Down goes Uruguay

Unlike many on this blog, I hope the superstars on the US national team don't let the exceptional game of one goad the rest into an "anything you can do, I can do better" mentality. I would file that kind of thing under "self-defeating."

Great to see positive things said about Kobe coming from USA Basketball coach K, Chauncey Billups, and Jerry Colangelo after this summer's media crucifixion. But alas, the haters just don't and can't get it.

Well, I wasn't able to stick around yesterday, but it seems like we have a clear divide concerning a trade scenario between the Lakers and Wolves.

I think that it is just semantics to argue over which players the Lakers offer at this point. As Gino said, the basic idea is the same whether we are offering Crittenton or Farmar. In watching summer leage, Crittenton appeared to be the better option because of his size, perimeter shooting and control of the offense. Although Farmar has more experience including a season in the pros, his size is someting that can never be changed. Phil likes big guards for a reason....defensive flexibility and ability to see over the defense on offense. Farmar will never provide that for the Lakers.

Furthermore, the real true divide comes down to salary cap/financial issues. I am not surprised that Ex is leading the charge against this trade. He totally ripped up JJ for suggesting this same basic trade weeks ago. He had the same reason then. My question to Ex and those in his camp is this: Are the Lakers assured of anything positive if they don't do this trade? According to reports they had a plan a few years ago of leaving capspace in order to sign a guy like Amare or LeBron when their contract was up. Well all of the players they wanted resigned with their teams. How do we know that if we leave capspace someone good will want to sign in LA now? Chicago has tried to do that a few times since Jordan retired and the biggest free agent they have signed is Ben Wallace. Is it really worth it?

I contend that the Lakers are best served to add a few pieces around Kobe that actually can fill some voided areas. You mention Kwame, Vlade, Luke and Fisher as reasons why the lakers should not give any more money...stating that they have already overspent for those players. WELL, none of those players provides the offensive or defensive impact that Ricky Davis has each season of his career. He would be All-Star level if his attitude had been better at any of the first couple teams. Juwan Howard has been consistent each season in the league and is an all around quality teammate. For those that keep saying Howard is washed up, i want to know when it happened? I look at his numbers from last season and I don't see a washed up player. I watched several of those games including ones where Ming was injured and Howard stepped up very strong. Did he become washed up over the summer? When did his game fall into the garbage?

It is crazy how some of you can be so critical of some players that the league actually values. I have lost count of the number of guys that several of you have been totally against the Lakers looking at getting this summer that other teams are going after hard.

Well, I wasn't able to stick around yesterday, but it seems like we have a clear divide concerning a trade scenario between the Lakers and Wolves.

I think that it is just semantics to argue over which players the Lakers offer at this point. As Gino said, the basic idea is the same whether we are offering Crittenton or Farmar. In watching summer leage, Crittenton appeared to be the better option because of his size, perimeter shooting and control of the offense. Although Farmar has more experience including a season in the pros, his size is someting that can never be changed. Phil likes big guards for a reason....defensive flexibility and ability to see over the defense on offense. Farmar will never provide that for the Lakers.

Furthermore, the real true divide comes down to salary cap/financial issues. I am not surprised that Ex is leading the charge against this trade. He totally ripped up JJ for suggesting this same basic trade weeks ago. He had the same reason then. My question to Ex and those in his camp is this: Are the Lakers assured of anything positive if they don't do this trade? According to reports they had a plan a few years ago of leaving capspace in order to sign a guy like Amare or LeBron when their contract was up. Well all of the players they wanted resigned with their teams. How do we know that if we leave capspace someone good will want to sign in LA now? Chicago has tried to do that a few times since Jordan retired and the biggest free agent they have signed is Ben Wallace. Is it really worth it?

I contend that the Lakers are best served to add a few pieces around Kobe that actually can fill some voided areas. You mention Kwame, Vlade, Luke and Fisher as reasons why the lakers should not give any more money...stating that they have already overspent for those players. WELL, none of those players provides the offensive or defensive impact that Ricky Davis has each season of his career. He would be All-Star level if his attitude had been better at any of the first couple teams. Juwan Howard has been consistent each season in the league and is an all around quality teammate. For those that keep saying Howard is washed up, i want to know when it happened? I look at his numbers from last season and I don't see a washed up player. I watched several of those games including ones where Ming was injured and Howard stepped up very strong. Did he become washed up over the summer? When did his game fall into the garbage?

It is crazy how some of you can be so critical of some players that the league actually values. I have lost count of the number of guys that several of you have been totally against the Lakers looking at getting this summer that other teams are going after hard.

ATTENTION BLOGGERS : TODAY (AUGUST 30, 2007) IS DEDICATED TO ANGRY LAKER
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
PAST HONOREES: MIKE TENIENTE, EDWIN GUECO, KLBEAST, GENERIC_ONE, A.K. J.J.,
LAKER TOM, SONNY BELFAST, JOREMA, TALIQ, DAVID WHANG, THA SHOW, FAITH
RICK FRIEDMAN, HOBBITMAGE, FATTY, KOBE APOLOGIST
NEXT HONOREE (?)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Has any one ever repeated gossip to you that you knew was a lie? Has anyone spread
vicious rumours that cried out to be rectified? Have you ever seen injustice that cried out
to be righted? If so what have you done about it? Did you just shrug your shoulders and say
"Thats a shame" Or did you get angry and say IM AS MAD AS HELL AND IM NOT GOING TO
TAKE THIS ANY MORE? Well todays honoree observes injustices and gets angry.
If its social injustices he gets angry and takes whatever action is needed in the medium that it
occurs in, but since this is a Lakers Blog, todays nominee gets angry and seeks to rectify the
situation with his post. I say all of this as a long way of introducing todays guest,
ANGRY LAKER. GRRRR! Yesterday we had another person who sought to set the record
straight and make the playing field level in Kobe Apologist and I would say Angry Laker is cut
from much the same cloth. Days can go by and you never hear from Angry but after repeated
BS printed day after day Angry feels compeled to come on and set the record straight.
Be it demystifying the almighty MJ, or blasting the Busses for letting another free agent get
away. Be it one note sambas sung against Kobe by KL to putting garbage on display and
expecting it to sell. GRRR I'm getting mad myself just thinking about these things. Angrys
trademark GRRR and name may be unique but Angrys reason for being is as old as time.
One sees a wrong and tries to right it. Is that so hard to understand. Angry Laker I never
met you but I feel like we are kin. So for your tireless fight against injustice today
August 30, 2007 is dedicated to you. The Blog and the world are a better place for
your being and we thank you for all you have given. Enjoy your day my friend and
Stay Angry. GRRRRR!!
--- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
******* EDITORIAL COMMENT ******* Because some may see this as being a
pro Kobe bandwagon tommorow our honoree will be ANDREW Z and next week GUNNER
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
*** BACK BY POPULAR DEMAND *****
Get it done Mitch, get it done fast
The Free Agents are fading,
Dont end up picking last
Get it done Mitch, Get it done not just for us
Get it done Mitch
Youre running out of trust
Get it done Mitch, Im not taking sides
Get it done Mitch
Damn, have you no pride
You Once played with legends, Like Kareem and Magic
Now Jim Buss gives you orders
Man thats so damn tragic
Get it done Mitch, This is our last cry
If you dont get it done Mitch
Not only Kobe will be saying goodbye
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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(6) David Whang (7) BD (8) Dan Dan the Laker Fan (9) Long Time Laker Fan
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,Ghost of Spiderman, Steve in Denver Guy Owanlele, Lincoln Laker, Houston Laker
MITCH KUPCHAK, JERRY BUSS, PHIL JACKSON, KOBE BRYANT, CLEON
Marc Gasol, Sun Yue, Shamond, Williams, Ronny Turiaf, V. Radmanovic,
Maurice Evans, Lamar Odom, Derek Fisher, Luke Walton, Brian Cook,
Kwame Brown, Andrew Bynum, Coby Karl, Chris Mihm, Sasha Vujacic
Jordan Farmar, Jarvis Critterton, JERMAINE ONEAL???, FAITH

ALL TOGETHER NOW:
WE ARE THE FREAKIN LA LAKERS THE WINNERS OF 14 NBA TITLES
THE HOME OF WILT, KAREEM, GEORGE MIKAN, SHAQ, MAGIC, KOBE,
ELGIN BAYLOR, JERRY WEST, PAT RILEY, JAMES WORTHY, SILK
COACHED BY THE 9 TIME TITLE WINNER PHIL (9RINGS) JACKSON ANDAND
NO ONE AND NOTHING WILL EVER DIVIDE OR CONQUER

The D,

Just for reference sake, who exactly is desiring the others to try to outdo the performance by LeBron from last night? Based on your message it sounds like you have read where someone wants him to be topped?

LeBron's game was "Kobe-esque".

That's when you perform so well, you COULD have broken records (all time international USA scoring record), but your team dominated so much due to your performance that you didn't have to!

BK,

It seems with age you've learned that clever little language we like to call, sarcasm. haha

Andrew Z,

No offense but I must say that I am quite surprised that you thought the whole Minny deal was well thought out and well put together. I recall you cutting up JJ pretty strong for suggesting the same trade on here a few weeks ago. All I did was repeat the same trade he had listed since Howard is now requesting a trade and the team is now in agreement. I expected you to cut this trade to pieces.

First of all sorry for my bad english.
You are talking about THE SAME URUGUAY with only 3 million people, the same Uruguay with 2 football world championships, the same Uruguay with 2 Football Gold Medals making us the 2nd most succsessfull winning country in the world in football after only Brazil.
The same Uruguay were I was born and actually live I am a Lakers and Kobe fan.
The same Uruguay that is not so good in basket ball as in football but we are 3rd in South america (Argentina-Brazil), and we have won many SothAmerican championships in the past (more than Brazil), and we have a Silver Medal in the Olympics 1958, and 6th in the Olympics in LA, and 3rd in South America is not so bad for a country with 3 millions were football is the number one game by far.
For us being 6th in this championship is quite good, we had a chance to finish 5ths which was our maximum goal but we lost that chance with Venezuela to whom we usually beat, on the other hand we beat Mexico and Puerto Rico which are much stronger than us so we are quite proud of what our guys did (I am assuming we are gfoing to loose today with Brazil, but if we made a miracle and won, we would be 5th) you have to look at our Rooster and we have only one NBA player (Batista) who barely plays, and only one in Europe in a mediocre team which is Mazzarino. We have problems finding guys in the 2 metres and that know how to play. That is why it is nearly a miracle to us to beat stronger teams as Puerto Rico and Mexico, and because of that we are quite proud of our basketball team.

Well I ALWAYS READ THIS BLOG because of Kobe and the Lakers, I never right because my english is not very good.
Keep the good work, and GO KOBE and the Lakers.
I am optimistic and think that next year that we will be a better team than last year, I think we would be 4th or 5ths in the west, and maybe win the first series.
I also think that with Bynum and the other youngsters with one more year and may be one good trade we can get the ring in 2 more years.
I would love to have Jason Kidd with the Lakers (seems impossible now), and I would never give Odom for O'Neil, I think that would end being a very bad move, I'd prefer to stay just as we are now, may be give Cookie and Sasha and Brown for one good shooter if it is possible.
Ricardo

The US team should be fine as long as they play tough D tonight. Kobe will come out to kill tonight. Carmelo will continue to be open...by the way, why doesn't anyone take him seriously and play some D on him?...I guess he is the lesser of 12 evils.

FIRE KUPCHAK ALREADY.

The D

"Unlike many on this blog, I hope the superstars on the US national team don't let the exceptional game of one goad the rest into an "anything you can do, I can do better" mentality. I would file that kind of thing under "self-defeating."

in the spirit of kobe bashing, isn't it already happening? i see kobe forcing several shots (Walton Sr. calling them out too) and Team USA is destroying the competition. Wait until the real competition begins, then "kobe ball" will work its way into the game with or without Coach K's approval.

tHE D
"I hope the superstars on the US national team don't let the
exceptional game of one goad the rest into an "anything you
can do, I can do better" mentality. I would file that kind of
thing under "self-defeating."

Sounds good to me D,

One often-overlooked fact about Uruguay is that it is the second least corrupt country in Latin America (after Chile) [according to the rarely inaccurate wikipedia]. Does this mean that when the refs aren't paid off Lebron is free to have a perfect game?

USA!!! LBJ 11-11! Down goes Argetina!

Anaheim Ducks World Champions
Anaheim Angels World Champions
Los Angeles Lakers World Champions--Kobe MVP---Bynum is Godzilla!!!!

I could dream all day in this Africa heat. I think I will go back to dreaming Critt being named ROY and Maloof sending Artest over for Kwame...

bd

I'm bummed that LoLo closed his blog. I was looking forward to it when the season started.

LoLo, if you're reading this, thanks for the hard work and hopefully you post here sometimes.

ricpir,
"You are talking about THE SAME URUGUAY "
WELCOME ABOARD RICPIR WE CAN ALWAYS USE
ANOTHER KOBE FAN GOOD TO MEET YOU

ricpir-

No doubt Uruguay is a fine and beautiful country that would likely kick our ass in soccer, and, assuming I remember correctly from my rugby days, rugby as well. (It's still pretty big in South America, right?) Probably a bunch of other stuff, too. But what Uruguay isn't is a basketball power, so I can't get too excited about the win. The best NBA players should beat the national team from Uruguay. By a lot. Granted, I'm not all that into this particular tournament as it is, but some of the overly fawning media coverage of it I find a little goofy. Certainly no offense intended.

Jman-

Sorry you're upset. It has nothing to do with "Kobe bashing," pro or con. Just the content of the post. That one I felt was inappropriate for what is a sensitive subject.

BK

LakerFanatic,

"According to reports they had a plan a few years ago of leaving capspace in order to sign a guy like Amare or LeBron when their contract was up. Well all of the players they wanted resigned with their teams. How do we know that if we leave capspace someone good will want to sign in LA now?"

-----

If the Lakers had freed up cap space this summer (say by not signing Radmanobrick and
not extending Kwame), they could have made an offer greater than the MLE to
Chauncey Billups or Mo Williams. Do you think maybe one of them might have helped
the Lakers more than Derek Fisher?

Don't discount the value of having cap space. Ricky Davis is a good player and worth
pursuing. Juwan Howard is a cap anchor.

Ricardo
Excellent post, and you know what your English is pretty good keep them coming.....

I myself know a great deal about Urugay and what they have accomplished in Spots in a country with only 3m residance......SInce I myself am from a county of 3m residance as well

LONG TIME LAKER FAN

Says
"WRT the cap issue.

It's funny how everyone complains that the Lakers haven't brought anyone significant in for the last
three years, while ignoring the fact that the Lakers have been over the cap that whole time and thus
have only had MLE or less to offer. And then when someone suggests that maybe the team should
do something that will lead to cap space so they can make an offer, they get all huffy about trying
to make cap space.

If the Lakers had had cap space this summer, they could have made an offer to Chauncey Billups
or Mo Williams. Do you think maybe one of them would have helped the Lakers more than Derek
Fisher?

"""

You don't understand the cap and neither does exholadar

The lakers would not have been able to sign Chauncey or Mo Williams because of the Kobe, Odom, and Kwame deals along with the other small ones.
Those 3 big ones prevent cap space beyond MLE.

So it's nothing they could have done different since giving KWAME BROWN THE 3RD YR OPTION 3 months after he arrived which was STUPID.

So you guys should stop talking about the cap like we're planning like the SPURS.

We are a MINIMUM of 2 yrs from having cap space.
That does not count Luke and Vlad Rad

All of you cap guys will hand ANDREW SOCKS BYNUM 100 MILLION DOLLARS TO BE YOUR NEXT FAKE KAREEM ABDUL JABAAR

Watch

Charles,
"USA!!! LBJ 11-11! Down goes Argetina!"

I second that Charles!
"USA!!! LBJ 11-11! Down goes Argetina!"
"USA!!! LBJ 11-11! Down goes Argetina!"
"USA!!! LBJ 11-11! Down goes Argetina!"
"USA!!! LBJ 11-11! Down goes Argetina!"
"USA!!! LBJ 11-11! Down goes Argetina!"

kobe apologist

"LeBron's game was "Kobe-esque"."

since when did LeBron become a malcontent wannabe franchise guy who can't handle the pressure to lead as the #1?

Let's see kob's box score....nah, i not going to dignify Mr. Apologist's cheap attempt at humor.

Long time Laker fan,

I'm not discounting the value of capspace. I am discounting the idea that players will just be lining up to come to LA. The Lakers have NEVER had superstars lining up to play here. Name me 5 top free agents that the Lakers have signed since Magic Johnson retired? I'll do you one better.....name me 1 top player that has signed with the Lakers OTHER THAN SHAQ while still in their prime? The Lakers don't get a lot of top free agents, they haven't for a long time. They have gotten players through trades and drafts, but not free agency. Malone and Payton were not playing like future Hall-O-Famers when they signed with the Lakers. They were on the last part of their careers. Mitch Richmond was on the last of his career when he signed. Jim Jackson was on the last of his career when he signed.

My point is that this belief that the Lakers can acquire a top free agent simply because they have the money just hasn't been the reality for the Lakers. Top Players don't run to LA until they are old and want a championship.

EastCoastJessie

"Kobe will come out to kill tonight."

kobe's been exposed to be over-rated time and time again by Lebron and Melo...."kobe ball's" a comin'

Like it or not, kobe can only be on his best behavior for so long. Team USA is kobe's team and he'll take it even it that means losing Olympic Gold.

Didn't the rest of Team USA get the memo that Team USA 2007 is kobe's team. What the hell are those guys thinking?

Coach K,
"He'll do whatever he thinks he needs to do to bring about a championship. He's proven it and he wants to prove it again. There are lot of people who prove it once and never want to do it again. He's uncommon. He wants to prove it over and over again. There is nothing bad about Kobe Bryant."

Guess this means I've got to start rooting for duke now. It's really kewl to see someone go out of their way to say something nice about bryant. This is the kind of love NY can show kobe that LA never can. Come home Kobe, come play for the mecca of basketball.

Again kudos to coach k for giving credit where credit is due.

James shot 11 times in 14 minutes? What a freakin' ball hog!!

Regarding LeBrickNoMore's 11-11 performance.....

WATCH OUT KOBE, YOUR DUBIOUS STATUS AS THE BEST PLAYER ON THE PLANET IS .......WELL....DUBIOUS.

For my kobe loving friends, please take note of the boxscore.

http://sports.espn.go.com/extra/fiba/boxscore?gameId=270831964

Kobe's the only player (outside of Billups who’s a PG) to have a shooting percentage of less than 50%. I saw a tendency to play "kobe ball", but then kobe remembered that Team USA is his tryout session to leave LA.

But i digress....

Lebron is the real deal holy field and i guarantee that LBJ will be the next "billion dollar athlete" as well as a finals MVP enroute to multiple championships (assuming LBJ doesn't pull a Grant Hill with the ankle injury). One supporting "fact" (for my unformed friend hari-yahoo) of why i believe LBJ is going to "do it all" is that he has enough humility (whether pretend or sincere, it doesn't matter) to get other NBA players to trust him AND LBJ has befriended my idol, Warren Buffet, as a financial advisor.

Being a finance guy, if you gave me LBJ's money, i can turn it into a billion before he retires from the NBA.....having said that, i'm sure my idol Warren Buffet will do better.

Kool and the gang?

Long time Laker fan,

Wouldn't Howard be available as a trade option with his expiring contract next summer? Doesn't that mean that REALLY, the Lakers would only be committed a minimum of 1 season to both Davis and Howard?

You don't think that it is worth it for 1 season to see what they can do for the Lakers?

On the ESPN page where Coach K says "There is nothing bad about Kobe Bryant", one of the comments is "he means as a basketball player, right?" Yeah.... some people are just retarded. No offense Gunner.

Laker Fanatic said it best when he attempts to explain to you guys that Kwame Brown's expiring contract is not that big of a deal.
It's not going to part the sea like MOSES.

It won't fetch a big time player alone.
It would have to be attached to someone that is wanted to do anything.
The player will have a hell of a time getting into the traingle offense mix.

Move it now, and try to mold a team together.
You can't put patch work on the court to beat the Spurs but if you can start a season with the best player and a team of guys with courage in training camp you have a chance.
This deal would get bums off of our roster too which is good.

Gino said it best by saying that the deal keeps us in position for a block buster trade for JO or whoever else might become available.

Kwame leaves out and the new big contract that will be expiring not as soon but relatively soon is Lamar Odom's which will be 14 mil at all star break 2009.

Why not grab him early if it all comes to that for a JO deal that becomes fruitful later to attach to Ricky D, Fish, Kobe, Walton, and co. as GINO said.

We keep options WIDE OPEN with this MINNESOTA deal is the point and
for you capologist guys we also can keep you on schedule for a clear cap summer 2009 because KOBE might leave anyway if we not winning and Odom will expire so you guys will be happy too.

I just WARN you to not give ANDREW SOCKS BYNUM 100 million next summer to be a FAKE - Kareem Abdul Jabaar.

Please guys think about it.

1 other thing for you capologist guys, the reason Jerry West would not come here is because the cap is already not clean.

Why would he want to clean a cap again or be hamstrung as he has been in Memphis?

Signing Kwame Brown to a 3rd yr option was just plain DUMB and DUMBER.

I sure miss Caron Butler!!

"Phil likes big guards for a reason....defensive flexibility and ability to see over the
defense on offense. Farmar will never provide that for the Lakers."

-------

Here we go again. Ever since Magic, there's been this impression by some people that
there's some inherent advantage to being a tall PG. All of these PG's seem to be able
to get their shot off and/or get their passes to the right player at the right time:

Steve Nash - 6'3"
Tony Parker - 6'2"
Kirk Hinrich - 6'3"
Jason Terry - 6'2"
Chauncey Billups - 6'3"
Baron Davis - 6'3"
Sam Cassell - 6'3"
Mike Conley, Jr. - 6'1"
Mo Williams - 6'1"
Jason Kidd - 6'4" (a giant among PG's)
Chris Paul - 6'0"
Andre Miller - 6'2"
Mike Bibby - 6'2"
T.J. Ford - 6'0"
Deron Williams - 6'3"
Gilbert Arenas - 6'4"

I'm not saying I'm positive Farmar will be a better PG than Crittendon, but at this point
I'm not sure. Most of you point to his height (which the stats above show is irrelevant),
and his performance in summer league. Look at their NCAA tournament performance.
Farmar carried his team to a championship game and was the only person on his team
that looked composed against Florida. Crittendon's team flopped in the first round.

I think one of them could turn out to be a good point guard for the Lakers, maybe both.
I'd just hate to trade away one and have the one we trade turn out to be the good PG
and the one we keep turn out to be a bust.

Taliq,
"Guess this means I've got to start rooting for duke now"
Say it aint so Taliq. LOL! But coach K is cool. It's almost
to bad he did not take the Laker job instead of Phil when the
Lakers offered it to him.

Mamba24/10

"Because some may see this as being a pro Kobe bandwagon tommorow our honoree will be ANDREW Z and next week GUNNER"

Andrew Z is cool, but you're actually gonna honor someone who puts the word KB*ATCH in every other sentence he types. Well let me be the first to ask that you take me off your honor roll if Gunner is going to be on the same list.

Don't reward irrational arguments, don't reward obnoxiousness, don't reward an unapologetic mean spirit ... don't turn ya back on fam just to prove that you can be fair ...

There is something to be said about the balance folks like Andrew Z bring to the blog, but to group him with the likes of Gunner and KLBeast (who litter their posts with a$$ and kb*tch) is doing AZ a disservice ...

It ain't a crime to dislike kobe but it should be a crime to be offensive and rude without shame ...

Mamba24/10

Thank sir! Are you all for the Ricky Davis Juwan Hoard trade bro?

Charles

"James shot 11 times in 14 minutes? What a freakin' ball hog!!"

Lebron also had four assists - tied for the lead among the starters - and no turnovers. He's now up to 30 assists (3 off team lead) with 6 turnovers for the tournament. Ball hog?

More shots were available this game because Carmelo was out. That's why James shot 11 times. Kobe also shot 11 times. Prince also shot 11 times. Stoudemire shot 10 times as well.

The difference is, Lebron took the good shots - that's why he went 11-11 and scored 26. Kobe was only 5-11 - how the heck did that happen against Uraguay? Lebron's now 80% on fg for the tournament, while Kobe is at 53%, well below the team average. Chauncy is the only guy on the entire team who's shooting as bad as Kobe on 2-pointers, and Kobe is now 6th on the team in 3pt shooting. He's also leading by a significant margin in turnovers and has a much worse assist-to-turnover ratio than everyone except the big men and Miller. Is his shooting that bad, or is he taking the wrong shots? Lebron scored 26 on the same number of shots that Kobe needed to score 13, and Lebron didn't even shoot any free throws.

Kobe is not a bad shooter. Kobe should be doing way better than 53% against this competition and with these teammates. Kobe should be way better than 19 assists and 12 turnovers with the guys he's passing to and the little men defending him. Kobe needs to learn how to play like a real team player. I think in this tournament, Lebron is showing him how.

KLBeast,

"Being a finance guy, if you gave me LBJ's money, i can turn it into a billion before he retires from the NBA.....having said that, i'm sure my idol Warren Buffet will do better"

Yeah, I'm sure you'll be able to squeeze in 10 mins for LBJ somewhere in between your 567,890th kobe sucks post and the 789,324 kobe is a retard post.

Ex,

"James shot 11 times in 14 minutes? What a freakin' ball hog!!"

Lmfao ...

Gunner (Large Bore, No calibre) your the basketball expert who said!!!

"REPEAT, A GREAT DEFENDER DOES NOT GET INTO FOUL TROUBLE."
Posted by: Gunner | August 29, 2007 at 03:30 PM

SHOW ME THOSE DEFENSIVE STATS OVER THE LAST 3 SEASON, WHILE KOBIATCH HAS BEEN #1 AND THEN LET'S TALK.

Posted by: Gunner | August 29, 2007 at 06:18 PM

As request by Gunner (Large Bore, No calibre) here are the stats.

Kobe

Playoffs
03/04 2.7 pf/pg 2.77 TO/pg
05/06 3.6 pf/pg 4.09 TO/pg
06/07 2.0 pf/pg 4.40 TO/pg
career 3.1 pf/pg 2.85 TO/pg

Season
04/05 2.6 pf/pg 2.77 TO/pg
05/06 2.9 pf/pg 3.13 TO/pg
06/07 2.7 pf/pg 3.31 TO/pg

career 2.7pf/pg 2.91 TO/pg

"I THINK IT'S TIME FOR YOU TO RUN AWAY ONCE AGAIN. "
Posted by: Gunner | August 29, 2007 at 06:18 PM

I do not run away from my responsibilities, ie my job and family. Hence, if I am not there when you are ranting. I afraid, I don't give it a nanosecond of thought. Also I assume you live in the USA, while I live in the United Kingdom. Just, a little bit of a time difference. But, I don't expect you to understand such concepts from insular world of your bedroom.

Lakers Nation must apologise for typo in turnovers for Kobe in yesterday's post. Basketball geeks will realise, Kobe could not have career playoff TO/pg of 0.7 but in fact it is 2.85

Kobe Bryant : 4.5 apg to 2.85 TO/pg

MJ: 5.4 apg to 3.05 TO/pg

I would like to say how well the USA team played a 'Man of The Match' award goes out to LeBron James for his performance.

But as KLBeast (The Supremacist) and Gunner (Large Bore, No Calibre) have already pointed out to infinity and beyond. The as in Kobe's case, the USA are not playing at NBA teams, NBA offenses and NBA defenses and you have to take these performances with 'tonne of salt'.

Aaarrrhhhh!!

Angry_Laker

Taliq-

Well said, I would like to add: "Don't confuse quantity with quality."
also...
Proverbs 29:9
"If a wise person goes to court with a fool,
the fool rages and scoffs, and there is no peace."

LakerBake,

"The lakers would not have been able to sign Chauncey or Mo Williams because of the Kobe, Odom, and Kwame deals along with the other small ones."

-----

Funny how you conveniently edited my post to suit your argument. I specifically said that
IF the Lakers had gotten some cap space this summer AND I SPECIFICALLY GAVE THE
EXAMPLES OF NOT RESIGNING KWAME AND NOT SIGNING RAD. Sorry for the caps
but you must not have read it the first time.

The thing is there's no guarantee which free agents will be available any particular
summer and there's no guarantee that they will take your offer. But players are more
likely to take offers with a big-name team like the Lakers than they are with a small
market team, and if you don't have ANY cap space, then all you can do is offer 5 million
like any other team, and that won't get it done for big name players.

Thus I would argue that it's worth ruining your cap space for Kevin Garnett, or even
Jermaine O'Neal, but not for Juwan Howard or Troy Murphy.

LakerFanatic:

"Just for reference sake, who exactly is desiring the others to try to outdo the performance by LeBron?"

My point wasn't that bloggers have expressly stated that they want their favorite players to top LeBron's numbers. My point was that by citing individual highlights and numbers from a single game as proof of LeBron's comparative leadership/value/excellence, many bloggers are feeding into what has been a US weakness; that is, tacitly encouraging our players to treat the game as an audition for ever greater celebrity as opposed to an actual team competition.

LeBron did an awesome job of exploiting a situation and executing to the benefit of Team USA. It's like a small scale version of what Kobe did in the 81-point game for the Lakers. Both were fun to watch and both were mind-melting performances, but I do not think that either performance should be treated as some sort of goal or yardstick outside of the context of the particular game. We have to continue to demand that our top players see such performances as products of, not formulas for great basketball.

LakerFanatic,

JJ's deal a ways back had Mark Blount coming with Juwan Howard, not Ricky Davis. It makes a huge difference. Ricky Buckets provides something we need and has an expiring deal. Mark Blount, is just the opposite.

To be honest, if the deal went down I'd be cool with it. It wouldn't be too horrible because Howard expires next year so there's no long term ramifications if it doesn't work.

But I just don't think it makes us that much better.

Ahhhhh KLBeast, what would a good blogging day be without you...just refreshing!

Kobe has proven to be the leader of this team, not because he is or will be their top scorer, but because he has set the tempo with his tough D in all of their games. He sets the tone early and everyone just follows.

My reason for saying that Kobe will come out to kill tonight is because Kobe's got that killer instinct and he wants to avenge our loss to them. That's it! Kobe, Kidd, and Billups are all veteran leaders on that team.

Aloha Long time

If the lakers were running a more traditional offense, I would agree with you that height isnt that important in PG's. But the triangle doesnt really use a traditional PG. That said our big guards have hurt us by not being able to stay in front of those small quick guards. That is Why I am excited by Critt. He is tall enough for the triangle And seems to be quick enough to stay in front of quick guards. Now from what I understand he is also versitle enough to play the 1, 2 or 3. Thats why I believe you can keep both for now.

MH

Angry Laker,
"I do not run away from my responsibilities, ie my job and family.
Hence, if I am not there when you are ranting. I afraid, I don't give
it a nanosecond of thought. Also I assume you live in the USA,
while I live in the United Kingdom. Just, a little bit of a time
difference. But, I don't expect you to understand such concepts
from insular world of your bedroom."

Today is your day Angry Laker but please no more allusions to
KL in Bedroom. MYGOD!!!! LOL!

Charles,
"Thank sir! Are you all for the Ricky Davis Juwan Hoard trade bro?"

Charles I am but only because Juwan Howard is a family friend and very
civic minded individual. He can still play a lil bit to I believe. LOL!

Kobe Apologist, Angry Laker are you male or female.
You don't have to answer I just ask because I just
assumed in my write-ups to you that you were male and
if I'm wrong I probably want to say I'm sorry.

Lakers Nation some gems of how other players have acted and what other bloggers think about Jordan!!!

Pippen Angry
From: The Washington Post Date: September 30, 1999

Scottie Pippen unleashed a torrent of criticism at Rockets teammate Charles Barkley, calling Barkley "selfish" and "fat" and saying he doesn't have the desire to win an NBA championship. Also, the Houston Chronicle reported today that Pippen could be traded to Portland before training camp opens next week.

PIPPEN'S PARADOX

Can Scottie Pippen, the second-best player in the league, succeed without the first-best player in the league?

by Jackie MacMullan

Chicago veteran Steve Kerr figured he had read Scottie Pippen's lips wrong. What other answer could there be? He recalls staring at his visibly distressed teammate, who was cursing at coach Phil Jackson, and waiting for the strange, distorted picture to right itself. Instead, Kerr watched incredulously as Pippen threw up his hands, threw down his towel and took a seat at the end of the Bulls' bench.

It was playoff time, 1994, and a basketball game was hanging in the balance. These were the moments Kerr and Pippen had discussed at length since Michael Jordan had retired and signed with the Chicago White Sox to play minor league baseball. Pippen understood it was his job now to lead the Bulls in these critical times. Everyone else in the league—not to mention his teammates—expected it. Again and again, Pippen had insisted he was up to the task.

And yet, with 1.8 seconds remaining in Game 3 of the Eastern Conference finals, a tie ball game against the Knicks, Pippen was ... taking himself out?

"I was shocked," Kerr admits now. "The only way to describe it was total disbelief. Here was a guy who had done so much for our team, who had been our leader all year long. He was, and still is, one of the greatest teammates I've ever had. But on that day, I think all the pressure and frustration of our season caught up with him, and he snapped."

The pressure was easily identifiable: the effort to become heir Jordan, successor to the greatest player in the history of basketball. At the time of Michael Jordan's emotional decision to leave the sport in October 1993, Pippen was itching to prove to the world that he could stand on his own, without his superstar teammate to lift him to greatness. He vowed that he would emerge from the shadow of his legendary friend and lead the Bulls to another title.

Statistically, Pippen lived up to his billing. He led the Bulls in scoring (22.0) and assists (5.6) in 1993-94 as Chicago won 55 regular-season games. Yet the sheer love of basketball with which Jordan inspired his teammates was missing. Pippen, a quiet, subdued man off the court, simply could not fill the leadership void left by Michael's departure. The pressure inflicted by the fans and the media was stifling, yet the self-induced pressure Pippen felt was the most crippling.

He struggled with his duties as team leader. He feuded with general manager Jerry Krause, publicly called him a liar and asked to be traded. At one point during the season, Jackson observed, "We've asked Scottie to take on too much. We've got to find other people to help shoulder the load."

Chicago's second-best player has a knack for getting into—and out of—tight spots.
photo by David Liam Kyle

Maybe that's why on May 13, 1994, with the scoreboard reading 102-102, Jackson called his team into the huddle and diagrammed the final shot, which forward Toni Kukoc would take. Pippen, who wanted the chance to win the game himself, was shocked—and furious—to learn that he was going to be relegated to inbounding the ball. He swore at his coach, stomped out of the huddle and stormed down to the end of the bench, leaving his team in the lurch for the most important moment of the game—and perhaps of the Bulls' season.

Kukoc went out and hit the game-winner, a fallaway 23-footer. Still, Jackson, a coach known for protecting his players at all costs, didn't even try to conceal his feelings of betrayal. As he walked into the interview room he announced, unprovoked, "Scottie asked out of the play."

Days later Jordan, hundreds of miles away in Birmingham, shook his head sadly. "Poor Scottie," he said. "I kept telling him it's not easy being me. Now he knows."

Yet Jordan had never been branded a traitor, a quitter or a bratty adolescent. Because of his self-centered action, Pippen had become the poster child for the spoiled athlete who needs everything his own way, and who takes his ball and goes home if he doesn't get it. The national outrage stunned Pippen and added to his sense that he was suffocating. His quitting was to become a moment of infamy almost every sports pundit predicted Pippen would never live down.

As Jordan points out, Pippen's versatility is unparalleled.
photo by John W. McDonough

In the face of the mounting criticism, he withdrew further. "I apologized to the team and to Phil Jackson," a contrite Pippen said days later. "I don't think I have to apologize to anyone else."

He came back in Game 4 with 25 points, eight rebounds and six assists, but the Bulls lost the series in seven games—and Pippen lost all his credibility. Furthermore, his simmering jealousy of Kukoc, whom Krause courted while Pippen was trying to renegotiate his contract with the Bulls, was now an ugly subplot. "It was a devastating thing," Kerr said. "Scottie never could have judged the magnitude of his actions. I felt so badly for him."

Over the month following the incident Pippen regained his composure. "I don't think you can call me a quitter," he said. "I think you can look at it and say I made a stupid mistake. That's pretty much it. I haven't been a quitter. I think I go out and approach the game as hard as anyone. I play smart, I play hard, and I play as a team player."

But what Pippen desperately needed was to play again on a team with Jordan. When Pippen is alongside Jordan, he is the second-best player in the league. Without Jordan, Pippen is still an All-Star, but one who lacks deadly clout. That's why Jordan's decision to return to basketball late in the 1994-95 season helped salvage Pippen's reputation. It may also have saved his career.

As Jordan reassumed the scoring duties, Pippen was free to become an offensive creator and a gambler on defense. When the Bulls came up short in the 1995 playoffs, nobody was wondering what effect Pippen had on the series: Everyone was too busy debating whether Jordan had lost a step.

Fast-forward to the 1996-97 campaign. Jordan was in top form, causing those who had predicted his demise to backpedal furiously. Pippen, meanwhile, was happy playing second fiddle. "Michael and I have a sense that when the other isn't going well that it's time to step up," Pippen said. "When he's going well, I want the ball in his hands. I know sooner or later that he will create chances for others." In fact, Pippen's early-season play was so superb that Jordan immediately embarked on a Pippen-for-MVP campaign. "This is the most fun I've had in basketball," Pippen declared in January, with Chicago in the midst of dominating another season. "I think I'm playing my best ball."

As the Bulls marched toward their fifth championship in seven years, Jordan was showered with the usual accolades. Yet it was Pippen who, despite a soft-tissue injury on the sole of his left foot, set the tone for the series against Utah with a monster Game 1, scoring 27 points and grabbing nine boards, with three steals and four blocks. The Jazz coaching staff marveled aloud at the most well-rounded player in the NBA, a multiposition talent who can score, defend, run the floor, dish the ball and make the big play. In the heart-stopping Game 5, Pippen carried the Bulls' load when the ill Jordan couldn't, scoring 17 points and pulling down 10 rebounds. "We ham-and-egg it pretty good," said Jordan of his sidekick after Game 1. "Whenever I'm not on my game, he's there to pick me up. He's been a big help to my success."

Pippen's talents and his faith in the team concept did the unthinkable: all but erase his shameful act in the 1994 playoffs from the NBA's memory bank. "It was a long time ago," said Pippen. "I was a different player and a different person. I don't even think about it anymore."

Nor do his teammates. "Scottie has grown up," says Ron Harper. "It was unfortunate for him that his growing pains had to be on national television. But he's come through it just fine."

It is with this added maturity that Pippen faces the possibility of losing Jordan again. Michael says he is seriously considering retiring, if not this summer, then in 1998, and Pippen has said that he is prepared to assume control of the Bulls once more, only this time with the benefit of the proper seasoning he has received.

Whether Pippen will be afforded that opportunity is another matter. He will become a free agent in 1998, and his asking price will be hefty. Owner Jerry Reinsdorf must consider all his options, including trading his hybrid forward. Reinsdorf said Pippen's unsuccessful solo run in 1993-94 will not be a factor in determining whether he is given that leadership role again. "The first time, he wasn't ready," Reinsdorf said. "But now Scottie is the complete package. Everybody has bad offensive games here and there, but Scottie almost always has a good defensive game, and that's what wins championships."

Still, Pippen's future remains unclear. Reinsdorf has not yet committed to re-signing him, and—particularly if Jordan does retire—Pippen could be his best trade bait to help begin the rebuilding process. Reinsdorf concedes, however, that he's intrigued with the idea of keeping Pippen around.

"This time, Kukoc will be a much bigger help," Reinsdorf says. "As for the other stuff, Scottie has learned a lot from Michael Jordan. You don't read any more dumb comments from him, no more gun incidents, no more girlfriend problems."

For his part Pippen says he would like to stay in Chicago, but he realizes his worth. "I'm one of the best players in the NBA, and it doesn't matter to me that Jerry or Mr. Reinsdorf or anyone shops me around," he says. "I know what my value is in this game. Obviously I would like to stay here. I don't know what Michael, Dennis and Phil's careers hold, but I would love to finish my career here."

Jordan has assumed the role of Pippen's publicist, and he reminds Chicago fans and Bulls management that Pippen is a unique talent whose versatility is unparalleled in the league. "I can't imagine why anyone would trade Scottie," Jordan said during the Finals.

For all Pippen's talent, however, questions about him linger. If Jordan goes and Pippen stays, Scottie will be in the media glare, both as a player and as a leader. "Scottie understands that," said Harper. "Give him credit for watching and learning. He understands now exactly what his strengths are and how best to use them. Over the last two seasons I've watched him learn to read situations, then attack them. That's something he didn't do very well when he first came into the league."

When the 1997-98 season starts, Scottie Pippen will be 32 years old. He will have five championship rings, two Olympic gold medals, seven All-Star appearances and the knowledge that all those accomplishments, save his 1994 and 1995 All-Star appearances, were reached with Jordan by his side.

Can he be a superstar independently of his celebrated teammate? Does he have the personality and the savvy to carry a team on his shoulders, both physically and spiritually? Has he truly obliterated from history the darkest day of his NBA career?

"I think he has, and you know what? It's pretty amazing," said Kerr. "I think everyone has come to realize that what happened with Scottie in 1994 is the exception rather than the rule."

Kerr added that Pippen's attitude about succeeding Jordan has been altered drastically. "He realizes now there's no need to try to fill Michael Jordan's shoes because it's impossible, for him or for anyone else," said Kerr. "I hope he's realized that being Scottie Pippen isn't such a bad deal."

Did Jordan make those around him better?
Article from website below!!!
http://www.angelfire.com/ks2/airjudden/jordan.htm

To this, the answer is an emphatic "NO!"

I issued this challenge on Usenet: Name one player whose career was enhanced by Jordan. I never received a serious challenge. Let’s look at some of the candidates.

Scottie Pippen – The press love to sing long songs about Jordan made Pippen. However, their songs are missing a few verses. For example. Why did Pippen have his finest seasons without Jordan? In 1994, Pippen averaged 22 ppg, 8.7 rpg, and 5.6 apg. In 1995, Pippen became only the second player in history (Dave Cowens was the first) to lead his team in points, rebounds, assists, blocks, and steals. How could he do this without Jordan to make him better?
Furthermore, when deciding to retire, Jordan said over and over that he would not play without Pippen. While recovering from foot surgery in December of 1997, Pippen said that he was not going to play with the Bulls when he was fully recovered. Jordan said that if he had known this, he would not have come back. Why? If Jordan makes everyone so much better, why not fill in Scott Burrell into Pippen’s position (or Toni Kukoc, for that matter), and make another Pippen? Answer: Jordan didn’t make Pippen. Pippen made Pippen. Without Jordan, he is still the dominating defensive player, and he continues to be a complete player.

Dennis Rodman – Rodman had established himself LONG before playing with Jordan. His defensive reputation was made in Detroit, where he was voted the Defensive Player of the Year in 1990 and 91. His rebounding ability was established in Detroit, also, where he won the first of his seven consecutive rebounding titles (4 without Jordan), and his reputation as a winner was established in Detroit, where he won two titles – both times defeating Jordan’s Bulls.

Luc Longley – Put simply, Longley was a bad player before he joined the Bulls. He was a bad player when he played with the Bulls, and he was a bad player after he left the Bulls. Nobody has questioned Jason Kidd’s ability to improve his teammates, and even he hasn’t been able to coax out respectable play from Longley. If eight points and 5 rebounds is what you want out of your center, then Longley is your man, but you don’t need Jordan to get this out of him.

John Paxson – This is the guy that most Jordan fans bring up. Paxson was on the perfect team in Chicago (perhaps the only team he could get significant minutes with), but his career blossomed because of Pippen, not Jordan. Jordan did not like playing point guard, and Phil Jackson didn’t like him playing point guard. Jordan didn’t pass enough and turned the ball over too much, to be a full-time point guard. However, Jordan didn’t like point guards who were the classic "drive-and-dish" style points. He disliked playing with Sam Vincent and Steve Colter for this very reason. When Jordan came back in 1995, he had problems playing with B.J. Armstrong, who drove more during Jordan’s absence.

When Phil Jackson took over as coach, he made Pippen a point forward, and this allowed Paxson to fill in as a spot-up shooter, since Paxson lacked the skills to play the point, and the defensive ability and height to play the shooting guard. If Pippen were not able to play the point from the forward position, Paxson could not have started. Either Jordan would have had to have played the point -- in which case, Paxson lacked the size and defensive ability to be a shooting guard, or else, the Bulls would have had to play a classic point guard, and Paxson lacked those skills. That is why he couldn’t fit on any other team – not because they didn't have a Jordan-type of player (Clyde Drexler filled the Jordan role in Portland – but Paxson could not have filled in adequately for Terry Porter), but because Pippen filled the point role. The only other team that Paxson could have fit on was Milwaukee, who was using Paul Pressey as a point forward and Alvin Robertson as a shooting guard...and that's probably why Craig Hodges, a similar type of player, got significant minutes there.

Steve Kerr – See John Paxson. Furthermore, Kerr had established himself as one the top 3 point shooter in history (percentage-wise) and set a record for best 3 point shooting percentage (from the long distance) in a season (1989-90). Considering this, and how he filled in for Mark Price when Price was injured in Cleveland, I ask, what Jordan did differently for his career? Furthermore, Kerr joined the Bulls in 1993-94 and had his best season -- that was the year that Jordan missed due to retirement. Pippen made Kerr better, just like he made Paxson better

What do you think!!!!

Aaarrrhhhh!!

Angry_Laker

Taliq-
"Guess this means I've got to start rooting for duke now. It's really kewl to see someone go out of their way to say something nice about bryant. This is the kind of love NY can show kobe that LA never can. Come home Kobe, come play for the mecca of basketball.

Again kudos to coach k for giving credit where credit is due. "

Sorry Bro. I think you have been duped by reading too much into this blog. The anti-Kobe sentiment shown by a pretty good percentage on this blog is way skewed from reality. This is not a good place to poll pro-Kobe vs. Anti-Kobe in Lakers fans because most Lakers fans (say, about 1 million to 1) do not post on this blog. You have a tiny minority of anti-Kobe fans posting here as if their opinions are significant sample of the sentiment of Lakers fans in LA and elsewhere. In reality, their opinions do not represent the majority. Most everybody (including the anti-Kobe protagonists that you read here) are well aware that this Lakers team without Kobe Bryant, and with whatever we can get for him right now in a trade, is years away from a championship. In reality, unfortunately, this may be the case with him or without him. In any case, Lakers fans (about 1,000,000 to 1) would rather watch Lakers games with Kobe Bryant playing than not.

KL- n the spirit of kobe bashing, isn't it already happening? i see kobe forcing several shots (Walton Sr. calling them out too) and Team USA is destroying the competition. Wait until the real competition begins, then "kobe ball" will work its way into the game with or without Coach K's approval

This was my basic point in the last thread. The difference on this team vs the Lakers is these guys will not allow Kobe to take over.

I still dont understand in watching the game last night (the 1st quarter admittedly) how anyone can think Kobe is better than lebron all around. I think its my preference to watching a team-played who works the ball around in the offense instead of going one on one. That would explain why Walton Sr rips Kobe at times too for not playing team ball. I wonder how the wizard of westwood would coach Kobe.

LA Guy,
Thanks for the analysis..... you are like John Hollinger's bastard child. Seriously though, you seem to know more about basketball from looking at box score than Coach K and all the players can deduce from being with the team. What's it like being the smartest man alive? And, shouldn't you be out discovering the Higgs boson or curing Alzheimers or something?

LakerBake,

"We are a MINIMUM of 2 yrs from having cap space."

----

Maybe that's true in your un-creative mind. Cap space can be made and made quickly.
Want to see me make some cap space:

Golden State needs a backup point guard, and they have a big trade exception. Trade
them Crittendon for a trade exception and a future first round draft pick
extra cap space next summer: $1,285,200

Or if you're really good, trade them Crittendon for Jasekevicius (who they don't want)
with Cook riding along in the deal. (there'd have to be a couple of other small contracts
riding along to make the salaries match)
extra cap space next summer: $4,881,560

Chicago was looking at Chris Mihm. If Mihm shows that he can actually play during
the start of the season, offer Mihm + Crittendon to Miami for Chris Duhon
extra cap space next summer: $3,785,200

Think Miami might want Andrew Bynum? I think they would. The catch is they have
to take on Rad's contract to get him. Bynum + Rad for Jason Williams & a future pick
extra cap space next summer: $8,818,700

Want mondo cap space - Offer Lamar Odom + Luke Walton to Washington for Antawn
Jamison.
extra cap space next summer: $18,979,000

I'm not saying the Lakers SHOULD do any of those deals just to get cap space right now.
What I am saying is, if a big name player was to become available, it is possible to get
cap space very quickly any time up to the trade deadline. In fact, that's HOW the Lakers
got Shaquille -- dumping off quality players for almost nothing in order to free up space.

But every extra anchor you add is one more turd you have to give away a good player
to get rid of.

If you keep trading your "bad players with less years left on their contracts" for
"bad players with more years left on their contracts", then in a few years you're
the Knicks. Hooray. Let's suck like the Knicks.

Hello all. I'm still on Blog Vacation until either any important Laker news hits the wire or training camp starts. Glad to see things more peaceful.

Laker Fanatic

I was as surprised that Andrew Z did not rip up the Minny trade.

He disagreed because of his value of the KWAME BROWN trade chip and the thinking that a deal can put us in title position.

However, he did not slam it.

My point to Andrew Z and others like AK who want a deal that can really put us in title contention.

That is very hard to do. At this point, the Lakers would have to pull the wool over someone's eyes.

I think we're still to this day stung by what Ernie Grunfield did to Mitch Kupchak in that dark room.

That deal has been harder than all hell to overcome and we have not found a sucker yet to correct that deal. (Well actually we found the Nets at the all star break but we would not do Kidd for Bynum/Brown).

We're not terribly smarter than the rest of the league. That sucker deal is just not out there.

We need to improve with a mid-major deal as GINO / Laker Fanatic have suggested.

LakerFanatic,

More on the cap space topic:

There are a couple of issues here. First if you have two big stars (Kobe and Shaq), then
you don't go fishing for another big star, you go fishing for role players to put around them.
So from about 1997 to 2004, the Lakers had no REASON to go fishing for a big name star.

Similarly, if the Lakers had been able to pull off a trade for KG or Jason Kidd, or if they'd
have lured Chauncey Billups to come to the Lakers through free agency, there wouldn't
be a great need for cap space, as they wouldn't NEED to bring in another big-salary
player to be competitive.

Just because there hasn't been a big name 10+ million dollar player coming to the
Lakers each year through free agency doesn't mean it isn't possible or even likely.

My other point is that the NBA is so out of line with contracts.
I mean if Kevin "basic player" Martin who is not a sought after fantasy player or top notch defender can get a contract for

55 million over 5 yrs.

then no wonder all of the real so called superstar players re-sign for the MAXIMUM POSSIBLE as soon as they can with their own team. (See Chris Bosh, Carmelo, Yao, Amare and many more)

These kids don't even care about BIG MARKETS anymore.

It's about BIG EASY DOLLARS.

Laker Fanatic,

"Wouldn't Howard be available as a trade option with his expiring contract next summer?
Doesn't that mean that REALLY, the Lakers would only be committed a minimum of 1
season to both Davis and Howard?"

-----

Ah. Now you show that truly you don't understand the salary cap. If it got to next summer
and the Lakers still had Juwan Howard, and if you trade him for another player, then that
other player still counts against the cap. The only way you could get rid of that extra
7 million dollars in salary is if you could get a team to trade him for a trade exception
or if they had cap space and would trade him for nothing. 7 million in cap space would
get you a much better player than Juwan Howard. The trade exception thing might
work if the Lakers threw in two future first round draft picks, like Phoenix did in dumping
off Kurt Thomas' contract.

And just in case your're thinking ahead of offering to buy Howard out, that wouldn't work
either. If you buy a player's contract out, the full contract still counts against your
salary cap.

Howard's contract becomes more effective as an expiring contract near the trade deadline
of the 2008-2009 season.

laker lover

"I still dont understand in watching the game last night (the 1st quarter admittedly) how anyone can think Kobe is better than lebron all around. "

the main difference between kob and LBJ is that LBJ takes what is given. if he doen't have the shot, he gives up the rock. remember in game 6 of last seasons East finals, LBJ told his guys to look for the ball because Detroit was probably going to apply the "Jordan Rule" to LBJ...

Maturity beyond belief.

Mamba24/10,

I am most definitely 'Alpha-Male', I am cutting short my blogging tonight because I have to got some a C programming to do. The program will facilitate an operator user menu on the (264 x 64) LCD display within a RF Switching Matrix Unit. So, it is going to need my full attention.

Happy blogging everyone. It is now 21:30 BST

Aaarrrhhhh!!

Angry_Laker

Andrew Z

I see where you're coming from better just to mention that.

Long Time Laker Fan

I must not have saw where you mentioned the Kwame 3rd yr option and the Vlad Rad deals as what got us in this mess.
Credit given if that's what you said.

On another note, you can not create cap space by doing deals of Sasha and Mihm unless someone gives a trade exceptiono back.
Who in the hell will give a trade exception for Sasha? He can barely play.
Getting trade exceptions for scrubs does not happen.
Seattle and Indy got trade exceptions by making big deals for players folks want like Artest, Peja, Ray Allen, or very high draft picks.

The only thing you mentioned that is feasible to perhaps net some cap space is moving Lamar Odom today for someone who has an expiring deal next summer like an Antawn Jamison.

I live in Maryland outside of Washington DC, as I said with Kwame Brown a few yrs back PLEASE DON'T DO IT if you want some productivity. He's small and not the rebounder or defender Odom is. Yes that's one guy Odom is more valuable than.

All to say with reference to the CAP, we can't create cap space right now and win or start building towards the West Finals to take some further steps towards the Finals with KOBE now.

We were practically in the 2nd round last yr if we did not have SCARED AS HELL players.
So with Ricky Davis who has his own courage and Juwan Howard who has been in wars for 15 yrs (only good for 15 minutes which is fine) coupled with the SUBTRACTION of (Brian Cook, Kwame Brown, and Farmar/Evans) added to D-Fisher, Luke, Odom, and KOBE
we could win rounds in the same scenario as we were presented
2 YRS AGO up 3-1 on BIG BAD PHOENIX and then we just
CHOKED with terror.

On the premise that we almost beat Phoenix when healthy, we're not far away from the 2nd round and beyong because Phoenix goes to the West Finals each of last 2 yrs if they don't run into San Antonio.

Obviously a healthy version of the last 2 yrs team can't get it done but with a small tweak like this trade

WE HAVE A CHANCE.

I like a chance with a FOREVER HUNGRY KOBE.

That's all this trade is about.

A FIGHTING CHANCE, not cap room and other pipe dreams.
All that cap room and lottery picks that Long Time Laker and Ex might want are coming soon enough,at this pace.

Happy_Laker (fka Angry)

"I am most definitely 'Alpha-Male', I am cutting short my blogging tonight because I have to got some a C programming to do"

Nerd...stike that...Alpha Nerd.

Enjoy the game tonight.

CHAUNCEY BILLUPS IS NOT WORTH 10 MILLION A YEAR ANYWAY.

HE does not finish at the rim anymore.
This is not the guy who pulled down Gary Payton of the lakers pants anymore.

He turns the ball over when driving or just kicks it back out for jumpers.
He has a good outside jumper but that's about it.
He could hit the age wall at any moment.

He's failed miserably the last 2 yrs in the big EAST FINALS series against
the HEAT and CAVS.

People on year really think that Kwame is worth alot more than his expiring contracts... People wake up, the deal with Minny is a great deal for both teams involved.... Like LakerBlake mentioned if RD doesn't pan out than he can go somewhere else, if he does we can alway use our MLE for next year on him. RD for MLE if he does turn out to be a great chip is a steal of a deal... Juwan Howard can easly be our version of Kwame Brown after next year (a 7M expiring contract)... But lets not kid ourselves, his by far much better. For example, JH averaged more pts, about same amount of rebounds, 83% FT, 47%FG in less mintues than that of KWame Brown... His also averaged 17ppg in his carrer... Now if you can get both these guys for Kwame, Farmar or JC, Cook and 1st rounder you've got to make it happen Jimbo... I just can't understand for the life of me why anyone would think this is a bad deal. I actually think Minny might consider this, us taking one of their bad contracts.

Lakers will finally have the balance they need with this team to compete ( considering RD is kept in check by PJ)

Listen up Jimbo, you will benefit from this trade by putting fort a competing team, not to mention keeping your pet AB.

MAKE IT HAPPPEN

"Seriously though, you seem to know more about basketball from looking at box score than Coach K and all the players can deduce from being with the team. What's it like being the smartest man alive? And, shouldn't you be out discovering the Higgs boson or curing Alzheimers or something?"

If Coach K sees the same things I see, what would he say publically about them? Seriously, Kobe is his friend and his freaking player. He's not going to rip him pubilcally and trash his own team - the only people who do that are people who are no longer associated with the team (such as PJ when he was between coaching gigs) and, um, Bryant himself. It's just silly that you take Coach K's talk as meaning something.

Just tell me this - do you think that Kobe has had good shot selection this tournament? Do you think he's distributing the ball well? What is causing the difference between Lebron's 80% and 70% and Kobe's 53% and 47%? What is causing the difference between Lebron's 30 with 6 and Kobe's 19 with 12?

LakerBake,
"2 YRS AGO up 3-1 on BIG BAD PHOENIX and then we just CHOKED with terror."

The Lakers were lucky to get to that point; PJ pulled a fast one on D'Antoni, and nearly got away with it. The Lakers were not a "second round team". If you go with the logic that "the Lakers were almost there, and just need a little more ..." you will be making a big mistake.

Yep KL I remember, LBJ makes the right basketball play, Kobe tries to make it happen on his own.

I also remember somone saying the sign of a great leader is what happens to the team/business when the leader is no longer on the team. A great leader plans for continued success and doesnt foster over-dependency on him or herself.

oh my god... you guys are still pushing this Juwan Howard/Ricky Davis trade?

lemme tell you, tell me... you guys don't like Walton's defense? You'll be HOWLING about Ricky Davis and then you'll bash Mitch up and down for making the trade in the first place and Howard??? How long will it take until fans start showing up with oil cans, "Hey Howard! You need some 30 weight to get going tonight?" or maybe they'll show up with batteries and jumper cables... I'm not saying he's old or anything but... gosh darnit! HE'S OLD! He plays like he's older than he really is. Aaron McKie was more spry than Juwan Howard!!! and when you need him the most? in the playoffs? Hoofa! 2 points in 27 minutes! WE NEED THIS GUY!!! DO IT, MITCH!

and I love all the flowery comments coming out about Kobe. OF COURSE he's on his best behavior, did anybody really expect him to be a ballhog as they were WHOMPING on 3rd world teams which can barely scrub together one or two guys who could even play in the NBA? (Durka! Durka!) Even the hardcore pro-Kobe guys are saying, "where was this defensive effort last year?"

and the attendance... who wants to watch this? I'm getting it free on tv, I'm a BBall fan and I can barely take it after the first quarter... at this point, I'd rather they just send high school and college players...

Could they just have all the NBA allstars play each other for a couple of games, make them red and blue teams, the winning team splits say $3-5m between their team's players and coaches, etc., losers get zero. How about best of 7? THAT would be entertaining!

repost,

ONCE AGAIN, IT'S NOT ABOUT QUANTITY, BUT THE QUALITY OF SHOTS TAKEN.

"In a sensational display of speed and power, James raised his tournament-leading shooting percentage to an almost comical 79.7 percent (47-of-59). He is 14-of-20 from 3-point range, a 70 percent mark that also leads the event."

I GUESS LEBRICK IS SHOWING WHY HIS STOCK IS ON THE RISE. WHEN PLAYERS ARE PERFORMING LIKE THIS AND COMPLEMENTING THEIR TEAMMATES NO MATTER WHO THEY ARE PLAYING WITH, THIS IS WHY OTHERS WILL WANT TO COME AND PLAY WITH LEBRON IN THE FUTURE. FREE AGENTS WILL WANT TO PLAY WITH A PLAYER OF HIS QUALITY. (TAKE A NOTE ROLE PLAYER KOBE)

Long Time,
"LeBron was amazing last night. He's shooting a much higher percentage than he does with the Cavaliers. It's because Kobe makes the players around him better."

WELL, I WONDER WHY HE'S NOT MAKING HIS LAKER PLAYERS BETTER. WHY THEY KEEP GETTING BOOTED OUT THE FIRST ROUND.

KL
"in the spirit of kobe bashing, isn't it already happening? i see kobe forcing several shots (Walton Sr. calling them out too) and Team USA is destroying the competition. Wait until the real competition begins, then "kobe ball" will work its way into the game with or without Coach K's approval."
"Kobe ball"? Oh you mean taking over in crunch time? hitting the clutch shots and winning the game (see intra squad game)?
You should be worried about "Lebronze ball" getting a free pass (east conference playoffs) and shining when it's tooo easy (see currnet score box, and again east conference playoffs), only to choke at the first true challenge (see 07 finals, and more importantly previous Int'l tournaments BRONZE). . .
Hey by the way, was it you or some else talking about re-habbing a knee a couple of weeks ago?

then no wonder all of the real so called superstar players re-sign for the MAXIMUM
POSSIBLE as soon as they can with their own team. (See Chris Bosh, Carmelo, Yao,
Amare and many more)

---

Yeah, but look at Chauncey Billups and Gerald Wallace. They didn't get max deals. If the
Lakers had had 12 to 13 million free, they probably could have lured one of them away
from their respective teams with more money and the thrill of playing for the
Hollywood crowd (not to mention extra revenue from big endorsement deals).

"On another note, you can not create cap space by doing deals of Sasha and Mihm
unless someone gives a trade exceptiono back."

Not quite. Sasha will be in a qualifying offer next summer, so all you have to do is
waive the qualifying offer and he's off the books.

If Mihm plays poorly this year or isn't able to play, you're stuck with him. If he plays
well, I'm absolutely sure he will opt out of the second year of his contract as a Center
who is actually productive can make way more than 2.5 million.

LakerBake,

Thanks. Every year there are a couple of teams who had high hopes for their seasons and things go sour. Some of these teams try to ride an All-Star too long and it doesn't pay dividends anymore or ownership feels they are paying too much money without getting the results or whatever the case, and they look to cut ties with high salaried and quality players. It happens all the time. Iverson, Vince Carter, KG are all recent examples. And you know it's going to happen this year.

When that player(s) becomes available, more than likely the team will want expring contracts as part of the deal, to provide financial flexibility going forward. That's where Kwame is valuable.

In the end, I don't think the Lakers with Howard and Davis are so much better where I would jeopordize the possibility of landing an All-Star later in the year. Not sure if that makes sense.

Having Kwame's expiring contract is a chip I'd like to have throughout the year. I think this Laker team is a 6-8 seed as presently built and if they can use Kwame + pieces to get something big at the trade deadline, we're talking contender.

LM,

"Sorry Bro. I think you have been duped by reading too much into this blog. The anti-Kobe sentiment shown by a pretty good percentage on this blog is way skewed from reality ....... In any case, Lakers fans (about 1,000,000 to 1) would rather watch Lakers games with Kobe Bryant playing than not."

I know ... I know ... I watch the games on TV ... I hear the MVP chants from the staples center crowd ... but ...

But we'd rather watch NY games with kobe playing than not as well ... I mean you guys have had him for 11 years ...

I guess all I'm trying to say is if the knicks get Kobe ... it ain't like we'd be breaking up a happy home ... he wants out ... and for good reason to ... y'all have a horse trainer who thinks being the owner's son gives him a right to play gm ... a gm that acts like a ball or is it bus boy ....

I understand y'all love him ... but seems like y'all ain't capable of providing an envinroment that'll help his growth ... we can ... think about it ... Isiah is the opposite of Mitch ... the latter doesn't have the b*lls to pull off any signigicant trades whereas the former is always willing to pull the trigger on any trades out there ( and yeah yeah he gets duped every now and then but at least you can't accuse him of not trying )

Enough is enough ... LA give him up

WWW.FIREMITCHKUPCHAK.COM

The People of Los Angeles v. Mitchell Kupchak

Dear Dr. Buss,

I know you are getting up there in years and you may not be down with the Internets like us younger folk. But someway, somehow, I hope you get a chance to read this.

On behalf of the diehard P&G faithful, I would like to suggest that it's time for a change in leadership. Mitch Kupchak may be a nice, intelligent man but he is not the right person to be the General Manager of the Los Angeles Lakers.

We've been suffering these past few years Doc. Really suffering. First Chick died, then that Kobe thing, and then the meltdown in the Finals against Detroit. And then the losing. Oh dear God, the losing. All that agonizing, heartbreaking, "what the hell was he thinking? I'm not going to sleep tonight" losing.

Through it all, through all the mindnumbing losses, we've tried to keep the faith. We're not those powdered donuts that you see on the lower level of the Staples Center. We're the guys who listen to the radio shows, post on the boards, buy the jerseys and really put that money into your pocket. We're the ones who hurt after a loss, who watch the grainy Internet feeds and get manic during win streaks.

We're the Lakers fans. We bleed Purple and Gold.

Like Kobe, we had hope that someway, somehow, things could get turned around again and we'd all be dancing down Figueroa doing the Madsen 3 step. But like Kobe, we've had our hearts broken by some really dumb decisions by management. Brian Grant? Vlade Divac? Aaron McKie? Kwame the Kake-throwing Klown?!? (Don't even get me started on the ongoing water torture that is Sasha Vujacic.) Why did we draft Brian Cook instead of Barbosa? Why did we compound our mistake by giving that bad attitude, low-flying matador an extension? Whose idea was it to let Fisher walk [and then bring him back at way too much money], piss-off Payton and then give the starting point guard job for 2 years (2 YEARS!) to Smush Parker? And why, oh why oh why, did we let one of the most annoying Celtics of all time, Danny Frickin' Ainge, punk us over Marcus Banks [and now KG!!!]?

I could go on but you get the point. There are a lot of questions about the moves the front office has made, or failed to make, during these past 3 years. Granted, it's a bit unfair to pin this all on Mitch. But he's the GM. Like any CEO, he's the one who ultimately needs to take responsibility for the bottom line.

You're a Poker player. You know that some dealers give you nothing but junk cards. I don't know when Mitch killed a lephrachan, broke a mirror and walked under a ladder but the guy has some really bad luck. First as a player and now as a GM, the guy is a walking 3-leaf clover! The organization needs some dynamic, daring visionary who will put an end to all of this squabbling and BS and bring the trophy back to Los Angeles.

I know you have high hopes, as any father would, for your son, Jim, but the game is too dynamic and too complex for a latecomer like your son. He's up against guys who have done nothing but eat, sleep and breathe basketball for every waking moment of their lives. You need someone like Bryan Colangelo (or Magic!!!) who seems to have that Midas touch.

Find the hot hand Dr. Buss and then ride the shit out of it. Ditch Mitch. He's suffering under the sort of karmic debt that would make serial killers weep. Hire someone who is willing to make the sort of bold moves that made the Lakers great for all those years.

We're begging you Doc. It's not too late for another dance down Figueroa.

Sincerely,

"On the premise that we almost beat Phoenix when healthy, ..."

-----

That's probably part of the reasoning of the current front office in standing pat. When they
were healthy they nearly beat Phoenix. Now Phoenix has Amare back, but they gave up
their best post defender in Kurt Thomas and they don't have Tim Thomas to hit the miracle
3 with 6 seconds left to save the series and the Lakers have two more years of chemistry
and better point guards...

KLBeast:

"i think FO has asked a lot of people to play in LA in the past 3 years."

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA.... Wow... I should've guessed your answer would be something like that. I asked you about this current offseason, and your answer is about the last 3 years... typical.

If what you say is true, can you name one quality free agent the Lakers have pursued?

Why is it that we hear about teams trying to acquire free agents (like the Celtics going after Reggie Miller) but we've never heard of the Lakers going after any free agents?

We heard volumes about how the Lakers didn't get JKidd for Bynum, and how they didn't get KG from the Wolves, but we NEVER hear about how they didn't get a quality free agent they were going after... maybe because they aren't going after any.

KLBeast:

"i doubt FO sits on their a$$es and purposely do nothing."

Isn't that what the Lakers are doing this offseason? You've said so yourself.

Maybe you should change your name to F.O. Apologist.

LA Guy,

"Just tell me this - do you think that Kobe has had good shot selection this tournament? Do you think he's distributing the ball well? What is causing the difference between Lebron's 80% and 70% and Kobe's 53% and 47%? What is causing the difference between Lebron's 30 with 6 and Kobe's 19 with 12?"

ok LBJ is playing better than kobe ... is that a crime?
ok LBJ is better than kobe period ... is that a crime?

What's causing LA Guy to highlight the difference between Kobe and LBJ as opposed to say the difference between LBJ and Melo or LBJ and Wade ... or LBJ and Michael Redd ... what's causing LA Guy to keep posting about how some team usa members are better than others ... what's stopping LA Guy from just rooting for his country ... what's stopping LA Guy from just supporting team usa.

Just tell me this dawg ...

Angry,

In the spirit of your day, I'm not going to comment on your posts even though i have something that will shoot your stats down once again.

Have a good day Poindexter.

KL Yeast,

Can't hear you - your head is too far up LBJ's butt.

Open letter to the Laker Nation
ATT.Mamba24/10(spokesperson and leader of the light)
ATT.KL.Beast(spokesperson and leader of the darkness)

I have come to this site to pull the covers of my fearless leader Dr.Jerry Buss.Last night after the booze and whores,I(at Buss residence) stumbled and listened on a private conversation with Jerry Buss and his son Jimmy.Jimmy just got done bitch slapping his farther after Jerry admitted to being the insider,so that he could try to cause chaos in the FO to deflect any attention off him and try to twist the impression that Kobe and myself was the instigator of this disaster that has taken place since Jerry West left the organization,and he is categorically the person that snitched on Bryant,and I call upon all fans to boycott all Laker games till Jerry confesses to his blasphemy.For some reason i feel cleaner now....Thanks...Mitch K.

exhelodrvr,

[The Lakers were lucky to get to that point; PJ pulled a fast one on D'Antoni, and nearly got away with it. The Lakers were not a "second round team". If you go with the logic that "the Lakers were almost there, and just need a little more ..." you will be making a big mistake.]

Ex with Kobe, you're always one piece away from taking the trophy home. Lost in all this trade me crap is the fact that it ain't the players that kobe has a problem with but rather management's decision. Remember what he asked for initially was J. West before everyone came down on him for asking for the impossible. Honestly speaking I think if Mitch got fired today and Magic was made GM, accross the industy ( fans and sports analysts ) would think the lakers future is brighter. But we all know Magic won't be GM because frankly speaking none of us can see him putting up with the crap Mitch does (i.e. constantly taking orders from jim buss) and that really is the biggest problem I have with Mitch, he seems content to just keep his job. H*ll even Shaq said back in the day that since West left the lakers no longer have a gm.

This organization has grown very risk averse and in doing so they constantly passup on opportunities to improve themselves. Forget the players we have now ... change management / ownership's mentality and then you can move forward knowing that you have a management team behind you that's constantly working on improving what's currently out there on the floor.

KLBeast,

"i doubt FO sits on their a$$es and purposely do nothing"

Same way your boss doubts that you sit on your a$$ and purposely waste your company's resources and time on ranting about kobe the devil ...

In my humble opinion you're both wrong.

"The Lakers were lucky to get to that point; PJ pulled a fast one on D'Antoni, and nearly got away with it. The Lakers were not a "second round team". If you go with the logic that "the Lakers were almost there, and just need a little more ..." you will be making a big mistake."

exhelodrvr

Adding Juwan Howard and Ricky Davis to a team that's already got DFISH as well as Mimm back ( who was actually having a carrrer year before going down) is a lot more than a little more pieces... Your essetially adding on veterans who know what is excpected from them... I have always said give PJ and Kobe the team who knows how to win and they will get the job done.... When you have players such as Smush, Cook, Kwame, Sasha, Vrad, Bynum (will give him a break since his only 19) your not expected to even make the playoffs, not to mention an incossitant LO....

I actually think LO will benefit a great deal off of this trade becuase a lot of the pressure put on him to be that #2 guy ( which he is not, and nor will he ever be) add to in Luke who can pretty much give you a little of everything, plus all of the reinforcments (Turiaf, DFish, Vrad, Mimm, Bynum, Mo Evans) and you've got your self a great team... I wou