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More Lamar Odom-centric polls for your Monday

Ain't much new to report or worth talking about, so we might as well give y'all the chance to sound off and be heard.

And thus, without further ado...

If you'd like a second opinion before voting on the following poll, listen to our latest 710 ESPN podkast, where BK and I discuss the slim pickins' worth of big men out there.

AK

 
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Have you considered changing the name of the blog to Odomopolis.com

Funny stuff guys!

Ex,

It would probably send our Google traffic through the roof. haha

AK

I still blame the Shannon Brown contract. If the Lakers hadn't offered the 2.1 million for two years to Brown, that money could have gone to Odom and all problems are solved. By next year Morrison's 5 million contract is gone, and Sasha's 6 Million per year contract gone the next year. All that salary cap relief could have made it easy for Odom to get his 10 million a year. Brown is a luxury, not a necessity like Odom, I still don't understand the Lakers management reasoning for signing Brown before all details were worked out with Odom. My only thinking is they believed Lamar would have taken their generous offer, and not insisted on the 10 million per. I have to believe that when they signed Brown, Odom felt that was a slap in the face, and now we're on the verge of losing him.

The polls just get better and better.

However, I must say I shuddered filling out the "Plan B" if we don't sign Lamar poll.

Wow.

I saw TIm Thomas's name there and I just thought, "Really? REALLY? THAT'S a potential Plan B? Wow. Why isn't Yaroslav Korolev on that list while we're at it?"

What do we play for? RINGS!!!!

Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.

GO LAKERS!!!!

Not enough LOCO weed

Jon K,

Koralev is unappealing enough to make the list. He's just not tall enough. haha

I voted for Joe Smith.

AK

Getting board boys.? Hopefully LO gives us all more to discuss today, good, or bad. Would be nice to get this out of the way. Odom and his agent have made a silly strategic blunder with this a hole thing. Geez, Lamar, right, or wrong has gone from great guy to potential goat.

Has anyone seen the Shaq "Beat It" video?

http://tinyurl.com/kpremt

I wish Shaq was like this all the time instead of sometimes screaming at Dr. Buss "Pay me my damn money!" or threatening to kill petit single-mother rappers who spurn his love.

What do we play for? RINGS!!!!

Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.

GO LAKERS!!!!

At Power Forward, number 42, Brian Kamenetzky!

I a Personal Trainer than can add 2" to your hops and we can work on your up-and-under moves during the shrinking off season.

BK for 6th Man of the Year!

I guess this means Mitch did the right thing by not drafting Sean May instead of Andrew Bynum.

to be honest, with all the trade rumors that followed odom around during his laker career, im sure hes just enjoying how the tables have turned and lakers nation is begging for his return. cause seriously, all the trade rumors that involved odom were pretty ridiculous.

The Miami offer is backloaded so LO will get paid the most when he's oldest & least productive. So the Heat will have an incentive to trade him likely to a franchise in an income tax state right when he's making the most money to be taxed.

If D-Wade splits in 2010, he may get traded sooner so the Heat can rebuild.

The Heat's "tax advantage" doesn't look so good in this light. You would hope LO would take this into consideration.

AK,

Here are some other suggestions for additional polls:

Do you think the Lakers will put their last offer back on the table?
--Yes
--No

If the Lakers do not sign Lamar, who do you blame?
--The Lakers
--Lamar Odom
--Jeff Schwartz
--All of the above
--None of the above

If Lamar walks, how will that affect the Lakers?
--They will not be as good as last year’s team and will not win the championship.
--They will not be as good as last year’s team but will win the championship.
--They will be better than last year’s team but will not win the championship.
--They will be better than last year’s team and will win the championship.

Tom

I really like that this Alfonso person is calling LakerTom out.

I don't really have the time, but I'm glad someone does, because LakerTom usually makes wildly self-interested comments and predictions, and then will vehemently defend his "rightness" even if he's wrong, at least mostly.

I will bring up the "Kobe will opt out" argument as evidence. Kobe did not opt out, and LakerTom was wrong about that, yet continually defended his defeated position on the grounds of semantic differences.

Just a few days ago, LakerTom was making predictions about LO signing his new deal the next day, based on another random commenter's "inside info" about LO flying to Hawaii to meet Dr. Buss. Now, he's altered his position and says the Lakers are better off without Lamar anyway.

The writing has a very pompous air about it, and that can rub people the wrong way.

Found the lakers Championship DvD on youtube!

check it out

http://tinyurl.com/ms8glq

LakerTom,

Do you think the Lakers will put their last offer back on the table?
--No (but they'll put another offer back on the table and followed by another offer that was similar to the first).

If the Lakers do not sign Lamar, who do you blame?
--Jeff Schwartz

If Lamar walks, how will that affect the Lakers?
--They will not be as good as last year’s team but will win the championship.

What do we play for? RINGS!!!!!

Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.

GO LAKERS!!!!

AK,

Just a suggestion....

If you get bored, how about throwing together a "Where are they now?" thread for former blog icons?

Slava Medvedenko? Selling deep fried Snickers in the Ukraine?

Mike Penberthy? Coaching basketball in Uganda?

Smush Parker? Playing basketball in the Phillipines? Suspended from his team?

Jamal Sampson? Working at McDonalds?

Isiah Rider? Serving 8-10 in Federal Prison?

Mark Madsen? On a jet to play for the Clippers?

Inquiring minds want to know.

What do we play for? RINGS!!!!

Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.

GO LAKERS!!!!

Hmmm, which made me wretch more the Plan B Options to Odom or the Shaq tribute to MJ?

Shaq's turned into such a train wreck. Does anyone think he makes the Cavs the favorites? I think it is 50/50 that he does for the Cavs what he did for the Suns (almost destroy the franchise). But at least he ain't our problem anymore.

Go World Champion Lakers!!!

Laker Tom,

I don't separate Jeff Schwartz and LO, as far as these negotiations go. It's not like David Lee, who got things off an an irreversibly wrong foot with his PDQ public comments and negotiation tactics while guiding a very young, inexperienced and somewhat passive client in Trevor Ariza. Not that TA doesn't have his own mind and voice, but those specifics can play a role. But JS has been almost entirely silent, and even if he's giving LO what some would consider bad advice, LO is big boy who's been around the NBA block. He should be held responsible for his decisions.

BK also asked the "what kind of team do you think the Lakers will be without LO" question in an earlier poll.

AK

y'all were waiting for my comments, i just know it. For the record, i decided not to vote if I didn't like the choices.

First poll question- you have nine options, but I think the most prevalent opinion I’ve seen argued here is that if Lamar does leave, we won’t blame anybody, we’ll just regard it as the decision that he feels will be best for him, and wish him luck.

Second poll question…[runs screaming from the room, takes a stiff drink, pours cold water on his neck, and retires to a monastery]

Fifth question – I honestly have no idea. But props for reading my mind and possibly my hard drive, as I actually was writing a bit about how traumatic I might find candy if LO leaves. My dentist will probably miss the income, though


To continue from the last thread...

Ok, I went back and reread. And in case anybody was wondering (probably not), I really do have a life. Unfortunately, I don’t have a job. So I’m spending crazy time on my computer looking and revising resumes etc, and I keep getting distracted by the LOCO. You guys should be grateful you get the full benefit of my brilliance. But this isn’t about my delusions, it’s about…oh, wait, it probably is. Never mind.

Alfonso- I get it, but Lamar wasn’t storming the beach at Anzio, he was playing basketball. I’m not really the right person to criticize rhetorical flourishes, but jeez.

Tom daniels– great post on Morrison. I doubt any rational person would dispute any of your points, which means I would expect a lot of posts disagreeing with you any minute now. Oh, and I get a little tingle every time somebody takes a shot at Kapono. Brings back great memories of my time in the Pit Crew at U of Oregon. We hated that guy.

Oh, I’m making a list of guys who are going to the wall defending Kobe and Odom because they contributed to our championship but are already in line to buy pitchforks and torches the next time the blog decides to discuss Luke Walton. I know, I know, you think Walton didn’t help. And when you argue that Luke didn’t help, you expect people to listen. But you don’t listen when people argue that Lamar didn’t help. Heck, I think both of them helped, cause, you know, WE WON! And all that. Just making a list, is all.

Otis- since you mentioned it, I think that the sources who are reporting that Miami offered Odom a deal are better than all the twits who are posting about Lamar’s negotiations. D Wade went on the record as wanting him to come back, and Pat Riley didn’t dispute that an offer had been made.


cool polls

"…People are just so "all or nothing" that they can't seem to keep themselves from making a straw-man "LO Hater" of LT, and then debunking/decrying that fictional character…
Posted by: Laker Kev | July 20, 2009 at 08:17 AM

Kev- Good point. However, I think one reason I criticized LT when I didn’t criticize a bunch of random people who jumped on Lamar is because frankly, I hold LT to a higher standard. He generally comes off as the more rational person when he debates other posters, I almost never disagree with him, and I was disappointed to hear that he didn’t want LO back. I think many people might feel the same way. Maybe not fair, but that’s how I felt.

Pig,
"The writing has a very pompous air about it, and that can rub people the wrong way."

cry us a river ...

I would like a mint, actually, justa. While I can still stand candy.

"Alfonso is knocking BobbieT?
Posted by: Otis | July 20, 2009 at 08:59 AM

Yeah, it’s pretty weird. LOCO makes strange um, whatever the opposite of bedfellows is.

"Funny the difference in stress and opinion on the two coasts. In Miami, Lamar Odom is of mild interest in the blogs I've read, and I'd say most fans are pessimistic they'll land him. Example:
"Why do you guys do this to yourselves? We're not getting Odom. It would be beyond retarded for him and the Lakers to part ways at this point. He fits their system very well. That franchise can provide him with an incomparable combination of winning and exposure. They both already agreed to annual salary terms. Miami can't come close to what the Lakers are offering on a per annum basis."
Meanwhile we're over here chewing our faces off wondering how he could possibly leave.
I love sports. http://tinyurl.com/mxvsgo
Posted by: Mike | July 20, 2009 at 10:15 AM

Mike…you and your balanced perspective…wacky. Obviously one of those new-comers to the blog. [j/k] Also, ‘chewing our faces off’ is a pretty good expression, I gotta say.

Umm…sorry, alfonso…you can um…claim that there is no need to be public relations friendly if you don’t mind people thinking you are a (*&@.

Tom..um, I know you’ll still be a Laker fan when Lamar comes back. So there.

"LakerTom
'I understand you love Lamar and cannot see past that.'
Do you not see how ironic this statement is?
Posted by: giantsquid | July 20, 2009 at 11:48 AM

Good one.

"…I don't want to get into a long drawn out debate either….
Posted by: hobbitmage | July 20, 2009 at 12:29 PM

Since when?

Tim thomas might actually be a good signing if he's willing to take it ... I'm still haunted by that dagger 3 he hit to send the game to overtime when we were up 3-2 on the suns playing game 6 at home ... speaking of which that goes down as one of them Odumb plays ... I forget where he was on the court but all I know is there was an initial miss and we failed to secure the rebound ... he's a big guy, he shoulda been in there wrestling for the ball ... still if we'd gone far that year, we just might have given smush parker a long term deal ... now how painful would that be ... yikes!!!

Did I mentione we're the 2009 nba champions ... ha ... how u like us now mr smush parker aka "playing with kobe wasn't all that" ... ha ... eat me punk ... and i liked u 2 ...

phred,

"Oh, I’m making a list of guys who are going to the wall defending Kobe and Odom because they contributed to our championship but are already in line to buy pitchforks and torches the next time the blog decides to discuss Luke Walton."

umm kobe contributed to our championship? same as luke did? ... yeah pass me that blunt you're smoking, it must be really good

repost, not cause it's that brilliant, but I wanted some of our CBA gurus to tell me why this can't work.

"I'm posting here because I actually had a NEW IDEA! One that hasn't been posted before. It's probably quite crazy, but at this point, that's probably a selling point.

Give Lamar a one year deal. $20M. Throw in a team option that we can opt out and resign him for $40M/ four years, guaranteed. Then wait until the trading deadline. If we still need him, take the second option. If we don't, he becomes the most valuable trading chip of all time. We can offer his expring contract to anybody, for anybody. Chris Paul, Bosh, LBJ, Wade, whoever. Sure, we would just have them for the rest of the year, and after that we would have a bigger bill, but hey, we're going to renegotiate with Kobe after this year. You're telling me the Lakers wouldn't want to have a chance to A)have just won another title B)have both Kobe and another franchise player, both of whom would not be able to get a significant offer from another franchise because of CBA rules?

Sure, it would be a *&%( thing to do to Kobe, Lamar and whoever, but Lamar would have his guaranteed money and a title or would have been traded to someone, with a chance to get more in FA next year, which combined with the $20M, would be more than he could get otherwise, or a title and a four year guaranteed deal. And kobe and the other franchise player would have a title, and still get a competitive offer WITH A WINNING TEAM, which is all they claim to want.

Ok, there are probably all sorts of technical details that might make this a stupid idea. Like I said, it's crazy, and I don't have an advanced degree in the CBA like some people here, but hey, it's a new idea, and might be an interesting topic of discussion. or at least more interesting.

Posted by: phred | July 20, 2009 at 12:06 PM

Jon K,

Timmy can hit the open 3 ... vet minimum aint 2 much 2 pay for that

Oh yeah...WE WON! WE WON! WE WON!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA...WE ARE THE REIGNING NBA CHAMPIONS! CHAAAAMPION! WE'RE NUMBER ONE! WE'RE NUMBER ONE! NOT YOU, US! NUMBER ONE!

TAKE YOUR BEAUTY PAGEANT SMILE AND YOUR TINA FEY GLASSES AND WE WON! WE WON!

IT IS ALL ABOUT THE LOVE!

GO LAKERS!

Pig,

LakerTom is an optimist. We need optimists in Laker Nation.

What do we play for? RINGS!!!!

Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.

GO LAKERS!!!!

phred,

"Second poll question…[runs screaming from the room, takes a stiff drink, pours cold water on his neck, and retires to a monastery]"

I had the same reaction.

What do we play for? RINGS!!!

Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.

GO LAKERS!!!

THE NEW LAMAR ANTHEM
sung to the music "If I Only Had a Brian" (Wizard of Oz)

I will be a Laker playa
When I'm a bigga millionaire-a
Were just 2 mil away
dodo dodo dodo

But 5 years is what I need-a
Cause I smoke alot of weed-a
If I only had a brain

This should have been done soon-a
But my agent's playin it cool-a
Just like David Lee
dodo dodo dodo

Yes he's sharp as a razor
But I don't want to be a Blazer
My god I must be insane.

Miami would be betta
I know the beaches there-a
And D-Wade's got some game
dodo dodo dodo

I could sleep away the season
And steal a few more millions
Who said I had no brain?

Odom
Jest sign zee papers, old man!

In regards to the second poll question, if forced to address a Plan B, I would suggest simply giving Josh Powell and DJ Mbenga a lot more playing time and bringing up a D-League project to fill the big man void left by Lamar Odom's absence.

If Lamar leaves, we need hungry players filling that void, not worn out, potentially somewhat pricey veterans.

What do we play for? RINGS!!!!

Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.

GO LAKERS!!!!

taliq...huh. I didn't say Kobe contributed to our championship, I said you said it. But I agree, he did. And so did Luke, as did Shannon Brown, Adam Morrison, the ball boys, and phil's chair. We won as a team, and you have argued that we should recognize the contributions of all team players. So i'm just holding you to your own standards.

But yeah, whatever I'm smoking, you should get some of that.

AK,

Regarding "Plan B" options, why isn't Chris Wilcox on the list?

What do we play for? RINGS!!!!

Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.

GO LAKERS!!!!

If the Lakers were smart, they'd find a way to lure #2345 MJ himself out of retirement to play with us. He could temporarily sell his interest in the Bobcats and finish his career alongside Ten Rings Gimping (PJ's Native-American name - see pg 34, Sacred Hoops II: Spiritual Methods To Be More Awesome Than Anyone Else While Getting To Hook Up With The Owner's Daughter On A Semi-Casual Basis). MJ could prove once and for all that he's the better player, not KB824 and could also continue his tutelage of young Adam Morrison, and the Bike/Commerce/Hustler casinos are a short trek from downtown (although, I would give my right toe to see MJ walk into Club Caribe for their $40 NLHE evening tourney).

Admit it - I'm on to something! It's gotta be a better option than Tim Thomas or Sean May.

Actually, i'm not saying he's a good replacement, but josh powell is probably a better replacement than all of those guys, and we're already paying him. One lone point of hope.

Taliq

"cry us a river ..."

There aren't enough tissues, tough guy.

Wait, let me try that again.

Ahem . . .

dang son! why u gotta h8 on me like dat? was da matta wich u? U mad jus cuz people don like lakertom's writin and they sayin' dat? cmon dogg! u know iss all good!

Is that better?

phred,

There are Haters out there roaming the wilds of Laker Nation. Always have been. Always will be. Best to leave bear traps for them and leave them to be eaten alive in a severely dehydrated state by coyotes and ice weasels.

What do we play for? RINGS!!!!

Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.

GO LAKERS!!!!

Taliq,

Tim Thomas is a cancer.

I'd rather trade for Kwame Brown than sign Tim Thomas.

What do we play for? RINGS!!!

Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.

GO LAKERS!!!

Taliq,

"umm kobe contributed to our championship? same as luke did?"

Actually, yes, in that they both CONTRIBUTED to winning a Championship. Luke did not hold us back in winning a Championship this year in the Playoffs. He literally made our team better and, thus, CONTRIBUTED to us winning a Championship.

Luke Walton deserves the ring he'll be getting.

What do we play for? RINGS!!!!

Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.

GO LAKERS!!!

Staples,

Thanks for your excellent post of Lamar vs. Bynum.

Tom

Taliq,

He can hit the open three, but he has an awful work ethic, disappears during long stretches, and doesn't play defense.

How do you think Kobe Bryant will respond to having a player like that on his team? It will drive him nuts, thus creating a worse locker room environment and undermining team unity.

Tim Thomas is a cancer.

I've watched him play as a Clipper and I can personally attest to this. He would be an terrible Laker. Ask AK or BK about this, I'm sure they'll agree with me.

What do we play for? RINGS!!!

Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.

GO LAKERS!!!

Jon K,

Wilcox signed with the Pistons.

AK

Jon K- hey, all us genial optimists gotta stick to together.

But you notice, I never mentioned taliq by name, or quoted anything he said. He just jumped in and defended his right to criticize Luke. Sure, I saw that coming, but taliq, all you had to do was say hey, I think luke is useless, and here's why. My smoking habits don't have much to do with it, do they? But yeah, ya'll should get some of what i'm smoking....WE WON! That's what I'm smoking, y'all! Fill your pipe up with a lot of that!

and add some love, be sure to get some of that in there.


let us pay you millions of dollars!!!!!!!

Like most here, I think the Lakers chances of repeating are seriously, seriously in doubt if they lose LO. The other contenders all got stronger while the Lakers got worse. Their bench is pathetic without LO. With that being said, I am absolutely sick of this waiting game and am prepared to let him go. LO and his agent are playing games with Buss, who, based on his track record and offers made to LO this offseason, is a loyal owner and rewards his players.

Is Matt Barnes available? If so, I think he'd be a good fit for the triangle. Barnes is young, athletic and is a good "intangibles" guy, which would help the Lakers more than Tim Thomas or Joe Smith, both of whom are washed up at this point in their careers.

Rocky,

"As a Laker, he'll never be an all-star. In Miami, he'd probably be an all-star in the East."

He had all the chance here in LA to be an all-star if he produced consistently, for three years he was the number two guy, everybody expected from him to produced like it, he never delivered. With a line up of Kwame, Mihm and Smush that's ALL-STAR written all over for Lamar. Opporunity he had and never reached his potential.

If it is Miami that he can be an all-star, then he should leave and take that quest. But if it is championshhip and all-star. He has that opportunity here as well if he PLAYS LIKE IT THE WHOLE YEAR EVERY GAME.. Being the fifth player he can still establish himself ahead of Bynum and Artest, go to ALL-STAR with Kobe and Gasol. It is really up to him, he has the skills he always had, that was never the problem.

BEFORE the bandwagon jumping reaches it's peak, let it be known that I have been awarded the FA franchise for Kobe's Ankle Insurance. No claim filing will take place until after LO signs...with someone. (Please expect delays in claim processing due to the high number of potential injuries)

At the end of the day; it's business, not personal and only the front of the jersey matters...GO LAKERS!

AK,

Thanks. So the Pistons have Wilcox and Brown? Kind of odd.

What do we play for? RINGS!!!

Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.

GO LAKERS!!!

phred,

since now. if i weren't scrounging for Lamar info, I'd
be a ghost.

Sorry to waste your time.

(although, I would give my right toe to see MJ walk into Club Caribe for their $40 NLHE evening tourney).

I've played that tourney a couple times. Fun times.


"my response: My *recollection* is that Lamar played
much better and harder once Pau showed up. You
may show statistics which invalidate this, but that's my
rememberence. This obviously begs the question: Why?"

See my previous post Hobbitmage. It wasn't just LO Kobe and the rest of the Lakers played very well. Gasol and his better play from the post along with his great passing ability made almost the whole TEAM better. Odom is more perimeter PF that can dive to the basket. Gasol is best used in the post since he has a variety of moves to SCORE and be a playmaker. Odom's production went up and so did his FG% and look so did Sasha's and Kobe's! In fact Kobe's FG% hasn't been this good (which actually moderate compared to LBJ and Wade and they don't have good post presence in the last few years) since the days of another good passing big man scoring type in Shaq! Gasol was the perfect complement to not only Odom but Kobe as well! That does mean Kobe's alpha wolf status got threatened? Not by a long shot. Just only goes to show that it was Gasol's presence that made Odom's (and others) production/efficiency go up rather than the job security that you believe it to be.

"However, with the exception of the
last 1.5 seasons playing with Pau [ where's no longer
the #2 guy ], my observations is valid. As a #2 guy,
he has had little success in terms of winning."

Really? Try 03-04 with the Heat LO as 2nd option to Wade and the Heat not only make the playoffs but nearly upset the #1 Seeded Indiana Pacers who had won 61 games that year. Or 05-06 where he was 2nd option to Kobe's Lakers that made the playoffs despite having more inconsistent scrubs in Kwamay/Smush/Cook and nearly upsetting the 2nd second seeded Suns. And 06-07 where if it weren't for a knee injury he could have made the all star team and having the same amount of scrubs which included Bynum whose poor play down the stretch was one of the reasons for Kobe's rightful if unprofessional rant in the summer of 2007. Remember that for a while some teams had the Lakers ranked number 1 before the Lakers lost many games down the stretch due to poor play and a shoulder injury to LO. LO has had success as a 2nd option just not as good as Gasol who was the perfect fit for the Lakers. You wanted me to consider injuries to the 1991 Pistons as reasons of their loss well consider those factors for the 06-07 season then! I didn't see Bynum dominate in the 07 series either.

"Can you think of another *name* who is as
prone to fade at crunch time?"

Again your recollections which is easily disproved:

07-08 LO's clutch rating (odd as it may sound) was good enough to rank above Rafer Alston, Rajon Rondo and heck even James Posey who was very clutch in Game 4 2008

Source: http://tinyurl.com/2hs39s

You were right though about this year he didn't fade during crunch time:

Source: http://tinyurl.com/93c97w

Before you go and try to say "yea right" keep in mind that he is not one who is usually handling the ball and scoring and that would be the top guy. Heck even both Ariza and Odom has better clutch rating this year than even Derek Fisher even though Fish was the one who was the clutches player in Game 4 of the 09 Finals.

Now my question is Hobbitmage: Whom should I believe more? Your recollection and yes memory can sometimes be blurred or what is recorded already?

AK and BK this is the best blog you've ever done. Congrads!

I don't blame anyone but Dr. Buss for the contract. If we're faced with the chance of him going somewhere else -- pony up the dough Dr. Buss.

As far as the unfair contracts go, Drew's has to be near the top for me. Every time I see this kid play I go crazy. I want to switch brains with him just during game time. There are just so many times I can yell "DUNK THE BALL DREW. YOU'RE 7 FEET TALL" before I lose my mind.

If I have to put up with 2 more years of this I don't know what I'll do.

"Give Lamar a one year deal. $20M."

You do realize that's essentially $40M this year because of the luxury tax, right? It's a creative idea, but that's ludicrous money for one guy. It's not my money, but I can't see the Lakers just throwing away money like that on a gamble.

Lakertom,

"Thanks for your excellent post of Lamar vs. Bynum."

I read Alfonso's and I thought he was making a good arguement there for a second until I realized there was something missing which is of course who would you preferred injured if it came down to it Bynum or Odom.

The answer is clear, Kobe said it himself.

But to anwser the question whether I want Odom on the team, defintely Yes! But not to the extent that he is being Odumb or atleast his agent is. I would go with Buss. Tieing up Odom for 4th and 5th year will make the Lakers less effective in the future.

Therefore I would not give it to Odom from a fans perspective. He is not the face of the franchise Kobe is and Bynum is the future. Lakers will soon need to sign up or trade for around Bynum, Odom's long contract will prevent that from getting achieved.

Lakers are thinking of their future success as well, why should we not be on their side, and why should we be on the side of Odom? Does not make sense, does it?

I am a Lakerfan first. Lakers forever!

Way too much comedy in the polls.

The question is will the Lakers win a title without Odom and the answer is NO, 95% likely unless other contenders have injuries or Bynum plays a healthy 82.

Will the Lakers put the offer back on the table?
They should.

Will the Lakers do a sign and trade for a Marvin Williams if LO would go to Atlanta?

Miami has nothing we want so put the offer on the table and let LO decide and be the bad guy but why would the Lakers take this stance of tough guy when Kobe will be a yr older and you can't expect him to do more. The bench is average on it's best day.

Staples24,

He probably could have been an allstar, but he's been competing with the likes of Kevin Garnett, Tim Duncan, Dirk Nowitzki, Amare Stoudemire, Pau Gasol, etc. The West has been tough to make an all-star team as a big man.

He was on Team USA for a while, that's kind of like an all star team. To bad that team humiliated us.

Go Lakers!
Sign Lamar!

Taliq

"cry us a river ..."

There aren't enough tissues, tough guy.

Wait, let me try that again.

Ahem . . .

dang son! why u gotta h8 on me like dat? was da matta wich u? U mad jus cuz people don like lakertom's writin and they sayin' dat? cmon dogg! u know iss all good!

Is that better?

Posted by: Pig | July 20, 2009 at 01:49 PM


Pig,

That was brilliant! You are the man!! Can't stand that poser..er ...poster. Thanks for that one bro!

Go Lakers!!

The Clippers just made a very odd trade.

Gordon, Davis and Telfair at point guard? Is that a good idea?

At least we get to see Madsen as a Clipper, which could be entertaining.

Go Clippers!

GO LAKERS!!!!

FredJ,

"I still blame the Shannon Brown contract."

Wow! Unbelievable. I thought that was an excellent sign. How nice it is to have your own opinion, cause imagine if had to go along with that and vice versa.

Staples 24
You gotta go for it now. Forget the future!
Once Kobe is gone, we start from scratch.
Bynum will not be a MVP caliber player.

Jon K

Gordon is a 2.

AK

I am a first-time poster.

is this what happened on the negotiations?

lakers offer 3/30 guaranteed.

odom asks for whatever,

lakers up to 4/36.

but wait.......

its really only 3/27
lakers buyout at end = 3m
so he waits to the end of 3 years to get the rest of 10/30 they already offered him.

i don't blame LOa bit for not liking that, if thats how it went.

thats an insult to anyones intelligence.

Staples,

>>> Lakers are thinking of their future success as well, why should we not be on their >>> side, and why should we be on the side of Odom? Does not make sense, does it?

Excellent post again, Staples. Like I said, there are lots of positive points on both sides of the argument about Lamar. Bottom line, I trust the Lakers front office to make the best decision. They are the only ones who really have all the info and know what is really going on. Good thinking and good to see we are in agreement, Staples.

Tom

Just nikpicking but Johnny Depp was in "Charlie and the Chocolate Factory." No Willy Wonka in the tiltle.

rdlee,

>>> Staples 24
>>> You gotta go for it now. Forget the future!
>>> Once Kobe is gone, we start from scratch.
>>> Bynum will not be a MVP caliber player.

In fairness, maximizing Kobe’s prime years is the one argument about re-signing Lamar that resonates with me. If we do end up putting an offer back on the table for Lamar, that would be the only reason that makes sense to me for taking such a risk. Excellent point.

Tom

AK,

So, do you like the trade?

Go Clippers!

GO LAKERS!!!!

Can the lakers go after Kleiza?

It is absolutely amazing how ignorant people come out the woodworks... John, why don't you do some reading before making your first time opinions be known...
Oh, by the way, how did we get to $10 for 3 years being the standard?
I thought that $8 mil per year for Odom would have been fair....
Get real, people!!!

A fair thing would be to pay Odom $5 mil per year - let him sit out the regular season - since he takes that off anyway... then, use him for the playoffs, as that's when we will need him... Fair?!!!
I am just kidding...

But, it is taking him this long to make a decision... what new factors are there? Am I missing something? Figure out what you want and make a decision already!!!

Miami partying life style worth missing out on few million dollars chance at a dynasty? Women in Miami must be really good looking!!!

Good luck, LO.
I used to be a big fan of yours... too bad...

I love Lamar but I'm tired of his crap. I agree with the fourth year not being guaranteed because he has a history of being inconsistent. To Lamar: You ungrateful jerk. L.A. ressurected your career. We waited 5 years for you to show what you could really do and you save it for the last 7 games of the 2009 season? You and Trevor really ate up you own hype, huh? At this point, I won't even be sad if you go. Not returning Dr. Buss phone calls? That's all the consideration you can give him after all he's done for you? If you want to leave, kick rocks. Shaq can tell you better than anybody: The Lakers will thrive and we will prosper without you. I at least hope we can get Michael Beasley in a sign-and-trade deal. Have a good time in a second-round and out Miami team, and a lottery team when D. Wade leaves after this upcoming season. Jerk.

KB Blitz,

1. Hi.

2. I guess you still want to debate with me after all the
long conversations.

3. I'll try to be brief.

you wrote: Really? Try 03-04 with the Heat LO as 2nd option to Wade and the Heat not only make the playoffs but nearly upset the #1 Seeded Indiana Pacers who had won 61 games that year.

So ... your argument is that a .512% season is a
winning season? Technically, it's not a losing season.
Sport, they didn't even win 45 games. They barely
broke even.

re: nearly upsetting the Pacers. Just like the Lakers
*nearly* upset the Suns. Almost counts in horse shoes
and hand grenades. [ atomic weapons too. ] it does not
count in basketball nor does it count when talking
about $$ or women. That is one of the reasons why
Kobe is not rated as high as MJ. [ there are others
depending who you talk to. ]

you wrote: 07-08 LO's clutch rating (odd as it may sound) was good enough to rank above Rafer Alston, Rajon Rondo and heck even James Posey who was very clutch in Game 4 2008

my response: This is another example of lies, damn lies
and statistics. Without KG & Ray Allen, would
we even know who Rondo and Posey are? They
were nothing before the Big 3 were assembled. Where
is Posey now and what is he doing? What was
Posey's clutch rating last year after he moved to NO?

you wrote: Before you go and try to say "yea right" keep in mind that he is not one who is usually handling the ball and scoring and that would be the top guy. Heck even both Ariza and Odom has better clutch rating this year than even Derek Fisher even though Fish was the one who was the clutches player in Game 4 of the 09 Finals.

my response: Excuse me! Aren't you the one who's
always ranting about LO's ball handling ability and the
"versatility" he brings to the team. Shame on you for
making excuses. If his ball handling is what you say
and the necessary, then *SURELY* the HOFer PJ would
have given him duties utilizing his fantastic ball
handling ability wouldn't he? Oh, wait. That didn't happen.

you wrote: Now my question is Hobbitmage: Whom should I believe more? Your recollection and yes memory can sometimes be blurred or what is recorded already?

You should always believe what is recorded fact. My
observation is that you *ALWAYS* get the facts that
support your opinion about Lamar being great and you
*NEVER* pay attention to the facts that detract from
your opinion.

ex: Who was the starting forward for the playoff run
of the Lakers during 2009?

-- sub question: If Lamar was such a great SF, how
come the Lakers have him at PF?

To clarify: There are a number of fans, of which I'm one,
who have noticed that Lamar doesn't play the game,
on a consistent basis, the way we think he should.
Rather than relay solely on the statistics, which you are
so fond of, we look at both the statistics and the
results for the complete picture.

The *complete* picture of Lamar [ my opinion ] is this:
A wonderfully gifted player, who has mental issues.
These mental issues have prohibited him from being
an all-star and stung teams who relied upon him too
much. They have also prevented him from developing
his game. As a 3rd or 4th option, Lamar is fantastic!
There is *NO ONE* in the NBA that I'd prefer to have
coming off the bench.

My hypothesis: If Lamar was as consistent as Kobe or
Pau, he wouldn't be taking a pay cut. If he was as
good as you make him out to be, teams would be
breaking down the door to do a sign & trade with
Lamar for a championship run. Nobody is doing that.
That supports the idea that your opinion of Lamar is
not what every one else's is. The people who make
this their livelihood are *NOT* breaking themselves to
sign Lamar. If it were Kobe or Pau, Dr. Buss wouldn't
be able to sleep because of the phone ringing.

These are the *FACTS*. Lamar was the 2nd string
PF for the Lakers. The Lakers could not win a playoff
series with Lamar, as the 2nd option, against a team
that didn't play defense. Lamar has never been an
all-star of any caliber. He couldn't win in the Olympics
& he couldn't help beat PHX. *THOSE* are some
recorded facts you forgot to mention. *THOSE* are
the facts that I'm looking at. Not statistics, which
mean very little.

Might I suggest that we drop this conversation, so
the blog doesn't bellyache too much?

BTW, did you buy your Lamar jersey?

Sign Matt Kemp he is way tougher than all the Fakers

So sayeth Kobe on Twitter. KobeBBryant: LO will make the right choice :)

So, let me get this straight.

Buss offers 3/30, which has a team option for a 4th year.
The team could by him out for 3 million, which becomes 3 years for 33 million at a minimum.

Isnt 11 million per what Odom made last year?

Think about that--walking away from a 11 million per!
Doofus!

AK/BK

"And thus, without further adieu..."

It's ado.

MAN! This board has been on FIRE the last week or two.

I used to post on an NBA site back in 2000, 2001, 2002 until they converted it into a paying site after the dot.com bust. At that time the boards were also on fire. We were arguing over whether or not our Lakers would match up well with the Blazers in the playoffs. We thought they would but the Blazers were scary good!

We ended up the season defeating them in that infamous 7 game playoff series and the 4th quarter come back of the ages. We spent THAT summer arguing with the Blazers fans about whether or not we deserved to be champs and whether we would repeat.

The next year Sacramento was added to the drama and we spent a good deal of time arguing with them about our Lakers and whether or not their team could beat us in the playoffs.

Those were some FUN YEARS and it all played out beautifully in my opinion. The hardcore basketball was being played on the West Coast and whoever came out of the Conference title series would easily defeat the East Champion.

THIS SUMMER is real different. The Lamar saga has turned all us inward and against ourselves. That takes alot of the fun out of the debate. This is a no win scenario. If we sign Lamar, we all try to move on and patch up the scars. If we don't sign Lamar, we move forward hoping something else will materialize that will help us in the years to come.

I liked fighting with the other teams better. We seem to be in a lose-lose. Interesting maybe, but surely unproductive.

The Snake,

Thank you.

AK

AK,

"And thus, without further adieu... "

you mean ado, don't you?

I know, I know, the bald guy made you do it.

P Ang,

No, it was my fault. I changed it.

AK

Posted by: Charles | July 20, 2009 at 03:53 PM

Charles. Please add an initial or a last name for your entries. People will confuse which Charles is posting.

Thanks,

Charles of 2006...

Alfonso;

Yawn.

Phred,

I don't know about $20k for LO, but I am completely on board, if the Lakers want to stretch to sign him, for paying more in the 3 year offer than adding years.

I think an aging LO is a big risk, it takes hard work to maintain in the NBA as you age.

I'd rather pay him more in the short run but keep salary flexibility in the long run.

Tom D.

LO is priceless to the Lakers and should be treated that way. When we had Shaq and Kobe, we were known as a team with two superstars. Same as Magic and Kareem. Kobe is our franchise player and head, but LO is our body. All the other players connect to him and together are a machine. If the body is not right, you can have strong arms and legs, even a good head on your shoulders, but you body allows your the mobility to function. We NEED LO! If he was screaming for a trade, I'd be like "Go!", but he isn't. He just wants to be recognized and treated fairly. Dr. Buss is shrewed and resourceful. He wants LO back and LO will be back, I hope. I've looked around and I can't see anyone with his skills. A lot of good players, but LO is a gem. Like a Grant Hill or a Joe Dumars. Ardent professionals. He deserves to get paid. been in LA for how long now? No news reports no arrest. Model citizen. Stays healthy. Knows the offense. Ran with Artest in NY and can keep him on a leash so he won't be getting arrested, robbed or whatever else. Simply put, LO is one of the good guys. He needs to know he's wanted here and we (the fans) should demand his return. If Kobe was in talks of leaving we would be screaming! Because he is the Lakers. but no man is a team. LO is key. PG is great, but without LO, we're in trouble. If we can't get him, be better try and get Boozer, Drew or Ike (although I voted for Sheldon. he and his wife Candace Parker would be great ambassadors for the NBA in LA). Although it will take time for two key players to learn the offense (RA and whomever) Plz LO don't go.

I've got to give this to Odom: he is absolutely number one in the OMG* stat. Nobody else in the NBA comes close.

So if the Lakers do lose him, say goodbye to guys dribbling the ball up the court instead of throwing it in (http://tinyurl.com/n5y7d9), making mind-blowing passes to out-of-bounds teammates (http://tinyurl.com/dkjznq), or throwing precision bullets to referees (http://tinyurl.com/nztbjl).

And nobody on the team is going to have the uncanny sense to dunk the ball two feet to the right of where the basket actually is (http://tinyurl.com/nujylr).

I ask you, who on the Lakers is going to make up that deficit?

If Odom goes, we all lose.

*Odom Moments per Game, (c) STATS Inc.

don't know where this is going. dr. buss pulled the offer, so it's not like lamar can say, "uhm, i guess i'll take it..." and hard to tell if it's his agent, or he copped an attitude, or what. but the drag-out is not good for laker zen, and i doubt the brass are bluffing.

Great thread. Great polls. But where is the LA Times sports department? Where is the journalism? Where is the LAT's answer to Ric Bucher?

Any editor worth his salt would have a LAMAR ODOM WATCH box prominently fixed on the front page of the sports section and on the home page of the web site. There would be a TMZ-like crew assigned to stake out Lamar like he was Britney Spears. The Times would tap Lamar's phone lines like the British tabloids do. There would be a tail on Jeff Schwartz like he was an underworld hit man. There would be NEWS.

Is there anyone at the LAT -- other than a payroll clerk who knows to cut checks for AK and BK -- who knows this blog exists and how much traffic it gets?

Seriously, we're talking about a major snag in negotiations with a key player and the NBA Champion Los Angeles Lakers. And the Times has made no effort outside this blog to own the story. Pathetic.

Speaking of pompous and arrogant, a few of you guys have decided that a newcomer is some kind of inferior species.
There's an inference that in this blog's hierarchy, the established members really don't want to hear outsiders, and dismiss them either with silence, or by complaining to each other about this infestation of foreigners . I don't like the spirit of that. Don't hear much that sounds like "welcome".

I'm here right now because of LOCO, which qualifies me (I have no desire to provide a pedigree, or pledge allegiance) as a real fan because not only have I endured (as we all have), some serious anxiety fired by these endless negotiations, but I've endured 10,000 of your postings. And enjoyed it, mostly.

Here's the introduction:
I'm new.


And it looks like the energy drink is working...

Let's see here what we are dealing with:

1.) A championship contenter team? Ummmm, lakers are the champs!!

2.) Willing and able to offer a great contract? wow, can most people live off $9mil a year? Most NBA players would be very happy with that!!

3.) Great location including - Climate!!!, night life!!, Hollywood!!, Awesome fans (willing to turn over cop cars!).

What else would an NBA player want..... ummmmm Lamar???? Are you retarted??????

How's about "Odumb-Watch"?

Love your work.

hobbitmage - i dare you. I just dare you.

mike- of course i realized that, as was evidenced by me saying about four times 'this is a crazy idea' i just wanted to hear what other people thought.

>>>The Clippers just made a very odd trade.
>>>Gordon, Davis and Telfair at point guard?

Eric Gordon is a SG.

PG: Davis, Telfair, Mike Taylor
SG: Eric Gordon, Mardy Collins
SF: Al Thornton, Ricky Buckets
PF: Blake Griffin, Marcus Camby
C: Chris Kaman, DeAndre Jordan

Pretty sweet lineup on paper. Wouldn't surprise me if they
fought their way into the cherished position of being the
Lakers first round playoff victim.

"I guess you still want to debate with me after all the
long conversations."

Because you keep distorting facts for your *recollection*.

Hint: Try looking at the Lakers in 2 ways: one as a fan and one who isn't fan (not a hater). Maybe that way you would understand a different perspective and see that maybe Josh Powell isn't an okay solution to the Lakers should let LO loose for sure.

"re: nearly upsetting the Pacers. Just like the Lakers
*nearly* upset the Suns"

They made it to the 2nd round which is saying something considering the Heat were a lottery team the year before Wade and Odom came.

Again the statistics don't lie. Just how you choose to put them into perspective. Fact is that Odom and Ariza were pretty well in the clutch this season considering neither had the ball as much as they do as Kobe. And Posey again was in that list of clutch rating and he was over people like Mason and our own Derek Fisher. You have nothing but your *recollections* to prove your point.

And the excuse me part? Jackson has used Odom as a guard role (note I said guard role not necessarily means Odom is a guard) allowing Kobe to play more SF. Tell me can Josh Powell play like a guard? Or can Bynum or DJ Mbenga? Guess not. Kobe playing more SF role offensively makes him deadly since he can go outside or inside to post up. Try reading the games more.

"ex: Who was the starting forward for the playoff run
of the Lakers during 2009? "

Gasol and Odom did get some starts too especially against Houston but here's another question: Which tandem got more minutes?? Bynum-Gasol or Gasol-Odom? Please tell me. ( Note that just because you start don't mean squat. What is the point of starting if you will receive less than 12 minutes a game? The last deserving 6th man of the year was Leandro Barbossa not Manu. Ginobili was essentially a starter. Leandro gave terrific production and still remained a 6th man backing up both Nash and Raja Bell.)

"If he was as good as you make him out to be, teams would be breaking down the door to do a sign & trade with Lamar for a championship run."

Now isn't that what Miami and Dallas are doing? Yahoo sports had LO as the top free agent over prominent ones like Ariza and even AI. And you forget that 1) Teams are banking more on 2010 and 2) The sign and trade can only be done IF and only IF LO gives the okay button which he only prefers Miami but no way would the Lakers want non expiring contracts no would Riley want to give someone like Michael Beasley. Man you are becoming more delusional not to mention forgetful.

Now these are the FACTS: Gasol-Odom was the most successful tandem the Lakers had. The Lakers beat BOTH Boston and Cleveland with that tandem. The Lakers won the championship with Gasol-Odom. That duo along with Kobe himself WON the title. Bynum was the one sitting pine most of the time. Any more revisionist history you want to write?

Btw if you want to admit that LO as a 2nd option couldn't win a playoff series, then you have no choice to admit Kobe didn't win a playoff series until Gasol arrived!

Don't worry I have an Ariza Rockets Jersey for you though I could give a Sir Choke-a-cic also for you. I'm keeping my Gasol and Bryant jerseys for sure.

There is no newcomer bias - one survives with one's words.

itsonlyme

u have to be loco to come to LOCO

Welcome to the Lakers DIASPORA. there is room for everybody.

 
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