I've got to go with Kobe on this one
The whole "Redeem Team" tag? Pretty, as Bryant put it, "cheesy" (unlike the notion of patriotism, which Bryant finds anything but cheesy). Look, I get it. There's a mission to be fulfilled, a bronze in 2004 was humiliating, America wants to own basketball again, yada, yada, yada. But at the same time, like Bryant says, more than a little cheesy. Just curious if the general blogosphere agrees or disagrees with the Mamba/AK take. If you concur, any thoughts on what would be a better nickname?
Personally, I'm thinking the "It's Amazing What Can Happen When a Roster Is Assembled in Haste-Free/Marbury-Free Fashion, Actually Practices Together for More Than a Few Days Before the Games, and Coach K Doesn't Inexplicably Deny PT to Kobe the Way Larry Brown Did With LeBron, Wade and Melo Team."
But that may not roll off the average fan's/marketing guy's tongue.
Also, curious about what y'all thought about Paul Pierce's clarification offered while on ESPN's Mike and Mike in the Morning Show (which begin around the nineteen minute mark)" As far as Pierce is concerned, this was purely about mustering the confidence needed while on the floor (and
frankly, he was a little tired of discussing Kobe 24/7), as opposed
to dissing #24. For what it's worth, Pierce presents himself as more of a fan than rival of Kobe. They never talk trash while playing (as opposed to Ray Allen, whom Pierce acknowledges has "something going" with Bryant). "I love Kobe," praised Pierce. "I watch him all the time when I'm not playing against him." He also considers Kobe one of top-25 all-time best, even without the seven or so years' worth of accomplishments still to come. Of course, many Kobe fans will automatically take Pierce as
not naming Kobe the all-time best as a "diss" in and of itself, so who
knows? At any rate, I was looking to get a cross-section opinion of Pierce's follow up? Are you now satisfied? Still pissed off?
Or were you like me and couldn't care less if Pierce believes he's better than Kobe (and I'm not really sure he truly believes it as much as he needs to believe it), since the sentiment ultimately means nothing? Yes, I can see where a Laker?Kobe fan could initially be offended, but all emotions aside, does it really matter? Pierce still offers Kobe plenty of respect (and thank heavens, since I'd hate to see Kobe fall short on what's become the most overblown measuring stick in sports, the "respect-o-meter"). And even he's if overrating himself a touch, it doesn't change the fact that a) Pierce remains an inarguably terrific player and b) Kobe is better and more accomplished, which just about anyone not named "Paul Pierce" (or "LGC") or living outside the Boston area wouldn't argue.
Did Pierce have a better Finals series than Kobe? Yeah, I think that's fair to say. But one series doesn't change any rational person's outlook when it comes to a season or body of work. Pierce undoubtedly took an already great career to another level with his role in 2008's title. But it's still a level or two below where Kobe sat to begin with, so it's all relative. And in the end, all pretty small potatoes, when you really think about it.
AK
"Come on, face it! The Lakers will never win it all playing the way they do and that's with or without Bynum."
The Lakers won't win it all if they had Kwa-may, thank goodness we didn't sign him.
And the Pistons won't win it all playing the way they do, and that's with Kwa-may.
Posted by: thekobebyrantblitz | August 18, 2008 at 07:51 PM
All this denial about the Lakers basketball philosophy.
This is what Kobe has to say on the matter:
"As Kobe Bryant said after that embarrassing game six blowout, LA can't win the title by focusing on offense. The Lakers have to focus on defense and rebounding, or they won't even make it this far next year."
That's KOBE! Unless the Lakers change philosophies...they won't get out of the WCF. If you don't believe me, just read Kobe.
mike t.
Posted by: Michael C. Teniente | August 18, 2008 at 08:19 PM
AK -
I absolutely ABHOR the name "Redeem Team". it's WAY too dumb. If it were all about patriotism, it should just simply be "The U.S. Men's Basketball team". They should be (or aspire to be) more like their female counterparts in this year's olympics.
Pierce said this to himself, and didn't really believe it? No biggie. If we only knew what a number of people thought to themselves to turn their intentions into action. I don't really think it's that big of a news item.
I think we should talk about how some members of the USA basketball team are showing up for the events of other athletes. Now THAT'S cool.
Posted by: Caliphilosopher | August 18, 2008 at 08:20 PM
What's wrong with cheesy?
Posted by: Rick Friedman | August 18, 2008 at 08:45 PM
Michael C. Teniente,
"NO WAY THE WIN IT ALL NEXT SEASON.
They're not even getting out of the Western Conference."
EVERYONE! EVERYONE IN LAKER NATION! I WANT YOU TO SEE THIS PREDICTION! EVERYONE!
SEE THIS PREDICTION! REMEMBER IT! REMEMBER WHO SPOKE IT!
REMEMBER IT!
As God is my witness, we are winning the Championship next year. Period.
GO LAKERS!
Posted by: Jon K. | August 18, 2008 at 09:05 PM
Caliphilosopher,
Brother, I like the name "Redeem Team". Yes! It is cheesy, but as Rick Friedman says, "What's wrong with cheesy?" It's good sometimes.
Give me a better name.
Perhaps "Kobe's Team that Reverses LeBronze's Inability to Lead Any Team to Championship"?
GO LAKERS!
Posted by: Jon K. | August 18, 2008 at 09:11 PM
Rick F,
It's cheesy.
Posted by: Faith | August 18, 2008 at 09:14 PM
Okay, on a scale of 1-10 of thinking things are cheesy and BS, I'm about an 8.5.
That said, I don't think Redeem Team is a cheesy name.
Basketball is our sport. We have the best league and best players. I don't like anything tarnishing that and our performances in 2002, 04, and 06 were a disgrace to that rich heritage.
While Redeem Team does have the forced branding/marketing feel, I feel like it's very appropriate in this case. There's a clear message. We didn't do good enough and now we intend to do better. If the team must have a nickname, this one is absolutely perfect.
Kobe may think Redeem Team is a cheesy title. I don't. I very much doubt Lebronze, Wade, and Melo think so either. It's less for Kobe to say than them. They experienced all those embarrassing losses.
As far as I'm concerned, this team owes us a Gold Medal.
As for PP, he's been an underachieving lazy cheesehead (I mean c'mon, gang signs? grow up dude) his whole career, but he's also a hell of a basketball player that earned a Finals MVP. I think it went to his head and he lost perspective saying he's the best. Obviously, his more recent interview is damage control because everything thinks he's full of himself. I think when he thinks about it instead of being high on himself, he needs to send a little more love Kobe's way. I believe him when he says he and Kobe get along on the court and that he's a fan.
But really, the only thing I care about with PP is that we find someone anyone that can seriously slow him down if we meet him next NBA Finals. The rest falls into the "don't really give a damn" category.
Posted by: Benjamin | August 18, 2008 at 09:26 PM
Dunno man, "redemption" seems to be the whole theme of this years Team USA, so I think it's pretty appropriate.
Posted by: Justin N. | August 18, 2008 at 09:27 PM
All this wringing of hands concerning Gasol. What does Mike T want us to do? Trade Gasol and move Odom back to PF? Trade both Gasol and Odom? What?
It's fairly easy to sit there all day and pick at someone. You could pick at Dwight Howard and attack his underdeveloped inside game or his lack of improvement on defense. To what end? Do you think Orlando is going to dump him on waivers? What's the point of posting that Gasol is "soft" every hour, on the hour?
Is there a point? Seriously... is there a point? Any point? What IS that point? Should we release Gasol before the season starts? LOL! Wacky...
Posted by: Lord Cassius Kwaminus Longinus, Earl of the Quick Foul, Viscount of the Sore Calves | August 18, 2008 at 09:30 PM
Lets see: Kobe says the Lakers can't focus on offense and expect to win.
The Kobe FLATTENS Gasol in the Olympics to send a message that with the Gasol's Spain was soft.
Those are Kobe's words and actions.
But the Lakers will score 120 pts next season. Just ignore what Kobe said. We know better than Kobe.
mike t.
Posted by: Michael C. Teniente | August 18, 2008 at 09:33 PM
Hobbit
Defensive philosophy doesn't mean getting a scrub center. Nor does it mean getting a high volume shooter like Artest though I agree he is a better personal defender than Lamar. Ariza is a decent but not great defender. Defensive philosophy comes first from the coach. Some prefer tough man to man defense some prefer zone.
Like I said, the defensive philosophy comes of the Lakers from NOT TURNING THE BALL OVER. It seems Mr. Small hands Soft Marshmallow Scrub just loved to turn the ball over quite a bit.
And against the Spurs one of the top defensive teams? Let's try some numbers. The Lakers DEFENSE held the Spurs to 88.4 ppg but still managed to score 93.4. Until Game 6 when the Lakers committed 19 turnovers which led to easy fast break points for the Celtics (the weakness of the triangle offense's defense), the Lakers made the Celtics score an average of 94.2 which is more than 7 points below the season average of what the Lakers gave up supposedly (it is decieving considering we BLEW OUT some out opponents and the garbage time minutes made the number go a bit high).
Why didn't we score more points? The Celtics own defense plus our bench. Who did we have more than Jordan Farmar and Sasha as viable scoring options off the bench? Don't say Ronny, he faded out. Luke? Luke is a better passer and runs the offense, not someone who is a primary scorer. Mihm? How can he score when he got another ankle surgery plus out of shape? And don't think about either Mbenga or Ira. Our bench was overrated during the playoffs because of Sasha's production. No one save for Sasha did good off the bench in the playoffs. Radman kept being put into foul trouble and he is a bench player or at best a sixth man. We had success very early in the season due to a strong bench but a combined factor of injuries plus our youth made our bench fade away and I noticed it in the playoffs especially against the Jazz. The Celitcs had Sam Cassell (he did start for the Clippers!), PJ Brown, Leon Powe, Eddie House, plus James Posey who could be dependent to score off the bench. Because of the lack of production from our bench in the playoffs and especially the Finals, the starters played more and when they were cold, no one else could be dependent to give them energy.
This season while our defense and starting lineup will be better, our bench will have the scoring option and some defense it lacked during the playoffs.
Defense and the bench! No soft marshmallow scrubs need to apply.
Posted by: thekobebyrantblitz | August 18, 2008 at 09:40 PM
Thekobebyrantblitz..................Fantastic post...well done ..
Great breakdown..cheers
Posted by: Thirty2 | August 18, 2008 at 10:13 PM
"Is there a point? Seriously... is there a point? Any point? What IS that point? Should we release Gasol before the season starts?"
What it means is that the Lakers aren't going to win a Championship and Kobe will probably walk after this season.
But you're right, there really isn't a point because there's nothing the Lakers can do about it.
I just wanted to rub it in how Gasol is just too soft for the Lakers to win it all.
Not going to happen.
mike t.
Posted by: Michael C. Teniente | August 18, 2008 at 10:21 PM
Speaking of redemption...
I think the USA track team needs a little bit of that.
Posted by: Faith | August 18, 2008 at 10:22 PM
Pig,
Thanks for the response from the Spanish photo thread.
Posted by: Charles | August 18, 2008 at 10:36 PM
thekobebryantblitz,
glad you're enjoying the discussion. so am I.
you wrote: Ariza I admit does have a bit more quickness than Lamar but Lamar this season has gotten more quickness and is working more on it this off season.
my response. I question how much you can work on
quickness. Quickness is a combination of fast twitch
muscle response and the quality of the muscle. I have a
hard time believing that the NBA is doing drills which don't
train fast twitch muscle fibers and i have to believe that
his muscle quality is already off the chart. So *I* don't
think he'll get significantly quicker. If that were so we'd
see Luke filling in for lightning during thunderstorms.
You also wrote this: Power as in your first step when you try to run.
No. You've gotten it wrong. Not completely but mostly.
a def. of power is: Strength or force exerted or capable of being exerted; might. strength is not necessary for
quickness because you're not moving a lot of weight.
This is purely a contraction of muscle fibers to move ~ 50
lbs of weight. [ the weight of a limb + change for shifting
the center of gravity. ] there are a ton of people out there
who can squat enormous amounts of weight, but they're
slower than a glacier at 10 below zero.
you wrote: It's what Lebron has in his body.
Lebron and Odom are about the same weight. LeBron is
significantly quicker. It's the fast twitch muscle fibers.
you also wrote: Amare was not as strong against a Duncan post up (nice trade but got exposed by Hack a Shaq).
I disagree. Shaq is actually more skilled at playing the low
post. Amare is *plenty* strong enough against the
Duncan post up. He's not skilled enough. Consider that
KG doesn't have much of a problem with Duncan and
he's more slender than Amare.
you wrote: Lamar against shooting guards and small forwards has more strength which he can post up his man easier.
my response. youi're looking at offense. I'm looking at
defense. His first step is slow compared to SG and quick
SF's. By the time he moves, they have position and if he
touches them, it's a foul.
you wrote: I disagree with that. In December before Bynum's injury and Pau's arrival Lamar averaged 15.4 ppg 10.6 rpg, and 3 apg on 48.9% FG, very similar numbers to what Lamar averaged with Pau.
my response. Let's agree to disagree. A quick search of
box scores against the Celtics shows an avg. 9. If Lamar
avg'd 15 & 10 phil would never have clowned him. Also,
Lamar never got 20 rebounds back to back until Pau
showed up.
you also wrote: I disagree to a point. Kobe was a scoring option during 2005-2006 because there was no one in the inside to score. His assists were less than 4.5 that year. Lamar was the ball handler that year and averaged 5.5 assists. Not to diss Kobe though, without him he wouldn't have made the playoffs.
my response. Let's agree to disagree. Perhaps you
should do a search for quotes from Brian Shaw and Phil
Jackson. Phil told him to carry the team. Chris Mihm was
the starting C and was good to mediocre. He got hurt
and Kwame stepped in. The team's offensive philosophy
changed once they hit the playoffs. Instead of Kobe
shooting so much, they passed. That's how they went up
3-1 over phx before crumbling.
you also wrote: If playing through an injured shoulder and knee and yet averaged 19.4 ppg, 13.0 rpg, 2.0 apg on 48.2% FG in the playoffs (2007 playoff season vs Phoenix Suns) isn't what a warrior would do then I don't know what a warrior is
my response: he averaged those numbers against a team
that didn't know how to SPELL "defense" let alone play
defense. They had no true Center and Amare was
coming off of microfracture knee surgery wasn't he?
7 seconds or less, remember? It is not that he
is not tough. It is that he does not have a killer instinct. He
is actually a *NICE* guy.
you wrote: Artest averaged more points at 20.5 ppg but at a lower 45.2% shooting. Meaning Artest had his "warrior" ways but shoot way more shots at an not so good rate compared to Lamar.
my response: to do a true comparison you'd need to see
Artest on a good team. The Kings weren't.
you wrote: LOL! Walton is 28, Lamar is 28 atm and will turn 29 this year. Radman is 28 as well. The only Small Forward that is young is no doubt Ariza and he is 25 and Lamar only has 4 years ahead of Ariza!
I'm probably not saying this clearly. Lamar has been in the
league for 9 years and has not shown the propensity to
work on aspects of his game and keep improving as
compared to Kobe. Lamar is *NOT* going to significantly
change is game nor is he going to significantly get better.
Ariza has not had the chance to develop his game. He is
not set in his ways yet. Hence, more upside. [ my
personal opinion. ]
you wrote: If you say that Ariza has more lateral quickness then you no choice but to agree that Odom is a better rebounder, attacking the rim, blocks more shots, has a better jumper
Yes, Odom is a better rebounder. yes, the PF does have
more blocked shots than the SF does. He plays closer
to the basket. A quick search on espn shows that the
best shot blockers are C's and PF's. Yes Odom did have
a better jumper last year. He's also had more playing time.
Actually, I prefer what I saw of Ariza going to the rim
before the injury than Lamar going to the rim pre-Pau.
you wrote: can bring the ball up the court like a point guard, and career wise shot better than Trevor at the 3 point line
my response: As I posted before, the overwhelming
reasons for Lamar at the SF, as posted on this blog,
are offensive in nature. Defense wins championships.
My desire for Ariza at the 3 are purely defensive.
My disdain for Lamar at the 2 or 3 are due to his lack
of killer instinct, wishy-washyness, and a lack of
commitment to defense. i.e. he isn't *known* for it
whereas Ariza was brought in for his defense.
you wrote: Very good pick too. Ariza was drafted in the middle of the 2nd round. Solid pick. Ariza has been in the league 5 1/2 years already (1/2 because of his foot injury). This will be his 6th or 7th year and still has to prove he is a competent starter. Lamar has proven he is a very good player and we shall see how he does at the 3 or even the 2.
The point that I was trying to make is that Ariza has a
defensive mentality and has been stuck in obscurity.
Lamar does not have the proper mindset to play hard
defense day in and day out. He has not been consistent.
That is not his emotional makeup. I would like to see
Ariza get a run at SF before switching to a slower
individual who is playing out of his natural position.
you wrote: Sasha is a good shooter and much better than Lamar at shooting threes but averaged only 45% on shooting. His defense is solid but still suited more against bench guys but in 2 or 3 years will be very solid.
We disagree. Sasha has shown more heart and more
improvement over 3 years than Lamar has in terms of
defense. Sasha is also quicker. Sasha is also hungrier
to win. His quote about wanting to be the best shooter
in the NBA perfectly details the attitude I'm talking about.
He is "DRIVEN". Lamar is not. Sasha is a gym rat and
Lamar is getting into music production. [ "fertile ground"
I believe. ]
you wrote: Lamar is a solid all around player. At the 3 that really is a good thing since the Lakers now have 3 players who can actually bring the ball up the court. Ariza may have better lateral quickness than Lamar but he isn't as bulky as Lamar
You're focusing on offense again. Defense wins
championships! I prefer to have the best defender
at every position possible. Ariza will be a better defender
at the 3. Kobe will be a better defender at the 2. Fisher
will be a better defender at PG. Lamar is a PF and playing
him out of position is asking for trouble. Versatility for
the sake of versatility is not a good thing. If Lamar had
the attributes and hunger of Lebron I wouldn't be having
this conversation with you.
you wrote: Lamar is at the moment the best choice to start until Ariza develops more.
I disagree. You have not verified that Lamar can increase
his lateral quickness. You have not verified that he will
become a better defender. You have reduced his
rebounds by moving him to a position which forces him
away from the basket where he has played for the last
3 years at least. By moving him to a starter you've taken
him away as an outstanding 6th man. I personally like
a bench mob which has Lamar at PF, Farmar at PG &
Sasha at SG. That team would run very nicely. Very
uptempo.
you wrote: . At the 3 that really is a good thing since the Lakers now have 3 players who can actually bring the ball up the court.
my response: How many people *NEED* to be able to
bring the ball up the court? If it's a fast break, Fish or Kobe
If it's half court, Fish or Kobe. Why do you need Lamar
to bring the ball up the court? How often do you need
Lamar to bring the ball up the court? Let's keep the
"main things" the "main things". Our problem was not
our offense. It was our defense. Defense wins
championships. We need to increase our commitment to
defense. lamar does not have the mentality to commit to
defense. That's not his emotional makeup.
you wrote this: Lamar knows the offense more than Ariza as well.
That was certainly true last year. I don't know that this
is true this year. At one point our bench was averaging
30 - 40 pts. per game, as I recall. The lack of production
against the Celtics hurt us. Lamar with the Bench Mob
should give us one of if not the best bench in the league.
I read your points. As I mentioned earlier. The mentality on
this blog *seems* to be one that favors offense over
defense. Watching the public humilation of the Lakers
has re-affirmed the age old adage: Defense wins
championships!
Posted by: hobbitmage | August 18, 2008 at 10:51 PM
Oh my god Mike T., will you just please just STFU? Dude, when are you going to get it? We made it to the finals a few months after getting Gasol, a few months! How far did we get with kwame? We could not even get out of the freaking first round. Yes defense is good, but you wanna know what's better? A seven foot player that can actually catch a ball.
Posted by: Elle | August 18, 2008 at 11:51 PM
boy do i love the lakers and this blog - during the season, i check it every day. but really these endless posts by Mike T about Pau and Kwame have made me stay away from the blog all summer long. then i read today's post, and it's the same stuff. the comments are practically unreadable. aaah!!!
btw, "redeem team" is a bit corny. go USA! go Lakers!
Posted by: dancat | August 19, 2008 at 12:08 AM
How much did the Lakers bench score?
Game 1: 15 points 42.1% FG
Game 2: 23 points 50.0% FG
Game 3: 29 points (deceiving because of Sasha's 20 point production, no other Laker bench player scored more than 5 points) 37.3% FG
Game 4: 15 points 32.2% FG
Game 5: 17 points 31.4% FG
Game 6: 32 points (Deceiving because most points were scored at 4th quarter when the result was already known) 63.7% FG
As the series the Laker bench shot 21.8 ppg on 42.8% shooting. If we were to subtract Game 6 statistics because of inflated value it gives (one rule in statistics is to look for outliers and also to do another test w/o outliers) the Lakers bench scored 19.8 ppg but on 38.6% Fg.
Reasons why the so called Bench Mob failed?
Boston Celtic Defense--It says for itself. The bench mob got creamed when it was inserted against the Celtics
Experience ALWAYS beats youth-- Except in cases like the 1st and 2nd Gulf Wars, Experience always has the edge. Guys like James Posey, Sam Cassell and even PJ Brown had the edge against the youth of the Laker bench and unlike the Spurs, these veterans knows how to score.
Streaking Shooting--Sasha averaged 8.3 ppg but on 42.5% shooting. He would have games where he shot 70% but then have games where he shot 11.1%. Jordan averaged less than 7 ppg even with 55.4% shooting. He didn't really score well until the last two games. Luke only had 2.6 ppg and Ronny did really poor with 1.8 ppg.
No good players outside of Jordan/Sasha--Jordan and Sasha were the only ones who even tried. (And even they weren't as energetic.) Luke simply was overwhelmed by the Finals once again and I never understood why Ronny was never the banger in the inside as he was. To me he was almost a complete clone of Brian Cook except for the energy and rebounding and blocking shots, Ronny settled for too many mid range jumpers in my opinion instead of trying to post up. Ariza still wasn't 100% int he Finals and Mihm was the same story. And simply Radman in the starting lineup removed their other 3 point threat off the bench and that allowed the Celtics to focus on Jordan and Sasha when they went out since they didn't fear Ronny/Ariza/Mihm/ or Luke.
Similarly the same story was with Detroit since their starters played decently but their bench again failed. Detroit is/was a very good defensive team yet they choked in the 4th quarter because of their bench. And that was how the Celtics also rallied in the Finals. And for Detroit Pistons fans your team is going down the hill. Got a new unproven coach and has a soft scrub at center, if he manages to make the starting lineup at all. No improvement at all. At least Flip Saunders had offense, Michael Curry doesn't even have much experience and was only an assistant coach! (His only experience as a coach at all!)
The Bench is an important part of a team. In fact it was the most important to the Lakers since the bench was in fact a team of its own. Yet when the bench failed the Lakers didn't do so well either and don't bring Game 6 because the result was already over. And in Game 6 after the 1st Quarter the Deficit was only 4, 2nd Quarter bench comes out and boom double digits lead.
Does the bench mob need more defense? Yes! Ariza will help at that along with Sasha's improving defense. Powell actually is quite interesting because he did have 2 games where he scored more than 20 points, something Ronny didn't do last season and Powell averaged even more rebounds than Ronny and both averaged similar playing time (and Ronny played more games). I think he could actually be the banger off the bench that the bench mob lacked. Mihm is still a question mark. Walton/Radman will be fighting for playing time. Will the bench be better next year. If they work hard this offseason, I mean Andrew Bynum hard (Jordan needed to hit the gym as soon as he came back from Israel). the bench could even be better. Time will only tell. Not one of us are prophets so don't even dare try to say this and that because while we could say such a thing, we can't see the future and no Jon K. or Mike T. you can't see the future, otherwise please tell me who will win the Indy 500 so I can make a bet!
Things to work this offseason:
1) Improving Defense when there is no turnovers and especially offensive efficiency to decrease turnovers and fast breaks (the type of defense the Triangle is weakest which the Celtics exploited in Game 6).
2) Everyone hit the gym to reduce the probability of injuries. Also to gain strength and increase stamina so they can get less tired. Most of them are younger 30 years old so no excuses! Hit the treadmill! And also the track!
3) After the Olympics, everyone save for Kobe (who will have surgery) and Bynum (who is working out like a gym rat in Atlanta), all the players (Derek, Radman, Pau, Lamar, Sasha, Jordan, Trevor, Chris, Koby, Sun Yue (should get an English name please!), and even guys like Joe, Dwyane should practice toghether during the summer. No better way to improve team offense and defense than to play toghether!
Still two months before even training camp even after Olympics, maybe a few days to spend with family and relax but most of the time should be spent working with each other.
Go Lakers!
No soft marshmallow scrub desired nor needed.
Posted by: thekobebyrantblitz | August 19, 2008 at 02:46 AM
Also another thing,
Los Angelenos should know this so fans from other states and other countries it would be understandable if this was news to you, especially if you don't watch College Basketball.
Coach Ben Howland of the UCLA men's basketball team has a defensive first philosophy and no doubt he's much better than Steve Lavin at running basketball and has success. Yet he hasn't won a championship yet, after 5 years as Coach of UCLA, despite an impressive winning streak against teams like Washington (Aaron Brooks) and Stanford (the Lopez twins). In the 3 times he went deep to the finals he lost twice to Florida and Memphis. And don't say he had poor talent, he has really good players (Jordan Farmar, Aaron Afflalo, Darren Collison, Kevin Love, and Russell Westbrook) and has a future first round guy in Darren Collison. Yet the Bruins has yet to win the tournament. They play great defense but hasn't won the championship. Surprise Surprise.
Offense AND Defense Wins it all! An inefficient offense scores tons of points off lower shooting percentages even with great defense equals failure. So don't try to shore up just team defense, 19 turnovers in Game 6 didn't happen on accident.
Surprise Surprise.
Posted by: thekobebyrantblitz | August 19, 2008 at 03:52 AM
Everything HAS to be given a label. It's in the contract.
Posted by: exhelodrvr | August 18, 2008 at 03:18 PM
Did you read paragraph 11 clause C.
Larry(Mamba24)
Posted by: Mamba24 | August 19, 2008 at 07:22 AM
QUOTE OF THE WEEK: MRS. LAKER TOM".The trolls are the distractions that keep us from
devouring each other. Ban them and then real blood would flow. "
Larry(Mamba24)
Posted by: MMABA24 | August 19, 2008 at 07:37 AM
The righty blogs have been killing Cris Collinsworth for that Kobe interview. It has turned into a hot mess. check it out here and here and here
http://www.wikio.com/news/Cris+Collinsworth
http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/daily/site_081808/content/01125113.guest.html
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB121901828943748251.html?mod=opinion_main_review_and_outlooks
http://www.wikio.com/news/Cris+Collinsworth
http://www.yardbarker.com/rss_articles/Kobe_Thinks_Patriotism_Is_Cool_Cris_Collinsworth_May_Believe_Otherwise/731445
http://www.sphere.com/search?q=sphereit:http://www.redstate.com/diaries/redhot/2008/aug/18/kobe-bryant-is-cool/
Posted by: Jams | August 19, 2008 at 08:06 AM
ELLE:"Oh my god Mike T., will you just please just STFU?"
HaHaHa. Just say what you really feel Elle. LMAO!
Posted by: Mamba24 | August 19, 2008 at 08:16 AM
As God is my witness, we are winning the Championship next year. Period.GO LAKERS!
Posted by: Jon K. | August 18, 2008 at 09:05 PM
As God is my witness I AGREE!, we are winning the Championship next year. Period. GO LAKERS
Posted by: Mamba24 | August 19, 2008 at 08:18 AM
thekobebryantblitz,
re: my questions to Mike T about Sasha you wrote:
Sasha has gotten better but until Kobe gets around 38 Sasha will be a sixth man at best. His defense is good and improving but not yet there.
My response: Kobe can not play the 2 & the 3 at the same
time. I'm looking for someone to take the other spot. You
have not demonstrated that Lamar is the one to take the
other spot from a defense point of view. You also
haven't seen his defense for the coming year. You also
haven't addressed that Sasha's game is improving year
over year and Lamar's is not.
re: Jerry West's comments. I asked for an article. I'm
interested in reading what Jerry West had to say not
in a possible one time event where things worked out
well. Thanks for the link though.
you also had this post: plus the Lakers, hobbit made their teams shoot less percentage this year than they did last year.
Lakers 2006-2007 (with Kwa-may)--46.1%, 103.4 points given up.
Lakers 2007-2008 (With Bynum then Pau)--44.5% with 101.3 points given up.
Also got more Steals and Blocks in 07-08.
my response: Have you forgotten that we upgraded from
Smush to D-Fish??? Of course we played better defense
this past season. We upgraded our PG and our C pos.
However, we still gave up over 100 pts. per game and
that seems like a lot. Maybe you're mingling two topics.
I have *NEVER* argued that we should have kept Kwame.
I have *NOT* attacked Pau. We were talking about
Lamar at the SF/SG/PG pos and who could/should play
those positions instead of starting him.
re: defensive philosophy. You wrote: Defensive philosophy doesn't mean getting a scrub center. Nor does it mean getting a high volume shooter like Artest.
Defensive philosophy comes first from the coach.
defensive philosophy comes of the Lakers from NOT TURNING THE BALL OVER.
my response. You're mixing me and Mike T. Please don't.
You are suggesting that Artest *MUST* be a high volume
shooter. I would suggest that you look at the Celtics to
see how high volume shooters *CAN* play together. I
repeat, it is not clear that Artest would have been a high
volume shooter on the Lakers. One could argue that
NOT TURNING THE BALL OVER is an offensive
philosophy not a defensive philosophy. Particularly since
it happens when we're on offense.
you also wrote: And against the Spurs one of the top defensive teams? Let's try some numbers. The Lakers DEFENSE held the Spurs to 88.4 ppg.
my response:
A glance at
ESPN shows that the Spurs were the 13th best
offensive team. Why are you comparing the Lakers
defense to the Spurs offense? If you wanted to
compare the Spurs defense to the Lakers defense
perhaps you should show how both of them did against
the Celtics....
you wrote: Defense and the bench! No soft marshmallow scrubs need to apply.
I agree. I'm wondering how this applies to Lamar at the
2 or 3 ...
Posted by: hobbitmage | August 19, 2008 at 08:22 AM
thekobebyrantblitz,
Here's what I don't get...
You call me out in a recent post saying I don't know what I'm talking about.
While you're screaming about how we need to improve our defense, especially on our bench.
But a couple threads ago you criticized me for suggesting that if we pick up additional players for the bench that they should be defensive-orientated players.
You're seeming more like a person who likes to argue than someone who is actually a Lakers fan.
In other words... a blowhard and a jerk.
GO LAKERS!
Posted by: Jon K. | August 19, 2008 at 08:23 AM
How far did we get with kwame? We could not even get out of the freaking first round.
Yes defense is good, but you wanna know what's better? A seven foot player that can
actually catch a ball. Posted by: Elle | August 18, 2008 at 11:51 PM
YEAH BUT HOW GOOD IS HE AT PIE THROWING HUH?
Posted by: KWAMES BIG CALVES | August 19, 2008 at 08:23 AM
LakerTom
Mike t
thekobebryantblitz
You have made this blog UNREADABLE. Thanks, idiots.
Posted by: Paulie | August 19, 2008 at 08:27 AM
I don't post here often, but try to read the blog everyday and I must say I am amazed that the Finals debate still rages. Lots of smarter folks than me have pointed out the basic reality: Celtics defense outplayed Lakers offense. I thought the Lakers defense actually did reasonably well, but there was no balance. And, when the offense did click, the Lakers seemed to lack focus, particularly from the bench, to maintain that execution.
We can look at Kobe and Pau and Lamar individually, but collectively they failed to understand what the Celtics were doing and then how to break it down. They also failed to make open shots. Sometimes, that's what it comes down to.
And as for the "soft" tag, I would simply point out that some people attacked the '80s Lakers for being "soft" going so far as to suggest the Lakers would never beat the Celtics with Kareem in the middle. Guess that was proven wrong. I can only imagine what things would have been like on the blog after the '84 Finals.
I also remember the Bulls being accused of being soft, with absolutely no center and a scrawng Grant at PF. Again, that was proven wrong.
To me, it's not just about your style of basketball, it's about execution at both ends, taking advantage of matchups, and having the mental strength to perform at the highest level. The '90s Knicks were the ultimate "rugged" defensive team and failed to win a championship because they lacked balance and the ability to execute.
Posted by: teamn | August 19, 2008 at 08:36 AM
Charles
No problem. I enjoyed that discussion.
Posted by: "Pig" Miller | August 19, 2008 at 08:41 AM
AK,
On the paul pierce bit, I think you're not being fair to kobe fans in painting us as "omg, pierce is so evil because he didn't call kobe the best". We only get mad when the media goes negative on kobe. i.e. "lebron's one of the greatest player the world has seen" won't get much of a response out of us "lebron's a better player than kobe, kobe's so selfish etc" gets a response from us cuz it's like just write your king james article and leave our boy out of it, we won't even read it to begin with if kobe's never mentioned. But y'all know that just as a billion chinese follow kobe, all eyes are on him in the states too the difference being it's a love hate thing down here. So the media knows throw in kobe's name and you get more hits, hence they're encouraged to keep on hating.
Anyway I've got no problem with pierce thinking he's better than kobe so long as some espn "expert" bless that as fact by printing an article agreeing with him and supporting his notion with some lame stats. Even kobe said pierce is a baller, if you had eyes you saw he out played kobe in that series and kobe himself will tell you he's ok with pierce getting the recognition given that they whooped us in june.
Some on hear said no mvp no peace. Die hard kobe fans said no championship no peace. We love kobe cuz of his dedication to his craft and for those of us following him, his end goal has always been winning a championship. So bring on all challengers, cp3, king james, paul pierce, etc ... just give us a team that can compete (which we now have) ... and we'll be happy to do battle. There is no peace in laker land right now, but like most fans I do believe that bynum gives us a significant boost in firepower and I'm very confident that next year we'll have kobe dunking all over garnett highlights on our way to the championship, the only thing that can mess that up is if boston can't make it out of the east but i hope they do.
Mike T,
Dude men we hear you and we agree with you. Our defense needs to get better. Honestly after the celtics series a part of me was screaming fire phil jackson and hire jeff van gundy right now, right this minute we need a defensive coach running things. But then I came to my senses, darn it I was there when the suns came back from 3-1 down and just making it to the finals (without bynum!!) is darn good progress. So I ain't on here to tell you that Bynum is going to improve our defense by X amount, I'm just here to tell ya I like my teams chances, I think we'll be a better squad both offensively and defensively next year and I can't wait till the season starts to see our kobe bryant led squad seek redemption.
LGC, From the bottom of my heart to you:
F the celtics ...
F paul pierce ...
F KG ...
F Allen ...
F their coach ...
F all celtci fans ....
See what I'm trying to tell you is the feeling is mutual. Back in the day I used to watch the truth ball during summers in chicago's proam tournaments (he used to come down with antoine walker who is a chicago native) and truth be told I used to be a fan. But just as I was a fan of dwade in marquette the moment there's a conflict of interest with kobe or the lakers, I'm sticking with the mamba all the way (i.e. dwade stopped being cool the moment shaq made him his best friend). So keep posting on here, keep saying how wack kobe is, keep telling us how wack our team is, enjoy it boy but understand that we've got just as much irrational hate for your squad. I only hope you don't jump off a building after we win the next 5 championships.
Laker Fans,
We got this yo ... we got this ... let em talk ... let em say all the thrash they want ... but we all know we're only getting started ... this is hollwood baby, this is where the scripts get written and I've got us penned down for june parades for many years 2 come. AMEN!
Posted by: Taliq | August 19, 2008 at 08:41 AM
Elle,
"Oh my god Mike T., will you just please just STFU? Dude, when are you going to get it? We made it to the finals a few months after getting Gasol, a few months! How far did we get with kwame? We could not even get out of the freaking first round. Yes defense is good, but you wanna know what's better? A seven foot player that can actually catch a ball."
Calm down, calm down, all Mike's pointing out is we didn't win the championship this year. He's right about that and I'm sure Mike will not be bothering the blog next summer after we win it all. So rather than get mad at Mike, I'd suggest you say "thanks for your thoughtful opinions but let's wait till next june and see what happens" or if you're a bit more ghetto like me you can go for "keep talking smack b****, wait till next june, we gonna bust you upside the head" ... now if we'd just had the kind of season dallas had and our key aquisition can't score 5 points as a starter in blow out wins in beijing, then I'd be really worried and take out my frustrations on the likes of mike t ... but as a laker fan, nothing but good times ahead yo ... ooo lamar with the outlet pass to kobe, bounce pass to gasol, behind the back to by bynum who just omg omg omg did you just see him dunk on sheed and kwame, hey ain't that mcdyce back there 2 ... nothing but good times yo
Posted by: Taliq | August 19, 2008 at 08:56 AM
thkobebryantblitz,
Aaron Brooks played at Oregon.
Posted by: "Pig" Miller | August 19, 2008 at 09:10 AM
Laker Fans, We got this yo ... we got this ... let em talk ... let em say all the thrash they want ...
but we all know we're only getting started ... this is hollwood baby, this is where the scripts
get written and I've got us penned down for june parades for many years 2 come. AMEN!
Posted by: Taliq | August 19, 2008 at 08:41 AM
OUT FREAKIN STANDING!!! BIG, BIG UPS!!! AMEN!!
Posted by: MAMBA24 | August 19, 2008 at 09:11 AM
Mike T,
"What it means is that the Lakers aren't going to win a Championship and Kobe will probably walk after this season.
But you're right, there really isn't a point because there's nothing the Lakers can do about it.
I just wanted to rub it in how Gasol is just too soft for the Lakers to win it all.
Not going to happen."
We like it soft,
We like Gasol's soft touch,
We like how he converts a hard pass into a soft layup,
We like his soft smile after a good play,
We like his soft nifty passes to odom around the hoop,
We look forward to his soft tip in after a bynum sky hook miss,
We like it soft ...
You know who else got it soft ... Bynum ...
We love it when he softly skyhooks the ball in ...
We prefer it when he softly blocks the ball to himself or a teammate ...
Kobe's nice when he's soft too ...
We like it when he's not overly aggresive and gambling on defense, we like it when he softly watches his man's every move ...
We like it when he softly complains to the refs (all those techs weren't necessary) ...
We like it when he pump fakes hard, only to softly nail the jumper (and 1 foul call) with a man in his face ...
I hear Bynum misses Kobe's soft alley oop passes too
Lamar can't help but be soft ...
See he goes after rebounds real hard but he's always got that soft look on his face,
Come on a man that scribbles lost members of his family on his shoe, now that's touching, that's soft but we think it shows hear too,
We like soft, we like want our players to care ...
See I could go on for days about how we like it soft, I could tell you about other members on the squad, like come on which laker fan doesn't love a sasha 3 pointer, the way it softly swishes through the net, I could tell you how we love the laid back style of our coach, how we're not worried about all that zen philosophy making our players soft cuz we like it soft ... but cuz i aint got all the time in the world how bout we just end it on i hear kwame likes it soft too, i heard the team was told to softly pat him on the back whenever he dropped a pass, just so it'd softly build up his confidence, so for your sake I truly hope he gets treated softly in detroit cuz y know ya boy's self confidence makes marshmellow look like titanium
I'm out like the soft cake an ex laker softly chucked accross the room :)
Posted by: Taliq | August 19, 2008 at 09:13 AM
Taliq on the blog to restore some order. Thank the Lord. Dwade stop being cool to me when he jumped on Shaq's side. I was a big fan of his in marquette, and the years he played with Caron and Lamar. I still remember his rookie season when he got the heat out of the first round, but he burned bridges with Kobe.
The funny thing since this Olympic started is that nobody even remembers Shaq's rap anymore. This Olymp.ic thing has sure been good for Kobe.
Posted by: wow | August 19, 2008 at 09:15 AM
TALIQ:"I'd suggest you say "thanks for your thoughtful opinions but let's wait till next june and
see what happens" or if you're a bit more ghetto like me you can go for "keep talking smack b****,
wait till next june, we gonna bust you upside the head" ... "
OMG!!! LMAO!! THEY SAY THAT CAT TALIQ IS A BAD MOTHER... SHUT YOUR MOUTH,
BUT I'M JUST TALKING ABOUT TALIQ, THEN WE CAN DIG IT!!!
Brother your 2 posts have made my day!!!
Posted by: Mamba24 | August 19, 2008 at 09:16 AM
teamn,
Regarding your analysis of the Finals... so you don't think the Lakers beat themselves?
Yes, I do agree with you that Boston played well, but I think the young Lakers and their relative playoff inexperience beat themselves as much, if not more, than the Boston Celtics beat the Lakers.
I'd like to know if you agree or disagree with me on this one.
GO LAKERS!
Posted by: Jon K. | August 19, 2008 at 09:32 AM
Taliq,
"Calm down, calm down, all Mike's pointing out is we didn't win the championship this year."
You're right and a lot of what Mike T. says about needing to improve on defense is also right.
The only problem is that the spirit in which it is said. Michael T. basically left the blog when Kwame was traded and then only came back after Game 6 of the Finals to gloat.
That kind of sucks, if you know what I mean.
GO LAKERS!
Posted by: Jon K. | August 19, 2008 at 09:37 AM
so for your sake I truly hope he gets treated softly in detroit cuz y know ya
boy's self confidence makes marshmellow look like titanium I'm out like the soft cake
an ex laker softly chucked accross the room :) Posted by: Taliq | August 19, 2008 at 09:13 AM
LMFAO!!! STOP IT TALIQ!! STOP IT NOW!! YOU GON GET ME FIRED MAN!!! AW SH++ HAHAHA!!
Posted by: MAMBA24 | August 19, 2008 at 09:46 AM
Taliq<--- Now that's what I call A Lakers fan!
Posted by: Quazzar | August 19, 2008 at 09:52 AM
Taliq,
"On the paul pierce bit, I think you're not being fair to kobe fans in painting us as "omg, pierce is so evil because he didn't call kobe the best". We only get mad when the media goes negative on kobe. i.e. "lebron's one of the greatest player the world has seen" won't get much of a response out of us "lebron's a better player than kobe, kobe's so selfish etc" gets a response from us cuz it's like just write your king james article and leave our boy out of it, we won't even read it to begin with if kobe's never mentioned."
Respectfully, I would say to go back and read the threads on and around the day when Pierce made the original statement. Kobe fans took considerably more offense than the reaction you're describing.
Also, I understand the point you're trying to make in regards to articles written about LBJ being the best, but from a pure logistics standpoint, it's basically impossible to write an article about a player being the best without making some kind of comparison to other players. Or at the very least, the guy who'd be naturally considered the next best player. That's just writing 101. In either case, Kobe is bound to pop up. I realize why that might annoy some Laker/Kobe fans, but there's really no way around it for this kind of analysis.
AK
Posted by: Andrew Kamenetzky | August 19, 2008 at 09:52 AM
Elle,
"Dude, when are you going to get it?"
Never. If Kwame never produces, it will always be the fault of the coach/teammates, never due to a lack of effort/focus on Kwame's part and/or the possibility that Kwame just isn't a basketball player - a square peg people keep trying to fit into a round hole.
The problem for MT is that he has too much of his self-esteem wrapped up in Kwame.
Posted by: exhelodrvr | August 19, 2008 at 09:55 AM
Can we have some threads that are teniente-free?
Seriously, like I was really enjoying the last thread until it became, once again, all about mike t. instead of GREAT LAKERS MOMENTS.
This blog is about the LAKERS, not mike t. I'd rather read any post from LGC than any post from mike t.
KBros, how about a No Consecultive Posts rule if we can't just ban this egotistical lousy writer of a blowhard?
Posted by: Jesterguru | August 19, 2008 at 09:57 AM
THERE'S A NEW SHERIFF IN TOWN AND HIS NAME IS TALIQ
Larry(Mamba24)
Posted by: MAMBA24 | August 19, 2008 at 10:04 AM
I hate to interrupt Mike T's rabid foaming at the mouth rants
about Kwame and Gasol and how the Lakers are going to hell
in a handbasket, but...
I got a chance to watch the China-Greece game last night,
and Sun Yue was very impressive in the game. Obviously
Greece is a much better team than China, so they
weren't
able to win the game, but they at least kept it competitive.
In the first half, China's starting PG, Liu Wei, was stinking
it up and at halftime they were down 22. So in the 3rd quarter,
the Chinese coach benched Liu Wei and had Sun Yue run
the point. With Sun Yue running the point, they slowly worked
into the lead. With 2:58 left in the 3rd quarter, Sun Yue hit
a 3-pointer that got the lead all the way down to 10. They
kept it around 10-14 points most of the rest of the game.
Sun Yue finished with 9 points, 6 assists, 2 steals, and 2 rebounds.
Not dominating numbers, by any means, but while China's
starting PG and captain got pwned by the Greek guards,
Sun Yue held his own and helped his team get back into
the game.
Posted by: Long Time Laker Fan | August 19, 2008 at 10:06 AM
To blog admin, please let this one through.
Jon K: Dude, you haven't been here long enough. Let's Go C's! is not a Celtics fan. He's just a person who enjoys ruining the joy of other people. In other words, he's a horrible human being. Too much a coward to be a criminal, but worse inside.
Seriously, is this necessary? Why the hate? Yoos taking this waaayy toooo personal.
Posted by: Let's go C's! (aka LGC) | August 19, 2008 at 10:11 AM
Lebron is better than Kobe at this point of their careers. Paul Pierce is better than Kobe at this point too.
Kobe may be popular, but is not the so-called 'best' anymore.
Sorry.
Posted by: Let's go C's! (aka LGC) | August 19, 2008 at 10:13 AM