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Know thy enemy: The Western Conference, Part I

How do you know the Laker season is underway?  Besides watching last night's home opener, the barrage of KCAL ads and your general ability to read a calendar, since the games start on more or less the same date each year? 

Because we're busting out the ol' "Know thy enemy," that's why!

It's time to analyze, deconstruct and generally pick apart the Western Conference that houses Laker enemies.  All 14 teams.  All angles and aspects explored.  I've divvied up the contenders (and pretenders) into four categories, two of which will be posted ri ... gh ... t ...



Minnesota Timberwolves
Give Kevin McHale credit.  He provided KG precious little help during his 12 seasons in Minneapolis, but the dude don't eff around when it comes to erasing remnants of the failed Big Ticket era.  And good call, by the way.  If you really want to rebuild, don't try to make the transition somewhat palatable.  Blow it the (bleep) up in the hopes of eventually becoming good by stockpiling young talent and cap space during those 3-5 years of being bad.  And make no mistake, this squad will be, as Homer Simpson once said, "crap on a crud."  Al Jefferson, Randy Foye (who'll be out a while), Craig Smith, Gerald Green and Corey Brewer could develop into one hell of a core.  But for now, expect the kids to experience mucho growing pains while being baby sat ... er, mentored, by Theo Ratliff and Mark Madsen.  And if McHale really wants to keep this inaugural rebuild atmosphere from turning poisonous, I'd advise making copies of Troy Hudson's and Juwan Howard's buyout papers for Antoine Walker.

Seattle Supersonics
Another team that could be good in a few years, but for now, yikes!  At least they've got one hell of a prospect in Kevin Durant to create entertaining losses.  To say this kid (who Kobe recently described as the longest player he's ever seen) can score from anywhere on the floor would be a comical understatement.  He also appears to have his head screwed on straight, which is fortunate, since the road to super-stardom will be filled with a lot of bumps in the immediate future.  Considering the Sonics are comprised of "one starter who can play but isn't a go-to guy" (Chris Wilcox), "starters who would come off the bench for almost any team other than Seattle" (Nick Collison, Damien Wilkins, Luke Ridnour), "solid role players who'll help but would likely rather be elsewhere" (Kurt Thomas, Wally Szczerbiak, Earl Watson), "youth movement dudes" (Jeff Green, Delonte West) and "the freakiest-looking kid I've ever seen in my life (Robert Swift)," Durant has already found himself in LeBron's company before even playing an official game.  He stepped into the NBA as his team's best player.

Portland Trailblazers
Greg Oden's out.  Reigning ROY Brandon Roy is battling injury.  Blazer fans are bummed.  And I'm totally suspicious.  Personally, I don't think either guy is hurt.  I think Kevin Pritchard looked at the roster and realized that despite this team's wonderful future, they're still too young to make much noise even at full strength.  So why not toss another season into the toilet, try to snag another freak-luck No. 1 pick, add O.J. Mayo to the Oden-Roy-LaMarcus Aldridge foundation and set this franchise for life?  For that result, I'd be willing to roll the dice and endure a crappy year with Joel Przybilla racking two points a game at center.  And no, that number was not a typo.  Remember, you heard this conspiracy theory here first.

Sacramento Kings
For what it's worth, there's definitely a team in the Pacific with more ill-matched or unimpressive parts than the Lakers.  You just don't hear about them, since nobody cares about the Kings anymore.  Save Nicole Richie-thin Kevin Martin, this rotation's core leaves mucho to be desired.  A star duo (Ron Artest and the thumb-addled Mike Bibby) that reportedly doesn't get along and has been on and off the block since about 1978, a small forward trapped in a center's body (Brad Miller), two power forwards (Shareef Abdur-Rahim, Kenny Thomas) who could lose their starting gig to a cat barely topping 220 pounds (Mikki Moore), and John Salmons, last season's mid-level-compensated addition whose name won't ring a bell for 9 out of 10 people reading this.  Hey, what's not to love, besides their terrible D and new coach Reggie Theus' rules, like no cellies on the bus and roadie curfews?  The perfect spirit-lifter during a sub-.500 season.   

Memphis Grizzlies
I'll be watching this rather lousy team for three reasons and three reasons only. 

1) I find the career path of Darko Milicic bizarrely fascinating (as well as his thoughts on FIBA refereeing). 

2) I'm just curious to see if Darko's presence motivates Stromile Swift, since Milicic snagging his minutes would soldify Swift as the worst No. 2 pick of the last 10 years.  Or vice versa, if Swift holds him off.  A historic "Battle to Suck Less" is in the works, people! 

3) After bringing in Pau Gasol's best buddy Juan Carlos Navarro specifically to appease the disgruntled star, I'm curious to see who G.M. Chris Wallace will swap out to add Jose Calderon, Jorge Garbajosa and Sergio Rodriguez and surround Pau with all his boys.  Will they put together a $100,000,000 package to lure Fran Vasquez out of hiding?  Whatever it takes to make Gasol "gruntled," a transformation that won't likely happen, since I'm pegging these guys for about 35 wins.

Los Angeles Clippers
Best-case scenario to stay afloat until Elton Brand and Shaun Livingston hopefully return in February: Corey Maggette becomes an efficient scoring machine, prompting Mike Dunleavy to wonder what the two ever fought about.  Chris Kaman proves that last season was a hiccup in an otherwise steadily improving career.  Rookie Al Thornton builds on a monster preseason.  Tim Thomas actually steps up for a team that needs him to become tougher and motivated.  Cuttino Mobley remains steady.  Ruben Patterson's bulldog attitude permeates throughout the squad.  Brevin Knight and Sam Cassell remain healthy enough to patch together a season's worth of quality point-guard play and leadership.

Worst-case scenario to stay afloat until Elton Brand and Shaun Livingston hopefully return in February: Corey Maggette becomes an inefficient shooting machine, prompting he and Mike Dunleavy to come to blows in a liquor store parking lot.  Chris Kaman continues looking easily distracted, just with shorter hair.  Al Thornton hits the rookie wall in January.  Tim Thomas remembers he gets the exact same paycheck no matter how he plays, which makes hitting cruise control a no-brainer.  Cuttino Mobley's biggest 2008 accomplishments revolve around his wardrobe (dude can dress).   Ruben Patterson's bulldog attitude gets him suspended twice by the team for "conduct detrimental."  Brevin Knight misses his usual assortment of games while Cassell nurses even more injuries, eventually getting dealt at the deadline to a contender that he guides to a title playing 18 mpg. 

I'm not sure either scenario will shake out exactly as described, but call me crazy: I'm picturing an outcome closer to the second than the first.   


New Orleans Hornets
Do yourself a favor.  If you're vacationing in the Big Easy and talking hoops with a local, don't bust out a sob story about the Laker injury woes, because you're likely to find a little spit in your gumbo.  Say what you want about the purple and gold's crummy health, but the Hornet starters missed a combined 133 games, 69 alone by Peja Stojakovic.  But even with that staggering number of contests featuring Hornets in suits, they still managed to make a serious playoff push.  If they can stay out of the trainer's room, this is a team equipped to, at the very least, nudge the Lakers further down the Western Conference ladder.  David West is the NBA's best "almost 20/10 player that nobody knows who the hell he is."  Tyson Chandler is beating Kwame Brown and Eddy Curry in the quest to be the 2001 high school draft class kid that almost lives up to the hype (as a defensive specialist/rebounding machine who alters roughly a zillion shots per game).  And with all respect to Deron Williams, Chris Paul still has my vote for league's most promising young PG.  Add Peja's triples, Bobby Jackson's ability (when healthy) to score in bunches, Mo Peterson's shooting and defense, plus solid role players like Rasual Butler, Ryan Bowen and Jannero Pargo, that's a team that can provide fits around the league.  Or at least beat the Lakers, whichever comes first. 

Golden State Warriors
Call me cynical, but I don't see Golden State improving much on last season's surprise success down the stretch.  Maybe it's because I think Baron Davis can't stay healthy enough.  Maybe it's because I think they don't have enough front-court scoring.  Maybe it's because I think they don't have enough D, whether front, back or middle court (if such a term even exists).  Maybe it's because any team with Stephen Jackson as a tri-captain seems pretty much destined to go off the rails like a ... wait for it ... crazy train.  But until the Warriors actually fall back into the mediocrity I'm predicting, they finished 2007 with the same record as the Lakers, so they deserve my treatment as more or less equals.

Incidentally, does everyone agree that last season wasn't a question of Dirk Nowitzki simply crumbling in the playoffs but literally being scared of the Warriors?   As in, "I'm frightened of these guys and I want my mommy!" Granted, between Davis, Jax, Al Harrington's mohawk and Matt Barnes running around like a tatted-out meth fiend from Fresno, the Warriors put out a decidedly edgy vibe.  But at the same time, the dude is 7' 0" and freakin' German!  Shouldn't that make him sort of tough?  I don't like tossing around the "soft" label, because I think it's often a cliche.  But I've been questioning Dirk way before the Mavs got bounced.  I was actually pretty relieved to hear Mark Cuban say that Dirk was off the table in a theoretical Kobe swap.  I'll take Josh Howard over Nowitzki any day of the week.

Part II to follow soon.

-- AK

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MJCMAN32 - Van Gudy was saying the lineup last night without Odom was not very good and certainly not one in the upper echelon of the league.

I dont know what booster boy is waiting for lets see what this kids Crit and Bynum can do with extended minutes.

March 07, 2007
March Madness
This month's phone message goes something like this:

"(Basketball by Kurtis Blow playing in the background)...You've reached the Smith's, press one to bypass the message, because around here March means, MARCH MADNESS, BABY!. Leave a message and we'll call you between games."

The message ends (if the caller didn't hang up or press one) with me rappin' w/Mr. Blow:

Basketball is my favorite sport
I like the way they dribble up and down the court
Just like I'm the queen on the telephone, so is Dr. J and Moses Malone

I like slam dunks that take me to the hoop
My favorite play if the alley oop
I like the pic n roll, I like the give n go
It's basketball with Mr. Kurtis Blow


I guess it's a street thing. That ol' pic 'n roll....


Street Cred verses book knowledge.



Brian Cook could shoot a quarter into a shot glass at 30 feet. It would be flat as heck, but it would go in. I don't know why you guys rip on him so much.

Believe it or not, that kind of one-dimensional skill gets you paid. If you look at most teams rosters, you'll find a B.Cook type player, that's why only a few guys are "superstars" and the majority of the league are role-players... - they have a role to play (in Cook's case, big-guy shooter) and that's what they're paid for. I'm fine with Cook on this roster, you need shooters on a team, and his contract is the perfect size for trade-thow ins, but as BK said, it's when Cook gets a longer burn that you know something's wrong and the team suffers because he's not really capapable of contributing in other areas of the game very well. But that's the case with most role players, it's the coaches job to work the matchups so that your role players inadequacies aren't exposed as much as the other team's.


Its PICK and Roll!
There is no such word as pic! The 'n is short for and...

Did you even read the article, it says nothing about pick and roll.

Somebody else help me out here!

And for the record, thosed lyrics were bitten off of the original Kutis Blow
song Basketball:

They're playing Basketball,
We love that Basketball,
They're playing Basketball,
We love that Basketball

(Now rapping Basketball, Number 1, Kurtis Blow)
Basketball is my favorite sport,
I like the way they dribble up and down the court,
Just like I'm the King on the microphone, so is Dr. J and Moses Malone,
I like Slam-dunks, take me to the hoop,
My favorite play is the alley-oop,
I like the pick-and-roll, I like the give-and-go,
Cause it's Basketball, uh, Mister Kurtis Blow,

Once again Mike, your arguments hold no water... I can cite thosands of referrences to the correct term if you would like:.You can google it yourself, I did and found 5,740,000...And THATS A FACT!!!

The rumor Kobe for Wallace and Artest is untruth, Lakers are very stupid to have Wallace and Artest, I saw Artest in the playoff, he is just a role player. Mitch Kupchak signed Luke Walton right away, because he wanted to show to us, he is a genius to draft Brian Cook and Luke. On Monday, Jerry West talked on radio AM570, he said Lakers has to pay Kobe 70% of his salary on the opening night of NBA, and Kobe is the only NBA player with no trade clause in his contract.


Now if you'll excuse me I have to go pic out my clothes to wear to work tomorrow.

Wait, my phone is ringing, should I pic it up?

Good night Mike, we can pic this up tomorrow after you do your research!

You never answered me about Kwame at the 4 and Bynum at the 5...
What say you?

Just watched the game again. Fish was the only player that had a good game.

Great teamwork by Kwame and Luke on the Houston basket. I am sure I will never see that again.

It is so clear after watching the game why there is no team work or chemistry or ball movement or this so called Triangle. How can you run the triangle w/Kobe?
Every single time the ball was passed to him it was like a black hole, one on one, force it, doesnt matter, dribble for 10 seconds than drive or pull up. So ugly!!
No wonder the team is in a funk when he is in the lineup. I would rather watch the kids play Team ball then Kobe one on one all game. That was to many shots by kobe last night I don't care if the other players missed the shot, you have to involve them to be a TEAM!!!

At least Kobe is working with the Lakers on who we get and who we don't get when he is traded. I am sure Kobe will make sure the Lakers get a good deal even thou he already veto'd the trade of Deng to the Lakers.


Fellow Bloggers,

I apologize for having that childish argument with Mike T...
I now know what the K Bros feel like when they argue with him...LOL

Mike T knows what he talking about. Last year for 2 months during the possible KIDD trade he stated that once the Nets demanded Kwame to make the trade, the Lakers veto'd the trade.


iIt's time of the year to see our young tots in their costume aa scary they can be. My son and grannies came too, he was wearing a kobe jersey that's how bias he is with sad clown make up crying.....ihe called himself the disgruntled Laker fan with words Kobe on left fist near the thumb and on the right the word Jim Buss then he rubs them in asking trick or treat, my granddaughter is a little bruin cheerleader guess also a loser. haha


do you even watch the game or do you just type?

I think the Suns game will be more of a barometer as to where this team is, and whether or not Kobe will stay.

Amazing, Kobe did not play well with Lamar and now he wants Deng, it's OK, i take Hindrich and Gordon, of course Gordon and Kobe can't be on the floor at the same time for sure. The rumor on AM 570, the deal with Chicago was off because of Kobe on last Friday, maybe this is reason, Phil and Magic were upset. When Lakers played against Detroit in Final, one play, KObe had the ball, he did not run and dunk the ball, he walked and stand around 3 point line, Linsey Hunter ran up and defended Kobe, why? You have the answer.


I don't understand what you are saying.....please explain

Mike T knows what he talking about. Last year for 2 months during the possible KIDD trade he stated that once the Nets demanded Kwame to make the trade, the Lakers veto'd the trade.

Posted by: BD | October 31, 2007 at 07:47 PM

any two year old would have told that would have been the case...who gives up both their centers for a PG? we would have no one in the middle? the FO is crap but they ain't that crappy.


I guess we, all laker fans are going through a phase just like what Mark Heisler said in his article. We are all torn on this laker Soap Opera. We just hate a part of Kobe and a part of the Buss Family and a part of F/O. This is what I termed factionalism, it happens to big corporations, it happens in Presidential election that husband and wife, mother and son quarrel on their idea of a leader. In our case, we all have "jaundice eyes" on things that we abhor against a selfish player or against a ruthless manager. Some of our traditional posters here and we know their names they were not anti-kobe or anti-Jerry Buss before but this year, it was just a nightmare and they want to just go over it. While those who favor Kobe, they cannot stand the remaining Lakers and wondering why is the best player being blamed for the inadequacies of the remaining group who could not convert shots, who could not grab rebounds and make follow upa, who could not defend. They are also in a precarious balance that if management threw out Kobe, then they abandon the Lakers. The latter is the current sentiments of the many on the streets who are not blogging here. They are agreeable in trading Kobe but surely they will no longer patronize the Lakers. I guess Jerry Buss is weighing his options whether his word or the sacrifice of the losses. I wonder how Mitch Kupchak feels? Can he face squarely his family, relatives and friends and tell them that he has done a great job?

pic' 'N roll...You make some type of argument because I leave out an apostrophe?

"There is no such word as pic! The 'n is short for and...

Well, gee smartass you think I didn't know that? Or did you think I spell and with an N? What do you think the apostrophe is for? Pic' 'N Roll.....That's the term or slang for your book knowledge. No wonder the Knicks suck.


How incredibly ignorant can a guy be? It's SLANG! Pic' 'N roll...or pic-n-roll...whatever it's not book knowledge just like Bynum can't guard the paint genius.


This guy is so arrogant that he thinks he teaching me to spell the word "and." The arrogance is amazing.


"Don't be afraid in taking risks with these guys"

Take a risk with who, though? Remember, this is someone that no one else in the league wanted, because all you have to offer is the vet's minimum. There is no way that anyone who meets that criteria is better than Mihm or Walton. Possibly there is someone who currently is very raw, that could eventually be better than them. That means that they need playing time. So you want someone like that getting 20-30 minutes a game right now? Again, remember that this would be someone that no one else in the league wanted.


Yuu wrote this: To start with there is no evidence that management are not trying to win now.They have just been restricted in what they can do and done a bad job

I disagree. The evidence reads as follows: Failure to acquire Boozer, Baron Davis or
J-Kidd. Failure pay Phil Jackson 10 million when he first asked for it. Failure to keep
Dereck Fisher. While tossing Bynum into the pot would not have made us champions,
the upgrade at pg might have been enough for us to make it pass the first round. It would
have been an upgrade on defense, passing, shooting and floor spacing. This year we'd
have a long shot at getting to the finals. I think Jason Kidd is that good and alters the
chemistry that much. Imagining J-Kidd, Kobe & Turiaf on the floor at the same time.

mmmmm Tasty!

"The Lakers didn't need to spend the whole 6 million on a PF."

WRONG AGAIN! The Lakers already spent 9 MIL for KWAME at PF and he can't protect the rim.

"While I agree Picks and doing little things win games"

Here's a guy who finally acknowleges that pic's and the little thing is what win games. Unit I put all that out there in the other thread he didn't mention it at all. And this guy says he been teaching for years.

Barely today he says:

"OK , OK if I give Kwame some slack, is he better suited to play the four?"

Here's a teacher of the game and it's barely today that you acknowledge that Kwame is the one who is doing the little things that get us wins?

Here's a teacher of the game and he watches the Lakers' game and has the nerve to preach Bynum who is weak on the pic's and defense.

And now he want to nit pick about the lack of an apostrophe?

You better take a closer look at Andrew Bynum's pic's and defense before you post your "expert" basketball knowledge and quit worrining about the lack of apostrophes.


Clearly you haven't been watching Bynum. And if Kwame is the starting center what does that say about Bynum? Can't figure that one out can you genius?


Let me break it down for Mr. Expert.

For every point Bynum scores he give up 1.5 in return. If Bynum scores 12 points you can bet the Lakers are giving up 15-18 while he's in there.

Kwame may not score much but the Lakers more often than not are leading when he's in there.

Now explain that Mr. Expert. Expert my ass!

You nonbasketball understanding pretender.


I know Salt Lake City is a small market and not the most desireable place to play, but I wonder why Utah isn't in Kobe trade discussions. They can give up Kirilenko, who clashes with Sloan, along with some decent players like Giricek (1 year left on K) and Ronnie Brewer (2 years left on K); a package that doesn't seem too bad for the Lakers. If Kobe truly wants to play for a championship, this would be the team: he would have a great coach in Sloan and join a core, playoff-tested group of Boozer, Williams and Okur, giving the Jazz four potential All-Stars. Thoughts?


You ignorant (fill in the blank)

"You never answered me about Kwame at the 4 and Bynum at the 5..."

I usually don't answer question I've already addressed.

THREAD: Last chance to make a first impression? Or to get ready to make a first impression? Something like that.

Lakersville, USA…
By Michael C. Teniente

The James Worthy Philosphy:

Big Game James, on the last telecast of LTV, was discussing the center position for the Lakers. He was discussing who should be the starter. Was it Brown, Bynum, or Mihm? James said it should be Bynum. He said that Bynum has been here long enough and has enough of Kareem Abdul-Jabbar’s teaching in him to be a beast or something like that.

He also mentioned that he thought Kwame Brown should be playing at the 4 spot. He said Kwame would dominate the smaller guys at the 4 spot. He might be right. But before that can happen a few things would have to be addressed before, I think, Kwame would feel comfortable with that move. I give my list of reasons why it’s a good idea.

1. My first reason is because I’ve been watching Kwame Brown since he arrived in Los Angeles. And I can tell you this without a doubt and full conviction. Everything Kwame Brown does with his body, on the court, has power forward written all over it. The way he moves, that is. The only thing that he doesn’t do, that has power forward written all over it, is when he receives an entry pass and he tries to play with his back to the basket. That is where he’s trying to be a natural center and it doesn’t always look to pretty. But why should it look pretty? He’s not a natural center.

The scouting report on Kwame, coming into the league, was that he had no post-up game. The scouting report also mentions that his game was more like Danny Manning. What that means is the guy can dribble and shoot. Since those days Kwame has put on a lot of muscle. That muscle takes away from the full effect of a Danny Manning type game.

So as a power forward, for the Lakers, the question has to be this: What are we expecting from Kwame at that position? What type of game do we expect to see? Well, if we’re going to see anything from Kwame at that position, in my opinion, the Lakers have to take the handcuffs off of Kwame. That’s the only way Kwame would work at the 4 spot for the Lakers.

What does that mean? Kwame has to be allowed and even encouraged to take the 12-15 footer for it work out at the 4 spot. Why is that you ask? It’s because one of Kwame’s strengths is his foot-speed. But that foot-speed isn’t being utilized by having Kwame playing the 5 spot. It’s not being utilized because there’s not enough separation between Kwame, the guy guarding him, and the basket. In other words: He can’t beat his man to the basket because there’s not enough room to the basket, down low, to take advantage of his foot-speed. Yet, how many times have we observed Kwame make all kinds of moves trying to create with his feet? And how many times has it looked…well…not pretty? He’s too close to the basket for all that. Being so close to the basket cancels out his foot-speed. And that’s one of his strengths.

For Kwame to take advantage of his foot-speed he has to be able to hit a couple of 12-15 footers in the game. That’s not going to happen if the Lakers, PJ, won’t take the handcuffs off. And I don’t mean for a couple of games. Kwame has to feel like the Lakers are going to ride him at the 4 spot no matter what. My feeling is that Kwame doesn’t want to mess up because he might get pulled from the game. So he doesn’t try to do things that are described on his scouting report when he came into the league.

It’s very important for Kwame to be able to hit the 12-15 footer because that would mean that his man would have to play him closer. Once his man plays him close, it’s then that Kwame will be able to take advantage of his foot-speed. Kwame would have the 12-15 feet from the basket to blow past his man. In other words there would be enough separation between Kwame, his man, and the basket for Kwame to use his foot-speed. Again, that’s not going to happen if PJ won’t take the handcuffs off of Kwame. Kwame has to be encouraged to shoot the ball without worry that he’ll be pulled from the game.

It’s not that Kwame can’t hit the shot. It’s that he fears that he’ll get pulled if he “messes up.” Take the threat of pulling him from the game and I think it’ll work. If my theory is right, Kwame Brown is going to have a lot of open shots. Not only that but Bynum would be playing center and Kwame would have the backdoor to play with all game long. We’re talking alley-oops for sure. You know how long Bynum’s arms are. All he would have to do is hold the ball over his head and pass it to Kwame if Kwame dives to the basket from the weak-side.

Not only that Kwame would be able to read the defenses further away from the basket when he doesn’t have the ball in his hands and crash for offensive rebounds.

2. The advantage of having Kwame play the 4 spot would work on the defensive side of the game, too. Here’s my reason for thinking it would. Kwame has been playing the high pic-and-roll by showing. It works pretty well for him and the Lakers. But I have my concerns that the day will come when a good guard will exploit that and break the Lakers defense down. But if Bynum were playing center Kwame could be more aggressive on the defensive end of the game away from the basket because Bynum is tall enough to discourage the shooter that get passed Kwame on the perimeter. With Kwame’s foot-speed he could create havoc all over the court on defense with Bynum in the background protecting the rim. And at the same time we won’t have to worry about Bynum’s foot-speed on the defensive end because Kwame would be doing a lot of the perimeter stuff. Kwame could play the strong-side of the defense and Bynum could play the weak-side. That’s almost a no lose proposition right there.

3. If all this fails it’s Bynum who would have to be pulled from the game and Kwame moved back to center because without Kwame, in the game, the Lakers defense just falls apart.

I think PJ would have to sell Kwame on this. Kwame is in a contract year and if PJ decides to put Kwame at the 4 spot and it doesn’t work, and then PJ pulls Kwame from the game, why would Kwame want to do that? If Kwame insists on playing the 5 spot the Lakers don’t really have a choice but to play him there because Bynum and Mihm just won’t get the job done. I think PJ know that already. He knows Bynum and Mihm can’t get the job done on the defensive end or else one of them would be the starting center.

The only way PJ can sell Kwame on this is to assure him that if it doesn’t work out he’ll move him back to the 5 spot. And I think PJ, Kobe, if he’s still around, Odom, and Fisher have to order Kwame to take that 12-15 footer. Kwame has to feel that he isn’t going to get punished for missing a shot or two. Sooner or later the guy is going to hit a few and then the game will open up for Kwame from 12-15 feet from the basket. Kwame would then return to his roots. Kwame is a natural face to the basket, using his foot-speed, type player. But the guy has been ripped so much he’s shelled shocked about that part of his game. His teammates and his coach need to pump him up to do it.

If these condition are met…I want Kwame at the 4 spot.

PJ has to create a no fail situation for Kwame at the 4 spot for it to work. If it doesn't work he's back at the starting 5 spot. I mean with Bynum's and Mihm's inability to protect the rim, reliably, over a 82 game season and in the playoffs...I think it would be the smart thing to do. Create a no fail situation for Kwame at the 4 spot.


Posted by: Michael Teniente | October 27, 2007 at 06:11 PM

I based that last post on this: The guy can shot the ball and score.

The Next Big Thing
by Chris Palmer
ESPN The Magazine

Kwame Brown likes to block shots from the weak side. Seems like this piece of info was kept from at least one baller at last summer's ABCD adidas camp. A high-profile guard -- whose name will be withheld to protect future earnings -- beat his man and flashed in the lane for an uncontested finger roll. Then Brown took one giant step and most definitely contested it, swatting the lay-in off the board from behind.

Wait, there's more. Brown pulled in the carom and fired the outlet to his point guard. He then beat him -- and everyone else -- down the floor, got the ball back and nearly scraped his forehead on the rim as he threw it down. "He's as fast as most guards on the break," says hoops guru Sonny Vaccaro.

Brown goes 6'11", 240. Combine that with his speed, and you see why he's about to be the next big thing in pro hoops. But wait, there's still more. Strength: Brown benches 340 pounds. Stats: 20.1 ppg, 13.3 rpg, 5.8 bpg and 3.5 apg in his senior year at Glynn Academy in Brunswick, Ga. Skills: soft hands, quick feet, an accurate shot out to 20 that makes KB-KG comparisons inevitable.

This guy was a scoring machine and now you're saying he can't shoot? Give me a break! They want him to play Power Forward...give him his game back. In other words take the handcuffs off!



In a curious note:

Neither Jermaine and Ron Artest played today.

Edwin, if you don't look at double-teaming the Suns, then you either get Nash penetrating all game long, or Amare dunking on everybody all day long. Or both. You can't cover the best offensive players in this league without a team concept, and the Suns have lots of guys who can score.


First, Kobe is obviously hurt. It was pretty brave to go out and try to run with must be a painful wrist. Kobe doesn't EVER miss 9 FT's in a game.

He had a horrible game, but he and Fish and Farmar seemed to almost pull it out anyway. Gutsy.

The first quarter shows that this team *can* be way above than average on D, and they just refuse to do so. I have NO idea why. Kobe can't get behind this group of guys anymore than we can. Looking realistically, does anyone here on this blog feel that the Lakers have a really good team? I mean, not based on potential. I mean based on what these guys produce.

DANG! Cook is a stiff! I would think his wounded pride would be enough to make him play better. What it looks like instead is that he caught that Smush Parker sulk-all-the-time disease.

This same group of guys could be really good. But, they are going to disappear for long stretches of games, and/or get injured and/or throw cakes at fans and stuff.

Just sad...


"Clearly you haven't been watching Bynum. And if Kwame is the starting center what does that say about Bynum? Can't figure that one out can you genius?"



Amazing. A truly masterful performance by the Artist, arguing that a slang term is actually English. I think anybody who argues against that must just be a hater, or "heater", I guess.

JD, if I was the FO, there's no way I'd make that deal without getting at least one of Boozer, Williams or Okur. Kirilenko wouldn't be enough.

Okay, so several other web sites reported that the three-way trade with Chicago and
Sacramento had Hinrich and Artest and something else coming to the Lakers. I like that
better than the "Wallace and Artest" version that was reported (especially if the
"something else" was Noah or Thomas). Maybe both versions were discussed and
rejected. I wonder who rejected them. Bulls? Kings? Lakers? Kobe? Whatever.

Now that Deng and Gordon have both turned down their 5-year 50 million dollar offers,
the situation has changed in this way:

1. It motivates Paxson to trade one or the other. If both Gordon and Deng are expecting
to get max contracts (or anywhere near it), that's around 30 million combined, which
would put the Bulls at about 82 million next season, which would be so far over the
luxury tax that they'd be paying over 90 million, and thus would effectively be paying
20 million EACH for Gordon and Deng. I can't see him doing that. If you're going to
have to pay someone 20 million, it might as well be Kobe, right? They could combine
either Gordon or Deng (probably Gordon) with either Hinrich or Wallace and maybe
another small contract or two, and then they could keep most of the core intact and
stay under or at least close to the luxury tax next season.

2. It's easier to make a deal with Deng or Gordon during the season, as their salaries
just count for what they are, no poison pill provisions to deal with. This makes
combining one of them with Nocioni or Hinrich possible, though Noc would have to
wait until Dec 15.

3. It makes a Kobe to the Bulls deal MUCH easier at the start of next summer. Salary
matching isn't an issue, as they'd be signing and trading either Deng or Gordon as
part of the package, so that would make up a big chunk of the salary matching.
They wouldn't need to include Hinrich or Wallace or even Nocioni to match salaries.
Or if they did, there could be a Laker player or two going back in the trade.

Kwame Brown will be out of work next year.

I realize that Kobe Bryant has the most difficult contract in NBA history from the standpoint of trying to send him somewhere in a trade, but this is just becoming ridiculous. How hard is it to put together a reasonable trade that makes everybody happy? Here is a couple of "simple" trades that would accomplish everything that the Lakers need.

Trade 1

Bulls receive Kobe Bryant and Kwame Brown
Wizards receive Ben Gordon, Ben Wallace, Brian Cook, PJ Brown and 2 future draft picks (1st & 2nd round).
Lakers receive Gilbert Arenas, Antawn Jamison, and Brendan Haywood

Why does it work?
Chicago: They would be able to keep Hinrich, Deng, Thomas, and Noah while adding in Kobe Bryant and Kwame Brown for defensive purposes or cap relief next season. Kobe would have some real talent around him in order to compete for the championship in the East.

Washington: Jamison will be a free agent next summer and Arenas can opt out of his contract next summer, making both free agents. At that point Washington would be stuck possibly not getting anything for either of them. In working this trade, they would be able to lock down Gordon to an extension...replacing Arenas. Ben Wallace would enter a lineup that will struggle with the absence of Etan Thomas. Wallace and Blatche would make a strong low post presence. Cook adds depth as a long range shooter. The team would still have Butler and Daniels among the others.

LA Lakers: The Lakers would in essence have a new face to the team. Arenas would instantly replace the star power and scoring power of Kobe Bryant. Jamison would enter as a versatile forward to play alongside Odom. Haywood would enter as a more experienced big man to play opposite Andrew Bynum. The Lakers starting lineup would become Fisher, Arenas, Odom, Jamison, Haywood. That is a much stronger lineup than they currently have and with Jamison in an expiring year, the Lakers would be able to negotiate an extension/new contract.

The second trade is actually with Chicago & Sacramento....

Kings receive Ben Gordon, and PJ Brown
Bulls receive Kobe Bryant, Brian Cook
Lakers receive Ron Artest, Thabo Sefolosha, Tyrus Thomas, and 2 future 1st round picks


Kings replace the bad contract and disruption of Artest with a guy that can enter and play point guard in the absence of Bibby and 2-guard when he returns. His contract would need to receive an extension. They would also get PJ Brown in a one year expiring contract.

Bulls would be able to acquire Kobe Bryant without losing Hinrich, Deng, or Wallace. They would also be adding in Brian Cook as another forward that can shoot long range and spread the floor. Adding Kobe to those three plus looking at the remaining roster should lift the Bulls ahead of last season.

Lakers would provide themselves players to fill the holes that currently exist. Artest could enter and play shooting guard. He provides the defensive presence they have been lacking on the perimeter. Thomas, enters as the new starting power forward with Turiaf becoming a reserve. That would be an explosive tandem at power forward. Sefolosha would become a solid reserve swingman for this team. The Lakers would then need to waive Karl or Vujacic to make room for these three players.


Trade 1: Fisher, Arenas, Odom, Jamison, Haywood
Trade 2: Fisher, Artest, Odom, Thomas, Brown

Trade 1 is definitely the more offensively strong scenario, while Trade 2 is definitely focused on the defensive end. It would then all depend on what direction the Lakers want to focus: Offense or Defesne. Either way, they will be a much better team if they work out one of these two trades.


Great cross-post. Looking at that, if a dude drops 12 dimes in one quarter, you cannot accuse him of not passing the ball. Especially you *shooting* guard. I don't remember Byron Scott passing that many times in a whole game when he was our shooting guard. When Scott got the ball, he shot it. With deadly accuracy, I might add.

Now, I know that Kobe is now the "facilitator". Looks like he's doing what his coach asked. It looks like only Farmar is also following suit. Only Farmar didn't pass the rock back to Kobe, which is what stagnates the offense. Too bad for Farmar that he didn't get the two assists he was supposed to because the dude who got the ball...wait for it...bricked the open shot.

If this keeps up, Farmar will be complaining that he isn't getting enough help, too.

Where have I heard that before?

At any rate, who would YOU pass to?

Yeah, I know. Fish.

It is what it is.


Maybe it's time for Jerry Buss to fold his trading cards. Media reports say the Bulls-Kings-Lakers 3-way trade is dead. The straight Bulls-Lakers trade talks aren't going anywhere. Hard to see how a Jermaine O'Neal trade that couldn't come off all summer has any shot. Maybe there's a Bulls-Pacers-Lakers trade, but no one has suggested such a thing.

Mavericks owner Mark Cuban says you can count out Dallas in the Kobe Bryant sweepstakes. During Wednesday night's game against the Cleveland Cavaliers, Cuban told ESPN that the team is not pursuing a trade for the Los Angeles Lakers star. "It's not going to happen. We've got a great squad. We like it."

I thought there would be a deal by now. I was wrong.

The Lakers seem screwed till Lamar gets healthy. The current uncertainty about Kobe is only making things worse.

Maybe it's time for Buss to sit down with Kobe, and tell him there's no deal out there right now that's doable, so let's just agree to peaceful co-existence, at least until closer to the trading deadline.

That gives the team 4-6 weeks of stability or at least a minimalization of distractions. It would be better for the Lakers. It would be better for Kobe. And it would send a clear message to any team that's serious about wanting Kobe: There's no fire sale, and low ball offers are a waste of time.

The thought on my part that Buss might see the wisdom of my suggestion is a stretch. Nothing that he or his front office have done until now indicate that common sense is a factor. He's probably laughing at David Stern's suspension and fine over a few bottles of expensive champagne, surrounded by women young enough to be his granddaughters.

Tonight, Kobe is being held hostage by his own contract. Both sides have painted themselves into this corner. A good contract is supposed to be a win-win. This one is a lose-lose. None of us fans signed this contract, but it makes a losers, too.


the lakers didnt pay kwame his salary. they inherited it from washington.

There's a Laker crisis going on, and the whole blog is arguing about how to spell pic(k)? LOL.

As the trade deadline approaches, and Bird starts getting desperate, we offer Kwame (expiring contract) and Bynum for Jermaine O'Neal.

We also offer Luke, Farmar, and two #1 picks for Artest.

Our lineup wil be:


This is a championship team. This team will trounce anybody in their path. If O'Neal and Lamar can stay healthy, a potential dynasty.
Get it done Jim.


Kobe played great D on T-Mac. Luke did not. Also, where were the rotations when Kobe was screened of T-Mac? Where were the other guys yelling out "screen" before Kobe got blind-sided? Where was the "show-and-recover"?

Carl played decent D on T-Mac by recovering after T-Mac absolutely broke him down. Good for him.

Can we transplant his heart into [insert Lakers stiff here] and get a really good player?


Well...if the INEVITABLE is INEVITABLY going to happen...

I say Gordon/Hinrich/Noah/Some Dude for Kobe/Kwame/Sasha. A Gordon/Hinrich/Odom trifecta alone should carry us into the deeper part of the first round.

Then again, it don't mean a thing. Gordon or Hinrich will INEVITABLY diss Jim Buss and they'll be outta here by next training camp.


Or...keep THE REAL CANCER and make Magic GM anyway. At least Magic will have the b@lls to stand up to Jimbo the next time he sees untested, poor ranked draft picks and starts having delusions of grandeur!


>>>any two year old would have told that would have been the case...who gives up
>>>both their centers for a PG?

I'd give up Kwame and Bynum for Jason Kidd, Steve Nash, Gilbert Arenas, Chris Paul,
Deron Williams, or Chauncey Billups. Maybe Kirk Hinrich, but I'd have to think about it.

Then I'd bring in Marc Gasol, pick up some stiff free agent like Jelani McCoy and go out
and win the Western Conference.

Meanwhile, Bynum would do his growing up somewhere else and Kwame would show
how mighty he was by holding Marc Gasol under 10 points when he faced the Lakers.

Michael Teniente,

The ONLY way your comparison between Bynum and Brown would hold water is if the other 4 players are the same for both periods when they are on the floor. Otherwise, it can not be proven that simply looking at the scoring disparity with Brown or Bynum in the game is a sign that the one is a better option than the other. Now if the same players are in the lineup for both big men and Bynum still gives up more than he scores, then your comparison would be proven correct. Otherwise, you are using some serious assumptions in order to justify your point.

Besides, I fail to understand the purpose of you trying to prove that Brown is a better defensive option than Bynum. That has already been proven from several different levels. However, it is not an option to have Brown on the court for 48 minutes a night, so clearly, you have to have Bynum play some minutes. Plus, at different points in the game it is more necessary to have an offensive presence in the paint than at other times. At that point, it makes more sense to have Bynum in the game over Kwame. Plus, the fact that Bynum is not a perfect player at this point only attest to the fact that he is still a work in progress which is an understood fact. Everybody knows that he has things to work on and improve on. The point is that he has demonstrated enough potential to give people the motivation to believe that he can improve. When Shaq played with the Magic, his defense was not solid at all. Olajuwon killed him in the Finals the year they met. It wasn't until Phil challenged Shaq in LA that he finally started focusing on defense. That was after about 6 years in the league. Bynum is in year 3 and is only 20....which is the age when Shaq entered the NBA. I think we can afford to give him a little more time. As for Kwame, he may become an even better defender in time with experience and more work, but I doubt that he will ever become an offensive presence. That is the difference of the two, Bynum has potential to be solid in both areas, whereas Brown doesn't. For now, Brown should start, but after this season, that will no longer be the case.

Instead of beating this dead horse, why not move on to other topics? No one disagrees that Brown is not the better defender. Phil has proven that he believes in Brown by the fact that he continues to pick him as the starter. So why are you continuing to make an issue out of this, when no issue exists? As for your disfavor of Walton or Mihm, I believe that first you can't lump them together. Walton, whether you like it or not, is a solid passer and he has developed some of the areas of his game offensively. On defense, he does work hard and as a team defender, helping out especially, he does get in the passing lane and disrupt things. One on one, he is clearly too slow to handle the better small forwards. He wouldn't be starting right now if Odom was available. In fact, he still may not be starting if Vlade is healthy. Phil proved in preseason that he prefers to bring him in with the second unit. As for Mihm, he only played after it became clear that Cook wasn't working out. Anybody that believes that Phil likes Cook so much should just look at how much time he spends on the bench and how quickly he is taken out when he messes up. Mihm only played out of necessity. However, as a power forward, he did cause some mismatches yesterday. If he is able to start hitting that midrange shot he will get some time. His defense is terrible right now as well, but do the Lakers currently have a choice of whether or not to play him? Last time I checked Kwame was only 1 person and therefore can't play center and power forward at the same time. Plus he can't play 48 minutes a game. That means that guys like Bynum and Mihm have to play. In other words, this is not a debatable issue because unless/until the roster is changed, this is what it is.

If I want to use the term pic n roll what is to you people. Now I have some guy trying to teach me correct grammar? I'm not the one who tried to correct someone about the use of pick and roll, like a professor. Or just a simple pic n roll. What's the difference? It not like you don't understand what I'm talking about.



I hope you don't blame me to the hilt if I could not give you concrete names. I know some players but they have been gotten by the Euro League like Papaloukas so this is not an instant scouting but a thorough research in a pipeline. Next time I will apply to be an international scout eventhough I could not even qualify to be a boy scout haha! OK, I mentuioned some names last summer many with Team Greece, Team Spain, Team Lithuania, Team Brazil and those who played in Final Four at Euro Fiba. There are many bangers there and shooters. Biedrins and Pietrus are just one of them, look on their second year they are decent players on defense also with offense.

I know you are serious that learning the triangle is a hard task. Do you really see a triangle in last nights game? The Center could hardly touch the ball and pass it back to Kobe. Look at the play on Turiaf back to Kobe or that Bynum to back to Kobe. Why back to Kobe, does he have a magnetic field? It appears Kobe is the center of the offense not the big man. Therefore the triangle is only effective when double teaming occurs and there is an open man. With the Lakers, it's obvious they double, triple Kobe. He fishes for foul in the post which other claims he's forcing his shots. Both are right but in absence of a reliable "money" shooter, Kobe is preferred than letting Kwame do the works. Kwame missed four in a row and nobody is guarding him on the free throw line, perhaps 12 in a row if you include the preseason lol! that's embarrassing for an NBA player. Euro and asian players that's the first thing they master the FT line because it's a free shot. In the case of Walton, he would rather pass the ball than shoot it, that's also bad , it means he has no confidence with his post play, he is only three meters from the basket, he could not manufacture shots because he's not athletic enough like Wells, Hayes or Alston. Of course, there is a room for improvement in the next 81 games. How about our kid drew bynum, can he double pump or move the ball from left hand to right in the air or dunk the ball with one hand with body english like the iceman. The Kid needs to go back to tapes of the Great Centers who played the game. I will mention two names which you are familiar with: Moses Malone of Sixers and Elvin Hayes of the Rockets if Bynum can copy these masters, do you think Yao Ming will not be fouled by 3rd quarter. It is not how you dunk but how you control your body while in the air? When will he learn that? Maybe 2011 when we're tired of blogging. lol!

Good posts Fearless. It is what it is lol.

Actually I felt like it was a slight on the part of PJ not to recognize the change that Houston made. They switched off T-Mac to Luke for a reason, and we didn't counter, or for that matter...perhaps a better answer was we don't really have anyone to counter with. Mo came in, but even though I liked Mo, he was barely a blip in the game. Ugly fouls, and ugly shots.

Either way we lost, let's move on. There's another game coming. Another day to discuss whether Kobe should stay or go...though if it was up to this fan, you know the answer to that.


>>>I say Gordon/Hinrich/Noah/Some Dude for Kobe/Kwame/Sasha.

The only way they could possibly include Kwame and still match salaries (at least right
now) is if Ben Wallace was one of the players coming back. Hinrich is BYC, so his
contract only counts as $5,500,000 from the Lakers' perspective. Kobe plus Kwame
is about 28 million (assuming Kobe would waive his trade kicker), so they'd have to get
back about 22.4 million in contracts to make it work Hinrich + Gordon + Noah is only
12.4 million. They can't get 10 million more in contracts right now without including
either Wallace or Deng.

How would you feel about Kobe + Kwame + Sasha for
Wallace + Gordon + Thomas + JamesOn Curry (or Aaron Gray)?

That one works.

Long Time Laker Fan

lol, my hubby said the same thing.....but then I reminded him it was the Laker front office here and not really he or I making these deals.

"If Kobe would have been smart, he would have mended those fences with Shaquille, let Shaquille be 'The Man' and we wouldn't be in this position," Johnson said. "Now, after four years later, he understands that he can't do it by himself. Now he's blaming the organization, and some of that blame should be on him and some on the organization."

and that´s the bottom line `cause magic said so.

Kobe 45 points!

Oh but wait they LOST again.

He! hew! he!


Michael A.,

That's the challenge on the Phoenix, we cannot afford to double team because we are slow in going back to our man. Like Kwame leaving the center and chase Nash on the top of the foul line, bang Marion or Amare will be taking their snack alley-hooping in the post. lol! Then clogging the post by teaming up on Amare, great Nasty will pass it to clothesliner or to Diaw bang! they got the painful three.

My view is Game 3 of the playoffs switching defense, there is always a man in front of the player. For Nash, we have to tire him by using tall guards or fast guards until his back aches with constant shadowing, without that scheme, Nash will hide with his traditional P & R with Diaw or Barbosa until lakers get bedazzled in finding whom to guard.

We have alreadyfought the Phoenix suns 11 games in the playoffs, plus 8 times in the season for the last two years until now we're still confused, that's how slow-footed our players are. We don't have these kinds of problem from 2000-04. If Fox-Horry can do it why not Walton-Kwme or Turiaf? they can all do the high fives right? lol!

jorema -

artest is suspended for the start of the season

for pleading no contest on domestic battery charge

I would not be suprised if average joe is KL, cause he is making people on this plog hate kobe because of avg. joe.

It's obvious he wants to piss people off

"They switched off T-Mac to Luke for a reason"

I didn't want to say anything because I written so much about it. But teams isolate Walton yet PJ plays him for 39 minutes.

I figured since there so much season I would get to it in time.


Preview of the nextgame:

KOBE - 100 points, 0 assist, 0 rebound
The rest of the team - who cares!

Oh by the way...THEY LOST "AGAIN".... & AGAIN.... & AGAIN...

PHOENIX - 101 (he! he! he!) & WIN.... by one point... without the starting five... just to piss that MJ wanna' be off... OUCH!

He he he !



I'm with you all the way.

What I know is this. Next game, Kobe will drop the same 12 dimes, but this time guys will make their shots and people will all of a sudden say how much of a "team" game he played. He'll have a line like 35-8-7 or something and everyone will say that we would have won the first game too, if Kobe only played like that.

I'm glad that guy made the post to show that Kobe was passing the ball, nobody was shooting. Or, the guys who did shoot, didn't make their shots, except Fish. And, only Farmar kept the offense going with his passing.

It must suck to have your game graded by how someone else plays. Especially if that someone else is a stiff.


PS: If Kobe's wrist wasn't hurt, he would have made at least 7 of those missed FT's and the game would have never been that close. Lakers win.

Sheridan: Kobe objecting to Deng's inclusion in Bulls-Lakers trade

The Bulls want to give him. Kobe don't .


Even if I think some of your posts are full of crap, and others are quite insightful, you can butcher your grammar any time you want to.

Substance? I care about.

Grammar? Who cares?

Broken English? Bah, humbug! Just say something cool and I'll either agree or yell at my monitor.

Period. End of discussion.


KOBE please stay and may you have many more brick shot attempt in the future!



I want to play with Deng, too. And I'm not an NBA superstar.


Isn't it funny that no matter how PJ tries to hide Luke, the other team is always able to find him and exploit him?

Maybe Phil needs to recalibrate his Jedi Mind Trick, or something.


ogurat or tarugo or whatever...u sure ur not KL?

Kobe is not going anywhere. If he is truely insisting that Deng not be included, then he will have a long wait. Dr Buss is a great poker player and a prideful man, he will not allow Kobe to call the shots here.

What Dr Buss should do is call a news conference and say that Kobe is off the table due to unacceptable offers. If Kobe wants to leave, then he will Ok Deng in the deal.

Like I have said over and over, there is no rush here. And from my perspective, the only guy woth giving Kobe up for is Deng. The other guys are either nice players or prospects. Deng is the only one that has true all star potential. Let Kobe wait. I know Dr Buss will.


That game last night made me sick!

Watching Kobe play last night was unsettling. There is just so much wrong with the way he played it is hard to know where to begin. I suppose you could start with the 50 forced shots, and overplaying his man on defense.

But you know the really amazing things is that you have an entire organization that has become so conditioned to this destructive style of play that they are afraid to put the clamps down on it.

I read the comments about the weaknesses of his teammates, and just keep thinking how in the hell could you expect anyone to play well with a guy who destroys the cohesiveness of your offense (and not infrequently) your defense?

I am impressed that Fisher managed to find 9 shots and scored 17 points. That is the guy there that really kept us in the game. Under the circumstances, that was a pretty impressive game by D-Fish. And I thought Luke, Turiaf and Farmar did a good job of hanging tough.

There are your real team leaders right there. The guys that kept plugging away trying to find a way to win the game as Kobe did his best impression of a guy auditioning for a white leather jacket in a padded room.

So, how come no one stands up to Kobe and say "F-U man, you are destroying this team'? Where is the voice of integrity in the spiritual abyss that has become the Lakers?

Where is the owner who says I not going to let a guy like that destroy my team?

Where the coach who has a commitment to playing the game the right way?

Where is the player who gets into Kobe's face and tells him, "You've disrespected yourself and every player on this team with the way you play, the way you act and the things you've said. And it is going to stop or I am going to knock you on your ass until it does stops." (Love Shaq for being that guy for us at one time).

I guess that is the real problem with the Lakers right now, absolutely no Juevos!

And, as for Kobe, man what frigging joke that guy is!

(Meanwhile, somewhere off in the desert, Steve Nash is rolling around on the ground in uncontrollable laughter).

"Bryant was booed during pregame introductions Tuesday at Staples Center. He was also jeered the first time he touched the ball, but as the game went on, Lakers fans began cheering for him. "It just felt good to hear them come back around later in the game," Bryant said Wednesday. "That's the most important thing. They know. A smart fan can kind of read between the lines and can kind of decide for themselves what's really going on. I just let it be. I just want to go out there and play the game that I love to play."

Read between the lines people. Something is going on and I bet Kobe won't be going anywhere. What's really going on? Any fool can see....I shoulld just keep my mouth shut on this one and just let it happen.



Man this blog is turning into nonsense.


now that being said,


JOREMA IS A MORON TOO, for TYPING RUMORS THAT THE BOOS WERE PROJECTED BY A SPEAKER. What the hell is going on this blog? I thought you couldnt make up false ideas or rumors. I thought things were being edited by AK/BK??? THE WORSE PART IS THAT HALF OF THE BLOG ACTUALLY BELIEVES JOREMA THAT THE BOOS WERE PRE-RECORDED. WHAT A BUNCH OF IDIOTS.

Those two are worse than KL, becaues they are complete nitwits who dont apologize. At least KL admitted his faults. These guys are moronic.

The odd thing is all of this is that I think that Mike T. is actually somewhat right. For all the craziness of the summer, I am questioning how Phil can coach this team. Phil is only around to coach Kobe and now Fisher, but he doesnt seem to connect to the rest of his players. He doesnt know how to use them. SUPER QUESTIONABLE rotations in the last game. Where was that second unit together? Why arent some of those guys playing together? Fisher, Farmar and Kobe as the perimter? Cook and Kwame together??? I dont know what was going on.

Furthermore, Kobe is screwing the Lakers because not only does he want to be traded, but now only on his terms. IF the Lakers get nothing in a deal, BLAME KOBE NOT THE FO.

The Lakers could get Luol Deng this trade would happen. Luol Deng and Ron Artest for Kobe would work in a second. Personally, Ben Gordon is asking for too much money, and we dont want Ben Wallace. A permiter of Artest, Deng and Odom would be very solid.

But one good thought is that the Jermaine Oneal trade is still a possibility. The originally wanted Lamar Odom, but the way the team is being assembled they may just go with Bynum and a contract like Kwame and a piece like Farmar. If you notice that roster, they have a hole at center. Diagu and Murphy are both PF and they like them a lot. Also they need a real back up point guard with a future. I say they might take a kwame, bynum, farmar, vlad package for JO and David Harrison in a couple weeks.

I am somewhat amazed by the almost near panic of some the bloggers after ONE GAME. Here is a few random thoughts.

First the Rockets are being touted as an elite team in the west if they can stay healthy. Well they were healthy last night we wrer not. And they beat us by 2 points on a last second shot.

Kobe had a sprained wrist. Our number 2 didnt play and we lose by 2. Yes this team is not good enough to win if a key player goes down but how many teams are?

Defense. The blog has been bugging me all day on this one. We gave up 95 points. If we had averaged 95 last year we would have finished 7th in the league in defense. If we average 95 this year we will win a lot of games. Yao dropped 25 on us and it's Oh MY GOD Kwame and Andrew suck!! Yao is now the best center in the league and he AVERAGED 25 against the LEAGUE last year. So he didnt have a great game, he had an average one. And T-Mac dropped 30. When healthy he is a superstar. It happens. If he is on, there isnt much you can do about it. But defensively we did what you do against a team with superstars, let them get theirs and shut everyone else down. Look at the stat line of the other guys. All the other guys only scored 40 points total. That is good team defense. guys, it was offense, Kobes wrist, missing all the freebees and missing Lamar that did us in. Heck even Vlade out with the flu could have made the difference if he had been available to drop a couple of 3's.

Just look at some of the 1st games around the league. Cleveland gets killed and Labron scores 10 points and has 5 turnovers. I am thinking we didnt do such a bad job. Lets wait until we get our team playing together a while be for we push the panic button.


After this comes out:

if Lakers still play him business as usual, I'll have to hop on that "FO is completely incompetent and lost all control" bandwagon. He is now publicly competing against the team, and therefore - an enemy. They HAVE TO bench him and start twisting his arm.

It's getting surreal now.

KOBE please stay and may you have many more brick shot attempt in the future!


Posted by: ogurat | October 31, 2007 at 11:42 PM

Uoy era na elohssa. Og kcuf flesruoy. daehkciD.

Chicago slowly inches toward a deal I'd accept for Kobe:

"The Bulls, according to's source, are willing to offer an alternative package of Gordon, Noah and Thomas."


The comments from the Lakernation thing deal with a small segment of the game. The point is Kobe spend a lot of the game dribbling around,holding the ball and working his individual moves. A couple really nice passes that were worthy of a Magic highlight film but many more ineffective passes and way too many shots. The refs were being extremely generous to Kobe as far as free throws awarded.
While we didn't have much time to observe it last night since Kobe was injchucking it up the whole night,the pre season(and pre season is what it is) games the Lakers often looked a lot better with Kobe out of the lineup and a lot of ball sharing going on.
The Seattle game was the epitome. The Lakers built a big lead in the second quarter(Kobe sat almost the entire quarter),played excellent defense and moved the ball. Kobe came in for the start of the third and the ball movement stopped. Seattle came back. Then Kobe nailed a bunch of shots to score 20 points but the ball movement died and in spite of all those Kobe points that quarter the Lakers lost some of the lead they built up in the second period with the ball movement. They also GAVE UP more points than they did in any other quarter in the third.
Kobe was basically shooting the ball every time he saw it and it was impressive,make no mistake,but the things the TEAM was doing suffered and disappeared.

Mike T -

I do not claim to be an expert in any sense of the word.
The whole thing started when I saw you spell pick like pic. It started as a joke and I was not trying to be arrogant or show you up!!!

Please accept my olive branch and we can debate on topics intelligently in the future with out the name calling.

I was just wondering, have you ever coached or taught? You seem to have alot of insight and are passionate about the game.

BK, Laker_STH,

Thanks for the info.

In addressing Kobe's passing...I hope you guys were listening during the game when they said Phil Jackson met with Kobe before tipoff and told him to forget about being the facilitator (passer/playmaker) and focus primarily on scoring....PJ giving Kobe the green light to do such a thing in the first game of the season...looks to me like Phil is ultimately the one not trusting the players.

Yes Kobe needs to trust his teamates more even though they've given him reasons not to. However, like one coach said when asked what he thought about the Triangle Offense. "Its an offense designed to get number 23, 34, number 8 (now 24) all the shots."

Guys were just standing around and when they had the ball, Kobe was cutting without the ball and would end up cutting right back to were he left the player with the rock. Kobe and Bynum didn't play that much to begin with.

seeing as the bulls don't want to pay Deng, a smart man would try to trade for Deng right now. If Mitch offers Bynum, Odom and Farmar/ or Crit. for Deng amd Wallace. Guarantee it works the bulls need an inside presence and everyone is high on Bynum. Wallace has overstayed his welcome and high salary.....but i'm not in the front office and i'm a smart man.


Can you address this with some type of historical perspective.

It's all over the radio this morning that Bulls are offering Deng and Kobe is vetoing it. After the game (or it may have been half-time) interview, Kobe said something like "when I put this jersey on, I am a Laker", but when probed further, he admitted that "HIS REPRESENTATIVES" are involved in the negotiations. Well, Duh!

How bizarre is this? A player is allowed to suit up for a team, when it's public knowledge that he is trying to leave and screw this team as much as he can on his way out.

Is there any sort of a precedent to this, in any pro sport that you guys can point to? Should he not be allowed to play, at least until such specific negotiations break down?

Laker fans, you are fake, fake, FAKES!
You booed your own star for goodness sakes
You sided with the FO, and let them feed you slop
Falling for the oldest con, good and bad cop.
You let a crackhead jockey go and pull your strings
You let them dis on Kobe then let them dis 9Rings
A house that is divided, can and will not stand
Just ask Dr Buss, he got punished aint that grand
He tried to con everyone, and make the bad guy be Kobe
Stern busted Buss the Drunk, with a 2 game penalty
A lot of so called fans said trade him, he dont want to stay
Would you stay for dinner, if garbage was on your plate
They tried to smear Kobe, say watch him take a dive
So he went out and on the Rockets, dropped a quick 45
Then he asked the Rockets, SHOW ME WHAT YOU GOT
Yao said I got this Kobe, Kobe blocked his freakin shot.
Then they said get him Tmac, come on you’re the new MJ
9Rings put Kobe on him, Tmac couldn’t get a shot away.
Folks don’t drink the Kool-Aid, Yeah it taste oh so sweet
But that’s to hide the poison, that knocks you off your feet
Kobe is good as gone folks, that train done left the station
If you put up with this crap, you are all fakes Laker Nation
This is it for Mamba24, I punched my ticket this is it by by
Thank yall for your love, but this FO crap dont fly
To my blogger sister FAITH, Take care I’ll love you forever
To my mentor EDWIN GUECO, a storm is coming get a sweater
To my inspiration and blogger brother, see you later take care THA SHOW
You said it, I understood it, youre right , Time for me to go
You want the truth well you got it, LAKER TRUTH knows why
other teams now look upon the Lakers, FO as a pig sty.
To the renaissance man, they call him GENERIC ONE
Man you’re a genius not generic, you’re second to no one
To KEIFO my blogger twin brother, stay strong and stay on course
I’m sorry my friend and brother, I got to ride the Kobe horse
To blogger sister EAST COAST JESSIE, big kudos sis to you
To root for the Lakers over KG, damn girl respect to you is due
To a man a lot respect, but just as many love to hate
you got skills MIKE T dont give up, Only God controls your fate
To utzworld THE BANNER HOLDER, like KRS ONE I got to fly
Keep on posting keep on believing, hold that banner hold it high
To fellow warrior ANGRY LAKER, you think you’re angry listen to this
That water that fell from Staples, that aint water but Buss piss
And finally MAMBA FAMILY, from this nest this mamba must fly
Godd@mnit ithis didn’t have to happen, let me go before I cry

(1) FAITH, MIKE T. TALIQ, Edwin Gueco,, KEIFO, Mamba24Fan4Life, Fan of Mamba, Wolf, Man
KL BEAST, Jorema, FearlessWhackJob, MARTY, JANDRO, LAKERFAZE, PhxLkrFAN,
TexasLaker, BOB, TreacherousBalloons, EagleBoy, JR., EASTCOASTJESSIE, Zakee,
Tully Moxness, KobeRocks, David Peterson, centralk, 244Life, SamII, vi lakerfan,
Swettual, Utzworld, Andrew Z, LAL Fan, BRANDON C., Kinglakernidas, BlackMamba24,
FKILLAH, CYRUS(VENTRILIQUIST), RespectMyAuthorith, Waterboy, Hariyahu, HUBBIT
SOCALIFE, HAL9000, Greekdude, Michael J, Michael H, Michael A., Rick Friedman,
PAUL LEE, Jay EL, SocalSpider , WEAVE MAN, JON KAVULIC, Tajluck, Alexinho17
JR, Dascilla, tellitlikeitisNik Kannan, GABE, SEAN P., HanSoulFood, HollywoodJack,
wiZo, MagicShaq, HugoBoss, OSCAR, RDLEE, RealityBites, LakerLarry, Bucky, LEELO,
Juno, LakerLifer, C.S. JOVA, BLAZE1BX, Tripgame3, TSPHERE, SIXONEZERO,
Mfeige, Reggie, Hollywood Jack, Reality Check Time, Jack In Hollywood, SLO Gal, Thi
EMMA, TIM IN SYDNEY RISING STAR, LakerBake, JuanMan888,Blkthght06, Man,
Any_One_mouse, 10milliondollarZen, Shiva, Laker_Hopeful, LakerDawg, East Nyboer
,Ghost of Spiderman, Steve in Denver Guy Owanlele, Lincoln Laker, Houston Laker
Marc Gasol, Sun Yue, Shamond, Williams, Ronny Turiaf, V. Radmanovic, Jennifer
Maurice Evans, Lamar Odom, Derek Fisher, Luke Walton, Brian Cook, KOBES T.
Kwame Brown, Andrew Bynum, Coby Karl, Chris Mihm, Sasha Vujacic
Jordan Farmar, Jarvis Critterton, JERMAINE ONEAL???, Larry Fulcher


thanks kobe.

you not only want to bail on the lakers, you want us to get ripped off in the process.

it is reported that the bulls ARE IN FACT willing to part with deng in a deal for kobe.

but good ol' kobe with his trade veto says no. no deal with chicago can involve deng.

and to all the kobe lovers, enjoy it. your idol is not only quitting on a team & city that has supported him, he would also like for that team & city to get ripped off in the process.

that cannot be stressed or said enough.

kobe bryant not only is demanding to be traded to the bulls, he also wants to make sure that the lakers do not equal value in return (deng, gordon, thomas and noah).


i am with HAB, bench kobe until a deal gets done.

and the lakers better remain steadfast in demanding deng & gordon with this deal. do not waver.

in a matter of 4 months, i have gone from defending kobe to eagerly looking forward to the day that he is gone.

so i guess chicago isn't so stupid. they are willing to part with deng, gordon, thomas & noah.

however, kobe bryant isn't cool with that.

wgat's next? does he want dr. buss to drive him to the airport after the trade is made?

the lakers front office is inept. no argument here.

but kobe bryant takes the cake.

after ALL the lakers have done for him, he not only wants out - he wants to make sure the lakers do not get equal value (or anything close to it) in return.

this is kobe's logic: "trade me now & don't ask for too much from the bulls, i am trying to win a title..."


I think those were the truest words Mike T has ever spoken.

By the way, to the brothers K - it's all right to curse as long as you're spelling it backwards? I'm just asking.

I'm really curious to see what happens versus Phoenix. They'll be coming off a back-to-back, so I think we've actually got a shot in this one. Can't hurt.

Lakers not in the hurry. Kobe wants out - FINE. Let him play out 2 years on this contract and if he still wants let him walk away. Accepting substandard package which is basically any package without Deng not an option. We just can not become another Timberwolves after trading KG this summer. Don't get me wrong, I would definitely prefer Kobe to stay, but common people get real, if he wants not only to tell what is his destination should be but also, who should or should not be included in the trade it's getting to the point who is going to blink first and in this case FO should remain firm and refuse any substandard package from any team. Don't we had enough accepting $15M per year Grant's salary in Shaq's trade?

Three way deal invoving Suns:

Bulls get Kobe.

Lakers get Marion.

Suns get Thabo Sefolosha and other considerations.

Its quite simple...Kobe waive your "no-trade" clause....if you do you can be outta here by weeks end. Dr. Buss if Mr. Bryant won't waive hos no-trade clause let it be known to him and all of us that he won't be trading him !

It's obnoxious how Kobe keeps on saying that everything is up to management, if indeed he's vetoing a trade involving Deng...

Reading post from certain bloggers reminds me of this story about a professor and a Zen Master:

A university professor went to visit a famous Zen master. While the master quietly served tea, the professor talked about Zen. The master poured the visitor's cup to the brim, and then kept pouring. The professor watched the overflowing cup until he could no longer restrain himself. "It's overfull! No more will go in!" the professor blurted. "You are like this cup," the master replied, "How can I show you Zen unless you first empty your cup."

Some may be passionate and have some knowledge of the game of basketball and are convinced so strongly that their perception is correct and true. However, there are different philosophies on how to play the game and what facet of the game is important. An opinion that differs from yours is not necessarily right or wrong - it is just different. Name calling and insulting other bloggers brings the blog down in my opinon.

One thing I think the K Bros do well in my opinion is lay out their opinions and then provide support as to why they think that way. Then when someone disagrees in a disagreeable fashion, they are respectful in their replies. I wish more bloggers would take that approach - rather than take the I am a know-it-all and you are a know-nothing, idiot approach.



Boy, sit your @$$ down! You ain't going nowhere!

LAL Fan,
I think you might be right. All the trade Kobe for this or that can't get done unless Kobe says OK. The reality is that this situation - regardless of whom you wish to blame is a real mess. There doesn't appear to be a good way for the Lakers or Kobe to come out with what they want. There are too many cooks involved in this soup. You have to find salaries that are close enough to make the deal work, you have to find some talent that works for the Lakers, then you have to find one or more teams to make a deal happen. There is plenty of blame to pass around, from Dr. Buss, Kobe AND Shaq, Phil - the whole lot of them. If you can't trade him let him play it out, hope for or sign and trade, but taking on bad contracts like Ben Wallace, is only going to hamper the ability of the Lakers to add the talent needed to get back to doing what they do - WIN CHAMPIONSHIPS. In my humble opinion the sooner Kobe is gone the sooner they can get back to getting in contention for a title. (Just think - 8 months ago that Boston still looked like a crummy lottery team at best - now they have the talent to maybe contend. I know I know, the naysayer’s will say the Laker FO would never do that. But who honestly thought Danny Ainge could work that kind of magic? Come on be honest you know you didn't neither did I!)


Let's look at the start to this season.

Our owner is serving a 2 game suspension for dui.
Odom is still injured and then gets into a car accident.
Mihm is not 100 percent.
The Kobe situation has spun out of control.
Vlad has the sniffles and a sore throat.
Phil has not signed an extension.

Are we at the bottom yet? This is a great franchise and will bounce back. It will take some time and patience. But man, there is some bad karma in Lakerland.

How 'bout my boy Gil's opening night? VERY KOBE-ESQUE.

34 pts, 10-25 shooting, makes a spectacular buzzer beating trey to send it to OT, then proceed to lose to the helpless, JO-LESS Pacers.

Wizards, BTW were full strength, playing with all 3 of their ALL-STAR PLAYERS.

We need to get better and get this trade talk over once and for all!!!

What about a deal for JO and Troy Murphy. Indiana wanted to include Troy's contract and screw the lakers this summer and the lakers said no. At this point they need to eat it, and take Murphy. I think they can do it without including Bynum (their project, the asset they are pinning all their hopes on). Here's the link:

We trade Kwame's expiring contract, LO, J Critt, and Turiaf for O'Neal and Murphy.

I think its fair. They get some real quality young talent with small contracts, they get Kwame's $9M off the books, and they get LO, who thrived in the eastern conference. We get Oneal and a servicable big with a huge contract in Murph.

What do ya think?

Thanks, Tha Show

Just when you thought the wacky meter has reached the top, it goes higher.

It's hard to believe that FO is that nutless. I have to assume there is a motive in play here that we don't know about.


"Also, what is the deal with fan "booing" for the best player on the planet? Where's the grattitude for Kobe's greatness?"

Oh, please .... spare us.

As I posted yesterday, Kobe thinks Deng is his Scottie Pippin and that's why Pelinka passed on the deal. Magic summed it up beautifully. Both sides of this equation add up to dysfunction.

MAGIC: a very biref summary

Years ago, he went into Buss' office and asked to be traded. He had just won a championship running the team himself. Westhead decided Magic should look over to him for the play every time down. Magic tried for a few games, went in to BUss and said don't fire Paul, trade me. Jerry fired Paul and told West to coach the team. Pat Riley stopped by the Logos office to find out what was going on and West stunned everybody by giving the job to Riley. Riley gave the ball to Magic and said, do what you do. That's how a dynasty was born. It ain't rocket science. You let the great ones do what they do.

Eagleboy -

You are absolutely right with your zen koan...
I appreciate your post!

I will eat humble pie.
Again, I apologize for carrying on with Mike T about the pick n roll thing!


Where you headed?

I haven't posted in a while due to all the negativity, but i'm with Magic. Trade him or declare you're not.

As a Chicago resident, I don't see Kobe plus whatever trash is leftover competing for a ring. Remember, Kobe is not asking to be traded to get back to the finals, he's trying to win. Even if they did beat the Detroits and Bostons of the world, I can't see them beating the Suns, Spurs, or Mavs with what is left.

I say keep him, BUT play Bynum. The problem I have with keeping Bynum over JO, JKidd, or KG is that he's not even starting! Demand that Phil play and start him so that he can get into some type of rythmn on the court. Bynum at this point is too passive to be a major star in this league, and we need to win now.

So yes, Kobe in Chicago would give me a chance to see the best player in the league more frequently (Lord knows the League pass west coast games keep me up way pat 1am), but I don't think this will be the answer for either team.

My proposed trade. Trade a gimpy JO for a gimpy LO, start Bynum, and let's try and compete with that lineup.


PS: Since Smush is gone, I change my annual Smush is garbage posts to
Kwame is Garbage

Kobe is beginning to see the position he is in; any trade that approaches fair value will gut the team he is going to, and thus he won't be able to compete for a title there. If he goes to a crappy team for draft picks, he will make it good enough that the draft picks will not be very high, and thus that team will not compete.

This is why, last season, the Lakers should have shut down Lamar and Kwame when they got hurt. The team knew that the absolute farthest it would go would have been the second round. Have them have their surgeries at that point. They would have been 1-2 months further along in their recovery by now. The team would have missed the playoffs, but gotten higher draft picks. (ANd with the lottery, maybe gotten real lucky.) So at this point you would have a (presumably) completely healthy Kwame and Lamar, a rookie who would be able to contribute more plus has a higher ceiling, and young players who got more experience last season and thus were further along in their development now. Another mistake by management, trying the highly successful "win now and rebuild at the same time" strategy.

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