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Hornets guard Chris Paul reportedly expresses interest in joining Lakers

Chris Paul

What started as a toast soon became a declaration. Only 11 days after New Orleans Hornets guard Chris Paul proclaimed at Carmelo Anthony's wedding that the two would "form our own Big Three," with New York Knicks forward Amare Stoudemire, CBSSports.com's Ken Berger reports that Paul wants the Hornets to trade him. One of Paul's prospects would fulfill the prophecy he made at Anthony's wedding. One of the others would make fans of the defending champions jump up and down in excitement and suddenly wonder why they made such a 24-hour fuss over Harvard guard Jeremy Lin.

"Paul's list of preferred destinations consists of the Knicks, Magic and Lakers, and members of his inner circle already have sent word to the Hornets of his desire to be traded to one of those teams, sources say," Berger writes. "If Paul has his way, he's played his last game in a Hornets jersey."

Whether that translates to Paul joining the Lakers remains to be seen. Nowhere in Berger's report does it indicate that the Lakers share the same interest. Meanwhile, the story makes it clear that New York and Orlando have made progress in pursuing Paul.

Here's Berger on the Knicks' interest: "Team president Donnie Walsh's first step was signing power forward Amare Stoudemire to a five-year, $99.9 million deal. The move wasn't successful in swaying James or Wade, but it represents the first piece of a strategy designed to land Paul, Parker or Anthony -- or perhaps, even two of them. According to sources familiar with the Knicks' strategy, part of the reason for orchestrating the sign-and-trade for David Lee -- which yielded young talents Anthony Randolph and Kelenna Azubuike from Golden State -- was to stock the roster with attractive assets that could be used to acquire such marquee players if the opportunities presented themselves.

Here's Berger on Orlando's interest: "Paul's inclusion of the Magic on his list dovetails with CBSSports.com's report June 30 that star center Dwight Howard has asked Orlando management to pursue a trade for Paul -- although Magic General Manager Otis Smith said by phone Wednesday that he is unaware of such a plan. The team that has most aggressively positioned itself to reap the benefits of CAA's latest power nexus is the Knicks, who struck out in their pursuit of this summer's Big Three but perhaps didn't whiff permanently.

Chris Paul

As far as the Lakers? Well, as I mentioned before, the article doesn't indicate that the Lakers share the same interest. But CBSSports.com's Matt Moore includes the Lakers, Magic, Knicks, Hornets, Cavaliers and Trail Blazers as the teams most likely to get him. With Paul having two years left on his contract worth $34 million, Moore suggests that the most plausible scenario involves trading center Andrew Bynum and a handful of short-term contracts (i.e. Sasha Vujacic and Luke Walton). Though I mentioned earlier Wednesday that Bynum will remain an effective presence inside even if the off-season surgery on his right knee slows him down, I wouldn't be opposed to the deal itself. But I can't help but wonder how that would fundamentally change the way the Lakers play.

Bynum and Pau Gasol mutually benefited from each other inside, and the Lakers' triangle offense flourished when the ball moved from the inside out. Lamar Odom often took advantage of mismatch problems because teams were left worrying about the Lakers' big men or about stopping Kobe Bryant. Odom's versatility gave them a valuable chess piece in that regard. And if Paul played for the Lakers, Derek Fisher presumably would come off the bench, a role he'd accept but that perhaps would dampen his invaluable role in holding the team together.

There's no doubt that teams should be very afraid if Paul arrives in L.A. But his open-court style would change playing alongside Bryant and having to work within the triangle. I imagine Paul and Gasol instantly forming chemistry, but Gasol's effectiveness inside wouldn't be the same without Bynum.

We very well may see Paul's demand for a trade result in him going to a team other than the Lakers, making this post as irrelevant as the post analyzing what Lin could bring to the team. But if Paul happens to join the defending champions, the question wouldn't be so much how would he fit in the team as how  the Lakers' system and personnel would fit with the new acquisition.

-- Mark Medina

Follow the L.A. Times Lakers blog on Twitter: twitter.com/latmedina. E-mail the Lakers blog at [email protected]

Photo: Hornets point guard Chris Paul reportedly listed the Lakers as one of three teams he's like to play for next season. Credit: Lori Shepler / Los Angeles Times

Photo: If Paul joined the Lakers, the move would add speed to the backcourt. Credit: Lori Shepler / Los Angeles Times

 
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It's true, Bynum is injury prone and will always be. He is becoming to be more of a liability than an asset. It's just a matter of time before he is out for an entire season. Then What? "We should have done this... we should have done that... wa wa!" We need to go after Carmelo. Think past this year guys. Our system will be a little hampered without Phil. If we can get our hands on Carmelo and Paul, we can possibly have showtime back. Oh yeah!!!! or maybe not... but that's besides the point. Our current group is old and age was killing us last year. Carmelo and Paul still got some legs underneath them. To get Carmelo and Paul, I would like to see the following gone... Bynum, Sasha, LOdom and another pebble lurking out there. With Kobe's interest and approval, I would also like to see Shaq in the pic to take the place of Bynum.
Kobe
Gasol
Carmelo
Artest
Paul

off the bench (let these guys run the ball)
Blake
Caracter
Shannon Brown
Shaq
Fisher

I have really mixed feelings about this one.

There's the Broadway axiom, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it." Going for the 3-peat with the ones who brought you to the dance" seems prudent.

It's still Kobe's team, and while he may be on the downswing, he's still Kobe Bryant. He's the most popular athlete in the Universe. He's still the ticket. The Lakers can return to the promised land just the way they are.

On the other hand, the opportunity to maintain a championship caliber team into the future without the ugly rebuilding years is tempting. Adding Chris Paul now is pretty much an assurance that the Lakers can remain the team to beat as far as one can see. Dr. Buss has gotten a great ride out of Kobe and Chris Paul can certainly be the next great ride.

It is difficult to argue that Andrew Bynum is the next great ride. Yes, he gives the Lakers incredible upfront presence. But there's no evidence to date that he's the ticket. Why do I say this? There were all sorts of Lakers jerseys at the championship parade, the dominant one of course being Kobe's. There were plenty of Pau jersey's too. Then there was the assortment of others. Glaringly missing were #17's. I saw only one. That tells me that Andrew has yet to capture the imagination of the fan base. Dr. Buss is about selling tickets and merchandise. Chris Paul will sell tickets. Chris Paul will sell jerseys.

Call me crazy, but that's the decider. Without Chris Paul the Lakers will remain competitive after next season, but the sure-shot championship years will be over. We Lakers fans are spoiled. We expect a parade at the end of every season. Adding Chris Paul to the mix now is a win for the fans and a win for Dr. Buss.

The Lakers may not be "broke" now, but an opportunity like this to "fix" the future shouldn't be passed up.

@segeboy

LBJ is taking heat for the way in which he went about the trade.
Sure, that summer of Kobe demanding to be traded was a terrible time in every Laker fan's life. And it was the best time for haters to be saying "i told you so". But between LBJ and Kobe, I can say one thing for sure: at least Kobe is honest and straightforward. He let everyone know he was unhappy. He didn't keep everybody guessing. He didn't keep L.A.'s hopes up by pretending nothing was wrong. Lebron didn't even tell Cleveland's FRONT OFFICE the day of that stupid hour-long ESPN special.

I'm not really trying to excuse Kobe's behavior either, but given either situation, it's easier to forgive Kobe than LBJ.

People love to misread what is being discussed. Any team who's forced to trade a star player (like Lakers did in 2004), were forcesdto receive junk, there is no ifs ands or buts! From a financial standpoint I think Odom, and Sasha along with Bynum, to a lesser extent, are replaceable.. CP3 is not replaceable. A youngster with will, hunger and desire to win that can move the ball and be a lock scoring-wise would mean Kobe gets to rest longer so he can put 30-40 ppg performances deep into the playoffs, is irreplaceable. CP3 is a kid with a ton of upside, and Bynum is too, but he has never been healthy for a full season.

AB is only one of a handful true center in the NBA. Why trade a center for a PG?

Please remember the Hornets was a playoff team when Paul was healthy, and the really did not have a true big man. Quite frankly, he's that good. With an aging KOBE, this good pay well for the future of the organization.

I understand the Lamar Odumb is a versitale player, but what exactly does he do to recevei all this praise year in and year out? He spent most of the playoffs on the bench in foul trouble. Did KOBE not out rebound him in several games in the playoffs? Doesn't he constantly make silly mental mistakes on defense? When he drives to the rim for a layout, is it me, but doesn't he shrink in size?

So trading Odumb is really not a bad idea. I would keep Bynum, if all possible, but he's actually been out of sorts during the playoffs? CP3 would ensure the Lakers have a future and not just a past. I do not trust Mitch when it comes to picking talent or signing them. He has not street cred like West did, or Riles does.

I say package Blake, Sasha, and ODumb!!!!

Has this been along summer or what?

JR

Art -FL Lakers Fan,

you wrote: Well, I wonder, if the Lakers had Chris Paul this past season, for the whole season, and no Bynum, would the Lakers have still won it all?

When thinking about that, keep in mind the times Gasol was out injured...

my response: Yes. Mbenga would have got playing time. He's less injury
prone. Same size. A better shot blocker. Plays better defense.

KB Blitz,

Sport, I agree with all that you say. However, I wonder why you say it?
Clearly, Bynum is the sacred cow of the Lakers! You can't touch him or his
bloated contract or his knock-knees. For reasons that escape me, Bynum's
fans/minions are clearly enthralled by his 25/10 games against scrubs.
They are enthralled to the point where a logical discussion is *NOT* POSSIBLE.

I think that's one of the reasons I don't post a lot about Bynum & Odom
anymore. Everyone is yapping about their potential & everyone ignores
when the potential isn't reached. Which seems to be 3 games out of 5.

And before LakerTom starts more of his "disingenuous" lying comments
about my statements:

I have *not* said that Bynum sucks.
I have *not* said that we should trade Bynum.

For what it's worth, I bet that a starting lineup of D-Fish, KB, Artest, Pau &
Mbenga would *still* win the championship.

No, I have no idea why Phil didn't play him more. No, neither do any of
Bynum's minions.

As you said Rick, why fix something that isn't broken? Well if you talk to Bynum he will tell you something else, actually til after this week he will tell you he's recovering but I digress.

There always seem to be two camps in the Lakers fanbase. One that will dispute every possible trade. When Artest came into the Lakers some were already the first to say, it would kill the chemistry and it wouldn't work, and even into the playoffs he was questioned. Some people questioned Mitch's IQ. It got us another title.

Some people questioned Steve Blake, whether he was too unathletic, not an adequate backup, overrated, and some people even said he was getting overpaid while the fact remained that he was fielding offers that were higher than the one the Lakers offered, but he wants to win a a title. We got him on the cheap actually. People will question this CP3 rumor, like they put into question the fact that Raja Bell or Matt Barnes were more foes than allies. It was mostly just heresay, Kobe dispelled all those rumors, and they had a nice talk afterwords. So here we are, and the same camp that will belittle such a trade based on bias, don't see the real agenda here.. The Lakers have the ability to secure the future. If humans weren't a species who liked to take chances where would we be? If Jerry Buss didn't put Showtime together and was willing to spend on Magic, where would the franchise be right now? If Jerry West didn't see the potential in Kobe and put together a trade to get Shaq, where would we be?

So I tell you now, once again, if we don't acquire Chris Paul will the Lakers continue to rule the basketball landscape or should we wait til the Magic, or Cavs, or Knicks or some unmentioned team get this kid.

I always respected his game, but never really liked Chris Paul as an individual. I do now, because I see his desire, he like Kobe exhibits the same traits that competitors are known to have, the relentless desire to tell you exactly how they feel about any given situation. I think it would translate into good things for the future.. It would achieve many things, put money into Buss' pocket, and still continue to win with our core. Mitch didn't see this coming and neither did I, but I can tell you that I'd be happy to see CP3 lift a trophy with Kobe and Gasol. AS for Bynum, he will remain a footnote into a never ending saga that dates back to Kobe's infamous trade request back in the faithful summer of 07. The Big three in Miami would be nothing more than a pitiful #., here it would be a symbol of triumph.

Small point guards don't win championships because they have no bearing on interior play. Defensive effectiveness in the paint can neutralize an opposing team's offensive gameplan, particularly one that is guard/small forward oriented, like Miami's will be. In addition, the high percentage scoring opps will always come close in to the basket. Thus, it is the center/power forward position that is key for winning titiles.

People forget that Michael Jordon's Bulls team had very effective bigmen, as did Magic's Lakers and Bird's Celtics.

Also, a PG doesn't have to be great in Phil Jackson's Lakers system; which is why we were able to win so many championships with Fisher at our point.

For the grind of a 7 game playoffs/championship series, you must control the paint, and this is why the Lakers, Celtics, and Spurs have all been so dominant in past years. Each one of those teams have had very effective big-men controlling the inside. Miami stole one with a dominant guard, but then again, they had Shaq at Center, and Dallas had NO interior presence. Lesson learned.

Again, teams that are perimeter-intensive don't win championships (read Phoenix, read the Sixers v. Lakers 2001 Finals). Teams with effective bigmen (Bynum/Pau, Duncan, Perkins/Garnett) win championships.

This blog is both "guard-happy" and "celebrity NBA player-happy", and I don't understand why. Forget CP3, forget Tmac, forget any other celebrity player except competent big men.

We-need-a-backup-center-not-a-guard, dammit. I don't see why this is so confusing.

Chris Paul's contract expries in 2012, about a year before Bynum's does, I believe. Bynum's contract is already sky-high, above $14 mill this year and around $16 mill in his last season. Add one more scrub and you have matched CP3's contract, not a difficult trade at all.

I find it extremely distasteful how the so-called young "superstars" are handling their business. Chris Paul being the latest example. He is still under contract to the Hornets, and, as their on and off the court leader, should be concentrating on making the Hornets better. Instead, he and his inner circle are tweeting and dropping hints all over the internet that CP3 is not patient enough to fulfill his contractual obligations and would rather team up with another "superstar." Sorry, Chris...you're not a superstar in my book. On or off the court.

Meanwhile, Dwight Howard is busy throwing Jameer Nelson under the Orlando bus by requesting that the Magic front office find a way to trade for CP3. The same Dwight Howard that doesn't have a go to move and has been relying on his athleticism alone during his NBA career.

Rich, spoiled kids. When they signed those big contracts, everything was lovely. Now, after a few playoff disappointments, these children are ready to jump ship and seek the bling in other situations. I say to them: nobody promised you a rose garden. Only wheelbarrows full of money. You've gotten the cash, now earn it. If you can't win a C'ship, at least have the dignity and integrity to wait until your contract is up before having your "inner circle" leak your trade desires.

And, no, I don't forget that Kobe did basically the same thing a few years ago. I wasn't too pleased with him, either. And I heart Kobe and the Lakers.

Whenever you are faced with a crucial decision, it is best to go slow and sleep on it overnight. That's what I did and go back to basics. Identify the Lakers problem. Our problem in the past season are the 2nd unit, we have an excellent starting unit but when the relievers come in from Farmar, Brown, Odom and Walton we lost the advantage. Second problem, the financial situation is way over the luxury threshold, we took care of players wants but not our aging owner who is giving all the barn to produce a Championship team. Third problem, PJ will only work for us one more year and after him would be a vacuum in coaching. Brian S. is there but he's no PJ. Fourth problem, the new face of competition. Why we still lord in the West, well the East has changed its landscape, shall we meet the challenge with meager budget on hand?

Based on these parameters, I come to conclusion to protect our treasured players. Kobe, Gasol, Bynum, Artest, Fisher, Blake and the rest can be duplicated in so many ways with other bodies. Odom is good but getting to be expensive in the long run too with what he could bring on the table. I he can be a JR. Magic Johnson, then he is also untouchable. As a result, there is no appealing player in the trade for NO. Remember when you make a trade, it is a risk, you give what is important and going with calculated risk that the exchange is much better.

Furthermore, I have read that next year, CP3 will demand for max contract. Actually, that is inaccurate, he has three seasons and the last season is a player option. From 2010-11 - 14.9M 2011-12 - 16.3M 2012-13 - 17.7M (Players Option), as a result we are extending our pursuit of dynasty for two more seasons w/ CP3 playing along with Kobe, Gasol, Artest, Blake, Fisher and Bynum. Those are formidable forces that will beef our 2nd unit especially if we retain the rights of our two more draftees. It meets four problems enumerated head on. If NO rejects our offer of Lamar and our scrubs, then it is not for us. Let's move on and keep on improving to the 2nd unit.

@troy the league is getting faster, younger, and smaller.. Do you want to be on the backside of next year tell me that the Lakers didn't get past team x because they werent fast enough? Sure the Lakers have capitalized on Kobe's relentless will to succeed by nursering multiple injuries, but they had a horrible time against the Thunder.

The Celtics didn't have tall guys in the interior and they still beat us, but what was missing most was will to win. The Lakers simply didn't have a heart in 2008. They learned their lesson. Lakers didn't have Bynum in 2008, they were still pretty competitive against a smaller, more agile, and nimble Kevin Garnett. Main reason why the Lakers were taken to 7 games this year was for the same reason, they fought us out, and had offensive prowess. Reason why the Lakers won was mostly because they defended their guards or forwards and impeded penetration- - Advantage: Artest. Chris Paul can defend, steal and give you boards, for his size 6'0 4ribbies is not too shabby. Looking forward, it seems the Lakers were able to dominate every big man since the lesson was learned in 2008, no guts no glory.

I tell you again, lil' CP-to-the-3 is defensive as well as offensive minded. And he has the skillsets to evolve his game. If there was ever a time to bear light into truth it's now. Defensive dexterity by Gasol & Co was mostly the solution to every problem. Now, Bynum is a regular season stud, but hasn't translated into the postseason, much like Lamar Odom. I am not a Bynum hater, I am a realist. Seasons are predicated on longevity (why Celtics weren't a threat in 09). If Fisher was a few years younger Bynum would register less because most of the success would be turning the triangle inside out, but this isn't the case as it is right now. With CP3 you get an instant game changer who can spread the floor and speed the pace (+Advantage Gasol, Kobe, Artest).

Wait a minute... What KOBE was to help the Lakers get better. Don't blame his action, but love the results. He went to ownership and say get better or trade me. I want to win championships, not scoring tiltes. But so many people hated him for it and buried him in the media, and yet his action, force the Lakers to do something, because up until that point, they had been pathetic. How come people only remember what Kobe did, and not the reason for doing it? How come people, become so fixated to blame KOBE for his opinion, which help the team, but do not remember how bad the team was? What did you want Kobe to do, leave?

This trade will not happen for Paul. Its too good. Its to story book. But if...

@Ed Gueco

" If NO rejects our offer of Lamar and our scrubs, then it is not for us. Let's move on and keep on improving to the 2nd unit."

-Exactly my friend. No need to bash opposing players just because they are in the market like Steve Blake, Artest in the past, Bell, Barnes, Jeremy Lin, now CP3. If you asked me out of those which one would make the most sense from a NOW point of view, and FUTURE, that made the most sense financially to continue to reap more titles, it would have to be without a question CP3. Let's all agree on one thing, grit and desire from Kobe, and Artest and Gasol being money, and Fisher being a freak got us titles.

Remember people, CP3 owned his team with no legit C. It's a guard driven league and it's not getting any slower. If the Lakers had to get Okafor, and CP3 then move on, continue to develop the 2nd unit, and hopefully dominate for as long as we are saying now, as far as anyone can see.

re: Kobe and the summer of infamy.

I believe y'all are mis-remembering things. As I recall,

1. The rant.

2. unknown source in the Lakers said, "Kobe was the reason why Shaq left.
Everything is Kobe's fault".

3. Kobe's response: Dr. Buss do the right thing. If you're not going to try and
win, trade me.

Hi Kids

Relax. Nothing's gonna happen soon, if at all. Astonishing that some here are willing to trade away half of a championship team for a rumor.

I hope this also ends up in that catagory of "the best trades are the ones that aren't made".

From Hoopsworld:
Chris Paul: Yesterday Ken Berger of CBSSports.com posted a story suggesting that Hornets guard Chris Paul wants out of New Orleans and that his camp has an elaborate plan to insure Chris is traded and that he will be traded before the start of the 2010-2011 NBA season.

Let's be clear about a few things. Ken Berger is one of the best in the game, and his sources and credibility are beyond reproach. If he wrote it, it means someone Ken trusts and believes to be connected to Chris said it.

However what's been said - "He wants out... He wants to play with another superstar. He wants to follow LeBron's model of teaming up with other great players... He feels like they haven't put the right pieces together." – isn't exactly news.

Paul has been dropping hints about this kind of scenario since the NBA Finals and it's ultimately why Jeff Bower is not the general manager of the Hornets anymore.

Hornets' sources at every level said in Las Vegas last week that hiring a new GM was about getting a new voice to the table. A voice that could try and sway Chris Paul back from the edge and try and repair the relationship.

Dell Demps has officially been on the job as GM for one day. The Hornets won't be making any decisions on Chris Paul quickly.

Paul has zero leverage in this scenario as he is under contract for two more seasons.

Sources close to the situation said this week that unless Paul torches the team, the city and ownership – he will remain on the roster. So if Chris really wants out of New Orleans all he has to do is grab the nearest TV camera and say what's being credited to him, into a camera.

Until that happens, the Hornets are hoping they can soothe the relationship and make some deals that get Chris back on board.

There is little doubt that this is a combustible situation that's likely not going to end well for New Orleans. But just because people near Chris are saying he wants out, doesn't mean the Hornets will do anything about it, at least not until they have to and right now they have two years until Chris can walk away and who knows what the labor agreement in the NBA will look like in two years.

This really is not a new story. It's the same story with new quotes.

Chris Paul is unhappy with the direction of the Hornets. Chris Paul would welcome a trade to a contender with another star. Chris would like for that to happen sooner than later.

The news of the story will be how the Hornets handle this. They have gone from "head in the sand" denial to a little preventive defense.

What they do over the course of the next few weeks will show how serious they are taking Chris' stance and whether Chris likes it or not, he has been outed and will have to respond to the story at some point soon.

Shift of focus?? I call it again, BULLHIT

Listen, CP3 is just as potent on the defensive end as he is on the offensive end.

I'm still not in favor of trading Bynum mostly because I think it would be unnecessary and self defeating, BUT assuming they did make this swap, you'd give up interior defense in favor of perimeter defense.

CP3 is the best perimeter defending PG in the NBA. I can't think of one that's better. It's like getting GP the Glove in his prime without all the smack talk attitude.

CP3 is Hall of Fame material. He may not be enough to build a whole franchise on like an LBJ or Wade, but he's not too far behind either.

Lamar Odom is on the downside of his disappointing career (in that we all know he had talent to be more than he was) - he's not a terrible trade chip in that regard.

Where we run into problems is that NO will need another PG if they let CP go. Since we opted to trade JF for Blake, we no longer have a PG to trade! Derek's contract is untradable because he's too old, too slow, and his contract is too long. Blake can't be traded until mid season. Therefore, the best you can do is throw in Sasha V or try some sign and trade with UPS.

I'm very much in favor of Sign and Trade with Morrison. He's not as much of a bust as people think - he was on a title team playing behind the likes of Kobe, Lamar, Ariza, and Artest. It's sort of tough to get minutes there. Like Kobe said on Jimmy Kimmel, Morrison can play.

Mitch would deserve to get fired if he didn't do everything in his power to make this attempt a reality.

bronxlakerfan,

your rant would be on point if GMs aren't guilty of leaking news about a certain player being on the trading block just so they can get feelers. Look free will people, capitalist society etc etc ... CP3 can demand for a trade all he wants, but the hornets don't have to oblige him. After seeing cleveland come up empty handed in the LBJ sweepstakes, I I'm them I open up the bidding and sell him to the team with the highest bidder. all-stars/multiple first round draft picks etc etc. Sure teams will be giving you shitty offers but they've got time, get the word out there and eventually teams will bid against each other for cp3. Where GMs screw themselves is going, umm I don't do the trade unless i get equal value. Not happening, but u could come away with a caron butler/odom for shaq type deal.

RDlaker248,
Totally agree on that one ... the decision was a pr nightmare for him and deservedly so ... still besides that storyline there's been another theme about how he's not willing to be the man ... i dont care who his teammates are, u lineup against LBJ and u're in for a hard days work on the basketball court, playing with wade doesn't somehow transform him into a lesser role player ... it just means he's gonna be able to wreak more havoc on the opposition ... did i mention how glad i am we got the mamba's will to win against all odds on our sides, hell yeah ... bring it on boston, miami, okc thunder ... 3peat baby, who want's a piece of us

Again to all those going oh u get cp3 we're weat at center ... i counter with, if for whatever reason u believe cp3 isn't a good fit ... fine ... but if u get cp3, don't u think u could pawn him for a better/healthier big man than bynum? ... how bout uniting the gasol brothers in LA .... mind u i think if NO is crazy to release cp3, we'd be just as crazy not to hold unto him ...

And to the dude that said would we have won it with cp3 ... i say yup yup and yup again ... don't doubt PJs, Kobe, and Gasol ... those are proven talents that know how to use the tools they're given to achieve their goal ...

Nuff said ... i need my championship dvds ... i miss my freaking lakers ... i hope we get boston on christmas ... lol, beating miami would just inspire them ... beating boston on christmas would just be mean, and dnt we love being mean to the green weanies from the east

I still think that the Magic (of the teams mentioned) have the pieces to make it go. They have 2 PGs, including an all-star, and a bunch of role players they can let go of

Ammo can play? to qoute a tennis player, "Are you serious?" Kobe was being nice when he said Morrison can play, after all he was on the team, a good team, and chameistry was important. Ammo is a bust! Odumb is not as good as people think. He's tall but has no skills around the rim. He mises layouts like no other big man I know, well Kwame.

Celtic Big 3 Cost Lakers a Title

How many titles will a stronger Superfriends trio cost the Lakers franchise?

That's THE biggest question.

I promise you, the answer is greater than 0.

Make a deal here and now you shrink whatever that number is....

Look at this line-up from a defensive end (if we can find a way to keep socks)
PG - CP3 (best defensive PG in the NBA)
SG - Kobe (best defensive SG in the NBA)
SF - Artest (former defensive player of the year)
PF - Gasol (decent defensively - especially good at help defense)
C - Bynum (Not the best at his position, but close to the top)

Now flip that around an imagine all the open looks that Kobe, CP3, Gasol, Bynum, and Artest all get... because each (other than Ron Ron) create opportunities for the others.

Point Forward,

I hope you will always forgive our passionate brothers who still have hangover of success. They will cling to it till the end of time because we are always winning. It is hard to separate yourself with the winning horse derby after derby even when he is getting old and lame every race.

Just think of the opportunity of CP3 in purple and gold, my God we can be creative in so many ways. Paul is not Payton and PJ could adjust his triangle in a running triangle not a bystander triangle with Brown and Farmar. Just think also of the players salaries wasted just sitting on the bench Walton 5.2M and Vujacic 5.4M that's 10.6M well, we understand that they were both injured last season not their own fault. How about in the previous season? And the previous season, is there a trend here? LO helps a lot on the rebound. He is our prized possession. Without offering LO, Lakers have nothing to offer.

Having said that we should not fight this matter through tooth and nail by insulting each other based on our personal spins and conjectures. We all differ in what we want. Let's find a reasonable grounds in discussing issues without going into attacks and counter attacks, it is just basketball and an entertainment in the off season assessing what the future will be. It is a healthy exercise.

OK, let me get this straight...you guys think that Phil Jackson decided to come back for one more run at a title, and will now agree to gut the core group that already won the last two titles and got better with the Blake deal? Is that what you're saying? One last season just to run an experiment? Surely you jest, fantasy league playuhs.

If , and I do mean IF, such an absurd idea was even worth entertaining, there is one and only one guard in the league worth such a gamble, and who would blend in perfectly with Kobe, Phil, and the triangle...and there's no friggin way Utah will let the Lakers have him at any price.

Look, I find such theoretical what ifs entertaining, and I do respect the BB knowledge of many of those doing it, but there is a very simple principle in play here: you NEVER gamble away the title you can (and very likely will) win this year for the titles you MIGHT win in future years. Dr. Buss's poker motto is surely something like: "Never gamble away your full house just to try to draw that one card for the royal flush."

Learn it. Live it. Love it. It wins, baby.

some of your guys must be high dismissing CP3 like that for....Andrew Bynum? don't get me wrong, Bynum is a bad mf! when HEALTHY. most big men go down too often and Bynum is no exception. yeah he showed heart last year but he was hanging by a thread last year. i dont wanta go thru another playoffs with our big man playing with one leg. CP3 on the other hand would bring showtime back to LA. he is the missing piece we need and havnt been able to fill for years. can you imagine him with Kobe, Gasol, and Odom handing it off???!!! im sorry, i was having visions of Magic and Kareem and, and , and Jordon (?) teamed up. yes it would be insane. LAkers do this move in a heartbeat and trade Bynum while he still has value!

I'm sure glad none of you are our GM, You wanted to call Mitch "cupcake"? You guys want to gut the current roster that just won back to back trophies and is poised to three-peat for CP3 right NOW !!!
#1 Good dominating big men are 10X more valuable than point guards.
how many are there, Dwight Howard, Yao Ming, who else beats up the competition consistently ??? Andrew does when he's healthy, which will be THIS year.
#2 We run the TRIANGLE , a system that does not need a quick pick and roll point guard
#3 We need to start stocking up on good draft picks that will develop over the next three years so they will be ready when this current team starts to wind down.
#4 We can trade Odom next year, Sasha in a sign and trade if he does good this year, and Luke's expiring contract next year for young players or draft picks. You build a team, you don't build and gut, build and gut, thats Clipper off season basketball strategy.

Let's take a vote on the three proposals based on what is being discussed here:

A. Bynum and others for Paul

B. Odom and others for Paul

C. Status Quo

End time for voting will be 6:00PM Pacific Time.
Any volunteers to make the score.....

@HOBBITMAGE... “Yes. Mbenga would have got playing time. He's less injury prone. Same size. A better shot blocker. Plays better defense... For what it's worth, I bet that a starting lineup of D-Fish, KB, Artest, Pau &
Mbenga would *still* win the championship. No, I have no idea why Phil didn't play him more. No, neither do any of Bynum's minions.”
~
Sometimes you even surprise me with your incredible bias against Andrew Bynum. Mbenga a better shot blocker and defender than Drew? Only somebody who never played the game would make such a ludicrous and indefensible comment. The reason why nobody has stepped up to sign Mbenga even though teams are desperate to matchup against the Lakers tells you exactly why Phil didn’t play Mbenga. He is not a player.
~~~~~~~~~~~
TOM

For Orlando to work, Orlando would have to give up Jameer Nelson and otherwise. This would likely make the most sense for the Hornets. I'm not sure it makes sense for Orlando unless they're looking to unload contracts beyond Nelson and see Paul as an upgrade. This I think would make the most sense for the Hornets though http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=35tysdj might need to involve some picks too.

The only way New York pulls it off is if New Orleans is willing to do it as a salary and take on Eddy Curry, another expiring contract or some promising player they might have (doubtful) and 1st round picks.

If you're the Lakers you do this http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=2cj2l6k

all things being equal.. Lakers must do a 3 team trade to acquire this guy.. and the way I see, it the Lakers won't trade Bynum.. it's a huntch. I love CP3, but the Lakers IMO, don't see it like this, they like the core, and they feel they are overpaying for a small PG to compensate for a younger Bynum. In any case, I think the Knicks, and Hornets would be dumb enough to pull it off, because we all know that the Knicks will take any overpaid cat they find, if it meant a CP3 acquisition. That being said, we might have a shot at this, but it's a long shot because of what the Lakers have to give up (giving up a Lamar Odom whos in the downswing of his career isn't giving up too much). CP3 is the real deal, and I would love to have him. Only time will tell, Mitch will surely be busy trying to sell Odom+sasha, and luke's contract and maybe ebanks..and he will be talking to Barnes' agent as well. I guess the off-season was busier than Mitch thought.

@ Joe_Corad "I don't remember any player in the 90's trying to join another star to beat Jordan."

Sounds like you're old enough only to be watching Laker ball for the past two years when we won titles and think short little Youtube highlight "clips" that makes you educated on NBA.

WRONG! First off, are you kidding me? For one, how about Charles Barkley, Jordan's BEST FRIEND! Yeah, he tried to join a team that just won back-to-back titles for a ring! Not to mention on the same team, Clyde Drexler, who did just that the previous year and won! Yes, two Hall of Famers and 50 Greatest Players in NBA History joining a third to attempt to win a title...shock horror.

Want more? How about Scottie Pippen, Jordan's TEAMMATE who had ALREADY won 6 titles and wanted to win MORE WITHOUT JORDAN! He joined the same team after Drexler left again with two other Hall of Famers and 50 Greatest Players in NBA History! After that team, he joined ANOTHER team, this one full of young stars and ALMOST made the Finals, going 7 games in the Western Conference Finals against our very own Shaq and Kobe during their first title run.

Speaking of which, how about SHAQ?! He didn't leave his team to win championships? In fact, if he DIDN'T come to the Lakers, Kobe wouldn't have gotten his first 3 rings. And he might not even STAYED with the Lakers if Shaq never came. You think Kobe would be satisfied being a perennial non-contender on a team with Elden Campbell, Nick Van Exel, and riding the bench behind Eddie Jones (don't get me wrong, I love those guys, they kept things interesting for us in the "lean years") with Del Harris coaching?!

Yes, you think Phil Jackson would have agreed to coach the Lakers if Shaq wasn't on the team?! Yeah right. Fact is, if Shaq didn't come to the Lakers SPECIFICALLY to get out of the Eastern Conference where Jordan ruled, Phil Jackson would have NEVER coached the Lakers, and Kobe may not have won ONE ring with the Lakers or even be on the team RIGHT NOW.

And are we going to conveniently FORGET how we went after KARL MALONE and GARY PAYTON, two perennial All-Stars and future Hall of Famers (Malone gets inducted this year), after we got spanked by the SPURS in the Western Conference Semifinals in 2003?! So I guess it's A-OK for us assemble star talent together but if Chris Paul does it, what a MONSTER!

Point is, elite players in the NBA play for one thing and one thing only, RINGS! Don't mention money because they know with rings COMES money! And elite players know that for them to WIN RINGS, they need to play with OTHER great players.

I've been true purple and gold since Norm Nixon was playing with Kareem BEFORE Magic came but I can't stand bandwagon nut-huggers that sprout crap which is blatantly false in the name of the "Laker Nation". And about MAGIC, he's gone on RECORD that he left school early to PLAY WITH KAREEM. He's stated that if the Chicago Bulls had won the coin-toss for the rights to draft him, he would have STAYED at Michigan State. So grow up, face reality, and stop trying to peddle this players don't want "to join another star" fantasy revisionist history non-sense.

M2,

Please allow me to echo Edwin's request for a poll:

>>> Let's take a vote on the three proposals based on what is being discussed here:

A. Bynum and others for Paul

B. Odom and others for Paul

C. Status Quo

We've had a good run this morning of healthy qualitative arguments. Summing it up with some quantitative data is the perfect follow-up.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=264ohm7 You could also do this, and throw in the rights to Caracter and/or Ebanks and maybe a first round pick.

On behalf of Celtics Nation, PLEASE trade Bynum for Chris Paul. Please do it. It would be so great for US if you did that.

Yes, I'm sure Mr. Kupchak, the best GM in the NBA is considering the following:
forcing kobe to play without the ball - he would love that
forcing Gasol to play Center every night - great for the team
forcing LO to start and be conisistent!! = uh huh
bringing BOTH Fisher and Blake off the bench - yep
having a TRUE point guard in the triangle offense in Phil's last year - he would appreciate, I'm sure, all the extra coaching he'd have to do

Yes, lakers fans, don't get your hopes up. This is a ruse. He will either go to the Knicks, or stay in NO. NO WAY does Kupchak trade a Center for a PG...........it weakens your whole team......on second thought, go ahead and do it - see you in the Finals next year.......:)

If we need to get a 3rd team involved, it would have to be one with a few PGs on their roster...

NO would be interested in:
1. young talent
2. cheap talent
3. expiring contracts
4. otherwise short contracts

Lamar doesn't fit any of those.
If we trade Bynum, then it's a straight up deal, one for one. No sense in taking back garbage for either team.

My favorite trade is LO + AM sign & trade but doubtful they'd do this; My second fav is LO + SV.

Looks like NO has some trade exceptions... does anyone know how this would work?? As in, NO can send OUT more money than it takes in?? They have quite a few of these, so if they need to salary dump, they could, no??

You guys that want to package Luke are dreaming. No way N.O. does it

Giant Green....,

Can you insure Bynum in the Lloyds of London that he will be healthy in the next five seasons? No more sick leave at equivalent of $1M per day of absence.

@RICK... “It is difficult to argue that Andrew Bynum is the next great ride. Yes, he gives the Lakers incredible upfront presence. But there's no evidence to date that he's the ticket. Why do I say this? There were all sorts of Lakers jerseys at the championship parade, the dominant one of course being Kobe's. There were plenty of Pau jersey's too. Then there was the assortment of others. Glaringly missing were #17's. I saw only one. That tells me that Andrew has yet to capture the imagination of the fan base. Dr. Buss is about selling tickets and merchandise. Chris Paul will sell tickets. Chris Paul will sell jerseys. Call me crazy, but that's the decider.”
~
LMAO. OK, Rick. You are crazy! Jerseys notwithstanding, the Lakers are NOT going to trade Drew for CP3. Lewsters said it best yesterday. You’re not going to trade the best hand in the league – 4 aces if you will – for a long shot at a straight flush at a cost of another $30M. In addition, word is that the Knicks, who like the Yankees have such a large revenue stream that they can take on bad contracts, are ready to also take on Emeka Okafor’s $50M contract as well as CP3’s. I seriously doubt that Jerry Buss would throw away those 4 aces.
~~~~~~~~~~~
TOM

I'm confused. The Lakers just won the NBA Championship, right? Its player core is intact plus they added Blake, right? PJ's onboard and so is the best player on the planet, right?

I guess its time to upgrade the team then. Upgrade from Champion to . . ah . . ah . . Oh wait, there is nothing higher.

I guess its time to upgrade the team then. Upgrade from Champion to . . ah . . ah . . Oh wait, there is nothing higher. - P Ang

~~ We want to reach the mountain peak and sing Alleluia, Alleluia with Chick and Wilt out there.

It is amazing to me how many people on this blog apparently don't understand one of the fundamental aspects of basketball. You can't coach size. To trade a 22 year old 7'1" 285 pound center for a 25 year old 6 foot point guard just doesn't happen.

With Andrew in the lineup, no team can match up with the Lakers. If you swap him with CP, you need look no further than the team we just beat for the title to see a team that could beat LA. Paul is a great player, but he is a guy who is effective in an unstructured system that allows him to pound the ball for most of the 24 second clock. That is TOTALLY out of the question when you have teammates like Kobe and Pau.

Oh, and to address Blitz's point last night that Kobe, years ago, wanted Jason Kidd, I'm not even sure where to begin. Kidd was far younger, Bynum had done nothing in the league (compared to now, where Kobe considers him to be a critical part of a championship team), and most importantly: THE LAKERS DIDN'T MAKE THAT TRADE.

You don't trade all star centers for all star point guards, and if you don't get that then you don't know much about NBA basketball....

I love this blog, but man the pipe dreams have to end at some point. Would every team in the league love to have CP3? Even the Jazz, Bulls, Celtics would say yes, but the reality is, what this team would have to give up to get him doesn't convincingly make this team better. Yes the perimeter defense might get better, but the interior defense(where playoff games are won) would take a significant hit. Chris Paul is a stud, but is built for a different style of basketball than what the Lakers play. I'd trust Phils' system and philosophy over clamoring for an elite pg. 11 titles, and not once has there been an elite pg....CP3 is great, but let's keep what other teams fear.....the height, skill and depth of the frontcourt

@segeboy

"And to the dude that said would we have won it with cp3 ... i say yup yup and yup again ... don't doubt PJs, Kobe, and Gasol ... those are proven talents that know how to use the tools they're given to achieve their goal ...

Nuff said ... i need my championship dvds ... i miss my freaking lakers ... i hope we get boston on christmas ... lol, beating miami would just inspire them ... beating boston on christmas would just be mean, and dnt we love being mean to the green weanies from the east"

---
Exactly. I couldn't have said it better myself

Ed Gueco,

It's fun but for all reasons we must continue to talk about it, it's the basis of democracy, the one created eons past to decipher our wants, needs and desires. It's the reason why Kobe went on a tirade in 07.. to democratically freely express how he felt about his situation nothing more nothing less.

He didn't become a transient pedestrian King like James, and not even talk to his owner or return repeated calls, he urged the ownership to step their game up, it's just that simple. Kobe is the barometer for success. Result = 2 titles and counting, 3 straight finals appearances.

Odom + namers for Paul

Bynum + namers for Paul

Now, on that subject. IF you pursue it you don't have anything to lose- at least you got more experience as a GM. Pat has been at it for a long time, and I would love to see Mitch pull a CP3 or CMello trade or Durant in the near future. It would hurt not to pursue CP2the3, if for no other reason than to let the Lakers know that he is trying to get brand name players, and send the message that at least the Lakers are in the mix, so they can leverage with other on going negotiations.

Laker/Bynum Tom,

you wrote: Sometimes you even surprise me with your incredible bias against Andrew Bynum. Mbenga a better shot blocker and defender than Drew? Only somebody who never played the game would make such a ludicrous and indefensible comment. The reason why nobody has stepped up to sign Mbenga even though teams are desperate to matchup against the Lakers tells you exactly why Phil didn’t play Mbenga. He is not a player.


my response: If you stopped riding Bynum's jock and paid attention
you'd be a lot smarter. Allow me to help. Educate yourself!

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/m/mbengdj01.html

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/bynuman01.html

per 36 minutes Bynum gets 1.7 blocks
per 36 minutes Mbenga gets 2.9 blocks.

I guess that means that I was right when I said that Mbenga was a
better shot blocker than Bynum.

Before this turns nasty ... I suggest that you leave me alone old man.

Be well

It is very possible that miami with all the talent around them will win...simple as that. There's no reason to start the same crap and keep juggling people to compete with that travesty in miami. riley wants to compete with Phil the same way laquit wants to rival Kobe. I still think we are set with our starters and only have to get more aggressive role players who will run the triangle properly. If our bench would hold serve with other teams, we would be in great shape. Our problem was giving up leads when the bench came into the game. farmar, luke, and sasha did not play like veterans who knew the system. Powell and DJ looked lost out there. Thats 5 role players not doing what they did in 2009, when they were "the bench mob".

@troy "People forget that Michael Jordon's Bulls team had very effective bigmen"

You've got to be joking! If anything, Jordan's Bulls proves that you DON'T NEED a dominant big man to win championships! Jordan played with the "three-headed-monster" big man scrub rotation whose major contribution was 18 fouls to give!

If we trade Bynum for Chris Paul, we still have Gasol and Odom, AND we would ADD another BIG MAN! Perhaps not with the size of Bynum, but we could make it work, ESPECIALLY with the positives that CP3 brings to the table. And very probably someone that's not going to be injured a major portion of the time, especially in the playoffs.

Let me ask you this, who played CENTER on those Spurs championship teams after Robinson retired? EXACTLY! Yes, they had one of the best big men in history with Tim Duncan, but he played mostly POWER FORWARD, usually with a SCRUB as the center! Fact is, we have Pau Gasol, the best big man in the league right now AND Odom, and add one more big man, don't tell me we can't win with that roster including Kobe, Artest, and CHRIS PAUL in the starting line-up, with Fisher coming off the bench!

There is no rush to sign the rookies, we have their rights, and the more and more we can make them less important, the less we will have to pay them. Lin on the other hand was open to all suitors, that's why everyone was in hustle mode....it would have been great to get him and DEVELOP him, but Phil doesn't do that. (regularly, at least).... Forget about CP3, he's not worth Bynum, we just got Blake, and he's a steady player, Odom is 4 players, Drew is 7 feet and 290 lbs....I say we stick with what we got and continue the chase for Barnes, who would make Odom expendable if he works out. Then we could use Odom as a trade chip for a center later on...

THE LURE OF SHOWTIME 2.0
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
While I don’t believe that the Lakers would trade Andrew Bynum for Chris Paul, I do think that Jerry Buss could be tempted to consider trading Lamar Odom and Sasha Vujacic for CP3, especially considering that this is going to be Phil Jackson’s last season and that the Lakers next coach might not want to run the Triangle.
~
There have always been rumors that Buss preferred a wide-open Showtime style of offense versus the discipline of the Tex Winter’s Triple Post Triangle Offense and CP3 would give him the point guard with the skill to run it. And a trade of Odom and Vujacic would give not only fit the Hornets lineup needs perfectly but also save them over $30M, which is the primary reason why New Orleans would consider trading Chris Paul in the first place.
~
Personally, I don’t think Jerry would bite because he already has the winning hand so why take the risk? On the other hand, if there really was a possibility of getting Chris Paul for Lamar Odom and Sasha Vujacic, Jerry Buss just might have the steely nerves to go all in to lock up the next decade as part of the Lakers dynasty. While I think the costs will ultimately deter any such trade, Buss could really shake up the entire NBA.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
TOM

The height advantage.....no problem if we trade Bynum for Paul, because we've been developing M'Benga the last few years.....what, we havn't????? Never mind.

Edwin,

Wilt won just two. Kobe's mountaintop already exceeds his threefold.

And Chick? In his own words "We? What do you mean we? Do you play for the Lakers?" Chick never won anything.

Laker Tom,

Bynum is a piece. A damn good one. But he'll never be the Franchise. Never.

Point Forward,

If I try to summarize of Laker fans here, they are so much confident of the future and would like to protect the Championship in so many ways....

with Chris Paul who will be dynamite in PG position a great aid to Kobe, Gasol etc and in preparation to post Fisher era as well as Kobe.

with Bynum who is a growing Center every year, a beast in the making but also fragile like an egg shell. He has baby bones and soft muscles

with our present line-up with veterans, superstars and scrubs, we are winning so why fixed it? We want to win more with the scrubs here and there but they helped as cheerleaders, one shot here and one rebound there then hug one another in June.

with PJ one year tenure, his triangle is crazy can be than no sane Superstar will understand it in one season. You have to loiter and wait for your turn if you are blessed by the Zen world of rotations

with Kobe as the Center fold of all these things. He is the Alpha-Omega of the Lakers.... and I'm just wondering what he is waiting in the medical treatment of mangled fingers.

with the budget of Jerry Buss, we are above the luxury threshold paying so much taxes, we need a tax cuts not more spending.

So those are the echoes of Lakers democracy. We are the Champions, yet we're unsettled with our pending obligations in going for 3-peat and more repeats. It is Laker passion at its best.

Enough of this ludicrous fantasy that Mbenga is a valuable NBA player. There is a reason Phil did not play him and it had to do with his talent and abilities. If he is so damn good, then why are the Lakers not even interested in bringing him back? And why are no other teams lining up to sign him even thought everybody needs bigs? Figure it out. The guy cannot play at this level and every general manager in the league knows it. Period !!!!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
TOM

They need a forward and a point guard if they lose CP3.

Lamar Odom + Steve Blake = $12.2 million salary vs CP3's $14 million

Throw in Sasha's expiring $5 million (easy for Hornets to trade to another team and he'll probably be good this year since it's a contract year) and you've vastly improved the 2 time defending champs, saved $6 million ($3 million salary + $3 million luxury taxes) and given the Hornets 3 serviceable players (all capable of being starters) in return for their disgruntled superstar. Pull the trigger Mitch!

With Phil Jackson retiring, I dont think the triangle will stay.
Not full triangle offense at least.

I would love to see a open style fast break team again...

So I welcome Paul.

Bronxlakerfan -

I, for one, thought your post was spot on.

I think having one player on the Lakers with eyebrow issues is more than enough to handle.

NO to Chris "unibrow" Paul.


LOL!!


Mornin' crue!

Meh...will never happen.

Why? Because no one wants the Lakers to get better.
What makes everyone think that the Hornets would help a Confrence rival get better?

For all the arguments about stats and injuries and blah blah blah. Remember these three things.

1. You can't teach height.
2. The Lakers FO already said they aren't trading Bynum.
3. Justa only said I might be an axe murderer. OR am I?????

But Me being an axe murderer is neither here nor there so remember these always remember these 4 things.

1. Ice Cream is delicious.
2. The Laker Girls are not pole dancers (you want that go watch a Miami Heat / Denver Nuggets game.)
3. I'm not into guys but Rick Fox was dreamy.
4. The Shaq Fu video game, The Kazaam and Steel movies where the worst things to ever happen to the entertainment industry

MM -

Is there a reason the formatting is all messed up? Breaks and spaces are gone, and it makes the posts much more difficult to read.

ESPN Trade Machine says my proposed Odom + Blake + Vujacic for CP3 trade will have to wait until December 15th because trading Blake is restricted until then...it can still work. We could give those three more playing time the first 2 months of the season to show the Hornets their value and then Santa Kupchack can bring joy to all of LA this Christmas. It would be like getting Gasol in mid-season all over again. Do it Mitch!

@segeboy -
I'm a Celtic - I don't know what a smack down feels like. Unless you call a 4 point win in Game 7 of the Finals a smack down. You won, you were the better team, but PLEASE - enough with the smackdown talk. It was a great series, don't tarnish it with your petty little rants that no one believes!

WOW O WOW...

What happened last night...Did our back2back championship Lakers just lose something...Were we not the team to beat to win the championship...What happened all of a sudden, that so many want to dismantle this team...What happened that we all so sudden we need to change our defense, give up the triangle...Break up a team, that PJ agreed to coach for one more year...We expect PJ to get a unit together, with 2 new pieces, and be dominant, all in 1 year, when it took PJ 3 years to finally get a unit this cohesive, and dominant, so much, you see what happened in the FA sweeps, and Lebron selling his soul to try to topple the Lakers, and get his first ring...

What happened to our pride, and support of our team, when CP3 includes the Lakers in his choices, are we so desperate, that in a heartbeat, we sell our soul to the devil, dismantle a proven roster, all for Paul, who just missed half a season due to injury...

"Kupchack should get fired if he doesn't sign CP3"...Did I read this correctly...
Like I posted yesterday...We have 4 aces in Kobe, Pau, Bynum and Artest...Why risk that to get a straight flush, and giving up a winning hand...

All I can say is, I'm glad Dr. Buss is a poker player...and I hope he can see my analogy...and I hope the rest of the Nation can relax and just wait for the Lakeshow to show the league how a dominant dynasty wins championships...not by buying it...

CP3 . . .

Lots of GREAT posts on this hot topic. I just want to remind everyone that GREAT players can excel in any system. Average players and role players need the right fit to succeed. But the GREAT ones have the talent and drive to take advantage of any system.

CP3 would excel in the triangle, any set offense, or two-on-two beach volleyball. He is GREAT. But, there is a principle of diminishing returns in the NBA when blending talent. Teams need combo of GREAT ones, Good ones, Average ones, and Role Players. Finding and maintaining the perfect balance is what leads to championships.

Lakers have been hovering near that perfect balance for a while now.

I suppose the best example of this is how so many of you feel that Wade, Lebron, Bosh won't work out as well as many think due to the overlap of Wade and Lebron games. In fact, you don't have to look too far back in Laker's history to see what happens if you try to fit two GREAT players together.

By the way, check out the stats of opposing Point Guards scoring against CP3. All the talk about needed a "quick point guard" to stop others is silly. CP3 is probably the quickest and slickets point in the league. But, it doesn't translate to defense. Just a random thought there!

GREAT posts everyone! Enjoying the reading.
Mike

I agree with some of the other comments about Bynum being more valuable and a better fit for this Lakers team than Paul. While I think Paul is talented enough to play with Kobe and within the Triangle, the loss of Bynum would greatly alter the dynamic of the team, as we would go from a big dominating power type team to a speedy and small team with Gasol and Odom playing the 4 and 5 spots.

I think our length and power down low is our greatest asset right now and a big reason we won the championship last season, and I don't think breaking that up is worth the risk of getting Paul. Don't get me wrong, it would be awesome for Paul to be on the Lakers and exciting as hell to watch, but I think it hurts their chances to REPEAT THE THREE-PEAT.

Now, if we could get Paul by trading Odom and Sasha and maybe Luke, now that would be fantastic!

I agree with some of the other comments about Bynum being more valuable and a better fit for this Lakers team than Paul. While I think Paul is talented enough to play with Kobe and within the Triangle, the loss of Bynum would greatly alter the dynamic of the team, as we would go from a big dominating power type team to a speedy and small team with Gasol and Odom playing the 4 and 5 spots.

I think our length and power down low is our greatest asset right now and a big reason we won the championship last season, and I don't think breaking that up is worth the risk of getting Paul. Don't get me wrong, it would be awesome for Paul to be on the Lakers and exciting as hell to watch, but I think it hurts their chances to REPEAT THE THREE-PEAT.

Now, if we could get Paul by trading Odom and Sasha and maybe Luke, now that would be fantastic!

I agree with some of the other comments about Bynum being more valuable and a better fit for this Lakers team than Paul. While I think Paul is talented enough to play with Kobe and within the Triangle, the loss of Bynum would greatly alter the dynamic of the team, as we would go from a big dominating power type team to a speedy and small team with Gasol and Odom playing the 4 and 5 spots.

I think our length and power down low is our greatest asset right now and a big reason we won the championship last season, and I don't think breaking that up is worth the risk of getting Paul. Don't get me wrong, it would be awesome for Paul to be on the Lakers and exciting as hell to watch, but I think it hurts their chances to REPEAT THE THREE-PEAT.

Now, if we could get Paul by trading Odom and Sasha and maybe Luke, now that would be fantastic!

I agree with some of the other comments about Bynum being more valuable and a better fit for this Lakers team than Paul. While I think Paul is talented enough to play with Kobe and within the Triangle, the loss of Bynum would greatly alter the dynamic of the team, as we would go from a big dominating power type team to a speedy and small team with Gasol and Odom playing the 4 and 5 spots.

I think our length and power down low is our greatest asset right now and a big reason we won the championship last season, and I don't think breaking that up is worth the risk of getting Paul. Don't get me wrong, it would be awesome for Paul to be on the Lakers and exciting as hell to watch, but I think it hurts their chances to REPEAT THE THREE-PEAT.

Now, if we could get Paul by trading Odom and Sasha and maybe Luke, now that would be fantastic!

nah, still not seeing it.

Think about this....we're contemplating an elite point guard vs a role playing big in Bynum. Everyone argues this and that about franchise players, but given several things, I don't see the Lakers everyone's pet trade in Bynum and CP3.

Those several things? Here they are:

1. The Lakers are committed to Phil's one last go at it....
2. Hence, the Lakers are committed to giving the Triangle one last go.
3. Thus, the Lakers are committed to dominant or unique post players in Pau, Kobe, Bynum, Lamar, Artest to create offense, NOT the skill of a defense breaking point guard.
4. Phil, doesn't put extra value on point guards, even if elite.
5. Mitch and Jim Buss are likely committed to letting the core they've built, especially with Jim Buss' pet project in Drew.

Again, its really not about Drew vs. CP3, its about the direction the Lakers are already committed to rather deeply.

So thanks for throwing us in the convo CP3, that makes you, Matty Barnes, TMac, Lebron, Chris Bosh, Shaq, and everyone else that said they want to leave their team.

I weighed it all out, I put it on paper...pros and cons if we should sign Chris Paul...

The results...It was very close, but...NO to CP3...

The deciding factor...his 'unibrow'...

I agree with justa...lol

Seems people aren't following the logic justa... if you include Sasha in the trade package for CP, who's gonna coach eyebrow grooming?

ya'll who wanted to keep bynum would be scratching you head this coming NBA season. mark my word that he will miss at least the first month into the season including training camp, and will have a non contact related knee injury mid point or latter. he's a jinx to the lakers.

laker fans forever.

Walton and Vujacic make ~$10 mil. Paul makes $14.9 mil. A sign-and-trade or getting another team involved could work. This would be bigger than getting Pau and would make the Lakers one of the best teams ever.

>>>I believe keeping Bynum would be better for the Lakers as a team. (If he's
>>>healthy)

I agree 100%...

but those last three words in parenthesis make me very very very nervous.

Hey, I know, lets trade Kobe for CP3! Screw the repeat, Kobe will be washed up in a couple of years, lets start planning our next dynasty now!

MM -

Please post a new topic...This one has been rehashed to death...

LEAVE BYNUM ALONE. IF WE TRADE HIM IT WILL PROBABLY COME BACK TO HAUNT US IN WAYS WE NEVER THOUGHT IT WOULD. I THINK ODOM HAS GOTTEN THE MESSAGE AND WILL BE A BEAST THIS YEAR. I THINK FOR THE MOST PART WITH THE TWO NEW RECRUITS, BLAKE AND THE TEAM WE ALREADY HAVE. WE MATCH UP GOOD WITH ANY ONE INCLUDING MIAMI, IT'S JUST HOW DETERMINED WE PLAY THAT WILL DICTATE HOW FAR WE GO. AT TIMES LAST YEAR WE SEEMED TO PLAY FLAT. THIS YEAR EVERY ONE WILL TRULY BE TRYING TO DETHRONE US AND WE DEFI NITELY NEED TO TRY AND WIN THE OVER ALL HOME TEAM ADVANTAGE THROUGHOUT THE PLAYOFFS. AS TIME CONTINUED, I BEGAN TO SEE A DETERMINATION IN BYNUM THAT I WAS NOT USE TO SEEING. HE'S YOUNG AND LEARNING, BUT NOW HE SEEMS TO BE MOTIVATED. KEEP HIM AND REAP THE REWARDS THAT WAS SOWN I NTO HIM . WE HAVE THE BEST COACH AND THE BEST TWO TEAM LEADERS. KOBE AND FISHER. LET'S TAKE THAT AND RUN WITH IT. SOM ETIMES FEAR CAN MAKE US DO THINGS THAT WE MAY REGRET. WE'RE STILL DRIVING OUR BENTLEY ON THE AUDOBON AND UNTIL SOMEBODY OVER TAKES US WE'RE STILL THE CHAMPIONS. SECOND TIMOTHY 1:7

@HOBBITMAGE... It’s pretty obvious that you never played the game when you continue to claim that D.J. Mbenga “plays better defense” than Andrew Bynum. It’s also pretty obvious how faulty your reasoning is when you cite Mbenga’s higher shot blocks per 36 minutes as “proof” he is a better shot blocker. Of course, D.J. never could last 36 minutes in an NBA game due to his proclivity to foul and make bad decisions, which is why your “better” defender hasn’t even had a single iota of interest from any NBA team out there. How do you explain that. I would leave you alone if you would stop making idiotic and indefensible comments.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
TOM

I AGREE.

Well here is today's haiku...

Lakers Dynasty...
Three years of dominant ball...
Why not make it four...

Package Odom, Blake, Sasha expiring contract

Then I would make the deal.

phred

>>> He will want a max contract next year,

CP3 is under contract for this year and next year. He can't get a new contract next year, whether he wants it or not.

And if the CBA scales down how much teams can spend the year after that, then he might not be getting as big a max contract in 2012.

You have got to be kidding me. No way - NEVER trade big for small. NEVER.

lewstrs / noah - I just don't get why people have no concerns about this serious topic. Even Jimmy Kimmel brought it up and said you do NOT want a champion with unruly eyebrows. It's a no-brainer if you ask me.

El Guapooooo!! So - are you or aren't you? I need the definitive answer before I schedule my vodka deliveries. A girl can never be too careful these days.


>>>-I don’t think the Hornets would trade CP3 for Odom, Sasha and Walton

Doesn't matter if they would or not, the money doesn't line up so that isn't a possible trade.

>>>If Bynum is really injured again next year, Okafor won’t save us


Okafor at 100% is much better than Bynum at 50%.

Bynum at 100% is much better than Okafor at 100%.

The question is, how confident are you that Bynum will be 100% in June?

phred ...or we can waive the whole team and forfeit the season. Then we'll see how good Mitch really is..

>>>CP3 to the Lakers will never happen - but I'd swap Blake Sasha and Drew ...

Again, money doesn't line up.

Drew and CP3 make about the same amount of money. If the Lakers are throwing in Blake (for a backup PG) &/or Sasha (for an expiring contract), then they'd have to be taking back 1 or 2 other players.

So if players other than Drew & CP3 are involved, then that means the Lakers are probably also getting back Okafor (which would be a salary dump move by NO, but would give the Lakers a decent big to replace Bynum) or Posey (a good replacement for Sasha, with 1 extra year on his contract).

Peja is 15 million in expiring contract and Songalia is 5 million in expiring contracts, so I can't see New Orleans trading them off. If you're rebuilding you want to have as much cap space as possible next summer.

So in the rebuilding train of thought, it's Bynum, Sasha, and Blake for CP3 and Okafor. If NO was willing to do that deal, I think the Lakers would at least strongly consider it. You don't want to break up a championship team, but on the other hand, if you can get the best point guard in the league and a reasonably good replacement for Bynum (and for less money than Bynum makes), then you've got to at least consider it.

LakerTom -

Mbenga IS a better shot blocker than Bynum. But that doesn't mean he's a better defender. Bynum is better at pretty much everything else - at both ends of the floor. Mbenga's sole advantage over Drew is shotblocking. Admitting that doesn't make Socks any less of a player.

IMO Chris Paul would be a no brainer as long as the trade went down like this,

Lakers get : Chris Paul, Emeka Okafor (26,480,528 in Salary)


New Orleans: Andew Bynum, Sahsa, Walton, Future 2nd round pick
(24,843,445 in Salary)

** The above trade is realistic and beneficial for both ball clubs- Sasha, LO, Luke for Chris Paul is ridiculous ....Orlando could put together a much better deal than that!!


Laker Lineup: CP-3/ Fisher
Kobe/ Blake
Artest/Ebanks/Tmac-Barnes
Pau/ LO/Character
E Okafor/ Theo Ratliff -Kurt Thomas


NO Lineup : D Collison
Posey
Peja
D. West
Bynum


IMO the Lakers would better defensively ....Paul is only 25....Okafor 28.....and wouldn't lose their advantage in the Paint......Andrew would have a real chance at being a Franchise Center and could max out his potential rather than waiting 4 seasons for Kobe and Pau to age out....

P. Ang,

You asked what is higher than Championship? I said to be in the mountain top, above the clouds maybe at edge of Solar System. We are all dreamin' here.

Another way of settling the issue is to consult the future through a horoscope or scientific experiment by applying Einstein theory on the destiny of the Lakers with the status quo. The biggest question mark is Bynum's health. The other one, will there be another enticing offer such as this?

After deliberating this matter in so many posts and so many twists and turns, attacks and counter attacks the verdict of NO management to ignore Paul and move on. Ahh, at least we though of the future, we created a seed of doubt on players mentioned, we dreamt big and fall back to earth and in other words we all didn't blog in vain and just surrendered to the three stooges.

good morning my daer laker blog crew...

and good morning to you mr MM

bronxlakerfan,

About the rich, spoiled kids growing up stuff, I agree with your post.

enjoy the game - that is a great trade - for the lakers. It is terrible for NO, and therefore cannot be made. Do you really think they will give up their two best players for oft-injured Bynum, stiff-Sasha, and Luke "I am not my father" Walton?

Also, you don't have T-Mac, Barnes, Ratliff or Thomas. Other than that...................it is NOT beneficial for the lakers at all. That team is not as good as the 2010 model, not by a long shot!

I love it as a Celtics fan, but if Kupchak made that trade, he should be fired, then hired by the Clippers or Knicks!

@ Giant Green Bald Headed Lunatic - you troll go back to boston...

one word of advice... please dont come in to our home turf and start talking about what lakers need to do for our own good... we are the true laker fans and we knows whats best for our team, you trolls dont even make a good argument because your basketball IQ is 0. so keep your comments and remarks about trading our core members for cp3.
why cant you go back on boston herald and start commenting on what you team needs to do to make it through the East Conference... ummm one word of advice, how about you dump the OLD 3 and get some new talent in the team, tahts about the best advice i can give you. so stop with those suggestions... no one cares and no one listens to you, we know your blog is dead so you can find a better place but the LAKERS BLOG!!! ahahahaha gotta love the CHAMPSS!!

MM - who let the trolls in??

>>>Triangle doesn't need cp3 overrated pg

Well, the triangle functions better if the PG is a good passer (in fact good passing from ALL positions helps the triangle)... CP3 is one of the top passers in the league

check

The triangle also requires that the PG is able to hit 3-pointers. Over the last 3 seasons, Paul has hit 37%, 36%, and 41% on 3-pointers.

check

And what everyone seems to be ignoring is that Chris Paul is also a very good defender. The Lakers greatest weakness would be shored up nicely with Chris Paul starting.

But again, before you come down too hard on me, it's a big gamble.

If Bynum can stay healthy, then he does more for the Lakers than CP3. But if Bynum turns out to be injured like this every year, then not trading him for CP3 would be a huge blunder.

Laker/Bynum Tom,

1st. I told you to leave me alone. You won't. Fine. Let's dance old man.

you wrote: It’s pretty obvious that you never played the game when you continue to claim that D.J. Mbenga “plays better defense” than Andrew Bynum. It’s also pretty obvious how faulty your reasoning is when you cite Mbenga’s higher shot blocks per 36 minutes as “proof” he is a better shot blocker. Of course, D.J. never could last 36 minutes in an NBA game due to his proclivity to foul and make bad decisions, which is why your “better” defender hasn’t even had a single iota of interest from any NBA team out there. How do you explain that. I would leave you alone if you would stop making idiotic and indefensible comments.

my response:

Let's talk reasoning. Wait. Hold on. Go get a dictionary. You're vocabulary
is limited. Get you wife, so she can translate for you.

bet·ter 1 (btr)
adj. Comparative of good.
1. Greater in excellence or higher in quality.
2. More useful, suitable, or desirable: found a better way to go; a suit with a better fit than that one.
3. More highly skilled or adept: I am better at math than English.
4. Greater or larger: argued for the better part of an hour.
5. More advantageous or favorable; improved: a better chance of success.
6. Healthier or more fit than before: The patient is better today.

So ... How would one logically compare two different players? Is it really
equitable to compare 1 player who played for 1 minute vs. 1 player who
played for 30 minutes? The answer to that is no. If you don't understand
go talk to your grand kid's math teacher.

I attempt to compensate for the lack of playing time by the metric per 36
minutes. If *YOU* have a better more logical method of comparison, now
is the time to get off of your old saggy behind and use that decrepit thing
you call a brain and write something intelligent. If not, shut up.

You spoke of DJ's proclivity to foul. If you go back to last year's playoffs ...
you'll find that Bynum was consistently in foul trouble. I've posted links
before, so I'll not do that now. If you don't remember it's because you're
mind is decrepit. Practice sodoku or play go or chess.

re: team's not interested in Mbenga. This is a straw argument. The line
you are supposed to be addressing is: Is Mbenga a better shot blocker/def.
player than Bynum? Teams *may* not be interested in Mbenga because
they feel that offense is more important. Odd, because we won with our
defense. No accounting for taste these days.... Other teams interest in Mbenga
are not relevant to the question you're supposed to be answering.

I know it's late in your life, but there are online classes. You should take
a critical thinking class. It would help you. Do you have an abacas?
Did you know you can watch MIT classes on line? In other words, stay on
point old man.

Here's a funny thing. I *ALWAYS* have some sort of evidence to support
my stance. [ Sorry. Is "evidence" to big of a word for you? Let's switch
evidence with fact or statistic. ] Why don't you ever use some sort of
objective information to support your claims?

btw, because I know your english is lacking:

b·jec·tive (b-jktv)
adj.
1. Of or having to do with a material object.
2. Having actual existence or reality.

To everyone else,

No. I am not being racist towards the half-asian LakerTom. He has
consistently acted like a jackass towards me. Kindly keep your nose out
of this.

Enough of this ludicrous fantasy that Mbenga is a valuable NBA player. There is a reason Phil did not play him and it had to do with his talent and abilities. If he is so damn good, then why are the Lakers not even interested in bringing him back? And why are no other teams lining up to sign him even thought everybody needs bigs? Figure it out. The guy cannot play at this level and every general manager in the league knows it. Period !!!!
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
TOM
=====

Tom,

Obviously you aren't paying attention.

Since it has been indisputably shown that Mbenga is a better shot blocker than Drew and, if the Lakers had CP last year instead of Drew they still would have won the title because-
Mbenga is ' less injury prone. Same size. A better shot blocker. Plays better defense', and 'Mbenga would have got playing time'
the solution is so simple everyone is missing it.

The Lakers should just sign and trade Mbenga for CP.

>>>Point Guards don't win championships.......unless they're 6-9 inch point guards.

here's a list of point guards who weren't 6-9 who made STRONG contributions to recent championships (and I'm not talking Fisher once-in-a-while contributions - I'm talking game in and game out).

2007-08 Rajon Rondo

2006-07 Tony Parker (MVP of the finals)

2005-06 - Dwyane Wade (not technically a PG, but he had the ball in his hands more than their PG, and he was ALSO MVP of the finals)

2004-05 - Tony Parker

2003-04 - Chauncey Billups (MVP of the finals)

2002-03 - Tony Parker

For those of you keeping score, that means that the PG position has contributed STRONGLY to 5 of the last 8 championships, and a guy who was technically a SG but who dominated the ball like a point makes it 6.

The only recent team that consistently wins championships WITHOUT a strong PG is the Lakers. And it's because of two things: 1. Kobe makes up for a weaker PG, and 2. The Triangle doesn't emphasize the PG position as much.

 
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