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Live Chat: Lakers-Wizards Chat

Lakers Coach Phil Jackson on Washington


--Mark Medina

Follow the L.A. Times Lakers blog on Twitter. E-mail the Lakers blog at mgmedin@gmail.com

 
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Someone answer this question for me - if Kobe takes so many shots because he "needs to", then why does he often have huge numbers of shot attempts against horrible teams?

Halfway through the 3rd quarter, and he has 17 shots to 1 assist. Why?

And the rest of the team is shooting over 50% right now (15-29), so you can't blame it on their shooting. Why does he have as many shots as any 3 others players combined? And why does he have only one assist when the team is shooting 50+% against a horrible defense? Is he just trying to "make sure he gets his"?

P.S. - comparable situation - Lebron and the Cavs (still lacking a post presense) beat up on the Pistons today. Lebron had 9 shots, 7 assists in limited minutes. In fact, 8 Cavs, many of them not very good, took at least 7 shots. Why isn't Kobe content to spread the wealth like that?

Heh - Kobe must have heard me. 3 assists and 0 shot attempts since I said that. Funny it took him 2/3 of the way through the game to realize that he didn't need to shoot every time he got the ball.

Who'd rather face Portland or Spurs in the 1st round? Not me.
OKC w/d be the easier opponent. Spurs and Blazers better start winning on the road. Not much time left.

Posted by: DFish

I giggle to myself thinking that you might have something substantive to say, and you always illustrate otherwise.

How does it feel being the butt of jokes by fans of the lakers? Lol.

Posted by: Caliphilosopher

Cali,
I love being the butt of jokes. Because watching Fisher play is pure comedy.
Another strong night for the grizzled veteran. 1 fo 10 in his last 2 games. Interesting to remember in the playoffs last year most of the Laker fans
were calling for Jackson to bench Fisher. Then he hit a couple of clutch shots that bought him another season of comedic play.

Posted by: DFish

I giggle to myself thinking that you might have something substantive to say, and you always illustrate otherwise.

How does it feel being the butt of jokes by fans of the lakers? Lol.

Posted by: Caliphilosopher

Cali,
I love being the butt of jokes. Because watching Fisher play is pure comedy.
Another strong night for the grizzled veteran. 1 fo 10 in his last 2 games. Interesting to remember in the playoffs last year most of the Laker fans
were calling for Jackson to bench Fisher. Then he hit a couple of clutch shots that bought him another season of comedic play.

@LA Guy , u sound and look like an idiot now dont u? did u even watch the game? and then if u like lebron so much go watch the cavs , piss off!


not sure if this is worth clearing or not, but FCM, if it makes you laugh it's probably worth it.

Real exchange; (or what happens when the comments all go through with a significant delay, anyway)

"[name withheld]: Yup. K______ is my bf. First exclusive bf I have ever had :)
Sunday March 21, 2010 8:48 [name withheld]

[other name withheld]: And [name withheld], we should be practicing like every moment is a struggle and an opportunity to master execution, right !
Sunday March 21, 2010 8:48 [other name withheld]

[third name withheld]: or padded underpants.
Sunday March 21, 2010 8:48 [third name withheld again]"

Man, nobody should miss the live chat. Sorry, I was laughing too hard to say goodnight to everybody. Great chat, as always.

[person who didn’t read the chat] what? Really?

[person who read the chat] what? Really? Cough cough, um no sorry, I meant ‘Bwahahaahaha, phred!’ cough. [looks awkwardly around, doesn't make eye contact]


[Times Editor]:WHAT!? MEDINA, GET IN HERE!

LA Guy,

Go and put your head into Lebron's behind again, instead of coming and talking crap here.

Today Kobe took only 17 shots in 30+ minutes, and did tons of passing, except that the guys who he passed to bricked the shots. And yeah, today Kobe was NOT Lakers' top scorer today, it was Pau, FYI.

You're not a fan dude, why you call yourself LA Guy, may be "Lebron's Behind" may sound better for your name!!

And yes, idiot LA Guy, Kobe did NOT take a single shot in the 4th qtr, and did not break the record.

Happy now?? Go ahead with your Crab behind smooching!!

Dude LA Guy,

In one game earlier this season, your wealth-distributor queen James scored 14 straight of his team's points.

And this was NOT a sequence like when they were behind in the 4th qtr and wanted James to score. This was in the 1st qtr against a mediocre opponent.

How does that look for a wealth distributor, as per your words?? Jumping ahead of Ben Wallace with 100% desperation in last yr's game against New York so that he can get the final rebound to get to the triple-double, thats also some great wealth distribution by your guy, isn't it??

No one was happier than me when NBA reviewed the possession and granted the rebound to Wallace ;-)

LA Guy,

I aint sure on what do people like you have to do on a Lakers' blog.

Let me show you some numbers, and then you decide on how true is that "Kobe takes a lot of shots" statement.

This season:

Kobe : 64 games, 1402 FGAs, and 491 FTAs. That makes it 21.9 FGAs per game, and 7.67 FTAs per game. Assuming that the FTs come of baskets that would have been made, then that 7.67 FTAs translate to 3.83 FGAs (assuming 2FTs for each FG)

So, that makes it 21.9 + 3.83 = 25.73 effective FGAs per game.

Now, lets see those number for James.

In 68 games, James has 1373 FGAs, and a humungous 697 FTAs. Putting the same formula like what we applied for Kobe, James has 20.19FGAs and 10.25 FTAs per game. Taking 2FTs = 1 FGA, then 10.25FTAs translate to 5.12 FGAs.

So, for James the numbers are: 20.19 + 5.12 = 25.31 effective FGAs per game.

So, the numbers for Kobe and James are very close, 25.73 and 25.31 effective FGAs, which shows a variation of 0.42. This means Kobe just takes two extra shots more than Lebron James over a period of 5 games.

2 extra shots compared to your queen over 5 games, wow - Kobe is "SUCH A BALL HOG" in your views, right??

Similar numbers are 26.52 for Carmelo Anthony, 25.29 for Durant. Dont see much of "hogging" by Kobe by comparing those numbers!!

Ruud van Nistelrooy -

Excellent job on the analysis there.

Might I also add that you are quite the footballer. I've enjoyed watching you play in the last few world cups, and was saddened that you announced your retirement from international play a while ago - I was hoping that you would have considered a run for South Africa a few years ago, but I guess I'll see you in the UEFA Champions League this summer, no?

Then he hit a couple of clutch shots that bought him another season of comedic play.

Posted by: DFish | March 21, 2010 at 08:56 PM

That's actually all we need him to do - hit a few shots in the post-season and help us to win another ring. Or did you forget that?

Nothing comedic about helping your team to win a championship.

Too many stats...

Lakers did well, slow down coz the opponent was the Wizards, but overall was ok...Kobe did good, don't care about numbers, Pau too.

It was good, as good as PJ team's do against those kind of opponents, just crusin'...

Cheers

WOW Ruud!!

That was quite some serious stats and analysis. Lot of number crunching and data to show why Kobe is not the ball hog as most of the media and dumb guys who follow the media (aka kobe haters) preach!!

You had very well put forward the numbers. Especially novel was the idea of including FTAs as shots. True, a player goes to the line when he is about to make a FG (attempt), and hence counting 2FT attempts as one FG attempt is a nice way of including that in shots taken count.

Are you John Hollinger of ESPN?? But wait, Hollinger hates Lakers, so you can't be him. Kudos to your work, looking forward to see more such stuff :)

Caliphilosopher,

Thanks for your appreciation/compliments. Always nice to hear one :-)

But, sorry to say I am not THE Nistelrooy. I am just a BIG fan of his, and hence using that as my forum handle.

Hey, I am sure you know that, and your remarks are a mix of fun and sarcasm, right? :-)

Ruud van Nistelrooy - first of all, you made an amateur error in your attempt at stats. Every 2 free throws is not a shot attempt. Free throws are also shot off of and-1 situations, technicals, and when you are over the foul limit. So you can't say that all of those free throws translate to shot attempts.

Second of all, what I have always cared about is the ratio of shooting to passing. Kobe averages 2 more shot attempts than James per game, but is at nearly 4 fewer assists. Lebron's shot/assist ratio is 2.3 Kobe's shot/assist ratio is 4.4. So while Lebron is only shooting a little more than twice as often as he's assisting, Kobe is shooting more than 4 times as often as he's assisting.


(assist/turnover ratio is similar - Lebron's is 2.5, while Kobe's is only 1.6.)

@Stephan Martin - yeah, Kobe's teammates "bricked" the shots. Then how did Kobe's teammates shoot 52% for the game? I love how Kobe's tendency to not pass is somehow turned into another way to insult every other Laker.

And cool it on the names. Calling other people names is an elementary schoolyard tactic.

Kobe's shot/assist ratio is 4.4. So while Lebron is only shooting a little more than twice as often as he's assisting, Kobe is shooting more than 4 times as often as he's assisting.
=====================
Problem with statistics is you can twist them into whatever you want to.

Now to get an assist the player you pass to has to make the shot after getting the pass. What does that say if players brick the shot? Nada! What is first pass rotates the defense and quick pass or touch pass leads to score. Does that lead to an assist on the assist? Factor in the times pass is made (attempts) and how many (shots) are made to get more accurate read. Curious to know what you stat guys come up with. Pass to assist when shot made pass to miss for no assist. Like 10 passes 4 assists and 6 misses.


People on here kill me trying to make this a Lebron versus Kobe thing -- that ISH is dead, very dead so step off with that. This is the LAKERS blog and we are all about our team, our players, all the time, everyday and NOBODY else! Kobe and Lebron are TWO ENTIRELY different style players -- so comparison is MOOT!

Kobe is the best in my opinion -- I dont care that he shoots -- He understands the game, how to jumpstart the team and understands what the team needs for him to do on any given night! He has WON in this damn league, so cut the crap already! He has accomplished far more than many NBA players can ever dream in multiple lifetimes from a personal and teammate standpoint! When its all said and done, mofos gon continue to kiss his damn rings! Believe that.

Go Lakers...I ryde or die !

JustaLakerFan - The good thing about statistics is that when they are made with fair standards (in other words, they're not cherry-picked to fit an agenda), then the noise tends to cancel out. We don't know exactly how many of Kobe's potential assists were missed - but since his teammates shot over 50% for the game, chances are that it wasn't a significant number. As I showed a few weeks ago, Lebron's teammates have shot a lower fg% than Kobe's teammates nearly every year for the past 7 years, so you can't really blame bricks for his low assist numbers.

As far as the pass-pass thing, that would sorta kill the point of assists. The point of counting assists is to find out how often a player is setting up another player with a makable shot. If all you're doing is passing out, and then the guy you're passing to is the one who sets someone else up, it really doesn't mean as much. That being said, the player who gets the most primary assists would likely get more secondary assists anyways.


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