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Bad enough to create an international incident?

August 12, 2008 | 11:20 am

Spanish_team_2 Probably not.

So lacking in even the most basic of common sense that you have to wonder what they were thinking? 

Yeah, that would pretty much describe the photo taken by members of the Spanish basketball team (including the Lakers' Pau Gasol), a snapshot where each player appears to be fashioning his eyes to resemble those of the Chinese hosts. 

Very clever and witty, assuming the Olympics featured a sixth-grade boys division. 

I can't speak for the rest of the Spanish players (having never met them), but in the case of Gasol, considering he's among the more soft-spoken and unfailingly polite athletes (much less NBA guys) I've ever met, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt in believing he (and hopefully by extension, his teammates) weren't actually gunning to offend.  And scattered instances of flat out racist behavior at European athletic contests aside, there's often a difference in what's considered taboo overseas vs. in America when it comes to issues of "P.C." 

Even with any benefit extended, I won't let Gasol or his cronies off the hook when it comes to sheer stupidity.  We're really gonna take this photo to mark an event in China?  Really? Does anyone with half a brain think this photo getting out- and you know it's going to- will lead to anything good?  Maybe not nothing disastrous, but still, is there a potential upside I'm missing?  In the end, it makes me shake my head more than my fist.

In other news, a Coby Karl update, a not so hot review of Sun Yue, HoopsWorld predicts Andrew Bynum will bust out next season- assuming 2008 wasn't a fluke, I was under the distinct impression he already has- and you'll find similar optimism coming from Drew's trainer.  Finally, if you were worried Brian Cook is still reeling after being traded to Orlando, stress over something else, because he's doing fine in smaller town surroundings.

AK


The comments to this entry are closed.

Comments

Regarding the picture, there may be more to it than what it appears.....I read the blog fast, hey, maybe it was shot by a Chinese photographer, and maybe it was dead time and they were told to play around, and someone started it and the rest followed (the herd follows the leader over the cliff)...Me, I'll wait till it either blows over, or more info surfaces. Don't crucify them yet. I'm 100% Chinese, and I am not offended. If it was done as an act of mockery, than it shows stupidity. I'll let it go until more facts come to light. In a similar theme, can someone answer me why there is still a candy out there called "Nips"....????

Benjamin,
"Why are you continually ignoring the fact that a Chinese company was intricately involved in creating this ad?

Don't you think that matters and absolves the Spanish team from some responsibility?"

I agree.

In addition, doing something like this does not mean the individuals who did it are racist. Does laughing at one of Dave Chappelle's or Carlos Mencia's skits make someone racist? They are both far more offensive (albeit funnier) than this.

LTLF,

re: Panda Porn. Was Gwyneth Paltrow involved? I
really enjoyed her as the Panda in Father of the Pride.

So not only is Pau Gasoft a loser, but he's a racist. We really need to get this idiot off our team.

BK - As someone mentioned before, different countries have different standards and sensitivities. Obviously the pic is in poor taste, but I don't believe that the entire team is filled with racists.
--

Oh please. See non sequitur.

Yes, I didn't and still don't think the ad was "racist" in any sense of malicious intent by the principals involved.

No, the culture defense is indefensible. Because "It's the culture stupid" *is* specious and unsubstantiated absent any evidence of *normative* cultural artifacts suggesting similar "cultural" (pervasive, historical, popular inculcated) behavior towards Asians.

In other words, SHOW US the Spanish sitcoms, magazine ads, videos, manja, TV news or popular films that routinely depict Spaniards slanting their eyes to convey Asian humor and I'll show you pink elephants wearing tutus on Mars.

Moreoever, the poster who cited the "culture" reference was *clearly* trying to have it both ways --- in one sentence claiming some cultures, i.e., Spanish culture, might find slant-eyes funny but in the next, risibly excusing the slant-eyed Spaniards as *exceptions* to that culture (not indicative of the "whole").

If it looks, smells, sounds like bullbleep ...

... it must be the cultchah

Posted by: Benjamin - Why are you continually ignoring the fact that a Chinese company was intricately involved in creating this ad? Wouldn't the Spanish national team defer to their Chinese sponsors?
---

Proof or link please?

Which Chinese "company" or "sponsor", how were they "intricately" involved, when and where are these sponsors cited?

According to the New York Times, the photos were shot on July 1 and have run as "an advertisement for the Spanish courier company, Seur, in the Spanish sports daily, Marca, for the last month" [ www.nytimes.com/2008/08/14/sports/olympics/14hoops.html?ref=sports ]

While I'm not all that upset about this photo, the bottom line is that there are people who are upset by it. It is overt racism anyway you want to cut it.

There is no maliciousness involved in it, but it is very ignorant in this day and age.

This kind of thing should be unacceptable.

Anyone trying to justify this picture in any way is showing great insensitivity to the ethnicity/culture who was discriminated against. In other words, that person is being racist.

Spain need not apologize for having fun - no intent, no problem. What in the $#$#$#$# is wrong with it? Nothing.

Gasol from the Times article [ www.nytimes.com/2008/08/14/sports/olympics/14
hoops.html?ref=sports ] -

“If anyone feels offended by it, we totally apologize for it,” the Spanish star Pau Gasol said. “We never meant anything offensive by it.”

“Some of us didn’t feel comfortable doing it,” Gasol said. “To me it was little clownish for our part to be doing that. The sponsor insisted and insisted. They pushed because they’re the people that pay the money. It was just a bad idea to do that. It was never intended to be offensive or racist against anybody.”

--
End of story. Hopefully.

As defined by Oxford – Racism - the belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, esp. so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races.

Charles,

I think this one may be hitting close to home for you, so you're slightly blinded by rage. All of this is based on Point Of View, and yours happens to be that this mistake of a photo was racist commentary. In the end, it may just be a matter of semantics.

The photo that I see above, to me, does not imply any feeling of superiority by the Spaniards. Just that they're a bunch of silly idiots for being so callous.

To your response on the Chinese responding to the photo, I think that if it were as bad as many in the free media see it as, or as Americans see it as, then the Chinese state sponsored media outlets may have something to say. There are enough people in China to cover a story like this if it's important enough.

PEOPLE, PEOPLE, PEOPLE! NEW THREAD TIME

Let's Go C's:

Ok, OK - Laker fans get it. We lost, you won. Secondly, you are correct in all of your posts, and Kobe is completely off on an "I am Jordan" world. I don't like him - never will, but why sit out there to torment Laker bloggers? Have you no job? Can I help? Get a new personality and try again. I mean this in a caring way, as I am a New Englander transplant here in L.A. C's were truly great last year and should be again this year. Tell you what - drive down to the cape today (remember, no job) and go way out to those nice beaches on the southwest corner (before the cape makes a left turn to Truro). Order yourself up some fried littlenecks and start to enjoy what you have.

Truly offensive! Outraged, at least Gasol apologized for it, that other scrub player is truly a moron.

Rocky,
"Anyone trying to justify this picture in any way is showing great insensitivity to the ethnicity/culture who was discriminated against. In other words, that person is being racist."

No, anyone accusing someone else of being racist because that person questions whether the accusations of racism leveled against others are valid is being racist.


NOW WOULD BE A GOOD TIME MR. SCOTT!

Exhelodrvr,

"No, anyone accusing someone else of being racist because that person questions whether the accusations of racism leveled against others are valid is being racist. "

No, anyone accusing someone else of being racist by asserting that the act of questioning whether the accusations of racism leveled against others are valid is being racist.

DOOO BEEE DOOOOO BEEEE DOOOOOO

I know how to end this thread.

Make everyone decide to either..
A) End this photo convo going..or
B) We can talk about my Might and Unstoppable Oakland Raiders

oh..wait..that's a bad example...how bout this..either

A) Move on to a new topic..or
B) Lets talk about my Super Bowl bound Oakland Raiders..

That'll stop this lol!

What I find pretty offensive about the Spanish team's photograph is almost not the photograph itself, but the team's reaction to it. I can almost understand Pau's explanation in that they did not intend to harm - but they should have realized that it would be taken offensively by those in the Asian community. I completely don't understand Calderon's explanation that they were doing "something nice," likening the gesture as some sort of gift, as if the Spanish teams was giving some kind of props to the Chinese by doing the slant-eye manuever. Never mind Spain has a recent (if not long) history of acting racist towards minority athletes.

I'm not a fan of political correctness, and I'm the first one to get participate in racial-jibes with my friends (most of whom are minorities). But I think there is a big difference between a group of friends busting each other versus what the Olympic team did. Now if Team ESP and Team China are great buddies and do stuff like this in private then so be it, but Team ESP has to be smart enough to not allow such a photograph to be taken.

Anybody remember Junior Seau's crack about LT eating fried chicken? That basically blew up and LT, being a stand up guy, had to come out and defend Seau, saying that he did like fried chicken.

The media's partially to blame for this whole slant-eye flap, the Team ESP made themselves the target by being dumb in the 1st place.

"...anyone accusing someone else of being racist because that person questions whether the accusations of racism leveled against others are valid is being racist."-ex

I disagree.

The picture is a racist picture. The Spaniards are doing the slanty eye deal. Which is overt racism through and through. There is no justification for it.

Like I said, it does not bother me as much as many other things when it comes to race. Mostly because we're not dealing with inequalities, oppression, or even stereotypes. But to justify the reasoning behind this picture as something better than racism is not being just to the people who were discriminated against.

It's a small world these days. Respect must be given to people of all ethnicities no matter what they look like.

If I were Chinese, I'd be insulted by the picture. The equivalent would be the Chinese team taking a picture wearing giant Spanish noses.

There's just no place in the world for that racial nonsense in my opinion.

Chinese company...

The Spanish team gathers for a promo shoot they'd rather not be doing. The creative director, art director, photographer and Chinese client come on set. The players dress up, make up and they're told how and where to stand, smile etc.

Pau objects. They persist. He objects again. The team backs down. Pau persists, they persist harder and Pau, being the mild mannered, cerebral type, thinks, let's just get this over with.

He was quoted as saying, the worst part of it is it isn't funny. And he's right.

It's not like the agency had another concept up their sleeve, ready to go in case the athletes broke rank.

"Time is money, people, we're losing light."
Boycott the company, the players are pawns.

latopia-

That wasn't really my point (very solid chance I wasn't making myself all that clear). In the specific, I'm certainly not saying that the picture was defensible, because it isn't, nor that "culture" in Spain made it a reasonable choice.

My point about culture was more broad, related to the discussion people were having over the course of the day about how different norms in different places with different people can result in people seeing the same thing in different ways. It gets to the difficulty at times of separating respect for different POVs and norms with setting standards that need to exist for moral judgement on right and wrong. This case is fairly simple- what the hell were they thinking? But in broader terms, it's a complicated issue.

BK

So not only is Pau Gasoft a loser, but he's a racist. We really need to get this idiot off our team.

Posted by: troy | August 13, 2008 at 08:14 AM
---------------------------------------------------------------------

'm sorry but did anyone else have a pretty good laugh after reading that? Because I know I sure did.

About the picture, can we truly judge anyone by a snapshot that only covers a single moment in time?
We truly do not know the underlying circumstances or the context it was taken in. Yes steadily more things are coming to light about what it was going on but we still don’t know the whole story.

Calling some one racist on the basis of a single lapse of judgment which this was is a little overboard. This doesn’t even register on the Richter scale when you compare this
to what some very famous and very popular stand up comics have said or done. For example Carlos Mencia used have a whole segment in his act as to why African American don’t workAt KFC and why Latinos don’t work at Taco Bell but he got a pass because it was funny? He has said things that are truly just plain jaw dropping offensive about people from the Middle East and Asia, but again he got a pass because it was funny? Come on that’s no pass either and we all know it.

Also please do not mistake political incorrectness (which this picture obviously was) with racism. Some of you point at various incidents that have happened in Spain
before, but none, not a one, included the guys on Spain’s Olympic Basketball team.

Believe me racism is some thing that can not be even explained unless you experience it. Try being Mexican engaged with a white woman in the middle of rural Tennessee and then get back to me on some one being racist. I was called everything you can possibly think of (as was she) by people who where just total random strangers and never even took so much as a second to get to know me or her. Do I consider everyone in Tennessee a racist? Not at all. Have we had a problem
any where else besides that little Podunk town there? Not a one. As far as I'm concerned it was an isolated incident
and just let it slide of my back.

I understand that maybe some of you aren’t as thick skinned as me or other people who post on the blog
but all I’m trying to say is take a step back and look at the whole picture before
labeling anyone a Racist.

Latopia,

Is Jose Calderon, the author and newspaper columnist? If he is, he was my professor in College. Anyway, to comment on your reply - I believe the joke or prank done by Team Spain is out of place but I don't consider it within the bounds of racism. Yes, it is irresponsible as Tsphere said more of a juvenile character alligned with the mentality of taggers, gangsta rap who are insensitive to the feelings of others, however to blatantly put it under the context of racism, I believe that is a serious accusation.

I consider racism what is happening today in many european countries where neo-nazis assault immigrants. They want to preserve the purity of their race. My niece was a US peace corps and was kicked at the train station in Poland and chased by neo nazis, and it was the elders of the town where she was assigned that fought back on these demented juveniles. Two years ago, there was an incident in Sydney beaches where muslims or any south asian looking immigrants were mauled and driven out of the beach. In return, these Muslim youths banded together and retaliated at the white communities burning cars and throwing molotov bombs. I don't blame the countries or its citizenry, those are just sample of incidents of blatant racism. One group can't coexiist with another group nor tolerate each other differences. If they want to separate from Muslim, that's fine but to hurt another group and accuse them ALL as terrorists b/c of their looks is another matter. Lately, there was news on CNN about a mexican who was with his anglo gf walking in the evening (I forgot the state in the E/C) was killed by a group of teens without any provocation, it is all b/c of his looks as a south of the border immigrant immediately branded as illegal who are being blamed for joblessness, outsourced of jobs in a former industrial town. Wrong person!!! it should have been the greedy CEO who made the decision to close the Mfg plant. huh! There is just too much suspicion thrown at the poor illegal immigrants as a whole. In my book, those are example of racism.

What Team Spain did was an unfair joke, plainly insensitive by misdirected group of cajones headed by Gasol. I blamed more their elders like the Coaches and head of the delegation who tolerated it.

In November, when Gasol comes back to LA why don't we reprint and get his autograph using the same picture at Staples or in Manhattan beach area or at commercial promotions? See who gets the last laugh?

MihmZetaJones,

Is your email correct? I just sent you one.

Thanks

AK

That gesture of slanting the eyes is clearly a racist gesture. It has a history--it's not something just made up on the spot. For Pau Gasol to say it was just meant to be funny but not racist is beside the point--a lot of racism is "meant to be funny."

To say that the context in Europe is different is correct--this kind of gesture is more acceptable there. In other words, this isn't the only instance of it, just the first time (because of the Olympics) that it's made the international press. That doesn't mean it's less racist.

Thank God! New topic!

AK, ok, ok, you're right... I see what you're saying, I'll drop it... Just messing around... just bored with the new Mihminus monikker, I'll figure out a new one...

No, anyone accusing someone else of being racist because that person questions whether the accusations of racism leveled against others are valid is being racist.


Posted by: exhelodrvr

this reminds me of the conundrum of being an anarchist....from dictionary.com an anarchist:

"a person who seeks to overturn by violence all constituted forms and institutions of society and government, with no purpose of establishing any other system of order in the place of that destroyed."

...and the problem is if you are part of an anarchist group you are a hypocrite, because by being part of a group you are by default, a contituted form or institution of society"...

Let's go C what else we can talk about, until the repurcussions of this come....

Jannero Pargo is ok, I was reading Jackson's last book, on the dismal season, and just got to the part where they cut Pargo. They liked Pargo, but it came down to money. If there is room, and if there is sign that Fisher is slowing down, I say ok, I think Farmar still has a big future, I love his play, I love his 42" vertical....but I still want Sun Yue to get some playing time with the other "bigs". His reviews from his performance in the US vs China game were harsh. I think he held his own. Keep in mind, he is not their focal point. He is not their type of player. The thing is, as a Laker, he will be a hard worker, he will hit the weights, and his shooting will improve, especially since he won't be aimed to be their point guard. What is it with these designations of players to positions (1 to 5)....look, MJ played the 3, Pippen played the 1, Kerr, Hodges, John Paxson the 2....We have versatile players, and we have to use that to our advantage, next blog, please!!!!!

Infamous El Guapo, you alright, man. Thanks for putting it proper perspective.

At the risk of sounding racist to some people, I'm gonna say that when I saw the picture I did not see anything wrong with it. By that I mean that if I was a member of the Spanish team I would not have apologized for it and I really cannot understand why anyone would be offended by it. Slant-eyes are as culturally taboo in mind as Wisconsin being known for cheese. I really don't get what the whole problem is about. And let's not be hypocritical, because there are so many movies and instances in American popular culture where different races are stereotyped with things that are worse than slant-eyes. And please let's not call people racist without checking ourselves.

I will change my opinion when and if I hear that most of the Chinese population finds it very offensive. From what I have read the two people that commented on this blog and are Chinese did not find it to be even bothersome.

>>>re: Panda Porn. Was Gwyneth Paltrow involved? I
>>>really enjoyed her as the Panda in Father of the Pride.

No, they did a piece on Pandas. They were showing how they
used food treats to make the Panda stud exercise his back
legs so he could be extra studly. Then they showed what they
do if the stud ain't doing his studly duty. Basically, they
put a TV in front of the cage showing Panda Porn.

Okay, let me ask you this...

Is Mike Myers or Adam Sandler being racist when they do
an accent? That is mimicry, more or less the same as slanting
your eyes. So are they heinous racists like the Spanish team?

WOW i never understand people who accuse others of racism.
We are all inherently racist.
Some are fortunately aware of their racial tendencies and trained by the culture to avoid it.

When we are under emotional duress, these tendencies always manifest themselves.

Anybody remembers the movie Crash?.

What about this line in a Farrell's movie talking to his dog when barks at him? "I told you I don't speak Spanish" Isn't that's offensive? NOOOOO that's hillarious isn't? move on you uptight puritans.

SPAIN BASKETBALL 1 - GUANTANAMO 0. PAU GASOL FOREVER

¿desde cuando mencionar una característica física es un insulto? Hay que ser muy muy muy racista para ver racismo en esta foto, ese asqueroso paternalismo anglosajón hacia todo lo no-blanco es lo que os define, ya sea defendiendo al que considerais vuestro inferior o atacándolo. En esta foto muestran una característica del país al que van a jugar: ojos rasgados, eso no es ni malo ni bueno. Da asco vuestro paternalismo, si no sois capaces de admitir las diferencias y admitir que éstas no constituyen ningún defecto, es que sois muy racistas. Saludos.

¿desde cuando mencionar una característica física es un insulto? Hay que ser muy muy muy racista para ver racismo en esta foto, ese asqueroso paternalismo anglosajón hacia todo lo no-blanco es lo que os define, ya sea defendiendo al que considerais vuestro inferior o atacándolo. En esta foto muestran una característica del país al que van a jugar: ojos rasgados, eso no es ni malo ni bueno. Da asco vuestro paternalismo, si no sois capaces de admitir las diferencias y admitir que éstas no constituyen ningún defecto, es que sois muy racistas. Saludos.

Posted by: Juan | August 14, 2008 at 04:38 AM

Anyone willing to translate this for me? I'm a Korean American who grew up in Paraguay, and it has been over 20 years since I used Espanol on a daily basis. Having said that, I think Juan is asking Since when did it become an insult to mention physical characteristic/attributes?

Juan, it is an insult. It was, it is and it wiil be. Where have you been? Juan, haven't you ever slanted your eyes and said "Chino" at a Chinese, Korean, Filipino, Japanese, etc?

It is premature to label Espana of being racisit. Their behavior was in poor judgement, poor taste, or whatever excuse you can think of. (They said they didn't know.)

However, I'm perplexed as to the Spaniard attitude. Spaniard unilaterally decided that eye-slaning is not offensive and insulting toward the Chinese. (It is insulting!) Did you ask the Chinese, any other Far East Asian? What did the Chinese say?

If you don't want to apologize, at least acknowledge that what you did is offensive and insulting so that you will never do it again. If you do it again, then you are a racist.

Go USA!!! you too espana

Let me say that I enjoyed reading the blog. Now, can't we all get along?

That photograph can be stupid and simple but IS NOT racist. How somebody can say that behind that photograph there is hate against Chinese people? Obviously there is no intention of offence, but it has offended some people so it was a mistake and they must apologize.

People overuse the term "racist" to control a dialogue by unfairly shaming other people. While there are clearly "bigots" out there who hate other people for no damned good reason, people reign outrage far too easily at "racist" gestures.

Like I've said earlier, what the Spanish team did could be categorized as an immature act of poor taste, it certainly isn't racist or bigoted. People who are "outraged" by this act need to take a long, hard look at themselves and ask themselves, "Why do I so easily see the worst in others?"

Perhaps you're projecting something of yourself...

GO USA!

GO LAKERS!


ChrisMihmn,
" think you guys are being a little hypersensitive. You should hear what Asians have to say about blacks, they just don't put out a picture about it. "

This has got to be one of the most ignorant comments I have read on this blog in quite some time. Let me get this straight. You overheard some Asians making racist comments, and therefore, all Asians are fair game when it comes to being victimized by racist behavior? People that react to this blatant racist behavior are hyper-sensitive? Are you serious?

Posted by: LAKER TRUTH | August 12, 2008 at 03:40 PM


Obviously, not all Asians are racist against Blacks. It seems to be a fairly prevalent attitude, however. You hear Asians girls say the best way to piss off their parents is to date a Black guy. My dad is a therapist and gets to hear more hidden, inner opinions people hold. His experience suggests that Asian-Americans have a strongly racist attitude toward Blacks as a general rule.

It sucks. I don't wish it were that way. But sometimes the world just isn't how you'd like it to be. And sometimes it's pretty damn ugly.

Posted by: Benjamin | August 12, 2008 at 05:12 PM

===========================

I am Latino and in my time have seen much racism all around the world. It is just not limited to Black and White, Laino or Asian.

When I was in Hong Kong A friend (also Latino) and I went to a resturant to eat. The owner grabed our arms and said get out we don't serve your kind here.

We did not respond with violence as we did not want to get arrested in foreign country. I was shocked to see such hatred as I knew of no racial tensions between Latinos and Chinese. I later found out that there was no tension between Latinos and Chinese but a bitter tension between Eastern Indians and Chinese. Because we were brown they assumed us to be Indians.

so racism is prevelant all over and I wish it did not exist but it does. The only hope I have that there is good and bad no matter what the race and that the bad is the minority.

I am glad the Lakers are multi cultured and is a smaller melting pot.

Since I went down memory lane to describe racism world wide I will also tell of several incidents in HS which show the good in people. As I said I am Latino and faced much prejudice for that. But happy memories abound when I was befriended by two Chinese sisters.

They had a great impact on my life that they don't even know it. I am trying to find them to thank them for helping me turn my life around.

I was experinccing a lot of discrimination from students, teachers and even principal. I also had help from teachers stunds and vice principal.

To get to the point I was getting frustrated with the discrimination was was tuning out and headed for giving up and dropping out. I confided to the two sisters about my feelings and explained why. They noticed what was going on and spoke up for me even though I never asked them to.

This spread to other students and I thought maybe it was worth trying to get education rather than giving up.

I have a reasonable good life, not filty rich yet lol. but I owe it all to those two Chinese sisters. I have been trying to locate them in classmates but no success yet just to thank them. I owe them a lot and they don't even know it.

So just to say there is good and bad no matter what race and they showed me some of the best side in people.

Go Lakers.

 


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