Know thy enemy: The Western Conference, Part I
How do you know the Laker season is underway? Besides watching last night's home opener, the barrage of KCAL ads and your general ability to read a calendar, since the games start on more or less the same date each year?
Because we're busting out the ol' "Know thy enemy," that's why!
It's time to analyze, deconstruct and generally pick apart the Western Conference that houses Laker enemies. All 14 teams. All angles and aspects explored. I've divvied up the contenders (and pretenders) into four categories, two of which will be posted ri ... gh ... t ...
Now.
TEAMS THAT DEFINITELY WILL BE WORSE THAN THE LAKERS
Minnesota Timberwolves
Give Kevin McHale credit. He provided KG precious little help during his 12 seasons in Minneapolis, but the dude don't eff around when it comes to erasing remnants of the failed Big Ticket era. And good call, by the way. If you really want to rebuild, don't try to make the transition somewhat palatable. Blow it the (bleep) up in the hopes of eventually becoming good by stockpiling young talent and cap space during those 3-5 years of being bad. And make no mistake, this squad will be, as Homer Simpson once said, "crap on a crud." Al Jefferson, Randy Foye (who'll be out a while), Craig Smith, Gerald Green and Corey Brewer could develop into one hell of a core. But for now, expect the kids to experience mucho growing pains while being baby sat ... er, mentored, by Theo Ratliff and Mark Madsen. And if McHale really wants to keep this inaugural rebuild atmosphere from turning poisonous, I'd advise making copies of Troy Hudson's and Juwan Howard's buyout papers for Antoine Walker.
Seattle Supersonics
Another team that could be good in a few years, but for now, yikes! At least they've got one hell of a prospect in Kevin Durant to create entertaining losses. To say this kid (who Kobe recently described as the longest player he's ever seen) can score from anywhere on the floor would be a comical understatement. He also appears to have his head screwed on straight, which is fortunate, since the road to super-stardom will be filled with a lot of bumps in the immediate future. Considering the Sonics are comprised of "one starter who can play but isn't a go-to guy" (Chris Wilcox), "starters who would come off the bench for almost any team other than Seattle" (Nick Collison, Damien Wilkins, Luke Ridnour), "solid role players who'll help but would likely rather be elsewhere" (Kurt Thomas, Wally Szczerbiak, Earl Watson), "youth movement dudes" (Jeff Green, Delonte West) and "the freakiest-looking kid I've ever seen in my life (Robert Swift)," Durant has already found himself in LeBron's company before even playing an official game. He stepped into the NBA as his team's best player.
Portland Trailblazers
Greg Oden's out. Reigning ROY Brandon Roy is battling injury. Blazer fans are bummed. And I'm totally suspicious. Personally, I don't think either guy is hurt. I think Kevin Pritchard looked at the roster and realized that despite this team's wonderful future, they're still too young to make much noise even at full strength. So why not toss another season into the toilet, try to snag another freak-luck No. 1 pick, add O.J. Mayo to the Oden-Roy-LaMarcus Aldridge foundation and set this franchise for life? For that result, I'd be willing to roll the dice and endure a crappy year with Joel Przybilla racking two points a game at center. And no, that number was not a typo. Remember, you heard this conspiracy theory here first.
Sacramento Kings
For what it's worth, there's definitely a team in the Pacific with more ill-matched or unimpressive parts than the Lakers. You just don't hear about them, since nobody cares about the Kings anymore. Save Nicole Richie-thin Kevin Martin, this rotation's core leaves mucho to be desired. A star duo (Ron Artest and the thumb-addled Mike Bibby) that reportedly doesn't get along and has been on and off the block since about 1978, a small forward trapped in a center's body (Brad Miller), two power forwards (Shareef Abdur-Rahim, Kenny Thomas) who could lose their starting gig to a cat barely topping 220 pounds (Mikki Moore), and John Salmons, last season's mid-level-compensated addition whose name won't ring a bell for 9 out of 10 people reading this. Hey, what's not to love, besides their terrible D and new coach Reggie Theus' rules, like no cellies on the bus and roadie curfews? The perfect spirit-lifter during a sub-.500 season.
Memphis Grizzlies
I'll be watching this rather lousy team for three reasons and three reasons only.
1) I find the career path of Darko Milicic bizarrely fascinating (as well as his thoughts on FIBA refereeing).
2) I'm just curious to see if Darko's presence motivates Stromile Swift, since Milicic snagging his minutes would soldify Swift as the worst No. 2 pick of the last 10 years. Or vice versa, if Swift holds him off. A historic "Battle to Suck Less" is in the works, people!
3) After bringing in Pau Gasol's best buddy Juan Carlos Navarro specifically to appease the disgruntled star, I'm curious to see who G.M. Chris Wallace will swap out to add Jose Calderon, Jorge Garbajosa and Sergio Rodriguez and surround Pau with all his boys. Will they put together a $100,000,000 package to lure Fran Vasquez out of hiding? Whatever it takes to make Gasol "gruntled," a transformation that won't likely happen, since I'm pegging these guys for about 35 wins.
Los Angeles Clippers
Best-case scenario to stay afloat until Elton Brand and Shaun Livingston hopefully return in February: Corey Maggette becomes an efficient scoring machine, prompting Mike Dunleavy to wonder what the two ever fought about. Chris Kaman proves that last season was a hiccup in an otherwise steadily improving career. Rookie Al Thornton builds on a monster preseason. Tim Thomas actually steps up for a team that needs him to become tougher and motivated. Cuttino Mobley remains steady. Ruben Patterson's bulldog attitude permeates throughout the squad. Brevin Knight and Sam Cassell remain healthy enough to patch together a season's worth of quality point-guard play and leadership.
Worst-case scenario to stay afloat until Elton Brand and Shaun Livingston hopefully return in February: Corey Maggette becomes an inefficient shooting machine, prompting he and Mike Dunleavy to come to blows in a liquor store parking lot. Chris Kaman continues looking easily distracted, just with shorter hair. Al Thornton hits the rookie wall in January. Tim Thomas remembers he gets the exact same paycheck no matter how he plays, which makes hitting cruise control a no-brainer. Cuttino Mobley's biggest 2008 accomplishments revolve around his wardrobe (dude can dress). Ruben Patterson's bulldog attitude gets him suspended twice by the team for "conduct detrimental." Brevin Knight misses his usual assortment of games while Cassell nurses even more injuries, eventually getting dealt at the deadline to a contender that he guides to a title playing 18 mpg.
I'm not sure either scenario will shake out exactly as described, but call me crazy: I'm picturing an outcome closer to the second than the first.
TEAMS THAT WILL BE ABOUT AS GOOD AS THE LAKERS, MAYBE A LITTLE BETTER
New Orleans Hornets
Do yourself a favor. If you're vacationing in the Big Easy and talking hoops with a local, don't bust out a sob story about the Laker injury woes, because you're likely to find a little spit in your gumbo. Say what you want about the purple and gold's crummy health, but the Hornet starters missed a combined 133 games, 69 alone by Peja Stojakovic. But even with that staggering number of contests featuring Hornets in suits, they still managed to make a serious playoff push. If they can stay out of the trainer's room, this is a team equipped to, at the very least, nudge the Lakers further down the Western Conference ladder. David West is the NBA's best "almost 20/10 player that nobody knows who the hell he is." Tyson Chandler is beating Kwame Brown and Eddy Curry in the quest to be the 2001 high school draft class kid that almost lives up to the hype (as a defensive specialist/rebounding machine who alters roughly a zillion shots per game). And with all respect to Deron Williams, Chris Paul still has my vote for league's most promising young PG. Add Peja's triples, Bobby Jackson's ability (when healthy) to score in bunches, Mo Peterson's shooting and defense, plus solid role players like Rasual Butler, Ryan Bowen and Jannero Pargo, that's a team that can provide fits around the league. Or at least beat the Lakers, whichever comes first.
Golden State Warriors
Call me cynical, but I don't see Golden State improving much on last season's surprise success down the stretch. Maybe it's because I think Baron Davis can't stay healthy enough. Maybe it's because I think they don't have enough front-court scoring. Maybe it's because I think they don't have enough D, whether front, back or middle court (if such a term even exists). Maybe it's because any team with Stephen Jackson as a tri-captain seems pretty much destined to go off the rails like a ... wait for it ... crazy train. But until the Warriors actually fall back into the mediocrity I'm predicting, they finished 2007 with the same record as the Lakers, so they deserve my treatment as more or less equals.
Incidentally, does everyone agree that last season wasn't a question of Dirk Nowitzki simply crumbling in the playoffs but literally being scared of the Warriors? As in, "I'm frightened of these guys and I want my mommy!" Granted, between Davis, Jax, Al Harrington's mohawk and Matt Barnes running around like a tatted-out meth fiend from Fresno, the Warriors put out a decidedly edgy vibe. But at the same time, the dude is 7' 0" and freakin' German! Shouldn't that make him sort of tough? I don't like tossing around the "soft" label, because I think it's often a cliche. But I've been questioning Dirk way before the Mavs got bounced. I was actually pretty relieved to hear Mark Cuban say that Dirk was off the table in a theoretical Kobe swap. I'll take Josh Howard over Nowitzki any day of the week.
Part II to follow soon.
-- AK
utzworld,
>>>I say Gordon/Hinrich/Noah/Some Dude for Kobe/Kwame/Sasha.
The only way they could possibly include Kwame and still match salaries (at least right
now) is if Ben Wallace was one of the players coming back. Hinrich is BYC, so his
contract only counts as $5,500,000 from the Lakers' perspective. Kobe plus Kwame
is about 28 million (assuming Kobe would waive his trade kicker), so they'd have to get
back about 22.4 million in contracts to make it work Hinrich + Gordon + Noah is only
12.4 million. They can't get 10 million more in contracts right now without including
either Wallace or Deng.
How would you feel about Kobe + Kwame + Sasha for
Wallace + Gordon + Thomas + JamesOn Curry (or Aaron Gray)?
That one works.
Posted by: Long Time Laker Fan | October 31, 2007 at 10:23 PM
Long Time Laker Fan
lol, my hubby said the same thing.....but then I reminded him it was the Laker front office here and not really he or I making these deals.
Posted by: bob | October 31, 2007 at 10:28 PM
"If Kobe would have been smart, he would have mended those fences with Shaquille, let Shaquille be 'The Man' and we wouldn't be in this position," Johnson said. "Now, after four years later, he understands that he can't do it by himself. Now he's blaming the organization, and some of that blame should be on him and some on the organization."
and that´s the bottom line `cause magic said so.
Posted by: DC | October 31, 2007 at 10:31 PM
WOW
Kobe 45 points!
Oh but wait they LOST again.
He! hew! he!
I TOLD YOU SO!
Posted by: ogurat | October 31, 2007 at 10:33 PM
Michael A.,
That's the challenge on the Phoenix, we cannot afford to double team because we are slow in going back to our man. Like Kwame leaving the center and chase Nash on the top of the foul line, bang Marion or Amare will be taking their snack alley-hooping in the post. lol! Then clogging the post by teaming up on Amare, great Nasty will pass it to clothesliner or to Diaw bang! they got the painful three.
My view is Game 3 of the playoffs switching defense, there is always a man in front of the player. For Nash, we have to tire him by using tall guards or fast guards until his back aches with constant shadowing, without that scheme, Nash will hide with his traditional P & R with Diaw or Barbosa until lakers get bedazzled in finding whom to guard.
We have alreadyfought the Phoenix suns 11 games in the playoffs, plus 8 times in the season for the last two years until now we're still confused, that's how slow-footed our players are. We don't have these kinds of problem from 2000-04. If Fox-Horry can do it why not Walton-Kwme or Turiaf? they can all do the high fives right? lol!
Posted by: Edwin Gueco | October 31, 2007 at 10:35 PM
jorema -
artest is suspended for the start of the season
for pleading no contest on domestic battery charge
Posted by: CBuck | October 31, 2007 at 10:36 PM
I would not be suprised if average joe is KL, cause he is making people on this plog hate kobe because of avg. joe.
It's obvious he wants to piss people off
Posted by: greek dude | October 31, 2007 at 10:44 PM
"They switched off T-Mac to Luke for a reason"
I didn't want to say anything because I written so much about it. But teams isolate Walton yet PJ plays him for 39 minutes.
I figured since there so much season I would get to it in time.
mike
Posted by: Michael Teniente | October 31, 2007 at 10:51 PM
Preview of the nextgame:
KOBE - 100 points, 0 assist, 0 rebound
The rest of the team - who cares!
Oh by the way...THEY LOST "AGAIN".... & AGAIN.... & AGAIN...
PHOENIX - 101 (he! he! he!) & WIN.... by one point... without the starting five... just to piss that MJ wanna' be off... OUCH!
He he he !
I TOLD YOU SO!
Posted by: ogurat | October 31, 2007 at 11:11 PM
Faith,
I'm with you all the way.
What I know is this. Next game, Kobe will drop the same 12 dimes, but this time guys will make their shots and people will all of a sudden say how much of a "team" game he played. He'll have a line like 35-8-7 or something and everyone will say that we would have won the first game too, if Kobe only played like that.
I'm glad that guy made the post to show that Kobe was passing the ball, nobody was shooting. Or, the guys who did shoot, didn't make their shots, except Fish. And, only Farmar kept the offense going with his passing.
It must suck to have your game graded by how someone else plays. Especially if that someone else is a stiff.
--FearlessWhackJob
PS: If Kobe's wrist wasn't hurt, he would have made at least 7 of those missed FT's and the game would have never been that close. Lakers win.
Posted by: FearlessWhackJob | October 31, 2007 at 11:30 PM
Sheridan: Kobe objecting to Deng's inclusion in Bulls-Lakers trade
The Bulls want to give him. Kobe don't .
http://abclocal.go.com/wpvi/story?section=sports&id=5736890
Posted by: jorema | October 31, 2007 at 11:32 PM
Mike,
Even if I think some of your posts are full of crap, and others are quite insightful, you can butcher your grammar any time you want to.
Substance? I care about.
Grammar? Who cares?
Broken English? Bah, humbug! Just say something cool and I'll either agree or yell at my monitor.
Period. End of discussion.
--FearlessWhackJob
Posted by: FearlessWhackJob | October 31, 2007 at 11:37 PM
KOBE please stay and may you have many more brick shot attempt in the future!
I TOLD YOU SO!
Posted by: ogurat | October 31, 2007 at 11:42 PM
BTW,
I want to play with Deng, too. And I'm not an NBA superstar.
--FearlessWhackJob
Posted by: FearlessWhackJob | October 31, 2007 at 11:42 PM
Isn't it funny that no matter how PJ tries to hide Luke, the other team is always able to find him and exploit him?
Maybe Phil needs to recalibrate his Jedi Mind Trick, or something.
--FearlessWhackJob
Posted by: FearlessWhackJob | October 31, 2007 at 11:47 PM
ogurat or tarugo or whatever...u sure ur not KL?
Posted by: kobelovesjuan | October 31, 2007 at 11:58 PM
Kobe is not going anywhere. If he is truely insisting that Deng not be included, then he will have a long wait. Dr Buss is a great poker player and a prideful man, he will not allow Kobe to call the shots here.
What Dr Buss should do is call a news conference and say that Kobe is off the table due to unacceptable offers. If Kobe wants to leave, then he will Ok Deng in the deal.
Like I have said over and over, there is no rush here. And from my perspective, the only guy woth giving Kobe up for is Deng. The other guys are either nice players or prospects. Deng is the only one that has true all star potential. Let Kobe wait. I know Dr Buss will.
MH
Posted by: michael h | November 01, 2007 at 12:14 AM
That game last night made me sick!
Watching Kobe play last night was unsettling. There is just so much wrong with the way he played it is hard to know where to begin. I suppose you could start with the 50 forced shots, and overplaying his man on defense.
But you know the really amazing things is that you have an entire organization that has become so conditioned to this destructive style of play that they are afraid to put the clamps down on it.
I read the comments about the weaknesses of his teammates, and just keep thinking how in the hell could you expect anyone to play well with a guy who destroys the cohesiveness of your offense (and not infrequently) your defense?
I am impressed that Fisher managed to find 9 shots and scored 17 points. That is the guy there that really kept us in the game. Under the circumstances, that was a pretty impressive game by D-Fish. And I thought Luke, Turiaf and Farmar did a good job of hanging tough.
There are your real team leaders right there. The guys that kept plugging away trying to find a way to win the game as Kobe did his best impression of a guy auditioning for a white leather jacket in a padded room.
So, how come no one stands up to Kobe and say "F-U man, you are destroying this team'? Where is the voice of integrity in the spiritual abyss that has become the Lakers?
Where is the owner who says I not going to let a guy like that destroy my team?
Where the coach who has a commitment to playing the game the right way?
Where is the player who gets into Kobe's face and tells him, "You've disrespected yourself and every player on this team with the way you play, the way you act and the things you've said. And it is going to stop or I am going to knock you on your ass until it does stops." (Love Shaq for being that guy for us at one time).
I guess that is the real problem with the Lakers right now, absolutely no Juevos!
And, as for Kobe, man what frigging joke that guy is!
(Meanwhile, somewhere off in the desert, Steve Nash is rolling around on the ground in uncontrollable laughter).
Posted by: OldSchool | November 01, 2007 at 12:22 AM
"Bryant was booed during pregame introductions Tuesday at Staples Center. He was also jeered the first time he touched the ball, but as the game went on, Lakers fans began cheering for him. "It just felt good to hear them come back around later in the game," Bryant said Wednesday. "That's the most important thing. They know. A smart fan can kind of read between the lines and can kind of decide for themselves what's really going on. I just let it be. I just want to go out there and play the game that I love to play."
Read between the lines people. Something is going on and I bet Kobe won't be going anywhere. What's really going on? Any fool can see....I shoulld just keep my mouth shut on this one and just let it happen.
I KNOW NOTHING!
mike
Posted by: Michael Teniente | November 01, 2007 at 12:25 AM
Man this blog is turning into nonsense.
Blkthing06 compared Kobe bryant to an abused woman. HOW MORONIC!!!. I DONT KNOW HOW MUCH OF A JERK/IDIOT YOU HAVE TO BE TO COMPARE KOBE BRYANT TO A BATTERED WOMAN IN A RELATIONSHIP. IF THAT WAS YOUR SISTER OR YOUR MOM AND YOU SAID THAT THEY WERE LIKE KOBE I WOULD HOPE THEY PULLED A TRIGGER ON YOU. WHAT A MORONIC THING TO SAY. KOBE IS MAKING MILLIONS, HE IS WELL TAKEN CARE OF. KOBE BRYANT IS NOT A VICTIM. YOU ARE A COMPLETE MORON IF YOU THINK SO. YOU DESERVE THE BIGGEST F-U IN THE WORLD FOR SAYING SO.
now that being said,
AVERAGE JOE IS A LOSER. I DONT KNOW WHY HE IS EVEN POSTING ON THIS BLOG. ITS THE LAKERS BLOG, NOT THE KOBE BLOG. I DONT CARE IF KOBE WINS ANOTHER GAME IF HE IS TRADED. IF HE WINS A TITLE ITS ONE LESS TITLE THE LAKERS COULD WIN.
JOREMA IS A MORON TOO, for TYPING RUMORS THAT THE BOOS WERE PROJECTED BY A SPEAKER. What the hell is going on this blog? I thought you couldnt make up false ideas or rumors. I thought things were being edited by AK/BK??? THE WORSE PART IS THAT HALF OF THE BLOG ACTUALLY BELIEVES JOREMA THAT THE BOOS WERE PRE-RECORDED. WHAT A BUNCH OF IDIOTS.
Those two are worse than KL, becaues they are complete nitwits who dont apologize. At least KL admitted his faults. These guys are moronic.
The odd thing is all of this is that I think that Mike T. is actually somewhat right. For all the craziness of the summer, I am questioning how Phil can coach this team. Phil is only around to coach Kobe and now Fisher, but he doesnt seem to connect to the rest of his players. He doesnt know how to use them. SUPER QUESTIONABLE rotations in the last game. Where was that second unit together? Why arent some of those guys playing together? Fisher, Farmar and Kobe as the perimter? Cook and Kwame together??? I dont know what was going on.
Furthermore, Kobe is screwing the Lakers because not only does he want to be traded, but now only on his terms. IF the Lakers get nothing in a deal, BLAME KOBE NOT THE FO.
The Lakers could get Luol Deng this trade would happen. Luol Deng and Ron Artest for Kobe would work in a second. Personally, Ben Gordon is asking for too much money, and we dont want Ben Wallace. A permiter of Artest, Deng and Odom would be very solid.
But one good thought is that the Jermaine Oneal trade is still a possibility. The originally wanted Lamar Odom, but the way the team is being assembled they may just go with Bynum and a contract like Kwame and a piece like Farmar. If you notice that roster, they have a hole at center. Diagu and Murphy are both PF and they like them a lot. Also they need a real back up point guard with a future. I say they might take a kwame, bynum, farmar, vlad package for JO and David Harrison in a couple weeks.
Posted by: The Lake-Show | November 01, 2007 at 12:45 AM
I am somewhat amazed by the almost near panic of some the bloggers after ONE GAME. Here is a few random thoughts.
First the Rockets are being touted as an elite team in the west if they can stay healthy. Well they were healthy last night we wrer not. And they beat us by 2 points on a last second shot.
Kobe had a sprained wrist. Our number 2 didnt play and we lose by 2. Yes this team is not good enough to win if a key player goes down but how many teams are?
Defense. The blog has been bugging me all day on this one. We gave up 95 points. If we had averaged 95 last year we would have finished 7th in the league in defense. If we average 95 this year we will win a lot of games. Yao dropped 25 on us and it's Oh MY GOD Kwame and Andrew suck!! Yao is now the best center in the league and he AVERAGED 25 against the LEAGUE last year. So he didnt have a great game, he had an average one. And T-Mac dropped 30. When healthy he is a superstar. It happens. If he is on, there isnt much you can do about it. But defensively we did what you do against a team with superstars, let them get theirs and shut everyone else down. Look at the stat line of the other guys. All the other guys only scored 40 points total. That is good team defense. guys, it was offense, Kobes wrist, missing all the freebees and missing Lamar that did us in. Heck even Vlade out with the flu could have made the difference if he had been available to drop a couple of 3's.
Just look at some of the 1st games around the league. Cleveland gets killed and Labron scores 10 points and has 5 turnovers. I am thinking we didnt do such a bad job. Lets wait until we get our team playing together a while be for we push the panic button.
MH
Posted by: michael h | November 01, 2007 at 12:52 AM
After this comes out:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/columns/story?columnist=sheridan_chris&page=Deng_Bryant
if Lakers still play him business as usual, I'll have to hop on that "FO is completely incompetent and lost all control" bandwagon. He is now publicly competing against the team, and therefore - an enemy. They HAVE TO bench him and start twisting his arm.
It's getting surreal now.
Posted by: HAB | November 01, 2007 at 12:56 AM
KOBE please stay and may you have many more brick shot attempt in the future!
I TOLD YOU SO!
Posted by: ogurat | October 31, 2007 at 11:42 PM
Uoy era na elohssa. Og kcuf flesruoy. daehkciD.
Posted by: Jman449 | November 01, 2007 at 04:40 AM
Chicago slowly inches toward a deal I'd accept for Kobe:
"The Bulls, according to ESPN.com's source, are willing to offer an alternative package of Gordon, Noah and Thomas."
Wes
Posted by: wesjoenixon | November 01, 2007 at 04:42 AM
The comments from the Lakernation thing deal with a small segment of the game. The point is Kobe spend a lot of the game dribbling around,holding the ball and working his individual moves. A couple really nice passes that were worthy of a Magic highlight film but many more ineffective passes and way too many shots. The refs were being extremely generous to Kobe as far as free throws awarded.
While we didn't have much time to observe it last night since Kobe was injchucking it up the whole night,the pre season(and pre season is what it is) games the Lakers often looked a lot better with Kobe out of the lineup and a lot of ball sharing going on.
The Seattle game was the epitome. The Lakers built a big lead in the second quarter(Kobe sat almost the entire quarter),played excellent defense and moved the ball. Kobe came in for the start of the third and the ball movement stopped. Seattle came back. Then Kobe nailed a bunch of shots to score 20 points but the ball movement died and in spite of all those Kobe points that quarter the Lakers lost some of the lead they built up in the second period with the ball movement. They also GAVE UP more points than they did in any other quarter in the third.
Kobe was basically shooting the ball every time he saw it and it was impressive,make no mistake,but the things the TEAM was doing suffered and disappeared.
Posted by: Umat | November 01, 2007 at 06:32 AM
Mike T -
I do not claim to be an expert in any sense of the word.
The whole thing started when I saw you spell pick like pic. It started as a joke and I was not trying to be arrogant or show you up!!!
Please accept my olive branch and we can debate on topics intelligently in the future with out the name calling.
I was just wondering, have you ever coached or taught? You seem to have alot of insight and are passionate about the game.
Posted by: MJCMAN32 | November 01, 2007 at 06:48 AM
BK, Laker_STH,
Thanks for the info.
Posted by: hariyahu | November 01, 2007 at 07:00 AM
In addressing Kobe's passing...I hope you guys were listening during the game when they said Phil Jackson met with Kobe before tipoff and told him to forget about being the facilitator (passer/playmaker) and focus primarily on scoring....PJ giving Kobe the green light to do such a thing in the first game of the season...looks to me like Phil is ultimately the one not trusting the players.
Yes Kobe needs to trust his teamates more even though they've given him reasons not to. However, like one coach said when asked what he thought about the Triangle Offense. "Its an offense designed to get number 23, 34, number 8 (now 24) all the shots."
Guys were just standing around and when they had the ball, Kobe was cutting without the ball and would end up cutting right back to were he left the player with the rock. Kobe and Bynum didn't play that much to begin with.
Posted by: Rhon Salmon | November 01, 2007 at 07:12 AM
seeing as the bulls don't want to pay Deng, a smart man would try to trade for Deng right now. If Mitch offers Bynum, Odom and Farmar/ or Crit. for Deng amd Wallace. Guarantee it works the bulls need an inside presence and everyone is high on Bynum. Wallace has overstayed his welcome and high salary.....but i'm not in the front office and i'm a smart man.
Posted by: vizardronin | November 01, 2007 at 07:29 AM
AK/BK
Can you address this with some type of historical perspective.
It's all over the radio this morning that Bulls are offering Deng and Kobe is vetoing it. After the game (or it may have been half-time) interview, Kobe said something like "when I put this jersey on, I am a Laker", but when probed further, he admitted that "HIS REPRESENTATIVES" are involved in the negotiations. Well, Duh!
How bizarre is this? A player is allowed to suit up for a team, when it's public knowledge that he is trying to leave and screw this team as much as he can on his way out.
Is there any sort of a precedent to this, in any pro sport that you guys can point to? Should he not be allowed to play, at least until such specific negotiations break down?
Posted by: HAB | November 01, 2007 at 07:47 AM
*----------------------------------------*
*THIS GOODBY AINT FAKE....*
*---------------------------------------.*
Laker fans, you are fake, fake, FAKES!
You booed your own star for goodness sakes
You sided with the FO, and let them feed you slop
Falling for the oldest con, good and bad cop.
You let a crackhead jockey go and pull your strings
You let them dis on Kobe then let them dis 9Rings
A house that is divided, can and will not stand
Just ask Dr Buss, he got punished aint that grand
He tried to con everyone, and make the bad guy be Kobe
Stern busted Buss the Drunk, with a 2 game penalty
A lot of so called fans said trade him, he dont want to stay
Would you stay for dinner, if garbage was on your plate
They tried to smear Kobe, say watch him take a dive
So he went out and on the Rockets, dropped a quick 45
Then he asked the Rockets, SHOW ME WHAT YOU GOT
Yao said I got this Kobe, Kobe blocked his freakin shot.
Then they said get him Tmac, come on you’re the new MJ
9Rings put Kobe on him, Tmac couldn’t get a shot away.
Folks don’t drink the Kool-Aid, Yeah it taste oh so sweet
But that’s to hide the poison, that knocks you off your feet
Kobe is good as gone folks, that train done left the station
If you put up with this crap, you are all fakes Laker Nation
This is it for Mamba24, I punched my ticket this is it by by
Thank yall for your love, but this FO crap dont fly
To my blogger sister FAITH, Take care I’ll love you forever
To my mentor EDWIN GUECO, a storm is coming get a sweater
To my inspiration and blogger brother, see you later take care THA SHOW
You said it, I understood it, youre right , Time for me to go
You want the truth well you got it, LAKER TRUTH knows why
other teams now look upon the Lakers, FO as a pig sty.
To the renaissance man, they call him GENERIC ONE
Man you’re a genius not generic, you’re second to no one
To KEIFO my blogger twin brother, stay strong and stay on course
I’m sorry my friend and brother, I got to ride the Kobe horse
To blogger sister EAST COAST JESSIE, big kudos sis to you
To root for the Lakers over KG, damn girl respect to you is due
To a man a lot respect, but just as many love to hate
you got skills MIKE T dont give up, Only God controls your fate
To utzworld THE BANNER HOLDER, like KRS ONE I got to fly
Keep on posting keep on believing, hold that banner hold it high
To fellow warrior ANGRY LAKER, you think you’re angry listen to this
That water that fell from Staples, that aint water but Buss piss
And finally MAMBA FAMILY, from this nest this mamba must fly
Godd@mnit ithis didn’t have to happen, let me go before I cry
THIS IS IT FOLKS THE FINAL TIME:
ROLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL
CALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL:
(1) FAITH, MIKE T. TALIQ, Edwin Gueco,, KEIFO, Mamba24Fan4Life, Fan of Mamba, Wolf, Man
KIWI, WOW, PEACE, J_COOL, DAVID WHANG, ADAM KILEY, LAKERSRYDEORDIE, CLEON
FISH_GUY,TIM-4-SHOW, THA_ SHOW, WESJOENIXON, BAYWOOD, THE_D, SBPIMP, DAXMDD
utzworld THE BANNER HOLDER, CALI KING, RICK FRIEDMAN,THIRTY2, EXHELODRVR,
GENERIC_ONE, TWOODY, JJ, AJAX, MITCHELL., LAKERTOM, LAKERFAN, CHARLES,
KHANG VMAN, KOREY, XTRO, MCGARNAGLE, GUGY, GDChild,Laker4Life, Laker Seth
KL BEAST, Jorema, FearlessWhackJob, MARTY, JANDRO, LAKERFAZE, PhxLkrFAN,
TexasLaker, BOB, TreacherousBalloons, EagleBoy, JR., EASTCOASTJESSIE, Zakee,
Tully Moxness, KobeRocks, David Peterson, centralk, 244Life, SamII, vi lakerfan,
Swettual, Utzworld, Andrew Z, LAL Fan, BRANDON C., Kinglakernidas, BlackMamba24,
FKILLAH, CYRUS(VENTRILIQUIST), RespectMyAuthorith, Waterboy, Hariyahu, HUBBIT
ZEN, SARCOCOP,Staples24, Bobby, COMPTONS FINEST, MIGUELINHO, Greek Dude,
TUKLAW, CDUB0512, MRBARNEYDANGLES,BENJAMIN,MJCMAN32, KobeFromManilas
SOCALIFE, HAL9000, Greekdude, Michael J, Michael H, Michael A., Rick Friedman,
Gunner24, GINO, FATTY, CBUCK,LAKERGURL, CRITICAL BEATDOWN, PFUNK36,
PAUL LEE, Jay EL, SocalSpider , WEAVE MAN, JON KAVULIC, Tajluck, Alexinho17
BERKLEYLAKER, Dice8Up DION, KARL, CRAIG, MITCHELL, Lakers4Life, Ryan,GiantSquid
JR, Dascilla, tellitlikeitisNik Kannan, GABE, SEAN P., HanSoulFood, HollywoodJack,
Jay Jay, TaosHum, HOBBITIMAGE, Caeser, Obel, CHITOWNLAKER, ANGRYLAKER
wiZo, MagicShaq, HugoBoss, OSCAR, RDLEE, RealityBites, LakerLarry, Bucky, LEELO,
Juno, LakerLifer, C.S. JOVA, BLAZE1BX, Tripgame3, TSPHERE, SIXONEZERO,
Mfeige, Reggie, Hollywood Jack, Reality Check Time, Jack In Hollywood, SLO Gal, Thi
JONINJAPAN(INCANADA), VIOLATER, LT Laker Fan, , KATE, TROY, Mainor, Caesar
JEFF, ANDY B., SWANWORLD, PUPLE&GOLD_4EVA, BENNY BLANCA,CS in Virg
EMMA, TIM IN SYDNEY RISING STAR, LakerBake, JuanMan888,Blkthght06, Man,
Any_One_mouse, 10milliondollarZen, Shiva, Laker_Hopeful, LakerDawg, East Nyboer
,Ghost of Spiderman, Steve in Denver Guy Owanlele, Lincoln Laker, Houston Laker
MITCH KUPCHAK, JERRY BUSS, PHIL JACKSON, KOBE BRYANT, CLEON, B4hoops
Marc Gasol, Sun Yue, Shamond, Williams, Ronny Turiaf, V. Radmanovic, Jennifer
Maurice Evans, Lamar Odom, Derek Fisher, Luke Walton, Brian Cook, KOBES T.
Kwame Brown, Andrew Bynum, Coby Karl, Chris Mihm, Sasha Vujacic
Jordan Farmar, Jarvis Critterton, JERMAINE ONEAL???, Larry Fulcher
ALL TOGETHER NOW:
WE ARE THE FREAKIN LA LAKERS THE WINNERS OF 14 NBA TITLES
THE HOME OF WILT, KAREEM, GEORGE MIKAN, SHAQ, MAGIC, KOBE,
ELGIN BAYLOR, JERRY WEST, PAT RILEY, JAMES WORTHY, SILK
COACHED BY THE 9 TIME TITLE WINNER PHIL (9RINGS) JACKSON AND
THE DUMB @SS FO HAS DIVIDED BUT NOT CONQUERED
LAKERS TODAY LAKERS TOMORROW LAKERS FOREVER
Posted by: Mamba24 | November 01, 2007 at 07:48 AM
thanks kobe.
you not only want to bail on the lakers, you want us to get ripped off in the process.
it is reported that the bulls ARE IN FACT willing to part with deng in a deal for kobe.
but good ol' kobe with his trade veto says no. no deal with chicago can involve deng.
and to all the kobe lovers, enjoy it. your idol is not only quitting on a team & city that has supported him, he would also like for that team & city to get ripped off in the process.
that cannot be stressed or said enough.
kobe bryant not only is demanding to be traded to the bulls, he also wants to make sure that the lakers do not equal value in return (deng, gordon, thomas and noah).
wow.
i am with HAB, bench kobe until a deal gets done.
and the lakers better remain steadfast in demanding deng & gordon with this deal. do not waver.
in a matter of 4 months, i have gone from defending kobe to eagerly looking forward to the day that he is gone.
so i guess chicago isn't so stupid. they are willing to part with deng, gordon, thomas & noah.
however, kobe bryant isn't cool with that.
wgat's next? does he want dr. buss to drive him to the airport after the trade is made?
the lakers front office is inept. no argument here.
but kobe bryant takes the cake.
after ALL the lakers have done for him, he not only wants out - he wants to make sure the lakers do not get equal value (or anything close to it) in return.
this is kobe's logic: "trade me now & don't ask for too much from the bulls, i am trying to win a title..."
wow.
Posted by: tha show | November 01, 2007 at 07:59 AM
I think those were the truest words Mike T has ever spoken.
By the way, to the brothers K - it's all right to curse as long as you're spelling it backwards? I'm just asking.
I'm really curious to see what happens versus Phoenix. They'll be coming off a back-to-back, so I think we've actually got a shot in this one. Can't hurt.
Posted by: Michael A | November 01, 2007 at 08:02 AM
Lakers not in the hurry. Kobe wants out - FINE. Let him play out 2 years on this contract and if he still wants let him walk away. Accepting substandard package which is basically any package without Deng not an option. We just can not become another Timberwolves after trading KG this summer. Don't get me wrong, I would definitely prefer Kobe to stay, but common people get real, if he wants not only to tell what is his destination should be but also, who should or should not be included in the trade it's getting to the point who is going to blink first and in this case FO should remain firm and refuse any substandard package from any team. Don't we had enough accepting $15M per year Grant's salary in Shaq's trade?
Posted by: LAL_Fan | November 01, 2007 at 08:10 AM
Three way deal invoving Suns:
Bulls get Kobe.
Lakers get Marion.
Suns get Thabo Sefolosha and other considerations.
Posted by: MJCMAN32 | November 01, 2007 at 08:19 AM
Its quite simple...Kobe waive your "no-trade" clause....if you do you can be outta here by weeks end. Dr. Buss if Mr. Bryant won't waive hos no-trade clause let it be known to him and all of us that he won't be trading him !
Posted by: LALAKERLOVER | November 01, 2007 at 08:19 AM
It's obnoxious how Kobe keeps on saying that everything is up to management, if indeed he's vetoing a trade involving Deng...
Posted by: jukt | November 01, 2007 at 08:19 AM
Reading post from certain bloggers reminds me of this story about a professor and a Zen Master:
A university professor went to visit a famous Zen master. While the master quietly served tea, the professor talked about Zen. The master poured the visitor's cup to the brim, and then kept pouring. The professor watched the overflowing cup until he could no longer restrain himself. "It's overfull! No more will go in!" the professor blurted. "You are like this cup," the master replied, "How can I show you Zen unless you first empty your cup."
Some may be passionate and have some knowledge of the game of basketball and are convinced so strongly that their perception is correct and true. However, there are different philosophies on how to play the game and what facet of the game is important. An opinion that differs from yours is not necessarily right or wrong - it is just different. Name calling and insulting other bloggers brings the blog down in my opinon.
One thing I think the K Bros do well in my opinion is lay out their opinions and then provide support as to why they think that way. Then when someone disagrees in a disagreeable fashion, they are respectful in their replies. I wish more bloggers would take that approach - rather than take the I am a know-it-all and you are a know-nothing, idiot approach.
Eagleboy
Posted by: Eagleboy | November 01, 2007 at 08:20 AM
Mamba: "THIS IS IT FOLKS THE FINAL TIME..."
Boy, sit your @$$ down! You ain't going nowhere!
Posted by: utzworld - THE BANNER HOLDER | November 01, 2007 at 08:22 AM
LAL Fan,
I think you might be right. All the trade Kobe for this or that can't get done unless Kobe says OK. The reality is that this situation - regardless of whom you wish to blame is a real mess. There doesn't appear to be a good way for the Lakers or Kobe to come out with what they want. There are too many cooks involved in this soup. You have to find salaries that are close enough to make the deal work, you have to find some talent that works for the Lakers, then you have to find one or more teams to make a deal happen. There is plenty of blame to pass around, from Dr. Buss, Kobe AND Shaq, Phil - the whole lot of them. If you can't trade him let him play it out, hope for or sign and trade, but taking on bad contracts like Ben Wallace, is only going to hamper the ability of the Lakers to add the talent needed to get back to doing what they do - WIN CHAMPIONSHIPS. In my humble opinion the sooner Kobe is gone the sooner they can get back to getting in contention for a title. (Just think - 8 months ago that Boston still looked like a crummy lottery team at best - now they have the talent to maybe contend. I know I know, the naysayer’s will say the Laker FO would never do that. But who honestly thought Danny Ainge could work that kind of magic? Come on be honest you know you didn't neither did I!)
Eagleboy
Posted by: Eagleboy | November 01, 2007 at 08:32 AM
Let's look at the start to this season.
Our owner is serving a 2 game suspension for dui.
Odom is still injured and then gets into a car accident.
Mihm is not 100 percent.
The Kobe situation has spun out of control.
Vlad has the sniffles and a sore throat.
Phil has not signed an extension.
Are we at the bottom yet? This is a great franchise and will bounce back. It will take some time and patience. But man, there is some bad karma in Lakerland.
Posted by: MJCMAN32 | November 01, 2007 at 08:33 AM
How 'bout my boy Gil's opening night? VERY KOBE-ESQUE.
34 pts, 10-25 shooting, makes a spectacular buzzer beating trey to send it to OT, then proceed to lose to the helpless, JO-LESS Pacers.
Wizards, BTW were full strength, playing with all 3 of their ALL-STAR PLAYERS.
Posted by: HAB | November 01, 2007 at 08:36 AM
We need to get better and get this trade talk over once and for all!!!
What about a deal for JO and Troy Murphy. Indiana wanted to include Troy's contract and screw the lakers this summer and the lakers said no. At this point they need to eat it, and take Murphy. I think they can do it without including Bynum (their project, the asset they are pinning all their hopes on). Here's the link:
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=981~3197~617~2789~1013~615&teams=11~11~11~11~13~13&te=&cash=
We trade Kwame's expiring contract, LO, J Critt, and Turiaf for O'Neal and Murphy.
I think its fair. They get some real quality young talent with small contracts, they get Kwame's $9M off the books, and they get LO, who thrived in the eastern conference. We get Oneal and a servicable big with a huge contract in Murph.
What do ya think?
Posted by: BSulli | November 01, 2007 at 08:37 AM
Thanks, Tha Show
Just when you thought the wacky meter has reached the top, it goes higher.
It's hard to believe that FO is that nutless. I have to assume there is a motive in play here that we don't know about.
Hopefully!
Posted by: HAB | November 01, 2007 at 08:44 AM
"Also, what is the deal with fan "booing" for the best player on the planet? Where's the grattitude for Kobe's greatness?"
Oh, please .... spare us.
Posted by: luigi999 | November 01, 2007 at 08:46 AM
As I posted yesterday, Kobe thinks Deng is his Scottie Pippin and that's why Pelinka passed on the deal. Magic summed it up beautifully. Both sides of this equation add up to dysfunction.
MAGIC: a very biref summary
Years ago, he went into Buss' office and asked to be traded. He had just won a championship running the team himself. Westhead decided Magic should look over to him for the play every time down. Magic tried for a few games, went in to BUss and said don't fire Paul, trade me. Jerry fired Paul and told West to coach the team. Pat Riley stopped by the Logos office to find out what was going on and West stunned everybody by giving the job to Riley. Riley gave the ball to Magic and said, do what you do. That's how a dynasty was born. It ain't rocket science. You let the great ones do what they do.
Posted by: Vman | November 01, 2007 at 08:51 AM
Eagleboy -
You are absolutely right with your zen koan...
I appreciate your post!
I will eat humble pie.
Again, I apologize for carrying on with Mike T about the pick n roll thing!
Posted by: MJCMAN32 | November 01, 2007 at 08:52 AM
Mamba-
Where you headed?
Posted by: MJCMAN32 | November 01, 2007 at 08:53 AM
I haven't posted in a while due to all the negativity, but i'm with Magic. Trade him or declare you're not.
As a Chicago resident, I don't see Kobe plus whatever trash is leftover competing for a ring. Remember, Kobe is not asking to be traded to get back to the finals, he's trying to win. Even if they did beat the Detroits and Bostons of the world, I can't see them beating the Suns, Spurs, or Mavs with what is left.
I say keep him, BUT play Bynum. The problem I have with keeping Bynum over JO, JKidd, or KG is that he's not even starting! Demand that Phil play and start him so that he can get into some type of rythmn on the court. Bynum at this point is too passive to be a major star in this league, and we need to win now.
So yes, Kobe in Chicago would give me a chance to see the best player in the league more frequently (Lord knows the League pass west coast games keep me up way pat 1am), but I don't think this will be the answer for either team.
My proposed trade. Trade a gimpy JO for a gimpy LO, start Bynum, and let's try and compete with that lineup.
Chitown
PS: Since Smush is gone, I change my annual Smush is garbage posts to
Kwame is Garbage
Posted by: Chi-Town Laker | November 01, 2007 at 08:58 AM
Kobe is beginning to see the position he is in; any trade that approaches fair value will gut the team he is going to, and thus he won't be able to compete for a title there. If he goes to a crappy team for draft picks, he will make it good enough that the draft picks will not be very high, and thus that team will not compete.
This is why, last season, the Lakers should have shut down Lamar and Kwame when they got hurt. The team knew that the absolute farthest it would go would have been the second round. Have them have their surgeries at that point. They would have been 1-2 months further along in their recovery by now. The team would have missed the playoffs, but gotten higher draft picks. (ANd with the lottery, maybe gotten real lucky.) So at this point you would have a (presumably) completely healthy Kwame and Lamar, a rookie who would be able to contribute more plus has a higher ceiling, and young players who got more experience last season and thus were further along in their development now. Another mistake by management, trying the highly successful "win now and rebuild at the same time" strategy.
Posted by: exhelodrvr | November 01, 2007 at 09:03 AM