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Belly up to the bar

November 21, 2008 |  9:50 am

Measuring_stick_l But don't take that as an invite to drinking (although we at Lakers Blog certainly won't stop anyone from partaking, should the interest be there).  Instead, the bar in question is the one Suns coach Terry Porter claimed the Lakers represent in a "measuring stick" metaphorical sense.  And with that in mind, a 105-92 Lakers win- a victory not even as close as that sizable margin would indicate- equals Porter's squad going belly up.  For that matter, so did the "story lines" heading into the contest. 

Before the tip, the focus seemed to swirl around matters of star power.  Shaq's complaints that Phil Jackson kept his threepeat era stars at each other's throats, a statement the Big Man insists was taken out of context.  PJ is buying it, particularly upon insisting that ducats, not daggers, led to Shaq's trade outta L.A.  The threepeat stars in question, obviously, were Shaq and Kobe Bryant, a volatile playing relationship that everyone always suspects could boil over again.  No dice.  Just kind words- at least until Shaq changes his mind again- about Kobe being quite the team player.  Those hoping Shaq and Andrew Bynum would pick up where a brief 2006 encounter left off were ultimately disappointed.  Shaq didn't put a huge stamp on things despite quite a few touches and Bynum followed suit, struggling all night with foul trouble.  Throw in shooting struggles for Kobe (8-23), Pau Gasol (2-8, offsetting 9 dimes and boards), Amare Stoudemire (9-21),  and Steve Nash (3-9) and the box score wasn't really "about" the biggest names in question.

Instead, what ended up putting the Lakers over the top was their celebrated depth and supporting cast.  Vlad Radmanovic, whose recent shooting slump left PJ cryptic about a lineup shift, steadied himself and made Phoenix pay dearly for leaving him open behind the arc.  Lamar Odom came off the bench and put forth a strong 13/9 effort, setting a tone for Trevor Ariza, Jordan Farmar and Sasha Vujacic to follow suit.  Perhaps not a triumph of sexy storylines, but the Lakers' 9-1 record certainly looks rather dishy in its own right.

OTHER NOTES


Comments (94)

I hate to even bring this up, but I'm nursing a bit of a hangover, and I might not be thinking straight:

Does anyone else think that our weakest link is in our guard play? Don't get me wrong. I love Fish, but you can count on him taking some really bad shots several times each game. I have high hopes for Jordan, but I'd like to see a taller guard starting (Sun Yue is NOT even close yet).

Go Lake Show!

Mike T,

"When Kwame was out of the game the Celtics went up by 12 points 39-27. That's a 15 point difference. That’s the Pistons going away from the grinding, smashmouth basketball and they get killed by the Celtics with the small line-up.
....
Give Kwame 30 minutes a game and he’ll average a double-double. Go small with Maxiell and Johnson and the Pistons get killed by the elite.

That's my opinion.

mike t.

p.s. What part of this post insults any blogger?"

Hmm lemme take a stab at this

1. you look riduculous coming on here to tell us what we already told ya "i.e. no coach will give kwame extended minutes" ...
2. While we appreciate the thorough analysis on how the Pistons can get better, we really dont care much for the pistons ... wait until the next time we play the pistons to come rant about one of their games

Besides those two points, we got no qualms against ya post ... best of luck to you and kwame ... hope prop 8 hasn't thrown a wrench in ya plans for kwame

Wait a minute....

You mean to tell me that MT is now posting on a Piston's blog about how they can't beat the major teams in the league without more minutes to a certain... Kwame Brown?

I'm in shock.

Well, actually, I suppose it confirms everything we've all known for so long..... MT was that dude on YouTube saying "leave Kwame alone"

Funny, seems as though we dismantle a team and the trolls dissappear. I guess Mike T. still has his mancrush on Kwame. Some things will never change. lol.
As for tonights game, I think the new look Denver Nuggets will prove a more difficult challenge than the team we saw a couple of weeks ago. I didn't think bringing in one player would change their mindset, but I really think it has. Seems not unlike the Manny effect on the Dodgers, but we still have a lot of season left and that remains to be seen. I know we will win this one tonight, but its not going to be a walk in the park.

I think it's pretty obvious that the only teams that can beat the Lakers this year are the Pistons, Celtics and the Lakers. I think it will take a monumental effort by the Pistons to beat the Lakers in a seven game series, but I am definitely still worried about our abilty to manage the Three A-Holes and their supporting cast in Boston. Last night, it was obvious the Lakers depth can pretty much offset an off-night by our starters; I think that ability will allow the coaching staff to focus on developing a game plan to beat the Evil Green Menace next June.

Goooood Morning Laker Blog!

What a game! Some super D. A Vlad sighting (insert Dio's "Rainbow in the Dark" here).

It's always a good sign that Kobe can have an off game and we still pull out a double digit win.

When did Derek Fisher become the King of the 7 seconds or less offense? He has just started jacking up shots at about the 18 second mark on the 24 with regularity. I wish he would get the offense moving instead of looking for his own shot. He'll get his, but I thought he did play excellent D last night.

Poor Stevie Nash, looks like Mike D'Antoni should have been winning COY instead of Nash winning MVPs, eh?

At least BUTLER is still making sense...in his mind. Maybe he's really Stu Jackson with the way he wraps his head around such philosophical topics like "Who ACTUALLY Won Last Night?"

Poor Shaq, he can still get the ball over the rim for back board bending dunks, but he gets no lift on his 'chippies' which is why he is leaving them short. Too bad he never developed a mid range jumper like Andrew Bynum already has. that would sure come in handy nowadays.

Poor Amare, he looks like a moron with his mohawk, didn't anyone tell him the Rays have been eliminated from the MLB post season?

Nice to see Sasha and Ariza getting it together and playing well with each other. Ariza played more within himself last night and it was great to see. We also got tosee 31 and 4 get some burn. Gotta put those tradeable commodities in for nationally televised games, someone might be watching.

Can anyone tell me how Gasol managed only 8 shots? WTFITBS? How do our guards miss a 7 foot tall Spaniard with a sweet beard?

Can we always have Craig Sager wear his laker friendly purple suit? Plus I love marching bands, I wish they had cranked out a band version of 'Iron Man' in honor of Shaq.

Big game tonight, we need to let this new Denver squad know who is top dog and the best way to do that si to beat the snot out of them. I will, however, miss tonights game (never fear, through the magic of VHS I will tape it) as I will be at the El Ray Theatre watching Medeski Martin and Wood. Who's jealous?

I think as long as we force Billups to be the main scoring threat tonight and keep him from getting Mrtin and Nene easy looks we should be alright. If those guys get going it could be a long night. I also think our second unit needs to make keeping J.R. Smith from drilling 3s in transition, he loves that off-the-dribble 3 pointer more than I love coffee and that's saying something.

GO LAKERS!!!!!

Mamba24

Sans the integrated economy idea . . . What will our economic recovery be based upon? We have lost our industry. India speaks English and does IT and tech support. China has our factories and cheap labor. Wall Street's repackaging schemes can no longer be trusted. We already rode the dot.com wave. On the back of what productivity will our indebted economy once again fly? Lakers' sales??? Hell YA!! But what else?

JohnnyP

Get your Official Mamba24 Lakers G-String/Thong.
Only used a few times. Guaranteed fresh!
Wear the thong and impress your friends, girlfriends, future In-laws.
Posted by: Fatty | November 21, 2008 at 11:26 AM

hahhahahahhaahhahahhahahhahhahhahahhahhahaahahah
haha ROFLMAOF
hahhahahahhaahhahahhahahhahhahhahahhahhahaahah
ahhaha ROFLMAOF
hahhahahahhaahhahahhahahhahhahhahahhahhahaahah
ahhaha ROFLMAOF
hahhahahahhaahhahahhahahhahhahhahahhahhahaahah
ahhaha ROFLMAOF!!!

Meanwhile, the question on everyone's mind is...

What will MT do once Kwame retires?

On the back of what productivity will our indebted economy once again fly? Lakers' sales???
Hell YA!! But what else? JohnnyP Posted by: JohnnyP | November 21, 2008 at 11:57 AM

Sounds like you have been putting a little thought into this thing also JohnnyP.

Shaq:

We Don't know how your ass tatstes, but you can tell us after you sample it yourself now that we just handed it to you on a platter -- Love, Kobe and Phil.

I've got just two words:

"Who's next?"

--Fearless

What is up with Micheal T.? It is a good thing Kwame is in D town because I can't help but think you'd be his stalker if he was left here in LA. Let it go Bro. Your takes are as old and stale smelling as a tired old birddog.
You latch onto something and don't let it go...just like a Labrador.

If you're going to bloviate, at length, like you alwasy do, please keep your focus on the Lakers.

That fact that you scribe at such lengths on other blogs, only cofirms the fact that you need a life and it's time to move out of mom and dad's house.

I hear Butler can use a roomate. His mom is tired of his lame arse too.

Meanwhile, the question on everyone's mind is...
What will MT do once Kwame retires? Posted by: Tim-4-Show | November 21, 2008

He'll put Kwame out to stud.

Wondering if I'm the only one who's been having this thought lately: Notice how few minutes Luke Walton is getting. Notice how all the NBA announcers and commentators are always talking Luke up. Notice how PJ frequently allows as how Luke would like more minutes.

I'm thinking the Lakers are trying to shop Luke. Prediction: Luke will be wearing a different uniform by the trading deadline.

Am I alone in this thinking?

Kwame's Boy,

Sense you asked....

All of your post (and all your previous posts) insult my intelligence for one...

Your lack of any basketball knowledge whatsoever, coupled with your infantile ramblings are an insult to the integrity of this blog (albeit sometimes the integrity of this blog is a little lacking---thanks in no small part to posters such as yourself)...

Your claim of being a Laker fan insults me as well...

I really wish you would put your name at the top of your posts so I can skip them all together and not have to read a few words and then figure out it's your worthless waste of space...

I bet the Pistons blog really likes you being there (lucky them)...

I usually adhere to the starve the troll / fool theory and this post will be my only exception...I feel soiled enough responding to your obvious bait etc.

GO LAKERS !!!

I've got just two words: "Who's next?" --Fearless
Posted by: Fearless | November

NOW THAT'S WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT!!!!!

Shaq: We Don't know how your ass tatstes, but you can tell us after you sample it yourself now that we just handed it to you on a platter -- Love, Kobe and Phil.
Posted by: HmrHed | November 21, 2008 at 12:08 PM
THAT'S WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT!!


LAL FAN,

Never does a very valuable service here--he is the reverse (don't talk about it) sports curse guy...

Never is a true Laker fan who indeed wants us to win and uses the reverse curse (don't talk about it) as an art form...

Never, I understand and indeed salute you sir

GO LAKERS !!!

Jon K,

Yes indeed Sir---more playing time for Mihm and Powell....

We are so deep it's almost a curse...but I like it....

GO LAKERS !!!

I found Shaq's comment interesting: “For an old man I still demand a double- and triple-team.”

It may be a case of his ego getting in the way of his perception, but that wouldn't be the first time. Shaq didn't look bad out there and in fact looked like the one mythical player the Suns have. Grant Hill is still talented by has no mythical mojo left. Amare can do some breathtaking things but leaves you with an impression of overall mediocrity (especially last night, missing numerous attempts on the rim). Nash looks pathetic in a game no longer built for him.

But Shaq is still a presence as he showed on his early move around Drew (which reminded of the move Drew made on him two years ago). The problem with Shaq's analysis was that the reality (as it appeared to me) was that he drew double and triple teams not out of fear but opportunity. The Lakers knew that they could either provoke a turnover of push Shaq into making a hasty shot, which reduces the percentage to about 10%. In other words, he's double-teamed now not because he's so dominant but because he's more vulnerable than he used to be.

I've never liked Shaq and his shenanigans...and hated the helplessness and sinking feeling I felt whenever I watched him go to the free throw line for the Lakers. But he is a force to be reckoned with and came across - in spite of being fairly ineffectual - as the best thing the Suns had going (Barbosa's absence may have been a factor of course). The problem is that Shaq's force no longer has any meaning, especially on a team like the Suns.

It's sad all the way around, including Shaq's belief that he's still (or ever was) superman.

This game was exactly what I expected, a Lakers win. How it happened and who shined was a differrent story. The Lakers have continued to show that they are the best in the west, and that they can definately win "ugly". Their role players showed up and were a big factor in this win.The shocking part of the night was that at the end of the game you could here Laker fans chanting "Lets go Lakers!" when phoenix is (was) considered one of our toughest opponenets just a year or two ago.Overall its a Lakers win and we'll take it.

Jamie Sweet,

Is that Rad Vlad's official theme song now, Dio's "Rainbow In The Dark?"

Do we have to cue a bone-shattering Ronnie James Dio scream every time Vlad hits a three-pointer from now on?

I'm all for it.

Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.

GO LAKERS!

Jamie Sweet,

Pau passed out of the post to shooters like Radman and got 9 assists. If the team will double in the post, it helps that the guy posting up is an excellent passer, it makes people pay for doubling hence one of the reasons why Kwa-may Brown was a poor fit for the Lakers and well most other teams save for bodying up defense since he was a poor passer out of the post.

Suns chose to double with guys mostly from the perimeter and Pau passed out to open shooters. When they doubled with a PF or SF Pau made them pay from teammates who made dives toward the basket.

You don't need only 9 shot attempts to be a great player on the post, as long as the inside out game is firmly established heck, the offense will run smoothly.

-blitz

I know a lot of people are bitter because Michael Teniente has been an ambulance chaser for so long and seems to be a much bigger Kwame Brown fan than an actual Lakers fan.

This is all true, but...

We might want to try to be civil with the guy for a change. I mean, Michael T. has been an incinerary force for some time now, but for the most part he receives more insults than he throws out.

Michael T's a proud guy. We're not going to bring him back to reason any more quickly by insulting him all the time.

And his skepticism will not break our unity. Let Michael be Michael and we'll focus on how we're going to win the Championship this year.

What do we play for? RINGS!!!!

Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.

GO LAKERS!

Rick F -

I think the Lakers would gladly move Luke if someone would take his contract. Unfortunately, Isiah Thomas is no longer a GM, so I see Luke wearing Laker gold until 2013, when his contract runs up (no, I'm not joking).

About tonight's game...
The biggest key to tonight won't be stopping Billups or Melo or Nene. It's stopping the #1 Laker killer:

Linas Kleiza.

I know Kleiza's got game, but he seriously doesn't miss whenver we play the Nuggets. I'd like to see someone knock him down to take him out of his comfort zone for once.

The Nuggets are looking like a really strong team. They beat Boston in Boston and are 6-1 since getting Billups.
Once JR Smith gets back on track, they could be very, very good.

I'm looking at their lineup though and wondering who the heck is supposed to guard Pau? Nene will be on Bynum, and Kenyon Martin generally guards Kobe. Will they try JR Smith on Radman and Melo on Pau?? If so, Pau could have 40 tonight. If they put Martin on Pau and Smith or Dahntay Jones on Kobe, Kobe could have 40. Either way they play it, I see us having an advantage at either the 2 or the 4.

Interesting comments.

I posted it here for a reason. I went to the Lakers facebook page and saw a bunch of people but only a couple of people I recognize from here.

Rick Friedman. I went to his page and he said something interesting. He says on his page: "If you're rude when I see you, don't add me as a Facebook friend!"

I thought to myself: When people disagree on this blog they are very very rude.

Now I wonder what Rick would make of people's responses to my post. Tell me, Rick, are they rude?

I guess when people don't use their real names they can be anything they want to be...especially rude.

I thought the Lakers facebook is a good idea. It allows for developing strong friendships with people we've been blogging with for, like, 3 years now. I want to give it a shot but like, Rick, why would I want to be friends with people who are rude?

I know, I know people will say I'm the king of rude. But I'm only rude when people are being sarcastic or rude with me. I like to give what nameless people give. I character flaw, I know...but, if people are willing, we can start a new.

mike t.

I think Walton's reputation is well known around the league. The Lakers are stuck with him.

mike t.

GO LAKERS! Weird game, but I always get a nice visceral kick from beating those guys...

GO LAKERS!

Jon K

Everytime Vladi shoots I give a little "Like a Rainbow in the Dark" shout out as it goes swish!

Blitz

I am a huge fan of the inside/outside game and wish that we ran it more, my beef with the offensive ball movement is when our guards wait about 6 seconds before jacking up a shot 20 feet and out. Fish has fallen into this habit recently and Kobe has always been a "hmm, nobody looks open, must be time for me to shoot it". Whenever we throw it inot th post and it comes back out again, it makes the offence look good. Our rebounders are in place, our transition defence is ready, our post players are cutting and moving without the ball.

Pau should have had double digit shot attempts and 9 assists. Gasol should be a major focus on offence, more so than Fisher, Farmar, Ariza and Vujacic. They are one dimensioanl players that are trying to to create opportunities for themselves where none exists. Actually, I'd leave The Machine out of that equation, he's playing smart ball right now. When guys like Ariza and Fish and Farmar have equal to or more shot attempts than Gasol, it generally reflects a lack of iniatating the offence, which is why we brought Fish back and what Farmar should be striving to grasp if he wants to be the PG of the Future.

I agree that the offence runs smoothly when they double Gasol and he kicks it out, but against an inadequate defender like Amare (especially Amare because he is prone to fouling on defence) you have to give Gasol an opportunity to get him out of the game.

However, we won, so it's all good.

Eric,

>>>>>If it is physical, who knows. Let's just pray it's only mental.

I’m with you 100% on that one. We need the real Beast back, the sooner the better.

Tom

Every village needs a jester. Ours is MT. We should all be grateful and appreciative for what he brings to the blog.

I can't tell you how many times I've rolled on the floor laughing from some of his posts.

Laughter is a great thing people. I vote for the mad genius.

"We might want to try to be civil with the guy for a change. I mean, Michael T. has been an incinerary force for some time now, but for the most part he receives more insults than he throws out."

This is the first CIVILIZED discussion the man has had on this Blog since the days of the Jackson Journal when he was still a Lakers fan...and we were getting blown out of half the arenas in the NBA.

I've said this for years and I'll say it again: Anybody who roots for a team because of one guy is not a true fan. Don't believe me? IF Kobe had've been traded, half of this Blog would have left along with him.

Ya know I ain't lyin!

And that's my (and our) beef with Mike T. When it was obvious to everyone with two eyes that Kwame just didn't have the mojo to contribute to this team, Mike T. hurled insult after insult against everyone. When AB got the starting job, the insults got more fierce - right on down to his infamous gloating when AB got injured!

Kwame gets his final chance at redemption, layups get blown on a nightly basis and the insults keep rolling one. Finally Mitch gets on the phone, in comes Pau and we don't hear A SINGLE SOLITARY WORD FROM THE GREAT MICHAEL C. TENIENTE UNTIL AFTER GAME 6 OF THE FINALS.

Until today, the only time we've heard from him is when we lose games. When we lose, he celebrates. When we win, the crickets are a chirpin.

Frankly, it ain't the obsessive compulsive Kwame stalkerism that's got us up in arms. It's the arrogant and smug attitude he takes with ANYONE who disagrees with his opinion. He makes a point. Someone makes a counterpoint. That person is lcalled stupid, has a low basketball IQ, is not worth having an intelligent discussion with, and worse.

He may receive more than he dishes out, but we just throw rocks. He throws razor blades at folks. And that ain't right.


INSULT LADEN COUNTERPOINT FROM THE GREAT MIKE T IN

5

4

3

2


Mike T -

I think that was one of the most respectful posts of yours that I've read. You have a point about the value of size and post defense in an overall defensive scheme, but you seem to think Kwame is capable of sustained concentration and physical output.

He has demonstrated over and over again for his first two teams that he cannot do that. His mental lapses and hurried offensive moves always limit and offset his positive contributions, so it's only in a fantasy world that Kwame would have the kind of extended minutes production that you envision for him.

Yes, every once in awhile he has a "great" game. But can't you objectively see that they don't happen that often? Why would anyone be surprised that his first game back against the Lakers would be a good one for him? Let's see what happens the next time. I'm not saying I know what will happen, but an educated guess says that Jackson will have that one figured out pretty easily.

Our biggest problems with the Pistons are Wallace and Iverson, not Kwame.

RMA

"He may receive more than he dishes out, but we just throw rocks. He throws razor blades at folks. And that ain't right."

You want to have your cake and eat it, too. You want to throw rock and then try to make a rule of no throwing razor blades? Hey, have you ever thought of not throwing rocks and just maybe no razor blades will be coming your way.

Way can't you think of it that way?

Amazing how mindless so of these thoughts are.

mike t.

Tully Moxness -

"the Three A-holes and supporting cast in Boston"

LMAO!

RMA

utzworld,

I share your frustration and echo your sentiment, but isn't there a time when we should let bygones be bygones?

As Chaplain of Laker Nation, you know the Lord calls upon us to forgive.

Michael T. is who he is and while I find him to be frequently delusional and far too proud for his own good, he HAS been a part of the blogmunity almost since its inception and the present state of Laker Nation has been influenced (I believe ultimately in a positive way) by all the years of battles featuring (if not centered upon) Michael C. Teniente.

So, what would it hurt if we tried to be civil with him for a little while and see how responds because we know how he's going to respond if we continue to insult him.

What do we play for? RINGS!!!!

Lakers Today... Lakers Tomorrow... Lakers Forever.

GO LAKERS!

Looks like the Clips just traded Mobley and Thomas for Zach Randolph and Mardy Collins. Good move for Clips.

Yeah, we're called to forgive one another. We're also called not to cause divisions against each other, to maintain an attitude of humility and to do away with pride and arrogance.

Of course Mike knows this. He's a Believer just like me.

But, like most Believers, it's one thing to write up deep insightful thoughts on Scripture. It's ANOTHER THING to do what what Scripture says. Which would put his defense of throwing razor blades to combat other's rocks in direct violation of "Turn The Other Cheek," "Do Not Repay Evil for Evil," "Love Your Neighbor As You Love Yourself," etc...

But, then again, I'm just being MINDLESS, right?

But I do forgive Mike T. The same pity I (jokingly) had for Butler, I (seriously) have for him as well. Beneath all the insults, there's a deeper pain and hurt that he's hiding. He needs to make other feel smaller than he. Because, in his own mind, HE is the one who is really small.

I really will be praying for you, Bro.

Utz,

"When AB got the starting job, the insults got more fierce - right on down to his infamous gloating when AB got injured! "

You must be referring to his INFAMOUS statement that he used an ancient spirtiual technique to bring AB down. The rest of us just pictured him in some basement somewhere with a voodoo doll....

Utz... do you see what I mean?

You can't make this stuff up. It's CLASSIC.

I hear what you're saying, because frankly it's dead on, but hey, the guy is a total comedian....

And, I hate to admit it, but when he posts, everyone else does too... even if it does diminish the content of posts to some degree.

Live and Let Live bro. He has his Kwame, we have our Lakers... but I'll be darned, that MT makes me laugh even to this day thinking about some of the statements he's typed on here.

Amen.

PS... where in the world is STRANGER IN THE NIGHT?

FROM PALM BEACH, FL

BONSOIR GUYS,

I HAVE A BAD FEELING FOR THE GAME TONIGHT, I SAW DENVER IN MY DREAM COMING TO PLAY WITH THE LAKERS AFTER THE HOUSTON GAME. LAST TIME, THEY PLAYED AN EX-MEMBER OF DENVER, IVERSON: WE LOST

I AM VERY SICK WITH A HIGH FEVER AND MY ENERGY IS LOW FOR THE TEAM MEANING WE HAVE 50/50 FOR THE RESULT TONIGHT.

OUR TEAM MUST FOCUS 100% IF NOT WE CAN BE BURNT TONIGHT(9/2)

FANS AT STAPLE CENTER, PLEASE, GIVE OUR TEAM SOME ENERGY TONIGHT.


LOVE TO ALL


SHEKOBE


Wondering if I'm the only one who's been having this thought lately: Notice how few minutes Luke Walton is getting. Notice how all the NBA announcers and commentators are always talking Luke up. Notice how PJ frequently allows as how Luke would like more minutes.

I'm thinking the Lakers are trying to shop Luke. Prediction: Luke will be wearing a different uniform by the trading deadline.

Am I alone in this thinking?

Posted by: Rick Friedman | November 21, 2008 at 12:26 PM

==========================
I think the Lakers would like to trade Luke but are not actively shopping him. To shp him you have to showcase him and put him in games to show what he can do. Probably all teams know but the selling pitch would be he is healthy now.

I do think they are working the phones and if any interest is shown he will likely get more minutes.

Silence is golden! I am immensely enjoying this Butler free blog.

i am not in the roll call?
i am a laker. pure laker.

 

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