Ron Ron reaction reaction
As one might expect, plenty o' thoughts expressed about Ron Artest joining forces with the Lakers. I done searched the internets to find y'all some of the best.
First, a talkie before the reading. Artest already knows his way around L.A. and has certainly spent his time inside Staples Center, meaning he knows exactly how to find the new ESPN studio over at L.A. Live. What say we hear from the man of the hour? In a "hoodalized" SportsCenter segment, Ron Ron discusses his new situation, role on the team add lobbies the Laker Nation to help him choose his jersey digits.
The written stuff is below the jump.
Forum Blue and Gold's Kurt Helin lays out some thoughts on Artest's presence, positive, negative and every where in between. Among those free flowing reasons:
I have led the “No on Artest” camp in these parts, but now to me the
question is can a combination of Kobe and Phil Jackson keep him playing
within his role. As has been said, the question is not “could” he fit
in the triangle offense but “would” he. I have serious concerns here,
but if he just plays balls out defense, intimidates a little, hits
threes (in the rhythm of the offense) and posts guys up when
mismatched, we will be fine. The question is will he just do that?
If Phil Jackson can keep him in line, great. What about the next coach?
I dare you to call the Lakers soft now. That is one thing that Artest brings — intimidation. Not just physically, but because you just don’t know what he is going to do at any given moment, and that is scary. And can win you games.
Will Kobe and Artest have a “who can get the most technicals” competition next season?
Over at the ol' True Hoop, Henry Abbott relays why ESPN/Scout Inc.'s David Thorpe isn't wild about this addition...
I don't think the Lakers are suddenly better, even assuming Lamar
Odom is back. What is chemistry worth? Five points? Ten points? I argue
it's a difference maker. If you win by eight, maybe chemistry was worth
nine. I'm not saying Ron will be a jerk, I don't think he will be. But
I do know that for this team to succeed he'll have to play a role, and
I don't know how he'll be at that.
Trevor Ariza has much
better shot selection than Artest, and the ball tends to stop with Ron.
Now, the Lakers have Phil Jackson, but a coach only has so much energy.
Think of it like a bottle of water. When it's empty, it's freaking
empty. If Phil Jackson has to spend a lot of his energy stopping Ron
from taking stupid shots, that means he's not putting energy and focus
into other things that make the Lakers better.
... then Abbott explains why he doesn't agree with Thorpe.
Now, basically every key Laker but Derek Fisher is big, strong and
effective in the post. That might not seem like a big deal, but it's
really throwing down the gauntlet to opponents. The NBA has a lot of
players who really don't want to be isolated on defense in the post
(choosing from likely playoff opponents, think about the likes of
Carmelo Anthony, say, or Rudy Fernandez -- also consider the Rockets
played Aaron Brooks and Carl Landry together). But it will always be a
threat, and the hard-cutting Lakers work well as a team to make
opponents pay for doubling the post.
Keeping Kobe Bryant in
peak form is the most important thing for the Lakers. Artest can guard
anyone Bryant can guard, meaning the Lakers will have constant
opportunities to protect Bryant from wear and tear.
SI's Scott Howard-Cooper discusses the "combustible" tag that rightfully will always follow Artest. He's pretty confident the Lakers can handle that side of Ron's personality.
It make sense for the Lakers, too, because they can handle life in
the 24-hour reality series better than anyone. Artest has a great heart
and can be a wonderful teammate and is a passionate worker and
dedicated to winning, but he loses focus like few others and can wear
down a locker room. It's not a malicious thing. If there is not a
strong, grounded personality behind the scenes, though, it is
inevitable he will jump the tracks. His previous two stops, the Kings
and Rockets, were a group of good guys, and Houston was probably too
many good guys and needed his energy, however conflicting at times, to
mold into something other than constant first-round punching bags.
Let's just say the Lakers are a little practiced at the soap-opera life. Bryant is a very strong presence, Derek Fisher is a very strong presence, Phil Jackson is a very strong presence. Artest will have those kind of influences over his shoulder every day.
And according to the Houston Chronicle's Richard Justice, that influence may need exerting from time to time.
(Artest) was
on his best behavior in his one season with the Rockets as he
auditioned for a new contract. There were nights when he played like
one of the NBA’s 10 best players. There were way too many nights when
his focus and behavior were off the charts. He
screamed at the young point guards so much that he finally was told to
stop. He would agree he shouldn’t do it and would promise to stop. Then
a game or two later, he’d be back out there on the perimeter, demanding
the ball, then dribbling away the 24-second clock or bulling his way
into the lane.
The Daily News' Ramona Shelbourne offers a serious understatement: Mitch Kupchak just made a VERY bold move. Mitch Kupchak, we had you all wrong. So much for conservative and cool. By agreeing in principle with the highly flammable but highly gifted
attention magnet that is Ron Artest on Thursday, Kupchak and the Lakers
proved they were not only willing to take a risk to repeat as NBA
champions next year, but excited about it. Which is what they should be - bold and excited, not conservative
and complacent, sitting back and assuming they could do it all again
next year without making any structural improvements while the rest of
the league took aim at them. The second a team wins an NBA championship, they become a target for
everyone else. In the three weeks that have passed since the Lakers
beat Orlando in Game 5 of the NBA Finals, no fewer than six rivals have
made big moves to strengthen their teams. Cleveland added Shaquille O'Neal, Orlando added Vince Carter,
Boston's putting the blitz on Rasheed Wallace, Houston signed Trevor
Ariza, San Antonio traded for Richard Jefferson and Portland is wooing
Hedo Turkoglu - all moves made to keep up with the Lakers. All moves the Lakers just answered by signing Artest.
Those wearing purple-and-gold-colored glasses immediately celebrated
the news as an upgrade. Ariza, who will get the same first-year salary
from Houston that he thought was an insult from the Lakers, and his
agent David Lee were pilloried by the formerly adoring masses. Snap out of it. The kid wanted a decent raise after helping his team
survive the Western Conference Finals against Denver, then thrive in
the NBA Finals against Houston.
You thought it was great he would get less than a half-million more
than Luke Walton, and passengers Sasha Vujacic and Adam Morrison? Of
course he was insulted. Greed has little to do with this, it’s called pride, and the Lakers
wounded Ariza’s over a couple million dollars that, to Mr. Maximum Kobe
Bryant, would be considered chump change.
That's one way of putting it. Another, presented by Yahoo!'s Adrian Wojnarowski, is that Team Ariza- and in particular, David Lee, fell victim to their emotions and inflated sense of worth.
The Lakers don’t believe he’ll leave, Lee kept barking. Surprise, surprise: Lee didn’t think the Lakers would tell him to get lost, sign Artest and leave Ariza to take the five-year, $33 million deal in Houston he could’ve had in L.A. “I told Mitch that it was never about the money; it was about respect,” Lee told NBA.com.
Well, take your respect and pack your client’s bags for post-Yao lottery land in Houston. Respect? Yes, there are American soldiers and missionaries in faraway lands cheering for David Lee and this noble stand for the neglected and disenfranchised everywhere. It is about respect, and God knows a $33 million offer for Ariza’s eight points and four rebounds a game rates a disgraceful act.
No, this wasn’t about the money, nor his client’s needs. This was a failed power play, an embarrassment of the highest order. Looking back, Ariza will rue the day. He’s a good player, but he’ll never be a star elsewhere. He’ll just be another player on another team. “He was way too emotional about this,” said a league executive who had talked to Lee in recent days.
No doubt, it's been quite the whirlwind for TA. In any event, ESPN's Chris Broussard- who has more Team Ariza perspective- is expecting smoother, happier negotiations with Lamar Odom.
The Lakers are not expected to play the same type of hardball with Lamar Odom, even though Odom's leverage is shrinking by the day. They believe he should be rewarded for being a good soldier and going to the bench without causing a distraction, so they probably will offer him a three-year deal worth about $8 million a year. Odom wants about $10 million, but he's not likely to get that anywhere else, so he probably will settle for what the Lakers give him.
Back to Artest again. ESPN's J.A. Adande considers Ron Ron's decision not merely a reflection of a dude chasing a title, but the NBA's pecking order as well.
From a basketball perspective, Artest's choice reaffirms the final
theme of this season: Shaq was then, Kobe's now, LeBron's next. At the
moment, nothing matters in the NBA world as much as what the Lakers are
up to. Even on Shaquille O'Neal's
home turf of Twitter, "Ron Artest" was the second-ranked trending topic
Thursday evening, with "Lakers" and "Kobe" not far behind. No sign of
Shaq or LeBron in the top 10.
David Clark over at The Dream Shake sent us an email steeped in envy.
We here in Houston are a bit concerned, confused and depressed. We
loved Artest. And I don't know why we gave a guy who over his career
shoots worse than Rafer freakin' Alston a 5 year $33M deal! Here is hoping that Ariza's May/June is when the proverbial lightbulb went
off and he will forever be a 40+% shooter from deep. Otherwise I'm going
to ridicule him constantly in Interwebs print. ;-)
Perhaps Clark grew so emotional after writing this email that he was inspired to write "Crazy Pills" a proper farewell. Or he did it because he runs a solid blog and it comes with the territory. Either way, worth a look.
And finally, CBS Sports' Ken Berger (who first broke word of the changed landscape) reflects on the Rockets-Lakers semi-Finals, where Ron Ron was acting very "L.A." Seemed at the time like a guy just behaving uncharacteristically mellow. Who knew it was actually a sign?
There was a day during the Rockets' playoff series against the Lakers when Ron Artest
sat under the basket at Houston's practice facility and let loose. Not
his temper or his demons, but his personality. This wasn't the erratic
powder keg who went into the stands at the Palace. This was easy-going
Artest, drinking in every moment. Very laid back. Very L.A.
A marriage that once seemed implausible -- the hardscrabble, sometimes self-destructive star from the housing projects of Queens embracing the sparkle and serenity of Hollywood -- was consummated Thursday. Artest, who famously exchanged smack with Kobe Bryant during the regular season and almost bounced him from the playoffs, has agreed to a five-year, approximately $33 million deal to join the Lakers.
AK
Photo: Ron Artest, Kobe Bryant embrace. Credit: Stephen Dunn/Getty Images North America
Photo: Ron Artest shadow boxes. Credit: Harry How/Getty Images North America
Photo: Ron Artest, Trevor Ariza jostle. Credit: Harry How/Getty Images North America
Photo: Kobe Bryant dribbling by Ron Artest. Credit: Ronald Martinez/Getty Images North America)
Ron Artest at the premiere of Taking of Pelham 1 2 3. Credit: Kevin Winter/Getty Images North America
A reaction thread?
I think we had that last night, with all the old time bloggers out in masse... including Lazenby.
Our defensive line-up is now as formidable as it could possibly get (aside from say a CP3 as PG)...
I think if Rasheed goes to Boston AND KG is healthy, then I think the Celts come out of the East and lose to the Lakers in the finals.
Posted by: Tim-4-Show | July 03, 2009 at 11:13 AM
Comparing your salary to Luke, Sasha, or Morrison is like comparing your home's value with 2006 prices.
There's a big difference - and those prices are not today's reality.
Posted by: Tim-4-Show | July 03, 2009 at 11:22 AM
He's saying the right words, with the matching glow. Keeping it real.
Posted by: Charles | July 03, 2009 at 11:24 AM
Good move for Lakers and Artest. Ariza's agent hurt Ariza. Wrong negotiation style.
Posted by: drturk | July 03, 2009 at 11:35 AM
Adrian's article at Yahoo Sports is an excellent summary and must-read for all Laker fans.
PJ & Kobe can control Artest, god knows the Lakers are deep enough so that they can pull-him if does any of those hold-the-ball-for-22-seconds-then-heave-off-balance-3 plays with the Lakers, I just can't see that happening.
After Yao went down in the LA-Hou series who ELSE to take on the scoring load did the Rockets have but Artest? So I don't blame him there, besides his intensity really kept them in the series. Artest was the single-best opposing player the Lakers faced in the entire playoffs, AND NOW THEY HAVE HIM!!!!!!!!
This is a GENIUS move by Mitch, once again PROPS are in order!
Posted by: LakerMike | July 03, 2009 at 11:38 AM
REPOST - New expanded edition !
I love Ariza and will miss him. But I also love that the Lakers served notice to his slimy, bush-league jerk of an agent that we are not a team be tinkered, toyed or trifled with. We are the cream of the nba crop. Lee is a big-mouthed amateur who got himself and his client punked. We made Ariza a fair offer and now he has to leave the great weather, championships, comraderie, endorsements, and home-cookin' of LA. Way to go David Dumb-Ass Lee. Other potential clients will now avoid you like the plague.
Someone mentioned that Ariza is feeling really depressed right now. I'll bet. I can see him walking the floor in a daze, repeating over and over to himself, "How did I get mixed with this guy? How did I get mixed up with this guy?"
The icing on the cake will be when he goes to a chinese restaurant and opens up a fortune cookie that reads, "He who lies down with dogs, gets up with fleas."
New material - Laker Kev still has a little vitriol left for D.D.Lee (David Dumbass Lee). I would love to see Bynum fire his sorry ass and get his filthy fingerprints off this team once and for all.
Posted by: Laker Kev | July 03, 2009 at 11:38 AM
okay, i just found out about this verbal agreement with Ron-Ron for the MLE, and started to feverishly read articles, posts, and monitor ESPN. i read as many posts as i could, but there are way too many.
first, i was one of the most vocal posters in regards to the Lakers NOT signing Ron Artest. i'm really sad that Ariza left LA like that, and to a conference rival, no less. and for the same money (actually less, as LA would've been able to give Ariza larger annual raises). i also wonder why Mitch didn't try to negotiate more with Ariza/Lee.
but with that said, it is true that Ron for the MLE is a steal. he's definitely worth more than that. i will applaud Mitch for being able to get that done (although it was probably more Magic Johnson, Jerry Buss and Kobe getting the deal done).
i did enjoy hearing Artest's extreme happiness and desire to play for the Lakers. i was just surprised that Trevor didn't express the same kind of enthusiasm. oh, i think once he arrives in Houston, and realizes how crappy of a situation he's in, he will repent, at least deep down inside, and will rue the day that he allowed his agent to walk him out of LA.
as for the Lakers... well I'm gonna side with Plaschke, and some of the skeptics. i'm not sure if Ron is gonna fit in well with this team. how will this affect their locker-room and on the floor chemistry? will arguments break out next season when Artest isn't getting enough touches, Kobe isn't getting the rock from Artest, and Gasol doesn't get the ball enough in the post? or will there be harmony? who knows?
yet, i am excited for next season, because Artest, a wildcard, does make the Lakers a more talented team. and probably deeper, too, as Luke's minutes will prob go down. and forget about Ammo, he's never gonna see the light of day, now. i think if it all works out, Artest gels with his teammates, we bring back Odom and Brown, and Bynum improves and is healthy... Lakers could repeat and possibly win the most games of all time.
but let's not get too carried away. the game is won on the floor and not on paper.
Posted by: leonardbast | July 03, 2009 at 11:43 AM
I'm still pinching myself to make sure it's real.
I can't understand why Ariza isn't catching any flack for this move... ultimately HE is the one that chose the move. Lee acted the bad cop, but he is not the one with veto power.
Trevor's ego got in the way. He's not even a third banana. This signing by the Rockets is going to be viewed the same way we look at Luke's contract in two years. Ariza throws up wild shots while attacking the rim, and got more than a few lucky bounces and rim rolls in the playoffs. He is NOT going to be a career 40% 3-point shooter on any team. I was already seeing shades of Devon George in Trevor. From now on, other teams will realize on the defensive end that they have to force him into mid range jumpshots. His passing lacks and his attitude was spotty even during a contract year.
Artest for Odom was a bit of a stretch. Artest for Ariza is a freaking no brainer. This time last year, we would have jumped so quickly on that deal that it would have made your head spin.
Posted by: busterjonez | July 03, 2009 at 11:44 AM
I have to admit I'm a bit stunned. While I agree that Artest is a better player, I don't think he's a better fit. The Laker team as constituted last year was only going to get better this year, provided all the parts came back. Another year for Bynum, Ariza and Brown in the system, Sasha and Farmar with a chance to rehabilitate from their injuries, keeping the core together.
I guess, worst case scenario, it will be interesting. Best case, Artest comes in, toes the line and plays in the system. If anybody can make it work, it's Phil Jackson.
I still don't like it, but I'm notoriously slow to embrace change. During Showtime, there was offseason talk for a couple of years about trading Worthy for Dominique Wilkins. I was against that then, and I don't like this now. I hope hope hope I'm wrong.
Who knows? This could be what we needed to go undefeated.
Posted by: Marty | July 03, 2009 at 11:46 AM
From a purely business standpoint, the move was genius. We'll find out next season how it plays out from a basketball standpoint.
Posted by: Marty | July 03, 2009 at 11:48 AM
Ron Artest said all the right things and he sounds honest.
This is good.
His statment about playing to win over playing for money is more than refreshing.
I suggest that Ron Artest's number should be #1.
What do we play for? RINGS!!!!
Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.
GO LAKERS!!!
Posted by: Jon K. | July 03, 2009 at 11:50 AM
Jon K.,
Thanks for your bio-chrono insights on Ron from the last thread. I do hope that LA will give him the supportive environment he thrives in. (Did you notice how his face lit up when he mentioned Jackson calling and even speaking with his wife?) I still need to get with you regarding Bio-Chrono and how it relates to multiple intelligences and traditional personality profiles.
But your best insight of the day is that of No Longer Secret Agent Shaq working on the Laker's behalf to destroy the Cavs from the inside out.
Posted by: Laker Kev | July 03, 2009 at 11:58 AM
Jon K,
How about #73 - most victories ever in an nba season.
Posted by: Laker Kev | July 03, 2009 at 11:59 AM
I think this link has been posted before, possibly even by me, but I wanted to get it out there cause it is a great look on the 'do we need a pg who can defend any point guard' argument.
http://tinyurl.com/md3l4n
the basic point is that since hand checking has made it all but impossible to stop the incredibly past pgs, so there is no point in trying. pick your points for what they can do overall, and figure out a team defense to stop chris paul and aaron brooks.
Posted by: phred | July 03, 2009 at 12:01 PM
couple of reposts from last thread, cause i wanted everybody to get the full benefit of all my genius, natch.
Rick- ouch. go easy on plashke. the guy needs a lot of sleep these days.
BK- man, stop hating on ron artest. it's vicious and vindictive posts like that, in addition to relentless blocking all the criticism of you that people try to get past your vigilant censorship that makes you such an evil super villain type. or maybe i'm brown nosing too much.
Charles- Gi Nasty Dynasty has a better ring to it, in my opinion, something about the two syllables and the assonance, but you can have the lion's share of the huge bank that we're sure to make off of it.
oh, and since I haven't pointed it out for a few hours;
WHOOOOHOOOOO! WE WON! WE WON! WE WON! AND WE'RE COMING BACK MORE LOADED THAN BEFORE! HIDE YOUR WOMENFOLK AND PUPPIES! (oh wait, maybe i shouldn't say that) AH SCREW IT. WE WON! WE ()*^(&*^ING WON!
IT IS ALL ABOUT THE LOVE, AND THE FACT THAT WE WON!
GO LAKERS!
also-
Good interviews. I think the more we get to see of the real, off the court Ron the more we're going to like him. Of course, it all comes down to whether we win or not. Winning makes everybody more likeable, and losing reminds us how big of a jerk some guys are.
Posted by: phred | July 03, 2009 at 12:04 PM
LakerMike,
My sentiments exactly on the AW article. Also regarding Mitch. Yoda's pupil has become the master. The Force is with us!
Posted by: Laker Kev | July 03, 2009 at 12:04 PM
I don’t understand Ariza and his agent Lee. “I told Mitch that it was never about the money; it was about respect,” Lee told NBA.com. However, the Lakers needed to demonstrate that “respect” with a contract of 8 to 9 million a year! If Lee or any agent believes a GM such as Kupchak does not have a contingency plan when their player is not available, suggests to me they are not very good business people. This is a chess game. “He was way too emotional about this,” said a league executive who had talked to Lee in recent days.” I surmise that Mr. Lee was a thorn in Kukchak ‘s side over the Bynum negotiations. Learning who he was dealing with, Kupchak came well prepared for the Ariza.negotiations. Ultimately Ariza was effected by his representation. This is proof to me that players need to get a little business savvy. YOU are responsible for your career not your agent.
I love Ariza and am sooo sorry he is gone. Perhaps a message has been sent to Odem and his representation. We will see.
Posted by: Old Laker FAn | July 03, 2009 at 12:06 PM
Now time to get L.O back!! Him and Ron are good childhood friends so its another reason to come back to the Lakers!!!
Posted by: Marcus | July 03, 2009 at 12:07 PM
PHIL JACKSON IS COMING BACK!!!
Time to celebrate!!!
What do we play for? RINGS!!!!
Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.
GO LAKERS!!!!
Posted by: Jon K. | July 03, 2009 at 12:10 PM
How can you not like the move? Sure the is some risk involved, but next year's lakers may end up being the most talented team in NBA history. Yes, that's right. Bynum will go back to his monster 2009 january and at that point we'll be at a different level. Also, the other title contenders' best players (LBJ, PIerce and Anthony) are physical 3s Ariza had a hard time guarding. Artest puts us in a much better position in terms of much ups. Also, our second unit has always had a hard time without Kobe creating shots. Now we have another player who can do that while Kobe is resting. Finally, next year Boston will be back in the finals and they are good and tough. We'll need Artest for that.
Posted by: d | July 03, 2009 at 12:14 PM
Wow, this blog has truly mushroomed. I was on last night, went to bed, spent the morning away from the computer and then checked back... to find, literally, hundreds of new posts. It's a far cry now, from its seminal beginnings. Congrats to the K bros for tending their garden so well.
As for Artest, there's is absolutely nothing I can add that hasn't already been expressed. Except, there'll be no need to shave the Lakers logo into your head, buddy. Just express your inner role player and it'll all rock good.
Posted by: dave m | July 03, 2009 at 12:15 PM
i applaud this move.
kobe is the team's best horse, a player that will be remembered 50 years from now, but he's getting old and has a lot of hard miles on him. this move maximizes his remaining 2-3 good years. you play basketball one season at a time, not five years out. ron ron brings intensity and skill to more than make up for his trouble. trevor ariza is a good player, but even in five years he won't be ron ron, and good players are like leaves on the trees, there will be more coming along when kobe retires and it's time to rebuild.
Posted by: bruce | July 03, 2009 at 12:15 PM
Already posted about what the addition of Artest and subtraction of Ariza means to the Lakers for next season but one thing this addition of Artest allows for the Lakers is to become a great team. This 2008-09 Lakers team in my opinion was not a great team, a championship team yes, but not a great team. Hell if I am honest and I hate to say this as a Laker fan and Celtic hater but the reality is the 2007-08 Celtics champs were a better team than this Laker championship team. That Celtics team was hungrier with three vets Pierce, Allen, and KG who would have given their kidney for a championship, played solid to great defense every night and was nasty. Last year’s Lakers team was extremely talented and deep, deeper than the Celtics team, and very skilled with great coaching and a great player, and yes we won 65 games but every Laker fan knows that last year’s Lakers team did not play hard every night, did not play strong defense every night, was still overall a young team trying to find itself, and other than Kobe and Fish was not a nasty team. Bynum got hurt again and wasn’t himself in the playoffs, we struggled against Denver and Houston in the playoffs, our bench basically did nothing the last half of the year. We won because of Kobe, Gasol, PJ and guys like Fish and Odom and Ariza stepping in when they were needed. I know the Celtics struggled in their playoff run with Atlanta and Cleveland but they were solid every night on the defensive end, something I couldn’t say about last year’s lakers team. Now with the addition of Artest we have a chance to become great. We are still deep, but now we boast 3 all stars instead of 2, we are better defensively, and there should be no let down in intensity when you have Kobe and Artest on the same team. Plus the team now knows what it means to be champions, they have that added confidence of having done it, and Bynum still has a lot of room for growth. If he continues to improve and grows from his postseason disappointment of last year and with Artest and hopefully Odom back in the mix this team could be great. I am not sure if I would have felt the same way if they brought back Ariza, even if we brought back Lamar, especially with what Cleveland, Orlando, San Antonio and potentially Boston and Portland have done or are about to do. Now I can realistically see 2 or 3 NBA championships in a row, another mini-dynasty.
Posted by: lakers85 | July 03, 2009 at 12:16 PM
LAKER DYNASTY is now LAKER DIE-NASTY!
Posted by: ChicNstu | July 03, 2009 at 12:17 PM
I just can't figure out why Ariza would choose 5 years with Houston over the Cavs even if only for 3 years there. I love the Lakers and I really love this signing of Artest. Now we just need Odom and Shannon back. I wouldn't mind trading Sasha away but he probably wouldn't give us much in return plus he is good at harassing opponents on D. Bottom line is that if we can get Odom back along with Shannon Brown, Artest plays like the 3rd option he'll be, and guys like Farmar and Sasha play like they did a couple seasons ago, we will undoubtedly repeat as champs baby! Yes that was my Dicky V impersonation.
Posted by: Ty Guy | July 03, 2009 at 12:20 PM
AK/BK
What do you hear on the Lamar front?
Specifically, which teams do you believe are legitimate contenders to sign him?
Toronto has the money, but LO doesn't put them over the top. He may not even help them make the playoffs.
San Antonio would be beastly with LO, and Cleveland too.
Thoughts from you two?
Posted by: lone star laker fan | July 03, 2009 at 12:20 PM
looking at oen of the pictures with kobe and ron i realized that 24 x 4 is 96 the number artest had in houston
kobe's 24/7 and his old number 8 in 12 months make also 96.
maybe that's how the stars aligned for all this to be possible.
personally, I'M VERY EXCITED
this is the re-deem team. kobe needed some shaqless ring and ron need some more points for his good citizenship status.
he will enjoy when all the hollywood stars will clap for him and he will give his best. and hey, maybe they can train him for a smoother acting career on the court.
for the same price we lost a cheap shot pocket thief for a real mercenary. now the MOB BENCH can have real meaning
kobe's face and artest's face will be really intimidating
Posted by: ouchhhhhhhhh | July 03, 2009 at 12:23 PM
Fatty,
I'm going to go with D... unless I can give you E:
He's a scumbag immoral idiot looking out for his own interest and he just ruined Traitor Ariza's career
Posted by: Tim-4-Show | July 03, 2009 at 12:24 PM
Wow, I went out of town to the Mendocino coast for the weekend, and This happens! I've been such a huge fan of TA's since college that the joy of seeing his development as a player has been tamped by the loss of him because of that development; the championship makes it a lot more palatable. However, David Lee clearly thought he could play the same game with the Lakers that he did with AB, and it bit him hard. If there are any behind the scenes reasons for TA's desire to leave LA, then Lee did the right thing and took the heat for his player. If there weren't, I'd be looking for another agent if I were TA.
As for Ron-Ron, I'm almost excited to see how insane the next three years are going to be. When he's in normal mode, our team is going to be a defensive force, and his offense will be a big upgrade (Trevor was still very spotty, regardless of his playoff studliness). When Ron is in Bad Ron mode, TMZ and ESPN are going to be a lot happier than the members of this blog. I just hope this isn't a ploy for Kobe and RA to re-start their music careers, although I'd even buy their record if it ever comes out.
Since I won't be able to keep up this weekend while I'm away, I guess I'd just like to say to those who are depressed about the loss of TA that nothing ever stays the same - the Showtime-era Lakers wouldn't have been the force they were had stud Norm Nixon not been sent to San Diego for Byron Scott, and that team was constantly tinkering with personnel. I wish TA all the happiness and thank him for his two years with the Lakers; I hope he makes his way back to the Lakers someday as an even better player. But for now - LET THE ARTEST ERA BEGIN!!!!!
Posted by: Tully Moxness | July 03, 2009 at 12:27 PM
Okay, let's think of the happiest scenario possible, using all the strengths and weaknesses Ron Ron brings to the Lakers:
1) Ron Ron turns Richard Jefferson, Brandon Roy and Carmelo Anthony into a whimpering sack of bruises as the Lakers cruise through next year's playoffs.
2) In the Finals, Ron Ron takes no prisoners against the evil leprecons.
In game 1, Garnett starts his usual intimidation garbage. Ron Ron gets in his face and the profanity laden exchange finally sends KG over the edge. He is taken off the court in a straight jacket.
In game 2, Rondo tries to cheap shot Kobe, a la Brad Miller. Kobe, of course, makes the free throws to win the game, but Ron Ron sets a screen which flattens Rondo who proceeds to play like "Ron-don't" for the rest of the playoffs.
In game 3, Pierces tries to do another Willis Reed impersonation. He comes back on the court to thunderous applause in Boston. On the next play, Pierce does his usual "jump five feet sideways to draw fake contact on a three" act, lands on Ron Ron's foot and is taken out of the game - for good.
Finally to cap the sweep, in game 4, Ron Ron uses his ample rear end to give some karmic retribution to Kendrick Perkins (anybody remember his cheap shot play where he backed into and low-bridged Gasol in the 08 Finals?).
Nothing would be sweeter than out-muscling those cheap shot, foul mouthed bullies from Boston. Even better would be the trophy presentation to the Lakers after game 4 in Boston. And then hear Bill Simmons whine about the Laker championship for the next year.
Ah, the sweet championship dreams of summer...
Posted by: DaTruthSetsUFree | July 03, 2009 at 12:27 PM
Leave UCLA early + pride + terrible agent = Ariza stuck in Hou-stain. What a joke of an agent. Pride is the ultimate sin, someone needs to take Trevor to church or at least pass him a bible. Remember what a championship was like Trevor because Ron will enjoy what you had and quickly lost.
Posted by: Henry Ramirez | July 03, 2009 at 12:33 PM
The Blazers land the Turkoglu.
http://tinyurl.com/lm7vtg
Posted by: Laker Kev | July 03, 2009 at 12:35 PM
"I think if Rasheed goes to Boston AND KG is healthy, then I think the Celts come out of the East and lose to the Lakers in the finals.
Posted by: Tim-4-Show | July 03, 2009 at 11:13 AM"
Took the thoughts right out of my head.
I didn't want Ariza to go, but the more I read about how the deal went down (LA wanting Artest) and the more I see Artest responding, I'm feeling ok, especially since Phil has agreed to come back. TA was great, but you can't live in the past. I say we welcome RonRon with open arms and see what Phil and company can do with the guy.
GO LAKERS!!!!!!!!!!
ps - this is the first off season in quite some time I haven't suffered such intense withdrawals. I think it's because of the championship, and for that I'm abundantly grateful!
Posted by: longtimelakerlover@yahoo.com | July 03, 2009 at 12:38 PM
I'm trying to find out how long Trevor's sentence in the Houston penitentiary is for. Is it three years? I haven't seen the figure. Does anyone know?
How about this reading of the scenario that has just played out? Artest is in for three years and it's guaranteed rings (at least 2 of 3, missing one possibly because of key injuries). In the meantime. Trevor mopes his way through Houston but gets lots of minutes, further develops his skills and jumps on the opportunity to come back home when Artest's time and skills run out. So Houston will have prepared him for a more productive role when he comes back and some of the big salaries start disappearing (Kobe's a couple of years later... and Luke's and Sasha's for sure). By that time Trevor will be in his prime (29) and the new 19 year-old Kobe-Lebron-Magic-Michael will be on his way to Lakerdom to create a new dynasty alongside veteran LA doyen Ariza.
I'm sure Mitch has planned it all out this way!
Oh, and Shannon will be there the whole time!
Posted by: Tsphere | July 03, 2009 at 12:39 PM
If Phil is coming back, can he get a toe ring for number 11?
Go World Championship Lakers!!!
(Man I like the sound of that.)
Posted by: lazNirv | July 03, 2009 at 12:41 PM
This take by Eric Pincus has to be the best of all.
Eric just setting the record straight
http://tiny.cc/QNV8o
Posted by: Fatty | July 03, 2009 at 12:44 PM
"We don't know if Trevor Ariza just made some shots last season, or has actually improved as a shooter. But if he is now a much improved shooter, he has superstar potential."
"The Lakers didn't run much triangle last year, and I assume they'll run even less now. Ron Artest is a very instinctive player, and the triangle is not a very instinctive system."
These two quotes from David Thorpe made me laugh. First of all, I love Ariza and I hate to see him go. Love that we got Artest, but it still pains me to see Ariza not in a Laker uni. But seriously, SUPERSTAR potential? I'm sorry, as great as Ariza was down the stretch, I still think it's more of an aberration than anything else. He will put up decent numbers in his career, but c'mon Thorpe, SUPERSTAR potential?
And the second point is possibly even more ridiculous, if that's possible. It's actually more ignorant than anything else. How can he say that the triangle isn't an instinctive offense? The triangle forces players to make the right and THEIR OWN decision. How is that not instinctive? This was probably the only concern I had when I heard about Ron Ron joining. The triangle is a thinking man's system and relies on the players to INSTINCTIVELY react and make the right play.
Thorpe is a friggin moron.
Posted by: Skeletor | July 03, 2009 at 12:46 PM
So mitch takes 4 years to get a team who can win now and later.Did he not trade some of the roster to bring in a younger cast? So why would he digress from his intentions and pick up a 29 year old player. It bothers me that he just lost interest that fast (he could've negotiated) with ariza. Ron is good and it may work out but didnt a role player leave boston after the title and boston sunk.
Posted by: freddyP | July 03, 2009 at 12:49 PM
Of course, we all miss Ariza. If Mitch, Magic, PJ and finally JB did not make any move in getting Artest, then Lakers will be at the mercy of this David Lee, Lakers will be begging for less money, longer contract etc. If I were Ariza, I should have asked Lee to step aside and spoke with all parties concerned DIRECTLY. I'm sure they'll gave him 6.5M three years then go for Artest on MLE, then turn around to sacrifice a second tier player. LA loves Ariza but the city cannot be hogtied, mummified by the greedy agent of Socks. He fooled us once in prematurely signing Bynum to a large contract without proof that he can carry this team in the playoffs, he cannot fool us twice to keep on waiting for nothing. No need of a scumbag, snake oil salesman, David Lee. LOL!
You know what, this guy Lee has been reinforced by the glowing posts in this blog in venerating our F/A's as though they are sacred cows. He thought that Ariza is irreplaceable, indispensable because of all of these optimistic, dynastic and out of this world bandwagon hysteria. Bad read on the show cards. The Lakers Blog do not make the decision, in fact in the survey done by AK/BK more than 73% go with Artest signing and I'm sure if you will include Ariza + Artest, it is 99% approve. Why oh why do we have to maintain on these scrubs and bloopers meanwhile sacrifice a good player like Trevor? To past dreamers of imagining Ariza at 9M and LO at 10M (b/c Jerry Buss has deep pocket etc. etc.) in a bad economy where all employees getting pay cut is unconscionably unfair and unjust. My son who works at UCLA attended a huge meeting yesterday at Pauley Pavilion that to prevent furlough they got 8% cut across the board from the Chancellor to the last Staff getting 44K and above. David Lee is living in a different world enmeshed with too much dollars in his head.
Posted by: Edwin Gueco | July 03, 2009 at 12:54 PM
Isn't it great to be a Lakers fan right now... to think that just a few summers ago we were debating MT's voodoo doll and the merits of Kwame's Calf size and how he "was" the blog....
Now we have to take a day off of work just to read all the posts about how strong this team is getting
Posted by: Tim-4-Show | July 03, 2009 at 12:57 PM
Repost
I've finally discovered David Lee's identity!
Gríma, Wormtongue, from Tolkien's LOTR.
You poisoned King Théoden of Rohan's thoughts in the past, and now you poisoned Trevor's.
Bite your tongue Lee, and get poisoned!
Posted by: MrNano | July 03, 2009 at 01:04 PM
I think people need to see what Eric Pincus wrote over at hoopsworld to understand what his agent got up to...
This guy will spend his summer with Turiaf watching the finals...Big mistake Ariza...Big mistake...
Posted by: Thirty2 | July 03, 2009 at 01:15 PM
Ariza turned down more money offered by mitch and signed to a team that is basically paying him less and is not a title contender. It's all his dumb agent's fault for putting Ariza in that situation. He tried to play his cards and make Mitch fold, instead Mitch went out and signed Artest. Ariza should fire his agent, it's unfortunate that it led to this. I would have really liked to see Ariza come back next year. Who does his agent think he is to ask for 50million for 5 years? Sigh
Posted by: cinz | July 03, 2009 at 01:16 PM
Read this if you haven't already.
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=13174
Ariza was Plan A: With the Los Angeles Laker boldly agreeing to terms with forward Ron Artest, General Manager Mitch Kupchak has landed a player the team has been itching to acquire since he was in Indiana.
The cost was the well-liked Trevor Ariza, who has agreed to sign an MLE deal with the Houston Rockets (~$32.3 million).
A source tells HOOPSWORLD that Kupchak was prepared to give Ariza an offer equivalent to the full MLE but at 10.5% raises, totaling at approximately $33.8 million over five years.
LA's ceiling might have been a $6 million starting salary for $36 million over five but before negotiations progressed after 9:00pm Pacific on Tuesday night, the source says that Ariza's agent, David Lee, took a confrontational approach with Kupchak.
Lee wanted a deal in the $50 million range and took offense to the team's stance that Trevor should test the market first for that level of compensation.
By the next morning, the Lakers were going after Artest in full force with Kobe Bryant, Lamar Odom and even Magic Johnson reaching out to the Houston forward.
LA was acknowledging privately that Ariza was going down the path of Ronny Turiaf, a player the team had great affection for and wanted to keep but couldn't because of economics.
Ariza's agent ended up settling for significantly less money with the Rockets, at least based on the expectations he presented to Kupchak.
By getting a raise greater than 20% (he earned $3.1 million last season), Ariza's contract has Base Year Compensation (BYC) status which is a technical term that indicates he's difficult to trade. Should the Lakers and Rockets want to do a dual sign and trade with Ariza and Artest, Trevor being BYC makes that extremely difficult and quite unlikely.
While letting Trevor Ariza go was a difficult decision for the team, Kupchak reacted quickly. Taking advantage of Houston's misfortune with Yao Ming's foot injury possibly taking him out for an entire year, the Laker GM quickly turned to Plan B.
Posted by: cinz | July 03, 2009 at 01:17 PM
ariza probably chose houston over cavs b/c he doesn't get along with lebron. he and lebron and a high school rivalry (even though lebron was in ohio and trevor in cali). he also has said numerous times that kobe is a better player. i think even when he was in orlando he said that.
i heard on other message boards he still bleeds purple and gold and didn't want to play the potential rivals. also i still believe trevor will come back as a laker.
Posted by: laila | July 03, 2009 at 01:19 PM
So Hoopsworld is reporting more of the details of the Kupchak
negotiations with David Lee.
The contract Mitch offered Trevor was actually for MORE
than he'll be getting from Houston. The difference being that
the % raise each year would have been 10.5% instead of the
8% which is the maximum the Rockets could give him. It would
have meant another million and a half in Trevor's pocket in addition
to getting to play for a championship contender instead of a
lottery contender.
Eric Pincus also reports that David Lee was asking for a
deal in the neighborhood of 50 million.
So there you have it. David Lee managed to get his client
a contract for less money for a worse team. Nice negotiating
there, chief. I'm sure half the players in the NBA are looking
to sign up with you now, along with all the new draft picks.
Hope David Lee has a plan B, because that sort of move is
going to get him out of the agent business right quick.
Posted by: Long Time Laker Fan | July 03, 2009 at 01:25 PM
One more thing about this Artest signing and the way the Ariza negotiations were held/not held is to look at this from the eyes of Mitch Kupchak and Jerry Buss and through a retrospective historical lense. Ariza was riding the bench 2 years ago in Orlando and we got him for Brian Cook and Maurice Evans, popular guys amongst their teammates, but not exactly guys you want if making a championship run. At the time no one thought anything of that trade, it wasn’t even headline material, the bigger deal was getting Pau Gasol later that season. Now basically what you have done is taken Ariza, Cook, and Evans and turned it into Artest. Who wouldn’t have done a deal like that at the beginning of the 2007-08 season. These players are like chess pieces and you have to know when to hold and when to fold. They become assets to trade away for better pieces or to hold onto for immediate return. Look at Shannon Brown, he was a throw in for Vladimir Radmonovic and now he is being courted by a few teams. He was one team’s junk, Charlotte, and he became another’s team treasure, Lakers. Who’s to say the Lakers don’t bring him back for one more year, he has a break out year, and we are having this same discussion next year that we have had with Ariza this summer. Plus if I am Mitch I am weary about giving role players who have one breakout year long term contracts. He did this with Luke Walton and last year Sasha Vujacic. Remember last summer Laker fans when we were debating whether the Lakers should give that money to Turiaf or Vujacic and we all felt like Vujacic was a piece we could not lose because of the way he played against the Celtics and that with Bynum coming back there would be no room for Turiaf. Honestly after last year I would rather have Turiaf than Vujacic, Vujacic barely played in the finals and Bynum got hurt again. We could have used Turiaf. And as for Luke Walton he has never justified his contract. How do we know that Ariza doesn’t just become the next Devean George instead of an all-star? He fits well in the Lakers system but remember he didn’t fit in so well for Ben Howland at UCLA, or for the Knicks or Magic. I don’t see this guy ever putting up big numbers or being an all-star although I think he has value, but in a Bruce Bowen kind of way. Artest is a proven albeit sometimes crazy commodity. This guy has proven that he can put up 20 points and shut down your star player. I think he wants to win so bad and show people another side of Ron Artest that he is willing to sacrifice for the greater good. I don’t think he wants his legacy to be that Palace brawl in 2004 and nothing else. Like he said its not about the money or the stats. Its about winning. He knows his best chance is with the Lakers. Plus from Jerry Buss’s eyes he saves money in the long run by signing Artest and letting Ariza go plus he now has the chance to resign Odom. It makes sound financial sense. We as fans are the ones who get sentimental and attached to these players and we let our emotions cloud our judgements. That is why Jerry and Mitch are professionals and they make sound business decisions based on facts and numbers, also taking things like instinct and heart into consideration, and make the best short term and long term choices for the team and organization. Remember trading Shaq was considered an awful trade but 5 years later and we understand and respect why they did it and why it was a good decision. No way they win a title in the last 5 years if they keep Shaq and if Shaq comes back no way Kobe resigns with the Lakers, and now you would have an overpaid fat Shaq who you can’t trade for 50 cents on the dollar and no Kobe. Very few players are untradeable, only Magic, Bird, MJ, Kobe and Lebron in my book because they transcend basketball and sports and mean so much more to our larger society. Anyone else in my book is tradeable and replaceable. Good decision by Lakers management, Kupchak showing once again that after getting off to a rocky start as a GM(The JR Rider signing, the Mitch Richmond signing, etc.) that he should be considered one of the best GM’s in the league. In my opinion Jerry Buss is the best owner in the league, 9 titles and 15 title appearances in 30 years as owner of the Lakers. What other owner in any sport has that resume?
Posted by: lakers85 | July 03, 2009 at 01:33 PM
Hoopshype take on Ariza GAte!!!!
http://tinyurl.com/no9krn
Aaaaarrrrhhhhh!!!!
Angry_Laker
Posted by: Angry_Laker | July 03, 2009 at 01:33 PM
(Repost from another thread)
Rick Friedman -
You obviously took great delight in penning that piece.
Well done, sir!
Now for the rebuttal from Bill P..
Dear Rick Friedman,
I am supremely offended in your satire, spoof about me.
Let me set the record straight.
First, I am paid to do what I do and your not.
I am on TV, and your not.
So my credentials are impeccable, and yours? A LA Times commenter? Don't make me and Simers laugh.
As an expert, recognized in his field as the best at what he does, let me give you some advice.
When you write and make up stories like I do for the Times, the story and the facts are not important, its the writer, Its all about me. This is what my readers or fans want to see.
When the Lakers ignored me as you said and gave the scoop to others, (that really hurt my feelings) we reporters, do the next best thing, we trash the source.
I learned this lesson from watching the movie, 'The Natural.' Robert Duvall, my mentor, because of that film, taught me many lessons.
Dig hard for that inside scoop, and when people don't co-operate, you vilify them whenever you get a chance. (see all Kobe, Lakers articles)
In closing, now that I have thoroughly humiliated you. Remember, the only thing bigger than my belly, is my ego, and my belly is pretty big, I might add. hahaha
To review, its all about me, 24/7, not the story or the facts.
Signed,
Bill P.
Posted by: Fatty | July 03, 2009 at 12:20 PM
Posted by: Fatty | July 03, 2009 at 01:34 PM
How about number 68. I got mine and now I owe you one.
Posted by: laker greats | July 03, 2009 at 01:43 PM