Mike T,

So Dwight Howard who averages 15 boards and nearly 3 blocks a game doesn't set a defensive tone, but Kwame does? The Magic give up just 98 points per game and have a point differntial of 5.1 on the season.

That's just ludicrous.

Now I've heard everything.

And Ben Wallace is a shell of himself. The Bulls were a great defensive team before he got there and the Pistons have remained a great defensive team after he left. You know why? Because great TEAM DEFENSE wins games.

You say that the Lakers are 5-6 with Bynum as the starter, but you ignore that the Lakers are 4-8 with Kwame starting at center in the playoffs.

Where was Kwame when the Suns were running layup drills on us the past two seasons?

MikeT,

I really enjoy your post about Kwame. Like selling a Yugo and being told it's a Mercedes. I really get to laugh and I love the responses you are able to get.

BD

kwame brown sucks

GO LAKERS

that was probably the most entertaining game of the season so far. it would have been nice to come away with a W, but nonetheless was an encouraging game. there were some mistakes but i figure in the course of the whole game you can't avoid those.

when Kwame returns and starts, Bynum will surely fit in better with the second unit. for some reason, the starting unit just can't seem to get it in to him.

i noticed last night that PJ had odom out there with the second unit. i'm not sure why he did that. that took the ball out of farmar's hands and it seemed to have messed with how they did things out there.

i don't have as much love for Kwame as mike t. does, but i do understand that it would be better if he starts. one good reason is that luke gets relegated back to the bench. i think we can all agree that would be a big positive. as much as andrew has progressed and has done some nice things, i still think that there's a few things Kwame does better than he (at the moment) such as setting strong picks, and showing on pick and rolls. it might not seem like a big deal to some of you what these intangibles bring to the table but it contributes a lot to the general tone of the game.

"So Dwight Howard who averages 15 boards and nearly 3 blocks a game doesn't set a defensive tone"

Actually rebounds and blocked shots don't set the tone. Stuff like that happens near the rim. In my studies I'm seeing that players like Camby, Chandler, Howard, JO, and even Bynum get a lot of numbers because they play so close to the rim.

What that means is this: Penetration has already occured. Their activity near the rim is great but it doesn't lead to wins. It leads to numbers but no defensive tone is set at all. I'll give a full explanation in about a month.

mike

Having gone back and re-watched the fourth quarter, a couple things really stick out: First, they turned the ball over way too much, and against a team that runs as well as GS, that can't happen. But more than bad defense, what stuck out to me was bad O. The Lakers scored four points over the final three and a half minutes, and that included only one FG. More than that, there was little ball movement:

The last three minutes:

-Fish TO leads to easy Ellis run out. 102- 98 LAL.
-2:40, Kobe misses iso jumper, lucky to draw the foul. Makes 1-2. 103-98.
-2:20, Davis hits a ridiculous step back three in front of Luke, who picked him up on a switch. 103-98.
-2:04, Fish srapes off screen, misses runner off the left side of the lane. No passes on the possession. GS runs, hobbled Kobe can't stop the ball, turns into easy layup for Jackson. 103-103.
-1:39, Kobe misses three. Iso, no ball movement
-1:27, Lakers get ball back as Fish draws foul on Harrington after good D. Makes 1-2, 104-103.
-1:00- Beidrins tip in. 104-105.
-:42- Terrible possession w/o Kobe on floor, wild LO shot
-:16.7- Davis ridiculous step back three over Fish. 104-108.

After that, it was the Kobe missed three, lucky to get the ball back, LO drives, gets the and-one, misses the FT then loses the ball.

If you take it back more, the Lakers were ineffective offensively going back deeper into the quarter, settling for too many jumpers and not running the offense.

On the Walton question, I'm among the gang who thinks they're better having him come off the bench. He certainly hasn't played well (both AK and I called him the most disappointing member of the team on this week's podcast), and last night he had a couple of really bad turnovers. Ironically, though, down the stretch his defense wasn't an issue. Normally, it's a focal point. Combine the fact he's not hitting shots with too many TOs, and he's clearly not performing to the level the Lakers expect. They're better off with him on the court for 20-25 as opposed to 30+, no question.

And while LO didn't shine on a couple possessions late, he was a large reason they were even in the game down the stretch. Kobe was hobbled on D, which hurt (no pun intended) and shot the ball horribly before and after the injury, forcing way too many shots. Certainly he's earned enough good will to let one bad game slide by.

I know it's tough to swallow a loss like that, since they could and should have won. To me, they simply stopped executing offensively, which hurt them on the other end. They turned the ball over, and settled for jumpers. Ball and player movement basically stopped. Davis hit a couple monster shots of the sort where you simply tip your hat. There were too many breakdowns. But a couple buckets over the last six minutes or so, and they leave with a win.

GS is a good team, very good at home. That they lost to the Warriors really isn't a disaster, and upon further review, neither was that game. I still think they need to make a more concerted effort to play inside out, which will both take advantage of Drew's play and LO's ability down low, but also make it easier for Kobe, and everyone else on the court. Obviously, the TOs need to come down. But after watching this one again, I really don't see the need to get overly worked up.

A better effort to open the third might have helped, too. But once the initial lead was gone, they Lakers found themselves in a dogfight. They're not going to win all of them.

BK

"Where was Kwame when the Suns were running layup drills on us the past two seasons? "

On the bench! That was my whole complaint about PJ last season. The year before all PJ had to do was put Deven George on Steve Nash and we would have won the series.

and "great TEAM DEFENSE" can only be had with a strong defensive center. Great team defense isn't initiated with the 1, 2, 3 , or 4 spots. It's the 5 spot that allows the other players to be a strong defensive unit.

mike

mike t,

doesn't kwame play near the rim. shouldnt he be getting those same rebounds and blocks that all those other good centers are. there's no denying that hes not stopping penetration, a la every point in the league, but what does that say in terms of how kwame sets the tone of the game? if the guards arent scared to go to the rim, how is that setting a defensive tone in the game?

B K,
"what stuck out to me was bad O."

Absolutely - that had led to as many of the losses over the past couple of years as the defense. You can't look at the total number of points that the team scores and say "Oh, they should have won." It is those extended periods with no/minimal scoring, and the inability to score on a couple of straight possessions when that it is needed to put an opponent away.

also mike, if there numbers dont relate to wins, why are howards, chandlers, bynums, camby's team all with winning records. their numbers seriously dont have nothing to do with it? their rebounds, blocking shots dont correspond with wins? your arguement is stretching a little on what kwame does. if kwame could put up the numbers that those guys do, (being a center, physically blessed, and naturally playing close to the rim, you would expect that) but he doesnt.

only time i remember him doing anyhting was in the suns first series, but he still couldnt get those blocks or rebounds we needed consistently that would have set the tone for us to storm out of phoenix on top.

"Now all that is based on Bynum's inability to help the Lakers set a defensive tone to the game. Because that's the center's responsibility."

I mean if that isn't enough...the Lakers are 5-6 with Bynum as the starting center. Those wins and losses don't lie.

mike

Mike T,

Then why are Detroit and Orlando strong defensive teams? By your definition Howard doesn't set a strong defensive tone, than why are they one of the best defensive teams around. Why were the Pistons playing Chris Webber at center for long portions of last season and winning games?

By your definition that only 3 centers (Kwame, Big Ben and TD) in the league set a defensive tone why isn't every team in the league a poor defensive squad. And why is that the Lakers have never been a strong defensive team during Kwame's tenure in LA?

Kwame played nearly 33 minutes a game in the 05-06 Phoenix series and you say he didn't get any minutes. I agree that we do miss Kwame, but it's because we're forced to use Ronny as a backup center. With both Kwame and Bynum we've got a strong defensive center rotation with Kwame's strength and Bynum's length. But Kwame by himself isn't the reason why we're not better defensively.

Lakers trade: Lamar Odom
Lakers in: Udonis Haslem, Mickael Pietrus

Warriors out: Al Harrington, Mickael Pietrus
Warriors in: Lamar Odom

Heat out: Udonis Haslem
Heat in: Al Harrington

Using the proposed LA-GSW deal, the Lakers and Warriors include Miami in a threesome that benefits all 3 teams.

Lakers get Udonis Haslem - the perfect TRI PF. He has a very good mid-range game too and his defense is stellar. If the Lakers landed Haslem, I'd be jumping all over my room and office.

Miami trades Haslem for a better all around player in Harrington to support Shaq and Wade's cause. Miami has been slumping since last year and I wouldn't be too surprised if they dealt one more time.

JWill / Smush
Wade / Cook
Davis / Wright
Harrington / Blount
Shaq / Zo

Warriors fans are in unison in saying that Harry + Pietrus = Odom is a good deal for them. Odom is a better version of Harrington in Nellie's small ball and he can help their rebounding much. They will still be the lightning-quick organized-chaotic team, much to Nellie's liking. Losing Pietrus means they will have no pressure to re-up him as well. They have Biedrins and Monta Ellis to worry about for the moment and Matt Barnes will have to play exceptional here as well.

Baron / Hudson
Ellis / Belinelli
Jackson / Barnes
Odom / B. Wright
Biedrins / O'Bryant

As for the Lakers getting Pietrus, we add a real player that can play behind Kobe. He is a decent scorer and defender as well but as far as the future goes, we can trade him to Miami or another team depending on how he fits. Worst case scenario, we let him expire at the end of the season as we have another Frenchman to pay more - Ronny Turiaf.

Farmar / Crit
Kobe / Fish
Ariza / Pietrus
Haslem / Turiaf / Radmanovic
Bynum / Kwame / Mihm

I simply love the flexibility and defensive upgrades this trade brings to LA.

Mike T,

We're not as bad defensively as our bad PPG against suggests and that's what you're missing. The Lakers play at the sixth fastest pace in the league. We average 100.5 possessions per game. More possessions means more points for both teams. If you look at other stats you'll see that we're not that bad, though we're not elite.

We're 4th in the LEAGUE in opponents FG% at 43%. Sixth in the league in opponent's 3 point percentage at 33% and third in the league in rebounds per game.

You're ignoring these defensive stats and pinning our losses on Bynum. It's a team game and you're ignoring that Kwame's injury forced Bynum to start which took his strong play awayfrom the second unit. Turiaf was hurt at the same time, Lamar Odom was still recovering from injury and we traded away Cook and Evans and had to integrate Ariza into the team.

All of these things combined are the reason why we struggled after Kwame went down. Since we've adjusted to all these things we put together a 4 game winning streak and and were minutes away from a 5th.

That Baron Davis is a great player but he's not easy to look at. I don't know if he's a cartoon character or what.

Colorado loves the Lakers!

Last night's game was lost to bad coaching and Kobe being Kobe. Kobe shot poorly all night. Instead of him trying to pass the ball when he was doubled, he wanted to take poor shots. Bynum was killing them the whole game and could only get 10 touches. It just seems like to me that Phil needs to tell Kobe to get the ball to Bynum when he is hot. We should have rode him to victory because even if he gets fouled, he will make free throws. Kobe decides that he is going to shoot and nothing else matters. Did anyone one notice that he went 3-10 and then 3 -12 in the second half. He needs to show restraint and be a better leader and pass the ball when he doesn't have it especially when he got hurt...comments anyone??

Isiah Thomas is looking to trade Eddie Curry!!!

My suggested Trade Scenario between New York, Sacramento and the Lakers...

New York gets Odom, Artest and Kenny Thomas
Sacramento gets Kwame Brown, Quentin Richardson and New York's 1st rd draft pick(2008 and 2009)
Lakers get Eddie Curry, David Lee and Jarred Jeffries

Lakers starting line up

PG- Fisher
SG-KObe
SF-Walton
PF-Curry
C-Bynum

bench...farmar,lee,jeffries,radmanovic,ariza,critt, Mihm, Karl,Turiaf,Vujacic

"Is it a wonder that were 7-6 and 5-6 with Bynum starting?"

No, because that corresponds to Turiaf's ankle injury, which he apparently isn't fully recovered from. That period also includes additional physical problems that Mihm has had. Not just an issue of Kwame being unavailable.

last night did anyone else see that semi hook shot from bynum in the second half on the far baseline, with the guy in his face? beautiful! kareemesk?

Isiah is probably looking to trade Curry because he has Randolf to do the scoring down in the post. But neither Randlof or Curry can defend the post.

mike

Botsoy,

Why would we want an overweight, underachieving center with a bad attitude? We don't need Curry and he definitely can't play the 4 spot fr us.

Ex,

Not to mention trading Cook and Evans for Ariza. The team was discombobulated because of all these things happening at the same time. We just have the misfortune of having injury prone players who often get hurt at the same time.

staples24,

love that trade, but i dont thik that GW would part with AH and peitrus to get odum. maybe odum and sombody decent, but not just him. and haslem leaving miami? thats hard, hes been (from what i've read) one of their more consistent guys. avg 7? boards and dbl fig points? unless they're looking for a shake up of the team. but overall a haslem on the lakers would make me pretty damn happy too. how'd you come up with that? not bad.

botsoy,

i know curry is a beast downlow, i dont knwo if he has any midrange game, but his defense isn't what you call great. he's lazy and slow, and doesnt give any effort. especially at N. maybe he'd change with a trade, but that'd be a risk i'd rather not take. maybe for Randolph? i dont know why but he seems so much more appealing in terms of D and O ( he has that mid range game) and is a beast on the boards when hes trying. but same thing for him. it'd be a risk. but one id rather take then with curry.

Open letter to mike tenienite

Mike i just want to say that iam 100 per-cent behind your big body theory and you are correct when you say that the average blogger either does not have enough knowledge to understand the nuances of the game or they are to blinded by their pride by recognizing your genuis,Keep up the good work i do admire your courage in the face of the storm,and by standing tall by the relentless attacks against your very character.

BK/AK,

While we cannot ask for more on the Lakers efforts on offense, the defense left a lot of things to desired on Walton and Odom. In the end, Kobe became ineffective because of the groin injury. He brought in Ariza but did not assign to the toplight GS. I have been watching the games here in Connecticut with white surrounding at wee-hours in the morning. I wonder what the coaching staff are doing in a see-saw battle as if there were gunfights in trading shots and let the best man standing wins. Where are the defense tactics of the Zen. Is he really worth $12 Million a year??? Here are my observations, of course I'm just second guessing a HOF Coach.

1. Why did he not play Ariza or Vlad in the 4thQ instead of Walton who is faltering on defense and has non-existing offense although he made some decent free throws;

2. This coach is really stubborn in trying to freeze a reliable rookie, Javaris who is taller than Monte Ellis, he could have been more effective in slowing him down. An Ariza-Javaris-Kobe could have neutralized the offensive movements of Golden State. Fisher and Farmar are both good PG, but based on assignments, you need a nimble guy to match the agility.

3. Lakers were playing man-to-man against a team that is fast and furious, they easily go on pick and roll, Lakers could not solve this kind of offense. Had they went on zone, GS could have been finished in 4thQ when the score went up to 8 pts.

4. Why did we not use the height of Chris Mihm against the small Centers of Golden State;

Have you noticed the Lakers games, there is no clear path of the ball, it is a helter skelter kind of offense? They go for a fast play but they could not finsh it with a convincing finish, it is only when Andrew controls the middle. AK/BK, can somebody tell PJ to stop patronizing his favorite player in the triangle Luke Walton, instead go with Ariza or Vlad and it's a consensus in the Lakers Blog.

How many more games are the Lakers willing to lose, before they realize of letting Luke Walton sit down or just go away?

these trade proposals make me laugh.
i do NOT want lamar odom on my warriors.
i agree, they need to make some changes. they are an explosive team, but a little fragile. when they go cold and start bricking all those 3's thats where their achilles heel is exposed.
yes they certainly need a beefy rebounder in the middle. i can only dream of getting a player like boozer, zack randolph, deng... etc.
but personally i cant stand lamar... id like a player with the right kind of balls2thewall aggressive attitude that the warriors have in players like davis, harrington, stephen jackson... the fearless attitude they had when they beat dallas... odom would not fit, he just seems mentally weak to me.

LAKERS LOSE A TOUGH ONE…

That was one hell of a game last night. I knew the Warriors would be primed to play their best to try and break the streak. He may be injury prone and at times have a questionable attitude but you cannot deny that Baron has game. That fade-away 3 to seal the game was unbelievable. The Warriors got great contributions from Davis, Ellis, Harrington, and Jackson. 48% from 3-point land is hard to beat. Too many open looks from beyond the arc. The Lakers are still the better team and will win 3 out of every 4 games with the Warriors but last night the game ball went to Baron and the Warriors.

While we definitely let this game slip away, I was still proud of how we battled and competed. This was not your last year’s Lakers not competing in a back-to-back. This was the Lakers playing with fire and passion. The ebb and flow in the fourth quarter was unbelievable. Every play there was a new potential game star. The atmosphere reminded me of the playoffs. This is just one of those games that you chalk up to luck. In the end, we played well, defended pretty well, but lost to the team with the hotter hand from the 3-point line.

Bottom line, we lost the game because we missed six critical free throws that ended up costing us the game: Ronny 3 of 4, Kobe a technical and 1 of 2, and even DFish only 1 of 2 at a critical juncture. That and Kobe being injured and going 0 for 7 in the fourth quarter. I’ll bet you won’t see Kobe wear a collar for the fourth quarter again this year. I liked how we battled but poor shooting by Kobe, Lamar, and Luke really put us in the hole this game. Despite all these struggles, we still dominated the game for most of the night and really should have won the game if we hit our freebies.

Again, we also did not take advantage of Bynum by feeding him the ball in the hole. Most of his points, in fact, actually came from rebounds and put backs to Drew’s credit but we still need to feed him the ball when he has a huge mismatch such as Biedrins. Mike is partially right that the Warriors did instruct Biedrins to not leave Bynum when a penetrator gets into the paint but that just eliminated Andrew getting a couple of chippies via assists. Over and over, I saw Drew get excellent position right in front of the basket but not get a pass from Lamar or Luke especially.

Sunday night should be an interesting battle. AK’s boy Kaman has been playing well and we will finally get Ken’s long dreamed of 1-on-1 match-up between Kaman and Bynum. Would you still trade Bynum for Kaman, AK? Probably. Just like you would trade Farmar for Livingston (pre-injury, of course) or Kobe for Brand (J/K). LOL. Still a closet Clipper fan, AK? Let’s see which center plays better tomorrow night.

Tom

Mike T,

I think there's some validity to what you're saying, but it's actually even simpler on some other levels. Right now, Turiaf can't start at the 4 (moving LO to the 3) unless Phil wants to play Mihm more minutes, which he understandably doesn't right now. Vlad has played considerably better with the second unit than as a starter and isn't any better a defender than Walton (quite possibly worse, actually). And Phil has said he'd consider starting Ariza, but thinks he's a better fit with the uptempo second unit, which makes sense (regardless of whether it's how you'd personally do it or not). Thus, unless you want to play Kobe at the 3 and start either Sasha or Crittenton (which feels unnecessarily drastic), you're left with Luke.

But again, that's also just right now. Once Kwame returns, options open up. Either he or Bynum will move to the bench (my guess is Bynum), which allows Ronny to possibly start. Keep in mind, that was Phil's plan from the beginning, along with moving Walton to the bench. And I'll say it again. People make WAY too big a deal about starting. Minutes are what matter. Save last night, Luke has only played 30+ minutes once this entire season. He's actually averaging less than 25 mpg, considerably fewer than last season and right around what many fans seem to think is acceptable. And I do agree that as the season progresses, his minutes may drop to about 15-20, especially if he doesn't play better on a consistent basis.

AK

Walton on Stephen Jackson - NO

Walton on Micahel Pietrus - NO

Walton on Al Harrington - NO

Walton on Matt Barnes - NO

Walton on Biedrins - No

Walton on Monte Ellis - NO

Walton on Baron Davis - NO

Walton on Mbenga - NO

Walton on Donnie Nelson - Yes!

What in the world was Walton doing in a GOLDEN STATE WARRIOR GAME?
A game that could be so important to evaluate Trevor and Javaris 's game in this type of play. Why Walton?

For crying out loud, this is a joke! A big one and a costly one too!

Xodus,

I certainly wouldn't object if Phil started Vlad, but I understand why he doesn't. Vlad's production as a sub has been considerably better in smaller minutes than as a starter in larger ones. If you look at his splits, it's pretty dramatic.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/3522/splits;_ylt=AsrpstcAng.BHGPZb_9d3KekvLYF

I can't put my finger on why he seems to play so much better off the bench (it's not like when you think "uptempo," you necessarily think "Vlad Rad"), but it's hard to argue otherwise. And you certainly don't gain anything defensively by starting him ahead of Luke. So why mess up a positive from the bench to possibly create a neutral in the starting unit, you know what I mean?

Again, I expect to see a lot change once Kwame is back. I'd be surprised if Luke doesn't end up on the bench once that happens.

AK

Hey All - I tried to post this last night but the §•ª&#& blogspam blocker wouldn't let me - I'll try again now!

**** I WAS AT THE GAME Up HERE ****

OBSERVATIONS ---

1) Bynum is still making young guy mistakes but MAN is he on his way to becoming a Great Player! I take back everything I said about him all summer. I'd still like to get JO, but for Lamar and Kwame NOT Baby B. His wingspan is incredible - he rebounds, dunks, and alters shots. A little more experience and toughness and I think we've got an ALL-Star on our hands.

2) D-Fish is the biggest difference from last year's team. He's a quiet but steady floor leader on offense and disrupts the other team on defense. A wise warrior among the young guns. He helps on sooo many levels that aren't apparent on TV.

3) Lamar looks dazed and confused at least half the time - epecially on offense.. Doesn't know whether to drive or pass or shoot and doesn't do any of them consistently well. Fine rebounder but NOT the second scoring threat we need.

4) Luke - well its been said here already tonight. A good second stringer but definitely should NOT be a starter or big minutes guy.

5) Farmar and Ariza - GREAT potential. Jordan is thriving under Fish's mentorship and will be more than ready to assume Derek's role and minutes as the next couple of years go by. Ariza brings just what we need - lots of energy and strong defense.

A disappointing loss, but I have lots of hope for this team - especially if we can package Lamar with Kwame and/or Luke, Rad, etc and pick up someone like JO or Gasol. GO LAKERS!

AK,

Thanks for the splits. Is there any update on Kobe. Knowing him he's never going to say "I can't play," but is he really okay? He couldn't run at all in the 4th, this doesn't seem like something that will heal with one day off. Especially with his bad shoulder, knee and wrist.

AK and BK:

Some excellent responses to Mike regarding the effect of Kwame being injured to the Lakers depth and rotations. Unfortunately, I don’t think Mike will buy them. What Mike does not realize is that most of us agree that Kwame being out hurts the team. We just do not agree with his reasons why Kwame being out hurts the team. We are a better team with both Kwame and Andrew available at center to match up.

The question Mike needs to answer is what would losing Andrew cost the Lakers? My answer is a lot more than losing Kwame is costing us now. Think how this Lakers team would be if it were Bynum who was always injured rather than Kwame? I love Kwame’s 1-on-1 defense against Shaq, Duncan, and other power players in the league and we definitely miss it when he is injured, which seems like all the time. But the rebounding, scoring, and shot blocking that we are getting from Andrew is far more important than the man-to-man defense offered by Kwame. Not to mention that every minute that Bynum plays gives him invaluable experience and growth as a player.

It will be interesting seeing what happens when (and if) Kwame is healthy again. Will Phil give him back the starting job? It is not impossible but my guess is that Andrew has shown too much to relegate him to the bench. It was one thing when Andrew did not show the endurance to play 30 minutes per game or stay out of foul trouble. Now I think Bynum has shown that neither his endurance or proclivity to foul are really issues today. Look for Bynum to continue to start and finish games, playing around 26 to 28 minutes per game and Kwame to back him up playing 12 to 14 minutes per game.

The future is Kobe and Andrew. Not Kobe and Kwame.

A question for both of you: Who would you be willing to trade Andrew Bynum for at this point in time? I find it hard to see any deal in which the Lakers would include Andrew now. He has essentially become un-tradable at this point. Do you agree? Thanks.

A second question: I also see the situation with Kobe as clearly coming up in the Lakers favor. Whether or not we can win a championship this year, I do not see how a trade can put Kobe in any better situation than he is right now as far as a team with young talent that looks like a future championship contender. What do you think. Thanks.

Tom

pfunk36

Love your comment, "After all you can't characterize Luke's performance as "disappointing" in as much as you can't blame a turtle for not being able to fly..........although you may "expect" the turtle to fly..........turtles just can't fly.

On occasion they may have a little more pep in their step.....but the reality is .........a turtle is a turtle.

I personally subscribe to the philosophy of two-time NBA champion coach Rudy Tomjanovich..........place Walton at the end of the bench.......if he is on the team at all.......this way people like you will no longer be "disappointed" when turtles.........don't fly"

I think that says it all. Any minutes given to Walton are pretty much wasted.
Last night Luke got 30+ minutes, while Ariza got less than 4. That makes no sense whatsoever. I'll take any confusion on Trevor's part about all the Lakers systems over Luke's lack of talent and ability any day. I'm not saying Luke is the reason we lost, but his +/- sure didn't help us win.

AK and BK:

Following up on my last post where I posited that both Kobe Bryant and Andrew Bynum were untouchable as far as trades go, do you think the Lakers will make a move during the season and if so, who do you think they will consider trading?

My guess is that we may see another 2 for 1 trade such as Cook and Evans for Aziza. The players who may be included? I am guessing Kwame, due to his contract and injuries, and Luke, who more and more seems to be the odd man out. What would a combination of Brown and Walton fetch the Lakers? Hopefully, a defensive minded power forward. Maybe a shot at a lottery pick to get Kevin Love out of UCLA in next year’s draft.

I do not see the Lakers trading Odom at this point. Kidd is again having legal issues with his sexual behavior with strange women in public again. Jermaine O’Neal looks like a shell of himself. Despite his early season struggles, I still love Lamar’s size, length, and rebounding, and ability to create nightmare match-ups. I also like his heart. The Lakers need to move Bynum into a feature role to be the number two scorer and let Lamar just play his game and fill up the stat sheet. Anyway, that’s my take on Odom.

Tom

pfunk-

While AK addressed the point about how we've actually said the same things about Walton for a while now, and haven't been shy about pointing his level of play this season, to your other point, it's actually fairly simple:

I think Walton is a better player than you do.

He's not an All Star, and he's got flaws. But as a role player, especially with the style the Lakers use, he can be effective. They're a better team when he plays well. I think it was fairly clear last year when he missed a lot of games that the skill set Walton brings gives something to the team they don't otherwise get. To me, 20-25 minutes a night with a healthy roster sounds about right.

BK

AK, not to beat a dead horse... but, I'll beat a dead horse and leave it at this. It sounds like you guys are being fed a line. If these geniuses can't turn the function off after what? 2-3 weeks now? then I have to conclude that they are incompetent and are either rookies who can't anticipate problems or look at you as a low profit account and not worth the time it would take working on your account vs spending that time on some other big spender's account. It would seem to be common sense to be able to turn off a function IN CASE there would be problems but hey... I guess the lowest bidder won? LOL!

I mean... in a general sense... you ARE losing money over this via page views? as fewer people try to post here? I dunno... something's off here... and I know you guys aren't really involved in what software the LAT uses or picking vendors but... this is where I know to post my thoughts... so... that's about all that needs to be said on that!

A number of you sound like you think there is an All-Star SF sitting on the bench because Walton is getting all the playing time. Vlad is still inconsistent; Lamar is having problems (possibly due to playing more at SF and not being able to adjust); Ariza is new to the team and also has significant gaps in his game, particularly on offense. Kobe would be an option, but there isn't a decent shooting guard to replace him at that position.

exhelodrvr-

i just had to laugh at your post. it doesn't matter who plays ahead of luke. these people are going to find a way to trash that person anyways.

Having watched the replay, I know and can see that LO was pretty much set up to be the fall guy (I mean ball in his hands and we need to score? call me crazy but I want Fish to decide the game, not him). BUT, we lost the game far earlier than that. Even far earlier than gimpy Kobe. We lost it on the defensive side when we allowed Baron Davis to shoot a dagger 3. We allowed it on the defensive side when we let Al Harrington exploit us every trip and never countered. We allowed it when we let them lull us into playing their game.

That's where the changes have to be made.

LAKER TOM, WHAT ARE YOU DOING TRYING TO MAKE RATIONAL ARGUMENTS TO MIKE T.? HE WILL NOT RESPOND TO YOUR POST BECAUSE IT MAKES TOO MUCH SENSE. HE IGNORES THE POSTS THAT ACTUALLY DESTROY HIS STUPID ARGUMENTS.

FOR THE 10000000000TH TIME MIKE T,

KWAME AND BYNUM TOGETHER IS BETTER THAN JUST BYNUM, WHICH MEANS OF COURSE OUR RECORD IS NOT GOING TO BE AS GOOD. KWAME IS A DECENT DEFENDER SO IT HURTS OUR TEAM TO NOT HAVE HIM. BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN HE BRINGS MORE TO THE TABLE THAN BYNUM.

EVERONE KNOWS THAT KWAME WITHOUT BYNUM WOULD BE ATROCIOUS.

MAYBE IF KWAME WASN'T SUCH A SISSY HE WOULD SPEND ALL YEAR INJURED. MAYBE IF KWAME HAD SOME BALLS HE WOULD WORK ON HIS GAME IN THE OFF SEASON. MAYBE IF KWAME HE SOME BRAINS HE WOULD DO THINGS TO IMPROVE HIMSELF AS A BASKETBALL PLAYER.

EVERYBODY ALSO KNOWS THAT KWAME'S SEASON (+ -) STAT IS NEGATIVE 9, WHILE BYNUM'S IS WELL OVER 100. SO IF KWAME WAS HAVING SUCH AN AMAZING IMPACT ON THE GAME THEN THAT WOULD BE REFLECTED IN HIS (+ -) STAT, BUT IT ISN'T SO YOU BASICALLY IGNORE THAT POINT.

I don't know why people still reply to Michael T. His obsession with Kwame should be a red flag, but him saying Lakers scoring 104 points is not the problem should tell you something.

*Hint: How many points does GSW score on average?

Kwame is not nor will ever be in the top 20 centers in the league when it comes to defense. Since Mike T likes to bash Drew, I'll just come on here to bash Kwame the weakest starting center in the history of the Lakers. 2 years as the starting center has led to a barely over .500 record and two first round exits. He's the clumsiest center in this league with no offensive or defensive game at all. He has the worst basketball IQ in the history of the game and is the game's biggest bust. Our record and playoff exits are all the proof needed. I don't need to wait a month to make this point. Kwame is nowhere near the status of Biedrins, Kaman, Dampier, Diop, Okur, Dalembert, Bogut, Nesterovic, Oberto, Jeff Foster, Collins brothers, Haywood, Perkins, Curry and Milicic. I won't mention any of the top tier centers including Bynum because Kwame can't carry the jockstrap of the second tier of centers in this league. I don't need a month to explain what's happened the past 6 years of his lame career. He hasn't improved one IOTA in spite of playing with two of the greatest players to ever put on a uniform in Jordan and Bryant and playing for HOF coach in Jackson. I would even trade Kwame for the ageless wonder Mutombo who's never been great offensively, but even at age 52 plays better defense than the waste of big calves that sits on our bench because his legs as big as they are, are as brittle as a glass Christmas ornament. No wonder why the Nuggets scoffed and laughed this summer when we offered Kwame for Camby!!! Like offering a Pinto for an Escalade(LOL). PJ only uses Kwame because he's stuck with him and no other team in the NBA or D-League wants him. The High School and the District he came from must be pretty bad talent wise if he was the best player to come out when he did. We've had this experiment for two years now and all we've done was run in place with our version of David Boston(a buff receiver in the NFL that faded out)in the middle. I would even trade Kwame for the soft Spencer Hawes of the Kings, but I doubt that the Kings would even take Kwame. Pitiful. I would even take Paul Milsap or Jason Maxiell over Kwame any day of the week. It's so sad for me because I was an all-state point guard in high school at 5ft 7 inches to see such a waste of height when it comes to Kwame. If I were his height, with the attitude and heart I have, I would destroy people on the court. He's not even in former Utah Center Ostertag's class!!! More Kwame bashing to come, stay tuned!!! LOL

Hey everyone, remember last year when the Nets wanted to trade HOF point guard Jason Kidd for Kwame? Oh my bad, I meant Bynum. LOL

AK, BK, rest of bloggers

I'd just like to point that as much as I have been critical of Kobe Bryant, today I cannot be. Today I had the pleasure of representing a sponsor for the Annual Boyle Heights Miracle on 1st Street. For the whole day a bunch of companies give a way really nice free toys to kids and families who really need it. Today Kobe Bryant came on behalf of the Nike campaign which donates money to local neighborhoods to build athletic facilities like bball courts, soccer fields, etc. Today Kobe presented at $20K check to the Hollenbeck Youth Center in East LA. He was all smiles and he also stayed around for a while to hand out gifts to families and take some pictures and autograph jerseys, ball etc.

It is fitting because while I never really thought about, Kobe was a confirmed guest awhile ago to come to this event...and I never made the connection that it was December 15th until a few days ago. So today a bunch of really happy kids chanted Kobe's name and some people said "stay kobe" young and old and it was a really nice experience. Yeah and even though Kobe hurt his groin, lost a close nail bitter, and probably got home to his family late last night, he still showed up to East LA.

So today I felt a glimmer a happiness because here it was, the day he was supposed to be gone, but yet he was still here, an icon of Los Angeles, helping a neighborhood of mine.

Go Lakers!

Lake Show,

Really cool post. Thanks for sharing that about Kobe. A lot goes unnoticed about what players do for the community. Thanks Lake Show.

>>>It's not that I don't want Walton to play at all, what I've been saying is
>>>that there's no reason why Luke should get 34 minutes and Ariza and
>>>Vlad combine for 15 minutes. Vlad's a far better shooter than Walton and
>>>Ariza is a far better defender.

And the unstated part kinda leads to the crux of the biscuit. Luke is a better
defender than Vlad, and he's better in the offense than Ariza. And of course,
Kwame the Champion riding the pine means that Ronny has to back up center,
and that means that Lamar has to play PF. If we actually had a 2nd center who
could stay on the court and was worthy of getting some minutes, they could
slide Ronny back to PF and Lamar back to SF and Luke would be the veteran
presence in the bench mob and all would be well in Laker land.

If I remember right, Luke was kind of hoblling at the end of last season and
through the playoffs. I'm guessing he spent more time resting his ankle than
working on his game during the summer and it shows.

I think both Luke and Lamar (and maybe even Mihm) could recover their timing
and be more effective for the Lakers by the end of the year. If not, it wouldn't
surprise me if PJ started working in more time for PJ.

Perhaps the Lakers should either trade Kwame for a big who stays healthy
and actually contributes or they should use the extra roster slot to sign a
free agent big who could contribute.

SHAQ FAN:

Exactly.

Tom

It seems that all bloggers are agreeing that Walton should not be playing the minutes he is getting.

The only thing that bothers me about Ariza is that he breaks the rhythm of the offense. But I dont think that is a big problem because either way were going to score our 105+ points. BEcause Ariza is a GREAT cutter and finisher. I think if Phil were too put him out there with Kobe Bryant all will be dandie. This is how I think the minutes should look.

Walton 10-15 min (Its a no brainer. His game is limited to being a specialty role player)
Ariza 15-20 min (Defensive disrupter along with Kobe, great cutter, great finisher, draws fouls)
Radmonvic 20-25 min (Decent defender, Great shooter, good cutter, X factor-Wild card)
Odom 30-40 min (Average defender, Great rebounder, Average cutter, Average shooter, Decent passer,Average driver, Streaky shooter, X factor-Wild card)

Great post Lake Show

I too am super critical of Kobe, but I must admit only Kobe can bring those type of experiences that the Lamars of the world cant.

Thanks Kobe for being a decent person

Hey someone was comparing Devean George with Luke Walton!

Are you kidding me???

Devean George (two championships, great defender, clutch shooter, great cutter, great knowledge of triangle)

Luke Walton (Zero Championships, below average defender, cant shoot, below average cutter,)

whoever brought that comparison up is smoking