Contract Shtuff
August 8, 2006 | 1:02
pm
Thought y'all might find this article interesting for a few reasons.
1) Well, it's interesting.
2) It mentions Kobe (in a positive light) and Kwame (not so much) by name.
3) It makes you think about both the contracts of newest Lakers player Vlad Radmanovic and the non-contracts of players such as Antonio Daniels, Marcus Banks and even Caron Butler, all of whom would have liked to have been Lakers, but were deemed unworthy of the theoretical price, length of stay, or both. And given that it'll be a piece of time before the Lakers are well under the cap, it's a topic that will probably end up heavily discussed for a few seasons.
—AK
Laker Tom
First of all, why on Earth are you taking this so personally and throwing jabs at me? I didn't say anything meriting that reaction. I'm now suddenly in line with an allegedly racist owner for simply acknowledging that his team (that finished better than the Lakers and game for game, did better against the Suns in the playoffs) might actually be better than the Lakers? That's pretty weak.
And since you brought up the last game, the Clips were already in the playoffs at that point, more or less locked into a position (and if anything, trying to get lower) and playing without Maggette. The Lakers were the ones truly fighting. Not that the victory doesn't count, but it wasn't quite the mano y' mano you make it sound like (again, to me)
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/recap?gid=2006040913
As far as the way I assessed what you wrote, I already acknowledged that if I took it too literally, my bad. What more do you want? And for that matter, I too acknowledged that the Lakers could have ended up beating any of those teams. I just didn't think it was as easy as you made it sound (to me, if nothing else). But since the "individual players" are what actually consititute "the overall matchups," so I'm not sure why you seem to be dismissing my approach.
Finally, I'm a true Laker fan (since you questioned my sincerity), but I just call it like I see it, as opposed to how I want to see it. If you prefer to always take the most optmistic angle, have at it. That's your right. But you don't own the patent on how to properly be a fan any more than I do. To question anyone's loyalty smacks a bit of "high and mighty."
AK
Posted by: Andrew Kamenetzky | August 09, 2006 at 11:48 AM
Zakee:
I agree that Farmar will be primed the first time he plays Nash. He knows the Lakers need a strong defender and he has said he plans to become a shut-down defender.
Farmar is really our only “true” point guard and will be the starter sooner rather than later.
Tom
Posted by: LakerTom | August 09, 2006 at 11:58 AM
Sola:
Thank you for your post. You would think it was a Knicks blog the way we have to drag “optimism” out of some of the “fans” on this blog. This is the first time in three years that Kobe, Phil, and Mitch have all come out and said that this team can compete for a “championship.” That should be news to rejoice, be happy about, be hopeful about. All of these Laker “critics” just let go and be “fans” and believe for a change. Thanks again.
Tom
Posted by: LakerTom | August 09, 2006 at 11:58 AM
Here we go again. Laker Tom; the man with the litmus tests.
Posted by: sonnybelfast | August 09, 2006 at 11:59 AM
Andrew Z:
Tell AK to bring on the next group of West teams. As Mitch and Phil and Kobe all have said: There is NO team in the West that the Lakers really fear.
Tom
Posted by: LakerTom | August 09, 2006 at 12:00 PM
LakerTom,
The Lakers are NOT on the list of teams who might win the title. Even in this age of "parity."
Posted by: exhelodrvr | August 09, 2006 at 12:02 PM
Laker Tom,
I never said the Lakers should be "afraid" of any team. Why would they be? But not being afraid of them doesn't necessarily equal being able to beat them in a seven game series.
Again, rooting for the best (i.e., the Lakers taking it all). But I see a fair amount of obstacles. Just my opinion.
AK
Posted by: Andrew Kamenetzky | August 09, 2006 at 12:05 PM
Fear the Kings.
Posted by: sonnybelfast | August 09, 2006 at 12:06 PM
I have made note of this before and I will document it again, I feel we can go 500 within the WCF and 750 against the east. If we defend the basket and get after every play -- I think it just boils down to our guys making a commitment on both ends and covering each other as a team. Moreover, I believe we have the players who will display a disciplined needed to accomplish such a feat. We came together immensely at the end of last season -- and there was no locker room divide like previous seasons. To me, the overall growth of the team will have enabled them to evolve to the next level. We still have new pieces to incorporate . But at the same time, we have more players who understand their individual roles and will be able to share the love to our newcomers. Whereas in previous seasons, Kobe & Devean were the only ones who really had a grasp and orworking knowledge of what we wanted to accomplish. Now, whether that infers championships is another story. But I feel we have as good a chance as any of those other clubs out there -- none of them are imposing nor dominating and definitely none are dynasties.
Posted by: lakersrydeordie | August 09, 2006 at 12:10 PM
AK:
My apologies. You are right. The cheap shots involving Sterling and the Clippers were really uncalled for. I really would never associate you with anything anti-racist or of not being a fan. It just seems sometimes that you are always taking the Clippers side over the Lakers.
Anyway, it just frustrates me to see Laker fans acting as if we were the Clippers, oops I meant the Knicks, and had no chance at all of winning the championship. You just sort of had the misfortune to end up in my sights. I actually broke my keyboard typing so hard.
My true apologies, I never ever intended to question anybody's loyalty or fandom just because they do not agree with me. I am only trying to get the "doubters" to see that there is nothing wrong with believing and enjoying the high. Sorry for shooting at you.
Tom
Posted by: LakerTom | August 09, 2006 at 12:15 PM
You go AK, maintain blog order. Ain't it amazing how the Laker uniform gets a more intense level of loyalty than stars and stripes? Understandable, but, well, interesting. Gotta get the season started, the natives are getting restless. This goes on much longer there'll be a 72 win season bandwagon.
Since there's never been a blog offseason before, I for one, find it interesting as well, that we're still blogging our brains out and the Dodgers aren't quite getting the same kind of ink slinging even going on 11 wins. Got a take on that? Lack of internet access? Fans have real jobs?
Posted by: Vman | August 09, 2006 at 12:21 PM
Sonnybelfast,
What's up guy? So who are the Kings going to trade Artest to this year after he goes nuts? .....Again. :)
Ken
Posted by: Ken | August 09, 2006 at 12:22 PM
"I would never associate you with anything anti-racist..."
Now that's an apology!
Posted by: sonnybelfast | August 09, 2006 at 12:25 PM
AK,
Assuming that LO maintains his high level of play to end the season and Kwame Brown is able to average around 15 and 10, where do you place LA in the western conference hierarchy.
I've said this a couple times: I think Kwame Brown is the catalyst to a great Laker season. If he can give us a solid 15 and 10 I think we've got a legitimate shot at being a 5 seed in the west.
Your thoughts?
Posted by: Xodus | August 09, 2006 at 12:27 PM
Vman,
The thing is that the Lakers are an INSTITUTION while the Dodgers are simply just another franchise.
Posted by: Xodus | August 09, 2006 at 12:29 PM
Laker Tom, James Katt,
Glad you mentioned Bonzi. I totally agree he's the kind of experienced vet that could step in and produce. He'd be a nightmare for coaches alongside Kobe. I'd add Bynum to a deal for him although I know no one else here would. At 31 he's no bargain but Kobe comes first, and he needs all the ammunition possible now, not in years to come.
The original "cap" plan is toast. When Grant's money comes off we're still up around the cap. The league is wide open, but we need one more piece, one more guaranteed, playin' animal and Bonzi fits that pic.
Posted by: Vman | August 09, 2006 at 12:29 PM
Ken,
Yea, we're going to trade him to the Brokebacks, but only if he blows up first.
If you haven't noticed though, we have a way of turning bad boys around.
Posted by: sonnybelfast | August 09, 2006 at 12:30 PM
AZ,
Not really on drugs but closing eyes to realities and always imagining the glass is half-full. While others are evaluating the personnel and possible difficulties with proven records with power teams, some people think that we are the power team to be reckoned with, because of Kobe,LO and Phil.
I remember during the Phoenix playoffs, go back to the archives and read those posts who were so anxious of victory! and guarantee the 4th game on the Lakers winning it without resolving the problems encountered in Games 5 & 6, ahh! they just kept on saying: "Lakes will win beat Clippers", reminding me of the former radio Laker announcer, Joe Buttitta during those pregame interviews. He conditioned anybody calling on the radio on the prescribed solution to any kind of problem suggested and there wasreally no problem but it was outlook of that caller. When somebody probed him, he dismissed the call and select the ones that validated his arguments. All I am saying, we are all Laker fans like the beloved late Chick or Stu Lantz they're cautious and criticize when they see a bad plays and offer suggestions. If there are critics in this blog, we have to be thankful that there are someone concerned in painting a different perspective just in case an unforeseen pitfall and sh*t happens cuz' playing in the NBA does not always yield a rosy ending. Is it conincidence that many NBA teams have not won a single trophy to this date? There are lots of planning and player movements and imagination involved during the off-season, that is also the reason why it is necessary to load the team with good players, go for early practice and tune-ups and from there, leave it to the Coach how he will utilize his personnel.
Posted by: Edwin Gueco | August 09, 2006 at 12:32 PM
For everyone's edification, let's hear some of that great analysis (no sarcasm intended) of teams your team will play.
I will ask that you indulge me. For the sake of true objectivity, place the Brokebacks as the home team of Portland and the Blazers the home team of La La Land.
Do this with other teams as well, if needed.
Posted by: sonnybelfast | August 09, 2006 at 12:44 PM
for you sonny
http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=AuTxHqjBMYDtKwx8K5LInuy8vLYF?slug=cnnsi-freshair&prov=cnnsi&type=lgns
Posted by: joninjapan | August 09, 2006 at 12:46 PM
Laker Tom,
No worries. I appreciate it.
And to clarify, I'm not taking the Clipper's "side" on anything. My allegience is my allegience and it lies with the Lakers. I like the Clips and root for them (assuming they're not playing the Lakers), but there's no side to be taken. My mind is made up.
But if you're asking me which team is truly better (as opposed to the team I'd prefer be better), as of NOW, with what we KNOW (as opposed to what we're hoping for)... I'm sorry, but I honestly think it's the Clips. But I also have my reasons, none of which have anything to do with taking sides.
Yes, Kobe is better than anyone on the Clips. But Brand is an elite player better than anyone on the Lakers not named Kobe. And if you go down the rosters, the Clips are deeper, more athletic and more talented. That's a hard one to refute. They also put up a better record than the Lakers while dealing with more key guys getting hurt throughout the season (Maggette, Ross, Kaman, etc.). The Lakers, save Mihm and 10 or so games with Kwame, were borderline injury-free with important players. And yeah, the Lakers can get better. But so can the Clips (and every team, for that matter). I think people often overlook that part of it when they talk about the theoretical Laker improvement. These other squads can step it up as well.
Bottom line, the Lakers have more question marks than the Clips, in my opinion. LO has a history of inconsistency (which I personally think he'll overcome, but he hasn't YET). Kwame hasn't proven a thing other than being a very good one on one post defender, a match up that doesn't always even come into play. The best PG (in terms of what we've actually seen) is Smush, who (save improvement) is better suited as back up. Outside of Kwame and Mihm (assuming he comes back healthy) are the only true bigs we know can handle big minutes. Sorry, but that's a lot of ?'s to consider.
I do think the Lakers made some strides. They finished the season strong. Vlad fills a definite need and I think Evans was an underrated pick up. But that doesn't erase the fact that I think they're a still little behind some of the other teams. At least until I SEE otherwise.
AK
Posted by: Andrew Kamenetzky | August 09, 2006 at 12:46 PM
Vman,
I think the Dodger fans know deep down that this 11 game streak is a mirage. And that the Padres are the superior team. That's why the Laker blog is popping off way more in my opinion.
Posted by: Rocky | August 09, 2006 at 12:48 PM
LakerTom
See you at the parade this year. You SIR have the "FAITH" (hi Faith). Even more so, you got balls, stepping to AK... WOW! Glad you two can settle it like men. I agree with you that we were a win away from pulling it off last year, and our team is and will be better this year! You've got the Magic - Kobe attitude, meaning that there isn't a team we can't beat or a matchup were afraid of. We have the best player, coach and orginazation in the NBA. I'd hate for some of these guys to be in Mitch's shoe's cause they'd go after every big name time and time again. I think allowing this team some gel time, come January most of these posts will change and start chanting the Championship song. Unfortunately only you, I and a few can step up a say it now, instead of waiting for the standings in April to pull out the jerseys, flgs and the like. Sorry azzz fans that only jump on when things get real good. Are they not paying attention that Kobe is hanging with team USA? knowing that's going to fuel his fire because he's just watching from the side lines. Also that he was a active voice during this off season which brought in Radman. Wake up LAKER FANS... Our team is taking shape and if you'd stop making wish lists for players and support the one's we have we'll be just fine.
FazeOne
Posted by: Lakerfaze | August 09, 2006 at 12:50 PM
Xodus,
Should all that you mentioned happen, I definitely think they're in the thick of things. But I have to see it first.
I personally think LO is the true key in the Lakers success, since you know what Kobe's gonna bring and LO's the next most talented player and can do more things than even Kobe. I would say as Odom goes, so do the Lakers. But no matter how you rank them, Kwame certainly needs to step it up as well.
AK
Posted by: Andrew Kamenetzky | August 09, 2006 at 12:53 PM
AK can you clarify what you mean by "can do more things than even kobe"
im not quite sure i follow you
Posted by: joninjapan | August 09, 2006 at 01:06 PM
AK,
I'm sorry, but what are you talking about? The Clippers are not better than the lakers. They had a slight advantage after their trade for Vlad last year, but I see the teams as very even right now. Kobe is better that Brand and every other piece is about even. Plus the Lakers have a better coach, G.M., and owner. It will be a great thing to have both teams battle the next few years but the Clippers are not better than the Lakers.
Posted by: Ken | August 09, 2006 at 01:07 PM
i agree with lakertom. For the first time in three years we have a chance at going all the way. We should just be happy with that and enjoy the journey like kobe say's. Might as well think positive and dream, what do we have to loose?
Go Lakers
Posted by: TrueLakerFan | August 09, 2006 at 01:11 PM
JoninJapan,
LO's versatility, which I think is better than Kobe's. Not taking anything away from Kobe, who's certainly a versatile player (there's really no area where he's lacking) and obviously the best player on the team. But when I interviewed Kareem, he summed it up best by describing LO as a "swiss army knife." Plus, Odom doing what he can do at his size creates more mismatches.
AK
Posted by: Andrew Kamenetzky | August 09, 2006 at 01:11 PM
AK,
Thanks AK. BTW, what have you heard (if anything) about Kwame's offseason workouts. I've been thinking about this for a couple months now. And that's why I think Kwame coming back and playing well is of the utmost importance. I trust that LO will come back and play at a high level, I'm still not totally sold on Kwame.
Posted by: Xodus | August 09, 2006 at 01:14 PM
thanks AK
must be nice working closely with the kalers/NBA in general
hope it pays well haha
Posted by: joninjapan | August 09, 2006 at 01:15 PM
oops typo lakers my bad
Posted by: joninjapan | August 09, 2006 at 01:15 PM
Two free agents left who stand to make a big impact out there. Bonzi and Wilcox. Where will these guys end up? I gotta think Bonzi is a good fit in Detroit where they need some toughness now that Wallace is gone. Bonzi has shown that he is one of the best rebounding guards in the league. Playing him alongside Rip would give Chauncy a rest too. If he resigns with the kings, look out. Sac-a-tomatoes becomes the 4 seed in the west, easy.
Wilcox is another story. He wants more than Seattle wants to offer, and there are not many teams out there that can give him much. Could there be an Atlanta deal involving Al? Thoughts?
Posted by: Dmack | August 09, 2006 at 01:15 PM
Ken,
Every piece after Kobe/Brand is absolutely not "about even." The Clips second string PG (Livingston) is better than any option on the Lakers. Heck, Daniel Ewing could give Smush a run for his money. There ain't a GM in the league who'd take Kwame or Mihm over Kaman. Corey Maggette would possibly start ahead of any of our 3's. They're deeper with backup bigs with a track record (Aaron Williams, Rebraca). They're just deeper period.
Yeah, I'll give you PJ over Dunleavy (although Dunleavy can coach) and it's not like the gap is monstrous or anything. But until you see proof of the Lakers playing consistently like they did the last 20 games/playoffs, you have to give the edge to the team you've actually seen perform better. At least for now.
AK
Posted by: Andrew Kamenetzky | August 09, 2006 at 01:22 PM
Andrew Z, that line about the drugs cracked me up...
LakerTom, glad to see you apologize to AK, I thought you were out of line. It's all good.
AK, get that thread on the other teams started. I think before some of the expectations get out of hand here, we need to really see where we have areasonable chance of ending up. Personally, I agree with you; anything can happen in the playoffs, but it's hard for me to see us being better than fifth in the West. If we finish there, and get one series, that would be a good year. Great years only end with banners...
Posted by: Michael A | August 09, 2006 at 01:26 PM
Just to throw another name out there. I'd love to see Jamal Crawford in a laker jersey. The knicks have a gluttony of guards, we've got a mini-jam at the center position. Would a Mihm for Crawford deal make sense and is it feasible financially.
In Kobe we trust,
Go Lakers.
Posted by: Taliq | August 09, 2006 at 01:27 PM
Thank you Joninjapan. Nice link. For the most part, I concur with his assessment.
Posted by: sonnybelfast | August 09, 2006 at 01:28 PM
I think the team we're really going to have problems with is Phoenix. And I don't know anybody out west who wants to see Houston witha healthy year from T-mac and Yao, not that will likely happen.
I hope Kwame has a strong year. If we don't get anything from him or Mihm, we'll be in trouble. if we do, we'll take our share of wins.
Posted by: Michael A | August 09, 2006 at 01:30 PM
Taliq, I think Crawford may be the last guard they give up. Seriously, I know Thomas likes him, and he's the kind of player you'll never get equal value for.
And if we don't get another big, we can't afford to give up Mihm. We'd be one injury away from looking very much like a doughnut.
Posted by: Michael A | August 09, 2006 at 01:36 PM
Xodus,
Haven't heard a ton, but I'll let everyone know if I do.
AK
Posted by: Andrew Kamenetzky | August 09, 2006 at 01:45 PM
AK or anyone
HOw the hell are the CLIPS DEEPER then the LAKERS?????????????????
Please explain!
Posted by: Zakee | August 09, 2006 at 01:51 PM
Zakee,
Read what I just wrote earlier. Then take a look at their roster/potential 8-10 man rotations. It's pretty obvious, especially with the bench.
AK
Posted by: Andrew Kamenetzky | August 09, 2006 at 01:52 PM
AK,
I think we should continue the threads on the other teams on Western Division as suggested by joninjapan. We stopped on GS, T'wolves and Blazers perhaps concentrated on AH situation. If there are some people who think that we have won Western Conference at this juncture, that's their opinion, they can go on vacation since there nothing to be discussed.
With regards to to Donald Sterling housing bias suit, there was an out of court settlement perhaps to shun from unpleasant publicities similar to that of Kobe's case. There was no conviction to prove that Donald Sterling was guilty as alleged. Without any judgement of that sort, we cannot address him as a "racist on tenant applicants" since the case was settled out-of-court. To continue labelling him or insinuating that he is a racist could create a case of LIBEL. The Law Office of Donald Sterling and his economic influence in Greater LA, especially in real estate ownerships are vast and fully advertised almost weekly in the Los Angeles Times. He is no Al Davis, but if push comes to shove, his law office here will protect his economic interests and integrity as a clean businessman. I hope we take extra care on those unproven statements. We're enjoying our blogging and we don't want anybody being accused at the LA Superior Court.
Posted by: Edwin Gueco | August 09, 2006 at 01:56 PM
Edwin,
The next entry's in the works. Fear not.
AK
Posted by: Andrew Kamenetzky | August 09, 2006 at 01:58 PM
thanks, AK
Posted by: Vman | August 09, 2006 at 02:00 PM
LakerTom, Xodus, and Ken,
When we start speaking about the potential the Lakers have to contend for a ring and we use things like "If LO continues his high level of play like he had at the end of last year (which was basically averaging 20-10) and Kwame goes for 15-10" I cringe. These guys have been in the league for 5 and 7 years and have really come nowhere near to achieveing those numbers over the entire season. If that does happen I would be absolutely surprised if the Lakers aren't in the WCF (assuming they keep that level in the playoffs). But I can't sit back and start throwing IF's out there and convincing myself they could happen. Hell, IF Amare comes back to 90% of what he was we have no chance, IF Duncan and Ginobli both play on TWO legs we have no chance, and IF Josh Howard and Dirk Nowitzki continue the improvement they showed last year we have no chance. Like AK said, if the biggest most optimistic fans have to look at the situation realistically.
i think the Lakers can beat any team on any given day, and they should be saying they're not afraid of any team, but realistically they're chances for a title are such long odds it's tough to talk about them winning with any sincerity.
Posted by: Andrew Z | August 09, 2006 at 02:00 PM
Zakee,
Going position by position it's easy to see that the Clips look better on paper.
Chris Kaman is one of the better centers in the league unless Kwame is able to hit the 15 and 10 goal he's set for himself.
Elton Brand is an absolute stud. And as much as I love LO, I'd take Brand over him.
Corey Maggette is a very good 3 and I've heard a few people call him a poor man's Kobe. I think he's more like a poor man's Paul Pierce but either way he's better than both Vlad Rad and Luke.
Kobe Bryant is the best player in the league and he's much better than Cuttino Mobley, but Mobley is no slouch himself.
Sam Cassell is a great veteran PG and better than any PG we've got on the team.
Their key back-ups are Quinton Ross who's a great defender and Shaun Livingston who's also better than any PG we've got on our team.
Posted by: Xodus | August 09, 2006 at 02:01 PM
AK:
I just re-read my post against you. Sorry about that. I was really totally out of control and the cheap shots were totally uncalled for against anybody not named Steven. I also meant that I would not associate you with anything racist, not anti-racist (thanks, sonny). My bad and I appreciate your accepting my apology.
I also re-read your posts and do understand your well-made points. I do agree that not having Mihm would work against us playing the Clippers and I do remember that the last game was more important to us. It would have definitely been a 7-game series.
I also think the Lakers still have the edge against the Clippers because they are the Lakers and the Clippers are the Clippers. It takes more than winning two more games and getting one round further in the playoffs in one year to change that. Let's see who ends up with a better record and goes further in the playoffs this year.
I also agree that the Mavs in the playoffs were a different team than the one the Lakers beat three times earlier in the year. I actually think that the choke job the Mavs pulled against the Heat was very similar to the choke job the Lakers pulled against the Suns. Both teams were young and got their confidence shattered and ended up losing after being on the brink of winning.
It will be interesting to see what effect that has on the two teams this year. I think that the Lakers history and stature will let them shake the losses off, but the way they lost could affect the Mavs the same as it did the Queens. They may find that it is not as easy to get back to the Finals once you have blown your big chance.
Finally, I agree with your comments about the Mavs double-teaming Shaq and agree that Kwame could have made his rep in that series holding Shaq down one-on-one. I also think Kobe could have done a better job holding Wade down than the Mavs guards did. If both teams are lucky, we may actually get a chance to find out for real with a Lakers vs. Heat Finals this year.
Tom
Posted by: LakerTom | August 09, 2006 at 02:02 PM
zakee,
The lakers are about 2 deep with Kobe and Lamar. Everybody else couldn't start for any other team. Our bench players can't even bench for another team (maurice evans). The clippers have maggette, cassell, livingston, brand, kaman, ross, etc.
Posted by: Chim Chim | August 09, 2006 at 02:04 PM
Edwin
lol for a moment i thought you were going to give us an acronym for libel
AK
heh i've stayed up allnight waiting for the new thread. . .cant. . .ho.d. . .on. . .mu. . .l.n.er
but i guess i can always check tomorrow or something
lol no pressure intended
Posted by: joninjapan | August 09, 2006 at 02:05 PM
AK,
You mentioned performance that you have seen, then you mention Livingston,who while he is an excellent prospect, he hasn't shown anything yet. Right now he is the back-up with averages of about 6 ponts and 4 assists. Kaman is better offensively than Kwame but not defensively, which is what we need out of him. Odom is better than Maggette, Vlad and Thomas are about even. That's what I mean there is not that much of a difference.
Posted by: Ken | August 09, 2006 at 02:06 PM