloggers came to my home turf first right after the NBA's first ever Dream Team was assembled.
Heat in 3, Lakers forfeit Game 4 at Staples due to fear of being run off the court
Posted by: Garrett Kall

Trust me, none of us would be caught DEAD on a Miami Heat blog, must have been some Celtic fans posing as Laker fans, (They secretly want to be us) As for your "Super Galactic Dream Team" all they have done so far is run thru some fog and get lifted up in a fork lift. Know why LeBron James want that pendant back that that chick found in a garage sale so bad, because he knows he'll never get a ring.
MY Prediction: Miami go's 68 and 14 in the regular season, espn predicts 4/4/4 in the playoffs, Celtics beat them in 6 games, face the Lakers again for the finals, Lakers in 7 again. Wade demands a trade because he can't stand playing with crybaby LeBron.

 
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