I know it's preseason, but...

Ginger ale?

I recommend scotch...

by the all star break god knows what I'll be recommending much less taking

Well right now the odds makers have a minimun amount of data that they can crunch through their computers, so they are at a weakpoint as well. I am looking for them to over-dis the Lakers by a longshot for the first few games and provide some winning opportunities for Lakers fans who follow the spreads....

LOL I already have a queasy feeling in my stomach with that mental picture of AK in a thong. That's just wrong.

fly103,
"I already have a queasy feeling in my stomach with that mental picture of AK in a thong."

Well, on the talk show today he mentioned that he doesn't like being tied down.

Again this year I see the mistake being made of confusing "approximate equality between the starters and the bench" with depth. The Lakers are NOT a deep team. They are a team where there is not much to choose between players 3 and 10 when it comes to overall ability. That may change as the year progresses; hopefully some of the younger players will improve noticeably. (Walton, Turiaf, Bynum, Farmar) but right now they are not a deep team.

AK AND BK
THANKS FOR UPDATING ME ON KL'S STATUS. I SEE WHERE THIS IS GOING NOW. THANKS FOR ALLOWING ME TO POST ON YOUR BLOG.

IT'S ALWAYS NICE TO BE ABLE TO HAVE A PLACE TO VOICE YOUR OPINION OF HOW YOUR ONCE GREAT FRANCHISE HAS WENT DOWNHILL SINCE THE REMOVAL OF SHAQ FOR KOBE'S OWN SELFISH AMBITION. AND HOPEFULLY SOMEDAY IN THE FUTURE THE LAKERS WILL BECOME A TRUE TEAM AGAIN. (HOPEFULLY AFTER KOBIATCH IS GONE)

IF YOU COULD EMAIL ME INFO ON HOW TO GET IN CONTACT WITH KL, I WOULD APPRECIATE THAT. IF YOU CAN'T DON'T WORRY. HE WAS GREAT VOICE HERE AND A GREAT WARRIOR SO, OUT OF RESPECT FOR HIM, I'LL SIGNING OFF TOO.

I'M OUT! (NOW YOU ALL CAN CHEER!)

GUNNER

Perhaps this is why the alcohol vendors at Staples have widened the variety of choices to get sloshed with at Lakers games. Mojitos?!?!?

The SI article from the opposing scout ended by saying something along the lines of this franchise doesn't have a direction. It makes sense considering any move that involves Kobe, whether it be now or later, changes everything. So, how much progress they make this may or may not matter. You don't know if you're preparing to go deep in the playoffs or rebuilding from scratch. What I like is that there are players like Jordan and Bynum who've clearly put in a lot of work over the summer and seem less affected by what happens with Kobe. Jordan comes off with such an ego that I wonder if he really cares if Kobe stays or goes. Perhaps he wants to roll Tony Parker or Jameer Nelson style and really be the floor general for this team. And Bynum seems 100% focused on eating right, training right and getting better. I believe that the players who allow themselves to operate free of the Kobe-burden are the ones going out there and really putting forth the energy.

Gunner-

That's certainly your choice if you want to make it, but there's no reason you can't post. As long as you (and everyone) upholds the standards we have, it's totally fine. That people don't necessarily like what you say has nothing to do with it (assuming it's hoops related, of course).

BK

btw - I just got some junk email from Staples offering up two free Clippers tickets. LOL.

Gunner,

That's fine. If you email us (kambrothers@yahoo.com), we can pass along his email.

But just to reiterate, KL's situation had nothing to do with his opinion of Kobe. Nor was it an issue of other people not liking his opinion of Kobe. It was an issue of the language he used expressing that opinion and how he'd sometimes go out of his way to antagonize on a personal level those who disagreed with him. But we have no issue with the manner in which you personally have been posting of late. If KL's absence from the blog makes it so you don't want to be here or you simply don't like the rules, that's your choice. But you weren't being lumped together.

AK

Bummer24 Say it aint so!!!

HIP HIP HURRAY!!! HIP HIP HURRAY!! HIP HIP HURRAY!!!!

AK & BK can you please tell me what is going on for KL and Bummer24 to cause them to do 'Seppuku' put in their case it would be called 'Stuppidku'

Aaarrrhhhh!!

Angry_Laker

Hey BK -

I understand the dilemma you have posed to us - should you or should you not analyze the play of a team in the preseason. It is in fact, the PRE-season.

Nevertheless - you've brought up some valid points. One of which, I feel I would hold more value to than the other items you brought up in your piece.

Kobe certainly does look emotional divested in comparison to previous years. I remember him being very jovial and very positive around this time last year. I remember seeing him be very vocal to his teammates and very into the game last year - even in the PRE-season games NO LESS?!?! Oh, how one year and a trade demand can make a difference in a man's mindset, right? What happend to that guy, to that Kobe?

His body language, attitude, and overall demeanor wreaks of a man filled with guilt and remorse. I'm not a psychologist nor is my last name Parkman, but it doesn't take a genius to read his thoughts when sitting on the bench. Perhaps it's this current attitude he carries with him that is to be blamed for the malaise that the first unit is in. Perhaps D-Fish can snap and slap him around and say, "Dammit Jim... snap out of it... we need you!"

Either way - I'm not overly concerned about the other points you brought up. Odom will come around, as will Luke and the other walking zombies on this squad. The positives are certainly not going to overshadow the aforementioned negatives - but it certainly gives me hope. I'm loving what I'm seeing from Bynum, J-Crit, and Farmar. I'm even liking what I'm seeing with Sasha. But the biggest bright light for me is Turiaf. To me, he's the biggest positive thing to come out of this pre-season. I think the Lakers found ther PF>

I don't know... but it certainly is food for thought.

Ahlayn

The difference between an All-Star and a Champion.

Andrew Bynum has all the makings of a future All-Star. But Kwame Brown has all the makings of a future Champion.

Kwame's skill are perfect for a team that are in need of those skills to compete for a Championship.

Bynum's skills are the type that you would need to buid around. Bynum, when he comes into his own, may very well be All-Star material. But even if he's an All-Star he would have to be the focus of the team. And when you're the focus of the team you need help around you.

Just like Kobe needs help, Bynum will need help. Kobe right now is an All-Star and a Champion. He still an All-Star but is trying to get back to the Championship series. He doesn't need All-Stars around him. He needs the right pieces, who because of the chemsitry will be recognized as All-Stars.

Take A.C. Green for example. One year Kareem, Green, Worthy, and Magic were all named to the All-Star team. A.C. Green? If I remember correctly...these four were named starters to that game. A.C. Green was a piece in the puzzle of a Championship team. But after a while he was rewared with an election to the All-Star game.

Kwame has the makings of a Champion. Bynum has the makings of an All-Star. There is a difference.

mike

Caron Butler is an All-Star in Washington. Do you think he'll ever be a Champion in Washington?

Why not?

It's simple!

Wrong mix of talents. And they have three All-Star types.

mike

You lost me at "AK in a thong"...

Start Bynum and Farmar now. Mihm makes a good back up. Kwame is virtually useless on the offensive end. Love DFish...but Farmar is already a better overall player. Seems the 2nd unit is a better team right now. This is what I'd like to see in the near future.

LO
Walton
Bynum
Kobe
Farmar

That's a starting team that CAN go far in the playoffs. Let's not forget that 2 years ago, we almost beat the best team in the NBA (arguably). This team is better than that team.

One quick point on Kobe.

I would imagine it is incredibly difficult for him to play at such a high level while not being emotionally invested in the cause. With a guy like Kobe, because he is all heart and effort, when you are presented with no realisic chance to obtain your goals (playing in June) then I could see how his production would decline. My guess is he will still score at will but not do much else. It won't be tanking, but it won't be all-world either. To be the best in the world at something you have to believe in what you are doing. I think that is why MJ stepped away from the game the times he did. Kobe and MJ are not hard wired like most players that do it for money and the lifestyle--for them winning is all that matters.

For his sake and for the Lakers sake he should be moved as soon as possible. I willl still be a fan of the Lakers and I will root for Kobe wherever he goes.

I wholly support your decision to ban KL. Gunner, I would encourage you to stay, but perhaps remove all caps from your keyboard...remember, all caps doesn't make a ignorant statement intelligent or persuasive.

AK/BK the blog has returned to a normal blog!!!

When are we going back to the 'Gold' colour. You do know since we have been 'Lilly' white, the lakers have taken a nose dive in form!!! I am not blaming you two indirectly, but you have a lot to answer for!!! I heard your show and it was good but you two sounded like the 'Statler & Waldorf' of sports radio talk shows!!! LOL

Keep up the good work, I suppose we will not be hearing from 'Steven'.

Could you please post your AK/BK 'Blogg of Rights' !!!LOL

Aaarrrhhhh!!

Angry_Laker

Gunner24,

"..YOUR OPINION OF HOW YOUR ONCE GREAT FRANCHISE.."

Thanks for confirming that *you* were never interested in the franchise. Gives us a little visibility into your perspective if you were never interested in the franchise at all.

And oh yeah, CHEER!

This is why I don't think Bynum is right for this team.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/basketball/nba/lakers/la-sp-lakerep13oct13,1,7301266.story?coll=la-headlines-sports-nba-lakers

"This year's the year," he said. "I kind of think we go as far as our young guys take us, me and Javaris [Crittenton] being the young guys, going out there and getting some things done on our second unit. I'm still trying to go out there and be a starter, but as of right now, I think Phil [Jackson] is favoring Chris Mihm -- veteran status and all that."

In the article Bynum never mentions defense. He speaks of Crittenton and himself. That would imply offense of unity.

After three years the guy is still harping on his offensive game and it shows in his defensive game. When I read this article my mind was made up...ship him out. If it takes three years and the guy still doesn't understand that for this TEAM to do well the priority has to be defense, then that tells me he's really only thinking of his game and not the teams intrest.

mike

I'm really loving these daily videos from the Lakers. Today's practice is up - mainly interviews with PJ and Kobe.

http://www.nba.com/lakers/news/07preseason.html

Lots of discussion about defense and Andrew. I like what he says about Drew "getting the time". Even though starting is something it seems that all these players covet, who gets the time really determines who contributes most to wins and losses. If Bynum is going to continue to get the time, he'll obviously need to up his focus on the defensive end. Blocks are flashy but those are only good for one play. He needs to improve big time on help defense, rotations and recognition.

Early on in the video, it shows LO doing a core-strengthening exercise that reminds me of when Bob Backlund (then WWF Champ) was doing a similar exercise outside the ring during a Sgt Slaughter match only to get attacked by Slaughter and eventually whipped across the back repeatedly with his riding crop.

Angry Laker-

I loved Stadler and Waldorf. And we'll remind them about the colors again. We've been on that one for a while.

BK

alhayn-

Thanks for the note. You're right- in time a lot of this could even out, adn I think much will (health provided). But the injury issue is a big one for me. L.O., not exactly an iron man in terms of avoiding injury, will start the season without a chance to really work himself into shape before jumping into the action. I have a ton of respect for his will to play and ability to go through pain, but it can't help.

Bottom line, a little while back I said I thought injuries were by far the biggest issue for the team, even beyond the Kobe stuff, and I still think that way. It's just hard for a team that starts off injured to heal up over the course of a year. It can happen, but it's a tall order.

BK

If you aren't panic stricken and confused, you have idea what's goin' on.

The scout on SI said it when he mentioned that in trading Kobe, you're trading away the notion the new management isn't committed to backing their coach and players.

If LeBron James was thinking of maybe opting out of CLeveland (not) he'd have to think "if Kobe can't make it happen, it won't happen".

Mitch knows that and he knows he won't be acquiring another "best player" in the game.

The Buss boys have to say SOMETHING to Kobe and the fans before this thing starts for real.

I agree with you shaq fan about kobe good good points.

I have to say looking at the heat trade for ricky davis and blount for walker just makes me sick at the lakers. I am not saying that ricky and mark blount is the end all be all but you can't tell me that they would not help us. That is the problem with the lakers the last few years. You mean we couldn't have beat that deal. I know kobe was wrong for the way he approach things this summer but man it has got to be frustrating for him because it is frustrating for me. It is about time somebody said something to buss about this crap. I hope I am wrong but we are in for a long season.

KL gone, Gunner next, say it aint so!

Kwame a 'future Champion?' Not as a starter...that's for sure! Kwame is one of the dumbest players I've ever seen on a basketball court (EVEN DUMBER THAN ELDEN CAMPBELL...YIKES!) All that talent...and no intelligence to make it work effectively and efficiently. What a shame. That's what made Magic a 'champion.' He was as intelligent as he was physically talented.

Sorry...but that's reality.

PUSHING JERRY WEST OUT THE DOOR....WAS THE BEGINNING OF THE END FOR THE LAKERS. THERE'S BEEN ENOUGH TIME SINCE KOBE REQUESTED HIS RETURN, SO IT WON'T LOOK LIKE IT WAS HIS WHINING THAT DID THE TRICK. DR. BUSS...JUST DO IT! MITCH IS A NICE GUY, BUT COME ON! WITH WEST BACK IN THE FOLD...KOBE HAS RESPECT FOR THE ORGANIZATION ONCE AGAIN. AND YOU HAVE THE BEST GM IN THE BUSINESS! A WIN WIN SITUATION!!!

DO IT OR SELL THE TEAM TO MAGIC!!!

Actually, (I did manage to sucessully erase my memory of any reference to AK in provocative underwear) I actually don't mind the tough schedule upfront for a variety of reasons:

For one the rest of the teams will be still ironing out kinks, getting players into mid-season form (Amare for instance will be coming back from injury) - I'd rather face Boston in November than in April when they will be trying to peak for the playoffs
Another reason is that our young pups (Farmar, Crittenton, Bynum) will be more productive earlier rather than later in the season.
It means that our schedule towards the middle/end of the season is slightly easier - we can try and build momentum towards the playoffs.
And lastly, if we start off horrendously, it allows us to address the Kobe situation earlier in the season.

So yes, BRING IT ON!

I am not panicking. Enough fear-mongering already.

GO LAKERS!

Hariyahu-

Optimism aside, those are some nice points. I just worry that in a very competitive WC, if the Lakers dig themselves any sort of hole early, all margin for error the rest of the way is gone.

They don't have much to begin with, either (haha).

BK

Jon-

Fear mongering?

Maybe instead of the Panic Button pic, I should have put the Fox News logo. (haha)

(Okay, I know we're not supposed to get political- and I'm not. More a comment on media than politics!)

BK

Bk or Ak or anybody

Maybe you have answered this question before but what do you think of this latest trade by the heat. Doesn't it frustrate you all a little bit when you see trades like that... Could'nt those two have helped the lakers. You mean the lakers can't beat that deal? I just feel the lakers are not creative or aggressive enough. As soon as kg got trade I said no need to panic. Just go after j howard and ricky davis. Man the lakers just suck. Buss needs to sell the team.

hariyahu- why would you cheer with another laker fun leaves this or any blog?

Isnt that as closed minded as everyone claims gunner and kl were on Kobe?

So if someone doesnt agree with your opinions, get rid of them?

Hen,

Let me ask you this. Do you consider Ricky Davis valuable enough that you'd be willing to take on the 3 years/21 mil left on Mark Blount's contract? If so, then I get why you're upset. If not (and I personally vote "not"), you won't sweat the trade. From the Lakers perspective, it's not worth renting Davis (expiring contract) for one season if it means taking on Blount. And while the Heat were definitely looking for some athletic scoring options (Davis), that trade was as much (or more) about pawning off Antoine Walker as anything else.

If the Heat landed Howard (expiring contract) instead of Blount, I could see being upset. But with Blount attached, they're also paying a price, literally and figuratively.

AK

The Phoenix Suns have 3 All-Stars but they haven't won anything.

I'm listening to PJ right now and he just said Bynum is doing pretty good on the offense but he said that his defense is, basically, the question. He said Bynum owes a lot to his teammates for feeding him those little passed underneath but that Bynum needs to pay them back by playing defense, somethig, which I don't PJ thinks Bynum does.

Why do we need PJ to tell us that? Anyone can see that with Bynum the games goes to this quick up and down type style. That isn't good as far as defense goes. People get stats but it's a crap shoot.

mike

Laker Lover,

I guessed you missed reading the beginning of my post? Did you notice how he referred to the Lakers as "your" franchise?

I interpreted that to assume he was never a Laker fan. Ergo, the cheering.

Complaints?

(Repost)

I have neighbors who are down south fighting fires. From what I've seen and heard, Southern Californians are to be commended for keeping it together during this tragedy. Hopefully the fires will be out soon and in the same spirit, the rebuilding of homes and lives will begin. Best of luck to you in that regard.

I think we are about to witness one of the greater match-ups in World Series history. Go Rockies!

The Kings of basketball are in SoCal tonight to whoop up on your big brothers. Go Kings!

Sonnybelfast

AK,

Thanks for the response. I really do think that this whole thing is unfair to the real fans... At one point do you as an organization or as a professional say look... we are going left or we are going right, without keeping everybody in the dark about the conscious state of the team? I am most certain that both parties know what is really going to happen at this point. But we never know the truth until something does or does not happen, in the meantime we hear Kobe calling bluff and Dr. Buss calling his bluff or is he bluffing or isn't he?! And all kinds of speculation in between. Dr. Buss coming out and saying he would trade kobe if the right deal comes along is not saying much at all. Either you ARE or you ARE NOT! I find it very difficult to believe that Kobe is being kept in the dark about his future and does not know if he will indeed remain a Laker... give me a break. Is he REALLY hoping to remain a Laker?
Yes, No? And is the FO REALLY hoping to trade him? Yes, No?
Forget for a minute what teams or what deals are possible, because the first thing i want to know is does Buss want him out? Yes or No? If he does then there will be a deal, and that deal may not be great but could be the only way to get rid of Kobe once and for all. And if he really does NOT want to trade Kobe then no deal will look good enough to trade him, we understand that but which is it already?
ARE THEY WORKING HARD TO FIND A GOOD DEAL, OR ARE THEY WORKING HARD TO KEEP HIM?

BK,

Sure - I'm worried that we start off 0-12 or something like that. But that prevents us from assuming that this is a 55-win team, and level-sets expectations (in my opinion). Plus, I'm kinda looking forward to the team collectively playing with a chip on it's shoulder.

The way I see it, we'll only have to beat out the Warriors, Kings, Grizzlies and Hornets to get to the 7th seed - which I think we are capable of. I honestly don't think we are good enough to rank higher in the seedings.

I'm hoping though, that we go into the playoffs with some momentum (which would imply we have 24 on the squad) and upset Phoenix. Nothing would give me more pleasure than sticking it to the Suns. I think that if we play them this year we kill them - they have no center andAmare/Marion will get beaten up all season playing out of position.

Hope springs eternal!

"Kwame has the makings of a Champion. Bynum has the makings of an All-Star."

Wow... wow. What a statement.

Hey Mike, do you think you might be able to swing a GM position in Sacramento? If you can get Petrie's job, then I'm sure Mitch would love to help out the Kings by trading Kwame to you... all he'd want in return would be that cancerous player Artest. Straight up.

(Repost)

Before perusing anything else, I went to "Lakers Team Coverage-Gallery" in the Times yesterday where "Kobe through the Years" was featured. This slide show struck me as the manner in which a news outlet would reminisce the departure of a local hero. If only for a "fleeting" moment, I thought that Jorenema had finally flushed the bilges and had cleared the impacted tube which had become the Laker organization in recent years, but alas, it was only a fart, and not the release of a big mamba.

With further reading of several entries on this board ("Throughout the summer, despite Kobe's tirades, he has consistently maintained that he wants to win rings with the Lakers") and then watching highlights from last nights game, something clearer than skies Hollywoodies can only dream about occurred to me.

Many of you must be into pain, lots of pain. I feel your pain.

I too, "have consistently maintained" that "I want" to be innocent.

Sonnybelfast

Laker_STH,

That video was enlightening. You could see Phil literally bite his lips when asked to comment about Bynum! When forced he mumbled something about his offense being great and how he had to make up on the defensive end in return for all the layups/dunks he was getting in the paint.

You could also see condescending Phil there for a minute. I'm sure MikeT will have a blast with that :)

AK/BK,
Thanks for cleaning up this blog !! As for our Lakers...one pre-season game left ( Friday) I'm hoping for at least 3 quarters of regulars playing to set the tone for the season. Here's how I hope the line-up goes:

Bryant
Farmar
Turiaf- for LO
Bynum
V/Rad

Any opinions ????

Hooray! I mean thanks for the memories KL. Haha, jk!

Hey a defensive thread...cool! To build on that, our so called brain isn't being used effectivelty. On some sets it's a matter of using your brain (opponent showing you one move, recognize and react!) But mostly it's a combination of a lack of effort and athleticism like BK said. There's a reason why in the majority of the games we won, we scored a ton of points...and in the games we lost we gave up a bunch.

Isn't that like the pot calling the kettle black? No one knows more about pain than a Kings fan...except a clippers fan. The pain of losing haha, jk Sonny.

AK,

You make a lot of sense with your take on the trade. I didn't look at it that way. Although I might have still made the deal considering we did take on kwame brown for the last three years who has given us almost nothing. I don't know, I am just frustrated the lakers don't make moves. I am not saying make moves to make moves but do something get creative improve the team in some way. I mean I like the laker team this year but I just don't see us doing to well this year. We are built on a lot of hope. Lamar we hope he stays healthy and has a all star season, sasha we hope he has turn the corner, vlade we hope he shoots well, kwame oh my god we hope he can get 10 points 8 rebounds. 10 points 8 rebounds for someone that big you have got to be kidding me. Andrew I see promise but we hope this is his break out season. Man please like I said I know kobe's approach was wrong this summer but something has got to be done.

Sonny,

You disappoint me - I thought you were priming us for the "Don't put your Angelino fart before the burrito" line :)

How are the Kings looking? Read somewhere that Miller is looking like the Miller of yore? Has Bibby missed a step? Which of your young'uns has taken the next step? Are you missing Price?

Gunner,

First of all I say never go backwards. But if you're going there try to be accurate so you don't hurt your credibility. Shaq was gone and there could not be any thing to be done about it. Call it his request for a 3 year 100 mil contract ext. playing center in a body that looked like of a tall defensive tackle with LEGS as fragile as a delicate flower for that WEIGHT, or Kobe not wanting to play with him, or him being ineffective on D with the west BIGS for the last 2 years of PLAYOFFS with Lakers, and really The BIG WEST starting to take a toll on his body, SHAQ HAD TO GO.

But that is by no means where the problems started. The problem started LONG BEFORE THAT. when JERRY WEST announced his departure from his beloved Lakers. after leading them combine for 7 championships in 12 NBA finals appearances in 20 years. MORE THAN HALF OF THE SEASONS THE WEST WAS A GM WE WENT TO THE FINALS (65% OF THE TIME THAT IS). BECAUSE Jerry Buss thought he was the one that did all that. brought in the DIESEL, made the 80's RUN happen (From the party room with girls?WOW) and he thought he traded an MJ like player for Vlad Divac. YES JBuss thought he did it (with all the DRINKING?) (Now he's going as far as thinking his BUM SON can do that.) Now we're here.

GUNNER-

THE LAKER TEAMS THAT JERRY WEST WAS THE GM OF MADE THE NBA FINALS SIXY FIVE PERCENT OF THE TIME. And then you say a Naggin FAT leaving the team was the DOOM of this Dynasty. WAKE UP PLAYA, WAKE UP.

Kobe has the makings of a true All-Star. Sasha has the makings of a champion.

Think about it, Kobe has to be surrounded by talent, or else he cannot win a title, but he'll be an all-star all day long.

Sasha on the other hand does a great job of keeping the end of the bench warm and he commands serious respect in practices while he's pushing the A squad to defend their hardest. Now all he needs to do is find a way onto a top tier team so that he can be a champion.

This is why we should keep Sasha... he's a future champion.

Sonny,

Something I was never clear on - do you hate on the Lakers (and by reflex support the Kings) because of Kobe? If we do trade #24, would you come back to the fold (assuming you were once part of it)?

Only reason I'm asking is because I need to start working on my silver linings for that inevitable day :)

hariyahu - PJ knows that confidence is a big issue with Bynum. He wants to remain positive with him and challenge him versus belittling him the way he does with guys like Vlad, Kwame and Sasha. He may be known for trying to motivate his players through the media but he knows his personnel and doesn't take a blanket approach with them. You don't hear him making fun of a guy like Ronny per se. When asked about him, he replied that Ronny starting has pretty much been a given. He needs Ronny to be a rock at that position (b/c that's where we have the least # of options) so he treats him like one. Boy, it's looking more and more like Mihm's going to have to get comfortable at PF doesn't it?

All the lip-biting is a pre-season thing. With every win those lips will become smiles. With every loss they'll become frowns and eventually harsh words of discontent.

I went to the game last night and it was a real sad sight..... cook needs to go now

AK, Hen,

Miami is real lucky they put that "Team Option" in Walker's contract two years from now.
Chances of it getting picked up? About as much as

A champion and an All-star that can't make a layup.

HaHa. Good one.

After that, we can elect players into the baseball allstar team who can't bat or pitch.

"Kwame's skill are perfect for a team that are in need of those skills to compete for a Championship."

That is absolutely correct. Can't possibly argue with it. Of course, you can plug any name into that statement, and it will be true.

"Ben Gordon's skills are perfect for a team that are in need of those skills to compete for a Championship."

"Tim Duncan's skills are perfect for a team that are in need of those skills to compete for a Championship."

"Sasha Vujacic's skills are perfect for a team that are in need of those skills to compete for a Championship."

A NOTE TO EVERYONE

We're not going to put through comments going off on KL, especially when he's not around and able to defend himself. Plus, we're looking to increase personal respect towards each other. The point of this decision wasn't to create opportunities to take shots at him. We were simply trying to solve an issue and let people know that we were taking a stance.

AK

Lakers_STH,

I hear you. At first I thought the same thing - he doesn't want the praise getting to Drew's head. But then he talked about how he needs to start contributing on the defensive end in return for all the freebies he was getting. I'm sure he's not happy with Drew on defense - he seemed to go out of his way to call that out.

I'm scared stiff about Ronny - he's our only real PF, and I hope he doesn't get into foul trouble - after him, the drop off is pretty steep.

Imagine what the scouting report for the Lakers would look like as things stand today?

Mihm - Attack him
Bynum - Attack him
Fisher - Go right by him - and if he flops (which he will), it's not you, it's your tail dust
Kwame - Make him shoot. And when he does, get out on the break as fast as you can - the ball will carrom off the board to the other half (bonus points if you convert)
Ronny - antagonize him - he'll foul out, which brings us to
RadMan - Go through him - but don't get distracted by the red thingy he waves around
Walton - Kill him
Cook - Even if he's nowhere near the basket, attack him - he'll prolly screen for you.
Odom - Don't go near him - he's not on the court.
Vujacic - Don't go near him - he shouldn't be on the court
Crittenton - You won't find him - he'll be in the NBDL

:(

AK, BK,

Looks like you skip the in posts?
My post should have read:

AK, Hen,

Miami is real lucky they put that "Team Option" in Walker's contract two years from now.
Chances of it getting picked up? About as much as
(Insert your joke here)

hariyahu,

Guess you have to find somewhere else to dump your biodegrable compost. The guys closed your dumpsite. LOL.

Kwame! Kwame! Kwame! Only championship center to play with the best player in the world (MJ) and his successor (KB) and still not get a ring. But hey, maybe its because they KB/MJ didn't pass him the ball enough.

A note to ET!!!

Please phone home from 'Pluto' and tell Kobe it is safe to return to Earth, Superman's father has returned to 'Krypton' and all is quiet on the western front 'The Big Guns' have gone silent. There is new law on this blog, they the mean brothers from out west. AK, BK are their names.

Remember, to respect each other and lets hope 'Kwame' catches a cold. This will hopefully help him catch a basketball, I forgot he is naturally immune to that!!! LOL

Aaarrrhhhh!!

Angry_Laker

I don't care what you pay me, I'm not pushin' that panic button!

p ang,

:) I'm going to respect AK's wishes and not add ethanol to the fire

Kwame can't catch a cold..
Kobe won't pass a (kidney) stone...

Who has smaller hands - Kwame or Spud Webb? Nothing wrong with Spud's catching skills.

The difference between All-Star talents and talents that are suited for Championship teams is a concept that I'm trying point out to the students of the game. Not smart alecs.

To the students of the game all you have to do is study the year the Pistons beat the Lakers. The Lakers during the off-season brang in Karl Malone and Gary Payton. Two career All-Stars. Those two were paired with a couple of other All-Stars, Shaq and Kobe.

Detroit hand them their butts on a platter in 5 games.

Oh, and that scrub Elden Campbell was on that Pistons team. If I remember correctly Campbell gave Shaq fits in that series. The Lakers got smothered by the Pistons defense.

The Pistons at that time had no All-Stars. A group of no All-Stars team beat a group that, going into the series, had 4 of them.

Robert Horry a 6 time Champion...how many All-Stars teams did he make?

I'm not sure but I think it was ZERO.

But he had an ingrediant to his game that was benificial for the teams he was playing for at the time.

Offense or defense...it doesn't matter as long as it what's the team needs.

Again, that's for STUDENTS OF THE GAME.

mike

Yeah, that's right. Elden Campbell is a CHAMPION!

mike

And Karl Malone is a champion...NOT!

mike

BK

Injuries are a huge piece of the puzzle but if you've ever (doubtful) been in an impossible job situation, or a project from hell with people who's faces can't register pleasantry, you know that mental state takes precedence.

The first unit's malaise is palpable. SOMETHING should be said, some AGREEMENT should be reached to move forward into the season. For the sake of the Laker fans, come to an understanding. We deserve better than a half hearted effort.

So, let me see... Elden Campbell is a champion. Yeah, he was on a championship team.

Karl Malone didn't win a championship (injured against the Pistons) but is one of the greatest PFs in the history of the NBA.

I guess I'd have to be a "student of the game" to see how that makes Campbell somehow a more valuable player under any imaginable circumstances.

mike

if the lakers win a championship with bynum on the team, wouldn't that make him a champion also?

your explaination just doesnt make any sense to me, but i somewhat agree. Although i know you have been a major kwame fan ever since he game beause of his defense and you tend to over estimate him, i agree. Kwame is a much better defender than bynum at this point, but i rather have bynum over kwame anyday. Bynum was, still is, and will be the piece we need to win a championship with this team. If bynum could dominate at his position theres no telling what this team coul do.

Well it doesn't surprise me the Lakers lost last night..the Jazz had it going on all night..especially when they were up by 20 after the 1st quarter. I just hope this doesn't become a trend going into the season. I understand Lamar isn't playing..but still everyone else is almost and still they stink..I really like Javaris..I don't understand why Phil doesn't start him. Last night I believe he made ALL 5 of his shots in the closing seconds..or minutes of the game. Either way I'm nervous and I will still be nervous when the season starts.

Mike

Tyron lue is a champion, does that make him more valuable than Arenas?

Man - when we land on a player we just don't get off their back.

Kwame Brown: I don't agree with Mike T. {that he is an integral part of a championship team} but he does make good points about his ability to fit into the current Laker team.

We do not need a scorer, period. What we need is a defensive presence and Kwame has shown an ability to expand his defensive game this preseason. He can also pass the rock. He is also a complete stone down in the middle and even Shaq isn't going to move him. We need these things. Yeah, we want someone to score too, but with what he brings, I will put up with his not scoring if he brings it every night. That is the true question about Kwame, not his scoring ability.

We all take Phil's words as gospel, but we conveniently forget that his specialty is mind games - with the FO as well as with his players. It would pay to read Lazenby's 'The Show' and keep an even keel about Phil Jackson. Do not give him a pass as he, most likely, has something to do with this current Laker situation. His history indicates that - even if it is just as an advisor to Kobe.

I think if Kwame's healthy he should be the starting C. When he plays well (his strengths outweigh his weaknesses) the Lakers are a decent team. He needs to gain some confidence. Bynum should still get lots of minutes.

We all take Phil's words as gospel, but we conveniently forget that his specialty is mind games - with the FO as well as with his players. It would pay to read Lazenby's 'The Show' and keep an even keel about Phil Jackson. Do not give him a pass as he, most likely, has something to do with this current Laker situation. His history indicates that - even if it is just as an advisor to Kobe.

Gk, do u talk from your a..
I think bynum cold get really good but right now he is a guy who has a body like shaq but wants to play like KG. It's not his fault his teacher is a very skinny powerless great center. I think it would be better if the lakers got somebody who knows more about banging in the post to teach bynum than someone who like to fallaway jumper and skyhooks. No disrispect to Kareem but that is a fact.
I think kwame should start for now and split the time at center with bynum, forget about mihm he could play when one of these guys gets injured.

Isn't it a little early to worry about who's a champion and who isn't? I'm more worried that we'll make the playoffs if the current malaise can't be overcome. The Lakers looked more like a door mat than a team on Tuesday night.

Every member of the team needs to bring their game on Friday night.

"Kwame Brown: I don't agree with Mike T. {that he is an integral part of a championship team} but he does make good points about his ability to fit into the current Laker team."

That's what I'm trying to say. If the Lakers with Kobe Bryant and most of this roster are to win a championship, Kwame Brown is an integral part of that plan. And not necessarily Andrew Bynum. That just seems to be above the thinking of some.

mike

Put Kwame Brown in the middle of the Phoenix defense and that's a done deal for a championship. The Suns would be able to move Amare to the 4 spot and have Kwame guard Tim Duncan. The Suns couldn't beat the Spurs because Amare couldn't handle Tim. The Suns had to resort to Kurt Thomas who they traded away. I guess it didn't work.

Put Kwame Brown in the middle of the San Antonio Spurs and they win more championships.

Put Kwame Brown in the middle of the Detriot Pistons defense and they are close, again. But they are slipping in other positions.

What Kwame Brown can do on defense is a main ingredient for any championship team. Not the main ingredient. But a main ingredient.

mike

That's just part of the game that just come along with just anyone. Getting someone to be able to protect the rim...people will pay for that. Especially if that team is close to winning a Championship.

Kwame Brown will be playing for championships in his career. If not for the Lakers then for someone else.

mike

Mike T,

Question: If Kwame is truly the champion you say he is, how do you explain that none of the other NBA teams seemed to want him during the off-season?

CORRECTION: IT SHOULD READ:

That's just part of the game that DOESN'T just come along with just anyone. Getting someone to be able to protect the rim...people will pay for that. Especially if that team is close to winning a Championship.

Kwame Brown will be playing for championships in his career. If not for the Lakers then for someone else.

mike

Rick,

Jerry Buss told you in his interview. Nobody was sure of Kwame and Odom because of their injuries.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/basketball/nba/lakers/la-sp-lakers11oct11,1,107242.story?page=2&coll=la-headlines-sports-nba-lakers

"We've got two or three players that people would like to have, but they want them giving us not comparable returns. I am aware of every single trade that he has tried to make. What we had to offer just wasn't sufficient for them.

"One of the big problems we had was that Kwame [Brown] and Lamar [Odom] were both injured at the end of the year so that nobody knew how they would come back. The other guy that was good was [Andrew] Bynum and nobody knew, 'How good is he?' Nobody knows yet, really."

That's Jerry Buss. Everything else you heard was pure rumor.

mike

We tried to trade Kwame to the Suns but they didnt want him.
We tried to trade Kwame to Denver but they didnt want him.
We tried to trade Kwame to Indy but they didnt want him.
We tried to trade Kwame to the Kings but they didnt want him.

Mike I guess their just are not many GMs out there that share enthusiasm for Kwawe. Hmmmm.

MH

Kwame is getting so much love and some hate, I guess he needs a break. This blog is populated by guys who don't know a thing about basketball the media says something nice about Bynum and everybody is repeating it over and over again, same for all the other players. I just thing that it is good that the lakers got Chris Mihm back because even though he is playing like crap I think we wouldn't have to worry about having a personnel problem for the center position. I just want to start a get rid of Brian Cook talk. I don't wanna say I hate the guy but I can't resist it. He has the worst atitude is the nba, just look at him after he commits a foul...Cook sucks!!!

"We tried to trade Kwame to the Suns but they didnt want him.
We tried to trade Kwame to Denver but they didnt want him.
We tried to trade Kwame to Indy but they didnt want him.
We tried to trade Kwame to the Kings but they didnt want him."

ALL RUMORS...

mike

When you say things like that you never consider the media spin. Why wouldn't the Suns want someone who can guard Tim Duncan. The deal we heard was Kwame for Marion. Maybe it was the Lakers who rejected that deal. Why would we want Marion when we have Odom, Walton, and Rad just to throw in Marion in the mix, too? And Phoenix would have recieved someone who can guard Tim Duncan? Tim Duncan who stands in the way of Phoenix winning a championship.

As I said before...if it doesn't add up...it just isn't true. I wouldn't be surprise if the Lakers refused a Kwame for Marion deal. Add the media spin before you conclude on a RUMOR. Especially if the rumor came from Arizona, which I think it did. As the rumor the Nuggets rejected a Camby for Kwame deal. That RUMOR came from Denver. It's possible the Lakers rejected those two RUMORED deals and the GM's of those teams spun it in the media to say they reject the Lakers offer.

Man, there's so much spin in this game you have use your logic to make sense of it. The Suns with Kwame to guard Tim Duncan at the expense of Marion? All the Suns would have to do is move Amare to the 4 spot and they cover what Marion brought to the 4 spot and gain Kwame in the 5 spot what Amare couldn't do. Guard Tim. That's logic and not spin.

mike

Ak and Bk and everybody else,

You have to fill me in on whats going on with Kl and Gunner. What happened? I am glad they are gone, this blog seems more like the way it used to be. People just talking, I like that.

If there's someone who looks like they're on steriods or has done steriods it's Kevin Youkilis of the Boston Red Sox. Just because he doesn't hit homers doesn't mean he didn't use.

mike

My eyes have been opened!

Wow, absolutely amazing. If Kobe is to win a title, we MUST have Kwame at center. You cannot have an All-Star center paired up with Kobe if you ever expect to win an NBA title.

That's mind blowing. Thank you, I see it now. I've been way off and you just woke me up out of a daydream...

Also...
Robert Horry = Kwame Brown

I never saw the connection. But now I see it!

I vote to have Kwame enter the hall of fame, simply because he's such a clutch player in the playoffs throughout his career. A TRUE champion.

Kwame! Kwame! Kwame!

Oh... let me catch my breath...

nope, ROTFLOL...

breathe.... breathe... okay, I'm back.

This is great. One of the great days in blog history. I've rarely laughed this hard.

Thank you so much, fatty award winner Michael T. Great work with the comedic relief.

Kwame! Kwame! Kwame!

Dang, sure would love to have him in a Kings uniform.

wow-

It's in this morning's Extra! post.

BK

Mike T.,

"Kwame Brown will be playing for championships in his career. If not for the Lakers then for someone else."

Which Championship, is it the cake throwing contest or a video game? LOL! He's not even sure if he's employable by 2008-09 season. Also you said that he's a Duncan stopper, c'mon do you really believe on that he can stop Duncan in 4 consecutive games? U really find something amazing with Kwame that we don't see.

"If the Lakers with Kobe Bryant and most of this roster are to win a championship"

That no longer appears to be the agenda, if it was they wouldn't be taking "trade Kobe" calls.

Kwame frustrates the hell out of me. He's the most physically gifted big goin' but he needs to be re wired. He's a combo platter of size and speed. Anyone he was in the game, Boozer was nuetralized.

Postulating about Kwame and Laker championships is probably not a water cooler concept in the sporting world. When it's lookin' more like the next Laker championship might have a roster of players that aren't even born yet, we're talkin' Kwame hoistin' the Larry O'B. Wonder what his ring size is?

i would hit the panic button..... this team looks real bad.

bob-

I don't think I'd hit it... but I will take every opportunity to drop a fun jpeg into a post (haha). Actually, I think that's an encore appearance for "Panic Button jpeg." He's been here before.

BK

Like I have said since last May - this is a train wreck. It pains me, I'm not a cynic or pesimist by nature, really, I'm not, but this is going to be bad. You can lay this at the door step of our FO. No Jason Kidd, no JO, we never really had a shot at KG - so I won't even count that. Rather, we have LO on the DL, Mihm with a chronic bad wheel, Kwame with chronically bad everything, a disenfranchised KB, and Bynum - who can't even beat out Kwame for the starting spot, that speaks volumes. All of this by choice. I've been robbed of one of my greatest joys in sports, and that is Laker basketball - please Jerry Buss, sell this team to someone who gives a damn.

I was in favor of the Kwame trade - I thought (and still think) that it was a reasonable gamble - the Lakers needed big men, not soon to be free agent small forwards who don't play good defense. And Kwame does have some skills - he's good (not great) at man to man defense. But that does not make him a great defensive player - since great defensive big men actually gather up rebounds at a well above average clip - not average to below average. And they block shots well too.

He's a useful player - but one who is a free agent after this season, and who may have the most value to the Lakers as a trade chit, since his contract is expiring.

Bynum, for all his flaws, is better than Kwame was after two years in the league (and Kwame was older). It's silly to think that Bynum won't improve any. And frankly, it won't take that much improvement to make Bynum overall better than Kwame. He still has much to learn - but it amazes me that anybody who follows the NBA could think it unlikely that Bynum will soon be MUCH better than Kwame, given how Kwame has consistently underperformed. I mean, it's not like Kwame was a defensive marvel after two seasons - he was berated for his cluelessness all around in that period. Why can't Bynum also show the improvement that Kwame showed at a similar age?

NBA promos are crowning the Celtics already.

That non trade was our season flashing before our eyes.
Can anyone remember the last time the Lakers went hard for a high profile trade (meaning a difference maker) and didn't get it?

Thompson, Shaq, McAdoo, Wilt all went the way of the Laker.

It's like Game said:

"...This blog is populated by guys who don't know a thing about basketball the media says something nice about Bynum and everybody is repeating it over and over again..."

You guys know nothing of basketball. If you did you would see what Kwame does on the defensive end of the game and how important it is. It's a team sport and it take a few ingredients other than scoring to win championships.

mike

Mike T,

I agree with your assessment that Kwame plays better D than Bynum. Kwame has little touch on the offensive end which relegates him to using the body to play defense. By default, Kwame has had to use his size to remain on the team. After gambling on Brown, the Lakers immediately went for a young backup.

While I understand what you are saying with Kwame's "champion" ability, I don't agree on your A.C. Green comparison. While A.C. may have been a the only "champion" on a championship team, Kwame is strugging for a starting role on a .500 team. A.C. was an intregal part, as was Horry. Bob spread the defense from Shaq and could hit the 3 ball. Kwame demands no respect. What you describe as finding the right team is almost spiritual - or destiny - or luck.

You passion for Kwame is well documented, yet you despise Phil Jackson for winning. For your sake, I hope Kwame becomes a better coach than player.

"You can lay this at the door step of our FO. No Jason Kidd, no JO,"

I'm not convinced that Kidd is a difference maker for the current team - especially once you factor in the salaries that would have gone the other way to balance the trade. JO would have cost Lamar (who when healthy is good, and who wouldn't be accepted if the physical said he wasn't healthy), Bynum, and someone else (to balance out the salaries). Do you really think that Kobe, JO, and the rest of the Lakers (minus Lamar, Bynum, and whatever else was traded) would be a contender? I don't. Trading someone who might be excellent for enough help to still lose in the first round is a sucker's bet.

And, as others have pointed out, should the Lakers trade promising young players for help for Kobe (likely insufficient to get far in the playoffs) with Kobe holding firm on his trade demands? Because if the Lakers traded their young players for declining vets, and Kobe still opted out, I guarantee that most of the posters calling for trades would end up blasting the Lakers for making those trades.

Green was excellent man to man, could rebound well at both ends of the court, and blew away most power forwards at running the fast break, creating great advantages for the Lakers at times. He wasn't great offensively, but he had decent value because of that to the showtime Lakers - who also had very good scoring from the other four positions. Kwame is good man to man. That's his comparison to Green. Maybe he can take a step forward, and have another plus skill or two. Until he does, he shouldn't be compared to AC Green. And frankly, it's insulting for someone to say that others don't know anything about basketball if we don't worship Kwame, when Kwame just hasn't been a good overall basketball player. Let him show excellent overall defense, or show a balanced skillset, then we can talk.

I didn't compare Kwame to A.C. Green. I said A.C. Green, if you followed his career wasn't a real All-Star but he made the team one year...I think it was because of the Lakers winning. Like of like a reward.

My point is that A.C. Green had a certain ingredient that fit well with those championship years.

My point was that there's a difference between All-Stars and Champions.

Caron Butler is an All-Star but will never win a championship in Washington.

Neither will Arenas or Jamison.

Jason Kidd is an All-Star as is Richard Jefferson and Vince Carter....All-Stars...all of them. But they will never win a championship because they're All-Stars without the other ingredients they need to win it all.

Championship are won with a balance of a couple of All-Stars and the rest having the ingredients to win it all. If you don't believe ask Karl Malone.

mike

>>>Andrew Bynum has all the makings of a future All-Star. But Kwame Brown has all the makings of a future Champion.

ROTFL.

Champion of the busts maybe.

Am I the only person who thinks the Lakers will do FAIRLY well? They basically have the same team as last year, just with a years worth of more experience. The one fairly major change is a pretty big upgrade. Not to bash on Smush since he made some big shots for us, but Derek Fisher is a pretty big upgrade in that department. (Smush never made a shot with .04 remaining.) Granted we do have a tough early schedule, but a lot of players are hurt anyway. Might as well get the tough part out of the way, and by the time the players are healthy, they'll have had time to gel and start winning some games against easier teams, and gain some momentum. Well that's what I think. Around 50 wins! Woo!

I think our mgmt could have traded blount and r davis for a first round pick and kwame. As much as I cant stand kwame, he has a better contract than A walker and r davis could play alongside kobe if we went small now and then. Blount is at least an improvement over kwame in ball handling and maturity.

GM poll: Bryant was chosen the player that forces opposing coaches to make the most adjustments, 3rd in MVP, 1st in the guy to take the last shot and 2nd best on ball defender.

Trade him? Because the owner is mopey? Pampered basketball superstars can be mopey, owners should just go buy things and leave the basketball decisions to the basketball professionals.

maleke,

>>>After gambling on Brown, the Lakers immediately went for a young backup.

You've got that backwards. The Lakers drafted Bynum before they traded for Kwame.

"My point is that A.C. Green had a certain ingredient that fit well with those championship years."

Yes. He was an overall good player - significantly better than Kwame is at defense, with some offensive value also.

Kwame on a team with Kobe, a couple of all star caliber players, and several other decent players for depth could win a championship. But then, let Bynum keep on developing (and Bynum after two years is better than Kwame was after two years) and such a team would be MORE likely to win a championship.

I'm not saying that Kwame isn't a useful player, in the right situation. I AM saying that Kwame is not so skilled at his defense that it makes him a player likely to be important to a championship caliber team. After six years in the league, he has shown himself to be a guy who MIGHT be a component on a very good team - but then, numerous other players could be such components. He has shown nothing to allow himself to be compared to players such as Robert Horry - who actually performed better in key situations than during the regular seasons.

If the Lakers were poised to win it all this season, with just a break or two, I could understand favoring Kwame over Bynum. But they aren't. With a break or two the Lakers will make the playoffs, maybe even be the seventh seed. So favoring a guy who has never actually been a good overall player after six seasons, over a kid who has outperformed Kwame relative to age, doesn't make sense. If Bynum just shows a bit of improvement over each of the next four seasons, then he will blow Kwame away. I mean, it's not like Kwame was known for his defense after two years in the league - he was pretty much considered a bust by all observers. Why shouldn't Bynum get an opportunity to improve? After all, he showed more willingness to work hard this offseason than Kwame has EVER shown.

"Trade him? Because the owner is mopey? Pampered basketball superstars can be mopey, owners should just go buy things and leave the basketball decisions to the basketball professionals. "

No, trade him because he has said - repeatedly - that he will opt out if not traded to a situation of his liking.

The last real chance to please Kobe passed when McHale decided to trade Garnett to his old team, rather than take the Laker's offer (which involved the Lakers' two best trade chits not named Kobe). The other trade options at best marginally improved the team, while limiting the Lakers' options and future if Kobe wasn't satisfied.

A trade that would make sense talent and money wise!!!!!

Indiana would get:

Lamar Odom: Gifted all around talent but injury prone. Salary: $13,524,000.

Kwame Brown: Great size for post defender/rebounding w/ one year left on contact. Salary: $9,075,000.

Jordan Farmar: Young w/ potential to be a pretty good NBA guard. Improves every year. Salary: $1,009,560.

Lakers would get:

Jermaine Oneal: One of the top 5 PF's in game. Been injured latey but it's because his back was sore carrying the Pacers for the past 3years. Salary: $19,710,000.

Mike Dunleavy: streaky shooter, was former 1st round pick. still young w/ room to grow. Salary: $8,219,008

Give up salaries:

Lakers: $23,608,560 if give up 1st 08' 1st rounder +3mil = $26,608,560

Indiana: $27,839,008

Diff: +$1,230,448
-$ 1,198,560

Laker starting Lineup:
pg- Fisher..... Jarvis can be decent backup
sg- Kobe.....Evans or Sasha ar backups
sf- Luke.....w/ Rad and Dunleavy make team w/ one of the top SF tandems
pf- O'neal.....Turiaf is best energy guy on team. Rad can play some here.
c- Bynum.....Mihm will back up and O'neal may play here a lot also. Bynum may not be ready to start.

Pacer starting lineup:
pg- Tinsley.....nice backup in Farmar
sg- Daniels.....Granger can play some sg
sf- Granger.....or Odom can start there
pf- Odom.....Murphy or Brown can start here too
c- Brown.....Foster

Sounds like the best deal for both sides. Try tell Bird this one Mitch... Please!!!!

akrasian: "No, trade him because he has said - repeatedly - that he will opt out if not traded to a situation of his liking."

If Kobe opts out, what are his options? As a free agent, if he wants to play for a championship calibre squad he'll have to take the MLE - unless he contacts a team early so that they can free up cap space the preceding season by the trading deadline.

If the front office trades him, they'll more than likely have to take something bad to get what they want. Ex - to get JO, Indy would say the deal has to include someone like Troy Murphy. More cap hell. It's like being in over your head in debt. You feel paralyzed and powerless to improve your situation. Doing a deal like that would be like transferring the balance from one card to another card - does it ever solve your problem? No. It just allows you to get by. The front office needs to extricate the bad contracts and build this team back up in a much smarter way. As a season ticket holder, I'd endure some real rebuilding years if I could see that the team has some real direction and a smart strategy. What have we had to endure anyway these past 3 seasons? I wasn't a big fan of Dominique Wilkins as a kid - these Lakers squads are like those old Hawks teams. In the absence of real progress, the "highlights" get old after awhile.

Mike T.,

I get what you're saying...and I agree with your assessment on Kwame's defense...I sure hope we improves on the offensive end so he'll be more effective role player...

Mike T,

>>>You guys know nothing of basketball. If you did you would see what Kwame does on the defensive
>>>end of the game and how important it is. It's a team sport and it take a few ingredients other than
>>>scoring to win championships.

Kwame can hold position because he's big and strong. So Duncan can't push him right under the
basket and score. That is a good talent.

But with a lifetime average of 5.7 rebounds a game, you have to admit Kwame is a poor rebounder for
his size. If he was a guard, that would be a nice number. For a 6-11 Center, that's only getting the balls
that come directly to you without you having to actually put in any effort.

And 1.2 blocks per game is about average for a center with his size - not completely terrible, but not
great.

Being a good defensive center is a combination of those things. Doing only one of them well doesn't
make you a great center. Kwame is not Ben Wallace. In his career, Wallace averages 10.7 rebounds
(a good but not great number) and 2.27 blocks in addition to being able to body someone up. That's
why Ben Wallace is a great center and why people excuse that he sucks like a Hoover on offense.
Kwame's defense isn't good enough to make up for his offense.

And you're whole thing about Detroit vs LA. finals thing is ridiculous. First of all you claim the Pistons
had no all-stars. Let's just look at the all-star weekend for 2004, shall we?

Tayshaun Prince played on the Sophomore team
Chauncey Billups competed in the "Shooting Stars" event, as well as the 3-point shootout
Ben Wallace STARTED for the East team.

And Rasheed Wallace was also a two-time all-star (2000, 2001) before the 2004 playoffs.

And of course, in 2006 four of the five starters from Detroit made the all-star team.

So at this point, the tally would be 4 all-stars to 4 all-stars. Except for the fact that Gary Payton was
so over the hill as to be almost useless and Karl Malone was injured in the Western Conference Finals
and barely limped his way through the Detroit series.

So let's tally these up - Payton and Malone each count for 1/2 of an all-star because that's how
much they gave.

So considering only the past, the Lakers had 3 all-stars (1+1+.5+.5), while the Pistons had 2.

Considering past-present-future all-stars, it's 4-3 in Detroit's favor (taking the slowness & injury of
Payton and Malone into account).

Do you honestly think if the Lakers had had Payton and Malone playing at even 75% of their prime skill
level that the Pistons would have won even 1 game?

Kwame is not Ben Wallace and never will be.
Kwame isn't even as good as Elden Campbell, because he was as good a defender as Kwame and had some offense.
If you replace Ben Wallace on the 2004 Pistons teams with Kwame, the Lakers win the series.
The only way Kwame will win a championship is on a team where there are at least 3 other all-stars to carry the load.
And probably only as a backup center then.

KL retired? Gunner gone?

Hmmm... The blog seems so peaceful. Back to the good ole days of arguing over Kwame Brown and Andrew Bynum! ... lol

I might start posting here again once I see if the climate's legit.

AK/BK,
thanks for taking a stand.

The blog got so ridiculous that many regulars (like myself) had to just back off for awhile!

I actually predicted (though not in public) that if KL left -- or was banned -- Gunner would beat a quick retreat. Gunner was number 2 in a tag team that thrived on a slightly sadistic style of meanness. And when he wasn’t an active tag-team member he was KL’s cheerleader, so it’s natural that when one goes the other bows out.

But this whole thing leaves me sad because I always have the hope that antagonistic situations can be resolved without radical solutions such as excommunication or caving on one side or the other. KL in particular injected a healthy tension into the blog, but his maniacal manner first of all diminished his credibility and finally led to his exclusion. It really did seem that he was on a pathologically self-destructive path.

The blog will be better off with the “open the floodgates” tactics of KL, but it will be poorer for want of his provocation. KL has always been a notch above Steven in the same genre and his Jeckyll and Hyde game was actually quite interesting to follow, breaking the very monotony he created with his multitudinous repetitious ravings about Good (Shaq) vs. Evil (Kobe).

I for one don’t say good riddance to either of them. But I am looking forward to blog discussions that allow us to explore the subtleties of the complex season ahead of us and move away from the eternal return to a single obsessive question. I believe that if we can weather the first couple of months at around .500, Kobe will be here until the end of the season at least and that there will plenty of interesting plotlines to follow and speculate on. Most bloggers seem to love to speculate, so being liberating from the logic of “who’s to blame for what happened in ‘04” should in itself be an exhilarating experience.

Plus the quite possibly shared mediocrity of the Lakers and Kings should bring SonnyBelfast and his singular wit back into the game playing major minutes. I’m not predicting mediocrity for the Lakers, but I’m resigned to the possibility. And I know that whatever happens over the next couple of months – surprising success, mediocrity, failure – some major drama will take place during the season at least in the relationships between personalities (2007/8 personalities, not 2004 ones) and that will keep the virtual ink flowing on the blog. The Lakers are built for drama. Let’s hope that at some point the drama provokes a taste for winning and the requisite decisions. Then we’ll be able to reassess the roles of those who contributed to the drama.

If KL is reading the blog, let him know that many of us shed a tear and wish him well even if we think that he got what he bargained for.

in the absence of red bull. . coke or sprite??

this question would have deeper meaning if i were to call LO the red bull. . luke the coke. . and vlad the sprite

but in reality i'm just thirsty

BK, I think your analysis of the Lakers is very similiar to mine. Health is this teams biggest concern. The Kobe issue aside, the team has some talent, but they need to be healthy to have a shot the Pacific. Maybe this year will be the opposite of last year. Start slowly, Finish strong

Now here is my 2007-2008 opening day lineup based on Pre-season play:

PG Farmar (This guy has handles like an allstar) /Fisher (defense, clutch shooter, leadership)
SG Kobe (He needs to penetrate the lane as soon as he touches the ball, or give up the ball)
SF Cook (He is one of the best shooting big men in the NBA)
PF Turiaf (rebounding, energy)
C Bynum (the guy can score, plus he has great size)

I really don't think Kobe should be a play maker. The team loses its edge when he starts dribbling too much. He makes bad decisions, creates too many turnovers. Kobe needs to penetrate first if he could, Shoot if he is open, or give up the ball immediately so the offense can run. I really hate when he dribbles for 10 seconds and then lobs up an 18 footer. Lakers have much better shooters on the team (Fisher, Cook, Sasha, Radmonovich) if they want to settle for 18 footers

peace.

Hari, have you been paying attention? Amare and Marion have been playing those positions for three years now - the years they keep making all-star teams. They were playing those positions when they killed us in the playoffs last year. Styles make fights, they say, and Phoenix is literally the last team I want to play. We can't stop them form scoring, and all they do is score. What about this is it you're looking forward to?

Bynum has the makings of an all-star, Kwame the makings of a champion...that's pretty funny. I guess Phil is holding Kwame back, right?

Or, perhaps, Andrew has more talent