Handle the rock, Lamar
Phil Jackson has never been afraid to tinker in the preseason. Last year, he experimented with Kobe Bryant as a push pace facilitator in the pretend games, only to abandon the idea once the season started. This year, he's exploring his options with Lamar Odom. Rather than place him at the three -- which folks were expecting -- PJ has Odom running the point, initiating the offense and trying to take advantage of ball-handling abilities extremely unique for a player of his size. In this configuration, Derek Fisher moves to the two, Bryant to the three. How long it lasts is anyone's guess, but for now, as you'd expect, the results have been mixed.
Writes the LAT's Mike Bresnahan:
"...The concept, if it sticks, has its pros and cons.
Odom, 6 feet 10, could post up smaller point guards, though the team would lose some of his offensive rebounding if he stayed out on the perimeter.
Also, there would be a litany of switching on defense, with Odom picking up the opposing small forward, Bryant guarding the opponent's shooting guard and Fisher picking up the point guard..."
Given how fluid positional responsibilities can be in the triangle, there's nothing inherently wrong with the idea. It plays to many of LO's natural tendencies as a player, particularly in ball distribution. The biggest negative might be the time lost in camp should the experiment fail and Odom be pushed back to the three. That ginormous front court will need time to come together, though probably less than that required to do what they're doing now. Should it work, the Lakers will present a very unique set of matchup problems for the opposition.
In the end, the Lakers simply have too many potential combinations available to not take a few out for a test drive, and there's no time like the preseason to get it done. It's definitely something to watch as October passes.
BK
I've been saying it all along . . . Why not go back to the old days when we used to have a huge hulking 6'9'' point guard . . . .
Projected Starting Line-up
PG: Lamar
SG: Kobe
SF: Slovenia's Favorite Son
PF: Gasol
C: Bynum
Have Fish and his sage ways come off the bench for a spark. This gives the Lakers undefendable length. Kobe would be the shortest starter by a good 3 inches. It would also shore up any weaknesses by smaller quicker players because given the height, everyone can be able to switch, and lay back on D and funnel everything to the 7 footers. And if Sasha can space the floor with his 40% long range shooting, then there will be plenty of space to work on the inside and the outside . . .
Thoughts anyone?
Posted by: SA | October 02, 2008 at 01:43 AM
To all who think Lamar will make a good point guard
Don't know what Lamar you've been watching all these years but the one I've watched doesn't have any ball handling skills unless he goes coast to coast without any ball pressure.
PJ has tried this before and it's failed miserably.
Why he is wasting the Lakers time doing this again is anybodys guess.
What I have seen when Lamar has played the point ....
1. the ball gets stolen often
2. he can't dribble unless he looks at the ball (see #1)
3. he throws the ball away
4. the only way he can protect the ball is with his back to basket
Additionally, we will have to watch him make that stupid (I screwed up) smiley face even more times than before
Lamar will not all of sudden become even a good ball handler. Remember he spent his summer on the beach not dribbling but drinking and it shows. He looks soft and mushy.
Nine Rings is wasting some valuable time with this experiment. He should be focusing on reality.
If I am proven wrong... I will be the first to admit it, but I know I'm right.
Again let me repost the Lamar Odum Personal Anthem
"IF I ONLY HAD A BRAIN"
I COULD BE A BETTER BALLER
IF MY HEAD WAS ONLY SMALLER
IT JUST GETS IN THE WAY
I WOULD FLY THROUGH THE AIR WITH EASE
AND DUNK IT WITH AUTHORITY
IF I ONLY HAD A BRAIN
I COULD BE A BETTER SHOOTER
BUT I'D RATHER BE AT HOOTERS
DRINKING BEFORE A GAME
I WOULD MAKE ALL MY 3 POINT SHOTS
BUT HANGOVERS BLUR MY VISION LOTS
IF I ONLY HAD A BRAIN
THEY SAY I COULD BE MAGIC
BUT THAT WOULD BE JUST TRAGIC
TO DRIBBLE MY LIFE AWAY
SO I'LL TOKE AND TOKE THE CHRONIC
WHO CARES IF IT MAKES ME MORONIC
IT'S ONLY JUST A GAME
Posted by: Troll Man | October 02, 2008 at 01:53 AM
http://tinyurl.com/525syg
The Leadership of Derek Fisher.
-blitz
Posted by: thekobebryantblitz | October 02, 2008 at 02:56 AM
Just thinking of all the combinations hurts my head, but if Phil can get it to work man it would cause hell for opponents.
The dilemma other teams will face is that they will either have to go big sacrificing speed or go small allowing Lamar to post up after he brings the ball up.
Hopefully we get to see some of these potential lineups in action later in the pre-season
Posted by: Tej | October 02, 2008 at 03:37 AM
hmmm...it seems like a complex concept,Odom as a PG in offense can work,but can he really prove to be a true PG,i know he's a great facilitator for his size,but for the PG position? May be he's the best passing man after kobe. If thats true than its not a bad idea. In defense,so much switching is what seems complex to me and it sounds odd too,but lets see how the experiment turns out to be. We will be sound in the defense except i doubt d PG position,i mean quick and young guards. Inside is not a problem,pau and drew will prove to be nightmares for the opponent's inside scorers. This season is going to be about about so much coin-flips and lets see how much we win on our gambles.I bet even if one of em proves effective,no one stop the lakers dynasty.
aadi24
Posted by: aadi24 | October 02, 2008 at 04:51 AM
Good Morning Laker Fans!
LO needs to step it up this year. He was better about not playing so passively and then came the Finals where he all but disappeared. Sometimes change is the most effective vehicle for success. You get out of your comfort zone and are forced to rely on being open to do what you don't want to do. Hopefully LO will be open to doing whatever it takes to win. Can't help but think of Ginobli and the success he has had coming off the bench. If it works, do it Phil.
SO GLAD SEASON IS ALMOST HERE!!!!!!!!!!!
GO LAKERS!
Posted by: longtimelakerlover | October 02, 2008 at 05:15 AM
BTW Mamba,
Please put me on the +60 bandwagon, which I will continue to ride 'til I "just can't ride it no more"
I LOVE LA!
Posted by: longtimelakerlover | October 02, 2008 at 05:21 AM
They say a kiss makes everything better. I'm willing to do all that I can for that Sasha ankle lol.
Posted by: Faith | October 01, 2008 at 07:52 PM
OWW, OWW, Hey Faith I think I twisted my ankle too! LOL! One can dream.
Posted by: Mamba | October 02, 2008 at 06:43 AM
POST OF THE YEAR:
There won't be an 08 Western Conference championship banner to give away because we're the
Lakers and don't lower ourselves to the likes of those who celebrate conference titles.
I couldn't imagine what depths we'd have to sink to if we started putting up Division title banners like the Suns.
Posted by: Xodus | October 01, 2008 at 08:30 PM
KUDOS! KUDOS! OUT FREAKING STANDING!! I SHALL GET A TATOO OF THIS AND POST IT!!!!
Posted by: MAMBA | October 02, 2008 at 06:46 AM
*_________________________________*
• THE CHAMPIONSHIP PREDICTION*
• CHAMPIONSHIP SEASON BANDWAGON *
•________________________________*
(01) NAJJA aka BONUS – *** LIVE FROM IRAQ*** , And glad to be back in the fold.
Didnt think I would be able to chime, but technology is a beautiful thing. Basketball
is back, all is right with the world again. ***GOD PROTECT sub BANDWAGON***
(02) FATTY – We're going to ride that Purple and Gold bus down Figueroa
and not stop till we get to Disneyland 60 + WIN BANDWAGONNER
(03) JUSTANOTHERMAMBAFAN – I know I'm about excited as I can get without
blowing out blood vessels in my eyes!! FINALLY - Laker season has arrived!!!!
I'm rolling on the 60+ win bandwagon this year - I'm feelin it! 60 + WIN
(04) DEREK – don't forget about the 70+ win bandwagon. i'm driving
that bus. there are many open seats, bandwagon should be filled up by seasons end.
Ooh, OOH it’s almost filled up. I’ll order a double decker!!
(05) TOAD – WER’RE FAVORITES FOR A REASON
( (06) SAMLL – 60 + WIN The motto for this year should be NO COMPLACENCY
(07) JAMIE SWEET – 70 + WIN Cue the music: Ecstacy adicted clam!
That's fricking priceless!
(08) LONGTIMELAKERLOVER - We're gonna ride it till we just can't ride it no more
(09) HAPPY GILMORE – 34+ game win streak, 73+ win season & 2009 NBA Championship?
(10) LAKERGURL - My prayers for the good health of all especially the players till we get
the first of the coming championship trophies & the next one, & the next one & the next..........
(11) EDWIN GUECO – We have a sustaining force that will lead us to victory
(12) #4 - This year, the championship is ours for the taking; the Lakers WILL be ready to
snatch it from whomever the East brings (it won't be the Celtics this year!!!). The Machine
rolled his ankle? Replace it with a new one. C'mon, he's the Machine after all!!!
(13) JANAYA - My summer hibernation is over. I can't wait! Lets get this party started already!!
(14) PUDDLE - Great feeling about Drew this year. The boy is now a man & is hungry for a title.
(15) THEKOBEBRYANTBLITZ - "The real question is...........Do we have the right coach to put
The pieces together successfully?....That is a definite: YES!!!
(16) OTIS CAMPBELL - Where is the Bar? I'm going to be very thirsty this year.
Yes, I'm in - the bar will remain open all season long.
(17) FAITH - I'm encouraged about the desire to be better defensively. God knows we have
enough weapons to click offensively. But still, can't wait to see lol. They say a kiss makes
everything better. I'm willing to do all that I can for that Sasha ankle lol.
(18) BD - Phil you better be all over Lamar this year because if you can't win it this year
you will be gone just like Lamar.
(19) MRBARNEYDANGLES - I don't care where or when Odom plays as long as he
stays on the Lakers. Lamar = Laker for Life
(20) JG - Big year and years to come. I'm excited.
(21) JON K – 70 WIN BANDWAGGONER – To quote Trevor Ariza "I don't understand
how people are going to be able to stop us." RIGHT THE FRICK ON
(22) LALAKERLOVER - BYNUM IS DA BEAST !!! LO will have a great contract season !!
LAKERS 65-17 !!
(23) TSLICKK - damn...it looks like bynum is ready for war! let's do this!
(24) SID - Being 36 years old and being a Laker fan since age 10, I'll be moving
back to CA to watch my boys win this years NBA title.
(25) DICE8UPCUP - MAN...THIS IS PRETTY EXCITING TIMES FOR LA LAKERS....
(26) BYNUMITE - WOW! Bynumite will be a BEAST!!!
(27) KSDAX - Hey all we need to do is keep everything in front of us and stay focus.
(28) SBPIMP - I'm blowing the dust off the 65 win bandwagon from last season, revving
her up, putting the top down, and taking her for a spin down the Ventura Freeway
along the coast. Peace to all my brothers and sisters!
(29) FATSAM - 70 win bandwagon here, por favor. Kobe for his second MVP, and a
4-game sweep of the Celtics in the Finals.
(30) MOB WAGONEER - last month I started calling this season at 65 wins.
Mihm with a breakout year, which is as important as a VP debate. Okay, more
important than that, but you get my point. – YES SIR I DO!!!
(31) BUTLER - Hi I'm Butler! I'm in 3rd grade. I can count to 6. That's how
many more Dynasties the Lakers will have.
(32) MAMBA - THE FREAKIN LA LAKERS - WHERE DYNASTIES HAPPEN
(33) THE OUTLAW - 67 wins, More importantly, home court advantage throughout
the entire playoffs. I am nearly leaping out of my skin with anticipation.
(34) "PIG' MILLER - NO WAY NO HOW anyone keeps me off this Bandwagon.
6 Dynasties, 73 wins!
(35) SEAN714 - this training camp, someone’s going to “get” something – I call it
the “Aha!” moment when the hard work finally creates clarity – and I’ve got to shuffle the
deck to take full advantage whenever it occurs....."
(36) WESJOENIXON – The only explanation, is Laker Magic (pardon the pun). 68 wins!!
(37) LAKERTOM - Dynasties upon dynasties! I love it,
(38) ROCKY - I can't wait to see this team whoop some @SS.
(39)LAKER_STH - This year is the beginning. NOW IS THE TIME! LO plays extraordinary
for the Lakers and becomes an essential piece to the championship puzzle.
(40) TRUELAKER FAN - man i can't wait the season is finally almost here.
(41) JOHNNYP - This is very exciting stuff!! GOOOooOOO LAKERS!!!!
(42) XANDOPRO - -We are gonna use a MONSTER lineup to finish games.
Nobody on the floor for the Lakers will be less than 6'7".
this could be the deadliest in the NBA.
(43) TP - just ignore the trolls. they'll go away as we roll up 65 wins & another championship.
(44) FROZIE - Goooo Lakers! Go Lamar! Go Beast! LAMAR THE 6TH SENSE
(45) LAL FAN 65 WINS and who knows how many championships
(46) FRANKIE – The Suns setting is in the shadow of The Lakers rising! Go Go Go Lakers!!!!
(47) VMAN - Training camp report: there's not a thing worry about. If you're a Laker fan,
that has to make you uneasy.
(48) EDWIN GUECO - There are no more day dreaming of the era of the beast b/c we are now
in the jungle and the Beast rules!!
(49) HELLRAISER(: certified Mamba fan) - LET HELL BE RAISE LAKERS!!!!
THE FUTURE IS DECIDED!!!! 80-2 KOBE = MVP BYNUM = DOPY
LUKE = 6TH MAN OR MAYBE TREVOR ^^ ODOM – MIP
(50) BADFINGER - I, for one, am tired of all this yellow talk. When do the games start? I'm ready
for the Lakers New Dynasy to slap these pretentious fools down. The Title is ours for the taking.
Like Pig, I want to ride bandwaggons. Let's see, 65 wins, Figeroa Parade, Mamba MVP II, and
Beast MIP, that should do it.
(51) HTJ - How about a "Forget about the regular season, 16-0 in the Playoffs bandwagon?"
(52) CHARLES - I'm normally not one to be on Bandwagons unless it's "get well soon" or
"happy birthday" however."The Trees Tri-nasty is here!" Number (00) is possible...
(53) BAYWOOD – Back to basketball. IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE?
(54) BLAZE1BX - This is our year!!!
(55) JK - Big year and years to come. I'm excited.
(56) KAREEM4PREZ – Kobe is the greatest.
(57) CHUCK23 – Got an E-Ticket Gonna ride and ride and ride.
(58) HMRHED - Since I am the driver of the 4th Dynasty BW, it only makes sense that I
hitch a ride on the Championship Season Bandwagon –
(59) RICK FRIEDMAN - Please add me to the 60+ band wagon. Can't wait till next week
when we get to see how all this really works.
(60) KEIFOM – I AM IN - GO LAKE SHOW!! LIGHTS OUT!!
(61) THEW LAMAR SHOW - Its that time of the year again. Times to play in the
yearly YAHOO FANTASY BASKETBALL!!
(62) utzworld THE BANNER HOLDER - ...who is the NBA All Time Leading Scorer
has more NBA Championships than SHACK does. The night we play the Suns,
I've got a special prayer just for you, Butler. Watch for it1
P.S.: 62 wins. Playing it safe. After all..."Pride cometh before a fall..."
(63) JOHNNY LAKER - Lakers are team to beat. There is not a single team in the NBA
that can matcup to the quartet of Kobe-Pau-Odom-Bynum + the Bench Mob
Let's get that championship.....Woooooooooooooooo
(64) JMAN449 - We know you'd kill for one of those. Tell you what, after we get #15 next
June, you can have the 08 WC banner. The rafters in PHX must be freezing with nothing on them.
(65) XODUS - There won't be an 08 Western Conference championship banner to give
away because we're the Lakers and don't lower ourselves to the likes of those who
celebrate conference titles.
Posted by: MAMBA24 | October 02, 2008 at 06:51 AM
Truth be told, the Lakers are going to be able to put a gaggle of different combinations on the floor. I like that Phil is experimenting with Lamar at the point. That guy can rebound and gallop his way coast to coast for some quick buckets. As long as the Lakers are confident in their defensive switches and help defense, this experiment can't hurt. Really, the combination possibilities are staggering.
I'm off to J-Tree for a climbing trip... and when I return, it'll be time for the first pre-season unveiling of the tallest frontcourt in the NBA.
Have I mentioned that I cannot wait?
Go Lake Show!
Posted by: The Outlaw | October 02, 2008 at 06:58 AM
Go Scottie Lamar :-)
Posted by: BrownMamba24 | October 02, 2008 at 06:58 AM
AND SO IT BEGINS!
Posted by: SIVA | October 02, 2008 at 07:24 AM
Love the photo. LOVE the photo.
GO LAKERS!
Posted by: Jon K. | October 02, 2008 at 07:29 AM
Hahaha, great picture. I actually have a pair of those shoes Lamar has on (only 48 pairs made).
I like the idea of Lamar running the point. I've been saying he will be getting a lot of assists this year for a while now. He has always been a good passer, especially with targets like Kobe, Pau, and Drew. He will have a career high in assists this year, whether he plays the point or not.
His dribbling must need a lot of work though. With those assists at PG will come a lot of turnovers. I'm not sure how teams will guard LO at the PG position but I can see a few steals and some bad passes from LO coming.
This is a great if this is the worst problem the Lakers have this year. Eventually Lamar will find a spot and develop a rhythm and be a very valuable part of this team. It will be interesting to see how this develops throughout the season. The only problem is that we NEED home court this postseason so he can't experiment too much if its leading to losses.
Lamar = Laker for Life
GO LAKERS
Posted by: mrbarneydangles | October 02, 2008 at 07:41 AM
I like this move by Phil Jackson. It's common knowledge that Odom is an underrated, highly skilled and pass first player. Add to the mix, the fact that the triangle offense DOES NOT need a conventional point guard, and Odom might very well excel in this role. But like LAT's Mike Bresnahan stated: it has its pro's and con's because then on defense, there will be a lot more switching AND Odom is a natural rebounder so being on the perimeter will effect that part of his game.
Bottom line, I think it could work because we are talking about a group of very skilled and talented ball players. The most important part is knowing your opposition and utilizing the players to best match up against them.
GO LA!
This is our year!
Posted by: Blaze1Bx | October 02, 2008 at 07:48 AM
I really missed Phillip Jackson's snarkiness.
IT'S ON!
LET'S GO LAKERS!
LET'S GO!
LET'S GO LAKERS!
LET'S GO!
GO LAKERS!
Posted by: Jon K. | October 02, 2008 at 08:08 AM
Good morning Mamba24, Charles, Jon K and the rest of this fabulous Laker morning CRUE!!!!!!!!!!!
Back to debating where LO will shine the most...the 1? The 3 or 4? Personally I'm a huge homer of an LO fan and I believe this is his year. He's finally going to be in a position where the pressure will be off and he can do his thing. Trust me on this one - the SWISS ARMY KNIFE cometh.
GO LAKERS!
Posted by: justanothermambafan | October 02, 2008 at 08:12 AM
I think it's time for an All Tall Trees lineup.
Lamar Odom - PG
Pau Gasol - SG
Chris Mihm - SF
Andrew Bynum - PF
DJ Mbenga - C
It COULD work! Maybe!
GO LAKERS!
Posted by: Jon K. | October 02, 2008 at 08:13 AM
All Rise!
Have a great day fam!
Posted by: Charles | October 02, 2008 at 08:13 AM
To quote the eternal bard, Neil Peart:
"There is unrest in the forest,
There is trouble with the trees,
For the maples want more sunlight
And the oaks ignore their pleas.
The trouble with the maples,
(And they're quite convinced they're right)
They say the oaks are just too lofty
And they grab up all the light.
But the oaks can't help their feelings
If they like the way they're made.
And they wonder why the maples
Can't be happy in their shade.
There is trouble in the forest,
And the creatures all have fled,
As the maples scream "Oppression!"
And the oaks just shake their heads"
The Tall Trees Project has been initiated!
GO LAKERS!
Posted by: Jon K. | October 02, 2008 at 08:15 AM
Phil has a whipping boy in every camp.
Big shot Rob was his target in Phil's first year because he knew he'd have to rely on him for heavy minutes in a division of heavy power forwards. Looks like Andrew and LO got the bull's eye this year.
The entertainment factor alone of having Lamar play point is worth the experiment. Not too many points are going to influence an LO post entry pass... 'cept when they lay off him and dare him to shoot.
Posted by: Vman | October 02, 2008 at 08:26 AM
Mamba24,
Thanks, man. LOL
Posted by: Xodus | October 02, 2008 at 08:36 AM
Mamba24, thanks for throwing me in the bandwagon.
Despite what troll says, I like this move a lot. Whenever Pau got the ball down below, I worried about a steal. Perhaps he'll be better facing the basket. But I never worry about a steal with LO handling the ball (missing the layup due to not finishing strong - yes, but losing the ball - no).
As for those of you saying we're wasting valuable training camp time, you are wrong. First of all, these guys will get a solid pattern down even with two less days of practicing it. Secondly, if it works, the two day investment will have paid off in droves. Lastly, if this isn't normalized immediately, I can see PJ pulling it out as a secret weapon at times. Remember Mimh going in during the finals? PJ likes secret weapons.
GOOOoooOOOO LAaaAAAAAAKERS!!!!
Posted by: JohnnyP | October 02, 2008 at 08:38 AM
I think Phil understands that Lamar is not someone who you want to have handling your balls on a regular, full-time basis. But I think Phil also understands that Lamar is not going to move to the next level unless something (whatever that may be) is done to shake him out of the level he's grown comfortable with over the last couple of years...
Posted by: Guity | October 02, 2008 at 08:41 AM
Blitz,
In response to your post in the earlier thread.
Yes, LO put up a decent assist-to-turnover ratio, but we weren't playing well offensively and with no fluidity with him as the facilitator in 2005-06 for a variety of reasons, the most important of which being that no one outside of Kobe (and Luke) knew the offense. As a result, we ran the Kobe Bryant offense until the last 13-15 games of the season and things started clicking for us as we entered the playoffs, and we ended the season on something like an 11-3 run entering the playoffs.
I didn't say the poor offensive play was Lamar's fault, just that we struggled offensively with him as the facilitator in 2005-06 for reasons that won't be an issue for this upcoming season.
Secondly, I didn't say LO played badly on defense at the 3. We were actually pretty good defensively in 2005-06. What I was saying was that the two most important things for LO to do for us is be able to hit a corner three reasonably well and defend the 3. I didn't say whether he did this effectively or not in 2005-06 so the stats you posted have no relevance to what I was saying. I didn't say he wouldn't do well defensively, just that it will be important for him to do so.
You're a good blogger with a lot of insight, Blitz but you've got to stop nitpicking every post and trying to argue with EVERYONE. You're essentially arguing against statements that I didn't make.
Posted by: Xodus | October 02, 2008 at 08:47 AM
Blitz,
I have no intention of dancing with you in any way. :)
That being said:
You spent two weeks cramming Lamar's stats down my
throat while arguing that Lamar was the 2nd best SF on
the team outside of Kobe. I find it interesting that within
the first week, Phil has him at point instead of SF.
re: "it won't work". There's this saying: "Keep it simple
stupid". The paradigm of Lamar at pg and then switching
off to SF for defense is flawed. It is not simple. It opens up the
opportunity for missed defensive assignments long term.
Since quickness is *NOT* Lamar's strong suit and neither
is defense, putting him in a position where he has to
rely on quickness and defense seems flawed.
I would never tell you that Lamar is not a versatile big man.
I would tell you that Lamar is somewhat passive. From
a team design stand point, I would tell you that versatility
is not as high a priority as defense. I would tell you that
there are *NO* passive champions.
His desire *NOT* to play "Manu" for the Lakers is a 'little'
troubling to me. Yes, I understand wanting to start. On
the other hand, when it's couched in the terms of being
"Manu" I'd really expect him to relish the opportunity.
BTW, your quest for great matchups would best be
served if he was coming off the bench. Just my opinion
and you know what that's worth. :)
Posted by: hobbitmage | October 02, 2008 at 08:47 AM
Lam-Od a PG? AHAHAHA!!!
The lakers are starting to implode already!
Posted by: BUTLER | October 02, 2008 at 08:54 AM
Two things which Lam-Od lacks, and which every good PG should have in abundance: heart and smarts
Look at Nash...the best PG of all time...none are smarter, no laker has as many MVPs, and none are more effective.
Then look at Lam-Od...indecisive...timid...short circuited brain wiring...
This is great news for the league!
Posted by: BUTLER | October 02, 2008 at 08:57 AM
Lamar Odom - PG
Pau Gasol - SG
Chris Mihm - SF
Andrew Bynum - PF
DJ Mbenga - C
It COULD work! Maybe!
GO LAKERS!
Posted by: Jon K. | October 02, 2008 at 08:13 AM
It's ok to fantasize Jon. Some people are Larpers and I consider them people too...
Posted by: Charles | October 02, 2008 at 08:59 AM
A guy who after 10 years, still waiting for him to play to his potential.
A guy who disappears under the pressure of being the 2nd opt.
A guy who has a weak to NO outside shot.
A guy who can't or simply won't go right.
Seriously people,
>>But I think Phil also understands that Lamar is not going to move to the next level unless something (whatever that may be) is done to shake him out of the level he's grown comfortable with over the last couple of years<<
Posted by: Guity | October 02, 2008 at 08:41 AM
What the hey does this mean? This is a 10 year vet pro player we're talking about here.
After 10 short years, Phil still has to do something to get this guy to up his level, c,mon.
This is the guy you guys want running the point, the offense?
Posted by: Magia32 | October 02, 2008 at 09:06 AM
I will say this...
If there's one player on the current Lakers who could do what
Magic did in the 1980 finals - jump center and play all 5 positions
in the game - it would be Lamar.
Posted by: Long Time Laker Fan | October 02, 2008 at 09:16 AM
No way does Lamar become the starting PG for this team. His ball handling skills aren't good enough. Put Lamar in as point guard and you'll wind up having Kobe bring the ball up every time. I think Lamar's extra ball handling practice is just Phil seeing if Lamar can run the point forward for the second unit.
Wes
Posted by: wesjoenixon | October 02, 2008 at 09:18 AM
"Bynum also has a left hand waiting to be revealed this season, in addition to the long-awaited “skyhook.”"
I just got chills.
Posted by: "Pig" Miller | October 02, 2008 at 09:22 AM
The more I study Phil the more I am convinced that this guy is just grasping at straws.
WTF was he doing all summer? This is essentially the same personell from last year and NOW you want to experiment with L.O at the point??
This idea is about as silly as the one he did last year when he tried to make Kobe the facilitator of the offense. Why would you take a NATURAL scorer and make them facilitate the offense?? That whole concept is crazy.
Moving L.O to the point would negate his best asset (rebounding) and expose his worst (decision making)
The only way Lamar can be effective with this unit is by spacing the floor and the only way he can do that is by improving his shot up to 20ft and becoming a real threat from that range.............IT IS SIMPLE BASKETBALL!
That's all Lamar should have been working on this summer......a lot of defensive slide drills and increasing his range on the perimeter.......THAT'S IT! If he hasn't done that then Radmanovich will have more value because at least he can shoot the ball on offense and spread the floor for Gasol and Bynum.
If Lamar hasn't improved in these areas then he should be traded before the deadline for someone that is defensive, athletic, physical and can check the 2 and 3 to relieve Kobe of those duties...............oh wait a minute.....that sounds like Ron Artest
But Phil complicates and makes the simple complicated to try and justify his $12million salary.
Posted by: pfunk36 | October 02, 2008 at 09:22 AM
I like the look on kreem's face in that photo - like, "don't touch me, you underachieving millionaire!"
Posted by: BUTLER | October 02, 2008 at 09:30 AM
At the stage of his career, I think Lamar should heed from Magic Johnson's outlook. It is not me but it is the team. Magic played point, center and forward if need be. Hone skills where weaknesses exist by increasing percentage in shooting mid range jump shots, perimeter set shots, stepping on the brakes on quick layups to prevent forcing throughs or traveling, FREE THROWS. Lamar can do all of these by adjusting his mindset of performing varied roles. A veteran should not be asking Why? on changes but should have the attitude of Why not?
When translated on his contract negotiations, he just explanded his skills not merely typecasted as PF but also a tall and a good PG as well. He was not effective during Smush/Kwame time but his teammates today can deliver his feeds and blend with his repertoire. As a 6th man, he found a safe role that the Laker needs. If the Lakers cut him at the end of the season b/c of luxury caps, how many teams other than the Lakers need a tall PG? However, I still believe Lamar can help the Lakers more by energizing the 2nd unit, we need an enforcer and facilitator when Kobe, Pau and Socks are resting. There is nothing wrong for being a 6th man like Manu Ginobli, Michael Cooper, Robert Horry and last year, James Posey.
Posted by: Edwin Gueco | October 02, 2008 at 09:37 AM
Blitz,
As the fount of all things Odom:
http://tinyurl.com/47gr3x
Odom would have to show an improved aptitude for organizing the triangle offense, though, as he has shown limitations there when playing a guard spot in the 2005-06 and 2006-07 seasons and late last season. Triangle inventor Tex Winter has often scoffed at the idea that Odom is comparable to Scottie Pippen, who played guard in Chicago’s triangle while Michael Jordan roamed the wing.
How do you respond to Tex scoffing at Lamar? Thoughts
on his pg prowess?
Lamar said: Odom said he is looking forward to less of a scoring responsibility this season and more of a distributing one: “I’m going to be able to control the game taking eight shots — getting 12 rebounds and eight assists and scoring 10 points a game.
Do you believe he's right?
re: Lamar's characteristics:
http://tinyurl.com/4eov6a
Lamar said: “I had to relax, you know. I had to let that [knee] tendinitis calm down and just take some time off. I feel good.
&&
“Sometimes, with that tendinitis, the best thing to do is absolutely nothing. Just lay on the beach with some good company and a Corona, if that’s your preference, whatever. Just kind of just chill out, take it easy and kind of build back up from the beginning.
Your thoughts? I ask, because I know Kobe's response
would have been very different.
finally,
http://tinyurl.com/4sqjvd
*I* have some very clear thoughts on this, but I don't know
what the "place where dead people go" I'm talking about..
Feel free to wax poetic and enlighten me
Posted by: hobbitmage | October 02, 2008 at 09:39 AM
a 6'10" pg with two 7' options inside, dfish or sasha outside and kobe anywhere... short of lamar pitching the ball into the stands every trip down, even he couldn't mess this up.
it's not a question of if itll work, it's if it'll work better than the myriad other ways we can dominate.
Posted by: db | October 02, 2008 at 09:41 AM
Mamba24,
I'm all in for the Championship Bandwagon. Forthwith!
--Fearless
Posted by: Fearless | October 02, 2008 at 09:44 AM
Hi Laker Ladies and Gentleman,
Today we'll be talking about the Lakers as dinosaurs (Robin Williams, Mrs. Doubtfire).
It's A Lakersaurus Line!
And please welcome... the king!
It's a dinner show. Hi! Where you from?
I'm gonna make you a champion.
Thank you very much. Thank you! All right!
Ladies and gentlemen,
put your balls together!
Please welcome... Lamar Pointgaurdasaurus!
"I eat wood.... It tastes good.. No meat, big feet
I eat wood
Oh, I got to help myself!
Can't go on! I'm goin' extinct!
Oh, thank you, James. But right now...
it's time for the Raptor Rap!
I'm a raptor, doin' what I can
Gonna eat everything
till the appearance of man
Yo, yo, see me, I'm livin' belowthe soil
I'll be back but I'm comin' as oil
THE CELTICS ARE GOIN DOWN!!!
GO LAKERS
Posted by: Robin Williams - Huge Lakerfan | October 02, 2008 at 09:46 AM
Jon K,
Before Mbenga becomes a legitimate Center on the 2nd team and bypass Mihm, he should enter a rigid training with Kareem and Kurt on how his height, body frame can be fully utilized. He should also run in the track everyday and achieve a goal of 13 seconds in 100 meter dash, the world record is 9.69 established by Usain in the previous Olympics. I saw Andrew Bynum the first time he played at the Summer Pro League with Ronnie Turriaf and Smush. Ronnie and Smush were better players than Drew at that time. Hardwork and understanding the position from the masters changed his game persona.
Posted by: Edwin Gueco | October 02, 2008 at 09:47 AM
This sense of urgency that alot of naysayers and trolls have for the lakers makes it seem like its the month of May.
Let's face it, the Lakers have the least amount of questions going into camp. The fact that the coaching staff doesn't know where to place LO is because of the overabundance of talent as opposed to a talent deficit.
They'll figure it out in training camp and in the preseason. Needless to say, the problem may solve itself, as all of Lamar's angst might not be from just whether he starts or not, but also from whether he is going to be traded or not.
In anycase, count our blessings and count our forthcoming Laker championships.
Posted by: #4 | October 02, 2008 at 09:50 AM
Jon K.
the tallest lineup the NBA has ever seen better watch out for that this season
THE FUTURE HAS BEEN DECIDED!!!
KOBE = MVP
BYNUM = DOPY
LUUUKE OR ARIZA = 6TH MAN OF THE YEAR
ODOM = MIP
LET HELL BE RAISE LAKERS!!!!
GO LAKERS!!! ( Jon K. Style)
Posted by: hellraiser(certified mamba fan) | October 02, 2008 at 09:52 AM
Jon K,
That was a nice quote "unrest in the forest". Maybe they can hear the footsteps of the beast or the keeping up with the optimism of LakerTom. If the maples are troubled due to lack of sunlight, it is about time to grow and follow the sun.
I wonder how are the other Laker newest imports progressing at the practice like: Mitchell, Powell, Crawford, Heath and Giles. Not all them will become a maple but at least we can assess if they are capable of blooming.
Posted by: Edwin Gueco | October 02, 2008 at 09:59 AM
I'm not sure I understand the deep-felt animosity toward Lamar. Is it his happy-go-lucky facial expression? He creates fits for the opposition, and his post-up defense is underrated. He's solid on offense, and occasionally brilliant. He hustles, he's got heart, and leaves everything on the court ... He's Ronny, with more game. This is a guy we want on the floor, not the trading block.
Posted by: Marty | October 02, 2008 at 10:03 AM
Mamba, dude, I need onto the Championship bandwgon. Do we have an 80-win bandwagon yet? I'll drive that sucker, with Tom riding shotgun I'm sure.
Hope everyone had a great summer. Now it's (the first of) our year(s).
And I like Odom initiating. His most successful moments last year had him on the perimeter, driving and creating. As long as he doesn't get complacent and stay away from the boards (and fall back in love with the three) he should be fine. Why not use camp to get him used to playing the guard spots in the triangle?
Posted by: Jesterguru | October 02, 2008 at 10:06 AM
i think its worth exploring...thats what preseason is all about. and the triangle doesnt need a pure point guard, its always been a two backcourt system, most of the time the point guard passes the ball as soon as he crosses half-court to start the strong-side triangle.
what really worries me about lamar going to point is in the defensive side. lamar is good but he's no pippen. scottie proved he can do both, i dont think lamar can guard the pg today. even if they plan to switch, there's still going to be a lot of instances that he's going to have to guard the opposing pg.
Posted by: lent08 | October 02, 2008 at 10:06 AM
#4 sez:
"Let's face it, the Lakers have the least amount of questions going into camp."
Except for bynumb's knee, the on-court chemistry, who will be playing PG, Lam-Od's future with the team, the tired legs of 30-yr-old bryant and his torn finger...yeah.
I guess there aren't any questions at all!
How about this one - will the lakers melt like hot cheese every time they face a great defensive team like the celtics or SUNS?
Posted by: BUTLER | October 02, 2008 at 10:09 AM
#4-
I don't necessarily see it as them not knowing what to do with LO, but exploring different options to see what else is available. Like you say, they have so few big questions to answer that they can afford to try new things. And it's important to remember that even if LO doesn't end up playing the point all season- I suspect he won't- that doesn't mean there won't be some potential benefits down the road. Perhaps they come back to this at different times to exploit different matchups throughout the year.
It's about options. Not every idea is going to be good, but the preseason and even the early few games are good times to tinker around. Ideas lead to other ideas, and can have residual benefits, even if they don't become dogma.
Regarding the LO as sixth man thing, I think some of what people are saying misses the point. When people talk about him being a super sub like Ginobili, they sometimes forget that Manu's a guy who plays 30 minutes a night, in the fourth quarter, in important minutes, etc. Fundamentally, the question is whether or not LO, Gasol, and Bynum can play together. I think it'll be fine, but while playing LO off the bench might change the rotation early, at the end if he's a Ginobili like super sixth man- essentially a bench player with near starter's minutes- he'll be on the floor with starters in the second half. Thus, the need for those guys to play together.
Otherwise, if he's truly a guy to "energize the second unit," he becomes a 20 minute a night player, perhaps less, running with the subs. That to me is a waste of his talents.
As it is today, I see the current "LO as sixth man" thing, whether he'll accept it or not, etc. to be putting the cart ahead of the horse, and something of an early training camp media story for a team without much else to talk about. PJ already said they'll only go that direction if what they want to do with him as a starter doesn't work. Cross that bridge when they get there.
BK
Posted by: Brian Kamenetzky | October 02, 2008 at 10:11 AM