Fatty,

I had a water and almost drowned.

How is Kwame Brown a Top Ten free agent?

How?

How?

GO LAKERS!

[Repost: Makes more sense here]

I think it makes sense, financial and emotionally for Artest to opt out now.

Current salary for upcoming season 8.4 million.

Most he would realize by opting now. 5.8 mil x 5 years. (MLE)

So why opt now?

1. His choice. He chooses the team, location, and situation.

2. Sac chooses where he goes, if he stays. He has nice value for trade bait with his expiring contract. It could be the Memphis Grizzlies. Who knows? He would have to endure one more unsettling and losing season.

3. He won't get much more money if he stays with Sac this year over the long run.

If if no team is willing to pay him more than the MLE (5.8) this year, would it be any different next year?

So, if Ron Ron opts out now, he chooses the team, (instant gratification) can immediately be on a winner, and over the next 5 years would realize only 2.5 mil less in salary.

A Sac Sign and Trade?: Would give Ron more money, but so far Sac hasn't been interested in helping Artest get more money.

Artest extension?: Sac has no interest in giving Ron one. So why should Artest show any loyalty to the Kings?

So Ron Ron, don't worry about all this stuff. Just be happy now, opt and sign with the Lakers.

Fatty,

Playoff incentives for Ron-Ron?

Artest ain't coming, accept it.

Kwammus the Brownus is in the TOP TEN, baby! LOL! Come on! We've GOT to get this guy back, Mike T would come back to the blog, it would be hilarious!

Still wonder if the Lakers could work anything out with Chicago, Hinrich or Deng. Seems the salary cap issue kills both of those ideas unless... Sasha (sign and trade), Odom and ? get moved in trade to get one of those guys? Don't really see it happening.

Wonder if the Lakers really go after Posey or that was a smokescreen?

What about the scenerio I suggested before? What if RA opts out and Lakers offer 1 year MLE contract. Then he becomes FA and we can offer more as our FA if he pans out playing in our system with our players.

So in effect he would only take pay cut for 1 year and chance to get bigger contract and the benefits of playing in LA market.

Been a long time since my last post here....tried to avoid the bandwagon effect. ;-)

Anywhoooo....

Here are my thoughts going into next year.

We need someone at the 3 who is a good spot-up shooter and defender. One thing I always remember about the 90's Bulls under PJ is how they could put a bunch of guys who could hit a 15-footer around MJ. Pippen, Grant, Wennington, Kukoc, Longly, etc. About the only one who couldn't shoot was Rodman, but unless we're going to pick up someone who can rebound and defend like that, the point is moot.

LO, Walton, Ariza, and even Vlad-Rad don't fit this mid-range/defender mold. As we saw with the Bulls, that 10-15 foot look is what the 3 spot generally gets in the triangle, and if we don't have anyone who can hit it consistently, we're in trouble.

So I honestly think Mitch should try work something out to replace LO, Walton, Vlad Rad, or some combination of them with what I described above.

The other thing that worries me is how often I saw Gasol miss open 10-15 foot jump shots this year. When he and Bynum are on the floor together, he's probably going to get a lot of them and if he can't knock 'em down, the other big is just going to sag off and DT Bynum. Not good.

Work on your jumper Pau!!!

Other than that, I think (as do most) we're in great shape for next year.

To supplement your F/A list, here is the complete roster provided by InsideHoops:

http://tinyurl.com/39g6w2

After enjoying the shopping list, get down to reality by considering the luxury threshold issues without future salary of Ronny Turiaf, DJ Mbenga and Coby Karl, rookies and the MLE. Also Sasha's salary is pegged only at $2.6M = Lakers total is $75.3M

http://tinyurl.com/4959bz

Let us put some arbitrary figures. Supposing they get back Sasha at 5.5M, Turiaf at 3M. Mbenga at 0.8M, Karl at 0.8M Rookies: Crawford at 0.5M and Lue at 0.5M and spend the MLE at 5.5M. the new total will be $89.3M. I think these are low ball offers. Will the old man have the appetite to take that payroll and pay about $14M of luxury taxes? (Lakers have to give up some players not Mbenga and Karl who are only 0.8M but one who earns 6M, another 4M, on the bench at 2.5M and the jackpot player at 14M.)

Next problem, before the start of the season Lakers have to look at Bynum's contract which is only 2.6M. In 2009, he can opt for player's option, therefore, Lakers want to make him happy. According to LakerTom and Hoopsworld estimate, it is the vicinity of $ 80M for 5 years so that is 16M per year. Therefore, if that contract becomes retroactive for '08-'09 in order lock in the deal, the new total will be $102.7M. If Mitch Kupchak could balance the budget of Jerry Buss, he becomes automatically the EOY in November. LOL!

Posted by: Jason F. | June 30, 2008 at 11:37 AM

Excellent Post Jason F!

Charles,

"Since we own the Bird Rights to Sasha and Ronny, do we still have the mid-level and vet's minimum to use?"

That is correct. But I'm still of the opinion that unless it's for someone that's likely to make a pretty big impact (James Posey would be about the only one who comes to mind), I doubt the Lakers will use their MLE this season. Or at least not much of it. The FA crop just isn't worth it.

AK

Edwin Gueco wrote:

“…Let us put some arbitrary figures. Supposing they get back Sasha at 5.5M, Turiaf at 3M. Mbenga at 0.8M, Karl at 0.8M Rookies: Crawford at 0.5M and Lue at 0.5M and spend the MLE at 5.5M. the new total will be $89.3M. I think these are low ball offers. Will the old man have the appetite to take that payroll and pay about $14M of luxury taxes? (Lakers have to give up some players not Mbenga and Karl who are only 0.8M but one who earns 6M, another 4M, on the bench at 2.5M and the jackpot player at 14M.)”

“Next problem, before the start of the season Lakers have to look at Bynum's contract which is only 2.6M. In 2009, he can opt for player's option, therefore, Lakers want to make him happy. According to LakerTom and Hoopsworld estimate, it is the vicinity of $ 80M for 5 years so that is 16M per year. Therefore, if that contract becomes retroactive for '08-'09 in order lock in the deal, the new total will be $102.7M. If Mitch Kupchak could balance the budget of Jerry Buss, he becomes automatically the EOY in November. LOL!”

Sobering analysis Edwin;

Interesting that people are here throwing around names such as Artest and others for the Lakers to sign with their full MLE. Yet seem to be ignoring these serious upcoming these salary and luxury tax issues for the organization. I would love to see the Lakers bring in FAs to help us win the championship.

But how can anyone realistically expect Jerry Buss (or any sane owner for that matter) to eventually fork out something in the range of $100,000,000 in payroll with $23-$30 million in luxury tax penalties on top on that?

And when can Kobe Bryant opt out and wish to resign for more? At the end of the 2009-2010 season?

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Ron Artest will do nothing but hurt the Lakers. These current Lakers are all about chemistry. No ones arguing about shots or anything, everyone loves their role and plays up to it. Ron Artest will come in and demand certain things and before long the Lakers will be in turmoil. And I don't want to hear how PJ is good at getting these type of players to play well. Rodman never went in the the stands and beat the crap out of fans, or took off games to make a crappy rap cd.

How can you say Odom is a mental liability and Ron Artest isn't? I'm all for doing nothing to this roster. The addition of Socks will be all we need.

Lamar = Laker for Life

GO LAKERS

the Kwammus thinks Kobe is a mortal lock to opt out, not to leave, but to get more $$$. Not saying he's a bad guy, that's just how it is...

as far as payroll, the Kwammus thinks we may already be over the pain threshold that Buss is willing to endure. One way out is certainly to sit on Odom through the season and let his contract expire. This would frustrate the Kwammus as we have seen how penny pinching affects you years later (see Phoenix). The best time to make a trade is when you are rich and running a surplus of good players.
****
MIAMI — The Miami Heat will start making their phone calls to free agents at 12:01 a.m. Tuesday, and team president Pat Riley will have two simple messages to most of those on the other end of his line.
Don't expect a bankbreaking offer.

And don't wait too long to decide, either.

"The players that are smart, that are on the cusp, that get talked into holding out by their agents might be very disappointed at the end," Riley said. "A player's got to know his value and know where he stands."

...Miami's other major need is center, and again, there aren't many options out there who likely be willing to settle for the short money Riley is talking about. DeSagana Diop (whom Dallas reportedly wants back) has been talked about as a Heat target, Kwame Brown is available and even Michael Doleac - another former Heat player - might be there for Riley's taking.

lovethelakeshow

"Interesting that people are here throwing around names such as Artest and others for the Lakers to sign with their full MLE. Yet seem to be ignoring these serious"

I don't think people are ignoring it when they talk about Artest. Many have posted several times about we might have to choose between players. Posey, Artest, vs Sasha, Ronny, DJ, Karl, Crawford, etc...

As Mitch said over the weekend, If Ronny or Sasha take too much time in deciding:(I assume to shop) the Lakers may do the same thing.

If we are prepared to sign our restricted agents, then the Lakers responsibly would be prepared to sign others if a better deal comes along.

I'll spell it out for you, so you can clearly understand how it works in the NBA.

If Ronny, Karl, DJ, Crawford together would cost you 5.8 and Artest costs you 5.8, who would you rather have?

My suggestion before you make comments like you did, is think first, before you belittle others.

I hope Artest becomes a Laker. I feel adding him will be the cherry on top

Complex - I have to admit Im not much of a Rap fan but I checked out the link you posted on the other thread and I was mezmerized by Jay Z's performance. I totally agree with you man.. he rocked London. My kid found the unedited concert with Beyonce dancing off stage and heres a warning to you Republicans... he issues a F-Bush and the crowd went nuts LOL. Be safe in your travels Brother.
http://colonisedminds.wordpress.com/2008/06/29/jay-z-glastonbury-performance-full/

Denver Dave

To Fatty:

That's my "Bruce Wayne" name. Do you know me from one of my other lives?

By the way, I have a very close friend from the Bay Area who is a King fan.

He told me that Artest just isn't the player he used to be.

I think we should collectively let go of this Artest fetish that's been developed.

Think Quinton Ross.

GO LAKERS!

FF,

>>>So, if Ron Ron opts out now, he chooses the team,
>>>(instant gratification) can immediately be on a winner,
>>>and over the next 5 years would realize only 2.5 mil
>> less in salary.

2.5 million per season. If it's a 5 year contract, that's 12.5
million total. That's a lot of cheddar.

The key is to give him opt outs after the first and third seasons.
That way, if there are a lot of teams with cash next summer
he has the opportunity to opt out and try to get a bigger
contract. And if he opts out after 3 years, then the team that
originally signed him can re-sign him for whatever they want.

Kwammus,

>>>Still wonder if the Lakers could work anything out with
>>>Chicago, Hinrich or Deng. Seems the salary cap issue
>>>kills both of those ideas unless... Sasha (sign and
>>>trade), Odom and ? get moved in trade to get one of
>>>those guys? Don't really see it happening.

We actually have exactly what Chicago wants. They tried
to trade for him several times but were rebuffed. If you
really want Deng, the Lakers could get him... for Gasol.
Might even be able to get them to throw in one of their
rookie contract guys like Tyrus Thomas or Joakim Noah.

>>>What about the scenerio I suggested before? What if RA
>>> opts out and Lakers offer 1 year MLE contract. Then he
>>> becomes FA and we can offer more as our FA if he
>>>pans out playing in our system with our players.

Not quite. He has to stay with a team for 3 years for them to
be able to offer more.

A 1 year contract is a mixed blessing - yes, it puts him back
into the free agent market next summer, when he might be
able to cash in for more. But it also means if he has a career
ending injury this season, then his income is done.

The best offer to make would be a full 5 year MLE with an
opt out after each season. Thus, he'd be covered in case
of injury, but at the same time would have the flexibility
to opt out to try the market at any time.

>>>Let us put some arbitrary figures. Supposing they get
>>>back Sasha at 5.5M, Turiaf at 3M. Mbenga at 0.8M,
>>>Karl at 0.8M Rookies: Crawford at 0.5M and
>>> Lue at 0.5M

Already have Karl signed for next season.

I doubt Lue would work for half a mil.

Okay, checked out the free agent list.

Firstly, Kwame at 10 is just dumb. He's shown to be a post defensive specialist with poor mobility, bad help D, can't play the power forward position even though he's the right height for it, and is a major liability on offense. Come on.

Mickael Pietrus, while an incredible athlete is a bit of an moron. I was incredibly frustrated watching him on Golden State. He'll probably have trouble learning the triangle. He also expressed interest in living closer to his family in the Caribbean. He's improved in mental performance, but given how bad I've seen him play I don't trust him at all.

Beno Udrih is great. He's tough. He can distribute and he can score. We could definitely use him. Signing him does create a glut at point guard, make it weird to decide what to do with Sun Yue and probably is insulting to Farmar. He's the right age. He'd fit well with the "It's a Small World" team we have going. He had quite a few injury issues this season. We probably can't get him since the Kings made it clear he can serve as their point by shipping Mike Bibby.

Maggette is great and would be a huge improvement at the 3, but I'm not sure his defense would be good enough for us. Do we need another slasher? I guess it would never hurt to have another guy that can earn free throws at will. The Clippers organization has had major issues with Maggette, not really sure why. Too injury prone?

Posey obviously does a great job of filling a need. Tough, good-defending vet at SF that can shoot the 3. Perfect fit.

Najera is a dirty, dirty player and as annoying as he is, I think we could use him. He brings toughness and effort, including at the defensive end.

Interestingly enough, many of the guys are Denver (Anthony Carter, Melo is okay, original K-Mart, and Camby) are good individual defenders. Something is just very wrong with their team defense.

Matt Barnes reminds me of Odom a bit. He's less talented and doesn't rebound as well. He's got more heart and he's more consistent.

For restricted free agents...

Igoudala and Josh Smith are young studs that we could use. We probably can't get either of them. I see Atlanta dumping Woodson before Smith, but the league is always full of surprises like NY getting D'Antoni as a coach.

Calderon is a very talented point guard with tight execution (low turnovers). Same issues as with Udrih. We probably can't get him since Toronto demonstrated their commitment to him by shipping TJ Ford.

I like Josh Childress a lot. Young, high energy, good rebounder, high shooting percentage. I haven't paid much attention to his defense. Any SF we get has to be able to defend. He's young enough and athletic enough perhaps we can mold him.

James Jones can shoot, but without the strong overall team D of the Trailblazers, can he defend?

Utzworld,

Sorry if it looked like I was getting to personal. I was at another site for 'meet up groups', saw the 'utzworld' and wondered if you were one and the same.

Don't worry, I won't be showing up at your door. lol

Thanks for responding.

Benjamin,

Thanks for the reply. I am not really sold on Artest, but since the Fam is talking about him, I might as well chime and dime with our blog.

If we do push for him, I am all about short term. And make him show and prove.

"I don't know if any of you watched the Kings this season, but Ron Ron had a nice looking 3."
Yes I did. What's more impressive is when he knew to drive to the basket in 2-3rd gear after making a couple of outside shots. It looked like he was in slow-mo and bulled his way and the defenses could'nt stop him.

His decision making is my main concern. But with KB24 as the top dog, that may alleviate the leadership pressure.

In all honesty, I share AK's and Matt Money Smith's (AM570) opinion about the free agency. Keep the current team. (Mbenga-Karl-Newble out) And someone like Posey becomes available, sign that person.

Reminiscent of Payton and Malone, if a great player is available, why not. (RA) I just hope it's the Malone mentality instead of the Payton kind.

Best,

Morning all....At the end of the day Shawn Marion is the safer option (mentally that is)..Just like the Gasol trade,if Mitch does make a trade it will be conservative ..If the Lakers traded with Miami without it being a sign and trade for Marion wouldnt his contract be a bigger better chip to have than Odom's. ?.The Lakers would also need to send parts for the contracts to match the 17mill ..Luke(cough) or Vlad(cough)...And the heat would want to send a dud back as well....I like Marion and understand he could go unrestricted but if things went really sour 17mill would be a hell of a lot of money to come off the books for another team at the deadline not to mention could bring back some decent talent.