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Most... talented... draft class... EVER

PROGRAMMING NOTE: The season may be over, but Purple, Gold, and Blue isn't.  Today at 11 am.  Hit the show widget on the side of the page, or enter the chat board by clicking here. 

In the spirit of Thursday's upcoming draft, SI's Chris Mannix speculates how each team would select from a pool of players currently in the NBA.  Same order (Chicago first, Miami second, Minny third, etc.).  Very different results.  And check out which team just happens to have the most players selected.  Not to reveal any head-spinning spoilers, but one of them is Kobe Bryant.

How the hell does Eddy Curry not make the cut?


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Do people at SI have nothing to do all day?

Good Morning!

Thursday is Draft day?

Great! I'll take a Bass Pale Ale, a Hefeweizen, and a Budweiser for my domestic friend.

Absolute Truth,

Maker's Mark and Dit Da Wan (Wine Version) for me!

Caharles, Absolute.....make mine a Fat Tire!

Interesting in that it is skewed toward young players with upside. Would be different if you allowed 1 year contracts only, in which case you'd see Kobe, Duncan, Garnett and Pierce move up to the top, and see Howard, et al fall. LeBron would probably still be top three.

I think it would be more interesting to assume the players are all the same age (since we're having a hypothetical draft anyway)

BTW, how do they have Oden going before Socks?

Another idea that would be cool would be to take the "best of" each draft position.

Who's the best 24th pick ever? Who's the best #1?

I'll go out on a limb here and say the best #3 pick was MJ and the best #13 pick was KB24.


Dry hopped with a nutty malt flavor and hoppy aroma?

Interesting how well the Spurs come out. Oden 6 spots ahead of Bynum? How? Bynum has 2 and half years of NBA experience to Oden's zero. Oden had the much more serious injury. Crazy.

I think Bynum, with a bit of speculation of course, could have cracked the top 10. Ironic from last year to this year but it is shaping up to be a brilliant pick.

I have still yet to see Howard do anything when it counts. He has immense physical gifts. Le Bron was from another planet when he won that game against Detroit last year and also how he played in game 7 this year. Hard to argue against him number 1 but Kobe also hard to agrue at number 1. Kobe at worse is a clear number 2 for me although it would be a Bird Magic situation for 1 and 2.

Kobe's position was hurt (justifiably) relative to the others because of his age.

I don't see how anybody can make an argument that Kobe shouldn't be #1 on that list. He's got another 5 years ahead of him, possibly tapering off a little towards the 35-36 year old range. Even after that, he could play another 2-4 years if he leans more on, say Bynum, if they are still together. He's the full package, he's better than Lebron, etc. at taking over games in the clutch, playing D on the other teams best man, plus he's probably the greatest box office draw in the league today. Nobody puts in more hours preparing for a game or season for that matter than Kobe. I don't see the logic in picking a Lebron or Wade or whoever, expecting them to ever approach the level Kobe is currently at and will stay at for the next 5 years.

I also think Oden is being overhyped and Durant should be much higher on that list but... this is why some people win fantasy leagues and others lose. LOL!

Hey... I didn't see Kwame on that list, the ROCK, the GREAT CALVES of the Sacred Trust, the man they call... CAKE...

Charles........correct my friend, a wonderful draught ale

Kobe's position was hurt (justifiably) relative to the others because of his age.

Posted by: exhelodrvr | June 25, 2008 at 10:15 AM


I know the shaq rap this is pretty much a dead issue at this point but someone wrote this on another blog and i hought it was pretty funny:

Sorry Shaq but Kobe didn’t f*ck ya wife good enough to buy him a house, cars, and clothes with ya money, the personal trainer she hired did. That’s why ur getting divorced!!!! Shaq is a joke and disgrace to basketball right now!! He had to chance to be a true hall of famer until last night. Freestyle or no freestyle, this guy still wanna hold a grudge with Kobe after all these years. Kobe’s gonna be the bigger person because he’s moved on. Shaq is nothin more than a cancer to any team he’s on now. His play ( or lack of play) contributed to the demise of a promising organization with the Heat. Now he’s in Phoenix and can barely run up the court!! Phoenix will never make it out the first round while Shaq’s playing. He’s obviously is at the final stages of his once respectable career, but attacking Kobe is not the way to go. It was a classless and gutless act. On top of all that, the freestyle itself was sorry as hell!!! He better stick to tryin to be a "rental cop" cause basketball and rapping has departed him!!! .

I hope cats stop putting Luke Walton and Vladamir Radmonovic in trade proposals.

No NBA team on earth will trade for Luke with 5 yrs left on the ridiculous contract he signed with us at a vulnerable time last yr. We would not make that deal this yr with a stronger team, at least I hope not.

Nobody wants Radmanovic for 3 yrs at that price.
He might be worth something in 2 summers maybe if packaged with someone else.

We're screwed with him too.

The D wanting B Diddy Boom Davis?

A number of posts here about the age factor and I agree... it just struck me in reading the article, how much aging, through either years or injuries, is factoring into the current NBA landscape.... it will be interesting to see where the league is, 5 years or more from now. Will new stars fill the vacuum as quickly as the old ones leave?

If anyone gets read bored, take a look at the draft and list three players that you think might become true all-stars.

Dave M

Iron Man, The Hulk, and Nick Fury.


I hope you are wrong. But in this case, you make total sense.

Hopefully where there is dumb, there is Memphis.


Caveat to my last post - I'm pretty dubious that there ARE three possible all-stars in this draft.... but the future stars have to come from somewhere. My own picks: Derrick Rose and a couple of longshots that might pay off in 5 years - Danilo Gallianari and Courtney Lee. I'll duck now, haha.

The way it's looking right now, I'd guess that the Lakers expect Radmanovic to become the player they originally signed and fill the SF position with Ariza providing 15-20 minutes off the bench. Odom doesn't make any sense playing with the starting group so maybe the 6th man theory is right, he could be the leader of the second group which would have 3 point shooting in Farmar and Sasha to spread the floor with Odom playing the PF slot and either Mihm or KWAME BROWN at Center.

I don't know where this leaves Turiaf but that's a real solid second unit that could obviously be altered due to foul trouble or injury. Again, you have to ask, where does Luke Walton fit in here? He's not going to be on the first unit, he simply can't play the minutes without getting injured and Ariza, Sasha and Odom fill possible "Walton" slots on the second unit. Radmanovic is needed as a 3 point threat for the first unit unless the Lakers bring somebody else in, like Posey - would he even start? or ???

I'm starting to agree with the theory the best move the Lakers can make with Odom is to sit on him until the trade deadline and decide if they want anything back for him at all or just let his contract expire, allowing them to spend on the players they already have.

Charles - fine then, nix my last - I'll toss in the Silver Surfer, Mr. Fantastic and James Bond (going with more of a finesse game).


Ok, Al Harrington wants out of Golden State. Nelson loves streaky-i dont care about defense-outside shooters.

Would you (don't bust a vein brother) and others trade for Al Harrington = Vlad and Mihm? Salaries match.

Scalaweenie was paid $15 mill for 3 years to sit on the bench for the Keltics. And I'm sure Golden State Donnie would give Vlad more PT.

Just curious...

Dave M,

You think Michael Beasley might turn out to be the next Danny Granger? In other words, could be poor man's Scottie Pip; but developing in 2nd gear?

Maxwell Smart (from the TV show), Jim West, and Sgt Troy from "The Rat Patrol"

Kwammas Brownus the III ,

Ariza - After Craig Hodges shooting camp or Sign Posey if he will take the mid level.

2nd Unit
Turiaf (Bird rights resign)
Radmanovich (3 6'10" guys on the front court)
Vujacic (Bird rights resign)

Mihm, Walton, maybe develop and resign Mbenga.

Kwammas Brownus says this draft looks like the biggest collection of stiffs in years. The Lakers picked a great year to trade their pick away because they wouldn't have gotten anything of value anyway.

Who wants to lay odds Roy Hibbert is out of the league in 3 years? What about the Lopez brothers? Which one will end up in Europe in 3 years?

Kwammas Brownus also says, what's the difference in having the 25th pick or the 45th pick? I'd rather have the high second rounder because their contracts aren't guaranteed. Whatever happened to J. R. Pinnock? Kwammas Brownus doesn't remember flexing his massive calves over a laid out J. R. Pinnock on an NBA court...

Kwammas Brownus also says we should trade up for Bill Walker for the sheer entertainment value. Doesn't matter if he ever plays in the NBA, we all want to see him dunk in the preseason.

I'd like to see Gasol in the weight room all summer for one. Odom working on the outside shot and finishing at the rim... and Trevor working on the mid-range game.

Charles I like the line-up above but, the spacing on offense would/could be off with no outside shooter(s). They'd clog the paint all day if Fish and Ariza can't hit from 15 and out....V-Rad helps spread the floor when he's in the game and making the shots.

Charles -

If you're handing out drinks, I'd love to have a cask conditioned ale - served at room temperature, please!



So the finals are over and Gunner's back to being the hater,
huh? So since you know so much about Michael Jordan,
you know that he didn't make it out of the first round until
after the Bulls acquired some quality help... especially
Scottie Pippen, a second future hall-of-famer.

So do you know what Jordan did the first year he had
Scottie Pippen to help him out?

Clearly from your ignorant statements you dont.

1988 - Jordan and Pippen go down 4-1 in the second round
of the playoffs.

So the first time that Jordan actually had quality help,
he didn't make it to the finals. In fact they barely made
it out of the first round.

The first time (post Shaq) Kobe had quality help, he did
make it to the finals. Granted, Pippen was a rookie his
first year together with Jordan, but by his second year
he was putting up as good a numbers as Gasol puts up
for the Lakers.

The second year Jordan and Pippen teamed up, they lost
to Detroit int the Eastern Conference finals. When Kobe
got handed Gasol, he managed to make it to the NBA
finals in their FIRST season together, and they only had
1/3 of a season at that.

The third year Jordan and Pippen teamed up, they lost
in the Eastern Conference Finals to Detroit (again).

So Jordan, even with a future hall-of-famer sidekick (which
Gasol isn't) never even MADE it to the finals his first three
tries. He lost to the older and more experienced team.
Kobe and his young teammates BEAT the older and more
experienced team (San Antonio) on their first try.

It wasn't until Jordan's FOURTH season paired up with
Scottie Pippen that he even MADE the finals. And then
he won... and won two more the next two years.

It takes time for a team to get chemistry. You can rant
senselessly about Kobe all you want right now, but when
this same team is mopping up the floor with Cleveland
or Orlando in the finals next season (Boston won't make
it next year), perhaps you will start to gain a tiny glimmer
of a clue. Until then, calm down and wipe that foam off
of your mouth.

Charles - Beasley's definitely a real good player but (like Love) he's a bit undersized at the 4 and I don't know if he can make it in the league as a 3.

exhelodrvr - excellent choices! What about Lurch? Can't teach size as they say.

Let's get focused, team!

We've got a second round draft pick!

Who are we picking?


AK, interesting idea by Chris Mannix, but I think he should have done an entire draft to fill full rosters and see what the teams would look like. Then each team, based on where they were in the draft order, would have to consider what players would be available after every other team had drafted and rather than take the player with the most potential, they may consider taking a center because there may not be any top caliber centers after the first round. Perimeter players, although all the Wades and Kobes would be gone, there maybe some reasonable players available in the 2nd and 3rd rounds. That would have been more interesting.

Kwammas - I agree, this year's draft is actually a lot more interesting once you get past the top ten or so... as for Bill Walker, he may slip pretty far down anyway. I think J.R. Pinnock's bedazzling in Greece.


I agree that we are stuck with Walton for awhile unless he gets back on track, at which case it wouldnt matter. But Vlade on the other hand would be marketable for run and gun teams off the bench. He tends to shoot better in transition, then he does in the half court set. Now could we get back anything we need in return is the real question. With salary cap issues, perhaps an expiring contract would be enough.


I say... DRAFT Mbah a Moute!

See how Sun Yue does in summer league.

Sign Quinton Ross!

Retain Coby Karl, Ronny Turiaf, and The Machine!



I'll tell you what...

Every player better come back next year with something added to their game.

Vlad, that means you buddy. It's a rare occasion that a team comes as close to a championship as we did, and I hope the players take advantage of their circumstances and come back next year with specific, tangible improvements. Bynum needs to hold the block better. Ariza needs a jumper. Kobe needs to work on his 3 point shooting and passing. A lot of players need to work on their shooting and defense. Maybe add some muscle.

Next year is going to be one heck of an exciting year. I can't wait for training camp to see how Bynum and Gasol mesh.



Jon K

Look up JR Giddens.

Caliphilosopher - LakerFaze

Finger point at cha'

Okay Jon, since you want to get serious...

Three choices:

Courtney Lee if he drops that far (doubtful)
D.J. White - 6'9" banger from Indiana
Ante Tomic - 7'1" from Croatia - skinny kid, maybe we retain his rights, let him keep developing in euro

I'm looking thru the Sports Illustrated magazine that features KG and Bill Russell on the cover.
And I'm sick to my stomach.
I hate the Celtics.
However, I admire the toughness of:
The Big Ticket (Kevin Garnett)
The Truth (Paul Pierce)
Jesus Shuttlesworth (Ray Allen)
I love the Lakers.
However, we have a soft team.
The Lakers will not beat the Cs with Lamar/Luke/VladRad.
Man, I'm depressed all over again.

Michael H,

Aloha and I will be in Maui the week of August 11th. Any good spots to hunt Hapas? Hopefully the Olivia Munn type or Arianny Celeste looking. I know the islands have some

Anyways. What do you think of: Al Harrington = Vlad and Mihm?



GOOD call and analysis with regards to Vlad and Walton...I am getting tired of all these trade scenarios by people who just package 2 or 3 of our worst players for one good player on another's time to wake up...nobody would be willing to take Vlad or Walton..those two dudes are here to stay so let's make the best of it!

I am very intrigued by the discussion of Odom coming off the bench. Would it work? Who knows. With the Lakers front line being so big, spacing might not even be an issue since we'll be able to dominate the inside so much!

I know everybody is weary of the whole "Shaq Disses Kobe" thing, but this link provides the best analysis of this pitiful situation that I've read.


I know some of you are going to think I'm crazy, but:
How do you blow a 24 point lead in game 4?
How do lose by 39 points in game 6?
And how do you do the above to the hated Celtics?
The Celtic players understand the history being a Celtic.
The Celtic players understand the need to hate the Lakers.
The Lakers do not understand the 2 above sentences.
PS: remember when Luke stated-after losing to Phoenix in 5 games-"let's win some championships?"
Again, sad.

Morning all.........Charles.....Talking beer...A Coopers pale ale for me...Brewed right here in South Australia...Even a Sparkling ale would be nice...South Australia makes some of the best wines world wide but our beer is right up to par as well..

Its being reported over here that Australia will play the USA soon,and the hype in the papers over here is all about Kobe and Lebron..The USA will kill us but some players to look out for people of the LA Times Blog...

David Barlow...6,8..Great shot and as strong as an ox
Chris Anstey...7,1..Played for the Mavs when Kidd played first time around..

Patty Mills..Plays for ST MARY'S College in LA...Is as fast as TJ FORD and Parker...
David Anderson..Just signed with Barcelona with Navaro from the Grizz..7,0 foot..
Nathan Jawai....Should go late first round tomorrow....I would like to see him go to a bad team so he can get a little playing time...

dave m,
"What about Lurch? Can't teach size as they say"

Supposedly he's not a good teammate.

Odom off the bench makes the most sense from what I see. The first unit needs a 3 point threat to spread the floor, so you would have Fisher or Farmar as one, then the SF would be the other, allowing Kobe to either play outside or drive the lane. So Radmanovic, if he could up his defensive skills at all, would be the most likely starter. Walton can shoot the 3 but he can also go into a tailspin and he's also injury prone so I just don't see Phil depending on him as a starter.

You get towards a few minutes left in the first quarter, Odom could come in at PF, Bynum and Fisher could rest, Gasol moves up to C, and you now have this year's lineup with Farmar at PG.

If Radmanovic gets in foul trouble, this is where Luke would come in for his 3 point shooting to keep the floor spread OR Ariza develops his 3 point shot over the summer.

Second quarter, Kobe, Gasol and Radmanovic sit if Radmanovic wasn't already in foul trouble, Sasha, Ariza and the backup Center comes in, say Mihm. Again, you've got pretty good spacing with Farmar and Sasha hovering outside, Ariza will have to find a midrange game, Odom would be the anchor of the unit and we'll see if Mihm can get some of his offensive game back.

Then the starters would rotate back in. Where does Walton fit in this scenario? What about Turiaf? I'd like to keep Turiaf as injury protection but some other team may just make him a good offer.

I like MBenga as a person but... come on... dude is a stiff, he may get a little better but... hopefully Mihm will be ok otherwise... this is why I'd be all for bringing back Kwame. The 2nd unit would be pretty solid, we wouldn't need Kwame to score at all. MBenga isn't an offensive threat either - he just hasn't been studied yet by players around the league so whatever cute little shot he comes up with will eventually be STUFFED. I'd rather have Kwame's giant calves back there putting some wear and tear on the other team's starting Center. Then Bynum could come back in and whale on him.

That's a 10 deep lineup right there, and if we still have Luke, he would be the 11th in case there are any injuries.


Hello. Sparkling ale. That sounds nice.

David Barlow reminds me of a Walter Herman. Bit of a tweener but can certainly bang.



Good Job and Thanks for the link!

There are probably over 5000 better beers than Budweiser made in the US. Please, don't impose that swill upon us. A beer made with rice instead of 100 percent barley because rice is cheaper can't be considered a decent beer. The initial taste isn't bad. The lack of aftertaste due to the rice in it is inexcusable.

I'll personally take a Grottenbier from Belgium. It's the best of the 1200+ beers I've tried. Just simply extraordinary.

Zum voll!

exhelodrvr ,

Lurch is too tall. Even when Christina Ricci played Wednesday Addams,
her Forehead was too big. Now Black Snake is a different story.

Have a good one and thanks for flying and protecting the US, Chopper Man.


I like Al Harrington pretty well, but he's too much like Odom, just not as good. He has a better, yet very inconsistent, outside shot. His defense isn't as good, his passing is worse. He's more inconsistent offensively and he plays way smaller than his 6'10" body. His defense is unproven.

As much as Vlad frustrates me, I think with Harrington we lose Vlad's shooting. We also gain another tweener at 3/4 when we've already got one of those in Odom, a decent backup 4 (regular season and home playoff games so far) in Turiaf, Pau starting at 4, Ariza at 3 possibly backing up Odom and Walton at 3.

Harrington is a neat, athletic, talented player, but I'm not sure what he adds to this team. I do think some of his talents have been masked by Nellie's use of him (or lack thereof).

If Harrington's shooting and offense were more consistent (and they might be when he's not playing 4/5) and I felt he could defend the 3 better, I'd gladly pick him up.

Currently, I think it's at best a lateral move.

Kwammas Brownus the III,

Fisher, Farmar, and Ariza need to train with Craig Hodges all summer. (Shooting)
The little training that Ariza did with him improved his shot.

The Coaching Staff needs a Defensive Mentality change. Cooper for the Perimeter,
and Cap needs to add Turiaf, Mihm, and Gasol for both ends of the floor.

Kwame needs a brain transplant and remove the stones in his finger tips.


Have you tried Booker's? Now THAT is one hell of a bourbon. Knob Creek and Woodford Reserve aren't so bad either. The single barrel Wild Turkeys and Jack Daniel's are also quite good, though Jack isn't a bourbon.

Be careful though, Booker's is like 117 proof. It's much better as a digestif or as the last 1-2 drinks of an evening. A protective coating of a few beers is most helpful.


You have Sashimi with a Dark one?


Thanks for the reply and input... Knob Creek is always my 2nd. I am a Kentucky Bourbon kinda guy. I once mixed Dewars and Woodford and my carpet hasn't been the same since.

Booker's I haven't. Unfortunately the Single Barrel's are all junior college trials mixed in with Mexican Beers and Mixers and faulty pick up lines. "Nice shoes wanna fu@*!"

I also like Sangria's and Sake Sangrias. (I used to manage a Salsa Club, forgive me.) Go figure an Asian guy in a Guayabera.

Thanks for the input on Al Harrington. His contract expires in 2009. I figure that might be the benefit added to his athleticism.


what about SUN YUE!! he could be a great off the ball defender.

passionate Lakers fan,

“The Lakers will not beat the Cs with Lamar/Luke/VladRad.
Man, I'm depressed all over again.”

How about Bynum/Pau/Lamar? Andrew Bynum would have made the difference in that series even if we didn’t have Pau Gasol. Before his injury, Drew was probably the single most physical power player in the NBA. Just replay the Making of a Beast YouTube.

I also agree that issue of SI really sucks. I just threw my copy in the trash without even reading. I know you are still really bummed out by the way the Lakers lost in the Finals but the team overachieved with Pau at center and just ran out of gas when they ran into a hot and tougher Boston team. In my mind, the Lakers lost some of the hunger of earlier rounds once they won the West and became the favorite not only to win this year but for many years to come. It’s the problem of coming too far too fast in my mind. Even Kobe seemed to lack the fire of the earlier rounds. Anyway, that’s my take on the loss.

As for Luke and Vlad, it’s going to be hard for either guy to get playing time next year with Lamar and Trevor holding down the small forward position but both will can be very effective in the right matchup. I just hope they will dedicate themselves to making their games better next year. If they do, then they both will be contributors, although with less playing time overall.


There is a flaw in concept that trading Lamar Odum at the trading deadline will bring the most value. His 14.5 million expiring contract on the surface looks very enticing but look at the following salaries of players in the last year of their contracts.

1. Mike Bibby -------------------------15.2
2. Wally Szczerbiak------------------13
3. Jason Kidd--------------------------21.3
4. Allen Iverson-----------------------21.9
5. Rasheed Wallace------------------13.6


What an absolutely stellar post. Talk about bringing some perspective back to Kobe's legacy. People tend to forget that Jordan also failed... and didn't start winning championships until he was, um, just about the age that Kobe's at now.

Nothing shuts up Gunner like the simple TRUTH. Actually, nothing shuts up Gunner like the Lakers winning. Can't wait to listen to all of his silence next year.

Go Lake Show!

The Kwammas was able to purchase a large bottle of Ancient Age for around $12. The Kwammas then downed several large mixed glasses of Ancient Age, ice and 7Up. The Kwammas was then driven to an undisclosed location where he paid a very large amount for an undefined amount of lapdances. The Kwammas was then driven back home. The Kwammas decided the $12 bottle of Ancient Age wasn't so cheap afterall...

The next time, the Kwammas decided to forego the Ancient Age. The undisclosed location was entertaining and the Kwammas drove the group back home. The next day the Kwammas took the money that was not lost at the undisclosed location and bought a new set of 4 tires for his car at Costco. The Kwammas was pleased.


I'm not sure what you mean by "a Dark one."

Certain beverages don't require very careful food complement selection. They aren't easily overpowered by any food, but don't have a taste trademark that interferes with the flavors of a meal. Grottenbier is strong, yet mellow enough to fit into that category. Booker's is a little overpowering and I think you'd want to wait for the taste to fade before you took another bite of your food. That's why I'd suggest it a a digestif, after dinner. I think Grottenbier would go fine with sashimi, but I would feel weird eating sashimi or any sushi with something other than sake or Japanese beer.

At this point, I think the web is filled with food pairings for just about every well known beer or wine. Grottenbier would certainly be included. It's probably one of the 50 best known Belgian beers that gourmets tend to go all ga-ga over.

A quick google search suggested earthy cheeses as a pairing (Camembert, Fontina) and that it would work as a general pairing or as an aperitif (appetizer).

From what I've read (I have only general knowledge), if you stick with standard beers of a region, you can usually pair those beers with the most common cuisine of a region.

Looks like I'm accidentally getting your whole meal planned out here. Start with the Grottenbier and finish with a Booker's.

dave m/Charles,

I'd be real happy with either JR Giddens or DJ White.


You know what, guys?

I have this green shirt that I love. One of my favorite shirts, right?

Ever since the Finals. I haven't been able to wear it.

Don't know if I can wear it again.

By the way, what passionate Lakers fan said, “The Lakers will not beat the Cs with Lamar/Luke/VladRad" is just crazy.

A year of maturation with a healthy Treavor Ariza, Chris Mihm, and Andrew Bynum and the signing of Quinton Ross to replace Ira Newble = A Championship.

Pure and Simple.

We'll be better next year. Much.

The Celtics won't.



6. Baron Davis----------------------17.1
7. Elton Brand-----------------------16.4
8. Shawn Marion-------------------17.1
9. Stephon Marbury----------------21.9
10. Andre Miller----------------------10

Unlike Kwame Browns expiring contract of last year, this year total of expiring contracts are ridiculous, and Lamar's contract will be one of many options for GM's to considered, thus the value of his contract is considerably less than it's face value.
The Lakers best option is to either trade early or not at all. Because come the trading deadline, GET IN LINE.


I too appreciated the historical perspective you provided. Thanks! I feel better after reading it.

Do You See What I See,

You bring up an important point. It will be interesting to see what happens with those other guys.

I think Iverson stays and takes a pay cut unless Denver wants to completely blow up the team. Even then, it might be hard to trade his 22 M contract for something worthwhile to Denver.

I think Atlanta likes Bibby and might want to give that team a chance to succeed. It's still possible they go for a more defensive team overall and better defender at point guard. If that's the case, Bibby might get traded.

Wally world at 13M seems expensive. What do the Cavs do with him? He's never been the same since coming back from his injury. Can he play defense?

J. Kidd? Not sure. I suspect he gets more time to mix with the Mavs. Will he take a pay cut? It doesn't seem the Mavs are teams to blow it up and start over. It seems like Cuban is in the permanently Win Now mindset.

Sheed? He's still got some mileage. The Pistons said they're looking to blow it up so I think he's attractive as a pickup for a contending team. I used to really think he was overrated and too much of a head case. Lately I realized he's a lot better than that. I almost wish we needed a power forward. I really like his man to man D. I think his appeal is different. He's not salary cap fodder like Odom and the rest of this group.

I'm not really sure where this entire group stands just like I don't know where Odom stands.

You do bring up a great point that if we're marketing Odom as salary cap relief, we've got some serious competition. Still, 14M isn't anything to sneeze at. We know Phoenix is always looking to save a buck. Hell, let's get Stoudemire and trade him for Lebronze! If only, huh?

Good point, Do You See What I See,

But I think although those players do have large expiring contracts, a lot of these guys are pretty old and it's only going to be just a Kwame Brown to Memphis type trade. Odom will at least give the other team a decent 6-10 PF that they can re-sign for about 6-7 million less to save some salary space. I guess though with the Lebron sweepstakes coming up in a couple of years, I think there may be many teams just interested in dumping salary rather than getting better.

Oh, I didn't see 6-10, Do You See What I See. Nevermind what I said in the last post. Sorry about that.

Has there been any word about the Lakers talking about an offering Odom an extension? Or are they waiting to see what happens with Sasha and Ronny? Or is it too early to offer one? Not to read into it too much, but could the Lakers be holding off so that they're really interested in trading him?

I feel like I'm already over the limit in driving home just reading our alcohol chat.

Do You See What I See,
Thanks for the numbers. That creates a Whole different perspective on trading Lamar. Get in line is right!

check it....last week kobe couldn't do it without me!

that's the different between last place..

"Kobe, tell me how my a%$ taste?"

I'm a horse, Kobe (punk) ratted me out, that's why I'm getting a divorce.

Once again, "Kobe, tell me how my a%$ taste?"

passionate Laker fan,

>>>I love the Lakers.
>>>However, we have a soft team.

Yeah, I remember people saying that about the 1984 Lakers after they lost to the Celtics
in the finals. That was the year of the famous clotheslining of Kurt Rambis.

People were saying, "Oh the Lakers are good, but they're a finesse team, and they aren't
tough enough to handle the Celtics.".

In 85, the Lakers came back with basically the same team and beat the Lakers in 6.

Bynum and Ariza will add enough toughness to turn a 2-4 loss into a 4-2 win... if Boston
can actually make it back to the finals next season.


Anybody else think that the final player selections for Team USA Basketball looked eerily the same as four years ago? The roster looks more like a shoe company all-star team rather than a team put together to work as team. What happened to the talk about putting designed for international play? Too many shoe customers in China?

I mean, Carmello Antony and Dwayne Wade were big reasons we didn’t win last time. This now is looking like their chance for redemption. What happened to defenders and shooters? We have one center in Dwight Howard and only one certified shooter in Michael Redd. But we got a lot of guys who can dunk and sell shoes.


And is anybody else bothered that the rest of the world has taken the game we invented and changed the rules so that it is to their advantage and our disadvantage? It’s ironic to think that the rest of the world plays a different game. I mean, do playground basketball courts overseas have trapezoidal lanes drawn on the asphalt? What ever happened to old school and tradition. International rules are almost as bad as WNBA rules.


No matter how much I try to leave the Shaq freestyle video behind, the angrier I get over the free pass that most of the media world is giving the Big Nothing. If I hear one more hip-hop street-cred fool of an expert justify Shaq’s tasteless and talentless behavior by claiming Kobe deserved it, I am going to go ballistic.

I sure hope Kobe has enough common sense to just say “No comment” when asked about the incident. You can also bet money that if it were LeBron James that Shaq had slurred in his rap, Commissioner Stern would already have suspended O’Neal. By not reacting, Stern is basically telling Kobe to get screwed. Way to go, Commissioner. You tool.


I do have to give Shaq credit for giving all of his detractors and haters the perfect line to use every time he gets dunked on or dissed. You may not hear it on the air from the broadcaster but you know that Drew and Kobe will both be looking for opportunities to ask Shaq how his @ss tastes.


Chris Mannix’s mock draft was interesting, although the Lakers get screwed as usual, getting overrated Kevin Durant and losing Kobe Bryant, Andrew Bynum, and Pau Gasol. Why keep the order of teams drafting the same when everybody loses all of their players? It’s like what would happen if Al Gore actually became the NBA Commissioner. Too fantasy league for me although the Lakers did have the most players drafted.

And as was immediately pointed out, many of the selections bordered on ridiculous, such as LeBron before Kobe or Oden before Bynum. It was good to see Mannix at least was smart enough to include Drew at 17th but no general manager would still have his job if they were to select Dwayne Wade, Amare Stoudemire, Chris Bosh, Carmelo Anthony, Dirk Nowitzki, or Tony Parker before Andrew Bynum. Read the writing on the wall.


After the dust has settled, I think our young Lakers team just ran out of gas in the Finals after over-achieving with Pau Gasol at center and with Andrew Bynum injured. Once the Lakers won the West and were crowned as a future dynasty, the Lakers basically lost the hunger that they had as the underdog and just ran into a team that was hotter and hungrier than they were without Andrew Bynum. But if Drew had played (even without Pau), the Lakers would have won the series and be the champions, as they will prove next year.

Andrew Bynum ends parity in the NBA in 2009. The Era of the Beast begins.


Now, trade scenarios.

Stephon Marbury for

Jason Kidd for
Lamar+Luke+ Farmar

Allen Iverson for

Rasheed Wallace for

Mike Bibby for

Baron Davis for

Elton Brand for

Shawn Marion for

Andre Miller+ player for

We need a point guard or a forward


The Canadian Baller article was awsome. Thank you for the reads...

Shaq is an A$$....can't wait to see how it ends in Phoenix......can't wait..... it fall yet????

Shout out to the OG Bloggers.....going on 3 or is it 4 years did you guys start this???

peace -




If only

It certainly is fun playing GM, I like all the different perspectives and choices that are available.

But we do have a pretty good team and standing pat isn't a bad option.

I heard that the Clippers are going to trade away Elton Brand. That would not only be a shame, but the stupidest thing they could do.


Do You See What I See,

Wow, there's more!

Elton Brand is worth it. B-diddy and Marion are worth a lot, but maybe not their contracts. Andre Miller is probably a little overpriced, but not horribly.

Marbury is obviously the biggest salary cap relief bomb that the world has ever seen. If he is utilized as such, he could destroy a medium-sized country. NY may need to just let him explode at home to get within a few light years of the salary cap. Or maybe try to trade him for Lebronze and change. I don't see the Cavs just giving up right now though.

I would love to get either B-diddy or Marion. Both have some issues (B-diddy's reckless shooting and health, Marion's inconsistent shooting and attitude), but both are very good individual defenders and overall some of the best 2-way players in the league.

Fisher has been great, but probably only has a few good years left. We need someone with his veteran savvy, heart, and defense. We need to plan ahead now how we're going to replace his output, particularly what he did for us in the playoffs.



for the next 5 years.

You do paint a picture of Odom's expiring contract being less and less helpful to us.

Laker Tom
"How about Bynum/Pau/Lamar? Andrew Bynum would have made the difference in that series even if we didn’t have Pau Gasol. Before his injury, Drew was probably the single most physical power player in the NBA. Just replay the Making of a Beast YouTube."

As much as I like your optimism, what evidence do you have that Andrew w/o Pau would handle the Celtics? We lost both games rather handily with Bynum w/o Gasol. Andrew was definitely coming on but we don't KNOW if he would have made all the difference vs. the Celtics. This is a young up and coming player, not a proven All-Star.

Has anybody else heard about a
LUKE & LO for Marion trade on the table?

A normally sensible source mentioned it this morning...

apologies if it's old news, been off for my birthday.

passionate Laker fan,

>>>How do you blow a 24 point lead in game 4?
>>>PS: remember when Luke stated-after losing to Phoenix in 5 games-"let's win
>>>some championships?"

Nice job. You really show that you know what you're talking about here. So you blame
Luke for losing the 24 point lead in game 4. Is that right?

Maybe it would be nice if you actually watched the game and knew what happened.

When Luke left the game with 8:12 left in the 2nd quarter, the Lakers led by 21 points.

So Luke was really soft giving up those 21 points FROM THE BENCH.

I get the point. You're a Luke hater, and aside from the Denver series, Luke didn't give
the fans many reasons to be a Luke FAN this season. But to pin any of the losses by
the Lakers on one player (or 3 players) just displays ignorance. The whole TEAM lost
that 24 point lead over the course of 2 and a half quarters.

I'll point out to you that in game 2 the Celtics gave up all but 2 points of a 24 point lead
over the course of 7 1/2 minutes of the fourth quarter! Seriously, with 7:54 left in the
game, the Celtics led 95-71, and with 38 seconds left, the score was 104-102. If Fish
doesn't foul Pierce with 22 seconds left, the Lakers could have gone down to the other
end of the court and won the game.

Yes, the Lakers didn't manage to finish the job, but the point is that the Celtics blew a
huge lead as well, and in a much shorter period of time. And note that it's not that Boston
put the bottom of the bench in. The Lakers made a 22 point comeback in 7 minutes
against Garnett, Pierce, Allen, Posey, and Rondo.

Does that make the Celtics "soft"? No. What it means is that a team got a huge lead
and started playing to try to protect a lead rather than continuing to attack aggressively
on offense.

So if you want to call teams soft, then yes both the Lakers and the Celtics were soft at
times. But to pin it on 1 or 2 or 3 players (especially players who weren't on the floor
when the alleged "softness" happened) is ludicrous.

Jon K,

>>>A year of maturation with a healthy Treavor Ariza, Chris Mihm, and Andrew Bynum
>>>and the signing of Quinton Ross to replace Ira Newble = A Championship.

I'm on the same page as Jon K here. Ross would be a good choice or someone similar. It's
more important that they be a defensive player and a chemistry guy than a star. The Lakers
clearly have enough offense, Bynum and Ariza will ratchet up the defense a bunch, and
a bench defensive stopper would be icing on the cake.

One of he rumors on hoopshype is that Miami is looking for a backup center and might
pursue Kwame Brown.

I would find it totally amusing if the Heat made it back to the finals next season (and lost
to the Lakers of course) with Kwame Brown as their starting center. Then Kwame could do
a rap about Shaq.

I had no idea that Shaq has a "Greatest Hits" album. Just crazy. Somebody's not spending his offseason improving his game.

I sure hope Kareem and Bynum take Shaq's latest rant as a personal challenge.

I will absolutely buy a beer each every member of Laker Nation next year if I'm given the joy of watching Bynum DOMINATE Shaq as we play the Suns in Phoenix.

Next season can't start soon enough.



Wow, who put a burr in your saddle this morning? Heh. We must be getting closer to the era of The Beast as your dark side is coming through.

It's eerily similar, yep. However... this time we've got Kobe. And Melo, Wade and Lebronze all have much more experience. I agree that we need another shooter and at least one strong defender other than Kobe. Why Shane Battier (with his great college experience at Duke with the same coach as Team USA) wasn't included is beyond me. He can spot up shoot, he can defend. He played well last time. What more do you want?

I'm annoyed with the world changing the rules of OUR game. However, one part isn't as bad as it seems. The any zone defense allowed in the international game is the same as we have in college. The lame trapezoidal lane, changed 3 point line, no basket interference (once the ball hits the rim) and other impurities bug me big time too. How this could happen is beyond me. How'd we lose control of the rules at the international stage?

One thing that I think is a real issue is NBA star power. I think the officiating is better in the international game (Greece vs. Serbia notwithstanding) and as such Lebronze/Wade didn't know how to handle the fair instead of star treatment officiating in 06. Worth considering.

Interesting thought on the Shaq freestyle. I hadn't thought about the NBA/commish reaction. I think the NBA probably thinks rivalries between players help keep the NBA divisive and therefore competitive, fun, and profitable.

As for Al Gore, pre-2000 election defeat I don't know about him. After the defeat, he stuck to his beliefs and was one of the only public voices against a corrupt, fear-mongering administration. I can't imagine someone with that sort of righteous action (even if only from his own ethical perspective) being a bad leader, even of the NBA. Your comment was vague though so I don't really know how you meant it.

I like AB17 too. I hope your optimism is predictive.


Happy Birthday Sir!!!!!!

Hey Ladies,

You Fakers are history, made history and now are trying to re-write history.


Ya know why the C's won? Teamwork!

None of this "I (Kobeef) can get off at anytime".

The C's can get off at anytime, that's why we came back from 24 down (made history), blew you Fakers out by 40 (made you Fakers history) and destroyed this "Kobe is Jordan" crappy comparision (you all trying to re-write history).

You girls enjoy your bikering while I watch Game 4 and Game 6 again and again with a big-o-smilely.

"Anything's possible" K Garnett after HISTORIC 40-point beatdown of the Kobe and Gang Fakers.

What about Herman Munster? He has a great attitude.

But if he were a Celtic, he would probably be the 12th man on their all-time ugly team.

"was one of the only public voices against a corrupt, fear-mongering administration"

That's right, he has been pretty critical of the Clintons!

By the way, looks like Shaq lost ANOTHER of his rent-a-cop licenses... lol

rdlee ,

“As much as I like your optimism, what evidence do you have that Andrew w/o Pau would handle the Celtics? We lost both games rather handily with Bynum w/o Gasol. Andrew was definitely coming on but we don't KNOW if he would have made all the difference vs. the Celtics. This is a young up and coming player, not a proven All-Star.”

Come on, rd. How can I have any evidence? It’s just my opinion based on how Drew was playing the month before he got injured. Truthfully, the two games I missed this year were the Celtics games where Drew apparently did not play well but both games were before Drew really started coming into his own. Unless we get some form of time machine to take Drew from this year back to last year, we will never know. That’s why Mike T. still believes we would have won if hadn’t traded Kwame.

As an aside, while Drew is not a proven All-Star, he was selected ahead of all but 16 current NBA players on Chris Mattix’s mock draft that is the subject of this thread. In fact, Drew was selected before Tracy McGrady, David West, Carlos Boozer, Brandon Roy, Manu Ginobli, Steve Nash, and Rick Hamilton – all of whom have been all-stars.

Again, it is just my opinion but Andrew Bynum is probably the #3 center in the league today behind Yao Ming and Dwight Howard. If you don’t believe that, then try and make a list of the centers who you think are better right now. I guarantee you the Lakers will not trade for any of the guys on your list. We are entering the Era of the Beast.



Thanks for your comments. You’re right that I am in a testy mood today. Dan Patrick had several hip-hop commentators on his show the past few days all claiming the Kobe deserved what he got. Seeing Shaq praised for his totally disrespectful and tasteless antics is always a good one to get me riled up.

I agree with your Battier comment. Who chose this team? Was it Coach K or the shoe companies? Need to make sure that the billion Chinese know what sneaker to lust for. I would have left Carmelo and Wade off the team for sure and put in Battier for defense and Mike Miller for shooting. We also got too many point guards. You’re also right that the refs are going to be a real surprise for LeBronze and DWade. Kobe will be fine.

I thought things were going to be different but it looks like more of the same. I hope Kobe can make the difference but we are kidding ourselves to think we can keep putting together all-star teams on the fly who practice for a couple of weeks and then go meet professional teams that have played together for years on their courts playing by their rules. Yeah, that’s really smart.

And Shaq’s profane rap says gangster and thug a lot more than a couple of yards of jewelry and oversized clothing. Stern needs to step in like the two sheriff’s offices that have revoked Shaq’s deputyship and taken back his badges and gun. LOL.

The only thing that saves this horrible time called off season from totally decimating me is that we are indeed entering the Era of the Beast.


Lakertom's a nerd.

Big time nerd.


C's win! C's win!

I can't wait until next year when you all scratch your "big" azz and wonder why you can't beat the C's.


Oh Young Bynum is a joke. Let see what the kid can do before you NERDs annoint him as the best center in the league.



I heard about that trade rumor, and at first thought it would be great since Marion is probably the only player that can replace LO's skill set, and add better defense.

But then I started to think about how much it would cost to re-sign him(I don't see him taking a pay cut if we win the CHIP next year), Bynum, and extend Kobe. I think he could be the missing piece to us winning the CHIP next year, but I don't think it's worth the risk to rent him for 1 year and then have to try to find a SF that could replace his skill set next summer.

Hey Lady (FakerTom)

The "media" is on board with Shaq cuz Kobeer was WRONG for ratting out a teammate.

Don't you non-fat, soybean latte Angelinos have any pride, kissing Kobeef's "big" azz like you do.

Kobe ratted out a teammate!

That's the worse offense in any profession.

LadyTom is a tattle-tale in real life. Ya one of those who reports to HR evertime someome makes a joke however innocent.


Well said Long Time Laker Fan!

Great history and perspective.

Go Lakers!


The Era of the Beast.

I can't wail until October

lets go C's

you're a cavs fan you idiot...

stop pretending you're a celtics fan....

talk about disillusional.....better hope your GM gets help for james

You guys do know what the chant is going to be when when Kobe goes to a visiting arena.l

Kobe, tell me how my a@@ taste?

That line is kinda of funny.

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