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Another Offseason Breakdown

Lakerville (as the kids like to call it) is being heavily discussed and dissected today on Hoopsworld.com. The post includes a potpourri of perspectives on what the team should do, shouldn't do, would do if they could, etc. Some ideas strike me as dead on the money. Some strike me as either unrealistic or just plain off. But either way, it's food for thought and y'all are always hungry when it comes to the Purple and Gold. So eat up and enjoy.

AK

 
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On the same note, its not really Phil's job on saying what players we should draft or trade for. However, his opinion counts because after all he has been very successful in his system and he knows what type of player would fit well.

From what I understood about the JW/Phil problem was that JW was in the locker room during a playoff game and Phil asked him to leave. I don't think Phil was wrong in doing that even though JW may have been the boss. Phil wanted the players to only hear his voice at that moment in time. After all Phil was the coach. JW should have just let him coach. JW can talk to the players during other times. Not in the middle of a playoff series!

Mike T,
Your right. JW is very knowledgeable and and as a player I would also seek advice from him. However, there is a time and a place for that and I think it was just bad timing.

Mike T.

I think the locker room incident was just a straw that broke the camel's back. Jerry W. could already sense the frustrations brewing up between these superstars and he tried to patch-up their simmering distrusts with each other.

When PJ was signed by Dr. Buss in 1999, Jerry West embraced Phil with a suspicious smirk. JW and PJ were diametrically opposed with their coaching philosophy and there's competitive spirit between them not only in the management but also when they were players in the 70's. Phil was considered as an outsider from the Bulls trying to get into LA turf of JW. When Dr. JB became comfortable with Phil with the prodding of his daughter, Kobe & Shaq, as well as LA fans adored Phil's influence cuz' Lakers were winning games, somehow Jerry West's power got dissipated by overnight success and at the back of his mind, he sensed that his services were no longer needed. He knew then that his Laker days were numbered. According to Chick not relating to incident, JW was always psychologically upset of himself, couldn't watch games, couldn't move freely anymore the way it used to be. Jerry West wants to be a normal Jerry West again, however it was not easy to be uprooted from his long relationship with his beloved Lakers as a player, coach and GM nor leave his Bel Air home and settle to the boondocks of West Virginia.

Well, it's all history now, the move to Memphis was a win-win for Jerry West.

Jon K:

I predict that whoever signs Bonzi Wells as a free agent will get a 20/10 player next year with no atttitude issues who will become a major matchup problem for the opponent every time he steps on the floor. It is not impossible to foresee him also winning the Most Improved Player award.

If the Lakers do not sign him, then we will be sorry and some other team will be very lucky. He would be the missing piece to contending for a ring next year. Remember this when I remind you next year at this time. We will see who was right then.

Jon K:

We will have a free agent prognosticator contest between us based on the performances of Bonzi Wells vs. Darius Miles during the next season. Loser will, of course, have to eat his words on the blog.

Go, Bonzi.

Mike T:

Props for backing the Buss family. Laker fans are spoiled by having one of the best owners in the world. They have no idea what it is like to be a fan of the Clippers, Celtics, or -- God, forbid -- the Knicks.

Thank you Jerry Buss. Go, Lakers.

Bonzi or Darius? I wouldn't want any of those guys unless they came real cheap.

Better yet, lets ignore Bonzi and Darius. They aren't worth thinking about.

AK:

Thanks for your view on what Kobe should have done to prevent the Lakers from having to make a quick deal with the Heat to trade Shaq.

Unfortunately, you make the same mistake as your brain-dead (not you, them) fellow media do: you intentionally or wrongly assume that Kobe was part of or involved in the team's decision-making process regarding trading Shaq.

For the record, Jerry Buss made the decision not to give Shaq the extension he was demanding for specific contractual and financial reasons. It was Shaq's reaction to that decision that lead Buss to decide to trade him. As Jerry has clearly stated and Kobe steadfastedly maintained, Kobe was never invited to nor did he participate in the process.

You said "I don't mean this is as an 'it's all Kobe's fault.'" No, just mostly his fault. Funny, but he wasn't the guy that let the team down and wouldn't get into shape. Nor was he the guy with the rude comments and ridiculous contract demands. He didn't ask Jerry to fire Phil. He didn't ask Jerry to trade Shaq.

Contrary to what Chuckie Atkins and the anti-Kobe media want everyone to believe, Kobe didn't want or try to be the Lakers general manager. For you to suggest that the insufficient value received in Shaq's trade was Kobe's fault, is another example of the almost insidious bias that the media has against Kobe.

To insinuate that Kobe was at fault because he didn't call the Lakers up and tell them to take their time trading Shaq because he was going to reup with them is grossly unfair. And, I would add, unappreciative given all that Kobe has done for the Lakers and what he means to the franchise.

It's another of those "Damned if you do, Damned if you don't" media scenarios for Kobe. AK, you should be abashed if not ashamed. Give the kid a fair break for once. Show us you are a Laker fan.

Edwin:

Excellent recap of the Kobe vs. Phil situation that led Jerry to resign. Unlike Shaq, Jerry has always taken the high road and shown his class when asked about the Lakers. He will always wear purple and gold in his heart, even though that may be in Memphis now. I am one of the bloggers old enough to have seen West play in his prime. There has never been a backcout player who scored so many points so effortlessly. That, of course, is why he is the Logo.

Andrew Z:

Mike and I can include you in our rotisserie free agent contest next season if you don't think Bonzi is overrated. I am taking Bonzi, of course, and Mike has chosen Darius Miles.

Who would you like to have as the "player" the Laker should have gotten? To keep the contest fair, of course, you can't choose someone that we could not get, e.g. LeBron, KG. etc. We can have AK add the GM Free Agent Rotisserie Challenge as at thread on the blog with monthly standings of each blogger's "guy we should have gotten."

AK: What do you think?

Those two players are going good during a contract year. Move on!

LakerTom,

I don't think Darius Miles is a free agent so I can't say I would sign him over Bonzi Wells. I think Bonzi Wells would be a nice addition, I just don't think he's a 20-10 guy and an All-Star which you seem to think. I also think, in terms of dollars, that he will be in the same range as Al Harrington and I would much rather have him. He's young, talented, and has no track record of being a serious headcase.

I for one don't see any free agents on the market this offseason that are particularly appealing (I'm taking what they probably will get contract wise into the equation). That is why I would like to see the Lakers secure a couple picks or trade for some young talent. We seem to be taking the approach of building this team organically rather than looking at free agency or trades to make an impact, and if indeed that is our approach then I would like to see them commit fully to that.

As for a free agent rotisserie league I would have to look at a free agent list to see who's all available.

Here's another question for all bloggers. If Toronto called and said they would trade the No.1 pick in the draft straight up for Andrew Bynum, would you do it? If so, who would you draft?

Trade Kobe

The Lakers SHOULD have traded Kobe prior to his becoming a FREE AGENT. There were many Shooting Guards out there at that time with the SAME skill-set as Kobe. Players such as Allen Iverson and Tracy McGrady would have fit very well with Shaq in the middle. Any ATHLETIC shooting guard will reap benefits from playing with Shaq. Shaq commands double teams as opponents plan around defending Shaq. Just look at the Miami Heat using the Dwayne Wade model, Wade has benefitted emensly professionally and privately with the addition of Shaq.

Professionally Wade being acknowledged nationwide for his basketball skills. Personally DWade is being marketed by the NBA and corporate sponsors which will pay big bucks for his endorsements, thus helping his family live a charmed life of the American Dream. So while Kobe Bryant and his agent are trying to 'get-in-where-they-can-fit-in', DWade is charming the major corporate sponsors with his flashy smile, his quiet unassuming demeanor along with a will-to-win.

Shaq is more than just a basketball player, or a DOMINANT presence inside. He is also revenue generator, just ask the DWade and the Miami Heat about their 'bottom line'

OUT!!!
the Truth

Of course West had "the right" to be in the locker room and talk to the players. Just like Jerry Buss has "the right" to do that if he wants to. But that doesn't mean that it is the right thing to do. It would depend on the context of the situation, whether or not Phil had requested that Jerry not do that without first checking (which would be entirely appropriate for a coach to do), and what the nature of the discussion was. (i.e. was Jerry giving advice on using the backboard vs not using hte backboard, or was he discussing the best plays to run in certain situations.)

LakerTom,

Thank you for your indefatigable efforts in trying to help the Lakers to put the right combination at the minimum cost. I salute you for all those research and promotion your MAN - Bonzi (sounds like Banzai! in Japanese it means may you live 10,000 years.) That's the real fan.

Well, in the case of AK comments about Shaq & Kobe, as Lysander said, it's now all water under the bridge. We're just going back to history and AK was contributing based on what he knew then about the situation. He's not entirely blaming anybody. Well, we always put AK in a dilemma. We asked questions, he answered based on what he knew, now he gets the rap for his unfavorable comments. It was just a story telling as we relate back to Laker history.

exhel, i dont really know what happened but from what i recall, i thought phil kicked jerry out of the locker room. (not literally). this is probably just speculation, but i wouldnt be surprised at phil doing that and undermining jerrys authority in front of the team. i think phil could have asked jerry in private to no longer visit the locker room as it is a distraction. its just odd that phil, being a dirty player in the L, being egotistical, unprofessional, and classless (trashing kobe in his book), is somehow portrayed as the epitome of wisdom and class. i think the word that best describes phil is "overated".

andrew z:
interesting question but almost impossible to answer. at this point i would say no. we've seen bynum's potential. he's still super young. and will be a legit C. so that makes me say no trade. however, we cant really answer confidently without seeing the top guys in their workouts.

i really think tyrus thomas is an intruiging prospect. watching march madness, we saw his potential. long lanky and ridiculous athlete. he gets compared to stromile, but in my eyes, will definitely be better than stro. stro while a freak of nature athlete, was as raw as u can get. tyrus definitely has more potential to improve.
then theres bargnani. i know every tall euro that can shoot is somehow the next dirk. i always thought that was ridiculous. in fact i hate almost all comparisons. qyntel woods was the next pip. dorrel wright the next tmac. yada yada. however, i think the bargnani comparisons to dirk are actually not way off. he actually might be a little quicker than dirk. very intriguing prospect as well.
im not too high on aldridge tho. however, he is bigger than advertised (6-11 235) which helps his cause.
but since Mitch hasnt called me yet about checking these guys out and helping him decide...i say no trade.

Has anyone else read that Bynum is on the block? That's what a New York paper said this morning. Just wondering how legit that was. But, if we were to trade Bynum we better get something pretty good.

As far as Bynum for the number 1, I think I might do it. But as far as who I'd draft, it would be between Bargani or Morrison. I really think Aldridge and Thomas are overrated. They're the next Loren Woods and Stromile Swift. I would have to see more workouts of Bargani and Morrison to decide who to take. I think both would fit decently in the triangle, and both would give us a good 2nd or 3rd scoring option. Morrison and Lamar or Bargani and Lamar in the front court would just be match up nightmares for teams.

Just for the record: I consider Phil Jackson an outsider. He doesn't have Laker roots. He a Knick as player and Bull as a coach. Everyone knows he has an ego but, I guess, that doesn't really matter. He's the coach now but I'm betting after his contract ends that'll be the end of PJ as a Laker anything.

mike

Laker Tom,

"Give the kid a fair break for once. Show us you are a Laker fan."

I am giving Kobe a fair break, because I described what I feel is obviously the truth. I'm evaluating things as I see them and from sources closer to this than myself. You can give a team your undying support and still call it like you think it is. One's got nothing to do with the other.

Of course, much of this had to do with money Buss didn't want to spend on an extension for Shaq (and rightfully, I might add). He would have been insane to extend Shaq at that price. I never said the whole thing was over Kobe. It wasn't. Shaq made his own bed in many ways.

For that matter, I never said Kobe was solely or even mostly responsible for certain difficulties during that trade. Just that he bears SOME responsibility. He absolutely played in role in putting the team between a rock and a hard place. And that's not only fair to say, it's incredibly obvious for anybody willing to see things other than through the eyes of a die-hard Kobe fan. There are certain things that were blatant and can't be ignored, unless you simply choose to.

When it comes to Buss' statements, I think you're taking them too literally. Yeah, Kobe may not have specifically drawn a line in the sand and said, "Him or me." But that's because he didn't have to say it, since he obviously didn't want to play with Shaq anymore. And Shaq didn't want to play with him anymore, either (again, not letting Shaq off the hook). The two were done as a duo.

You can't tell me that Kobe was indifferent as to whether or not he'd continue playing with a guy he butted heads with for 8 seasons. That's just ridiculous. Perhaps Kobe didn't sit down with the Buss family and Kupchak during those meetings, but that's only because his opinions were already clear. And it clearly played into all of this.

If Shaq's trade had absolutely nothing to do whatsoever with Kobe signing or not signing, then explain why the Lakers so obviously felt a need to do this transaction ASAP. Why were the Lakers so obviously sweating the speed with which this happened? The only logical reason is because they were trying to lock up Kobe ASAP and that wasn't gonna happen until Shaq was out of the picture. And Kobe pressed the issue by flirting so openly with the Clips. He forced their hand, to SOME degree. That's just plain and simple. Be objective for one sec and it's plainly obvious, unless you can provide me with a alternate and believable explanation.

What I'm saying isn't even "anti-Kobe," for that matter. Unless, of course, you're like many fans who seem to define "anti-Kobe" as saying anything less than 100% flattering about the guy. But that's a pretty narrow way of viewing things, in my opinion. Everything isn't black or white. There is a lot of gray and I think most things tend to shake out that way. And in this particular case, there were many sides at play. That's just the truth.

People sometimes take the whole "love me or hate me" thing a little too seriously. It's just a marketing slogan. It's not literally the only two options you have when it comes to thinking about Kobe. Saying something less than 100% complimentary about the guy isn't the same thing as being "against" him. Flat out criticizing him from time to time isn't being "against" him. At least not to me.

AK

BRAVO AK!!!!! BRAVO!!!!

About G-D time somebody with some SENSE pined in!!! Some of these folks need to put their pom-poms down and take off their Kobe Bryant panties to look at the BIG PICTURE.

(On second thought,....some might need to leave them Kobe Bryant panties on,...just unbunch 'em) However,....there is a BIGGER PICTURE to the scheme of things.

OUT!!!
the Truth

AK:

I do understand what you are saying and I was really only teasing you about being Anti-Kobe, although I would like you to be more Pro-Kobe.

I think most of the fans on the blog would agree with me that the media in general is definitely biased with respect to Kobe.

They persist in perpetuating the perception that Kobe was guilty of rape, even though the evidence said otherwise and the case was dismissed.

They continue to insinuate that Kobe demanded the Lakers fire Phil and trade Shaq, even though Jerry Buss has stated that that was a business decision related to Shaq's contract demands, ensuing age, and unwilingness to get into proper playing shape.

What do you think? Do you think the media has been unfair to Kobe in the past? It seems so obvious to me and many Laker fans that the media in general is definitely anti-Kobe. How can you not see that? As far as the general media goes, it IS only love and hate and Kobe is the HATE.

That is why we always end up in these passionate and emotionally charged arguments involving Kobe. We are quite literally getting his back as fans who appreciate everything he has done and will do for the Lakers. That is all we can do. That is the LOVE.

Can you understand that? Can you see why we are so sensitive when it comes to Kobe? Better yet, knowing that, can you be sensative when you feel the need to criticize or assign blame to Kobe. That is what I meant by "Give the kid a break."

I am NOT saying that keeping Kobe was NOT a factor in why Jerry Buss decided to move quickly on the trade of Shaq to Miami. It was clear to everyone that Kobe was tired of playing second fiddle to Shaq when the guy wouldn't even get into shape.

Having said that, my problem is that the media has wrongly portrayed the entire breakup from day 1 as Kobe demanding that Phil be fired and Shaq traded, which was never the case. Do you deny that this is the perception that has been created?

Jerry Buss has been very straightforward that Kobe was not consulted about the decisions the team made regarding Shaq and did not participate in any way in the making of those decisions. They were management and he was the employee.

What bothered me about your statement is that it is unfair to blame Kobe for not calling the Lakers and telling them to take their time to get the best they can for Shaq because he was staying.

Kobe has already been blamed by most of the media for orchestrating the trade of Shaq and NOW you want to blame him for the Lakers not getting enough in return. That is just not fair.

The real cause of the breakup was not Kobe's ego. It was Shaq's ego, his unwillingness to get into shape for the team, his rude and ridiculous demands, and his inability to share the spotlight with Kobe.

I do agree with you that nothing is black and white, but usually some shade of grey. Nor am I saying that Kobe was totally without fault for his part in the Lakers'b breaking up. I think we all are just so tired of the constant Kobe hating by the media that we are always ready to fight.

That is why the Love and Hate issue with Kobe is not a mirage or an oversimplification as far as most of us are concerned. We are just trying to balance the scales and get Kobe's back.

I hope this clears the air and helps you better understand where we are coming from and why most of us are ready to immediately counter-attack whenever we perceive a threat to Kobe.

LakerTom, AK,

Seems to me Kobe's problem (if you can call it one), and the cause of all this, is his inability to handle bullies.

Shaq's snide comments, Barkley's deregatory on air remarks and Bell's clothesline were all acts of bullying. You don't run from bullies. Kobe's got either the patience of a saint or an idiot.

When he couldn't take Shaq's badmouthing him anymore and finally reacted, Shaq did what most bullies do, they run.

When he text massaged Barkley, Barkley backtracked so far and so fast that when he wouldn't even place Kobe in the top 60 alltime now he's the best in the NBA. Actually better than the 10 he picked over Kobe in the first place. Chucky's consistent tirade probably cost Kobe the MVP in the first place.

And his reaction to Bell after being decked? Waving his index finger and pretending "nyah nysh you can't hurt me". In the schoolyard you do that and the only reason the bully won't do it again is the teacher's looking. You get up, tell him you got me and your a$$ is mine, fool. Or maybe get Karl Malone back. He covered Stockton,s back so well.

Well said, Laker Tom. Here's a question that I have: If it's true that Kobe leveraged Shaq out of his L.A. privileges because he was a lousy teammate and constantly out of shape, what was so bad about that? Good for Kobe. And, it saved the Lakers from having this dead elephant on their books until 2010. Come see the Heat in 2010, if they are still in Miami, to see what they think about Shaq's contract.

Lakertom: "I think most of the fans on the blog would agree with me that the media in general is definitely biased with respect to Kobe."

Yup!

I agree with most of the things said by both AK, Mike T, Lakertom and Edwin Gueco, but I would add more, I blame the team also. Horry was a 3 time champ before he got here, Fish virtually grew up with Kobe, these are all people that could have helped the situation as it was progressing (but didn't cause to be honest they were more for Shaq, and that's not unexpected but really not good). As for the whole trade thing, to be honest I don't think it could have happened any other way. It had to be painful, it had to be horrible, sometimes it's better to just rip off the band-aid than do it slowly. And let's not forget Snaq O'Meal --oops I meant Shaq O'neal was in the media everyday whether to tell Cuban through his wife that he wants to move there, or what not---guessing that just fueled the "media" exposure, not necessarily his worth.

In the end, Lysander is absolutely correct, water under the bridge.

Lakertom:
haha, i feel your pain man. im really glad i found this site cuz it has a lot of sensible and REAL laker fans. i remember all of 2004-05 a TON of "laker fans" would not stop blaming kobe for everything. not just the media, but the "fans"! i literally had to stop listening to sports radio cuz i would hear "laker fan" after "laker fan" trash kobe and praise shaq. i can take ppl cutting me off in traffic, or ppl leaving their blinkers on, but almost everyday i would go into road rage just from hearing comments from fake laker fans trashing kobe. so i understand your "counter-attack" mode.
with that said, i appreciate AK's attempt at remaining objective. if he were overly pro-kobe, he would be just another media guy being biased. and i didnt percieve his post to be anti-kobe really. i think there is a difference between kobe's responsibility of what went down and kobe's blame in what went down. and i think its in that subltety that you and AK seem like you disagree.

kobe is 100% blame free IMO. his committment to the team and work ethic was impeccable. he put up with a lot of crap that shaq always initiated and phil failed to mediate. he never got into a mudslinging match with shaq. everything he said...was true. after remaining silent for a long time, finally started to call out shaq on his weight and work ethic. kobe went thru so much crap, that all of a sudden free agency looked more appealing. i dont care what ppl say, i am positive that kobe was somewhat close to being a clipper. i listen to sports radio all day and i could tell that elgin felt like he had a VERY good shot at getting kobe. and afterwards, he admitted that he thought kobe was gonna be a clipper. you cant blame kobe for just waiting it out and seeing whats best for him after all the crap he went thru.

now noone can BLAME kobe. but from a more wholistic point of view... you can see how kobe has some responsibility of how things went down. why does he? because kobe has power. next to the buss's, kobe is the most powerful laker. if kobe wants shaq out, ...gone! phil? ...gone! kobe wants sasha deported out of the usa? gone!
now becuz everyone knows kobe has power, they ASSUME kobe pulled the strings and orchestrated this whole mess. he didnt. he was not involved at all. so now what AK says makes sense to me. kobe did nothing wrong...but his responsibility is that he did nothing at all. in part he probably did this to have no blood on his hands. and part of it is cuz i think hes being nice! "buss, im not gonna force the issue. im gonna explore FAgency. let me know what u decide." that way, the media cant blame him. but ...he got blamed anyways! haha. so in hindsight, the best thing for kobe to have done is work things out with mitch and buss BEFOREHAND. DEMAND shaq to be gone. Demand committment from Buss. in making these demands, he also clears the air of his intentions and gives mitch a little more time to trade shaq. (and also, probably prevents mitch from brainfarting and declaring in public how kobe is untouchable). and yeah, kobe woulda been RIPPED by the media...but it woulda been best for the lakers organization.
So...in HINDSIGHT, we do see kobes "part" in what went down. But you cant assign any blame whatsoever to kobe cuz kobe was doing what he thought was in his best interest AND what he thought was also ethically correct. and only in HINDSIGHT does this responsibilty on him appear.

Kobe is BLAMELESS

Kobe is blameless for not listening to his Father when it was suggested that Kobe wait on getting married.

Kobe is blameless for not following the advice of Laker management to have off-season surgery in Los Angeles, instead Kobe opts to have surgery in Colorado.

Kobe is NOT the Blame while his BEAUTIFUL wife just had the couple's first born child to have an AFFAIR with a woman.

Kobe is not the Blame to being a multi-millionaire sports celebrity who can have virtually ANY woman in the world, but,...he had to 'force' himself on a an hourly waged, broke, nasty hotel clerk who DOES NOT practice safe HYGIENE by changing her panties EVERYDAY, wearing the SAME panties she had on while having sex with another man.

Kobe is NOT the blame in the 2003 NBA Finals against Detroit for not PASSING the ball when he was doubled teamed.

Kobe is not at the blame for Karl Malone leaving the Lakers.

Kobe is not the blame for Rudy T to step-down as Coach of the Lakers.

Kobe is not the blame for Lamar Odoms inconsistancies. Kobe is not the blame for elbowing Mike Miller. Kobe is not the blame for any Raja Bell neckties. Kobe is not the blame for the team not being cohesive.

Kobe Bryant is blameless, unfortunat things just happen to fall in Kobe's direction. It is not Kobe's fault people around the nation are just imaging things.

Kobe is not the blame for text messenging Charles Barkley unfavorable messages regarding 'comments' from a COMMENTATOR

Kobe, and Kobe supporters need to hold Kobe accountable for his actions and stop with the 'free-ride'. Atleast give the man a 'wake-up-call' regarding life, instead of being enablers to what can turn small incidents into problems.

If Kobe is NOT held accountable for his actions with the free passes stopped we could very well witness Kobe as a passenger in a Ford Bronco being pursued in a slow speed chase on Santa Monica Blvd by a host of LAPD cruisers.

It happened once upon a time to 'another' free-pass' celebrity.

OUT!!!
the Truth

Laker Tom,

I would never deny that some of the media's been tough on Kobe and not always justifably. I've said many times that he lives a "damned if he does, damned if he doesn't" existence. That's unfortunate for him.

But at the same time, Kobe fans need to also realize that while some of the criticism Kobe currently endures isn't always legit, the roots of it come from years worth of criticism that often was. Even Kobe's biggest defenders in the media admit that he's brought much of his situation on himself. And unfortunately, that means it's going to take longer than it probably should for him to get a fair shake. That sucks, but again, it's the hand Kobe's had a large part in dealing himself. At the same time, I honestly think Kobe's on the right track when it comes to turning the tide in his favor. I would tell his fans to just be patient and ride it out. People forget, Jordan started out his career crucified by the media.

I do have to say, though, I haven't seen the media perpetuating the idea that Kobe's guilty of the rape charges at all. I can't even recall the last time it's been brought up, outside of discussing how the charges affected his marketability/popularity, but that's a competely seperate issue. If you have specific examples, please share, because maybe I missed them. But I honestly don't think the media's been doing that.

In terms of Kobe's role/responsibilities during the trade, we obviously don't agree and likely never will. And that's no biggie. But I don't think anything I said was either unfair or terribly inaccurate. And again, I didn't BLAME Kobe. I just said that he played a part in the way things went down. If you don't want to accept that because it's your goal to stand behind Kobe 100%, regardless of the circumstances, that's your right as a fan. A loyal fan, I might add. You just need to realize that you're ignoring a lot of reality in order to do that.

AK

Steven,

What is it that comes into your mind that you despise Kobe to the hilt? Is it a form of revenge that Kobe did to you or a message to someone who loves Kobe? Sometimes, we get tired of your tirades for no reason at all including this nonsense of Ford Bronco where Kobe was a passenger, insinuating that Kobe and OJ are alike. Boy, that's really a stretch, that paragraph even if you put the word "not" you can be charged for LIBEL & DEFAMATION for making those wild accusations and inferences, I don't know if you're aware of that. Steven, are you trying to get our attention by using DAMAGING remarks? I'm not a Kobe or Shaq-admirer nor a hater but reading your postings makes me wonder what's going on in your head? Why don't you try to be civil and join the debate but at least be a RESPONSIBLE blogger?

Edwin Gueco

Please refer to AK's post it is a bit more 'civil' than I can offer you yet on point. Your fallacy argument is ad hominem in attacking the man, instead of the issue. There is no type of 'agenda' for my assertions, even if using a slippery-slope causal premise.

Some fans seem to want to 'sugar-coat' things that have happened in the past. Kobe brought most of that on himself, just as AK mentioned in his above post.

I must sincerely offer an apology to you Edwin and the other bloggers due to the slippery-slope causal premise I offered, however......just so you and the other bloggers know I'll offer you all a bit of wisdom........some just can't handle,............................
.......'the Truth'


OUT!!!!
the Truth

case closed

And.........'the Truth' speaks VOLUMES!!!!!!!!!!!

OUT!!!
the Truth

Heat in 6 games

AK,

Remember what's his name? RoboQB from USC who ended up a heroin addict?

That's Kobe, but Kobe has a stronger spirit. He made it.

But I feel for him. I think we all know it would have been better for him if he would have attended UCLA until his sophmore or junior year.

One thing I truly love about Kobe is that he's human. I KNOW he didn't rape that woman. I also KNOW he did something terribly wrong in cheating on his wife.

The Greats have to overcome Great Challenges.

They wouldn't be Great if they didn't have to.

Life isn't easy and it is not easier for those who are historically great.

The story of Kobe hasn't fully been written yet, but I honestly believe he has the opportunity to be the Greatest Basketball Player of All Time. Literally so.

And I admire him for that. I hope he makes the best of that opportunity. How many of the seven billion people on this planet have the opportunity to be the "best" at any given trade, game, or skill?

So few.

God bless Kobe Bryant.

God bless Phil Jackson.

God bless Jerry Buss.

And...

GO LAKERS!

Steven,

Heat in seven.

Steven,

Shut the hell about Kobe.

You live his life and we'll see who came out better.

GO LAKERS!

Steven,

Are you Saint Stephen? I can tell by your comment, not at all.

Listen, Kobe is human. That's why he is one of us. He is also a Great. That is why he is worthy of respect.

You are neither.

You're just some stupid punk who would rather point out the speck in your brother's eye when there is a pank in thy own.

You would collapse under the opportunity to be the best at anything. Most would. And you would more than others.

Screw you punkass!

GO LAKERS!

Jon

Sorry but 'IF' I did decide to have an affair, and I had the type of FAME and MONEY that Kobe Bryant has, it would not, I repeat, WOULD NOT be an affair with some QUESTIONABLE, broke, HOURLY WAGED, off the street HOTEL CLERK that DOES NOT, I repeat, DOES NOT practice the BASIC HYGIENE habits of just changing her underwear after having sex with ANOTHER GUY!!! A woman that most likely gets home, walks toward the middle of the room, steps out of her undies, leaves them in the middle of the floor, so roaches can run around sniffing and exploring them. Wakes up the next morning, STEPS INTO THE SAME pair of UNDERWEAR that was laying in the middle of the floor, hikes 'em up her butt and thinks she's 'All That AND a Bag of Chips' the NEXT DAY?!!

Now Jon, you Kobe and some of the others on this blog might think that to be YOUR IDEA of a hottie, but NOT MINE!!! And to top it off I don't have close to the fame and money that Kobe enjoys. Call me a prude, call me 'old-fashioned' however I can't roll with the twins 'stanky' or 'skanky'.

Out of ALLLLLL, I repeat, out of ALL the Hallie Berrys, the Paris Hiltons, the Mariah Careys, the Angelina Jolis, the Anna Kournikovas, the Beyonce Knowles', the Brooke Shields, the J-Lo's, the Laker Girls, ANY aspiriing International model in the LA area, any woman with PRIDE, CONFIDENCE and DIGNITY on the same level as himself!!!!! But this 'man' who has a nice looking wife who also just had their FIRST CHILD, THIS 'MAN' who is a Sports CELEBRITY goes out and has an affair with a BROKE, BUSTED and DISGUSTED hourly wage earning HOTEL CLERK who doesn't change her panties?!!!!!

Jon you are right, everybody is human and we ALL make MISTAKES,.....HOWEVER, I'd rather make MY MISTAKES with the Beyonce Knowles, the Anna Kournikova and the Hallie Berry types. The types that practice BASIC HYGIENE!!!!!

OUT!!!
the Truth,...as told by Steven

Jon

I just had to add,....
I imagine YOUR IDEA of a HOTTIE and one you'd have an affair with would probably be along the KB line of sexy women would look like the boxer James Toney-wearing a halter top with belly sticking out, booty hugging shorts with cheeks hanging out, blended loud neon green and hot pink colors, large hoop earrings, hair tied up into a 'coco puff' style, white platform tennis shoes with white ankle socks, chipped nail polish, tarnished gold-toned jewlery, missing front tooth, snapping gum while chewing it AND breath smelling like last weeks meatloaf.

OUT!!!
the Truth

Heat win in SIX

Steven,

I find your rhythmic use of ALL-CAPS to be annoying and childish. Much like you.

GO LAKERS!

Steven,

I dub thee: "HATER!"


GO LAKERS!

Jon

You can 'dub' thee Santa Claus if you want however, I still wouldn't degrade myself, my family or my new born baby by 'forcing' myself on some hotel clerk that does not practice good hygiene habits, and STILL not wear a condom?!!!!

If Kobe can't make GOOD DECISIONS in his personal life, how can you expect him to make GOOD DECISIONS on the Basketball court?!!! Yea it's a slippery slope, however, the excuse I was seriously hoping for regarding his actions, would have been that he was under the influence of post-surgery medication and had his 'medication-goggles' on, but that turned out to NOT be the case!!!

Make no mistake about it, on the Basketball court Kobe can be one of the most Dominant, Entertaining and Unstoppable players in the game of Basketball today. He is also just as 'unstoppable' off the court, as even his own Bodyguard couldn't stop him from going STRONG to the hole. As mentioned before, sometimes it is better to 'PASS' in questionable circumstances, than to 'SHOOT'.

OUT!!!
the Truth

AK:

Thanks for your response. And thanks to the other blogger who expressed support for my position. I do appreciate the intelligence and perception you have displayed with respect to this issue.

Bottom line, I just want the media to be fair with respect to Kobe and Shaq as well as explaining to you why I and many Laker fans act so emotionally whenever Kobe is unustly criticized while Shaq at the same time is being unfairly idolized.

We don't believe that Kobe is perfect or that he should not shoulder some of the blame for the breakup of the Lakers. We do believe, however, that the constant naive pandering of the media to
Shaq and his never-ending sniping of Kobe just continues to feul the Kobe haters such as Steven, who defecate with glee on Kobe every day.

It is not always easy as die-hard Laker fan to hear Kobe be unfairly criticized and constantly put in a "damned if you do and damned if you don't situation." Especially with Miami in the national spotlight and Shaq having a prime-time access to continue his subtle Kobe-sniping Wade-pimping.

lmao...at the thought of steve being invited to share a court side seat with kobe at the nba finals. He'd probably be peeing himself in glee...ah, the painful life of a hater.

Steve, no one is calling Kobe blameless, rather we're just saying he is not to blame for everything. You can call him a snitch, call him an adulterer, say maybe he should pass some more, etc...alright, we'll live with that.

But umm, blaming him for Rudy T wanting to spend more time with his family, for all of Lamar odom's incosistencies, umm kobe wasn't with him in the clippers, and it ain't like Lamar was an all star in miami either.

But as I type all this, trying to be fair, trying to reason with you. I find myself wondering why I'm wasting my time. A hater can't reason, he only exists to hate, until someone offers him courtside seats that is, but that ain't never gonna happen to you...lmao, at the thought of you imagining yourself with Halle Berry, dude do you realise how pathetic your posts are. If I had money this is who I'd cheat on...seriously yo, get a life, cuz halle ain't hopping in your bed and neither is the hotel clerk...umm but i kno a few dudes that just got out of jail that'd be happy to cheat with you.

Taliq

I'd rather have Shaq or DWade invite me for Courtside Seats. They'd make better company with less DRAMA.

OUT!!!
the Truth

I think we should trade sasha for the 2nd and 16th pick. And then have the Bulls throw in ben gordon and luol deng. And then we trade the 2nd for the 4th and a future pick. and then we win the championship in 2007. And every season after that for the next 103 years.

think we should trade sasha for the 2nd and 16th pick. And then have the Bulls throw in ben gordon and luol deng. And then we trade the 2nd for the 4th and a future pick. and then we win the championship in 2007. And every season after that for the next 103 years. June 19, 2006 at 10:42 PM

LOL lol lol....


Lakers Send - Chris Mihm, Devean George (Sign and Trade), Aaron Mckie, 26th pick
Charlotte Send - Gerald Wallace, Brevin Knight
Dan | June 13, 2006 at 02:07 PM

I like the idea of signing Marcus Banks and trading Mihm & McKie for Gerald Wallace. Posted by: rdlee | June 13, 2006 at 12:51 PM

Have respect for the old time tested Laker rule by Jerry West & Chick "NEVER Trade Big for little"
But am intrigued with both of those trade ideas alot but would then trade BK & another Laker SF Devon George?? for Marcus Banks + 1 yr left expiring contract & top 10 1st Round Draft pick or at least 2 of these.

I definatley say Lakes spend the money and give Sam aka I-AM a 1 yr $7.5ml contract (go over the cap. Come on JB bust loose), besting tight wad Sterling, with a 1yr Laker health extention option due to his back. It's a no brainer. Sam is wiley VET, a proven winner, leader, crunch time player Plain & Simple. Not to mention a proven PG that brings 10 - 14 pts & 5 assists & 1 steal every night For sure.

 
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