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Break down, broke down?

The Jermaine O'Neal talks have hit a snag, apparently because the Lakers don't want to include Lamar Odom and Andrew Bynum (along with Kwame Brown) in a deal that would return O'Neal and Troy Murphy.  Since the idea of taking on Murphy's contract is fairly unappealing, I don't see this as a big loss.  O'Neal is a great player, but Murphy has the potential to be an albatross financially.  He shoots well for a big guy and is a pretty good rebounder, but Murphy is a terrible defender.  Can't say I would like this deal.  It wouldn't help the Lakers get push into the upper echelon of the West this or likely next season, and would lump basically all the tradeable assets they have into one deal. 

But the wheels are still spinning, I'm sure, even if they're goin' slow. 

BK

 
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Hopefully, while they are taking a break from JO talks they start widening the lense. There is no reason to get bent over by a former Celtic just to get an overpaid 19 and 9 guy. Those are great stats, but perhaps Gasol would come cheaper.
I realize the likelihood of West trading something to LA while he's a somewhat lame duck before the draft, our front office better have been exhausted that option.
I have nothing against JO, but i'm not convinced he immediately makes a contender for the title. Will Kobe be happy with a second round playoff exit?
We'll see.

Repost of post before Bresnahan article:
________________________

AK:

“That's only seven players. Given their cap situation, they can't do much via FA. Let's say they use Bird rights to resign Walton and Mihm (as many have speculated they will). Even with those two, the MLE and their two second round picks (assuming both make the team), they're barely fielding a 12 man roster. I would be basically impossible to get to 14, much less 15. That's too few bodies”

I disagree. Trading both Andrew AND Lamar for Jermaine O’Neal would be gutting the team in my opinion. We need to ADD another star, not just TRADE one star for another. Other than Andrew, I don’t really consider the loss of Kwame Brown, Brian Cook, Sasha Vujacic, or the #19 pick as anything to worry about. Losing Lamar Odom would be a step backwards. Losing these guys plus Smush might well be a step forward.

Filling in the back of the roster with minimum salary players is easy compared to trying to replace what you lose by trading Lamar Odom. And Lamar is not the guy that Larry Bird has to have; That’s Andrew Bynum. More importantly, the minute you put Lamar in the deal, you are then forced to take back one of Bird’s terrible contracts. Do that and you playing right into Indy’s hands. We don’t want Murphy, Dunleavy, or Tinsley. Andrew Bynum is the target Bird is after. We need to keep our eyes on the ball. Lamar is the diversion that gives Bird the chance to offload his bad contracts on us.

I would much rather have a stronger starting lineup and 8 man rotation than a weaker but deeper team. This is no different from the situation that the Lakers would have ended up in last year if they had made the Jason Kidd trade without Lamar. Yeah, the last five guys on the roster aren’t going to be very good but the first 10 guys will be much better than last year. Assuming we re-sign Luke and Chris and a point guard with the MLE, here is a solid 10 man roster with a big three in Kobe, Lamar, and Jermaine:

1 – Jordan Farmar, MLE
2 – Kobe Bryant, Maurice Evans
3 – Vladimir Radmanovic, Luke Walton
4 – Lamar Odom, Ronny Turiaf
5 – Jermaine O’Neal, Chris Mihm

Do you really think it would be hard to find 5 guys between our two second round draft picks and minimum salary guys who would be as good as good as or give us as much as we got last year from Smush, McKie, Mihm, Williams, and Radman? It’s the first ten guys that are going to play the minutes and make the difference – not the last five.

Chris Webber for the minimum might be an option. Maybe we can get Charlie Bell and Matt Carroll with our MLE. At any rate, if we get good growth from Farmar at the point and Vlade can give us what we thought we were going to get, this team can compete for a championship in my opinion. At the least, it is dramatically better than the team we had last year. Wouldn’t you agree?

I am sure your next argument will be that Indiana can do better. If the Lakers hold firm, I don’t think there is any other deal out there as good. Bird needs a home run and I believe he is set on getting Andrew Bynum. He sees in Bynum what New Jersey and everybody but disgruntled Laker fans and writers see: future greatness at center. He is looking for young players, expiring contracts, draft picks, and outside shooting. The deal I proposed gives him all of those. Silly as it may sound, Bird needs to make a deal as much or more than the Lakers do. He has fewer options than the Lakers do.

Tom

AK:

Just read the Bresnahan article. This is exactly what I was talking about in my post. The Lakers are playing this smart by saying no to Bird asking for both Andrew and Lamar. Notice how Murphy is suddenly in the deal to offset Lamar’s salary. It’s a two-for-none. Bird would get Lamar and get rid of Murphy. No Lamar equals no Murphy! Good move, Lakers.

I would stick to our guns and start talking Andrew Bynum to Memphis or New Jersey. Bird will quickly back down. He has to have Bynum. Just watch and see. The only tough part of the deal is that Bird is probably right to want Bynum that badly. It’s just Kobe’s situation that is now requiring us to make amends for not making the Jason Kidd deal last year.

Tom

Steven (and aliasis) and LA Guy,

SWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.

Thank you Lakers! For leaking some news.

Fatty

Congrats to the Spurs. I'm not a fan...in fact I hated them when we battled against them, but seeing as they're from the "big, bad" west I'm happy they won.

Now it's ON! Or are we gonna have to wait until the draft? lol.

Steven and LA Guy,

Yes, I am a witness...................to the SWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEPPPPPPPPP!!!!!!!!

CONGRATULATIONS ROBE!RT HORRY... 7 RINGS!!

WE MISS YOU!!!!!

Spurs destroy the Cavs in 4. Lebron shows me nothing.

Where is that fool woman LA Times sports writer who kept trashing Kobe by saying Lebron is a better player who knows how to get the best out of his players? What about the stuttering, ugly, dumbass Bill Walton saying the same stuff? This is why I don't give a damn about other people's opinions, including the so called 'professionals' who think they know better than the rest of us.

NOBODY on the Cavs did anything great this entire series. Lebron DID NOT make his players better. Lebron DID NOT play well consistently well. Lebron DID NOT win any games single handedly.

Case in point was this last game. Besides Lebron, only one other person scored in double figures, and Lebron James took more shots than EVERY OTHER CLEVELAND CAVELIER STARTER...COMBINED!!! Yes, COMBINED.

Now, who will criticize Lebron for being selfish? Who will criticize Lebron for not getting his teammates involved?

WHERE IS THAT DUMB WOMAN SPORTS WRITER FOR THE LA TIMES NOW? WHAT TYPE OF BS WILL SHE WRITE TO COVER HER TRACKS, OR WILL SHE JUST LAY LOW AND REMAIN SEEN AND NOT HEARD LIKE SHE SHOULD ANYWAY.

Everybody knows I dont want Kobe to leave the lakers.

But with how bad the East is, I will sign up for the east too.

Now finally we can talk about the offseason which is actually better than the finals. And the world championships games are coming too. Yea baby!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And we can get some resolution with Kobe and the lakers. I am tired of all these talk about if kobe is going or staying. I want some concrete answers and we will get them in the next weeks.

And I have to now say, Tony Parker is now my second favorite player in the league. That boy got game, until he plays against the lakers.

Give up both Lamar and Bynum and take on Murphy contract? Thank you Lakers for staying tough, lets Indiana find another takers. O'Neal is All-Star but he would be best playing alone Kobe as a 2nd option. He could not get Indiana in very weak East to the playofs, and taking Murphy contract for four years which is even worst than Radman? Thanks Lakers for staying put, Larry Bird can try to screw someone else, good luck. It's not a lot of takers for O'Neal contract either.

Nixing this deal gives me hope that management will not be pressured to doing something stupid. Skill-wise, the trade may turn out about even, but with those contracts??? No way! Murphy getting 10M a year shows that NBA GM's are not always rational beings.

We may still get J.O. but at a reasonable price.

all these crappy contracts, what about Tyson Chandler? He's a rebounding machine. Trade Kwame's expiring, and ? or our #19 pick, see if they bite? Piece by piece, right?

PG - TBD/Farmar
SG - Kobe/Mo
SF - Vlad Rad? or ? / Walton
PF - Odom/Turiaf
C - Tyson Chandler/Bynum/Mihm?/ ?

I wish we could find out what the Lakers are thinking about Vlad Rad. Last year was a disaster, no doubt, but the guy's got skills and this offense is made for somebody like him... you think? maybe??? he could come back and be a solid player for us? It would be a big boost, especially if Kobe is still here. LOL!

REPOST

This is probably the worst Finals I've ever seen and the Cavs are probably the worst team ever to make it to the Finals. Hello David Stern!!! Time to change the playoff format. The real 07 Finals was the second round series between the Spurs and the Suns.

Props to Tony Parker, hands down the Finals MVP.

Mitch

Stand tough. We own these guys.

Go Mitch. You can do it.

Fatty

The JO deal isn't the answer and for what they're asking, it would have to be 'cause there wouldn't be any tradeable assets left to get the answer.

I think Jerry's cold blooded enough to know that player rants in the media are just noise. He signs the checks, and he and his family will be here after Kobe's gone.

Just getting the team healthy would be a huge improvement. If Bird caves, great, but there are other ways to do this. In a perfect world, which this one clearly isn't, if there was any way to put Lamar and Jermaine next to Kobe next year ...winnin' time.

I think people may have misinterpreted my post in the last thread. I understand that these stats may be misleading, but the numbers that I'm talking about aren't point differential, but points surrendered or given up per 100 posessions. So when luke is on the floor, last year the lakers gave up less points per posession than when he was on the floor.

Again, I'm not saying he's good defensively, or even that he's decent. but, he definetly isn't as bad defensively as some of you make him out to be.

Oh no the sky is falling ahh!!!!!!! I hope we can keep LO and Bynum..look I know as well as every other fan that this season wasn't that great..but if there is any possibility that Bynum will get better..perhaps it's best to wait it out..and I do not want LO to leave..he'll be back and be ready to go..I hope the Lakers FO doesn't make any silly move that would give a lot away for just one guy such as JO..scary times indeed :-(

The Spurs are a class org. I like them for a couple reasons, not the least of which is I think the Lakers match up well with them.

A healthy 07 Laker roster with an updated point guard would play them tougher than what we just saw.

Let's get this offseason goin'!!!

anyone notice that a TEAM of players just won another trophy and did you all notice what a class act tim is for them it sure would be nice to have a class act superstar on the lakers not a ball hog cry baby. you would never see the ball hog talk about how all his team mates did such a good job noooooooooooooooo it would be all about how his team let him down even though our superstar just threw it up 40 times a game and did not let his team help at all get rid of the bum

If we can find a way to keep lamar and get JO, OMG, that would be one crazy team. We would have JO plugging up the middle, Lamar dishing it as the 3rd option, and the kobster doing his thing. That's what I'm talking about. Ronny coming off the bench, sasha hitting 40 foot bombs. Dang...

i'm not sure if O'neal is the answer to our defensive problems. He is spoken very highly of and is an allstar and a franchise player, but i didnt get to watch many of his games this past year and cannot quite remember if he was a good one on one post up defender. can anybody enlighten me on that aspect of his game? i know hes a good shot blocker and can score, but what about his defense against the big time names in the league? is he the same type of post up presence compared to (regretably have to compare to) kwame?

andand

Larry Bird must really hate the Lakers. This $106.-million dollar deal would bury the franchise in salary and taxes and would strip them from almost all of their players on the block. Giving Pacers $40.Mil liability in salary to receive $106.-Mil salary due is flat crazy. I don't think even Kupchack could be that desperate. NO DEAL

I can't believe up until now the Lakers FO has not contacted ROn ROn agent as wels as the Sac Queens.... That's the deal we need to get done first, and than look at other options... I hope I'm wrong, but given Mitch Kupcake's decision making his not that fund of defensive minded players......

oh i forgot, i mean that he is a help defensively and can hold his own, but defensively it seems that the concensus is that we are weak in the one and three problems and at least one of those areas needs to be addressed along with the aquisition of JO, if that is even going to happen. which i hope it does. JO LO KB is a nice front court. along with Farmar (depending who is signed in the offseason and his improvement over the summer) and a ? at the three position

In light of the Finals being over...

Can we sign a petition to make the Lakers an Eastern Conference team? haha.

andand,

No JO isn't a great defender. One thing you have to understand is that when players get a lot of blocked shot it means, not every time, that there's a lot of penetration. You can tell by points allowed by the team.

The Pacers allowed 98.1 points per contest. If I understand correctly the Pacers were a defensive team. For a team that focuses on defense that's a lot of points. They also score 95.6 points per game. The differential is -2.5.

What all that mean is that they weren't a very good offensive team so they focused on defense. Again, for a team who focuses on defense and to give up 98.1 is a lot.

Take the Lakers. They gave up 103 points per game and they were terrible on defense. The Lakers were an offensive orientated team.

I think JO could do well for us as a scoring option but he's not a defender.

What the Lakers have in Kwame Brown is this: Kwame Brown is "corn-fed." What that means is that he has a natural body. With those gentics he also has natural strength. That's the key.

Everytime Tim Duncan get position down low he's unstoppable. What Kwame Brown does is deny position. He does that with his strength. He pushes Tim Duncan out and it's rare that Tim will force Kwame into bad position. JO does not have natural strength. JO was an over weight kid coming into the league. What JO did to his body was a serious make-over. He looks good now but he doesn't have the natural strength to deny Tim Duncan postion.

Andrew Bynum, Chris Mihm and many other big men in the league have the same problem. Kwame Brown has the body and the strength to deny Duncan postion and that's why the Lakers can play the Spurs one on one when Kwame Brown is their center.

mike

I WON'T EVEN TAKE TROY MURPHY STRAIGHT UP WITH KWAME BROWN!

KWAME BROWN SUCKS! BUT ATLEAST IT'S JUST ONE MORE YEAR WITH THE LAKERS! HE IS INJURED, WHICH MEANS HE WON'T PLAY FOR A LONG TIME HOPEFULLY THE REST OF THE SEASON, WHICH IS A HUGE PLUS!

LIKE WHAT I SAID BEFORE, ONEAL AND GRANGER OR NO DEAL!

Lakers without Smush is already a better team.

Kwame traded for any starter makes the team even better.

When Radmanovich comes down from his space walk, so much better.

The additional year experience for Farmar and Bynum makes them better and thus the team better.

Trading LO for JO does not make the team better.

Yeah, this is actually pretty good news. Still kind of sad that not making a bad trade is goon news in Lakerland, but it is better than nothing. Now we know the front office isn't committed to bad moves just because there's a sense of urgency around here.

Yeah, Lakerdude,

I noticed a TEAM win of players win, players that were capable of contributing so that one player DIDN'T HAVE TO BE A BALLHOG AND COMPENSATE. I noticed a PG who scored points by breaking down defenses; a small forward the could hit from inside and out, a 7 time champion who did all the hustle plays, a 7ft MVP who controlled the middle.

Yeah, I saw a TEAM win tonight...a TEAM full of quality players who know how to win.

If this is true it would be the first GOOD news in awhile. Let Bird trade Oneil for the Knick's trash. Oneil overpaid and overhyped. He could'nt even get his team in the playoffs IN THE EAST! If he can't be dominant there what the hell is going to do here in the West against REAL teams?

I would rather reload with the questionable 'talent' we have now than bring him and his 19 million dollar salary in. NO PANIC DEALS!!

We should make another call to Minnesota. If we EVER trade both Odom and Bynum, we better be getting KG. WHAT SAY YOU?

It doesn't matter who we trade for if the ball hog Kobe Bryant is still on the team. It simply doesn't matter ... All of you posters are hallucinating if you think we will win another title with Bryant. He's poison in a bottle.

Larry Bird must take us (Cupcake) for fools! Why would we trade a 20 yr. old 7 footer with his potential AND Odom who has similar stats to JO AND give up a great expiring contract AND then take on an albatross contract for Murphy who will do NOTHING for our team except to keep us above the salary cap for years to come.

This would be a horrible trade. It essentially would take away all are tradeable assets for ONE JO, who will be turning 29. Bird can shove it. It is bad enough to ask for AB and LO for JO, but then to throw in Murphy's shitty contract for KB and his expiring contract is a joke. I think this says quite a bit about how MK is viewed around the league after that horrible Shaq trade. They think we are desperate.

Sorry, even if it means KB needs to wait a couple of years for AB, I do not make this trade. We are still a young team and KB is not going anywhere. We can pick up a great player in this year's deep draft, we have the MLE exception if MK can use it on someone other than a geriatric, keep LO and hope for a healthy season, and develop AB (JUST LOOK AT HIS IMPROVEMENT FROM YEAR ONE TO YEAR TWO), finally, KB is a tradeable asset, if we can get an Artest out of KB & LW or a lesser player, we have a pretty good team.

Tell Bird to keep his overpaid forward/center, who will be turning 29 and Muphy's horrible contract! I give up LO or AB, preferably LO and KB. That is it!

Lakedude gunner 24 etc

A few reasons why you may want to reconsider getting rid of Kobe.

NBA CHAMPIONS
1980 Lakers/ Kareem& Mgic
1981 Celtics/ Bird
1982 Lakers/ Kareem& Magic
1983 Sixers/ Dr J & Moses Malone
1984 Celtic/ Bird
1985 Lakers Magic & Kareem
1986 Celtic/ Bird
1987 Lakers Magic& Kareem
1988 Lakers Magic& Kareem
1989 Pistons Isiah & Dumars
1990 Piston Isiah& Dumars
1991 Bulls MJ & Scotti
1992 Bulls MJ& Scotti
1993 Bulls MJ & Scotti
1994 Rockets Hakeem
1995 Rockets Hakeem
1996 Bulls MJ & Scotti
1997 Bulls MJ & Scotti
1998 Bulls MJ & Scotti
1999 Spurs Duncan & Robinson
2000 Lakers Shaq & Kobe
2001 Lakers shaq & Kobe
2002 Lakers Shaq& Kobe
2003 Spurs Duncan
2004 Pistons (the exception but 5 all stars and vet bench)
2005 Heat Wade & Shaq
2006 Spurs Duncan& Parker?( MVP)

Now all of these teams had a collection of very good player but what you will notice is except for one year they all had at least one super star. In the NBA to win a ring, you need at least one Superstar. Not one Kobe trade that I have read contains a superstar. Now they all give us some good players but we will not win another ring with any of them. I suggest you consentrate on how we can bring in some quality players like all the other championship teams have done to compliment their Superstar. Everyone that wants to trade Kobe really doesnt seem to get what it takes to win in this league. Oh maybe you probably dont listen to the post game interviews but I did and I cant recall him ever trashing his team mates after the game.

MH

TROY FREAKING MURPHY!?!?!!!


DON'T WE ALREADY HAVE TWO POWER (LACKING) FORWARDS WITH LONGTERM CONTRACTS IN VLADAMIR RADMONOVIC AND BRIAN COOK???


THERE HAS TO BE MORE OUT THERE THAN WHAT THE PACERS ARE OFFERING.


PS. DRAFT RODNEY STUCKEY!!!

Talk about trying to take the Lakers for suckers. First the Pacer want Bynum. To make that work we would have to include Odom to match dollars. If we go in another direction the Lakers would have to do a lot of manuvering. What that means is that if the Lakers wanted to deal Bynum and Kwame that would leave us really short in matching salaries. Plus the Pacers would be getting two undeveloped offensive players for one that is developed. There's no way the Pacers are going for that.

But not only that but with Bynum and Brown the Lakers would have to throw in more players. O'Neal will be making 19.7 million nexy year. Bynum and Brown will combine for about 11.3 million. That's an 8 million dollar difference. The Lakers would have to throw in more players into the deal to make it work. First the Pacers would never go for that and second it's just too much manuvering for it to really work, realistically speaking.

The only deal the Pacers are going to make is with Odom and Bynum. Because of the amount of cash involved in those two contracts the Lakers are still short by around 4 million.

First the Pacers are getting the best of that deal because they're getting an established player in Lamar Odom and they're getting a great potential player in Bynum. If the salaries would match up the Lakers might do it straight up. But for the Pacers to try to throw in Murphy and his terrible contract and we throw in Brown is just the Pacers trying to rape the Lakers.

Take a look at Murphy's contract:

http://www.hoopshype.com/salaries/indiana.htm

If the Pacers want to be reasonable they have to throw in Granger or Williams for a player like Cook and Sasha.

We would send Odom, Bynum, Cook, and Sasha or for JO and either Granger or Williams.

That's the closes thing to fair in the Lakers trying to get JO. The salaries for that deal is around 21 million going in both directions.

Jermaine O'Neil: 19,710,000
Granger: 1,516,800

That's a total of 21,226,800

If it's for JO and Williams it's:

JO: 19,710,000
Williams: 1,470,360

That's a total of 21,180,360

The Lakers total are:

Odom: 13,524,000
Bynum: 2,172,000
Cook: 3,500,000
Sasha: 1,756,951

That's a total of 20,952,951

There's no way the Lakers make a deal for JO by having to give up Odom and Bynum without it making sense for us too.

mike

luigi, get away from the shrooms(toad) and get some peach, man.

ittsss aaa ma-rio!

well good... i see nothing positive in giving up both bynum AND odom for JO

sure o'neil is an all-star but w/o LO on the lakers, we'd still struggle.

but if the deal breaker is bynum (still!) i'd be pissed. keep LO, use bynum as bait

Did anyone catch Eric Snow imploring his team to give it there all while Lebron chews on his finger nails and like the rest of his teamates seem disinterested? Truth is, Lebron had a horrible series. Terrible field goal percentage, awful free throw percentage, almost as many turnovers as field goals, etc. In a crucial minute in the fourth quarter, Lebron simply mishandled the ball and got an unforced turnover. Terrible performance.

Michael Teniente'
"...when players get a lot of blocked shot it means, not every time, that there's a lot of penetration. You can tell by points allowed by the team."

Good Point.

Vent.

Fkillah,

I did notice that. Lebron had just another terrible performance and another bad shooting night. (10 for 30 FG) (32 for 90 on the series). Can you imagine the heat Kobe would be taking if he got swept and shot 32-90 and 10-30 in the final game? Every media person in the world would be calling him a selfish ballhog and calling for his head on a platter.

Lebron gets a break though with statements like "Oh, he's just not the King.....yet."

Hello Everyone this is Reggie. I think that the Lakers should trade Andrew Bynum, Maurice Evans, and Radmanovic to the Pacers for JO and Danny Granger. That's a great trade and I hope that it really happens because the lakers would be better this upcoming season without those four guys.

Reggie

KWAME BROWN CAN NOT DEFEND, ESPECIALLY WITH PERIMETER PLAYERS WHO LIKES TO DO DAMAGE INSIDE. WE NEED INSDIE DEFENSE WHO CAN INTIMIDATE AND BLOCK SHOTS.

KWAME BROWN IS A LIABILITY IN BOTH OFFENSE AND DEFENSE. ESPECIALLY IN THE MENTAL ASPECT OF THE GAME. VERY VERY WEAK MIND. ZERO CONFIDENCE IN HIMSELF. HUGE LIABILITY IF EVER WE GET INTO THE FINALS. HE CAN'T SHOOT A FREE THROW, DROPS THE BALL A LOT. A LOT IOF TIMES HE DOES NOT KNOW WHAT TO DO AND PANICS. HIS TEAM MATES GETS SCARED BECAUSE THEY KNOW KWAME IS SCARED TO CATCH THE BALL. HIS TEAM MATES CAN NOT TRUST HIM.

KOBE GETS DOUBLE TEAM EASY BECAUSE THEY ALLOW KWAME TO BE OPEN AT ALL TIMES. WHY BEACAUSE HE CAN NOT CATCH THE BALL AND CAN NOT SHOOT.

ANY STARTER IN THE LEAGUE IS BETTER THAN KWAME!

PHIL JACKSON'S MISTAKE IN THE 06 PLAYOFF WITH THE SUNS IS SMUSH AND KWAME TAKING UP CRITICAL MINUTES! THEY BOTH HAVE ZERO CONFIDENCE TO PLAY WHEN THE GAME IS ON THE LINE. STEVE NASH HAD A FIELD DAY ATTACKING KWAME IN THE MIDDLE. KWAME DROP THE BALL MANY TIMES IN THESE SERIES. KWAME EVEN HAD AIR BALL TAKING FREE THROWS. EVEN CHRIS MIHM WOULD HAVE FINISH THE SUNS WITHOUT AMARE.

KWAME IS SOFT AND SCARED!

I agree with most of the things Laker Tom said above. This is great news in my opinion. We need to keep Lamar if we want to have a foundation for a contending team. (not that we would contend next year) We would have a "big three" to work with. We would desperately need to fill the holes at PG & SF but maybe Farmar can make a big leap in his second year like Deron Williams did, not quite as big though. Deron was obviously a much higher pick and in reality the sentence before this is complete lunacy, but I can hope right. If we do get JO with out giving up LO then we are basically done with trades this summer hopefully the MLE can serve us well. Hopefully the Lakers can hold out and get this done while keeping Lamar. It would be a great reward for him after the energy and heart he poured in not only to that final Phoenix game, but the whole season. That also shows that he is committed/loyal to the organization.

Matt

Hey sorry to interrupt - I read the blog all the time

I know this is off topic, but does anyone know when Beckham will start playing with the Galaxy? I mean when will the first game be? Sorry again, I'm a girl and I want to get my Dad tickets

THanks!

There is no good reason to trade Bynum and Odom for JO. Odom is as good a player as JO, better priced and less injury prone. Bynum has the potential to keep Oden from totally dominating the Lakers for the next 12 years. Oden will dominate but Bynum will mitigate some of that when he develops Remember, Oden has been shaving for 12 years already and I just saw Bynum buying his forst Gillets with the Captain just a few weeks ago. If the Pacers want to move JO then they should find some other sucker or make the move taking Bynum, Brown and V-Rad. Otherwise forget about it.

As much as I would hate to lose Kobe, I think people in LA would come to see a winner. We loved the Dodgers in 88 because they won, not because of stars. I think its a misconception that LA needs starts, LA creates stars. The Spurs team, playing in LA would be as glamourous as the 3-Peat teams were. It the nature of the city. If the Lakers want to make a move to improve their team they should look to trade Kobe. How much would the NBA love to see Kobe battle Wade, LeBron and Peirce if KB went to Atlanta? The East needs stars and Kobe needs to headline in mano e mano battles. If the Lakers got Joe Johnson, the #3 and Childress (or Lue) in a trade for Kobe I think that would build up our chances of seeing some deep runs in the playoffs. Lamar, Johnson, Conley, Bynum and Young with Farmar, Luke, Chldress (or Lue), Mihm, Turiaf, Cook and maybe that PG thats playing in Russia right now (FA pick-up) would make a nice run in a league that needs quickness, and versatitlity and some shooting ability to make the triangle work. You could make a move later in the year with Brown and one of the extra SF going out for whatever the Lakers think they need. While I don't think you can ever get equal value for Kobe, you at least can leverage the fact that he is Kobe to get something close to what he brings. If the #3 pick turns out to be as good as I think he can be, I think the Lakers will have actually gotten the better of the deal. There is no way the Lakers get equal value for LO. However weird it sounds, Kobe is Kobe and people will pay more for him. LO can always be undervalued by everyone concerned. I also think LO wlll flourish without Kobe. Its not a knock on KB. I simply think LO is even better without Kobe and the begining of last season displayed this. LA makes stars of winners, not the other way around. Its time to sever the ties to the 3-peat Lakers and create a new legacy.

Hey Reggie

As for the
"I think that the Lakers should trade Andrew Bynum, Maurice Evans, and Radmanovic to the Pacers for JO and Danny Granger".

Salaries wouldnt match unless you add Kwame.

Trade Machine Link: It works

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/traderesult?players=981~2748~1031~1016~2760~615&teams=11~11~11~11~13~13

Miguel

IF LARRY BIRD REALLY WANTS BYNUM HE SHOULD TAKE BYNUM, KWAME(EXPIRING CONTRACT), VLAD and COOK FOR JO..... IF HE DOES NOT WANT TO LOOSE GRANGER HE DOES NOT GET ODOM!

Bynum: 2,172,000
Kwame: 9,000,000
Vlad: 5,000,000
Cook: 3,500,000

JO: 19,700,000

O'BRIEN THEIR NEW COACH LIKES 3 POINT SHOOTERS.

This is how line ups would look. If that trade went down.

Granger/Farmar/Sasha
Kobe/?
Luke/Cook
Odom/Turiaf
O'neal/Mihm

Miguel

It shows how little respect other GMs have for Kupkake that the Pacers would even think to propose such an outrageous deal. As much as Kobe and us bloggers would all like to see changes, the JO-Murphy package is one we won't swallow.

Next...

What I'm guessing is that like every year, big names but little trades for the lakers.

We need Gasol, that is also a good defender.

And we need an all star PG!!!!!!

Why talking O'neal, Garnett,... and all these big men? We need a passing PG!

michael h ,

Sorry, but I think there is a small typo in your Championship dates:
It should read,

2005-Spurs Duncan
2006-Heat Wade & Shaq
2007-Spurs Duncan& Parker ( MVP)

Vent.

Larry Bird wants to include Murphy fine! We include Kwame! They take Odom , we take Granger!

Jermaine O'Neil: 19,710,000 (they want out)
Granger: 1,516,800
Murphy: 10,000,000 (they want out)

Odom: 13,524,000
Kwame: 9,000,000 (we want out)
Bynum: 2,172,000
Vlad: 5,000,000(we want out)
Sasha: 1,756,951(we want out)

We will have a huge upgrade at every position: 1, 3, 4 and 5
C (without Kwame we are alrdy better)
PF Jermaine Oneal (better than Odom)
SF Danny Granger (better than Walton)
SG Kobe Bryant (better than Lebron!)
PG (without Smush we are alrdy better)

Well ......if this is a sign of things to come then im a very happy laker fan.....what does this tell and show me ? it shows that the ball is rolling and that the person or persons behind the ball are using there brains...to pull the trigger on that deal we would need to call OUR team the LA NICKS....that sounds like a deal they(newyork)would make...Like many of you have mentioned before taking on another FAT contract to get a deal done may not be the smartest move(long term)..lets hope that OUR team can be patient and make the right moves to get us to the next level....well done mitch and jonny and jimmy and jerry and bobby and peter and greg and cindy and marcia and jan and alice and mr and mrs brady......AND remember this please.......MOM ALWAYS SAID DONT PLAY BALL IN THE HOUSE PETER....hahahaha

wiZo,

I agree with you 100 percent. Lebron is the golden boy and carries an untouchable status in terms of media bashing. Thing is, if Lebron can be praised for his efforts to reach the Finals, then he must take the criticism for performing bad in the Finals. And to be fair, his team does suck and he is still a very young player. But it's not like he had one bad game, he had four horrible games which resulted in a sweep! Like I told KL, it will not matter if the Cavs make the Finals unless they become a legitimate threat against the West. Otherwise, how are they any different from the Nets team that made the Finals twice and got annhilated by the Lakers and Spurs? We are all witnesses to the disparity between the East and West. Shoot, Toronto might have a chance at the Finals next year. How is that for television ratings?

ENJOY IT FOLKS! WHAT THE COACH OF PACERS HAS TO SAY TO THE PLAYERS WE ARE LOOKING TO ACQUIRE VIA TRADE.

STAPLES 24

On Wednesday, O'Brien stopped by Pacers.com to chat live with fans, so check out what the new coach had to say about his style of offense and much more.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kyle (Holly Springs): What player, if you could only choose one, are you most excited about coaching and why?

Jim O'Brien: I would say it would be Jermaine O'Neal. I know there's been talk about trading him, but we think he's a huge factor at both ends of the court. He protects the basket, takes charges, blocks shots and he's been the No. 1 scoring option for the Pacers for a number of years.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Josh Sandstrom (Pittsboro, IN): How do you plan to utilize Marquis Daniels. Do you envision him as a point guard or more of a wing player?

Jim O'Brien: I think Marquis can play both the 1 and the 2. He's more of a 2-1 than a 1-2, but we can use him in both. I think with Marquis and Jamaal Tinsley, the more up-tempo we play, the better off both of those players will be. I want to get Marquis in situations where he's one-on-one.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Jim (Ft. Wayne, IN): What aspects of Jamaal Tinsley's game are most important for him (and the Pacers) to succeed within your coaching schemes?

Jim O'Brien: Jamaal has such a strong ability to handle the ball that the more he can penetrate, under control, into the lane, the more opportunities he's gonna create for himself and his teammates. An up-tempo game will suit Jamaal better than a slower tempo.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Steve Indianpolis: What Do Think Of The Potential of Danny Granger And Shawn Willams

Jim O'Brien: I've had an opportunity to work with Shawn, today as a matter of fact, with his skill level. He really has an ability to stretch the court for an inside presence like Jermaine O'Neal. We'll need to be patient as he learns the NBA game, but I think he has a very strong future as a Pacer. Danny is further along and was challenged last year to be one of the key weapons behind Jermaine and he responded well. We expect, with a summer of good conditioning, that Danny could be in for a breakout year next year.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Eric Matz (Indianapolis): In your previous NBA coaching stints, which season do you feel, personally, you did the best job, and why?

Jim O'Brien: It's a good question, I think we had fairly solid years each time I was a head coach, but my first full year with the Celtics was probably the best, when we went from 27th in the league in FG defense to third and not only did we make the playoffs after a long drought, but we won two playoff series where we were probably underdogs in both series. We grew alot in one year, so that would probably make that our best year.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nick (Dallas):: Last year the team finished last in field goal percentage. What needs to change to improve the team's offensive production?

Jim O'Brien: There are a number of things. No. 1 is to create a better tempo that will have us attacking before the defense can set themselves. Rick Carlisle is a good set offense coach, but I prefer a higher tempo and will challenge our team..on a miss shot and a made shot...to get the ball across halfcourt in three seconds, which should prevent the defense from setting themselves, so we'll be more unpredictable than we were in the past.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
361 - Dallas: Ike Diogu is an exciting young talent. However, his minutes have been limited. How many minutes do you see Ike averaging and what do you foresee his role with the Pacers?

Jim O'Brien: Ike's minutes, like everyone else on the team, will be based on his performance. His role is yet to be determined. Certainly he is a young man who is talented with the ball in his hands down low, but becomes less effective farther away from the basket. He would be a viable option backing up Jermaine, which would guarantee him double-digit minutes but he'll have to compete with David Harrison for those minutes.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tony in Houston: Welcome to Indy coach, I'm a native of Indy and am glad to hear your talk about being flexible and developing a style that is conducive to the roster that you have. With that being said, as the roster currently stands, who do you see as the players who are capable of playing the 2 guard position?

Jim O'Brien: We have a few options. Danny Granger would be one. Dunleavy. Marquis Daniels. They all have the ability to play the two-guard spot.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Evan (Chicago): In your introductory new conference you talked about how your offensive game plan involves shooting a high volume of three point shots. Since Reggie Miller's retirement, the Pacers have not had a player (let alone several) that can make the 3-point shot with any consistency. Doesn't your offensive approach contradict the ability of players you've been given?

Jim O'Brien: We think that we have players that can shoot the three. Danny is a good three-point shooter. Shawn Williams can shoot the three. Dunleavy, although he's been streaky, can shoot it. Troy Murphy can knock down threes. Even though it isn't a specialty of Jamaal's, he's shot at 37-percent for two years, so that's something we can work on. One of the big things in having a team being successful with the three-ball, is having a coach committed to it. We don't want to take bad three-point shots, our definition of a good three is when we have a standstill open three-pointer.

the idea of aquiring JO without losing LO is a must. its late now and my brain aint quite focused, but one quick trade that works money wise, wich i want to maybe tweak later would be a three team trade involving pacers and memphis and lakers.

lakers: JO
Memphis: AB Kwame
Pacers: Gasol MoEvans Cook Sasha

(Negs) Dont necessarily believe Gasol would want to leave for indiana but the pacers i believe would like Gasol and some other decent talent if they could unload one of their big salaries, but couldnt figure that out.
maybe a fourth team?


(positives) We get JO and keep LO
Indiana lets a frustrated JO who wants to go to LA, and they get a cheaper star center in Gasol and decent talent in Evans, cook and sasha
Memphis gets a young up and coming center in AB and an expiring contract with Kwame

What you guys think?

From CNNSI:

As the final seconds ticked off on Cleveland's finest season, Duncan stood at center court with both arms raised triumphantly as the rest of the Spurs danced around their quiet superstar in a huddle. San Antonio's star sought out Cleveland's Eric Snow, but was unable to find James, who had walked off, amid the pandemonium.

"I didn't want to turn around at all and look at it," James said.

That's disappointing. I expect more from Lebron than that.

PACER FANS THINK THEY ALRDY HAVE BYNUM LOCK IN

We need to go after Mike Conley Jr. or Acie Law. Picture this line up in a few years: Mike Conley Jr., Marquis Daniels, Danny Granger, Ike Diogu, Andrew Bynum and Shawne Williams as a sixth man.

"If they are desperate to keep me, then they have to make the necessary effort to get players around me that can compete at the maximum level.
"I want to be in a winning team that has ambition and fights for everything with stronger players.
"I want to have options to have the opportunity that I didn't have last season.""

Hold on, its not Kobe talking....its Pau Gasol. Again, when any other player makes statements like this, people hardly even think twice about it. But when its Kobe, he is the most selfish guy ever.

On Lakers.com:

"Mitch Kupchak: I am responsible for every trade, draft or free agent signing we make. I happen to think we have a great staff, many with 20 years plus of experience. We have our lead scout based in Atlanta, as well as 2 other scouts in the Midwest and East. We also have 2 scouts abroad, one in Europe and one in Asia. And of course we have our staff here. We have a lot of people watching 100's of games and writing reports. But ultimately the decisions of how to use that information and the responsibility are mine."

I've been critical of Mitch for a long time now. I've been harsh but I always gave him an out....and that out was maybe he didn't have full control over who he drafted or signed. Well, if he says the decisions are his....then the fault is his. Time to go Mitch!

Let me just say...nothing will happen this offseason. We're too salary capped right now. Maybe after next season we can trim our payroll and add more free agents.


LET'S GET TO THE POINT.

if the laker roster has ONE glaring weakness right now it is definately at the point guard position.

smush is gone. Evita, shall you weep?

i LIKE Lamar. he's versatile. you get to the playoffs, it becomes ALL about matchups; and LO can matchup 1-5 depending on the opponent. And there are definately WORSE 4s out there.

The PIVOT (aka. center, post.) manned by rehab Mihm, Bynum, injured Kwame, and Rony Turiaf. I'm not crying.

SF? Ok. Walton and Evans. By the way? Where the F@*% does VladRad fit in to ALL THIS???

the 2. The artist formerly known as no. 8. WHO ELSE???

Like you'd REALLY give HIM up for less than GREG ODOM + Zach Raandoph + change. REALLY. THAT'S THE ONLY REAL COIN FLIP.

PG?? This is where the help is REALLY NEEDED.

i personally hope the jo deal breaks down... all along ive felt that gasol would be a better option (cheaper too) and that artest should be a top priority...THE top priority... i mean if we get a mikki moor or a jason kapono or a grant hill thats great... but i honestly believe we NEED artest... and that we should have gotten him when he first left indiana... but yeah thats just me

oh and im not that big on trading bynum this year... but again thats just me... i really dont care if you agree with me or not... just taking up the space on the blog... waiting for the news that the lakers are actually acquiring artest...or that they have finally proved their ineptness publically

jonny

THE LEGEND HAS BEEN CEMENTED!

-Olympics
-World Championships
-NBA Finals

LeBronze has lost them all now! And as the "World's Greatest" he has been personally responsible every time! I guess he just can't make his teammates better. Maybe Team USA will have better luck this year with their no-names.

Somebody get Bill Walton a tissue, for a lot of reasons.

Good move Mitch. No, no, NOOOOOOOOO way do I give up Bynum, Kwame and Lamar for JO and Murphy. Not even close. No. Our three best bigs? Our three best young players for these two guys? Give me a break.

No way. Bird needs to return to ignoring his children (ouch) and stop trying to trade JO to the Lakers.

Wes

This deal would be terrible for LAL. If this is the best that stupid LA GM can do it's better to do nothing and tell prima dona Kobe to shut up.
Or maybe to trade Kobe for Arenas and Caron Butler

I would like to see the Bynum for Kidd deal revisited. I think putting Kidd with Bryant and Odom would help improve this team quite a bit. I would like to see Brown leave but I could tolerate him for a year if we had Bryant / Odom / Kidd and all Brown had to do was rebound and play defense.

Wow, just offering that deal was a slap in the face by Bird. Does Bird offer this deal if West is in the FO? I use to try the same thing trading baseball cards with my 5 year old brother.

Attention Bloggers: LET THE TRADES BEGIN:

FINAL SCORE LAKERS (14) TITLES SPURS (4) SUNS (0)

DAY(43) GARNETT HELD HOSTAGE BY MINNESOTA FOR RANSOM BY LAKERS.
Day (6 ) PARIS HILTON POLITICAL PRISONER

And now.ROLLLLLLLLLLL CALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL:
Faith, Taliq, Edwin Gueco,, KEIFO, FATTY, MITCHELL, KIWI, RespectMyAuthorith,
TIM-4-SHOW, WESJOENIXON, TALIQ, BAYWOOD, Khang, Bobie,SBPIMP
NEVER, CALI KING, RICK FRIEDMAN,THIRTY2, WOW, EXHELODRVR, J-COOL
JJ, AJAX, MIKE T., LAKERTOM, LAKERFAN, DAVID WHANG, GENERIC_ONE
VMAN, KOREY, XTRO, Tha Show, MCGARNAGLE, GUGY, GDChild, Laker4Life
KL BEAST, Jorema, FearlessWhackJob, MARTY, JANDRO, LAKERFAZE, PhxLkrFAN,
TexasLaker, BOB, TreacherousBalloons, EagleBoy, TWOODY, EASTCOASTJESSIE,
Zakee, Swettual, Utzworld, Andrew Z, LAL Fan, BRANDON C., Kinglakernidas,
Fan of Mamba, Mamba24Fan4Life, BlackMamba24, FKilla, CYRUS(VENTRILIQUIST)
Waterboy, Hariyahu, ADAM KILEY,Bynum=The BigLazy, ZEN, SARCOCOP,Staples24
COMPTONS FINEST, MIGUELINHO, Greek Dude, J.Walter Weatherman, SOCALIFE,
Greekdude, Michael J, Michael H, Michael A., Rick Friedman, Gunner24, GINO,
CBUCK,LAKERGURL, CRITICAL BEATDOWN, PFUNK36, PAUL LEE, Jay EL, Reggie
WEAVE MAN, JON KAVULIC, Tajluck, James da Kingpin, BERKLEYLAKER, MFEIGE
DION, KARL, CRAIG, MITCHELL, Lakers4Life, JimBussIsAMoron, JR, Dascilla
GABE, SEAN P., HanSoulFood, HollywoodJack, TheKobeShow, Jay Jay, TaosHum
Caeser, Obel, CHITOWNLAKER, ANGRYLAKER LAKER FANS, wiZo, MagicShaq,
HugoBoss, OSCAR, RDLEE, RealityBites, LakerLarry, Bucky, LEELO, BikBlonde,
Reality Check Time

ALL TOGETHER NOW
WE ARE THE FREAKIN LA LAKERS THE WINNERS OF 14 NBA TITLES
THE HOME OF WILT, KAREEM, GEORGE MIKAN, SHAQ, MAGIC, KOBE,
ELGIN BAYLOR, JERRY WEST, PAT RILEY, JAMES WORTHY, SILK
COACHED BY THE 9 TIME TITLE WINNER PHIL (9RINGS) JACKSON
AND NO ONE AND NOTHING WILL EVER DIVIDE OR CONQUER US

I think this is the Lakers front office using the LA Times to get this message around: “even if our star (Kobe) is asking to be traded (or demanding to see real improvements in the team), we are not desperate enough to make crappy deals with really bad contracts”. I guess that’s a relief... Gotta take a good stand and deliver the goods...
GO LAKERS!

Let me begin today by saying that I take no offense by any of the comments posted in response to my newest suggested plan for the Lakers this off-season. I must, however, admit that I found the majority of the comments highly comical among other things. What I find most amusing is how the comments/responses contradict each of the subsequent plans listed in opposition to mine. Please note that I am not saying that my plan was the best or can’t be criticized. It can and should. However, in many cases, the reasons you have listed for not liking my plans, have contradicted your alternate plans. Here is a synopsis of what YOU all said over the last 2 most recent threads…. “Red…Walton opinions” and “Break down, broke down?”

First, just as a refresher, here was my latest suggested new roster:
PG: Grant Hill, Jordan Farmar, Jason Hart
SG: Kobe Bryant, Maurice Evans, Rookie
SF: Lamar Odom, Devean George, Vladimir Radmanovic
PF: Chris Webber, Ronny Turiaf, Brian Cook
C: Andrew Bynum, Kwame Brown, Rookie
Okay, now here is a list of many of the comments in response:

Comments specifically about Webber and/or Hill:
Weak Defensively, Too Old, Could Retire, Second unit at best, Smush Parker was a better defender this year, Ron Harper was a natural guard, and also an excellent defensive guard. Hill is a SF, who has a history of injuries. No way Hill could defend the other PGs. Webber has NEVER been good defensively. When The Last Time Hill Got Past The First Round? When The Last Time Webber Went To The Finals? I Rather Get Steve Blake, Charlie Bell, Or Mo Williams. Chris Webber wasn't even a good defender in his prime. At this stage, he can barely move laterally, and he can't even out jump Brian Cook. Would you really be comfortable with Grant Hill covering Baron Davis, Deron Williams, Steve Nash, Tony Parker, Jason Terry, and AI..? Get real. These vets who are on their last legs are NOT the primary focus right now. Webber, Hill, etc, these are good guys to bring in once all the trades and signings are complete. Both of those guys aren't much more than Vet Minimum right now, and they will likely want to go to a winning team that has a chance at going all the way. Therefore, they're not signing now and we're not asking now.

Comments specifically about George and Hart:
Not sure we could sign the players: Alternate choices - Kapono, Mo Peterson, Mo Williams, possibly still Hill. Better choices like Charlie Bell, Desmond Mason or Kirk Hinrich. Why would George or Hart want to leave where they are and come to the Lakers?

General Comments:
Suns, Mavericks, Spurs, Rockets, Jazz, Pistons, And The Bulls would still be better. Worse Defensively than what they have right now.

Now…..here are some of the subsequent plans that were suggested within these same two threads….

Plan 1
PG: J Kidd = Kwame, Cook, Bynum, 1st or 2nd Round Pick.
SG: Kobe
SF: Artest = Radmanovich and 2nd round (We have 2, 2nd round Picks)
PF: Lamar
C: Jamaal Magloire (5million) Assuming he will take that....
Reserves: Farmar, Evans, Grant Hill ($1mil), Turiaf, Mihm ($1mil), Sasha and Left over draft pick.


Plan 2
PG Duhon/Farmar
SG Kobe/Evans
C Kwame/possible Mihm re-sign
SF Mo Pete/Vlad/Walton
PF JO/Turiaf


Plan 3
1 – Jordan Farmar, MLE
2 – Kobe Bryant, Maurice Evans
3 – Vladimir Radmanovic, Luke Walton
4 – Lamar Odom, Ronny Turiaf
5 – Jermaine O’Neal, Chris Mihm
Chris Webber for the minimum might be an option. Maybe we can get Charlie Bell and Matt Carroll with our MLE. At any rate, if we get good growth from Farmar at the point and Vlade can give us what we thought we were going to get, this team can compete for a championship in my opinion. At the least, it is dramatically better than the team we had last year. Wouldn’t you agree?


Plan 4
PG - TBD/Farmar
SG - Kobe/Mo
SF - Vlad Rad? or ? / Walton
PF - Odom/Turiaf
C - Tyson Chandler/Bynum/Mihm?/ ?
I wish we could find out what the Lakers are thinking about Vlad Rad. Last year was a disaster, no doubt, but the guy's got skills and this offense is made for somebody like him... He could come back and be a solid player for us? It would be a big boost, especially if Kobe is still here. LOL!

On LeBron:

I never had him in any serious discussion of "best all-rounder in league" anyway. Jaw dropping skills and unique package, but too young, and too few defining performances. I've said this several times, but he's a Penny Hardaway mid-nineties level right now. Fresh face, impossible skill combination, and iconic commercials. Still very good, and probably second team all-decade already, but not on the Kobe level yet.

He does have the potential to get to Kobe's present level, and maybe even to the ultimate Magic-Larry-Michael level. Then again, so did Penny.

It is obvious, that the Pacers are trying to get ride of both - J.O'Neal and Troy Murphy for two major reasons. The first one is no longer the franchise player, he was once and is injury prone. The second one is just not something, that you need very badly. Both of them have a big contracts and are definitely OVERPAID. That is why, Larry Bird is trying so hard to ship them together to L.A. Lakers don't need those players.
ESPN.co has published, that Pao Gasol from the Grizlies has asked for a trade. He is just 26, and has average of 20.8 ppg - 9.8 rpg - 2.1 bpg and will earn $ 13.3 mil. next season.Comparing to $ 19.7 for J.O'Neal, that is $ 6.4 milions less. Wow! That is a huge diference, hah! Lakers can work on this deal, shipping in package L.Odom, A.Bynum and V.Radmanovic. That deal is worth and will make the team container again.Of course, we need some more pieces for the new puzzle, like FA Mo Williams from the Bucks and Ron Artest from the Kings. The total of the salaries of Kw. Brown and Br.Cook will match the sum of Ron Artest. The Maloff brother will be happy to have Kwame as a starting PF and Cook as his back up.
If the Lakers can get these three players - Pao Gasol, Ron Artest and Mo Williams and eventualy trade our pics #19 and # 48, along with S.Vujacic for a higher first roud pic or role player - center or Power Forward, that will make Kobe more than happy, as well as all of the Lakers fans.
Mitch, it is your turn. The time is runing fast. July 01 is arround the corner.
Lakers needs significant changes in order to get back, where they belong.

I agree with LakerTom. I agree with BK and the whole consensus that Larry Bird is crazy as hell if he thinks we're taking Troy Murphy who is the second coming of (wasted contract money on Austin Croshere).
Bird got screwed by Chris Mullin and GState as they rolled after that poor trade. He's not going to hit us now.
If Bynum and Odom have to go which I think is smart by Indiana cause who in the hell wants Kwame and a not yet ready Bynum if they trying to sell their fans. Now at the all star break when you only have 2 months of Kwame left on the books that works but not now.

I think the Lakers should keep the #19 pick if they can. I think that's probably the deal breaker for the Lakers getting
Jermaine O'Neal and Danny Granger which makes more sense if you want Odom and Bynum.
The Lakers would have to throw in Sasha or Cook to make the salaries work. Who cares about Cook cause he plays smaller than 6-10 anyway and he does not mesh with Phil.

So the #19 pick should be held to make this deal work until June 28th if there are no better deals over the next 2 wks.
It's a BIG LAKER DECISION.
Why not go ahead and lock of Ron Artest if possible but that deal could cost Luke and you can't do Luke till July 1.

Lakers need to make a JO decision by the draft cause the #19 pick is the deal maker.

NO DEAL WITHOUT GRANGER ALONG WITH JO. THERE IS NO WAY unless there is a Kwame Brown deal happening for sure for a 3rd star.
If you give up Brown to Indiana then our summer is over from a tradeable asset standpoint.
Can't do that either.

The #19 pick although it is attractive, we know Phil barely will allow them to really become absolutely a solid rotation person. They might get minutes but will they be allowed to make a difference. It's 50-50 so
if there is nothing else we can do I'd sign off on

JO, GRANGER for ODOM, BYNUM and #19.

That's it if no other deals can be swung now or later.
Mitch needs to be busy working 15 hour days over the next 2 wks.

We have to keep in mind, NONE of us really wants another BYNUM and BROWN down low yr with Lamar acting like a 3rd star instead of a 2nd star on the team. Luke can't be the third best player without a shadow of a doubt anymore. More talent is needed or

KISS KOBE goodbye and welcome to LAKER HELL!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Michael Teniente,

"No JO isn't a great defender. One thing you have to understand is that when players get a lot of blocked shot it means, not every time, that there's a lot of penetration. You can tell by points allowed by the team."

Yeah, but when the Laker's consistently allow perimeter penetration, Kwame still only averaged 1.2 blocks a game. What Kwame gives you in one on one defense we immediately lose on help defense, which is probably more important in the faster-paced NBA.

Good Morning.

This is very unLaker like to leak this much info about a trade. So, why did they do it?

1. They are serious in making a trade, a big one.
2. They are not desperate and will not do something stupid.
3. They will go over the lux tax for the right deal if they have a chance to contend.
4. Odom could go.
5. Kid Bynum could go.
6. Kobe is not going anywhere.

Will the deal happen? I feel a high probabillity exists, but on terms more acceptable to us.
Why?
The only other team willing to make a strong play for JO is NY. But Bird covets Kid Bynum. A key component in our advantage. He wants him bad. He thinks Bynum is the player to build around. Everybody else is really secondary.
Remember this deal was being worked on before Kobe's meltdown. The deal was almost done. Kwame, Bynum, a throw in, and the number 1.
Bird got greedy and was testing the waters to see if he could dump some salary. (Perhaps because of Kobe's meltdown) The Lakers considered taking some bad stuff, but Bird wanted to see how desperate the Lakers were and pushed the limits. The Lakers refused.

Other teams will come into play now that the Lakers have set their ground rules for trading this offseason. This is a golden opportunity for Bird. Taking JO's large contract off his hands and getting his prize center Bynum. Not wanting to lose this opportunity, Bird will relent. Remember, he is under pressure as well after blowing two major trades, and having a team of criminals that he built.

If any other contracts are taken, it will not be Murphy. Tingsley is the only one the Lakers might take. Now that the deal is public, Indy fans will be evalueating it as well. Mid-season the Indy fans were talking trade with the Lakers. The player they wanted, Bynum. But they felt the Lakers would never part with him. The Lakers are now willing to part with Bynum. Indy fans love Bynum.

If Bird can ply away Bynum, take on a large expiring contract, get a #1, and possibly dump Tingsley on the Lakers, he will look awfully good to his fans. His teams future looks a lot brighter than before the trade.

This deal is going to happen and soon, but on more favorable terms to the Lakers.

Fatty "Let the trades begin, and the good times roll"

Mamba 24 =

FINAL SCORE LAKERS (14) TITLES SPURS (4) SUNS (0)

True... but we're not quite a dynasty yet!!!!

Keifo, "True... but we're not quite a dynasty yet!!!!"
Yeah maybe if we trade that ball hog Kobe we might
get somewhere. Just look how dominant Shaq
was this year. LOL!!!

Gary,
Are you reading news from february? Gasol has said that he will remain in Memphis, and thinks the team is taking positive steps. Not even worth conversation any more. In case you doubt me.

"Gasol re-iterated his desire to remain a Grizzly despite having made a trade request in January.

'Yes,' he said, 'I still want to be (in Memphis). There are a lot of things that still need to happen to make us better. We all want to see who the new general manager will be and what moves they make. We need a good free agent. We need some more pieces to be more competitive. Talent and youth don't always translate to wins. But it's great we have a coach now. It seems like a good fit.'"

http://www.commercialappeal.com/mca/grizzlies/article/0,1426,MCA_475_5565220,00.html

People It seems like a lot of people don't mind making fools of themselves by posting things that make them look that way. Read the date on the story before you say things like that. At least post a link to the story you read it in.

Hell NO, No trade for LO!
The only changes that need to be made is to get
Artest for some of our table scraps and get a jorneyman
point guard. Let Farmar start this season and by playoff
time he will be a seasoned vet and ready for the playoffs.
Kwame is in a contract year so since everybody thinks
he's all about money his play should improve tremendously.
Minh will also be back so we will have a three headed center
of Kwame/Bynum/Minh which should greatly improve things in
the center and provide insurance in case one of the centers
goes down like last year. The Subtraction of Smush and
the addition of Artest together with a healthy LO and
a mature Farmer and a healthy Rad is all we really need
There is no need for a second superstar. Artest defense
will reinvigorate Kobe's defense and this will be the equal of
the Bulls doberman defense. Smush was the cancer and
lack of defense was the killer. With both of these solved there
is no reason we can't contend. I say again:
HELL NO DON'T LET LO GO!
HELL YES, GET ARTEST

No deal unless Granger is involved!!!! They want LO, and Bynum, then we HAVE to get Granger. I wouldn't mind taking on Murphy's salary so much if they add granger to the deal. I'm at work so I can't use the trade machine but I've got a feeling this would work:

Indy gets:
LO
Bynum
Kwame
Cook

We get:
JO
Granger
Murphy

From what I hear Murphy is a horrible defender, but with his outside shot, and rebounding skills he COULD be a good fit with us. I don't like the idea of trading away all our chips to one team, but I would do it if it got us Granger, and O'Neal. Here's the roster:

Bell-Farmar
Kobe-Evans
Granger-Radmanovic
Murphy-Turiaf
O'Neal-hopefully a vet signed for the minimum (i.e.Mutombo/Magloire)

I don't think that's a bad lineup.

The Lakers should address their problems, not look for blockbuster trades.
Problems: 1. Perimeter defense. Especially against the Suns.
Solution: Get a defense minded PG. Get a defense minded SF.

2. Shot blocking:
Solution: Brynum, Mihm, Kwame, and Odem should be ok there healthy and improved. Brynum is due for a break out year this year or next.

Getting JO for Brynum and Odem would only be making more problems. These guys have upsides. JO is at the
downside and injured all the time.

3. Playing as a team
Solution: Share the ball. Watch the Spurs. This is the biggest problem to be solved.

How much would a Caron Butler be needed now for scoring. And Kupchak trades away for a gamble.
And instead of a defense minded player, Kupchak goes after Vlade.

Kupchak, go after defense minded perimeter players. Get some more athletic players instead of plodders.

The inside is fine with Odem, Mihm, Kwame, Brynum, Ronny.

The problem is the perimeter defense. Ask Jerry West.

Jman449,

LMAO. However, you forgot to mention Nike where "We are Witness" for creating the hype on this guy. I wouldn't want you to get fined by the NBA or NBC or TBS or ESPN that tries to sell this shyte.

THE LEGEND HAS BEEN CEMENTED!

-Olympics
-World Championships
-NBA Finals

LeBronze has lost them all now! And as the "World's Greatest" he has been personally responsible every time! I guess he just can't make his teammates better. Maybe Team USA will have better luck this year with their no-names.

Somebody get Bill Walton a tissue, for a lot of reasons.

Note to Stearn - YOUR LEAGUE SUCKS!

Mike T,
Kwame Brown is not a good basketball player. Period. HE STINKS. How can anyone possibly defend his ability?

Hey Lakers fans. My name is Gary Arakel.
I am well into the situation for that trade talks with Indiana and would like to say something for all of you guys.
JUST FORGET ABOUT JERMAIN O'NEAL.( and Troy Murphy)
We don't need O'Neal.Really. As someone has said above, the Lakers need to ad another star player, not to trade one of ours, for someone else. Just look at the rosters of the top four teams in the league.
The Surs have - Dunkan, Parker and Ginobili.
The Suns have - Nash, Stoudemire and Marion (not mentioning Barbosa)
The Maverics have - Nowitzki, J.Terry and Howard.
The Pistons have - Billups, Hamilton and R.Wallace
Teams with one or even two stars won't get a title. Just look what happened with Cleveland and Miami.That is the reality today in the NBA.
At the other hand, teams like Chcago, Golden State and Portland has straitened their rosters with young and talented players and are a real danger for the next season. It is going to be very, very competitive in the West. To make the conference finals, the Lakers need to ad another star(not an All-Star, but good all arround player) like Ron Artest, Jamal Craword, Mo Williams. How we can do that? Yes. It's tough question, I know, but we have some players for trades like Radmanovic, Kwame Brown, A.Bynum, Br. Cook, S.Vujacic and even Luke Walton. Speaking about Luke, I have just read in the LA Times, that he is going to ask for not less then $ 5.0 milions and six years contract. Honestly, I don't think, he deserves that kind of a money.Just look at his stats and compaire it with others, making that kind of a money. He was awfull in the playoffs. He will never be an All-Star, as his famous father was. There is no growt in him anymore.Trust me on that.
I think, it will be better for both, Luke and the Lakers to part a ways. He can get a better deal elswere and we can sign FA Jason Kapono (UCLA product) from Miami for the half of that money. And don't forget, the guy is one of the best three point shooter in NBA (.514 3P%). Another one, who will be perfect for our offence is FA Matt Carroll from Charlotte, sharp shooter from behind the arc, who makes just $ 1.1 this season.They both can split the money, Luke is asking for.
We need to resign Chris Mihm for something between $ 3.0 - $ 3.5 per year and Rony Turiaf, for about $ 2.5 per year. Those two are really important pieces for our future. At # 19 on the draft, there is no one, who can help and make an impact to our team. Therefor, it is better to include the pic in a trade package. With # 40, we can get Aaron Aflalo - UCLA to complimate His Bruins teammate Jordan Farmar.

Come on, folks:

All of you now talking about LeBron should really check yourselves. When it comes to Kobe going out in the first round, many of you say, "give him some help." I said before the Finals started that LeBron had basically the same roster, and got to the Finals in a weaker conference. It showed. But now you're dogging out LeBron the same way you DON'T like the way Kobe is dogged. I agree that LeBron will ultimately be judged by the number of titles he wins.

But there are three major differences between Kobe and LeBron.

1. Kobe is the better player.

2. Kobe is also the more experienced player.

3. Despite what any of you may think about the Trade, Kobe had the benefit of playing with Shaq, a HOF coach, and for the 1st 8 seasons of his career, he was surrounded by top-shelf talent/depth. The reason he's getting more heat now is because that talent is gone, and, rightly or wrongly, Kobe is blamed for much of that talent being gone. LBJ carries none of that baggage. At least, yet.

AS FOR THE TRADE:

No way I'd take Murphy in that trade. No way.

Thanks to Kobe we're going to get raped in any trade we try and make.

That's our fearless leader for you.

Peace, good points.

It's interesting and somewhat ironic that much of what has made Kobe great - experience with HOF center and coach - is also the reason he's disliked as being opportunistic and selfish.

I don't think Kobe was close to perfect in dealing with Shaq and Phil for those 8 years. I do think he's better for having give through those experiences. LeBron has yet to go through comparable development. This years Finals could help narrow that gap.

Lee

I agree with most of what you say. I don't think JO is injury prone however. I do think he's a downgrade from Lamar in one of the two big areas we need help: on-court decision making.

"Can you imagine the heat Kobe would be taking if he got swept and shot 32-90 and 10-30 in the final game? "

Kobe played worse than that in 2 of the 4 Finals he played in (the first and the last), and he had a far better supporting cast and far worse opponents to boot. And yet you guys still treat him like a god.

"Now, who will criticize Lebron for being selfish? Who will criticize Lebron for not getting his teammates involved?"

When Lebron has 10 assists in the final game and averages 7 a game for the series (and 8 a game for the playoffs), it becomes difficult for anyone to criticize him as selfish. Especially when his other biggest criticism was that he was too unselfish. And especially when his teammates show as complete incompetence as they did - and he kept passing anyway.

Honestly, If the FO can pull off a deal and not give up LO, we might have the best front court in the NBA with those two guys in the game at the same time. Lamar and Jermaine would make for a monster rebounding tandem. 23 RPG from the two of them. Not to mention a third guy up front that can pull a few if Phil wants to go big. I hope they pull it off that way.

"But it's not like he had one bad game, he had four horrible games which resulted in a sweep! "

14 points, 7 rebounds, 4 assists
25 points, 7 rebounds, 6 assists
25 points, 8 rebounds, 7 assists
24 points, 6 rebounds, 10 assists

Yes, he didn't shoot well and he had too many turnovers. But what kind of universe are you in where those are four horrible games??? He averaged 22-7-7 for the series - those are huge numbers! Compare them to Kobe's Finals numbers in the Detroit series, or in the Indiana series (and his shooting was worse than Lebron's in both). And Kobe did that despite having huge help, while the entire Spurs defense was keyed around Lebron. I think that you've spent a little too much time in KB's private room and got something in your eye.

psp,
"which is probably more important in the faster-paced NBA"

Exactly. Post defense is less important now than 10 years ago. Help defense and shot blocking are more important now than 10 years ago.

If Kwame Brown is as valuable as M T thinks, the Lakers phone must be constantly ringing with teams trying to trade for him.

Watching the Finals got me to thinking that the best thing for the Lakers to do is trade Kobe. I would take the approach of a 4-5 year plan, getting cap space, picks and young talent, developing an identity with the intention of peaking when Duncan, Nash, Detroit, Shaq, and the rest are on their way out.

I just don't think we have the pieces or leverage to make deals right now that would bring us to the level of the elite teams in the league.

I say get a deal done with Chicago if possible, let PJ walk or give him a front office job and promote Brian Shaw to develop a young team. If we could get players like Deng, Thomas, Gordan, the #9 pick and cap space (a combination of these pieces) I think the Lakers could be solid next year and have a much brighter future than they do now.

Mamba -

Might have to agree with you on this one.

No way we give up Odom, Baby B for JO.

Keep Lamar and get Artest for scraps.

GO LAKE SHOW!!

Come on Folks give Lebron a break. I seem
to remember the Mamba shooting airballs in
a couple of his initial playoff series. For his
age, Lebron is better than either Kobe or
MJ were at their age. And mind you this
is from a Kobe First Kobe Last Kobe Forever Fan.

"Thanks to Kobe we're going to get raped in any trade we try and make.

That's our fearless leader for you."


That's twice now that he's done it to us. Thanks Kobe!

Keifo!! Thanks for the support.
Just remember Phil is on his last year
Kwame is on his last Year, Baby B has
something to prove and LO will be healthy.
Give the Lakers Artest and another
point guard and they will rule.

 
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