A little more Sacto analysis
Just came across these two clips over at Sactown Royalty (via our friends at Forum Blue and Gold). The first is fun because it shows that every team's fans, after every game, go through the same questions about officiating, coaching strategy, player performance, etc. that happens here... except these days, the complaints of the Laker Nation are pretty mellow by comparison, even after a somewhat sketchball win. Sometimes sticking a toe in the pool of another team's misery is good for perspective! In the second link, there's a great comment from ESPN.com's David Thorpe about how the Lakers, by moving Kobe onto Kevin Martin, made the Kings totally one dimensional, and that Reggie Theus didn't do much to prevent it:
The Kings did a fine job for three quarters last night in mixing in lots of offensive looks. Post ups and iso's for Artest, a spread floor for Beno drives, and lots of 2-man action with Miller and Martin. Double screens are not needed to spring Martin free - only touches for Miller in the high post. Martin is expert at using backdoor cuts or handoffs to create shots for himself or teammates.
But in the 4th quarter, Miller was not involved. Which means Martin wasn't either. One reason why Kobe could explode in the 4th was that he got to rest on defense while almost every play featured a stationary Martin watching the ball being force fed to Artest. Kobe had 21 shots in the first 3 quarters-then he really got going. Martin had 16 shots in 3 quarters, with just one in the 4th. Only 2 touches overall. I wonder if the Kings would have scored just 18 fourth quarter points if Martin was just as central to their attack as Kobe was to the Lakers. And I also wonder if Kobe would have been so effective as a scorer in the 4th if he had to chase Martin around screens and hand-offs and backdoor cuts the entire quarter. We don't know if Martin can carry this team over the Lakers in crunch time. I'd like to find out. I'm sure Miller would love lots of 4th quarter touches.
Kobe was on Martin for a reason - Phil Jackson wanted the Kings to go to Artest. Had Artest started making shots, I'd guess Kobe would have switched onto him. The Kings did exactly what the Lakers' hoped they would do.
Kudos as well for the title of their game post for tonight's tussle with the Clippers: GAME 61 at Bad Los Angeles, Game Thread
Very clever.
BK
FearlessWhackJob,
"The final frame of this particular episode won't air until Kobe and LBJ meet in the finals. Who do you think would win?"
I would gladly pay you Tuesday, for the opportunity to see that today!
Posted by: exhelodrvr | March 06, 2008 at 09:23 AM
Edwin Gueco
for your info, walang laro mamaya ang Lakers, its on friday
Posted by: Botsoy | March 06, 2008 at 09:27 AM
BK/AK,
Of all the major sports(Basketball, Football and Baseball), which sport in your opinion has the best formula or does the best at choosing the MVP? I'd welcome responses from my fellow Laker fans as well. Thank you and have a great day. Go Lakers!!!
Posted by: Nemaia Faletogo | March 06, 2008 at 09:28 AM
ASM,
"Lakers young bench is starting to feel the pressure of season-end in ultra-competitive WC as well as heightened expectations of the team to go all the way after the blossoming of Bynum and addition of Gasol"
Farmar just had his best string of games recently, same with Vujacic; I think it has more to do with the recent thinness of the bench (Vlad out, Turiaf not playing as much or as well), with Fisher's slump, and the increased minutes that have come with that (which takes getting used to) than with pressure.
Posted by: exhelodrvr | March 06, 2008 at 09:29 AM
Stuart Scott of ESPN, was just wayyy over the top with his Bron Bron this and that, and this shot & that shot..
Then here came this fan from the stands (gotta love my city NY), but yeah dude comes all the way down to the huddle and gets in Lebron's ear! I know Stern pissed a BeOtcH when he saw his NBA prize approached by a fan, oh no he didn't??? LOL
But on the real, 9/11 happens, all these things happen, that ISH that happened, that fan coming down there never should've happened in this day and age, that is CRAZY..God forbid something bad would've happened LeBron or some other ILL ish! On the real tho, NBA needs to tighten that up..
Posted by: lakersrydeordie | March 06, 2008 at 09:32 AM
time for a little common sense:
the mvp award? who freakin cares...this award's past three winners are steve nash, steve nash, dirk nowitzki.
that should say it all. if you are wasting countless hours debating an award that has irrelevant winners like nash and nowitzki...then i don't know what else to tell you.
lebron or kobe? who's better? well, this season lebron has been better - the stats prove it. that doesn't mean lebron has been better player the past couple of seasons...and it doesn't mean kobe bryant sucks. lebron is a special player, as is kobe. and lebron is putting up better numbers across the board in a weaker conference. kobe is also putting up great numbers with a busted digit in the strongest conference i have ever seen.
ask sir charles if he'd exchange his one mvp award for a title...and he would look at you like you are the dumbest person in the world. that's turrrrible...
the suns don't look like the suns anymore. that squad is having an identity crisis at the most crucial point in the season...yikes! shaq gets 18 boards and they still get blown out by the nuggs?
brett favre retired...the way it was covered - you would have thought the guy brought peace to the Middle East. trent dilfer and hostetler have the same amount of superbowl rings as the cal ripkenesque brett favre. one of the best gunslinger qb's of all time, no doubt. the outright greatest qb of all time? c'mon now...
lebron put up 50 at the msg last night...good stuff...all the great ones (jordan, kobe) put on shows at the mecca of basketball...good to see lebron follow suit.
Posted by: tha show | March 06, 2008 at 09:32 AM
Xodus/Zen/Nemiaia (since everyone was in on the discussion),
The issue (at least in my mind) wasn't whether Shaq could get his numbers in Phoenix, at least not every once in a while. He's still capable of doing it on occasion, and more importantly, the Suns were getting those numbers with Shawn Marion in the lineup. According to Kerr and D'Antoni, Shaq was brought in to be a defensive presence and that ain't happening. Not even close.
On average this season, the Suns have held teams to 105 ppg and a 45.7 FG% (both figures which have risen since Shaq joined the team, but I digress). In 8 games with Shaq, Phoenix has only held opponents to those figures or below twice. They're getting smoked defensively. Is it ALL because of Shaq? No. But thus far, they looked like a considerably better defensive team with Marion. Which makes sense, because Marion is a much better (not to mention versatile and complete) defender than Shaq. Which is why the supposed rationale for bringing in O'Neal made no sense to begin with.
Plus, they're 3-5 since he joined up. And frankly, they don't have time "to adjust with Shaq." The West is too tight for that. Phoenix is only 3.5 games ahead of 9th place Denver, which is hardly a comfortable cushion. And even if you think the Suns couldn't possibly fall out of the playoff race, the rest of these top 8 teams are playing at a solid or better level. It's never a good thing to not only limp into the playoffs, but limp in while still figuring out what the hell you're doing. Teams that can't get on some kind of roll going in generally get bounced fast.
AK
Posted by: Andrew Kamenetzky | March 06, 2008 at 09:33 AM
AK/BK,
Have you guys gotten wind of any news regarding Ariza (or Bynum for that matter)? Last week we were hearing that Ariza would be evaluated on Monday, and it's Thursday now and we still have yet to hear any news.
Posted by: Xodus | March 06, 2008 at 09:46 AM
Hey, this is my second post on this blog. The first was yesterday. First off, I have tickets to the LAKERS vs. mavericks in Dallas on March 18th and I will be sure to try and give some live updates and post after the game.
Second, I would still like to be added to the LAKERS rollcall and the CHAMPIONSHIP bandwagon if there's still room.
Onto the lebron vs. KOBE argument, this is truly not an argument and KOBE knows it. He continues to demonstrate that he is the best player in the game by simply going out and WINNING and not worrying about the MVP vote or lebron.
KOBE understands he is NEVER going to get the love that lbj gets, he understands that he simply came to the league a bit to soon. People didn't want to forget about MJ just yet and here was this KID doing all the things that the great MJ did, only he was younger and doing it against a SUPERIOR league and against SUPERIOR teams.
MJ NEVER played in a league this tough, as a matter of fact, when the league was a bit tougher in MJ's younger years, I think you'll notice alot of scoring from MJ and alot of singular accolades, but when facing the TOUGH teams he simply couldn't get the job done. Then as the league went through a dip in talent, when Magic, Bird, Isaiah, and many others were seeing the end of their careers and there were way less TOUGH GOOD teams to deal with, all of a sudden he starts winning championships in an inferior league and everyone starts calling him the greatest ever.
I would of loved to see those BULLS in this NBA today and the past few years, can anyone say, Spurs, Suns, Pistons, Lakers, Celtics, Jazz, and more through the last five to seven years or so. I'd love to see how many championships his airness and his bulls would of had in THIS past 8 years.
I talk about MJ when comparing KOBE to someone else, not LBJ, because lebron will NEVER be anywhere near that. The only person KOBE has to worry about rising above is a ghost that should have been long forgotten by now. If KOBE can win a couple more championships, I'd like to hear the arguments then. Will people continue to compare KB24 to whiny, arrogant, impetulent kid named lebron that is simply a product of overhype that has never done anything except get his team through oneof the weakest conferences we've ever seen only to be BLOWN OUT OF THE WATER by a SUPERIOR western conference team, 4-0, or will they compare him to an over rated ghost that dominated the league when IT was in one of it's weakest moments.
Whether you agree or not, this is how I feel, KOBE is the greatest player of ALL-TIME, but he will never get that love because of WHEN he came into the league, and the JEALOUSY that was waitng there for him. Granted, his attitude early on his career hurt him with people, but at some point you have to get past that, he was a 17 yr. old kid, yet had more cahonas than any Laker on the court his rookie season, was it then or his second season that he took those shots against the JAZZ when everyone else on the floor was AFRAID to be the guy that missed. Not KOBE, he showed then and he shows it now, HE WILL NEVER BACK DOWN, HE WILL NEVER BE AFRAID, HE WILL TAKE THE SHOT, MISS OR MAKE, AND HE WILL DEAL WITH THE CRITICISM, BECAUSE WITHOUT TAKING THE SHOT YOU HAVE NO CHANCE, BY TAKING IT, YOU HAVE A CHANCE TO BE A WINNER, HE IS THE BEST, AND YOU WILL KNOW IT BY THE TIME HE'S DONE!
I am not rooting for KOBE to win the MVP because he DOESN'T CARE about the MVP. He told the whole world what he cared about when Phil Jackson had every player stand up at their first practice this year,
Phil said, Stand Up, give your name and some information about yourself.
Kobe's response when he stood up,
"I'M KOBE BRYANT AND I WANT TO WIN A CHAMPIONSHIP!"
Then he sat down, nothin about MVP, nothing about best records, or single minded goals, "I WANT TO WIN A CHAMPIONSHIP!"
That's all you need to know about Kobe "BEAN" Bryant, KB24, MAMBA24, THE ASSASSIN!
LAKER 4 LIFE
Johnny Z
Posted by: Johnny Z | March 06, 2008 at 09:47 AM
Johnny Z, I can appreciate your post and share many of the same sentiments as you do about Kobe.That was well documented.
Welcome to the blog......
Posted by: lakersrydeordie | March 06, 2008 at 10:03 AM
Johnny Z,
Are you really calling MJ overrated? I like your passion for Kobe, I feel the same way, but calling MJ "over rated ghost" is taking it a little far. The man is in the top-3 greatest ballers ever, and numero uno in most people's opinion. I just can't for the life of me see how you can think he's not that good. This is no slam on you, so don't take it the wrong way.
Go Lakers!
Posted by: bozz | March 06, 2008 at 10:04 AM
I must say that ESPNfirsttake this morning was all about LeBron and more LeBron. I watch that show almost every morning and LeBron is one of the topics discussed most frequently perhaps in part to get on the nerves of Skip Bayless who refers to LeBron as "Prince James". Even after Kobe scored 52 points in a more important victory against a better team(Mavericks)and with the stakes much higher, Kobe didn't have nearly as much coverage on ESPNfirsttake as LeBron did for his 50 against the woeful Knicks. I'm not hating on LeBron, just calling it like I see it. Obviously, LeBron is the media darling hands down.
What's even more funny is how LeBron when questioned by reporters after the game denied telling Spike that he would drop 50 on the Knicks because "that's not his game". Jay Crawford on ESPN went to show a replay of LeBron saying "fifty". I'm sure great players or scorers feel that they can drop big numbers on any given night, how often have you actually heard or seen a player say it publicly? Has Kobe ever said he'd drop 50 on a team publicly? So far I know of only Gilbert Arenas and now LeBron that have said it publicly(although LeBron now denies it). I think LeBron's comments after the game is up for interpretation. If Kobe said such a thing he would get blasted in the media for being selfish and a ballhog. I won't take anything away from LeBron, because the Cavs were in a tight game against the Knicks last night. Everyone applauds LeBron when he has a big game as he did last night but villify Kobe whenever he scores big and question whether it's good for the team or not. When you look at all of Kobe's 50+ scoring games, they've almost always taken place in a tough, close game with the exception of his 62 in three quarters against the Mavs in which Kobe decided to sit out the fourth quarter because the game was a blowout. I think the media can be unfair when discussing the greatness of Kobe and LeBron which is sad.
Posted by: Nemaia Faletogo | March 06, 2008 at 10:05 AM
I can break this Kobe/Lebron thing down very simply.
The fact that it was such a big deal that Lebron got 50 on a pretty bad defensive team and bad team overall in NY, coupled with the fact that Kobe only got a little bit of hoopla for dropping 52 on the Mavs, shows which player is better.
Posted by: Benjamin | March 06, 2008 at 10:41 AM
Hate to Beat a Dead horse, but ESPN is still running LeBron's 50 night game at MSG!! I noticed on the highlights there were several instances where LeBron was clearly checking the board for his stats!!
Posted by: lakersrydeordie | March 06, 2008 at 10:55 AM
Kobe now only has to play hard last quarter.
With Gasol and Bynum, even less, then his % will raise and LAkers will win the finals.
Best player at best team use to be MVP and perhaps he will made Gasol finals MVP or he will win all. It is only his choice.
He has just beat Michael Jordan 21.000 points scored earlier, - 2nd in the NBA history - , and without injuries, perhaps would beat him at all time scorers.
Posted by: mitcoes | March 06, 2008 at 11:01 AM
***** S H O R T S H O T S & Q U I C K T A K E S *****
zen,
“Shaq had a career high 18 rebounds tonight!”
Doubly unbelievable! Both that Kwaq’s career high was only 18 boards or that at 36 years old he could match that high, unless he grabbed a lot of his own missed shots.
------------------
LAGUNERO,
“Seriously when it's time for Kobe to leave the game, Do we expect Bron to entertain us for years to come like Kobe has?”
No! That’ll be Andrew’s job. The next generation of debate and blog-sync-think will be how Andrew Bynum stacks up against the other great centers in Lakers and NBA history.
------------------
Xodus,
>>>>The Suns pretty much suck now. They traded their best defensive PG (Banks)
>>>>and their best defender period (Marion) for one of the worst defensive bigs
>>>>in the league. As a Laker fan, I'm thrilled.”
Shame on you, Karl. Gloating over the Suns’ demise isn’t anywhere near as much fun as reveling in the Lakers ascent but it is nevertheless wickedly pleasurable in its own way.
------------------
wes,
>>>> “Still, I think the award is Kobe's to win or loose. If he continues to play
>>>>the way he's been playing, nothing LeBron does short of overtaking the
>>>>Celtics and Pistons is going to be good enough this year.”
Perfectly stated, wes. This is Kobe’s and the Lakers’ perfect storm year. Kobe’s a lock. Maybe even Phil and Mitch. It will be like the lifetime awards the Oscars give out.
------------------
Fearless,
>>>> “Kobe is Popeye, and his killer mentality is his spinach. Kobe has to eat
>>>>his spinach to become super human.
>>>>Lebron is Brutus. He was born super human and doesn't even have to try
>>>>to do great things.”
The only stat that counts is championships. Kobe is Jeter; LeBron is ARod. Kobe is Montana; LeBron is Elway. Kobe is Rice; LeBron is Owens. Kobe is Russell; LeBron is Wilt.
------------------
Tom
Posted by: LakerTom | March 06, 2008 at 11:28 AM
LakerTom replied, The only stat that counts is championships. Kobe is Jeter; LeBron is ARod. Kobe is Montana; LeBron is Elway. Kobe is Rice; LeBron is Owens. Kobe is Russell; LeBron is Wilt.
MY RESPONSE to Laker Tom,
O U C H , NUF SAID!
Posted by: lakersrydeordie | March 06, 2008 at 11:58 AM
Thank You Bozz and Lakersrydeordie for welcoming me to the blog. I don't take anything as a slam, I understand that we are all just making our opinions known here.
I simply feel in my opinion that MJ played in a watered down era of the NBA during his domination and was the sweetheart of a league that needed a front guy. None of his STATS or Championships even compare to guys like Wilt and Bill Russell, and I can't honestly say he's any better than Magic or Bird who had to play against some of the TOUGHEST teams EVER.
MJ had no TEAM in his era that was constructed near as well as the BULLS, whereas the Lakers, Celtics, Sixers, and Pistons of there era had to battle some very formidable teams.
I mean MJ beat what, a Lakers team that wasn't suppose to be there, a Portland that made it ONCE and disappeared, a Phoenix team with an over the hill Barkley, Gary Payton and Shawn Kemp, nuff said there, and then Karl Malone and John Stockton, NONE of these teams would have ever even SNIFFED the finals in the era I'm talking about previously, and NONE of them would SNIFF the finals in this era.
MJ was around during the perfect era, where was his LBJ, CP3, Tim Duncan, Shaquille O'neal, or even KOBE at his prime, to contend with. He never had one, the LEAGUE bowed down to him. He had it easy. Sorry, that's justthe way I see it.
Johnny Z
Laker 4 Life
Posted by: Johnny Z | March 06, 2008 at 12:27 PM
Johnny Z, now that you mention, I come to think that I dont ever recall MJ being referred to as a Ball hogg back in those days, and today, they would never say that about LeBron, he can do no wrong, shoot all day every day cuz he gets 8 assists and 8 rips a night its not a problem! With his athleticism, and physical stature and the percentage of time he handles that ball, if you ask me, no surprise there, that should be the case.
Somebody mention how TEAMS defended back in the day, if Oakley and or Anthony Mason was around, Lebron would def feel the wrath going to the hole..The rules have changed so that a slap on the wrist is deemed a flagrant so nobody really bothers to play a clean, YET physical game like that. Which makes what San Antonio, Houston and Boston do defensively that much more impressive.
Posted by: lakersrydeordie | March 06, 2008 at 12:55 PM
Soooooo, I am a life long Lakers fan living in norcal by way of Santa Ana..I cannot and will not ever find pleasure in watching the sacatomatoe queens be a serious contending team. Thankfully, that window has closed! Anyway.....it was great to see 3/4 of the fans @ ARCO on tuesday night were die hard LAKER fans!!! and to see those queen fans talking smack all the way until 4:00 left in the 4th quarter was classic. All of the Laker faithful made it a point to chant M-V-P when Kobe was at the free throw line and after #24 threw down his 360 degree dunk..We also let LUUUUUKKKEEEEEE know he was in the house......Get some!!!! take out the garbage, let the cat out, and turn off the lights. Game over!!!! Men amongst boys!!!! Lakers 4 Life, i'm done!
Posted by: jojo | March 06, 2008 at 02:45 PM
LakerTom,
great post!
agree on all points!
Posted by: Lakers Legacy | March 06, 2008 at 03:16 PM
ok lebron a fantastic player but not better than kobe he does not have a better shot than kobe and the only tme he plays defense when he playin kobe.....kobe plays strong defnse 82 games lebron two?? and beside forget bout lebron does lakers are in first place deciing on wha the spurs do tonight agaist indian.... spurs competion become alot tougher soon but i still expect them to win cuz there a great team but i feel lakers are strong.... n pheonix hahahahahahha enough said.....go lakers
Posted by: hardcore lakers | March 06, 2008 at 04:33 PM